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1908<2005
07-30-2010, 12:56 PM
Gambo620
Edwin Jackson is a White Sox! Details to follow.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 12:57 PM
http://twitter.com/TBrownYahoo/statuses/19923975743

whitesoxfan
07-30-2010, 12:57 PM
ESPNChicago (http://twitter.com/ESPNChicago)
BREAKING NEWS: White Sox trade Hudson for Jackson, prospect http://bit.ly/ESPNChicago (http://bit.ly/ESPNChicago)

eriqjaffe
07-30-2010, 12:57 PM
How long until we start up the Edwin Jackson Appreciation Thread?

ndgt10
07-30-2010, 12:58 PM
Great news! We needed another starter.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 12:58 PM
Hopefully his stay is short lived.

Rockabilly
07-30-2010, 12:58 PM
When is Dunn a member of the Sox?

whitesoxfan
07-30-2010, 12:58 PM
How long until we start up the Edwin Jackson Appreciation Thread?

Hopefully soon.

Do you think the Brewers have any interest in Edwin? I mean their rotation has been epically awful this year outside of Gallardo. Maybe Edwin, Viciedo, and a couple of others for Prince?

GoGoCrede
07-30-2010, 12:59 PM
Sooo, help a girl out...he's going to be flipped, right? I woke up too late.

edit - seems like the consensus is yes

Coops4Aces
07-30-2010, 12:59 PM
Great news! We needed another starter.

Or not.

VeeckAsInWreck
07-30-2010, 12:59 PM
Here's hoping the Sox flip him to DC for Dunn. :praying:

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:00 PM
Sooo, help a girl out...he's going to be flipped, right? I woke up too late.

edit - seems like the consensus is yes

One hopes. Otherwise we just traded a very good cheap pitching prospect for an average pitcher who the Sox will have to pay around 8 million for next year.

BleacherBandit
07-30-2010, 01:00 PM
Meh.

hi im skot
07-30-2010, 01:00 PM
Here's hoping the Sox flip him to DC for Dunn. :praying:
Who's the fifth starter, then?

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:00 PM
Hopefully soon.

Do you think the Brewers have any interest in Edwin? I mean their rotation has been epically awful this year outside of Gallardo. Maybe Edwin, Viciedo, and a couple of others for Prince?

Supposedly the Brewers pulled everyone off the table a few days ago.

If we're flipping it's probably for Dunn.

pudge
07-30-2010, 01:00 PM
The guy has a 5+ ERA in the NL - does anyone NOT want to flip him for Dunn?

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:00 PM
Gave up Holmberg too.

Good work Kenny. :rolleyes:

hawkjt
07-30-2010, 01:01 PM
Pitching is the key in this new era. Whether Jackson is here to stay or not, we need a 5th starter. Will not overreact til the dust settles tomorrow at 3.

Just concerned about beating the A's tonite with Harrell starting.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:01 PM
Who's the fifth starter, then?

Suit up, partner.

chisox616
07-30-2010, 01:01 PM
Don't trade him for Dunn...I'd rather they keep him than trade him for Dunn :\

BleacherBandit
07-30-2010, 01:01 PM
Hopefullly Jackson ends being a decent pitcher for us like Freddy was last year.

soxfanatlanta
07-30-2010, 01:02 PM
A bit perplexing, but the day is young!

Milw
07-30-2010, 01:02 PM
Not that I'm especially excited about Edwin, but if we do flip him for Dunn, who is our fifth starter then? I'd rather have no Dunn than Lucas Harrell every fifth day.

35th and Shields
07-30-2010, 01:02 PM
Damn. I guess I'll just have to trust KW with this one.

VeeckAsInWreck
07-30-2010, 01:02 PM
(insert cliche about a certain pitching coach that will fix him) :redneck

GoGoCrede
07-30-2010, 01:02 PM
A bit perplexing, but the day is young!


Wish I didn't have to go to work later. I LOVE all the trade talk, babble, speculation, banter, meltdowns....

Sad
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
Don't trade him for Dunn...I'd rather they keep him than trade him for Dunn :\

they're gonna have to keep him... unless Kenny has another deal going for a 5th starter...

1908<2005
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
SI_JonHeyman

dbacks get daniel hudson and david holmberg for jackson
3 minutes ago via web

balke
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
Man I hope Coop sees a way to make him better.

whitesoxfan
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
Wish I didn't have to go to work later. I LOVE all the trade talk, babble, speculation, banter, meltdowns....

I'm not getting much done today...luckily I get off at 3.

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
If the rumors are true, Washington wants Jackson a lot more than they wanted Hudson.

We'll see if the third part goes down and what else we'd have to give up...

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
If the Sox are indeed paying all of next year's contract (if they hold onto him), then Kenny was fleeced.

ndgt10
07-30-2010, 01:03 PM
Apparently, the Berkman amd Myers trade fell through. That was what Cowley was tweeting about this morning.

RCWHITESOX
07-30-2010, 01:04 PM
Hopefully his stay is short lived.

If he stays lets give him a chance. Many were chastising the Sox for getting 43 yr old Vizquel. Were would we be without him? With that said I still hope they can pick up another left handed hitter.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:05 PM
:shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
:gah::gah::gah::gah::gah::gah:

HUDSON AND HOLMBERG FOR JACKSON?

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:05 PM
Apparently, the Berkman amd Myers trade fell through. That was what Cowley was tweeting about this morning.

We have another day before the deadline. I'm sure Kenny's tabled that idea for now, but may come back to it.

Slappy
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
Gambo620
Edwin Jackson is a White Sox! Details to follow.


:\

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
This guy threw a no hitter....he has a very nasty slider...he isnt garbage guys

hawkjt
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
If he stays lets give him a chance. Many were chastising the Sox for getting 43 yr old Vizquel. Were would we be without him? With that said I still hope they can pick up another left handed hitter.


Agree. His WAR number puts him about #50 in the MLB...a #2 or #3 starter. Hope that Coop sees something.

Crede24Thome25
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
I'm happy if we keep Jackson or trade him for Dunn.

Milw
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
:shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
:gah::gah::gah::gah::gah::gah:

HUDSON AND HOLMBERG FOR JACKSON?
Cue the chorus of WSIers who think they know the Sox minor leaguers better than Kenny Williams. Happens with every trade. Kenny almost always comes out looking smart. Chill.

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
If Coop doesn't fix Edwin Jackson, we got freaking ripped off.

SephClone89
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
Anyone have info on Holmberg? What kind of prospect is/was he?

Coops4Aces
07-30-2010, 01:06 PM
Cowley says to trust him when he says the day is not over. Thanks but no thanks Joe, I'll trust my clock.

goon
07-30-2010, 01:07 PM
Hopefully, Arizona is eating some of Jackson's contract.

Hitmen77
07-30-2010, 01:07 PM
:shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
:gah::gah::gah::gah::gah:

HUDSON AND HOLMBERG FOR JACKSON?

Yep, and (unless there is something else in the works here) we owe Jackson $8.3 million next season. :thud:

Ugh, the guy has a 5+ ERA in the NL. He's not that good.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:07 PM
This guy threw a no hitter....he has a very nasty slider...he isnt garbage guys

Who cares about throwing a no-hitter? Anybody could do that on a given night.

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:07 PM
I don't think I like this trade. Even if Dunn comes along, I'm not so sure I like it.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:07 PM
If Coop doesn't fix Edwin Jackson, we got freaking ripped off.

This.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:08 PM
Cowley says to trust him when he says the day is not over. Thanks but no thanks Joe, I'll trust my clock.

Oh, I think more moves are made, but not because Cowley said it.

Rockabilly
07-30-2010, 01:09 PM
he was an all-star.. He's not worthless

1908<2005
07-30-2010, 01:09 PM
Who cares about throwing a no-hitter? Anybody could do that on a given night.

And the no-hitter he threw was far from impressive. Great feat no doubt but he walked like 7 hitters in that game and threw like 145 pitches.

October26
07-30-2010, 01:09 PM
Wish I didn't have to go to work later. I LOVE all the trade talk, babble, speculation, banter, meltdowns....

Me too! Now I am wondering, what else will Kenny do? As others have said, the day is young...

HomeFish
07-30-2010, 01:09 PM
So we give up two mediocre pitchers and get one mediocre pitcher back? :scratch:

Uncontested
07-30-2010, 01:09 PM
Yeah... he threw the saddest "No Hitter" in baseball... HE WALKED EIGHT (8) PEOPLE!

Dude is garbage, I really hope this is trade bait.

soxfan43
07-30-2010, 01:09 PM
Yep, and (unless there is something else in the works here) we owe Jackson $8.3 million next season. :thud:

Ugh, the guy has a 5+ ERA in the NL. He's not that good.

8.3?!?! Wow, that seems a bit high to me. I do not like this trade but I'll hold out judgment until 3:01 tomorrow.

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2010, 01:10 PM
Is Holmberg a throw in? I know nothing about him.

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:10 PM
Cue the chorus of WSIers who think they know the Sox minor leaguers better than Kenny Williams. Happens with every trade. Kenny almost always comes out looking smart. Chill.

Holmberg was in Great Falls at the higher rookie league. Who knows if those guys pan out, and at best he's 2-3 years away.

Not too happy with Hudson being dealt, but as with Poreda last year, it seems we value our prospects much more than the rest of the league does, and Kenny knows what he's doing.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:10 PM
Who cares about throwing a no-hitter? Anybody could do that on a given night.


No just no...:shakehead:

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:10 PM
This guy threw a no hitter....he has a very nasty slider...he isnt garbage guys
Sorry but a no-hitter doesn't make one a good pitcher especially when he's posting a 5.00 ERA in NL and has only posted an ERA below 3.00 once in his career. His stuff has yet to be translated into strikeouts and he walks a metric **** ton of guys for someone who doesn't get many puncouts.

Agree. His WAR number puts him about #50 in the MLB...a #2 or #3 starter. Hope that Coop sees something.
War! huh-yeah! What is it good for?

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:10 PM
Is Holmberg a throw in? I know nothing about him.

Projectable young LHP. Could be good. Far away.

35th and Shields
07-30-2010, 01:11 PM
Oh, I think more moves are made, but not because Cowley said it.
**** this. I sure hope so. I don't care that we traded Hudson, I'm just mad that we traded him for Edwin ****ing Jackson.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:11 PM
So we give up two mediocre pitchers and get one mediocre pitcher back? :scratch:

A mediocre expensive pitcher. At least he was an All-Star once.

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:11 PM
And the no-hitter he threw was far from impressive. Great feat no doubt but he walked like 7 hitters in that game and threw like 145 pitches.

8 walks, 150 pitches. Color me unimpressed.

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:12 PM
I don't care that we traded Hudson, I'm just mad that we traded him for Edwin ****ing Jackson.

Quoted for effect.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:12 PM
No just no...:shakehead:

He had eight walks.

PolishPrince34
07-30-2010, 01:12 PM
I hate this deal unless Jackson is going Washington for Dunn. Not a fan of Jackson at all. Holmberg has a lot of potential for a Left hander

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2010, 01:12 PM
Jackson's got potential and good stuff, but his no hitter was maybe the worst one of all time. He walked like 8 guys and was one batter away from being taken out in the third inning due to control problems. I think he threw like 160 pitches that day too. I would rather hang my hat on the first half he had in 2009 then the one game he had this year where he was lucky to get a win, let alone a no hitter.

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:13 PM
Jackson looked pretty good with Tampa and Detroit. I'm not going to weigh too heavily what he did this year with an awful Arizona team.

TheCQExperience
07-30-2010, 01:13 PM
Edwin will not being staying here. He will be heading to Milwaukee this evening.... cross our fingers.

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:13 PM
If you want SOMETHING to like about this deal, it is that Cooper is a wizard taking pitchers with tremendous stuff and ability and teaching them to harness it. This could very well be Gavin Floyd BIG when it is said and done, but it has to be, or its a big big loss.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:13 PM
overreaction at its finest right here

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:13 PM
Jackson looked pretty good with Tampa and Detroit. I'm not going to weigh too heavily what he did this year with an awful Arizona team.

Of course you wouldn't.

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:14 PM
Edwin will not being staying here. He will be heading to Milwaukee this evening.... cross our fingers.

For future reference, this post is better served in deep pink.

BigHurt3515
07-30-2010, 01:14 PM
not happy at the moment. who starts tonight

SoxxoS
07-30-2010, 01:14 PM
I heard Hudson is the next Jeremy reed

balke
07-30-2010, 01:14 PM
One thing I like is if the Sox do get to the playoffs with him at #5 - his 95+ mph fastball and slider would make him an excellent reliever in the playoffs.

GoGoCrede
07-30-2010, 01:15 PM
overreaction at its finest right here

Happens every trade deadline. I love it.

VeeckAsInWreck
07-30-2010, 01:15 PM
overreaction at its finest right here

:popcorn: Isn't it???? Anytime KW makes a deal the departing player is on his way to a great career.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:15 PM
Adam Dunn is coming here

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX

Danielgosox38
07-30-2010, 01:15 PM
We gave up too much.. *Sigh......

khan
07-30-2010, 01:15 PM
I don't like this trade, especially IF Jackson stays here AND IF none of his obese contract is picked up.

1. A 5th starter will get ~10 more starts, and then NOT start in the playoffs. If Jackson is 'above average,' he'll give the SOX 6 or more "good starts," [by whatever metric you care to use] whereas Hudson might have given 3 to 5 starts. I don't know if the 1 to 3 more "good starts" is enough to make this team a WS contender.

2. Jackson is really expensive. IF the SOX have to pickup all $8.3M, this trade really sucks.

3. With this in mind, this FURTHER hamstrings the SOX from a salary budget standpoint in 2011.

4. Most importantly, I think Edwin Jackson sucks at baseball.

This is a 'meh' move that looks to be overpaying for crap, since I wouldn't have let the d'backs PAY for the SOX to take him off their hands. I hope I'm wrong. I hope that Dunn is coming here [EDIT] instead of Jackson.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
overreaction at its finest right here

I think you are the one who is overreacting because you are trying to sell us on a NO HITTER. Big ****ing deal. He threw a no-hitter. That is one start.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
I would've been able to swallow this deal if it weren't for the random Holmberg throw-in. It goes to prove that the Sox can't draft for **** if a guy you thought was a steal in the round you selected him in, ends up becoming a throw-in for Edwin "But...but I have STUFF" Jackson.

Crede24Thome25
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
overreaction at its finest right here
100%

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
Adam Dunn is coming here

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX

Please be true.

I'm okay with the deal then.

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
overreaction at its finest right here

I do think people need to breathe. Either Jackson gets flipped, which is likely, or he's our fifth starter. You frankly could do much worse. This guy was traded for Max Scherzer just last year, who projects to be a number 2 in this league someday. Jackson precisely fits the profile of the guys the Sox have turned around before (good pedigree, one time huge prospects who have failed to produce at first but have shown flashes). Now there is always a concern that the Sox overestimate their abilities to "fix" guys, but let's let this settle a bit befoe jumping off the cliff.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
I think you are the one who is overreacting because you are trying to sell us on a NO HITTER. Big ****ing deal. He threw a no-hitter. That is one start.

He is going to the Nationals calm down

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
Adam Dunn is coming here

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX

That would make me happy.

MushMouth
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
who knows if this is true?

#ChiSox (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23ChiSox) #MLB (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23MLB) Jim Bowden reporting on MLB radio White Sox are getting Dunn...

Just posted...

kufram
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
I have an idea... let's all panic, completely overreact, and form opinions before we have any facts.

Rockabilly
07-30-2010, 01:16 PM
Dunn coming to the Sox

According to Bowden

ilsox7
07-30-2010, 01:17 PM
Well Jim Bowden is convinced Dunn is headed to the Sox, so no point in analyzing this trade until that is confirmed or denied.

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:17 PM
If Jackson is sent to Wash for Dunn, doesn't there HAVE TO BE a 3rd deal? We can't really be going with Lucas-Marquerz-Torres in the 5 spot...can we?

southwstchi4life
07-30-2010, 01:17 PM
I'll take an experienced pitcher over a prospect any day. I agree his numbers are not the best. But we needed another starter. more than a left-handed bat. You throw a guy into a pennant race compared to his old situation who has experience, decent stuff. Am I the only person who likes this trade?

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:18 PM
If Jackson is sent to Wash for Dunn, doesn't there HAVE TO BE a 3rd deal? We can't really be going with Lucas-Marquerz-Torres in the 5 spot...can we?
Oh we can, according to all those people that are telling us to take it easy.

hi im skot
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
That would make me happy.

Still need a #5.

pudge
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
Do you guys really think we're not flipping him for Dunn?? Why is everyone freaking out?

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
If Jackson is sent to Wash for Dunn, doesn't there HAVE TO BE a 3rd deal? We can't really be going with Lucas-Marquerz-Torres in the 5 spot...can we?

Yeah, that's got me concerned, too. But I'd gladly take the uncertainty if it means that we don't keep Edwin Jackson as our key acquisition.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
If Jackson is sent to Wash for Dunn, doesn't there HAVE TO BE a 3rd deal? We can't really be going with Lucas-Marquerz-Torres in the 5 spot...can we?

I think we get a pitcher of some sort still.

Danielgosox38
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
Ok, so the Sox trade 3 people for 2 months of Adam Dunn? Still not happy about this...

cws05champ
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
AWFUL, AWFUL trade on the surface!! Unless we get a big bat back as well in all this, it's awful.

SoxGirl4Life
07-30-2010, 01:19 PM
I have an idea... let's all panic, completely overreact, and form opinions before we have any facts.

:welcome:

This is what we do here! sheesh!

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2010, 01:20 PM
Adam Dunn is coming here

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX

If this is true, this is amaizing. Kenny effectively lowered Washington's asking price from Hudson plus a B+/A- prospect to Hudson and a prospect that is years away.

I just don't get why Washington would want Jackson over Hudson. It may make more sense of the Sox to have Jackson since he's a more proven guy in a pennat race, but Hudson who is cheap and under control for more years seems to make more sense for a rebuildiing team like the Nats.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:20 PM
Still need a #5.

I think we get one. If we don't then it's an awful move.

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:20 PM
Of course you wouldn't.

What's that supposed to mean?

The guy's done well in the AL, he went 13-2 with the Tigers last year with a 3.62 ERA. He's not the garbage as some suspect.

Besides, we should know better to think that Sox prospects will stay here when Kenny's the GM.

october23sp
07-30-2010, 01:20 PM
Who is starting tonight?

GAsoxfan
07-30-2010, 01:20 PM
If Jackson is sent to Wash for Dunn, doesn't there HAVE TO BE a 3rd deal? We can't really be going with Lucas-Marquerz-Torres in the 5 spot...can we?

I'd take the Dunn/Torres combo over the Kotsay/Jackson combo. I think having Dunn in the line-up every day is worth more than the difference between Jackson and Torres every fifth day.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:20 PM
AWFUL, AWFUL trade on the surface!! Unless we get a big bat back as well in all this, it's awful.
Hey hey take it easy there buddy. Kenny's done this in the past. You don't know **** and Kenny knows a lot more. Jackson threw a NO HITTER. HE'S GOTTA BE GOOD. HUDSON'S A BUST! YOU ARE SO OVERREACTING!

hoosiersoxfan
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
Ok, so the Sox trade 3 people for 2 months of Adam Dunn? Still not happy about this...

I'm not sure Kenny makes this trade if he doesn't think they can resign Dunn. Also don't they get at least 1 first round pick if he leaves in free agency?

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
Ok, so the Sox trade 3 people for 2 months of Adam Dunn? Still not happy about this...

There is such thing as quality over quantity.

HomeFish
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
If Viciedo gets traded for Dunn, I will lose my cool and the mods will have to ban me from this forum. I'm really high on Viciedo right now.

GAsoxfan
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
What's that supposed to mean?

The guy's done well in the AL, he wet 13-2 with the Tigers last year with a 3.62 ERA. He's not the garbage as some suspect.

Besides, we should know better to think that Sox prospects will stay here when Kenny's the GM.

He had a great first half of 2009. His post All-star break ERA was around 5.0.

khan
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
I have an idea... let's all panic, completely overreact, and form opinions before we have any facts.

Well, it is a fact that Jackson sucks this year. So, I think posters have a right to NOT like this trade, based on his numbers.

Danielgosox38
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
I rather them keep Jackson AND get Dunn. Doesn't look like that is going to be possible though, but it would solve both of our problems.

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
Ok, so the Sox trade 3 people for 2 months of Adam Dunn? Still not happy about this...

Dunn is a type A free agent. We can pull in two very good prospects for him if he doesn't resign.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
Who is starting tonight?
Lucas Harrell apparently.

soltrain21
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
Who is starting tonight?

You. Better start driving. It's snowing where you live probably.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:21 PM
Who is starting tonight?

Lucas Harrell

Danielgosox38
07-30-2010, 01:22 PM
There is such thing as quality over quantity.

True, but it's still just 2 months of Dunn.

BringHomeDaBacon
07-30-2010, 01:22 PM
I never understood why everybody thought this guy had so much potential. If his stuff is so good why is his K/9 lifetime is only 6.45? Even last year when his ERA was nice, his K/9 was only 6.77. If a pitcher is going to walk a lot of hitters like Jackson (4.02 career BB/9) does, he better be able to strike guys out.

A pitcher with a high ERA that can't find the strike zone or miss bats doesn't do anything for me.

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:22 PM
I'm not sure Kenny makes this trade if he doesn't think they can resign Dunn. Also don't they get at least 1 first round pick if he leaves in free agency?

It's 2 picks, a first rounder and a sandwich pick, but only if the Sox offer arbitration and if the team signing him doesn't have protected picks.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:22 PM
If this is true, this is amaizing. Kenny effectively lowered Washington's asking price from Hudson plus a B+/A- prospect to Hudson and a prospect that is years away.

I just don't get why Washington would want Jackson over Hudson. It may make more sense of the Sox to have Jackson since he's a more proven guy in a pennat race, but Hudson who is cheap and under control for more years seems to make more sense for a rebuildiing team like the Nats.

Agreed on all points. Deal becomes good if they get Dunn. Hudson+Holmberg for Dunn and 2 picks.

I also don't understand the Nats fascination with E-Jax.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
This guy threw a no hitter....he has a very nasty slider...he isnt garbage guys

He threw a no-hitter and his numbers are still as bad as they are. He is hot garbage. Hopefully his stay here is only a few hours. Otherwise... Blegh.

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
I am just going to throw this out there on pure utter gut speculation:

By this time tomorrow the Sox will have Adam Dunn and Jeremy Guthrie.

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
If Viciedo gets traded for Dunn, I will lose my cool and the mods will have to ban me from this forum. I'm really high on Viciedo right now.

Have you read this somewhere, or are you just doing your typical fear mongering thing?

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
As I posted in the earlier Jackson thread, the fifth starter spot (not counting today) will come up 6 or 7 more times if the Sox pitch guys on 4 days rest (i.e. skip the spot only when they have an off day).

The hole at DH is a much more pressing need. That's not to say I wouldn't like to get a guy who is better than Torres, but I don't think that will kill us either if we have to go with him or Pena.

ilsox7
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
True, but it's still just 2 months of Dunn.

Plus two high draft picks.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
It's 2 picks, a first rounder and a sandwich pick, but only if the Sox offer arbitration and if the team signing him doesn't have protected picks.

Not necessarily a 1st round pick depending on who signs him.

twentywontowin
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
I am just going to throw this out there on pure utter gut speculation:

By this time tomorrow the Sox will have Adam Dunn and Jeremy Guthrie.

I say we end up with Dunn and either Lilly or Zambrano.

Yes, Lilly or Zambrano.

Crede24Thome25
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
Jim Bowden is gonna give me a heart attack, break the damn news already will yah.

HomeFish
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
Have you read this somewhere, or are you just doing your typical fear mongering thing?

Apparently they wanted Beckham or Viciedo + Hudson for Dunn at one point in the negotiations. So that name has been thrown out there.

PalehosePlanet
07-30-2010, 01:23 PM
Let's hope if the Dunn deal goes down that the Nats DON'T throw us Livan in the deal. Or even worse Miguel Batista.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:24 PM
Cue the chorus of WSIers who think they know the Sox minor leaguers better than Kenny Williams. Happens with every trade. Kenny almost always comes out looking smart. Chill.

Yeah, he looked sage with both those Nick Swisher deals, AMIRITE?

Most people here, BTW, were lauding him for the Peavy deal last year.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:24 PM
Let's hope if the Dunn deal goes down that the Nats DON'T throw us Livan in the deal. Or even worse Miguel Batista.
Oh God, please stop it. You are killing me here!

35th and Shields
07-30-2010, 01:24 PM
Plus two high draft picks.
And a less then impressive starting rotation...

goon
07-30-2010, 01:24 PM
If Viciedo gets traded for Dunn, I will lose my cool and the mods will have to ban me from this forum. I'm really high on Viciedo right now.

No ****. So is everyone else.

ilsox7
07-30-2010, 01:25 PM
Jim Bowden is gonna give me a heart attack, break the damn news already will yah.

He pretty much has. He said the Nationals have a ****ed up way of making decisions so it has to go through multiple levels of approval, but it will get approved.

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:25 PM
I say we end up with Dunn and either Lilly or Zambrano.

Yes, Lilly or Zambrano.

I could live with that..Dunn and Zambrano (if Cubs eat half the salary). Zambrano is done as a 1, but could live with him as a 5, he isnt that old either, coop might fix him, and him and Ozzie are great friends, him and AJ are friends, it could be a really good fit.

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2010, 01:25 PM
It's 2 picks, a first rounder and a sandwich pick, but only if the Sox offer arbitration and if the team signing him doesn't have protected picks.

I would assume the Sox would offer arbitration...either they get Dunn, which isn't a bad thing, or more likey, he turns them down and they get the picks. The only reason teams don't offer is becasue they are worried the player will take arbitration and they don't want him at what it would cost. Dunn can still play and he likely won't take arbitration so this wouldn't apply.

VeeckAsInWreck
07-30-2010, 01:26 PM
I say we end up with Dunn and either Lilly or Zambrano.

Yes, Lilly or Zambrano.

I would be ok with that.

balke
07-30-2010, 01:26 PM
I am just going to throw this out there on pure utter gut speculation:

By this time tomorrow the Sox will have Adam Dunn and Jeremy Guthrie.


I love the idea of Guthrie. I still think Sox fans are going to be deflated when they see what they actually get with Dunn in the fold. Especially if he kicks and screams not to be a DH.

I feel like Swisher is coming back for his second trip with this whole Dunn thing.

Alex Krycek
07-30-2010, 01:26 PM
...Earlier this year the D-backs scouts thought highly enough of Jackson to give up Max Scherzer, due to the fact that AZ preferred Jackson's stuff and clean mechanics. Cooper also loves Edwin. The Sox also know more about Hudson than anyone else, and if they are comfortable trading him then so am I. I really like this deal for the Sox.

That being said, if the Sox trade Jackson for Dunn, that will be the dumbest thing I've seen in a long time. We of all fanbases should know that pitching wins pennants, and the Sox won't win a damn thing with Torres making 8 starts down the stretch.

PalehosePlanet
07-30-2010, 01:26 PM
Oh God, please stop it. You are killing me here!

Trust me, it was an unwanted, intrusive thought that made me shiver to the bone.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:27 PM
Rios Konerko Dunn and Carlos......man that is just a nasty middle order

voodoochile
07-30-2010, 01:27 PM
There is such thing as quality over quantity.

You mean one proven MLB power hitter is worth more than a handful of unproven prospects? NO WAY! :o:

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:27 PM
I'm just reluctant to go the rest of the way without a fourth starter, I know that Kenny doesn't have much appreciation for fifth starters (such as in 2001, 2003, 2004) but history suggests it's dangerous to go with four guys and then hope to out slug your opponents every fifth day. Also, I know that one of the problems the Reds had with Dunn was that he struck out so often he left way too many guys left on base. But, with guys like Konerko and Quentin around him, his strikeouts won't hurt too much hopefully.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
:popcorn: Isn't it???? Anytime KW makes a deal the departing player is on his way to a great career.

Please point out the hordes of people complaining that we gave up Dan Hudson. Hang on, I'll help you, NOBODY GIVES A **** ABOUT HUDSON. People who are pissed off are pissed off because Edwin Jackson suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks.

Maybe he's trying to take the heat off Kotsay and direct fan anger at someone worse, making way more money.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
White Sox are NOT trading Edwin Jackson for Dunn.....looks like we gave up prospects

russ99
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
Jeez. Do you guys want to see a contending team or not?

Prospects are prospects. Which prospect that the Sox have dealt has really burned Kenny yet? Chris Young has been the closest, and he's been a bit of a disappointment.

That said, I'll be very disappointed if Viciedo is moved for Dunn unless the Sox get a window to extend his contract.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
Tim Kurkjian of ESPN reporting that the Nationals told him directly they are NOT trading Dunn to the White Sox for Edwin Jackson

from twitter

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
I say we end up with Dunn and either Lilly or Zambrano.

Yes, Lilly or Zambrano.

That would be great. Just get Jackson off this team. Please. :praying:

voodoochile
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
I'm just reluctant to go the rest of the way without a fourth starter, I know that Kenny doesn't have much appreciation for fifth starters (such as in 2001, 2003, 2004) but history suggests it's dangerous to go with four guys and then hope to out slug your opponents every fifth day. Also, I know that one of the problems the Reds had with Dunn was that he struck out so often he left way too many guys left on base. But, with guys like Konerko and Quentin around him, his strikeouts won't hurt too much hopefully.

Trust me there's NO WAY they go to a four man rotation. They'll give the job to Harrell or Torres before they do that.

1908<2005
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
Tim Kurkjian of ESPN reporting that the Nationals told him directly they are NOT trading Dunn to the White Sox for Edwin Jackson
http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:28 PM
Olney saying that the Nats don't want EJ's contract.

DumpJerry
07-30-2010, 01:29 PM
I say we end up with Dunn and either Lilly or Zambrano.

Yes, Lilly or Zambrano.
I'm thinking Lilly more than Zambrano. Right now, Lilly is a better pitcher and has AL experience.

Anyone who says no to Lilly because he's a Cub needs to have his/her head examined. That is irrelevant to the discussion.

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:29 PM
Please point out the hordes of people complaining that we gave up Dan Hudson. Hang on, I'll help you, NOBODY GIVES A **** ABOUT HUDSON. People who are pissed off are pissed off because Edwin Jackson suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks.

Maybe he's trying to take the heat off Kotsay and direct fan anger at someone worse, making way more money.

And the grand scheme crystallizes.

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:29 PM
I love the idea of Guthrie. I still think Sox fans are going to be deflated when they see what they actually get with Dunn in the fold. Especially if he kicks and screams not to be a DH.

I feel like Swisher is coming back for his second trip with this whole Dunn thing.

Dunn is a million times better than Swisher.

munchman33
07-30-2010, 01:29 PM
Good job White Sox. Good job Kenny.

I'm usually in the minority of thinking around here, it's nice just once that minority thinking is in line with the teams'. :cool:

soxfan43
07-30-2010, 01:30 PM
Dunn is a million times better than Swisher.

And he's not a douchebag like Swisher. The Dirty 30 never meshed with Ozzie or the Sox.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:30 PM
Jeez. Do you guys want to see a contending team or not?

Prospects are prospects. Which prospect that the Sox have dealt has really burned Kenny yet? Chris Young has been the closest, and he's been a bit of a disappointment.

That said, I'll be very disappointed if Viciedo is moved for Dunn unless the Sox get a window to extend his contract.
None of the prospects dominated 5 levels of minor league one year removed from college and then got a callup and held his own. I don't think Hudson will be anything big but for Edwin Jackson? No thanks. Throwing in Holmberg is just adding to the injury. Jackson totally tanked in the second half last season. That scares me.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:31 PM
Ok, so the Sox trade 3 people for 2 months of Adam Dunn? Still not happy about this...

Adam Dunn and a serviceable 5th starter (a Ted Lilly for example) make this a World Series contender. No joke. Trade away everyone in the minors to push all the chips in.

Please, god, just don't stop with Edwin Jackson.

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:32 PM
Trust me there's NO WAY they go to a four man rotation. They'll give the job to Harrell or Torres before they do that.

I know they aren't going to a four man rotation, but if your fifth start sucks (and with all due respect to Lucas Harrell and Carlos Torres, they don't exactly inspire a whole lot of confidence) then you're back to where you were in 2001-2004. Yea, the fifth starter might start "only" eight games, but those eight games mean a hell of a lot when you're battling for a division title.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:32 PM
Adam Dunn and a serviceable 5th starter (a Ted Lilly for example) make this a World Series contender. No joke. Trade away everyone in the minors to push all the chips in.

Please, god, just don't stop with Edwin Jackson.
Relax. Didn't you hear? Jackson threw a ****ing no-hitter. He's got the stuff!

rdwj
07-30-2010, 01:33 PM
Don't think we're any better off with Jackson than Hudson - hope this is going somewhere.

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:33 PM
Adam Dunn and a serviceable 5th starter (a Ted Lilly for example) make this a World Series contender. No joke. Trade away everyone in the minors to push all the chips in.

Please, god, just don't stop with Edwin Jackson.

Who do we give up to get Lilly then?

PalehosePlanet
07-30-2010, 01:33 PM
Tim Kurkjian of ESPN reporting that the Nationals told him directly they are NOT trading Dunn to the White Sox for Edwin Jackson

from twitter

Well, if this is true, then Dunn is not coming here and KW is onto plan B by now.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:33 PM
Not happy about these reports that Nats don't want Jackson.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:34 PM
Who do we give up to get Lilly then?
Viciedo :angry:

johnny bench
07-30-2010, 01:34 PM
Meh. We traded a minor leaguer who can't throw strikes for a major leaguer who can't throw strikes. What's the diff? I mean other than $8MM?

TomBradley72
07-30-2010, 01:34 PM
I'm going to have some faith in KW/Ozzie/Cooper on this one...they were right about Jenks, Thornton, Floyd, Santos...I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. (and bury my memories of Todd Ritchie, Billy Koch and MacDougal :cool:)

RCWHITESOX
07-30-2010, 01:34 PM
Just watch. If the Sox land either Dunn or Fielder people will be posting that we got ripped. I would like someone to name just one rookie we traded in the Williams era that has turned into a superstar. Give Williams credit he's trying to improve our farm system; but at the same time he wants to win. Hell he could probably get C Lee and still get ripped for trading Hudson.

hi im skot
07-30-2010, 01:34 PM
Viciedo :angry:

Nope.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:34 PM
Well, if this is true, then Dunn is not coming here and KW is onto plan B by now.

Just got a tweet that the Sox are focused only on Adam Dunn nobody else

TheCQExperience
07-30-2010, 01:35 PM
If we get Dunn and keep Jackson then this is completely awesome. Jackson has had significant control problems at times, but his upside makes it worth it. Hopefully, Coop can help him harness it.

Moses_Scurry
07-30-2010, 01:35 PM
Good job White Sox. Good job Kenny.

I'm usually in the minority of thinking around here, it's nice just once that minority thinking is in line with the teams'. :cool:

I, for one, agree with you on this one. I'll take Jackson over Hudson for 5th starter any day. I just hope some money is coming with him.

Sad
07-30-2010, 01:35 PM
Tim Kurkjian of ESPN reporting that the Nationals told him directly they are NOT trading Dunn to the White Sox for Edwin Jackson
http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX

Tim's on AM1000 right now...

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:35 PM
Not happy about these reports that Nats don't want Jackson.
I think Rizzo ****ed Kenny over by misleading him into believing he likes Jackson. Or maybe they did like Jackson but not for Dunn.

Meh. We traded a minor leaguer who can't throw strikes for a major leaguer who can't throw strikes. What's the diff? I mean other than $8MM?
That's a huge difference.

hawkjt
07-30-2010, 01:35 PM
I do not see the Nats wanting Jackson with his big contract and only 14 months on his contract. I think Kenny and Coop like Jacksons big arm. He is rated as the #4 fastball overall in mlb only behind Jimenez,Jock Johnson and Verlander at an average of 94mph. Coop can work with raw material like that.

Now maybe the Nats will want Viciedo,Morel, and other top propects for Dunn. I hope that does not happen. Please kenny,do not mortgage the future for two months. Even draft picks are not that high if Dunn walks and will take years to help the Sox.

But, not going to panic til the dust settles.

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:36 PM
Tim's on AM1000 right now...

For those of us at work can you keep us updated? Tempted to eat lunch in my car to follow this lol

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:36 PM
Just got a tweet that the Sox are focused only on Adam Dunn nobody else

Link?

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:36 PM
Jeez. Do you guys want to see a contending team or not?

Prospects are prospects. Which prospect that the Sox have dealt has really burned Kenny yet? Chris Young has been the closest, and he's been a bit of a disappointment.

That said, I'll be very disappointed if Viciedo is moved for Dunn unless the Sox get a window to extend his contract.

No one in their right mind is complaining about the prospects. We're upset because Jackson is a **** sandwich. What the hell does anyone see in him? He doesn't strike any one out. He walks a ****load of hitters. He gives up a ton of runs. Teams hit and slug well off him. He is just bad.

Maybe this is just Point B to Point C. But, right now, this is a bad deal for the Sox, I don't care if the D'backs gave him to us for free and are paying 100% of his salary, every inning Jackson pitches for us, is a loss.

Lillian
07-30-2010, 01:36 PM
Jackson was acquired almost certainly with the intention of flipping him for Dunn. It's just way too coincidental that Kenny would go get the one guy that Rizzo wants, when he himself wants the one guy that the Nats have available to trade.

Whether or not it all comes to fruition is perhaps still in doubt. However, it would be shocking if K.W. made this trade with the idea of keeping Jackson.

Crestani
07-30-2010, 01:36 PM
There is really nothing to comment on until 3:00pm tomorrow...Too much time left to speculate about anything IMO.

1908<2005
07-30-2010, 01:37 PM
Link?

http://twitter.com/BNightengale

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:37 PM
Link?

BNightengale

#mlb The White Sox focused only on Dunn; not Berkman or Fielder

hawkjt
07-30-2010, 01:37 PM
Just got a tweet that the Sox are focused only on Adam Dunn nobody else


You,sir, seem to know of what you speak. Keep us posted.:D:

balke
07-30-2010, 01:38 PM
Dunn is a million times better than Swisher.


Not if you count defensive ability.

Dunn has more power. He'll hit 5 more Hrs than Swisher would from this point of the season on. I'll give him 5 more walks too. Otherwise... I don't see much difference.

They both have the ability to hit under .240 and strikeout a ton.

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:38 PM
Just watch. If the Sox land either Dunn or Fielder people will be posting that we got ripped. I would like someone to name just one rookie we traded in the Williams era that has turned into a superstar. Give Williams credit he's trying to improve our farm system; but at the same time he wants to win. Hell he could probably get C Lee and still get ripped for trading Hudson.

We haven't given away many super stars but Chris Young, Ryan Sweeney, John Ely, Gio Gonzalez and Clayton Richard have all been servicable (with the last three being young too).

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:38 PM
You,sir, seem to know of what you speak. Keep us posted.:D:

My phone is exploding :D:

Boondock Saint
07-30-2010, 01:39 PM
Not if you count defensive ability.

Dunn has more power. He'll hit 5 more Hrs than Swisher would from this point of the season on. I'll give him 5 more walks too. Otherwise... I don't see much difference.

They both have the ability to hit under .240 and strikeout a ton.

Um...what?

Domeshot17
07-30-2010, 01:39 PM
My phone is exploding :D:

All the stuff on Bowdens page about Dunn is gone now

canOcorn
07-30-2010, 01:39 PM
I would've been able to swallow this deal if it weren't for the random Holmberg throw-in. It goes to prove that the Sox can't draft for **** if a guy you thought was a steal in the round you selected him in, ends up becoming a throw-in for Edwin "But...but I have STUFF" Jackson.

Especially after we had to give the kid a half million dollars to not attend the University of Florida. This is a horrible trade if we're eating Jackson's salary.

munchman33
07-30-2010, 01:39 PM
That's a huge difference.

So is the difference in their pitches. Jackson's a fireballer. I'd rather have a got trying to harness awesome pitches than a guy trying to harness average pitches. :shrug:

SephClone89
07-30-2010, 01:40 PM
On one hand, I'm glad we're not out a pitcher now, but on the other...a hitter sounds pretty damn good right now.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:40 PM
All the stuff on Bowdens page about Dunn is gone now

Ya saw that....what a fool

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:40 PM
Not if you count defensive ability.

Dunn has more power. He'll hit 5 more Hrs than Swisher would from this point of the season on. I'll give him 5 more walks too. Otherwise... I don't see much difference.

They both have the ability to hit under .240 and strikeout a ton.

Swisher is far from a gold glove OFer, Swisher has the potential to hit 30 HRs and drive in 90 RBIs when he is surrounded with a productive lineup (like in Oakland in '06 and New York currently), when he has to carry a lineup he struggles. Dunn can hit 40HRs and drive in 100 RBIs regardless of who is around him.

ilsox7
07-30-2010, 01:41 PM
Ya saw that....what a fool

I unfollowed him and sent him a tweet about being a coward for running from his statements. What an *******.

GoGoCrede
07-30-2010, 01:41 PM
Ya saw that....what a fool

He backtracked big time about the Damon deal, too.

psyclonis
07-30-2010, 01:41 PM
very poor trade when you factor in Jacksons poor year in the NL and the ~$10M still owed to him

How does swapping #5 starters help the Sox this year?
Who knows how this will pan out, but Hudson has way more upside...

munchman33
07-30-2010, 01:42 PM
No one in their right mind is complaining about the prospects. We're upset because Jackson is a **** sandwich. What the hell does anyone see in him? He doesn't strike any one out. He walks a ****load of hitters. He gives up a ton of runs. Teams hit and slug well off him. He is just bad.

Maybe this is just Point B to Point C. But, right now, this is a bad deal for the Sox, I don't care if the D'backs gave him to us for free and are paying 100% of his salary, every inning Jackson pitches for us, is a loss.

Stop stealing my bit! :tongue:

SephClone89
07-30-2010, 01:42 PM
He backtracked big time about the Damon deal, too.

Yeah, I thought that was him.

JB98
07-30-2010, 01:42 PM
I don't even know who Holmberg is, so I don't give a squirt of piss about him. I'm not concerned with guys who are 2-3 years away. The world could end in 2012 for all we know.

Hudson is going to be a good middle-of-the-rotation starter. I like him, sad to see him go. But you have to give something to get something, and maybe the Sox see something in Jackson.

Let's not forget that Contreras and Floyd were hot garbage when we acquired them as well. I know I personally HATED the Floyd acquisition and ended up eating my words.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:42 PM
Swisher is far from a gold glove OFer, Swisher has the potential to hit 30 HRs and drive in 90 RBIs when he is surrounded with a productive lineup (like in Oakland in '06 and New York currently), when he has to carry a lineup he struggles. Dunn can hit 40HRs and drive in 100 RBIs regardless of who is around him.

Not to mention, Swisher would be playing everyday if he were still here. So if he's an improvement, and Dunn's an improvement of him, that's like... double improvement.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:42 PM
So is the difference in their pitches. Jackson's a fireballer. I'd rather have a got trying to harness awesome pitches than a guy trying to harness average pitches. :shrug:
How many more years will it take for Jackson to harness that stuff into strikeouts? Because teams have been waiting and the time is running out. He may only be 26 but he still seems clueless as ****.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:42 PM
He backtracked big time about the Damon deal, too.

Ya he screwed up big time....what an idiot

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:44 PM
National fans are happy.....ofcourse they think that they are going to resign him which is unlikely at this point

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:44 PM
So is the difference in their pitches. Jackson's a fireballer. I'd rather have a got trying to harness awesome pitches than a guy trying to harness average pitches. :shrug:

I think I would rather have a 23 year old kid who is being projected by some people to be a front of the line starter and is cheap rather than a 26 year old who has a 1.5 WHIP and high four ERA that is owed eight million dollars and keeps bouncing around from team to team. Call me crazy, I'd rather go with the potential for greatness rather than the known mediocrity.

munchman33
07-30-2010, 01:44 PM
How many more years will it take for Jackson to harness that stuff into strikeouts? Because teams have been waiting and the time is running out. He may only be 26 but he still seems clueless as ****.

He was pretty darn good last year. Oh, and Coop'll fix 'em. :tongue:

kufram
07-30-2010, 01:44 PM
There is really nothing to comment on until 3:00pm tomorrow...Too much time left to speculate about anything IMO.


Yes. If you can keep your head when everyone around you is losing theirs.. etc., etc.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:44 PM
Let's not forget that Contreras and Floyd were hot garbage when we acquired them as well. I know I personally HATED the Floyd acquisition and ended up eating my words.

The thing that bothers me about that comparison is that Contreras and Floyd were reclamation projects who didn't make any real contributions to the Sox until well after they were acquired. There's a chance Coop see something in Jackson he can work with, I don't know, but how fast can he turn him around? At his present level of play, he is an unacceptable answer for a starting pitcher in a chase for the play-offs. If we're stuck here with him, what's the point of this move if we don't see dividends until 2011?

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:46 PM
Looks like a Dunn deal could still happen.....alot of mixed rumors still out there

Coops4Aces
07-30-2010, 01:46 PM
Looks like a Dunn deal could still happen.....alot of mixed rumors still out there

I trust you very much

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:47 PM
Jackson for Dunn is not happening guys

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:47 PM
Yes. If you can keep your head when everyone around you is losing theirs.. etc., etc.

Get off your high horse, nobody has "lost their mind," it is possible to have rational, level-headed conversations about why you personally disagree with the moves the Sox are making. I'm sorry, it is possible to not be in love with a guy who has a WHIP of 1.500, walks 4 guys every 9 innings, and strikes out fewer than 6.5 per 9 innings.

Hmmm... A guy who lets on a ****load of runners, has control issues, and can't harness his power fastball to strike guys out... SIGN MY ASS UP.

SephClone89
07-30-2010, 01:47 PM
Yes. If you can keep your head when everyone around you is losing theirs.. etc., etc.

If you can dream--and not make dreams your master...if you can think--and not make thoughts your aim...

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:47 PM
Brett Ballantini still thinks Dunn is going to come here one way or another.

http://twitter.com/CSNChi_Beatnik

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:47 PM
The thing that bothers me about that comparison is that Contreras and Floyd were reclamation projects who didn't make any real contributions to the Sox until well after they were acquired. There's a chance Coop see something in Jackson he can work with, I don't know, but how fast can he turn him around? At his present level of play, he is an unacceptable answer for a starting pitcher in a chase for the play-offs. If we're stuck here with him, what's the point of this move if we don't see dividends until 2011?

Agreed, we were pretty much done when we got Jose in '04 and while we got Floyd at the start of '07 that season turned out to be a disaster so letting him learn on the job wasn't that big of a deal. We're very much in the hunt right now and having Coop try to fix someone know is very risky. At least with Hudson there was a much greater upside, the kid is 23 and is projected to be a front of the line kind of guy. Jackson is what he is and that is a mediocre at best pitcher.

october23sp
07-30-2010, 01:47 PM
I am very weary of his ERA but I really don't know anything about him.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
He was pretty darn good last year. Oh, and Coop'll fix 'em. :tongue:
For some reason, Jackson tanked big time in the second half in 2008 and 2009. He was dominant in the first half of 2009, I'll give you that but his 5.00 ERA second half is alarming given that he's done that in 2008 too. Oh wait, Coop'll fix'em? Dear me, why was I worried? Goodness, we got a steal in this trade!

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
Jackson for Dunn is not happening guys

Why? Source? Link?

balke
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
what's the point of this move if we don't see dividends until 2011?


I think Sale is ready to play some baseball next year. Maybe this move was partially to make room.

I can also see the Sox thinking - hey I'd rather have a guy if we do make the playoffs who can come in with some fireball stuff out of the pen. Jackson does throw hard - and would look good as a long reliever if the Sox make the playoffs.

Also - this does take some risk out of the situation. If the Sox miss the playoffs this year because they didn't get a 5th starter who is proven - Kenny might get axed.

I hate Jackson's stats - but will give him 5 starts til I say this is the worst move ever.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
Obtaining Adam Dunn a Priority for White Sox:

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicagowhite-sox/post/_/id/1164/obtaining-adam-dunn-a-priority-for-white-sox

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:48 PM
Jackson for Dunn is not happening guys

Good God you just said there were lots of rumors out there! What do you know?!

harwar
07-30-2010, 01:49 PM
i really appreciate these twitter updates since i have no idea how to find them ..

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:49 PM
Why? Source? Link?

It was on that radio station that was just posted....they dont like Jacksons 8 million

dickallen15
07-30-2010, 01:49 PM
You,sir, seem to know of what you speak. Keep us posted.:D:
Just take it with a grain of salt. The guy who was tweeting has Jackson making double what he's really making this year.

ShoelessJoeS
07-30-2010, 01:49 PM
Ok... if we flip Jackson for Dunn, who's the 5th starter?

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:49 PM
Agreed, we were pretty much done when we got Jose in '04 and while we got Floyd at the start of '07 that season turned out to be a disaster so letting him learn on the job wasn't that big of a deal. We're very much in the hunt right now and having Coop try to fix someone know is very risky. At least with Hudson there was a much greater upside, the kid is 23 and is projected to be a front of the line kind of guy. Jackson is what he is and that is a mediocre at best pitcher.

I don't think anyone has ever really projected Hudson to be at the front of the line of a good starting rotation. His ceiling is, at best a #3. So I don't mind too much that we dealt him, but I really fail to see how this move will benefit the Sox in the short-term. Jackson has some things he needs to work out, and we need him on the hill in what? 5 days?

TheOldRoman
07-30-2010, 01:50 PM
I am eager to see where we are at 3 p.m. tomorrow. I will reserve judgment until then. I will say that it's good Jackson is one of the guys that Cooper has wanted to get his hands on for a while. If he is moved for Dunn, we have to get another trade to fill in the 5 spot.

What has our dear friend Cowley said recent? Any updates on the megatrade?

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:50 PM
I trust you very much

I appreciate it :smile:

There is a reason Im in communications.I really want to do this for a job.

sox1970
07-30-2010, 01:50 PM
Anything is possible in the next 26 hours. A day ago, the Sox were out of the Dunn sweepstakes altogether. I think Jackson could go still if Kenny has something else brewing.

voodoochile
07-30-2010, 01:50 PM
So is the difference in their pitches. Jackson's a fireballer. I'd rather have a got trying to harness awesome pitches than a guy trying to harness average pitches. :shrug:

This is a huge point. If he can be fixed then Coop will get it done. If he can't be than he's still an adequate 5th starter.

If he doesn't get flipped the Sox are set for next year's starting rotation too. Maybe he gets flipped for Lilly...

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
I think we will have to unload the rest of the farm for Dunn if were going to make something happen

october23sp
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
Well no matter what happens we will either have an OK 5th starter or a decent bat.

Crede24Thome25
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
****, I give up, Rizzo is starting to piss me off.

Coops4Aces
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
It was on that radio station that was just posted....they dont like Jacksons 8 million

:scratch: Did they just realize his contract?

nitetrain8601
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
Agreed, we were pretty much done when we got Jose in '04 and while we got Floyd at the start of '07 that season turned out to be a disaster so letting him learn on the job wasn't that big of a deal. We're very much in the hunt right now and having Coop try to fix someone know is very risky. At least with Hudson there was a much greater upside, the kid is 23 and is projected to be a front of the line kind of guy. Jackson is what he is and that is a mediocre at best pitcher.

I don't think Hudson is projected as a front line starter. His potential is a good #3. That's a mid rotation guy.

doublem23
07-30-2010, 01:51 PM
I think Sale is ready to play some baseball next year. Maybe this move was partially to make room.

Jackson is under contract for 2011 for the low low price of $8.35 M.

munchman33
07-30-2010, 01:52 PM
I think I would rather have a 23 year old kid who is being projected by some people to be a front of the line starter and is cheap rather than a 26 year old who has a 1.5 WHIP and high four ERA that is owed eight million dollars and keeps bouncing around from team to team. Call me crazy, I'd rather go with the potential for greatness rather than the known mediocrity.

Where is this magical super optimistic scouting report? The bulk of reports I've seen say his ceiling is a 4, the optimistic one's a 3. Conversely, Jackson has one of the best fastballs in baseball. The potential for that is endless.

kufram
07-30-2010, 01:52 PM
Get off your high horse, nobody has "lost their mind," it is possible to have rational, level-headed conversations about why you personally disagree with the moves the Sox are making. I'm sorry, it is possible to not be in love with a guy who has a WHIP of 1.500, walks 4 guys every 9 innings, and strikes out fewer than 6.5 per 9 innings.

Hmmm... A guy who lets on a ****load of runners, has control issues, and can't harness his power fastball to strike guys out... SIGN MY ASS UP.


But nothing is done yet.

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:52 PM
:scratch: Did they just realize his contract?

Honestly I think its all just a bunch of BS from Rizzo. They wanted Jackson.Kenny has delivered it.

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:52 PM
With the exception of Thornton, Coop doesn't have a good history of fixing fireballers. Just sayin'...

kittle42
07-30-2010, 01:52 PM
I hear that Adam Dunn may be traded to the White Sox.

I hear that Adam Dunn may not be traded to the White Sox.

Link? SOURCE! Is this your pure speculation?!

Somehow, the above three lines have turned into about 750 posts.

DirtySox
07-30-2010, 01:53 PM
Honestly I think its all just a bunch of BS from Rizzo. They wanted Jackson.Kenny has delivered it.

I think they are holding out for more. By no means is this done. (Dunn?)

WhiteSox5187
07-30-2010, 01:53 PM
I don't think anyone has ever really projected Hudson to be at the front of the line of a good starting rotation. His ceiling is, at best a #3. So I don't mind too much that we dealt him, but I really fail to see how this move will benefit the Sox in the short-term. Jackson has some things he needs to work out, and we need him on the hill in what? 5 days?

Buster Olney quoted a couple of scouts as saying they see him being a "front of the line" kind of guy.

voodoochile
07-30-2010, 01:54 PM
With the exception of Thornton, Coop doesn't have a good history of fixing fireballers. Just sayin'...

Well yeah, but wasn't Thornton's big problem control just like Jackson? Also he did okay with Bobby too...

Baron
07-30-2010, 01:54 PM
http://dc.sbnation.com/2010/7/30/1596763/adam-dunn-white-sox-trade-rumor-edwin-jackson-nationals

Adam Dunn has been informed that he wont be traded to White Sox for Edwin Jackson

Pablo_Honey
07-30-2010, 01:54 PM
Buster Olney quoted a couple of scouts as saying they see him being a "front of the line" kind of guy.
He's always been labelled as such. The problem is, the results simply aren't there so far. I'd gladly eat my crow if Coop can fix him but I remain doubtful.

seventyseven
07-30-2010, 01:54 PM
With the exception of Thornton, Coop doesn't have a good history of fixing fireballers. Just sayin'...

Jenks?