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munchman33
08-02-2010, 09:01 AM
The guy who cracked the Elias rankings has an updated list of type A's and B's. (http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/08/elias-rankings-update.html)

Surprise: Konerko is currently a type B free agent, meaning if we offer him arbitration, we do not get a first round pick when he signs elsewhere. I wonder if this affects Kenny's thought process.

Either way, this makes a bidding war for Konerko's services all the more likely.

balke
08-02-2010, 09:36 AM
Cool. Please bump the thread in the offseason when I actually care.

soxfanreggie
08-02-2010, 09:38 AM
I wonder if the Sox will offer AJ arbitration. I have to think that the Sox would try to sign him to a salary similar to what he had in 2004 or 2006: $3.5 to $4 million unless we think we can sign someone else, get more out of Castro, or find someone else in our farm system to produce more. Maybe we could do something like the following:

Deal A.) 1 year, club option for 2nd year with $1 million buyout: 2011 salary of $3.5 million, 2012 salary of $4.5 million.

Deal B.) 2 years, $6 million

Both deals could have escalators based on games played and plate appearances. Deal A gives him a slightly higher salary and a buyout in case the Sox walk away, while Deal B gives him less money each year but more guaranteed.

As for PK, hopefully we can work out arrangements on a 2-year deal with salaries closer to what he had from 2003-2005 versus what he's earned recently. If both he and AJ agree to less money, that's more areas next year that we can address with free agents and working on extensions with Danks, TCQ, and possibly start looking at one with Alexei (both Danks and TCQ will cost us more next year, but how much?).

Balfanman
08-02-2010, 10:23 AM
I wonder if the Sox will offer AJ arbitration. I have to think that the Sox would try to sign him to a salary similar to what he had in 2004 or 2006: $3.5 to $4 million unless we think we can sign someone else, get more out of Castro, or find someone else in our farm system to produce more. Maybe we could do something like the following:

Deal A.) 1 year, club option for 2nd year with $1 million buyout: 2011 salary of $3.5 million, 2012 salary of $4.5 million.

Deal B.) 2 years, $6 million

Both deals could have escalators based on games played and plate appearances. Deal A gives him a slightly higher salary and a buyout in case the Sox walk away, while Deal B gives him less money each year but more guaranteed.

As for PK, hopefully we can work out arrangements on a 2-year deal with salaries closer to what he had from 2003-2005 versus what he's earned recently. If both he and AJ agree to less money, that's more areas next year that we can address with free agents and working on extensions with Danks, TCQ, and possibly start looking at one with Alexei (both Danks and TCQ will cost us more next year, but how much?).

I'm one who likes A.J. and I hope that he sticks around, but would hope that his work load would diminish somewhat to keep him fresher for the end of the season. Putting escalators in his contract for games played might cause some decension in the ranks if A.J. is given a few extra days off because he's going poorly, or if Ozzie just wants to give him a little more time off.

Now if it was for plate appearances and A.J would consent to D.H. occaisionally (couldn't be worse than Kotsay) or even play first to spell Konerko or whoever from time to time, that may work out better.

Zakath
08-02-2010, 10:26 AM
There are only 5 members of the 2005 World Champions that are still members of the team: AJ, Paulie, Buehrle, Garcia (with the side trips to Philly and Detroit), and Jenks. Maybe being sentimental, but I'd really like to see the first three retire as White Sox.

You begin to envy teams like the Yankees, that even though they go out and buy every big free agent they can find, have kept a core of three players (Jeter, Posada, Rivera) together for 15 years, without a thought that any of them would ever play anywhere else.

The business end of baseball being what it is, it's overly idealistic to think that all three would stay here until the end of their careers, but one can always hope.

Coops4Aces
08-02-2010, 10:39 AM
How do they come up with this crap? Denard Span is type A? Yeah, right :rolleyes:

DirtySox
08-02-2010, 10:47 AM
How do they come up with this crap? Denard Span is type A? Yeah, right :rolleyes:

Lol wut. Denard Span is a great player. Considering Elias results are derived from the previous season and the current season it makes perfect sense why he would be a Type A.

Last Year: .311/.392/.415

This Year: .276/.348/.363

Clearly this year he is down a bit, but by no means is Denard Span some ****ty player. You should probably know a bit about the topic at hand before employing the eye-rolling smiley.

rdivaldi
08-02-2010, 10:53 AM
Surprise: Konerko is currently a type B free agent, meaning if we offer him arbitration, we do not get a first round pick when he signs elsewhere. I wonder if this affects Kenny's thought process.

Either way, this makes a bidding war for Konerko's services all the more likely.

But isn't it pretty much safe to assume that with every home run and rbi Pauly will continue to march towards type A status? The rankings are averaged over a two year period and he may end up with 35 home runs and 110 rbis this year.

Coops4Aces
08-02-2010, 11:05 AM
Lol wut. Denard Span is a great player. Considering Elias results are derived from the previous season and the current season it makes perfect sense why he would be a Type A.

Last Year: .311/.392/.415

This Year: .276/.348/.363

Clearly this year he is down a bit, but by no means is Denard Span some ****ty player. You should probably know a bit about the topic at hand before employing the eye-rolling smiley.

No need to be condescending bro.

Since when does an OPS of 711 make someone a great player? Andruw Jones (761) and Mark Teahen (727) have higher OPS than him.

Zakath
08-02-2010, 11:07 AM
But isn't it pretty much safe to assume that with every home run and rbi Pauly will continue to march towards type A status? The rankings are averaged over a two year period and he may end up with 35 home runs and 110 rbis this year.

Given the number of games he's played this year (97 out of 104) and his stats so far, projecting out would give you 151 games played with 39 HR and 112 RBI. Paulie however has been very streaky this year, if you look at month-to-month:

April 11 HR, 21 RBI
May 3 HR, 12 RBI
June 6 HR, 23 RBI
July 5 HR, 16 RBI (4 of the 5 HR coming in 4 straight games vs. Seattle 7/26-7/29)

so as could easily end up 28/95 as he could 45/130.

munchman33
08-02-2010, 11:47 AM
But isn't it pretty much safe to assume that with every home run and rbi Pauly will continue to march towards type A status? The rankings are averaged over a two year period and he may end up with 35 home runs and 110 rbis this year.

Paulie's just missing, so yes there's a chance. But he'll not only have to keep up his stellar season, but need some of the people above him to fall a little. The cutoff isn't a specific number, it's based on percentile at your position.


How do they come up with this crap? Denard Span is type A? Yeah, right :rolleyes:

Um...Denard Span is good? And the ratings are based on position and your hitting value vs. others who play the same position. There's a lot of 1B better than Konerko. AJ is a type A because most catchers suck. It's harder to replace him.

Randar68
08-02-2010, 01:14 PM
The guy who cracked the Elias rankings has an updated list of type A's and B's. (http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/08/elias-rankings-update.html)

Surprise: Konerko is currently a type B free agent, meaning if we offer him arbitration, we do not get a first round pick when he signs elsewhere. I wonder if this affects Kenny's thought process.

Either way, this makes a bidding war for Konerko's services all the more likely.

Is it more surprising Konerko is a B or that Hamilton is a B? Both are borderline due to time missed or production reduced by injury. Will be interesting to see nonetheless.

I still think the Sox offer arb and Konerko walks looking for a longer term deal. I would definitely be ok with him coming back on a 3-4 yr deal for a lower salary, but I don't think that will happen.

munchman33
08-02-2010, 01:18 PM
Is it more surprising Konerko is a B or that Hamilton is a B? Both are borderline due to time missed or production reduced by injury. Will be interesting to see nonetheless.

I still think the Sox offer arb and Konerko walks looking for a longer term deal. I would definitely be ok with him coming back on a 3-4 yr deal for a lower salary, but I don't think that will happen.

I agree, and I think there's no chance we don't offer arbitration. But someone's going to pay him. Very few hitters with his kind of production will cost you zero picks. That means more to a lot of teams than money does.

Randar68
08-02-2010, 01:22 PM
I agree, and I think there's no chance we don't offer arbitration. But someone's going to pay him. Very few hitters with his kind of production will cost you zero picks. That means more to a lot of teams than money does.

The teams that are going to be interested are going to be contender types of teams that spend a little money, so none of them will really blush about the picks, IMO.

This is also why AJ will be offered arbitration, IMO. Even with the year he's having he is going to be a Type A.

I mean, really, if people give up picks for guys like Marco Scutaro, Greg Zaun, Rob Barajas, etc, why would they flinch for an AJ or Konerko?

UofCSoxFan
08-02-2010, 01:34 PM
It's interesting that Edwin Jackson is a Type B and rated higher than both Floyd and Peavy. Of course, by the time he actually becomes a free agent his steller 2009 (well actually his steller first half of 2009) will not count and he'll likely be a "none."

UofCSoxFan
08-02-2010, 01:37 PM
I don't necessarily think it's a given that AJ gets offered arbitration since there's a likelihood that he accepts it, in which case the Sox are locked into an old catcher at an inflated salary. AJ doesn't want to leave and has made enough money where I could easily see him staying and forgoing free agency. Moreover, it may not be likley he gets a significant rase in free agency.

I wouldn't mind bringing AJ back at a reduced salary. He handles the staff well, but I would also like to see him platoon more against lefties.

canOcorn
08-02-2010, 02:04 PM
Um...Denard Span is good? And the ratings are based on position and your hitting value vs. others who play the same position. There's a lot of 1B better than Konerko. AJ is a type A because most catchers suck. It's harder to replace him.

1B, DH and OF are lumped together, so it's the top 20% of that group. The categories for that group are PA, BA, OBP, HR and RBI. Span crushed it in BA, OBP and PA. It looks like Span will fall to type B and Paul will move to type A if they finish out the year at their current pace.

Randar68
08-02-2010, 02:05 PM
I don't necessarily think it's a given that AJ gets offered arbitration since there's a likelihood that he accepts it, in which case the Sox are locked into an old catcher at an inflated salary. AJ doesn't want to leave and has made enough money where I could easily see him staying and forgoing free agency. Moreover, it may not be likley he gets a significant rase in free agency.

I wouldn't mind bringing AJ back at a reduced salary. He handles the staff well, but I would also like to see him platoon more against lefties.

Agents aren't dummies and they will make the case to him about finding a multi-year deal for security reasons. I didn't say it was a lock, but I find it unlikely he would accept. I also wouldn't mind him back in a role like you describe and maybe that is possible given Flowers' struggles in AAA.

Randar68
08-02-2010, 02:09 PM
It's interesting that Edwin Jackson is a Type B and rated higher than both Floyd and Peavy. Of course, by the time he actually becomes a free agent his steller 2009 (well actually his steller first half of 2009) will not count and he'll likely be a "none."

Unless Coop turns him around. His numbers vs the AL the last 2 seasons compared to the NL just don't make any sense for some reason. His IP, K's, W's, games started, etc will keep him up there on their own if he stays healthy. If he turns his ERA around next season he will still likely be a Type A.

DumpJerry
08-02-2010, 02:11 PM
Lol wut. Denard Span is a great player. Considering Elias results are derived from the previous season and the current season it makes perfect sense why he would be a Type A.

Last Year: .311/.392/.415

This Year: .276/.348/.363

Clearly this year he is down a bit, but by no means is Denard Span some ****ty player. You should probably know a bit about the topic at hand before employing the eye-rolling smiley.

Lighten up on personal attacks. Attack the post, not the poster.

No need to be condescending bro.
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