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View Full Version : I for one welcome a strike


oldcomiskey
06-19-2002, 10:37 PM
the Sox aint going nowhere anyway

Daver
06-19-2002, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by oldcomiskey
the Sox aint going nowhere anyway

A strike will destroy the game,glad you are rooting for the apocalypse.

idseer
06-19-2002, 10:44 PM
Originally posted by daver


A strike will destroy the game,glad you are rooting for the apocalypse.

apocalypse .... lol

the game can't BE detroyed! only this stinking system may be destroyed. probably only to be replaced by yet another crappy system.

grab your dice and play a baseball board game. it's much more satisfying, and there are no agents!

Daver
06-19-2002, 10:51 PM
Originally posted by idseer


apocalypse .... lol

the game can't BE detroyed! only this stinking system may be destroyed. probably only to be replaced by yet another crappy system.

grab your dice and play a baseball board game. it's much more satisfying, and there are no agents!

Wanna bet?

The Antitrust exemption doesn't die because the two sides fail to reach an agreement,MLB doesn't exist without it,so yes the game can die.

Dadawg_77
06-19-2002, 10:52 PM
Originally posted by idseer


apocalypse .... lol

the game can't BE detroyed! only this stinking system may be destroyed. probably only to be replaced by yet another crappy system.

grab your dice and play a baseball board game. it's much more satisfying, and there are no agents!

There also isn't billions of dollars coming in.

NUKE_CLEVELAND
06-19-2002, 10:55 PM
If baseball is heading for an apocalypse , then PAYROD, with his insane contract, is one of the four horsemen. The other three are Selig, Fehr & Reinsdorf.

:payrod

"Glad I could be of service!"

Dadawg_77
06-19-2002, 10:55 PM
Originally posted by daver


Wanna bet?

The Antitrust exemption doesn't die because the two sides fail to reach an agreement,MLB doesn't exist without it,so yes the game can die.

What I think Deer might be talking about is that owners declare a impass and impose their CBA. Which the MLBPA will appeal to the NLRB, and what ever happens there, it will be appealed to the courts.

What will kill the game is the fact the house of cards will crumbled when revenue drops. Major League baseball should be able to stay a float for a couple of years, but if a strike happens, something major will either happen in three years. Either teams will fold or some how MLB recaptures the fan.

Dadawg_77
06-19-2002, 10:56 PM
Originally posted by NUKE_CLEVELAND
If baseball is heading for an apocalypse , then PAYROD, with his insane contract, is one of the four horsemen. The other three are Selig, Fehr & Reinsdorf.

:payrod

"Glad I could be of service!"

Hey don't blame A-Rod, he just said pay me and Hick (The guy to blame) said is 225 million dollars good enough.

duke of dorwood
06-19-2002, 10:57 PM
Apocalypse?

:jerry

I love the smell of blown games in the morning

CerberusWG
06-19-2002, 10:57 PM
Hey if we suck enough we could get a good draft pick.

Screw it, lets get to the playoffs!

idseer
06-19-2002, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by daver


Wanna bet?

The Antitrust exemption doesn't die because the two sides fail to reach an agreement,MLB doesn't exist without it,so yes the game can die.

i disagree. the GAME cannot die! mlb may die, yes. but something will take it's place as sure as ..... anything. it wil become organized in no time, played by the games best players, and people will pay to see it. personally i don't care if mlb dies.
it's storied history is stained by todays game anyway, it's records meaningless.

wouldn't bother me at all to start fresh.

NUKE_CLEVELAND
06-19-2002, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
Apocalypse?

:jerry

I love the smell of blown games in the morning



OH MY GOD THAT WAS FUNNY!!!!! *****!!!!!!!!

I just watched that movie the other day too!

Soxheads
06-19-2002, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by idseer


i disagree. the GAME cannot die! mlb may die, yes. but something will take it's place as sure as ..... anything. it wil become organized in no time, played by the games best players, and people will pay to see it. personally i don't care if mlb dies.
it's storied history is stained by todays game anyway, it's records meaningless.

wouldn't bother me at all to start fresh.

I'm willing to bet it can.

Daver
06-19-2002, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by idseer


i disagree. the GAME cannot die! mlb may die, yes. but something will take it's place as sure as ..... anything. it wil become organized in no time, played by the games best players, and people will pay to see it. personally i don't care if mlb dies.
it's storied history is stained by todays game anyway, it's records meaningless.

wouldn't bother me at all to start fresh.

When MLB dies,and it's antitrust exception goes with it,you will have the equivelent of semi pro ball with no draft and no minor league system.I'd rather watch HS ball than watch the end result of what you are calling for.

idseer
06-19-2002, 11:16 PM
Originally posted by daver


When MLB dies,and it's antitrust exception goes with it,you will have the equivelent of semi pro ball with no draft and no minor league system.I'd rather watch HS ball than watch the end result of what you are calling for.

personally i'd rather watch college ball!
but i doubt the antitrust exemption could not be reinstituted.
the game started up once ... imo, it would find a way to start again.

then again ... japanese baseball could always be piped in!

Soxheads
06-19-2002, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by idseer


personally i'd rather watch college ball!
but i doubt the antitrust exemption could not be reinstituted.
the game started up once ... imo, it would find a way to start again.

then again ... japanese baseball could always be piped in!

Then I wouldn't be watching.

Tavarin
06-20-2002, 12:14 AM
I'd watch some japanese and college baseball. Heck, its better than watching most of the MLB stuff. Have you been watching the College World Series? Damn, those guys have some talent, and they aren't after the money yet.

Lip Man 1
06-20-2002, 12:14 AM
Whether you want the strike / lockout to happen or not is irrelevant.

It's GOING to take place.

and it may not be all bad, you can break out your Sox video tapes (Mine go back to 77) and watch them again and again.

And if you are like me, the Sox ALWAYS win since those are the only ones I keep in my library.

Lip

Soxheads
06-20-2002, 12:21 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Whether you want the strike / lockout to happen or not is irrelevant.

It's GOING to take place.

and it may not be all bad, you can break out your Sox video tapes (Mine go back to 77) and watch them again and again.

And if you are like me, the Sox ALWAYS win since those are the only ones I keep in my library.

Lip

Wow, those tapes go back to ten years before I was born.

voodoochile
06-20-2002, 02:47 AM
Originally posted by daver


When MLB dies,and it's antitrust exception goes with it,you will have the equivelent of semi pro ball with no draft and no minor league system.I'd rather watch HS ball than watch the end result of what you are calling for.

Why? I still don't understand why you feel like that. The NFL, NBA and NHL have no exemption and they all have drafts.

Here's an idea that might work...

Each team could keep 50 men on their roster (instead of the current 40) and that would include everyone at AAA and the big league level. Drafts happen and players get taken (probably many less rounds). Then the other players go FA and end up on a roster if they can make it or on an independent minor league team like the Schaumberg Flyers. In the end, more kids go to college instead of to the minor league teams (which is really better for the kids too) and baseball ends up just like football and basketball where only people who are almost ready get drafted.

They could institute a 5 year rule (or something) where if a player isn't on the big league club after 5 years of service, they can be drafted again by any team (there is already a similar rule, but it's name escapes me at the moment).

Baseball wouldn't die, but there would be less drafting of kids straight out of HS, which would lead to less huge bonuses for unproven 18 YO's - might even include a rookie salary cap which would free up more money for the veterans - something everyone thinks is a good idea. The talent level wouldn't drop dramatically from it's current level, but all the big league clubs could rein in costs by dumping their multiple A-level and AA level clubs. Even if the talent level did drop off initially, it would recuperate within 5 years as teams figured out the system and refined their draft and FA search techniques.

Really, baseball is the least injury riddled sport of all (except maybe pitchers). How many minor leaguers do you need? If it really became an issue they could simply expand the rosters to 30 players on the AAA level and allow a team to carry 5 extra pitchers for emergencys or allow them to sign 10 extra pitchers and place them with independent league teams - similar to the way NFL youngsters play in Europe in the summer. In reality it wouldn't be necessary, because the team would be able to find FA pitchers galore in the independent leagues, all of whom would be AA level at least.

You just have to think outside the box to solve the problem, but I for one don't get it. Why is is so damn necessary for every team to have 4 minor league teams? Will the talent really stop developing if there isn't? No, it will simply go elsewhere (college, independent league teams) to be developed and end up right where it should in the first place, playing major league baseball.

Classic example - Jon Garland. This is a player who is really just graduating from college. Would he be that much worse off if he had spent the last 4 years in college developing? Maybe he would be a year behind where he is at most, but the talent level at college would increase also and thus the competition would be stronger and the kids graduating would be that much better. Right now, the average college WS winner has 2 future MLB players on it. With my system that would probably go up to 4 and it wouldn't cost MLB a single cent...

ma-gaga
06-20-2002, 09:23 AM
Voodoo/Idseer

I think you are right, baseball could come back with a new system, but part of the "lore" of baseball is the minor league system. I for one, don't want that to disappear.

Unfortunately I'm not very optimistic.

oldcomisky, this reasoning: the Sox aint going nowhere anyway is the stuff of bandwagon fans.

PANFIRECRACKER
06-20-2002, 09:56 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile


Why? I still don't understand why you feel like that. The NFL, NBA and NHL have no exemption and they all have drafts.

Here's an idea that might work...

Each team could keep 50 men on their roster (instead of the current 40) and that would include everyone at AAA and the big league level. Drafts happen and players get taken (probably many less rounds). Then the other players go FA and end up on a roster if they can make it or on an independent minor league team like the Schaumberg Flyers. In the end, more kids go to college instead of to the minor league teams (which is really better for the kids too) and baseball ends up just like football and basketball where only people who are almost ready get drafted.

They could institute a 5 year rule (or something) where if a player isn't on the big league club after 5 years of service, they can be drafted again by any team (there is already a similar rule, but it's name escapes me at the moment).

Baseball wouldn't die, but there would be less drafting of kids straight out of HS, which would lead to less huge bonuses for unproven 18 YO's - might even include a rookie salary cap which would free up more money for the veterans - something everyone thinks is a good idea. The talent level wouldn't drop dramatically from it's current level, but all the big league clubs could rein in costs by dumping their multiple A-level and AA level clubs. Even if the talent level did drop off initially, it would recuperate within 5 years as teams figured out the system and refined their draft and FA search techniques.

Really, baseball is the least injury riddled sport of all (except maybe pitchers). How many minor leaguers do you need? If it really became an issue they could simply expand the rosters to 30 players on the AAA level and allow a team to carry 5 extra pitchers for emergencys or allow them to sign 10 extra pitchers and place them with independent league teams - similar to the way NFL youngsters play in Europe in the summer. In reality it wouldn't be necessary, because the team would be able to find FA pitchers galore in the independent leagues, all of whom would be AA level at least.

You just have to think outside the box to solve the problem, but I for one don't get it. Why is is so damn necessary for every team to have 4 minor league teams? Will the talent really stop developing if there isn't? No, it will simply go elsewhere (college, independent league teams) to be developed and end up right where it should in the first place, playing major league baseball.

Classic example - Jon Garland. This is a player who is really just graduating from college. Would he be that much worse off if he had spent the last 4 years in college developing? Maybe he would be a year behind where he is at most, but the talent level at college would increase also and thus the competition would be stronger and the kids graduating would be that much better. Right now, the average college WS winner has 2 future MLB players on it. With my system that would probably go up to 4 and it wouldn't cost MLB a single cent...

I like it.

Clarkdog
06-20-2002, 10:06 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Whether you want the strike / lockout to happen or not is irrelevant.

It's GOING to take place.

and it may not be all bad, you can break out your Sox video tapes (Mine go back to 77) and watch them again and again.

And if you are like me, the Sox ALWAYS win since those are the only ones I keep in my library.

Lip

Hey Lip:

Any chance I could buy a copy of one of those tapes? Seventies for sure. Your best Harry/Jimmy called game. I really miss watching those games when they played on WSNS - Channel 44.

Paulwny
06-20-2002, 10:21 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile

Baseball wouldn't die, but there would be less drafting of kids straight out of HS, which would lead to less huge bonuses for unproven 18 YO's - might even include a rookie salary cap which would free up more money for the veterans - something everyone thinks is a good idea. The talent level wouldn't drop dramatically from it's current level, but all the big league clubs could rein in costs by dumping their multiple A-level and AA level clubs. way NFL youngsters play in Europe in the summer. In reality it wouldn't be necessary, because the team would be able to find FA pitchers galore in the independent leagues, all of whom would be AA level at least.


Many years ago (>10), during a rain delay, an interview was held with JR on the radio. He also proposed this. He felt, with the exception of pitchers, there were MAYBE 2 or 3 prospects on each minor league team who MIGHT have a chance to be future ml players.He thought owners were wasting money paying "never will make it" players just so the 2 to 3 prospects had someone to play ball with.
He felt college ball was equivalent to A ball, with some college programs equivalent to AA ball. He proposed that mlb set up a pool of $$ to be given to colleges for improvements in their college programs.

voodoochile
06-20-2002, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
Voodoo/Idseer

I think you are right, baseball could come back with a new system, but part of the "lore" of baseball is the minor league system. I for one, don't want that to disappear.

Yeah, but think of the new lore that would be created with that system or something similar. By limiting the draft to 10 rounds, there would be guys like Mark Buehrle who wouldn't be drafted just waiting to be discovered. Shrewd teams would see if they could let someone slide through the whole draft and pick them up FA later. GM's would snicker at the other teams when they pulled a fast one and got a guy they wanted after the draft was over.

Something needs to be done to bring the system into the 21st century. Maybe my idea is too radical, but changes have to happen. Everyone wants a new system, but no one is willing to bleed to make it happen. The only thing we all agree on is - No strike. Well something is going to have to give if the game we love is to get financially healthy...

Daver
06-20-2002, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by Paulwny


Many years ago (>10), during a rain delay, an interview was held with JR on the radio. He also proposed this. He felt, with the exception of pitchers, there were MAYBE 2 or 3 prospects on each minor league team who MIGHT have a chance to be future ml players.He thought owners were wasting money paying "never will make it" players just so the 2 to 3 prospects had someone to play ball with.
He felt college ball was equivalent to A ball, with some college programs equivalent to AA ball. He proposed that mlb set up a pool of $$ to be given to colleges for improvements in their college programs.

That is a pipe dream,Title IX assures that it can't happen.

voodoochile
06-20-2002, 11:53 AM
Originally posted by daver


That is a pipe dream,Title IX assures that it can't happen.

There are plenty of college baseball programs out there. If there were less minor league teams the ones that do exist would simply have more talent on them...