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DirtySox
06-16-2010, 11:47 AM
This thread will be used to keep track of the ongoing signing of 2010 draft picks. Feel free to contribute if you come across anything I have missed, and I will update the list accordingly.

Bold will indicate a player has signed. August 16th is the signing deadline.


1. Chris Sale LHP Fla. Gulf Coast
2. Jacob Petricka RHP Indiana State
3. Addison Reed RHP San Diego St.
3. Thomas Royse RHP Louisville
4. Matthew Grimes RHP Mill Creek, Ga.
5. Andrew Wilkins 1B Arkansas
6. Rangel Ravelo 3B Hialeah, Fla.
7. Tyler Saladino SS Oral Roberts
8. Josef Terry 2B Cerritos Coll.
9. Kevin Moran RHP Boston Coll.
10. Ross Wilson 2B Alabama
11. James McDonald SS Chaparral, Az.
12. Crayton Lee SS Morehead St.
13. Ethan Icard RHP Wilkes CC
14. Michael Blanke C U. of Tampa
15. Sean O'Connell C Chatsworth, Cal.
16. Edward McCray RHP Tennessee
17. Michael Schwartz 1B U. of Tampa
18. Randall Thorpe LF San Jacinto N.
19. Douglas Murray RHP San Francisco
20. Jose Ramos C W. Okla. St.
21. Tyler Jones RHP Madison Coll
22. Ozney Guillen RF Opa Locka, Fla.
23. Austin Evans RHP U. of Tampa
24. Jordan Keegan OF Col. of S. Nev.
25. Ethan Wilson SS Indiana
26. Kevin Rath LHP CS Fullerton
27. Pete Gehle LHP Azuza Pacific
28. Thomas Windle LHP Osseo, Minn.
29. Michael Earley OF Indiana
30. Kylin Turnbull LHP Santa Barb. CC
31. Robert Young LHP Dartmouth
32. Jarrett Casey LHP Nrthrn Kentucky
33. Jamaal Hollis RHP Miami (Ohio)
34. Dusty Harvard CF Oklahoma St.
35. John Spatola OF Boston College.
36. Benjamin Griset LHP Gustine, Calif.
37. Christopher Lee LHP Tampa, Fla.
38. Bradley Salgado SS Temecula, Calif.
39. Levi Schlick LHP Barton County CC
40. Conrad Gregor RF Carmel, Ind.
41. Samuel Phippen RHP UC Santa Barbara
42. Brett Bruening RHP Texas Tech
43. Lucas Irvine RHP Northwestern St.
44. Matthew Chavez RHP San Francisco
45. Ronald Cotton OF Florence, Ky.
46. Ronzelle Fort LHP Chicago
47. Matt Reida 2B Russiaville, Ind.
48. Audry Santana 2B Cape Coral, Fla.
49. Pat Schatz RHP Iowa
50. David Vazquez 2B Miami Lakes, Fla.

GAsoxfan
06-16-2010, 02:27 PM
How many of the 51 are realistically expected to sign?

DirtySox
06-16-2010, 05:35 PM
Updated. No-one too significant though.

doublem23
06-16-2010, 06:05 PM
Any ideas how much it will take to ink Sale?

DirtySox
06-16-2010, 06:08 PM
Any ideas how much it will take to ink Sale?

No idea. Unsure what suggested slot is. Couple that with Sale originally slated to go near the top 5, and he might be expecting more money. Jeff might have some insight once he reads this though.

Jeff B
06-16-2010, 06:27 PM
No idea. Unsure what suggested slot is. Couple that with Sale originally slated to go near the top 5, and he might be expecting more money. Jeff might have some insight once he reads this though.
Slot for the 13th pick last year was estimated at $1.656m. The recommendations are reportedly higher this year but players have been generally signing for less than last year.

The closest pick to #13 that has signed is Jake Skole at #15. He got $1,557,000.

Like you say though he could be looking for top 5 money (>$2.5m), or at least something in the $2m range.

Who knows though, I haven't read anything on the negotiations or Sale's bonus demand.

cws05champ
06-16-2010, 09:29 PM
I hope they get Joseph Terry, Grimes, MacDonal and Wilkens signed. And this draft will be a complete bust unless Ozney Guillen in signed!!!

Oh, and Levi Schlick....just because it would be a great name to have on the team.

soxfanreggie
06-16-2010, 10:04 PM
I could care less if #22 signs. It isn't worth the Twitter barrage of how cheap we are that we didn't give him 7 figures (don't the decimals and the point count?!?).

I'll guess Sale gets between $1.65 and $1.75 million.

DirtySox
06-20-2010, 11:39 AM
Seems McDonald won't be signing.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/Blog/jeffmetcalfe/87327

DirtySox
06-20-2010, 07:22 PM
http://a1.twimg.com/profile_images/799878370/harrison_pick_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA) jimcallisBA (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA)
White Sox, No. 13 overall pick Chris Sale agree to $1.656 million bonus. http://ht.ly/20WsA #mlbdraft (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23mlbdraft) 33 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA/status/16653014200) via HootSuite (http://www.hootsuite.com/)

EMachine10
06-20-2010, 07:24 PM
http://a1.twimg.com/profile_images/799878370/harrison_pick_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA) jimcallisBA (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA)
White Sox, No. 13 overall pick Chris Sale agree to $1.656 million bonus. http://ht.ly/20WsA #mlbdraft (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23mlbdraft) 33 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA/status/16653014200) via HootSuite (http://www.hootsuite.com/)
Excellent. I wonder when he's going to start throwing - will he take a little break?

DirtySox
06-20-2010, 07:27 PM
Woah.

Supposedly a reason the terms were so agreeable was that the Sox agreed to give a chance for Sale to join the bullpen this year. Chris will report to W-S with hopes of being promoted to Charlotte by July and to Chicago in August. He will than return to starting in the AFL with a chance to break camp with the Sox next year as a SP.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/draft/?p=2550

EMachine10
06-20-2010, 07:29 PM
Woah.

Supposedly a reason the terms were so agreeable was that the Sox agreed to give a chance for Sale to join the bullpen this year. He will than return to starting in the AFL with a chance to break camp with the Sox next year.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/draft/?p=2550
Whaaaaa?

He sounds promising, but this promising? I'm not sure about that route.

EMachine10
06-20-2010, 07:36 PM
After reading the article... beginning his pro career in WS seems right, but they seems to move him rather quickly. The article suggests he'll bypass Birmingham, spend a few weeks in Charlotte and see the pen by August. It just seems so risky, but exciting to watch.

Edit: Plus, unless they move a pitcher, is he supposed to leap frog Dan Hudson for next season?

KRS1
06-20-2010, 08:27 PM
The thing about his quick leap is a bit worrisome, but considering the fact that his stuff and command made him one of the most pro ready pitchers in the draft, it isn't too terribly disconcerting for me.

tm1119
06-20-2010, 09:06 PM
I never got the "risk" of bringing up a player quickly. A player is either going to be ready or not. There is no set amount of time that a player should spend in the minors just for the sake of development. And if the guy isnt mentally tough enough to endure failure at any level then he probably isnt destined for success anyway. If Sale shows the ability to dominate all levels of the minors this year then there really isnt any reason to think he cant contribute to the pen in Sept. Look at Mike Leake this year, he seems to be doing pretty well so far.

DirtySox
06-20-2010, 09:14 PM
Dusty Harvard and Randall Thorpe have signed.

Thorpe is somewhat interesting. Read about him here:

http://www.chicagonow.com/blogs/future-sox/2010/06/draft-report-randall-thorpe.html

cws05champ
06-20-2010, 09:45 PM
Sale probably saw Randy Williams pitch and said, "Really? I can do that."

It's really shocking and disconcerting if true. I know Mike Leake did it without going through the minors but he is the exception rather than the rule.

DirtySox
06-20-2010, 11:31 PM
http://a1.twimg.com/profile_images/799878370/harrison_pick_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA) jimcallisBA (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA)
Chisox did same thing w/Beckham. More teams shouldn't be afraid to test resolve of college jrs @jazayerli (http://twitter.com/jazayerli): So much for Sale being tough sign about 2 hours ago (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA/status/16661734944) via UberTwitter (http://ubertwitter.com/)

DirtySox
06-20-2010, 11:33 PM
Seems prep catcher Sean O'Connell has signed and is in Bristol.

Can read a bit about him here:

http://baseballbeginnings.com/2010/06/13/all-star-game/#more-7809

Lillian
06-21-2010, 07:07 AM
Woah.

Supposedly a reason the terms were so agreeable was that the Sox agreed to give a chance for Sale to join the bullpen this year. Chris will report to W-S with hopes of being promoted to Charlotte by July and to Chicago in August. He will than return to starting in the AFL with a chance to break camp with the Sox next year as a SP.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/draft/?p=2550

The Hell with August. Bring him up!!!!!!

Seriously, the quicker the better. Since there appears to be some concern about his motion, just let him be the LOOGY for the rest of this year.
That wouldn't give him enough innings to damage his arm, no matter how bad his mechanics might be.
The funky motion might make him really hard to hit, if he isn't over exposed.
He's supposed to have really good control, and two plus Big League pitches. That just might work as a LOOGY.

He wanted a chance to get to the Majors this year, so I say give it to him. Apparently, he has plenty of self confidence.
If he flops, then there is always "plan B". Let him go down to the Minors and prepare to be a starter next year.
The Sox will have fulfilled their obligation to give him a shot at the Majors this year.

It looks like a win - win situation to me.

Hitmen77
06-21-2010, 08:30 AM
Sale probably saw Randy Williams pitch and said, "Really? I can do that."

It's really shocking and disconcerting if true. I know Mike Leake did it without going through the minors but he is the exception rather than the rule.

Perhaps, in exchange for signing for less than expected, he wants to start his arbitration clock as soon as possible.

Coops4Aces
06-21-2010, 09:43 AM
The Hell with August. Bring him up!!!!!!

Seriously, the quicker the better. Since there appears to be some concern about his motion, just let him be the LOOGY for the rest of this year.
That wouldn't give him enough innings to damage his arm, no matter how bad his mechanics might be.
The funky motion might make him really hard to hit, if he isn't over exposed.
He's supposed to have really good control, and two plus Big League pitches. That just might work as a LOOGY.

He wanted a chance to get to the Majors this year, so I say give it to him. Apparently, he has plenty of self confidence.
If he flops, then there is always "plan B". Let him go down to the Minors and prepare to be a starter next year.
The Sox will have fulfilled their obligation to give him a shot at the Majors this year.

It looks like a win - win situation to me.

This x 100000

I would guess he would do much better than Williams as a LOOGY and maybe he could also eat some innings if a starter has a rough outing. We don't have a real long man.

cws05champ
06-21-2010, 12:43 PM
I wonder how Dan Hudson and Carlos Torres would feel about Sale leap frogging them to the majors? I know the popular opinion is " who cares what they think", but these guys are human and probably be pretty disappointed getting snubbed for a guy that just got drafted a few weeks ago.

If Sale is as good as advertised though the future rotation looks fairly good with Sale, Hudson added to it.

Huisj
06-21-2010, 12:54 PM
I wonder how Dan Hudson and Carlos Torres would feel about Sale leap frogging them to the majors? I know the popular opinion is " who cares what they think", but these guys are human and probably be pretty disappointed getting snubbed for a guy that just got drafted a few weeks ago.

If Sale is as good as advertised though the future rotation looks fairly good with Sale, Hudson added to it.

The big difference between Sale and those two guys is the arm they throw with.

DirtySox
06-21-2010, 01:17 PM
Thoughts on the Sale Signing (http://www.mlbbonusbaby.com/2010/6/21/1528586/thoughts-on-chris-sale)

Randar68
06-21-2010, 02:08 PM
Thoughts on the Sale Signing (http://www.mlbbonusbaby.com/2010/6/21/1528586/thoughts-on-chris-sale)

You still have to perform and in my opinion, that is always tough for a kid from college straight to the pros. Huge difference in learning to pitch at this level, even if it is just spot duty in September. If the Sox manage to really get into the race here over the next 2 months, I don't see how they can afford to do this unless he is mowing them down in AAA by that point.

cards press box
06-21-2010, 02:12 PM
Thoughts on the Sale Signing (http://www.mlbbonusbaby.com/2010/6/21/1528586/thoughts-on-chris-sale)

Excellent read -- it appears that both the Sox and Sale took a smart and nuanced approach to negotiations. Kudos to both sides and here's hoping that Sale excels as the Sox 2nd lefty reliever this August and as a future starter.

DonnieDarko
06-21-2010, 08:12 PM
Man, if Sales is going to be competing for a starting job next year, that begs the question of what the hell are we going to do with Torres and Hudson. Hudson deserves the first jab at a starting job in my mind.

Now that I think about it, Garcia might not be back next year. Buehrle, too. Danks might decide not to sign. So now that I think about it, this makes sense. Now, don't get me wrong, I hope that the above doesn't happen (minus Garcia, since I think that Hudson needs to get his shot in the bigs), but it's certainly a possibility. White Sox upper management must be thinking the same thing, otherwise why would they be doing this?

Coops4Aces
06-21-2010, 08:22 PM
Man, if Sales is going to be competing for a starting job next year, that begs the question of what the hell are we going to do with Torres and Hudson. Hudson deserves the first jab at a starting job in my mind.

Now that I think about it, Garcia might not be back next year. Buehrle, too. Danks might decide not to sign. So now that I think about it, this makes sense. Now, don't get me wrong, I hope that the above doesn't happen (minus Garcia, since I think that Hudson needs to get his shot in the bigs), but it's certainly a possibility. White Sox upper management must be thinking the same thing, otherwise why would they be doing this?

Too much pitching is a good problem to have :wink:

soxfanreggie
06-21-2010, 08:44 PM
If Sale can get things done for the Sox, then I'm all for him being on the roster later in the year. He's a great talent, and I'm sure the Sox and Sale's people have the best interest of both the Sox and Sale in mind.

tacosalbarojas
06-21-2010, 10:01 PM
Excellent read -- it appears that both the Sox and Sale took a smart and nuanced approach to negotiations. Kudos to both sides and here's hoping that Sale excels as the Sox 2nd lefty reliever this August and as a future starter.
I heard in one of the interviews about this pick that his girlfriend was expecting...perhaps one of the reasons he signed pretty easily.

DirtySox
06-22-2010, 03:51 PM
Ross Wilson, Tyler Saladino, and Kevin Rath have signed.

Updated.

sox1970
06-22-2010, 05:00 PM
I heard in one of the interviews about this pick that his girlfriend was expecting...perhaps one of the reasons he signed pretty easily.

Sale became a father in May, I believe.

DirtySox
06-22-2010, 05:07 PM
http://a1.twimg.com/profile_images/383508590/2879639_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/cst_sox) cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
The first-round pick is in the building, as the Sox will make his signing official in the next hour. 22 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/cst_sox/status/16800645052) via UberTwitter (http://ubertwitter.com/)

Rockabilly
06-26-2010, 02:09 PM
McDonald has decided to go to ASU.

Rockabilly
06-26-2010, 03:15 PM
http://www.swac.org/sports/m-basebl/spec-rel/062210aaa.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

DirtySox
06-29-2010, 10:16 AM
Kevin Moran signs.

Eye in the sky
06-29-2010, 10:45 AM
Brad Salgado signed.

DirtySox
06-29-2010, 10:57 AM
Brad Salgado signed.

Wow. Very nice.

Just like last year with the inside scoop.

Appreciated.

DirtySox
07-08-2010, 10:05 PM
Wilkins signs.

CPditka
07-12-2010, 09:47 AM
Any updates on Grimes?

DirtySox
07-23-2010, 01:01 PM
We will start to hear about some over-draft signings of the smaller bonus variety in the next week or so. While it's baseless speculation, Andy Seiler thinks that Grimes will sign.

http://www.mlbbonusbaby.com/2010/7/23/1584447/predictions-for-signings-next-week

cards press box
07-25-2010, 08:49 PM
Any word on whether Ozney Guillen will sign with the Sox?

DirtySox
07-25-2010, 08:51 PM
Any word on whether Ozney Guillen will sign with the Sox?

Not sure if joking.

cards press box
07-25-2010, 08:57 PM
Not sure if joking.

I wasn't joking but I do know that Ozney being drafted 22nd was a major source of conflict between Ozzie and KW. I wondered if the Sox were going top overslot Ozney in an attempt: (a) to sign a good prospect and (b) to mend some fences with Ozzie.

DirtySox
07-25-2010, 08:58 PM
I wasn't joking but I do know that Ozney being drafted 22nd was a major source of conflict between Ozzie and KW. I wondered if the Sox were going top overslot Ozney in an attempt: (a) to sign a good prospect and (b) to mend some fences with Ozzie.

He really isn't that good of a prospect. Better than Oney, but that isn't saying much. I don't expect him to sign.

Edit: And I recall that Ozney has been tweeting about being at school already. So I assume he's already made up his mind.

DirtySox
08-10-2010, 02:05 PM
Phippen signed.

CPditka
08-11-2010, 09:05 AM
Whats the latest on Grimes?

DirtySox
08-11-2010, 10:10 AM
Whats the latest on Grimes?

A few sources claim he is going to college.

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 10:52 AM
Signing deadline is today.

http://a3.twimg.com/profile_images/1048112299/georgia_1990_champions_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA) jimcallisBA (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA)
Pessimistic on both. @ProfessorFog (http://twitter.com/ProfessorFog): Any word on the #WhiteSox (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23WhiteSox) and Grimes? How about Terry? #mlbdraft (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23mlbdraft) 4 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/jimcallisBA/status/21324740735) via HootSuite (http://www.hootsuite.com/)


White Sox likely being cheap per usual. The possibility of missing out on both a 4th and 8th round pick is kind of sickening. No compensation is given for either obviously.

PolishPrince34
08-16-2010, 11:48 AM
Grimes is looking for $500,000 and Terry can probably be signed in the $200,000 range. What's another $800,000 when you haven't spent a dime on any international signings.

russ99
08-16-2010, 11:49 AM
Signing deadline is today.

White Sox likely being cheap per usual. The possibility of missing out on both a 4th and 8th round pick is kind of sickening. No compensation is given for either obviously.

I don't see the Sox being cheap here. 4th and 8th round picks shouldn't go for much more than slot, unless the Sox think they have a stud and go over just to sign them. If we were unwilling to go extra with a 1st, sandwich or 2nd rounder, then I could understand the accusation.

BTW - the Yankees went way over (4-5 times) slot for 2 later-round picks this weekend. That sets a really bad precedent.

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 11:54 AM
I don't see the Sox being cheap here. 4th and 8th round picks shouldn't go for much more than slot, unless the Sox think they have a stud and go over just to sign them. If we were unwilling to go extra with a 1st, sandwich or 2nd rounder, then I could understand the accusation.

BTW - the Yankees went way over (4-5 times) slot for 2 later-round picks this weekend. That sets a really bad precedent.

Grimes was going to likely cost over slot no matter what. He has a GA Tech commit and a decent chance to improve his stock in college. This isn't news to the White Sox or anyone paying attention. If they weren't prepared to go over-slot they shouldn't pick Grimes with a 4th round pick. Also pointed out above, if a team isn't going to spend a single dime on international free agency, skimping on the draft is even more unforgivable. Punting on your 4th, 8th, and 11th round pick is stupid.

White Sox draft spending has been abysmal generally, no reason to think that this year things will be different.

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 11:56 AM
BTW - the Yankees went way over (4-5 times) slot for 2 later-round picks this weekend. That sets a really bad precedent.

So?

Teams spend on the draft now. The White Sox need to as well.

russ99
08-16-2010, 12:06 PM
So?

Teams spend on the draft now. The White Sox need to as well.

Some teams over-spend on the draft, others don't like to go over slot. It's a matter of philsophy.

If you expect Jerry to OK going well over slot to sign a 4th rounder, you're kidding yourself. Who knows why they drafted the kid, maybe got an read that he would be more signable than he is...

And who's to say the Sox won't sign any international prospects, as that occurs most often in the offseason. That budget is separate from the draft budget anyway.

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 12:13 PM
Some teams over-spend on the draft, others don't like to go over slot. It's a matter of philsophy.

If you expect Jerry to OK going well over slot to sign a 4th rounder, you're kidding yourself. Who knows why they drafted the kid, maybe got an read that he would be more signable than he is...

And who's to say the Sox won't sign any international prospects, as that occurs most often in the offseason. That budget is separate from the draft budget anyway.

It's a matter of being cheap.

Plenty of international free agents have signed. Sources report the White Sox aren't expected to offer a single 5 figure bonus to any of them.

PolishPrince34
08-16-2010, 12:33 PM
I agree with Dirty Sox, why pick Grimes in the 4th who was going to be a tough sign with a strong commitment to GT without going over the slot. 85% of the league is doing it. Even the Mets went over the slot with 2 players and they have been even worse than the White Sox the last 4 years with spending in the draft.

Pablo_Honey
08-16-2010, 01:23 PM
If we were unwilling to go extra with a 1st, sandwich or 2nd rounder, then I could understand the accusation.
The problem is that the Sox are being very sneaky with their higher round picks. The Broadway/McCulloch debacle was way too blatant of a pure economic decision, and the Sox brass got a lot of flack for it. As the result, they started drafting higher ceiling guys that are willing to sign at slot or a little bit more than slot in first two rounds or so. Doesn't mean they are drafting the best talents available (Phegley over Scheppers? No wait, Phegley in supplemental round? Hello?), they are just fooling people into believing that their drafting philosophy has taken a 360 when in reality it's taken about a 180 turn.

Seriously, how many high round picks did we bust the slot big time on? Zero. Yes, we've busted the slots before but ultimately we barely went over the slots even in those cases, and we go overslot on marginal lower round picks (Upchurch comes to mind). I do like the fact we nabbed guys like Mitchell and Sale with our first picks but past those picks, we keep picking signable picks and let go better talents like Grimes. Of course, then again there is the ****ty job of developing prospects we do, but I digress.

khan
08-16-2010, 01:26 PM
The problem is that the Sox are being very sneaky with their higher round picks. The Broadway/McCulloch debacle was way too blatant of a pure economic decision, and the Sox brass got a lot of flack for it. As the result, they started drafting higher ceiling guys that are willing to sign at slot or a little bit more than slot in first two rounds or so. Doesn't mean they are drafting the best talents available (Phegley over Scheppers? No wait, Phegley in supplemental round? Hello?), they are just fooling people into believing that their drafting philosophy has taken a 360 when in reality it's taken about a 180 turn.

Huh?

Pablo_Honey
08-16-2010, 01:43 PM
Huh?
Well, the way I see it, the Sox draft picks were all about signability before 2006. Now, IMHO, it's about half signability and half talent, but more often than not, signability takes priority before talent. The Sox brass has made it sound like they are basing draft picks on talent alone, which I don't think is true at all.

khan
08-16-2010, 01:53 PM
Well, the way I see it, the Sox draft picks were all about signability before 2006. Now, IMHO, it's about half signability and half talent, but more often than not, signability takes priority before talent. The Sox brass has made it sound like they are basing draft picks on talent alone, which I don't think is true at all.

1. It has been, and will ALWAYS be about signability in this organization. [Together with the drafting weakness and developmental weakness and th utter lack of an international scouting dept, this is one of the reasons why the Jackson trade was stupid.]

2. A 360 degree turn means that you're still heading the same direction as before the turn. A 180 degree turn means that you're heading in the opposite direction after the turn. Hence, the bolded part of your previous post was confusing. Can you clarify this geometric reference?

Pablo_Honey
08-16-2010, 02:08 PM
2. A 360 degree turn means that you're still heading the same direction as before the turn. A 180 degree turn means that you're heading in the opposite direction after the turn. Hence, the bolded part of your previous post was confusing. Can you clarify this geometric reference?
No, you are right. I meant 180 when I said 360. Wow, just wow...Can't believe I didn't figure that out long before. Haha, I guess that's what a lack of sleep does to me :redface:

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 04:51 PM
http://a2.twimg.com/profile_images/518275190/olney_buster_m_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN) Buster_ESPN (http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN)
What we are seeing today almost across the board in the draft-pick signings: Most teams are completely ignoring the slot recommendations. 13 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN/status/21346803446) via web

PolishPrince34
08-16-2010, 05:06 PM
Except for the White Sox

Daver
08-16-2010, 06:17 PM
http://a2.twimg.com/profile_images/518275190/olney_buster_m_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN) Buster_ESPN (http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN)
What we are seeing today almost across the board in the draft-pick signings: Most teams are completely ignoring the slot recommendations. 13 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN/status/21346803446) via web

Except for the White Sox

Overpaying for unproven talent for a team that has a history of not being able to develop talent is not a very wise move.

Sockinchisox
08-16-2010, 10:28 PM
No Grimes.

http://twitter.com/ysportsncaabb/status/21370681467

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 10:35 PM
No Grimes.

http://twitter.com/ysportsncaabb/status/21370681467

Figures. :rolleyes:

Supposedly slot was around $250,000 and he was seeking near $500,000. Not a big deal for most teams.

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 10:51 PM
#Fullerton (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23Fullerton). #Rays (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23Rays) 7th-rdr Michael Lorenzen and #WhiteSox (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23WhiteSox) 8th-rdr Joe Terry are going to college. #mlbdraft (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23mlbdraft), #titans (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23titans)http://twitter.com/ysportsncaabb/statuses/21371379334


Pathetic draft spending is pathetic.

DirtySox
08-16-2010, 11:46 PM
http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/749525740/mlbbonusbaby-xl_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler) AndySeiler (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler)
Oh the White Sox. They hand out a pathetic $3.75 million. Their budgets for 2009 and 2010 combined will be less than some teams' 2010s. less than a minute ago (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler/status/21376046149) via web



lulz

soltrain21
08-17-2010, 08:35 AM
http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/749525740/mlbbonusbaby-xl_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler) AndySeiler (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler)
Oh the White Sox. They hand out a pathetic $3.75 million. Their budgets for 2009 and 2010 combined will be less than some teams' 2010s. less than a minute ago (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler/status/21376046149) via web



lulz

That's really unfortunate.

soxball14
08-17-2010, 08:59 AM
Maybe instead of constantly complaining about what the Sox spend you should look at what they have brought in! Some of you are saying to spend spend spend on players that none of us have ever seen. I think rather than complaining about the Sox not spending money on those kids I have never seen, I will just trust in the fact that they have had 3 ML's in 3 years and the system is getting better with the likes of Morel, Danks, Mitchell, Thompson, ect. Not to mention they have spend millions on Vicedo and Alexei and I don't think they have done too bad.

Domeshot17
08-17-2010, 09:30 AM
Maybe instead of constantly complaining about what the Sox spend you should look at what they have brought in! Some of you are saying to spend spend spend on players that none of us have ever seen. I think rather than complaining about the Sox not spending money on those kids I have never seen, I will just trust in the fact that they have had 3 ML's in 3 years and the system is getting better with the likes of Morel, Danks, Mitchell, Thompson, ect. Not to mention they have spend millions on Vicedo and Alexei and I don't think they have done too bad.

The Sox have one of the worst (IF NOT THE WORST) Farm in all of baseball. Some teams draft poorly, some develop poorly, some spend poorly, the Sox do all 3!

Morel is nice but not a very highly regarded prospect. Jordan Danks is a dime a dozen 4th-5th OF prospect, Trayce Thompson jury is still out some love him some hate him, Mitchell was a step in the right direction, but drafting a total tear down project like he was is dangerous for a team that has no idea how to develop anyone.

There isn't much to be excited about with our system. Morel may realistically be our best prospect outside of Sale, and he projects as a sub 800 OPS 3rd base, not exactly setting the world on fire.

Edit: Also, there are some guys here who have seen these kids and are very versed on the minor league system. I don't claim to be one of them, but we have some really smart posters with the minor leagues here.

khan
08-17-2010, 09:48 AM
Figures. :rolleyes:

Supposedly slot was around $250,000 and he was seeking near $500,000. Not a big deal for most teams.
This is criminal. A mere $250K? For ****s sake, this is a ****ing joke!

http://twitter.com/ysportsncaabb/statuses/21371379334


Pathetic draft spending is pathetic.
Agreed.

http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/749525740/mlbbonusbaby-xl_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler) AndySeiler (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler)
Oh the White Sox. They hand out a pathetic $3.75 million. Their budgets for 2009 and 2010 combined will be less than some teams' 2010s. less than a minute ago (http://twitter.com/AndySeiler/status/21376046149) via web
And yet, KW will throw around a combined $12M to sign a SP with questionable numbers in the little boy NL, and a greedy agent. This is the DEFINITION of Penny wise, but POUND foolish.

Remember this, SOX fans, when KW can't get a trade done in the coming years because he doesn't have the ammo to do so. Or when the SOX don't have an adequate injury replacement for a starting player in the minors in the next few years. Or when the SOX can't put together a competitive team because they don't have the money to fix all of the holes in the roster.

khan
08-17-2010, 09:58 AM
Maybe instead of constantly complaining about what the Sox spend you should look at what they have brought in! Some of you are saying to spend spend spend on players that none of us have ever seen.
I prefer to view draft bonuses as an investment into the future. Cheap/young players that are under club control enable the team to invest more into FA to fill holes. It enables KW to get trades done. It enables the team to have adequate temporary injury replacements for the big club. It enables a team to remain competitive/relevant over the LONG HAUL, rather than constantly ebbing and flowing above and below .500.

The additional $250K on Grimes may not have paid off EVER. But, in the big view of things, it isn't all that much money, compared to having to pay a BORAS CLIENT $8.35M in his walk year, for example.

$8.35M to a BORAS CLIENT in his walk year to a guy who hasn't been consistently-good is the definition of "spend spend spend," IMO.

I think rather than complaining about the Sox not spending money on those kids I have never seen, I will just trust in the fact that they have had 3 ML's in 3 years and the system is getting better with the likes of Morel, Danks, Mitchell, Thompson, ect. Not to mention they have spend millions on Vicedo and Alexei and I don't think they have done too bad.
It would help to compare what the SOX system has provided, both in terms of players IN the SOX, as well as available to trade. The reality is that "3 ML's in 3 years" is really craptacular, when compared to other organizations.


As an aside, I don't believe the SOX need to have a top ten minor league system. Nor should they want to, IMO. But in a big market like Chicago, having even an AVERAGE system would work wonders for this organization.

russ99
08-17-2010, 11:51 AM
And yet, KW will throw around a combined $12M to sign a SP with questionable numbers in the little boy NL, and a greedy agent. This is the DEFINITION of Penny wise, but POUND foolish.

Remember this, SOX fans, when KW can't get a trade done in the coming years because he doesn't have the ammo to do so. Or when the SOX don't have an adequate injury replacement for a starting player in the minors in the next few years. Or when the SOX can't put together a competitive team because they don't have the money to fix all of the holes in the roster.

Sorry dude, I absolutely disagree.

If the Sox go double slot to sign Grimes, the kid drafted 4th next year thinks he can get $750k. The Yankees gave their 4th rounder $1.45 million, and their 16th rounder the same $500K Grimes wanted. This is why the draft system is broken and it will be addressed in the next CBA.

And I'd much prefer the Sox spend on a young yet established big leaguer who can strike out 11 batters in a dominant performance over overspending on some kid who's agent or family thinks he should be bribed not to go to school, and may turn out to be a nobody anyway.

And what about the picks the Sox did sign? Looking at the big picture, the overall quality of the farm system isn't going to hinge on a 4th and 8th rounder we couldn't sign.

cws05champ
08-17-2010, 12:35 PM
Sorry dude, I absolutely disagree.

If the Sox go double slot to sign Grimes, the kid drafted 4th next year thinks he can get $750k. The Yankees gave their 4th rounder $1.45 million, and their 16th rounder the same $500K Grimes wanted. This is why the draft system is broken and it will be addressed in the next CBA.

And I'd much prefer the Sox spend on a young yet established big leaguer who can strike out 11 batters in a dominant performance over overspending on some kid who's agent or family thinks he should be bribed not to go to school, and may turn out to be a nobody anyway.

But difference is, Grimes wanted only $250K more than what the Sox were offering whereas Jackson will make 32X that next year.



And what about the picks the Sox did sign? Looking at the big picture, the overall quality of the farm system isn't going to hinge on a 4th and 8th rounder we couldn't sign.
Dan Hudson was a 5th round pick...he sure made a difference in our system and what we are available to acquire. Young players in the minors are KW's currency for deals...if he has no currency, they will not be able to deal.

Jeff B
08-17-2010, 12:38 PM
Did a quick recap on what the AL Central teams spent in the draft
Link (http://bit.ly/dDgo6Z)

khan
08-17-2010, 12:40 PM
Sorry dude, I absolutely disagree.

If the Sox go double slot to sign Grimes, the kid drafted 4th next year thinks he can get $750k. The Yankees gave their 4th rounder $1.45 million, and their 16th rounder the same $500K Grimes wanted. This is why the draft system is broken and it will be addressed in the next CBA.
Sure. When the CBA changes, then the SOX must operate under the new rules. However, until then, the SOX can, and MUST operate as the rules currently exist.

When you compare what the SOX have invested into the minor leagues, both between the scouting [especially the international scouting] AND the draft bonuses to the investments made by other organizations, it is CLEAR that the SOX have not been sufficiently committed in these areas.

Because of this, the entire organization suffers from a competition standpoint. KW's ability to make trades suffers. The team suffers from a lack of financial flexibility. The team suffers from a lack of adequate injury replacements. Youngsters that might otherwise benefit from more time at a level instead have to be rushed up, due to a lack of depth in quality in the system. All in all, this is penny wise, but dollar dumb.

And I'd much prefer the Sox spend on a young yet established big leaguer who can strike out 11 batters in a dominant performance over overspending on some kid who's agent or family thinks he should be bribed not to go to school, and may turn out to be a nobody anyway.
See, you're not making a very accurate, nor a very complete comparison. If we're going to be intellectually honest, it isn't "just" Edwin Jackson vs. Grimes in terms of salary or Jackson vs. Hudson/Holmberg in terms of assets. It is:

1. The top prospect in the system, who has shown he can pitch, by virtue of his 1.59 ERA since [stupidly] being traded. [Yeah, the ERA would probably be higher in the AL, but even if you double it, a 3.18 ERA is excellent.]
2. More pitching depth in the system in Holmberg.
3. The $12M that could be given to find a replacement closer for Jenks next season, a replacement C for AJ, perhaps a starting 1B if PK leaves, a starting 3B if Vizquel retires, and yes, a measly $250K extra to Grimes to beef up a ****ty minor league system.
4. The opportunity to trade Hudson/Holmberg to fix OTHER issues now.

vs.

A hereto fore mediocre NL pitcher with an obese contract for only one more year, and a greedy agent who will make it impossible to re-sign him beyond 2011.


Me, I'd take the huge MOUNTAIN of resources in the first list over the one SP who has gotten off to a good start, but historically has been craptacular, yet expensive.


And what about the picks the Sox did sign? Looking at the big picture, the overall quality of the farm system isn't going to hinge on a 4th and 8th rounder we couldn't sign.
Every little bit helps. Particularly with a system this ****ty.

DirtySox
08-17-2010, 01:00 PM
Did a quick recap on what the AL Central teams spent in the draft
Link (http://bit.ly/dDgo6Z)

Thanks. Nice work as always.

russ99
08-17-2010, 01:36 PM
Sure. When the CBA changes, then the SOX must operate under the new rules. However, until then, the SOX can, and MUST operate as the rules currently exist.

When you compare what the SOX have invested into the minor leagues, both between the scouting [especially the international scouting] AND the draft bonuses to the investments made by other organizations, it is CLEAR that the SOX have not been sufficiently committed in these areas.

Because of this, the entire organization suffers from a competition standpoint. KW's ability to make trades suffers. The team suffers from a lack of financial flexibility. The team suffers from a lack of adequate injury replacements. Youngsters that might otherwise benefit from more time at a level instead have to be rushed up, due to a lack of depth in quality in the system. All in all, this is penny wise, but dollar dumb.

See, you're not making a very accurate, nor a very complete comparison. If we're going to be intellectually honest, it isn't "just" Edwin Jackson vs. Grimes in terms of salary or Jackson vs. Hudson/Holmberg in terms of assets. It is:

1. The top prospect in the system, who has shown he can pitch, by virtue of his 1.59 ERA since [stupidly] being traded. [Yeah, the ERA would probably be higher in the AL, but even if you double it, a 3.18 ERA is excellent.]
2. More pitching depth in the system in Holmberg.
3. The $12M that could be given to find a replacement closer for Jenks next season, a replacement C for AJ, perhaps a starting 1B if PK leaves, a starting 3B if Vizquel retires, and yes, a measly $250K extra to Grimes to beef up a ****ty minor league system.
4. The opportunity to trade Hudson/Holmberg to fix OTHER issues now.

vs.

A hereto fore mediocre NL pitcher with an obese contract for only one more year, and a greedy agent who will make it impossible to re-sign him beyond 2011.


Me, I'd take the huge MOUNTAIN of resources in the first list over the one SP who has gotten off to a good start, but historically has been craptacular, yet expensive.

Every little bit helps. Particularly with a system this ****ty.

Gotta agree with Kenny.

IMO, Big league players with experience are always preferable to questionable prospects. What's the percentage of players drafted (even in the top 4 rounds) that go on to have an average big league career?

I can't understand the dislike of Jackson and why anyone would prefer Hudson and his obvious need for further development and a guy like Holmberg who's 3 years away from even coming close to the big leagues.

Especially with the justifcation of disliking Jackson being based on his agent, his extremely limited time in the NL (instead of his years in the AL) and his payroll number for next year which is less than we paid Javy Vasquez.

Sure, we can't expect him to pitch as he has with the Sox so far all the time, but the guy has the proven talent to do so. All Hudson has proven is that he can have a few good starts with a last place NL ballclub.

Seems we have to agree to disagree. I want the Sox to commit resources to win now at the big league level, you want them build a good farm system regardless of how that affects the year-to-year success of the team.

BTW - The Twins who are such supposed drafting geniuses and can develop prospects every year spent less in the draft than the Sox did. Bonuses are only part of the equasion.

khan
08-17-2010, 01:52 PM
Gotta agree with Kenny.
Ah yes: The lazy-minded "In Kenny We Trust" stuff, right?

2005 was great, but it's fading in our memories with every passing year.

IMO, Big league players with experience are always preferable to questionable prospects.
I disagree. Historically-****ty players with experience aren't preferable to say, Bryce Harper, for example.

I can't understand the dislike of Jackson and why anyone would prefer Hudson and his obvious need for further development and a guy like Holmberg who's 3 years away from even coming close to the big leagues.

Especially with the justifcation of disliking Jackson being based on his agent, his extremely limited time in the NL (instead of his years in the AL) and his payroll number which is less than we paid Javy Vasquez.
See, there is no disliking of Jackson himself. That's entirely irrational, and we as fans have no reason to dislike the man.


What is disagreeable, however, is what Jackson cost in terms of:

1. Assets: Hudson has pitched very well since being traded, while Holmberg has a future.
2. Money: Jackson's contract is OBESE for what he provides.
3. Length of his contract.
4. His agent.
5. The state of this year's team. [Many posters do NOT see the SOX as being only "An Edwin Jackson away from a World Series" in THIS year.]
6. The near future of this team. [The $12M paid to Jackson could have gone to solve problems at Catcher, 1B, 3B, DH, Closer, RH setup, and elsewhere.]


Also, your reference to Vazquez is entirely irrelevant. When Vazquez was acquired, the SOX had just won a WS, and did NOT have the holes st 1B, 3B, DH, Closer, or RH setup that they do now. The team was younger and better than it is now. The SOX did not have two SPs already @ $15M+/yr in the team. The SOX did not have a John Danks re-signing to face.

In sum, comparing Vazquez to Edwin Jackson is akin to comparing apples to supernovae.


Sure, we can't expect him to pitch as he has with the Sox so far all the time, but the guy has the proven talent to do so.
For the money and for what was given up in trade, he'd better.

Seems we have to agree to disagree. I want the Sox to commit resources to win now at the big league level, you want them build a good farm system regardless of how that affects the year-to-year success of the team.
Disagreed with your [again] incomplete and intellectually dishonest summary here. I don't believe that Jackson will be the reason for the SOX to win a World Series. [I say a WS, because that's MY definition of "win now."]

I want to have a successful team that uses it's resources wisely, so that my team has a chance to win EACH AND EVERY YEAR, not just once a decade or so. I disdain wasting and squandering of resources with the fire of 1,000 suns. Unless the SOX make the playoffs, it sure looks like they're wasting $12M, a couple players [one of which looks pretty good in early returns, BTW], and the opportunity to trade those players for other holes in the roster.

khan
08-17-2010, 02:04 PM
BTW - The Twins who are such supposed drafting geniuses and can develop prospects every year spent less in the draft than the Sox did. Bonuses are only part of the equasion.

Again, you're being intellectually dishonest here. [I say "intellectually dishonest" because you're not a dumb guy.] You're either being willfully ignorant, or deliberately omitting key facts:

1. The SOX did spend more on their draft bonuses [$3.455M vs. $3.08M.] But then, the SOX DID draft earlier in each and every round than the TWINS. [#13 vs. #21 in each and every round.]

Adjusting for the "slotting" difference between the two teams, the two teams spent similarly in this draft.


2. The twins have a much better minor league system than the SOX. Therefore, they are not as desperate to restock their cupboards as are the SOX, and have less of a need to go over-slot.


3. The twins are better at scouting and developing players, and thus, do not have to take the desperate measures to make up the difference between the two organizations.


4. The SOX, being a big market team, should have more financial resources to re-stock the minor league systems than the twins. Despite this, the two teams' investments into the draft are similar.

canOcorn
08-17-2010, 11:28 PM
Figures. :rolleyes:

Supposedly slot was around $250,000 and he was seeking near $500,000. Not a big deal for most teams.

Yet we pay 3 times that for our everyday DH. Clown shoes.....:scratch:

CPditka
08-19-2010, 09:52 AM
The D-Lee trade yesterday really got me thinking. To aquirre good prospects in a trade you have to eat salary of a vet like him. How many times do you see a team eating Millions (not thousands). I think we have done this in the past as well. Thome? Conteras? Not really sure on the specifics of that, and we didnt received "good" prospects.


Just one more reason to invest in your farm. A couple extra thousand could save you millions down the road in overpaying for someone elses prospect. Just do the cash dump, and dont ask for prospects back. But you can only do that if your farm is stocked.

DirtySox
08-20-2010, 04:24 PM
Only 4 teams spent less than the White Sox on the draft this season:

http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/draft/?p=2928

PolishPrince34
08-20-2010, 04:28 PM
You beat me to it, I was just going to share that information from baseball america. We are the 4th lowest in spending in the 2010 draft. We are last in spending for the last 3 years. Pathetic and we are major market team. Come on Jerry open up your wallet and realize the importance of a good farm system.

soxball14
08-21-2010, 07:13 AM
Dan Hudson was a 5th round pick...he sure made a difference in our system and what we are available to acquire. Young players in the minors are KW's currency for deals...if he has no currency, they will not be able to deal.[/QUOTE]




Dan Hudson also signed for slot!

soxball14
08-21-2010, 07:20 AM
I love how people on here are saying how the Sox can't scout and the Player Development guys are terrible... I would think the complete opposite. If they are getting Beckham, Hudson and Sale to the ML and have guys like Dexter Carter, Poreda, Ely, Holmberg and others that are being used to get guys in return for proven ML talent how can anyone say that those two groups are no good? I would say that with the money spent in the draft they are doing a good job of using their resources and getting the best players and developing them with what they have to spend.

Domeshot17
08-21-2010, 08:09 AM
I love how people on here are saying how the Sox can't scout and the Player Development guys are terrible... I would think the complete opposite. If they are getting Beckham, Hudson and Sale to the ML and have guys like Dexter Carter, Poreda, Ely, Holmberg and others that are being used to get guys in return for proven ML talent how can anyone say that those two groups are no good? I would say that with the money spent in the draft they are doing a good job of using their resources and getting the best players and developing them with what they have to spend.

Gordon and Sale came out mlb ready. Those other guys are all nothings. Poreda may never even make it as an mlb reliever. He has about no chance to be a starter in the pros. Yes, trading him for Peavy makes up for how terrible of a pick he was, but we passed on a far far superior talent to take him, it is what we do.

There is zero defense for the way the Sox draft and Scout. Kenny was terrible at it when it was his job, and Buddy Bell has only made minor improvements because his resources are so limited. The Sox, by being cheap, also passed on a player expected to be a TOP 10 pick in next years draft.

I will never hammer Jerry or Kenny for being cheap with Payroll. 90-100 mil every year with our fan base is solid. But in the draft, we cut corners, and it is obvious.

soxball14
08-21-2010, 01:18 PM
If they both are so MLB ready they why did 7 teams pass on Beckham and 12 pass on Sale? Go back and look at all of the Top 10 picks in the draft and see how man have had success in the ML. They have done a very good job identifying the right players.

As far as you saying being cheap... If you read my post I never mentioned the money, but the fact of what the scouts and player development with the resources they have should be applauded.

PolishPrince34
08-22-2010, 07:50 AM
Dexter Carter and Poreda are having horrible years with the Padres. Poreda is no longer considered a starter and has lost control of his fastball that never was that fast to begin with. Dexter Carter was sent down to Rookie League and is back in Low A because his mechanics are out of whack. Ely is a Triple A pitcher/Long reliever at best. The league caught on to him and there's a reason why he's pitching in the minors. He throws 86-89 on his fastball. Holmberg's got potential, but he's at least 3 years away and has an ERA close to 5.00. I'd would never say our scouting is great, I would put more emphasis on Kenny doing a great job getting rid of these prospects when they still had value.

cws05champ
08-22-2010, 09:21 AM
Dexter Carter and Poreda are having horrible years with the Padres. Poreda is no longer considered a starter and has lost control of his fastball that never was that fast to begin with. Dexter Carter was sent down to Rookie League and is back in Low A because his mechanics are out of whack. Ely is a Triple A pitcher/Long reliever at best. The league caught on to him and there's a reason why he's pitching in the minors. He throws 86-89 on his fastball. Holmberg's got potential, but he's at least 3 years away and has an ERA close to 5.00. I'd would never say our scouting is great, I would put more emphasis on Kenny doing a great job getting rid of these prospects when they still had value.
The rest of your post is spot on but the part in bold is completely false. Poreda when with the Sox had one of the best fastballs in the minors routinely getting it up there at 98-99. That's why he had some value in the Peavy deal.

PolishPrince34
08-22-2010, 02:10 PM
When the Sox called him up last year his fastball was so overblown. Poreda was only throwing 90-91 in the 3 appearances. Fastball was all over the place. There are so many times when you read minor league reports about their fastball being in the mid to upper 90s and it turns out to be not true. Also, the Cell might have the fastest pitching gun in MLB.

Pablo_Honey
08-22-2010, 05:39 PM
When the Sox called him up last year his fastball was so overblown. Poreda was only throwing 90-91 in the 3 appearances. Fastball was all over the place. There are so many times when you read minor league reports about their fastball being in the mid to upper 90s and it turns out to be not true. Also, the Cell might have the fastest pitching gun in MLB.
Eh, IIRC, Poreda's velo was down because he was brought into situations where he had to pitch out of stretch. Also, some prospects come up and lower their velocities to compensate for longterm health and/or control issues (See: Jenks, Bobby). Given Poreda's numbers this year, I'd assume he was starting to be concerned about his command. The Sox didn't make **** up about Poreda's velocity. Pretty much every other scouting report on him I've seen agreed his fastball was a plus.

PolishPrince34
08-22-2010, 06:54 PM
If you saw him pitch last year you would know where I'm coming from because he was no where close throwing in the mid to upper 90s. I never saw a plus fastball. Just the other day someone wrote Gregory Infante in Double A was clocked at 102mph on 3 pitches. Do you really believe that? It's not make believe like Brendan Frasor in The Scout.

Daver
08-22-2010, 07:25 PM
I don't believe the radar gun has any place in baseball, especially at the amateur levels, that tool has ruined ten arms for everyone single one it has so called helped.

Pablo_Honey
08-22-2010, 09:37 PM
If you saw him pitch last year you would know where I'm coming from because he was no where close throwing in the mid to upper 90s. I never saw a plus fastball.
It wasn't just the Sox hype. Many other prospect gurus saw Poreda's fastball as a legit pitch. If his fastball sucked, he would have never been able to put up the numbers he did in our minor league system. This guy was a prospect because of his fastball. Yes, his fastball seemed average in what little short time he pitched for us. What do I say to that? The good old 'Small Sample Size.' For example, Hudson's control was absolutely out of whack for us this year. His minor league numbers and all scouting reports say otherwise. The problem here is that we just don't have extensive data of Poreda's fastball against MLB hitting to say his fastball was garbage. Doesn't change the fact that this guy was a rather highly touted prospect by several publications.

Just the other day someone wrote Gregory Infante in Double A was clocked at 102mph on 3 pitches. Do you really believe that? It's not make believe like Brendan Frasor in The Scout.
Of course I don't. Infante is practically unknown outside of the Sox fanbase, and this was probably a radar gun in a minor league stadium. It's way too fishy to be trusted. I don't even know what this kid is supposed to throw. Until local resident experts confirm Infante's stuff, I ain't believing it. Now, if I heard, say, Petricka hit 100+ MPH on the radar gun pitching out of the pen, I'd believe it. Scouting reports say he can get it all the way up to 99, and in this hypothetical case, he was pitching out of pen.

I don't believe the radar gun has any place in baseball, especially at the amateur levels, that tool has ruined ten arms for everyone single one it has so called helped.
Huh, I don't think I've heard of a case where the radar gun either helped or ruined a pitcher's career. IMHO, it's just asthetics, a viewing pleasure for the fans. It just makes strike outs all the more exciting.

DirtySox
08-22-2010, 10:45 PM
Infante has a cannon. While 102 might not be accurate, he can pump it up there in the upper 90's. Baseball America had a recent blurb about him regarding sleeper bullpen prospects.

PolishPrince34
08-31-2010, 05:04 PM
I would of used the $4 million on drafting/signing higher risk players and signing international players rather than signing Manny Ramirez. Producing and developing players in your system saves you tens of millions down the road.

soxfanreggie
08-31-2010, 08:08 PM
I would of used the $4 million on drafting/signing higher risk players and signing international players rather than signing Manny Ramirez. Producing and developing players in your system saves you tens of millions down the road.

That depends - if we make the playoffs, we can sell a lot of season tickets and use those proceeds to bolster the MLB payroll and farm system. A $4 million investment in Manny could return a heck of a lot more than the initial investment.

Daver
08-31-2010, 08:28 PM
That depends - if we make the playoffs, we can sell a lot of season tickets and use those proceeds to bolster the MLB payroll and farm system. A $4 million investment in Manny could return a heck of a lot more than the initial investment.

And if they don't the 4 mil flyer on a known cheater has the potential to alienate a good chunk of the fanbase, that is those that did not get alienated by the claim in the first place.

sullythered
08-31-2010, 08:36 PM
And if they don't the 4 mil flyer on a known cheater has the potential to alienate a good chunk of the fanbase, that is those that did not get alienated by the claim in the first place.

If signing Wil Cordero and Albert Belle didn't alienate fans, it should be ridiculous to think that signing Manny might.

Domeshot17
08-31-2010, 11:08 PM
And if they don't the 4 mil flyer on a known cheater has the potential to alienate a good chunk of the fanbase, that is those that did not get alienated by the claim in the first place.

I would bet the Sox would lose more fans doing nothing then going for it and getting Manny. Baseball Fans have short memories. The first time Manny hits a big HR for the Sox many will forgive him. Then, when he signs elsewhere next year, we will resume calling him names.

PolishPrince34
09-07-2010, 08:50 PM
Infante is pitching right now and his fastball has been 95-96 every time. Another example of how scouts exaggerate on a pitchers fastball. When I saw the report about him throwing 100-102mph. I knew it meant mid 90s. He has impressive stuff, but needs to work on control