PDA

View Full Version : Hawk And The Umpires


blackcloud1956
05-11-2010, 10:37 AM
As a White Sox fan for some forty-five years, I am reaching my boiling point with Hawk Harrelson's game after game, year after year carping about the umpires. The umpires DO NOT have an anti-White Sox agenda. Yet, to listen to this over-the-hill hack put the blame on the umps make me want to fill my ears with silly-putty. Hawk, call the game using a little common sense. Maybe someone in the production studio could loop together all his comments that call the umpiring into question and play it back for him. Maybe then, he would hear what a clown he sounds like.

LoveYourSuit
05-11-2010, 10:40 AM
It's going to take MLB to suspend his ass or something in order for him to knock it off.

It is pretty damn annoying. He acts like a child.

jdm2662
05-11-2010, 10:43 AM
If he wants to point out the call was missed is one thing. To drag out borderline calls six innings later is quite annoying.

The Immigrant
05-11-2010, 11:15 AM
Last season he was called on the carpet by management on this very issue. I expect they'll have a similar talk with him very soon.

roylestillman
05-11-2010, 11:47 AM
A few years ago I saw a little league coach do something that put some faith back into youth organized basecall. A ten year old kid was called out on a called third strike. He came back to the bench loudly disputing the umps call. The coach sat him down and corrected him saying, "That was a strike. You know why it was a strike? Because the ump said it was."

Hawk could learn a lesson like that ten year old did that day.

downstairs
05-11-2010, 11:51 AM
Amen. Its far, far too much. Umps miss close ball/strike calls evenly. Get over it. If every borderline call went our way we'd have no different a record.

If that's Hawk's opinion, fine. But keep it to yourself. You're supposed to be entertaining the viewer, and I don't think many viewers are that crazy about the ump/White Sox conspiracy.

BigKlu59
05-11-2010, 11:55 AM
:D: The only thing that will shut his yap is if the Pale Hose run off a 15 game winning streak and put the balll in play. where the "Men in Blue" only have to have either their hands in their pockets, or make that wondrous pointing circle to the sky...

Goes with the territory of mediocrity.. Team's that win seem to always get the better calls,or it is just perceived that way..

BigKlu59

Coops4Aces
05-11-2010, 12:03 PM
Has Hawk ever mentioned a computerized strike zone?

dickallen15
05-11-2010, 12:05 PM
There are a lot of times Hawk has a point and the umpire blew a pitch, but its every single time a ball may or may not be an inch off the plate that he's complaining. He also never says anything when White Sox pitchers are benefitting from questionable calls. The other night the Sox were down about 10 runs and he wouldn't let a call go. It really is bordering on the ridiculous now. Maybe they should put the homeplate umpire up in the broadcast booth. The view from there is apparently much better to call balls and strikes.

Noneck
05-11-2010, 12:27 PM
Last season he was called on the carpet by management on this very issue. I expect they'll have a similar talk with him very soon.

Who called him on the carpet? Please expand on this. I have never heard about this before.

LoveYourSuit
05-11-2010, 12:49 PM
Wait for this man here to call balls and strikes in one of our games, it will be epic:

http://www.pe.com/imagesdaily/2009/10-10/cbbucknor265_265.jpg
CB Bucknor

Coops4Aces
05-11-2010, 12:56 PM
Wait for this man here to call balls and strikes in one of our games, it will be epic:

http://www.pe.com/imagesdaily/2009/10-10/cbbucknor265_265.jpg
CB Bucknor

I still don't get how he has a job...

jdm2662
05-11-2010, 12:59 PM
There are a lot of times Hawk has a point and the umpire blew a pitch, but its every single time a ball may or may not be an inch off the plate that he's complaining. He also never says anything when White Sox pitchers are benefitting from questionable calls. The other night the Sox were down about 10 runs and he wouldn't let a call go. It really is bordering on the ridiculous now. Maybe they should put the homeplate umpire up in the broadcast booth. The view from there is apparently much better to call balls and strikes.

There was a game last year against the Yankees. This was the Thursday game where it started two hours late because of rain. As we know, when the weather is ****ty, the umpire usually expands the strike zone. Hawk was whinning for the first few innings because Pettite kept getting a wide plate, how it was on sided, etc. Well, Floyd got the memo and started to throw his curve about a foot off the plate. The ump wrung up about five guys. Then, Hawk kept saying how he doesnt' like it, he loves when more strikes are called. Go figure.

LoveYourSuit
05-11-2010, 01:05 PM
I still don't get how he has a job...


He is by far the worst umpire I have seen in my lifetime, a mile ahead of this jackass:

http://kuiperactive.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/vfxbqcww.jpg
Bruce Froemming

The Immigrant
05-11-2010, 01:16 PM
Who called him on the carpet? Please expand on this. I have never heard about this before.

It was mentioned to me during the Dodgers series last year by someone who sits on the board of directors.

vinny
05-11-2010, 01:21 PM
He is by far the worst umpire I have seen in my lifetime, a mile ahead of this jackass:

http://kuiperactive.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/vfxbqcww.jpg
Bruce Froemming

Worse than Ron Luciano?

LoveYourSuit
05-11-2010, 02:13 PM
Worse than Ron Luciano?


Ron umped in the 70s, I was born in '79.

samurai_sox
05-11-2010, 02:21 PM
Phil Cuzzi.

WORST. UMPIRE. EVER.

shingo10
05-11-2010, 02:33 PM
The only thing worse than Hawk complaining about the umpires is people complaining about Hawk complaining about the umpires.

Listen to the radio, mute the broadcast, whatever. If you don't like it don't listen to him. Its pretty simple.

WhiteSox1989
05-11-2010, 02:46 PM
The only thing worse than Hawk complaining about the umpires is people complaining about Hawk complaining about the umpires.

Listen to the radio, mute the broadcast, whatever. If you don't like it don't listen to him. Its pretty simple.
The only thing that's worse than Hawk complaining about the umpries is the people who complain about the people who are complaining about Hawk complaining about the umpires.

Now there's something to think about.

kaufsox
05-11-2010, 03:56 PM
Crazy as it might seem, I think Hawk has been a little less critical this year. He still pouts quite a bit, but he seems to at least concede when the umps get it right. I'll be interested to see how he and Frank interact.

Slappy
05-11-2010, 04:03 PM
Hawk is the absolute worst, and he ruins the fun of watching the games. Dunno how it's possible, but he becomes more annoying every year.

He is either dead silent at times, whining about a strike call, or is reminiscing about a golf outing that he took with his ol' buddy Lester Van Miltenheim in 1996. Just dreadful...

Craig Grebeck
05-11-2010, 04:22 PM
The only thing worse than Hawk complaining about the umpires is people complaining about Hawk complaining about the umpires.

Listen to the radio, mute the broadcast, whatever. If you don't like it don't listen to him. Its pretty simple.
Haha. Perhaps people dislike it because it's a sad, sorry representation of the organization?

DirtySox
05-11-2010, 04:23 PM
Haha. Perhaps people dislike it because it's a sad, sorry representation of the organization?

Bingo.

Hawk is an embarrassment.

tony1972
05-11-2010, 05:23 PM
As a White Sox fan for some forty-five years, I am reaching my boiling point with Hawk Harrelson's game after game, year after year carping about the umpires. The umpires DO NOT have an anti-White Sox agenda. Yet, to listen to this over-the-hill hack put the blame on the umps make me want to fill my ears with silly-putty. Hawk, call the game using a little common sense. Maybe someone in the production studio could loop together all his comments that call the umpiring into question and play it back for him. Maybe then, he would hear what a clown he sounds like.

I almost never watch Sox games on TV (and simply because of Hawk)..even when they are winning. I'll listen to the games on the radio. I honestly don't think Sox TV ratings will ever be high with Hawk in the booth. I know a lot of Sox fans that dont watch the games on TV because of Hawk. He is very hard to listen to.

twinsuck
05-11-2010, 05:38 PM
It's called the mute button. :wink:

Dan H
05-11-2010, 05:53 PM
The only thing worse than Hawk complaining about the umpires is people complaining about Hawk complaining about the umpires.

Listen to the radio, mute the broadcast, whatever. If you don't like it don't listen to him. Its pretty simple.

No, it's not that simple since the radio play-by-play is no bargain either.

One point is that Hawk is a major extension of Jerry Reinsdorf and the organization. If the White Sox want to make a complaint about umpire bias, they should do so through proper channels.

Team broadcasters are always homers but Hawk needs to rein it in some and talk about something else. It's easy to slow down the action and call a game. Try it in real time.

The team has played poorly so far and even a homer announcer can allow us to see that without insulting our intelligence with excuses.

By the way, we all know Stoney won the Cy Young Award 30 years ago. We don't need to hear that every stinking game.

hellenicsoxfan
05-11-2010, 06:12 PM
I usually like Hawk, but it does get tiring listening to the complaining. Even when he's not directly complaining, he's still complaining, like when he says that pitch was on the outside edge of the outside corner, insinuating the umpire is stretching things against the Sox.

cards press box
05-11-2010, 06:18 PM
Haha. Perhaps people dislike it because it's a sad, sorry representation of the organization?

Bingo.

Hawk is an embarrassment.

Hawk has a large personality and has given the Sox a presence in this media market. What's more, Hawk has followed an old broadcasting tradition and coined many outstanding nicknames for the players. Broadcasters always understood that was part of the job. Bob Elson, I believe, coined the nickname "Minnie" for Orestes Minoso. Other broadcasters today -- who are pretty universally vanilla - don't do that. Hawk does and remains a reminder of when the game had a lot more personality.

That said, Hawk does complain about the umpires a lot. Of course, there are some awful umpires today. Phil Cuzzi is a bad joke as an umpire and he certainly proved that in the Twins/Yankees series last year.

Craig Grebeck
05-11-2010, 06:24 PM
Hawk has a large personality and has given the Sox a presence in this media market. What's more, Hawk has followed an old broadcasting tradition and coined many outstanding nicknames for the players. Broadcasters always understood that was part of the job. Bob Elson, I believe, coined the nickname "Minnie" for Orestes Minoso. Other broadcasters today -- who are pretty universally vanilla - don't do that. Hawk does and remains a reminder of when the game had a lot more personality.

That said, Hawk does complain about the umpires a lot. Of course, there are some awful umpires today. Phil Cuzzi is a bad joke as an umpire and he certainly proved that in the Twins/Yankees series last year.
There are broadcasters with personality that aren't total hacks. A lot of them, actually.

Juice16
05-11-2010, 07:18 PM
I have no problem with Hawk calling out the umps. We sit here and bitch and moan about players and umps all day long, but when someone like Hawk or another player says something, people have a problem with it. I can understand an ump blowing a call here or there, but when it is constant and obvious something needs to be said, and I applaud Hawk for having the balls to say so.

Craig Grebeck
05-11-2010, 07:19 PM
I have no problem with Hawk calling out the umps. We sit here and bitch and moan about players and umps all day long, but when someone like Hawk or another player says something, people have a problem with it. I can understand an ump blowing a call here or there, but when it is constant and obvious something needs to be said, and I applaud Hawk for having the balls to say so.
Maybe it isn't constant and obvious, maybe our announcer -- who is one of the representatives of the entire organization -- should learn to take the high road, rather than bloviate and bitch all day long.

Boondock Saint
05-11-2010, 07:20 PM
I have no problem with Hawk calling out the umps. We sit here and bitch and moan about players and umps all day long, but when someone like Hawk or another player says something, people have a problem with it. I can understand an ump blowing a call here or there, but when it is constant and obvious something needs to be said, and I applaud Hawk for having the balls to say so.

None of us are paid to be the voice of the White Sox on television.

CLR01
05-11-2010, 07:35 PM
Hawk sucks. The day after he steps out of the booth for good will be a great day worthy of a huge parade. I can't wait.

Brian26
05-11-2010, 07:38 PM
As a White Sox fan for some forty-five years, I am reaching my boiling point with Hawk Harrelson's game after game, year after year carping about the umpires. The umpires DO NOT have an anti-White Sox agenda. Yet, to listen to this over-the-hill hack put the blame on the umps make me want to fill my ears with silly-putty. Hawk, call the game using a little common sense. Maybe someone in the production studio could loop together all his comments that call the umpiring into question and play it back for him. Maybe then, he would hear what a clown he sounds like.

This is one of those dramatically misrepresented claims that ranks right up there with the upper deck at New Comiskey being too steep. I hope people in the Sox organization don't listen to nonsense like this, because they should be using their time wisely on more important matters.

I've watched almost every Sox game so far this year. Hawk's time spent on whining about calls for more than a half inning has been limited to a few instances when bad calls occurred in crucial situations. It's no worse than it has been in previous years, and in fact he's probably doing it less now.

And truth be told, when he does lose it, it's usually for good reason (Brian Gorman's call in Baltimore on Buehrle in 2005, the debacle in Oakland in early 2005, a fair-ball called foul in a late season game in Texas in 1991). These calls are memorable for a reason.

Seriously, Harrelson is the least of our worries right now. If this team is going to suck for the next five years, hopefully it sucks with some entertaining announcers. I've already lived through 1989 with Gary Thorne once. That was enough.

Brian26
05-11-2010, 07:41 PM
I usually like Hawk, but it does get tiring listening to the complaining. Even when he's not directly complaining, he's still complaining, like when he says that pitch was on the outside edge of the outside corner, insinuating the umpire is stretching things against the Sox.

I don't quite understand how you equate this with complaining.

soxinem1
05-11-2010, 10:17 PM
Phil Cuzzi.

WORST. UMPIRE. EVER.

I agree about Bucknor and Froemmiing, but Drew Coble and Al Clark were among the worst I EVER seen.

Bucknor has one of the truest non-strike strike zones in this era of umpiring.

cards press box
05-11-2010, 10:29 PM
There are broadcasters with personality that aren't total hacks. A lot of them, actually.

So, you are calling Hawk a hack, right? Can't agree with that at all. Is Hawk a homer? By his own admission, he is. But a hack? That phrase suggests that he lacks any command of his subject, namely major league baseball. And to use one of Hawk's favorite phrases, that is a lot of bull. Hawk's command of the game is strong and has been strong for a long time.

Calling him a "hack" is, to me, a bridge too far. And, seriously, after he gave you that great nickname of the "Little Hurt."

Slappy
05-11-2010, 10:34 PM
The Little Hurt ahah!

It's hard to hate on Hawk, because he is honestly a very likable guy, but his broadcasting abilities leave a lot to be desired to say the least.

Nellie_Fox
05-12-2010, 12:08 AM
It's going to take MLB to suspend his ass or something in order for him to knock it off.I don't think MLB can suspend him, since he doesn't work for MLB.

This is one of those dramatically misrepresented claims that ranks right up there with the upper deck at New Comiskey being too steep. The upper deck IS too steep. I've seen people actually scared to walk from their seat to the aisle, actually holding on to people as they walked, because they were afraid they were going to fall. Is it steeper than many other upper decks? No, but that doesn't mean it isn't too steep; it just means the other ones are, too.

VMSNS
05-12-2010, 01:05 AM
As annoying as Hawk is sometimes, he's still an integral part to the White Sox experience. I think he's fun to listen to because he loves the Sox so much and he's just so goofy sometimes it's funny. Watching the Sox on TV just wouldn't be the same without Hawk.

That being said, his blown call rants grow tiresome. I think Hawk has the right to call out an umpire if he has an inconsistent strike zone or makes a questionable call, but it's the constant whining he does for several innings that bugs me. Just accept it and move on. Maybe a questionable call can change the dynamic of an inning a little bit, but 90% of the time, that call isn't going to determine the outcome of the game.

I personally can't stand when he talks about golf or "ducksnorts". Whenever I hear Hawk say ducksnort, it's like someone is grinding nails on a chalkboard inside my brain. It literally sends shivers down my spine. Such a stupid, stupid saying.

KingXerxes
05-12-2010, 06:28 PM
:hawk

"Mercy...............yessir...............Lordy Lordy..............Now I can't speak for eveybody on this board, but Ol' Hawk can speak for Ol' Hawk that's for sure............Now if there's one thing you can always be sure of when it comes to Ol' Hawk, it's that Ol' Hawk will always mention Ol' Hawk whenever quoting somebody else. Let Ol' Hawk give you an example:

"Yesterday, I ran into Ol' Mountain Landis and he said to me, "You know Hawk - you've been around this game for 60 years - and I really appreciate your knowledge of the game..............do I suspend these guys for just a few years......or for life?"

Now, you see what Ol' Hawk did there? Instead of just stating what Kennesaw Mountain Landis had to say to me like a normal person, I threw in a reference to myself. It's all about self promotion.

Now why in the hell they would invite Tom Paciorek back into the radio booth for a few games is beyond Ol' Hawk. I love Tom Paciorek - but he just didn't see things the way Ol' Hawk did and he had to go. I ran into Paciorek the other day, and he said, "Hey Hawk - you apple polisher - I'm coming back AND HELL'S COMING WITH ME!"

Now Ol' Hawk didn't quite understand what Paciorek was talking about, but that's a story for another day when you stop by to visit with Ol' Hawk."

hawkjt
05-13-2010, 01:42 AM
I just heard Hawk go out of his way to praise the umps for the series vs KC last week and Toronto except for one ump.
So, he is not a broken record, he points out bad calls and if they are numerous,he gets on the ump.

Today I heard Farmer and Ranger get on the home plate ump on a called third strike call vs Beckham,I think....

With the tv shot from center field, we can all see the calls very well,unlike in the past,and I think Hawk is right, the umping is deteriorating overall.

Mohoney
05-14-2010, 05:17 AM
Thank you, KingXerxes. That laugh was sorely needed.

WhiteSoxFTW
05-14-2010, 11:00 AM
As annoying as Hawk is sometimes, he's still an integral part to the White Sox experience. I think he's fun to listen to because he loves the Sox so much and he's just so goofy sometimes it's funny. Watching the Sox on TV just wouldn't be the same without Hawk.

That being said, his blown call rants grow tiresome. I think Hawk has the right to call out an umpire if he has an inconsistent strike zone or makes a questionable call, but it's the constant whining he does for several innings that bugs me. Just accept it and move on. Maybe a questionable call can change the dynamic of an inning a little bit, but 90% of the time, that call isn't going to determine the outcome of the game.

I personally can't stand when he talks about golf or "ducksnorts". Whenever I hear Hawk say ducksnort, it's like someone is grinding nails on a chalkboard inside my brain. It literally sends shivers down my spine. Such a stupid, stupid saying.

Me neither. That, and his "Matt Abbatacola" broken bat reference. Yeah, maybe is was funny to give a shoutout to a Score personality a few times, but a lot of people have no idea what the **** he is talking about.

dickallen15
05-14-2010, 12:15 PM
I just heard Hawk go out of his way to praise the umps for the series vs KC last week and Toronto except for one ump.
So, he is not a broken record, he points out bad calls and if they are numerous,he gets on the ump.

Today I heard Farmer and Ranger get on the home plate ump on a called third strike call vs Beckham,I think....

With the tv shot from center field, we can all see the calls very well,unlike in the past,and I think Hawk is right, the umping is deteriorating overall.
He is never on the umpires when the calls go the Sox way and blames too much of the White Sox struggles on bad calls. The bad calls are happening both ways. If you just listened to Hawk for a week or so and took him at his word, you would think there is a conspiracy against the White Sox.

happydude
05-14-2010, 12:49 PM
He is never on the umpires when the calls go the Sox way and blames too much of the White Sox struggles on bad calls. The bad calls are happening both ways. If you just listened to Hawk for a week or so and took him at his word, you would think there is a conspiracy against the White Sox.

I think this is very accurate. Fans, in general, are inclined to search for reasons outside of their team to explain their team's failure and Hawk, of course, is a fan as well as the team analyst/play by play man but it does make the telecasts somewhat difficult to watch at times. You know its coming when we're not doing well and, unlike some guys in a bar doing the same thing, you can't get away from it short of turning the sound down.

If he has a problem, it'd be nice if he'd just point out his dispute and move on; I wouldn't mind a few less tales of his "days with the Red Sox", either.

Slappy
05-14-2010, 07:42 PM
Frank is pretty bad at announcing here, I think. There's double the silence with him in the mix.

It's funny, I was watching the Cubs a little today cuz I have McCutchen on my team, and I noticed how good Kasper and the other guy are (I forgot his name). They do a good job of just calling the game and being unbiased.

Marqhead
05-14-2010, 07:55 PM
Frank is pretty bad at announcing here, I think. There's double the silence with him in the mix.

It's funny, I was watching the Cubs a little today cuz I have McCutchen on my team, and I noticed how good Kasper and the other guy are (I forgot his name). They do a good job of just calling the game and being unbiased.

My only thing with Frank (as I posted in the game thread) is that he needs to slow down and speak a little clearer. Otherwise, I am interested in what he has to say in regards to hitting and I think he'll get better as he gets a few games under his belt.

He's also gotta stop saying "no doubt about it." :cool:

Frontman
05-14-2010, 08:51 PM
My only thing with Frank (as I posted in the game thread) is that he needs to slow down and speak a little clearer. Otherwise, I am interested in what he has to say in regards to hitting and I think he'll get better as he gets a few games under his belt.

He's also gotta stop saying "no doubt about it." :cool:

Frank just needs time to develop as an announcer. The man has a brain for baseball; and it does come through in the broadcast. But he's out of his element here currently; and to be honest?

He shouldn't be with Hawk. He needs a more....professional?....polished? play by play man to allow him to develop. Hawk's love of Frank makes this more like a conversation and the game is secondary.

soxinem1
05-14-2010, 08:51 PM
My only thing with Frank (as I posted in the game thread) is that he needs to slow down and speak a little clearer. Otherwise, I am interested in what he has to say in regards to hitting and I think he'll get better as he gets a few games under his belt.

He's also gotta stop saying "no doubt about it." :cool:

I agree. No doubt about it.

krispoulin
05-17-2010, 09:34 AM
It really is bordering on the ridiculous now.

This sentence is how I've been describing Hawk's game calling for years, not just his endless complaining about the umps, as dickallen15 intended it.

He's a cartoon and an embarrassment, who doesn't call the game so much as he roots and cheers. He's barely a step up from the drooling half-wit Ron Santo.

I feel bad for Steve Stone, a man who can talk about the game in an incredibly intelligent way.

krispoulin
05-17-2010, 09:37 AM
The only thing worse than Hawk complaining about the umpires is people complaining about Hawk complaining about the umpires.

Listen to the radio, mute the broadcast, whatever. If you don't like it don't listen to him. Its pretty simple.

I used to have the radio on with the TV muted, but once they put Stone on TV, I had to cave in and un-mute the TV. Now I take the good with the bad.

soltrain21
05-17-2010, 09:39 AM
Give me a Hawk soundboard and hook it up to the audio board and you would have no idea if it's me playing the soundboard or Hawk actually calling the game if you listened to it at home.

He is awful.

RhubarbStew
05-17-2010, 12:04 PM
Give me a Hawk soundboard and hook it up to the audio board and you would have no idea if it's me playing the soundboard or Hawk actually calling the game if you listened to it at home.

He is awful.

And in case you missed it...Poof, here it is.

http://www.palehosed.com/hawksoundboard.php

fox23
05-17-2010, 05:18 PM
And in case you missed it...Poof, here it is.

http://www.palehosed.com/hawksoundboard.php

Too bad they are missing the "Yaz" button.

Slappy
05-17-2010, 05:26 PM
And in case you missed it...Poof, here it is.

http://www.palehosed.com/hawksoundboard.php

Love the "Alright" button.

wassagstdu
05-17-2010, 06:53 PM
I really enjoy watching a game with Hawk. In fact, I won't watch a game on the other team's broadcast. Hawk hits it just right, in my opinion, when the Sox are going well and also when they are not. When the Sox are playing poorly we are all grouchy, and it is a great baseball tradition to take that out on the ump. I think everyone understands that it is just referred anger, and it is better than (a) pretending not to be angry or (b) directing that anger at the players where it belongs.

WhiteSoxFTW
05-18-2010, 11:48 AM
I thought of this thread the other night when Hawk spent the better part of two innings telling Frank Thomas that Mark Buehrle was a left-handed version of Catfish Hunter.

Ugh!