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Lip Man 1
05-21-2010, 04:34 PM
A day or so ago, someone posted a link to a apparently well researched blog about the Sox minor league system and their philosophy behind it as well as how much they spend on it.

I forward that link along and got an interesting reply this afternoon on it. I thought I'd share it. Feel free to discuss. The reply sure makes it sound like JR gets involved perhaps more often than folks think about how the organization is run.

Maybe, if true, some of the barbs directed towards Kenny on this, need to be reelvaluated.

Here is the reply:

Mark,

Thanks for the link. I've never been able to get anyone on the record to say that Reinsdorf gets involved in the draft at the last moment, putting pressure on the scouting directors to select college pitchers because they're a safe investment as far as getting to the majors.. It shows in the fact they haven't selected the high ceiling guy and are very conservative in their first-round picks.

I get the impression from amateur scouts throughout baseball that Jerry doesn't like to invest heavily in the draft.

Lip

DirtySox
05-21-2010, 04:39 PM
I get the impression from amateur scouts throughout baseball that Jerry doesn't like to invest heavily in the draft.


This is a shocking and intriguing development.

Seriously though, big changes need to be made.

WhiteSox5187
05-21-2010, 05:00 PM
This is a rather revolting development. If you're not going to develop your own talent then you are going to have to pay high to get someone else's and if you're not going to do that you're going to be mired in mediocrity while constantly trying to catch lightening in a bottle...which is exactly what we seem to be doing of late.

LITTLE NELL
05-21-2010, 05:02 PM
IIRC when Jerry and Eddie took over in 81 Einhorn made a statement that farm systems are over rated and the way to build your ballclub is with smart trades and free agency. It looks like KW subcribes to that theory.

DirtySox
05-21-2010, 05:04 PM
It looks like KW subcribes to that theory.

He might be forced to do so to some extent it seems.

WhiteSox5187
05-21-2010, 05:05 PM
IIRC when Jerry and Eddie took over in 81 Einhorn made a statement that farm systems are over rated and the way to build your ballclub is with smart trades and free agency. It looks like KW subcribes to that theory.

I don't know how much of it is Kenny or how much of it is in the ownership. But Einhorn was always an idiot and still is.

soltrain21
05-21-2010, 05:07 PM
Isn't this stuff we all knew? I could have told you the Sox really don't care about the draft.

DirtySox
05-21-2010, 05:10 PM
If you look at the information I posted that Lip was referring to, we are only talking 1 to 3 million more spent per year on strictly the draft. I think there is a misconception on the amount that needs to be spent to acquire decent talent from the draft. It's nothing that will hamstring the big league club.

DirtySox
05-21-2010, 05:11 PM
Isn't this stuff we all knew? I could have told you the Sox really don't care about the draft.

I think most people know we suck at developing minor league talent but they are unaware of how little the Sox actually spend to acquire it.

Noneck
05-21-2010, 05:37 PM
Honestly this doesn't surprise me at all. We are told that he is not involved in day to day operations but then we see this and the other most recent situation that the public knew about was the Damon deal.

He is and always has been a money guy, money guys always have their fingers in the pie.

Hitmen77
05-21-2010, 05:46 PM
A day or so ago, someone posted a link to a apparently well researched blog about the Sox minor league system and their philosophy behind it as well as how much they spend on it.

I forward that link along and got an interesting reply this afternoon on it. I thought I'd share it. Feel free to discuss. The reply sure makes it sound like JR gets involved perhaps more often than folks think about how the organization is run.

Maybe, if true, some of the barbs directed towards Kenny on this, need to be reelvaluated.

Here is the reply:

Mark,

Thanks for the link. I've never been able to get anyone on the record to say that Reinsdorf gets involved in the draft at the last moment, putting pressure on the scouting directors to select college pitchers because they're a safe investment as far as getting to the majors.. It shows in the fact they haven't selected the high ceiling guy and are very conservative in their first-round picks.

I get the impression from amateur scouts throughout baseball that Jerry doesn't like to invest heavily in the draft.

Lip

Who is this quote from? Is this from someone in the media or someone in the Sox organization?

The Sox poor farm system has been their down fall the last few years. Unless you have Yankees or Red Sox-level revenues, you can only get so far if your farm system almost never turns out anything good.

Kenny's knack for dealing prospects who eventually bust for proven MLB talent is a shell game that isn't going to carry us forever.

This isn't just about throwing money at Boras draft picks either. We've produced people like Fields and Anderson while other teams produce bona-fide players.....and not all those great players were top Boras-type picks.

Our farm system is so bad that we squander payroll flexibility spending $5 million for people like Linebrink, Swisher, McDougal, Teahen, etc. in an attempt to slap band-aids over our gaping holes.

I really hope the shakeup that started in 2008 is for real and is going to start producing home grown players. Otherwise, it might be a long time before we're competitive again.

canOcorn
05-21-2010, 05:51 PM
If you look at the information I posted that Lip was referring to, we are only talking 1 to 3 million more spent per year on strictly the draft. I think there is a misconception on the amount that needs to be spent to acquire decent talent from the draft. It's nothing that will hamstring the big league club.

It would completely hamstring us if Oz wasn't able to bring his brother, Omar. I mean how would we survive if we had a defensive wiz, who couldn't hit a lick, and made the minimum instead of $1.5M. He's sure taught Alexei how to play D. :rolleyes:

Lip Man 1
05-21-2010, 06:14 PM
Hitmen:

The comment is from a mainstream media member who pays close attention to the draft, has for years and knows numerous scouts and members of different MLB organizations. (No it isn't Phil Rogers...:D:)

Again if this is true perhaps Kenny's situation needs to be rethought. I don't excuse some of the awful moves he's made since the start of the 2007 season but he may not have a choice if what he could want to do regarding the minor league system is being cut out from him.

I haven't a clue if this is true or not, the source is a good one, someone not prone to exaggeration or hype to advance his career.

If you take his comment in the context of the Sox organization it makes sense. JR does not like to pay for "potential," he doesn't like to pay managers not to work and he's made the comment (paraphrasing) that he has to pay someone what his dumbest compeditor has to pay their people because of the way the sport is set up.

I'm sure he also knows the odds of a minor league player regardless of if they are a first round, or 40th round pick of spending a day in the show.

As stated earlier in the thread, if you can't grow your own players and aren't willing to pay top dollar for the best that come available each season, you are in a difficult position to get out of.

Lip

Daver
05-21-2010, 07:04 PM
You can develop talent without spending large sums on first round picks, but you have to pay for the scouts to find the talent and coaches that can teach at the low pro level effectively.

The problem with the Sox is that their whole philosophy to developing talent is geared towards producing offense instead of developing complete players.

NLaloosh
05-21-2010, 08:49 PM
IIRC when Jerry and Eddie took over in 81 Einhorn made a statement that farm systems are over rated and the way to build your ballclub is with smart trades and free agency. It looks like KW subcribes to that theory.

Well, then I'm glad to see that they'll have no problem taking this payroll up to $ 150 mil. to make this team a winner.

LITTLE NELL
05-21-2010, 08:56 PM
Well, then I'm glad to see that they'll have no problem taking this payroll up to $ 150 mil. to make this team a winner.

Don't hold your breath.