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View Full Version : Lucy optioned, Castro to re-join club.


GoGoCrede
05-02-2010, 03:34 PM
According to everyone's favorite beat reporter:

Lucy optioned, Castro joins club Monday.

DirtySox
05-02-2010, 03:34 PM
cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
Lucy optioned, Castro joins club Monday. 2 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/cst_sox/status/13264780356) via txt (http://twitter.com/devices)

GoGoCrede
05-02-2010, 03:35 PM
According to Cowley:

Lucy optioned, Castro joins club Monday.

http://twitter.com/cst_sox/status/13264780356

I'll miss Lucy. Liked what I saw of him.

LoveYourSuit
05-02-2010, 03:36 PM
According to everyone's favorite beat reporter:

Lucy optioned, Castro joins club Monday.

That should fix things :rolleyes:

jabrch
05-02-2010, 03:36 PM
I don' think Lucy could have taken advantage of his playing time any better than he did. I can't imagine Castro has a long rope here.

getonbckthr
05-02-2010, 03:36 PM
Lucy was one of the few guys I had any confidence in at the plate.

konerko 14
05-02-2010, 03:37 PM
Castro sucks, I want Lucy as the backup

Crede24Thome25
05-02-2010, 03:38 PM
cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
Lucy optioned, Castro joins club Monday. 2 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/cst_sox/status/13264780356) via txt (http://twitter.com/devices)
I'd rather have Lucy than Castro, He's been one of the bright spots.

LoveYourSuit
05-02-2010, 03:40 PM
Maybe Castro could help turn Buehrle around.

I'm grasping for straws.

GoGoCrede
05-02-2010, 03:41 PM
Maybe Castro could help turn Buehrle around.

I'm grasping for straws.

He might, we'll see. Can we send AJ to AAA to figure things out?

konerko 14
05-02-2010, 03:42 PM
He might, we'll see. Can we send AJ to AAA to figure things out?


if where sending AJ, why not send Williams, Peavy, Beckham, and Pierre with him

VMSNS
05-02-2010, 03:43 PM
Damn. Lucy looked like a solid player. This news actually bums me out a little bit.

Tragg
05-02-2010, 03:44 PM
Great- dump the young players. Bring Ozzie his lifetime .300 obp catcher back.

DirtySox
05-02-2010, 03:46 PM
I like Lucy. He hit while he was here but the track record shows that it wasn't likely to continue. That being said, he could be a very solid (and cheap) backup. I don't think we have seen the last of him.

tick53
05-02-2010, 03:52 PM
Another bad move. :angry:

sox1970
05-02-2010, 03:54 PM
It's backup catcher. Who cares?

jabrch
05-02-2010, 03:56 PM
Another bad move. :angry:

The only other option would have been to release Castro. This move likely gives Castro an audition to keep his job, and time for KW to shop him for some low level prospect.

Tragg
05-02-2010, 03:56 PM
I like Lucy. He hit while he was here but the track record shows that it wasn't likely to continue..
His replacement has a .300 lifetime obp, amassed in over 10 years of ML service.

I'll take my chances with LUcy.

jabrch
05-02-2010, 03:57 PM
It's backup catcher. Who cares?

While that's totally true, this is WSI - why not make an issue out of a non-issue?

getonbckthr
05-02-2010, 03:58 PM
It's backup catcher. Who cares?
Normally I wouldn't however when he is one of the few guys I actually feel good about at the plate......god that says alot about this team right now.

DirtySox
05-02-2010, 04:17 PM
His replacement has a .300 lifetime obp, amassed in over 10 years of ML service.

I'll take my chances with LUcy.

And what do you think Lucy's career minor league OBP of .321 will equate to?

I have no problem with Lucy as a backup, but it was quite obvious that Castro was going to return. Lucy will be back, be it sometime this year or next year.

Tragg
05-02-2010, 04:24 PM
And what do you think Lucy's career minor league OBP of .321 will equate to?

When the alternative is .300 proven over 10 years, I'm more than willing to take the chance on Lucy. There is really no downside.


It's the principle: I question the continued preference that this organizaton has of veterans who are proven over a series of years to be mediocre or worse, over young players.

Noneck
05-02-2010, 04:26 PM
Cutting Castro would mean the Sox would have to salt and pepper 1m. Not going to happen.

DirtySox
05-02-2010, 04:33 PM
When the alternative is .300 proven over 10 years, I'm more than willing to take the chance on Lucy. There is really no downside.


It's the principle: I question the continued preference that this organizaton has of veterans who are proven over a series of years to be mediocre or worse, over young players.

No disagreement here. The principle does suck. I hate the failure of the farm system, the abysmal spending on the draft, and the ineptitude in developing even replacement level players.

Lucy was a nice surprise in that regard, but they clearly weren't going to pay Castro 1 million+ to play in Charlotte.

LoveYourSuit
05-02-2010, 04:49 PM
While that's totally true, this is WSI - why not make an issue out of a non-issue?

To you, everything in Soxland is a "non issue."

People should never say anything bad about a bad team.

jabrch
05-02-2010, 04:50 PM
Lucy was a nice surprise in that regard, but they clearly weren't going to pay Castro 1 million+ to play in Charlotte.

Dirty, isn't it possible that since Castro has no options and Lucy does that they are going to take a look at Castro, see what he has, and see what his value is, and then make a move?

I mean - are you suggesting that it would have been better for the organization to release him outright today for nothing?

DirtySox
05-02-2010, 04:56 PM
Dirty, isn't it possible that since Castro has no options and Lucy does that they are going to take a look at Castro, see what he has, and see what his value is, and then make a move?

I mean - are you suggesting that it would have been better for the organization to release him outright today for nothing?

Yes, it is entirely possible.

And no, I haven't suggested that at all. In fact I'm one of the few who thinks it's entirely reasonable that Lucy was sent down. The Sox hands were pretty much tied here with the situation as it currently stands.

Lucy hasn't been banished because of this, and it's very likely he returns this season at some point or as next year's backup.

LoveYourSuit
05-02-2010, 04:57 PM
Dirty, isn't it possible that since Castro has no options and Lucy does that they are going to take a look at Castro, see what he has, and see what his value is, and then make a move?

I mean - are you suggesting that it would have been better for the organization to release him outright today for nothing?


What's the big loss if they would have gone this route?

This team for the last decade has failed to let people go when it was time to let them go.

jabrch
05-02-2010, 05:00 PM
Yes, it is entirely possible.

And no, I haven't suggested that at all. In fact I'm one of the few who thinks it's entirely reasonable that Lucy was sent down. The Sox hands were pretty much tied here with the situation as it currently stands.

Lucy hasn't been banished because of this, and it's very likely he returns this season at some point or as next year's backup.

Ok - I wanted to make sure I understood your point. I agree - this is very temporary and has less to do with not wanting to eat 1mm and more to do with making sure that is what they have to do before doing it.

Tragg
05-02-2010, 05:16 PM
Lucy was a nice surprise in that regard, but they clearly weren't going to pay Castro 1 million+ to play in Charlotte.
The mistake was paying him a nickle, much less a million, to play in Chicago.

SI1020
05-02-2010, 05:35 PM
Great- dump the young players. Bring Ozzie his lifetime .300 obp catcher back. Ozzie plays favorites more than he should and he almost never seems to like or support young players.

Dibbs
05-02-2010, 05:37 PM
I'm not too happy about this. I guess guys that make more money do automatically get an undeserved spot on the roster.

canOcorn
05-02-2010, 05:45 PM
Ozzie plays favorites more than he should and he almost never seems to like or support young players.

It doesn't matter at this point, but did you really think Lucy stood a chance on Ozzie's team over Castro? Not going to happen, if it's up to Ozzie.

TDog
05-02-2010, 05:50 PM
The only other option would have been to release Castro. This move likely gives Castro an audition to keep his job, and time for KW to shop him for some low level prospect.

If Lucy were out of options, they might have released Castro. I'm not so sure Castro is good at working with the pitchers. But I'm not sure how good Lucy is at working with the pitchers.

The only thing fans have to go by is the hitting. Given more playing time, that is, an injury to Pierzynski, for example, Lucy would have had significantly more playing time, and his average probably would have plummeted. Sometimes teams don't spend as much time going over how they will pitch the backup catcher, and there is less scouting information available.

Nonetheless, I am surprised Lucy was sent down. I wouldn't have been surprised if Castro had just gone away, like Ben Davis did.

canOcorn
05-02-2010, 06:01 PM
If Lucy were out of options, they might have released Castro. I'm not so sure Castro is good at working with the pitchers. But I'm not sure how good Lucy is at working with the pitchers. This is a pretty legit observation.

Sometimes teams don't spend as much time going over how they will pitch the backup catcher, and there is less scouting information available. This is a pretty silly observation. It's not like Lucy was brought up yesterday.

Nonetheless, I am surprised Lucy was sent down. I wouldn't have been surprised if Castro had just gone away, like Ben Davis did.Your first impression was correct, but since Ozzie has way too much influence on the roster we're stuck with Castro.

jabrch
05-02-2010, 06:04 PM
If Lucy were out of options, they might have released Castro. I'm not so sure Castro is good at working with the pitchers. But I'm not sure how good Lucy is at working with the pitchers.

The only thing fans have to go by is the hitting. Given more playing time, that is, an injury to Pierzynski, for example, Lucy would have had significantly more playing time, and his average probably would have plummeted. Sometimes teams don't spend as much time going over how they will pitch the backup catcher, and there is less scouting information available.

Nonetheless, I am surprised Lucy was sent down. I wouldn't have been surprised if Castro had just gone away, like Ben Davis did.

Sensible...There is a chance that they want to look at Castro, and give a few teams a look, to see if someone needs him as a backup C and is willing to give up a low level prospect for a decent gloved catcher. .

voodoochile
05-02-2010, 06:10 PM
This is a pretty legit observation.

This is a pretty silly observation. It's not like Lucy was brought up yesterday.

Your first impression was correct, but since Ozzie has way too much influence on the roster we're stuck with Castro.

Castro will be fine as a backup catcher and Lucy really should be in Charlotte getting regular PT if there's any chance for him to be the starter in the future at all. I liked what I saw of Lucy too, but it was unexpected. The people griping about Castro now are the same ones who would have been raising holy hell if the team had gone into the season with Lucy as the primary backup...

Craig Grebeck
05-02-2010, 06:13 PM
Castro will be fine as a backup catcher and Lucy really should be in Charlotte getting regular PT if there's any chance for him to be the starter in the future at all. I liked what I saw of Lucy too, but it was unexpected. The people griping about Castro now are the same ones who would have been raising holy hell if the team had gone into the season with Lucy as the primary backup...
Lucy will (and should) back up Flowers in Charlotte. He will not wear the tools down there.

Daver
05-02-2010, 06:20 PM
Lucy will (and should) back up Flowers in Charlotte. He will not wear the tools down there.

People will long for AJ'S defensive skills when he is replaced by Flowers.

guillensdisciple
05-02-2010, 06:21 PM
if where sending AJ, why not send Williams, Peavy, Beckham, and Pierre with him


Quentin, Alexei, Kotsay, Teahen, Floyd, Garcia, and Mark to boot.

TDog
05-02-2010, 06:21 PM
Lucy will (and should) back up Flowers in Charlotte. He will not wear the tools down there.

Both of them need regular playing time at catcher. Lucy seems much farther along defensively than Flowers. Maybe both will get in the lineup but Flowers will be the primary catcher.

canOcorn
05-02-2010, 06:22 PM
Castro will be fine as a backup catcher and Lucy really should be in Charlotte getting regular PT if there's any chance for him to be the starter in the future at all. I liked what I saw of Lucy too, but it was unexpected. The people griping about Castro now are the same ones who would have been raising holy hell if the team had gone into the season with Lucy as the primary backup...

It's not that I'm high on Lucy. Both Lucy and Castro are not good, but at least Lucy is cheaper, questionably is more liked by the pitchers and sadly is at least Castro's equal offensively. I just question why we keep Castro given those variables. Are we only allowed to keep a roster of Ozzie yes men? Seriously, anyone who questions him is ripped or gone, but if you bootlick and suck you might have a chance. Why is that?

Craig Grebeck
05-02-2010, 06:31 PM
Both of them need regular playing time at catcher. Lucy seems much farther along defensively than Flowers. Maybe both will get in the lineup but Flowers will be the primary catcher.
Have you seen Flowers?

People will long for AJ'S defensive skills when he is replaced by Flowers.
Various reports of huge improvements, but whatever.

voodoochile
05-02-2010, 06:32 PM
It's not that I'm high on Lucy. Both Lucy and Castro are not good, but at least Lucy is cheaper, questionably is more liked by the pitchers and sadly is at least Castro's equal offensively. I just question why we keep Castro given those variables. Are we only allowed to keep a roster of Ozzie yes men? Seriously, anyone who questions him is ripped or gone, but if you bootlick and suck you might have a chance. Why is that?

Well it isn't that, but feel free to feel that way if it makes you feel smarter.

Castro gets paid regardless of whether he's with the Sox or not on the Sox so since it doesn't matter who the BU catcher is, why are you making an issue out of this?

Daver
05-02-2010, 06:39 PM
Have you seen Flowers?

Yes I have.


Various reports of huge improvements, but whatever.

It would take huge improvements to equal AJ's skills, Donny Lucy is actually a good defensive catcher that can catch a knuckleballer, something that AJ or Tyler will never be able to claim.

Over By There
05-02-2010, 06:41 PM
Your first impression was correct, but since Ozzie has way too much influence on the roster we're stuck with Castro.

This situation would not have played out any different with any other team. Castro was intended to be the backup catcher and Lucy was only with the club due to an injury. As well as Lucy has played, you don't understand baseball if you think any other team would have treated a backup catcher situation any differently. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but you can quit blaming Ozzie for this one.

People can relax - the backup catcher position isn't going to dig us out of anything, and if Lucy is as good as the promise he flashed, he'll be back sooner than later.

Craig Grebeck
05-02-2010, 06:42 PM
Yes I have.




It would take huge improvements to equal AJ's skills, Donny Lucy is actually a good defensive catcher that can catch a knuckleballer, something that AJ or Tyler will never be able to claim.
And Donny, sans small MLB sample size, can't hit for ****.

TDog
05-02-2010, 07:06 PM
And Donny, sans small MLB sample size, can't hit for ****.

And even Peavy, who pitched to Flowers while rehabbing, didn't want Flowers catching him last September.

Seattle brought up a catcher who looked great offensively in the minors, and he has been having all kinds of problems defensively this year. After he became the first player since Mark Salas to be called for catcher's interference twice in the same game, he attempted to field a ball with his mask in another game. Last weekend, he was charged with a passed ball that helped the White Sox win a game. To make matters worse, he got off to an atrocious offensive start, despite his minor league success.

I'm not saying Flowers would look that bad, but the White Sox have been built with the promise of great starting pitching. Such teams need strong defensive catchers.

DrCrawdad
05-02-2010, 07:26 PM
I don't like this move, in that Lucy was one of the few bright spots on the offensive side. That said though they may have been forced to either bring up Castro or let him walk.

Konerko05
05-02-2010, 07:46 PM
Ramon Castro is a spark plug.

canOcorn
05-02-2010, 08:02 PM
This situation would not have played out any different with any other team. Castro was intended to be the backup catcher and Lucy was only with the club due to an injury. As well as Lucy has played, you don't understand baseball if you think any other team would have treated a backup catcher situation any differently. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but you can quit blaming Ozzie for this one.

People can relax - the backup catcher position isn't going to dig us out of anything, and if Lucy is as good as the promise he flashed, he'll be back sooner than later.

This is where people are becoming confused. Castro/Lucy is just a tiny part of Ozzie not being able to evaluate talent. The backup C is really not important, but Ozzie continually places inferior players in the field over more qualified players. He preaches defense and then puts crap out in the field, who are worse defensively, just because it's a RH/LH pitching matchup.

Lucy/Castro isn't going to decide our playoff chances. Stuffing his DH crap down our throat has...

PhillipsBubba
05-02-2010, 08:15 PM
According to everyone's favorite beat reporter:

Lucy optioned, Castro joins club Monday.

Too bad...I Love Lucy!!!

http://www.insidesocal.com/outinhollywood/,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,lucy.jpghttp://www.wavemagazine.net/arhiva/17/politics/castro2.jpg

DrCrawdad
05-02-2010, 08:46 PM
This is where people are becoming confused. Castro/Lucy is just a tiny part of Ozzie not being able to evaluate talent. The backup C is really not important, but Ozzie continually places inferior players in the field over more qualified players. He preaches defense and then puts crap out in the field, who are worse defensively, just because it's a RH/LH pitching matchup.

Lucy/Castro isn't going to decide our playoff chances. Stuffing his DH crap down our throat has...

I agree with the Lucy/Castrol comment. Worst first is the pitching trailed closely by the offense, it's been offensive overall.

Ramon Castro is a spark plug.

No, Ramon Castro is a ...

http://cdn2.overstock.com/images/products/P11721981.jpg

Over By There
05-02-2010, 09:23 PM
This is where people are becoming confused. Castro/Lucy is just a tiny part of Ozzie not being able to evaluate talent. The backup C is really not important, but Ozzie continually places inferior players in the field over more qualified players. He preaches defense and then puts crap out in the field, who are worse defensively, just because it's a RH/LH pitching matchup.

Lucy/Castro isn't going to decide our playoff chances. Stuffing his DH crap down our throat has...

This backup C situation has nothing to do with the other questions you raise. But don't let that get in the way of a good ol' Ozzie bashing.

Konerko05
05-02-2010, 09:27 PM
No, Ramon Castro is a ...

http://cdn2.overstock.com/images/products/P11721981.jpg

I thought it was pretty obvious.

veeter
05-02-2010, 09:27 PM
The mistake was paying him a nickle, much less a million, to play in Chicago.I don't think the Sox knew what they had in Lucy.

kittle42
05-02-2010, 09:49 PM
I don't think the Sox knew what they had in Lucy.

A crappy hitter who happened to do well over a very small sample size?

TDog
05-02-2010, 09:56 PM
A crappy hitter who happened to do well over a very small sample size?

Strictly speaking, if his sample size is so small, you don't know what kind of a hitter he is.

Frontman
05-02-2010, 09:57 PM
A crappy hitter who happened to do well over a very small sample size?

Keep that line of talk up and Lucy will be the 2010's version of Brian Anderson.

"Ozzie never gave him a chance!!!!!"

kittle42
05-02-2010, 10:26 PM
Strictly speaking, if his sample size is so small, you don't know what kind of a hitter he is.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=lucy--001don

This is a decent indicator.

Tragg
05-02-2010, 10:46 PM
A crappy hitter who happened to do well over a very small sample size?
And Castro is a crappy hitter who has hit like crap over a large sample size.
There is no upside to castro.

Noneck
05-02-2010, 10:56 PM
I'll take a .250 hitting catcher any day of week (Ed Herrmann), as long as he is good defensively. It is probably the most important defensive position on the field. But I am from an era when people actually thought defense was important. Now its just an afterthought.

Domeshot17
05-02-2010, 11:17 PM
As most have mentioned, this is all about the money.

soxlady8
05-02-2010, 11:46 PM
to see Lucy go --

He appeared to be hitting well during his time up here ...
he also was pretty good at defense...

He has a soft spot w me from Spring Training ... he SIGNED everything everyone asked him to .. balls , hats , notebooks etc. etc.
He was the last guy to the clubhouse after the game and had a smile on his face while signing !!

If Castro goes down again , Lucy is sure welcome up here by me !!

ilsox7
05-02-2010, 11:47 PM
As most have mentioned, this is all about the money.

How? The Sox are paying Castro no matter what.

TDog
05-03-2010, 12:42 AM
http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=lucy--001don

This is a decent indicator.

There are players who do much better in the majors than they do in the minors. I don't think Bobby Bonilla, for example, every hit higher than .265 in the minors before the Sox drafted him from the Pirates. It wasn't long before he was traded back to the Pirates and within two years as a major leaguer, he was a .300 hitter.

Labeling someone as a crappy hitter based on his stats ignores the possibility of improvement and the work they continue to put into their game.

Regardless, I suggested that Lucy could be benefiting from teams not intensely scouting him. I like Lucy because he seems to be a solid defensive catcher, and a team that lives and dies with its pitching needs strong defensive catchers. Defense is more important than offense in a backup catcher. And if he can hit well in a limited backup role, a small sample size, that's not a bad thing either.

Mohoney
05-03-2010, 04:21 AM
I'm glad Lucy had some success while he was up here. It might be a small sample size, but success at the major league level should never be disregarded. I hope he can build on it, go on a hot streak at the plate in the minors, and develop into a solid backup catcher for this team in 2011.

Randar68
05-03-2010, 10:25 AM
I like Lucy. He hit while he was here but the track record shows that it wasn't likely to continue. That being said, he could be a very solid (and cheap) backup. I don't think we have seen the last of him.

Well, wasn't he almost exclusively hitting against lefties (at least in games he started)? I haven't looked it up, but that is my impression.

veeter
05-04-2010, 08:29 AM
And Castro is a crappy hitter who has hit like crap over a large sample size.
There is no upside to castro.Thank you.

veeter
05-04-2010, 08:37 AM
A crappy hitter who happened to do well over a very small sample size?No, a capable back-up, who's cheap and from the Sox system. He can also bunt and runs a little bit.

asindc
05-04-2010, 08:45 AM
No, a capable back-up, who's cheap and from the Sox system. He can also bunt and runs a little bit.

Not weighing in on the merits of Lucy vs. Castro, but if the Sox ate Castro's salary to make Lucy the backup, then Lucy would not be so cheap.

veeter
05-04-2010, 08:46 AM
Not weighing in on the merits of Lucy vs. Castro, but if the Sox ate Castro's salary to make Lucy the backup, then Lucy would not be so cheap.My point was, if they knew Lucy could handle the job they wouldn't have had to re-sign Castro.

DonnieDarko
05-04-2010, 09:07 AM
Well, hopefully Lucy opened some eyes so that he can get another shot next year, or if Castro starts stinking up the joint this season. He was a big surprise, that's for sure.

Speaking catchers, has anyone heard anything about Flowers? Are they finally going to move the guy to 1B/DH?

Craig Grebeck
05-04-2010, 10:49 AM
My point was, if they knew Lucy could handle the job they wouldn't have had to re-sign Castro.
...maybe Lucy can't actually handle the job?

The Immigrant
05-04-2010, 10:56 AM
Speaking catchers, has anyone heard anything about Flowers? Are they finally going to move the guy to 1B/DH?

He's still catching and is hitting the ball well (.940 OPS in 70+ AB).

doublem23
05-04-2010, 10:57 AM
Ozzie plays favorites more than he should and he almost never seems to like or support young players.

That's probably because our young players suck.

doublem23
05-04-2010, 11:00 AM
http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=lucy--001don

This is a decent indicator.

Got to love people pining for a guy who couldn't hit in Great Falls.

SI1020
05-04-2010, 11:28 AM
That's probably because our young players suck. Most but not all of them. If Beckham washes out I will be more than a little disappointed. This team's inability or unwillingness to teach and develop young talent is frustrating to say the least. Of course I realize that this particular move is hardly going to make or break the Sox.

Randar68
05-04-2010, 11:44 AM
Got to love people pining for a guy who couldn't hit in Great Falls.

Got to love people using 6 year old data to judge if a player can hit or not today. :rolleyes:

Funny thing is there was plenty of other data to use instead of his rookie league numbers. Nevermind he was drafted as a raw offensive and good/athletic defensive catcher.

He hits well enough to be a backup catcher, IMO, particularly if you can platoon him with a lefty catcher. Hmmmm. What teams have situations like that? It's not like Castro is a top hitter (.237 career hitter).

Craig Grebeck
05-04-2010, 11:48 AM
Lucy's evidence of a pretty awful draft failure, especially considering what catcher was taken right after him.

Maybe he can hit enough, I don't know. No use getting hung up on this move.

voodoochile
05-04-2010, 11:49 AM
My point was, if they knew Lucy could handle the job they wouldn't have had to re-sign Castro.

That milk's been spilled and flowed under the bridge. So you won't be able to dip your crumbled cookie in it...

Randar68
05-04-2010, 12:05 PM
Lucy's evidence of a pretty awful draft failure, especially considering what catcher was taken right after him.

Jaramillo or Suzuki. Suzuki is mediocre defensively and it's not like he has lit the world on fire offensively. Jaramillo hasn't done much. They missed on a bunch of other guys in the 2nd round that year. Liotta and Whistler haven't done a damn thing, while Vargas, Pence and Pedroia all would have looked nice in Sox uni's.

That 2004 draft ended up being a huge failure. Just brutal how little they got out of it, although Brandon Allen, Gio Gonzalez, Fields, and Russell were parts of trades.

Craig Grebeck
05-04-2010, 01:14 PM
Jaramillo or Suzuki. Suzuki is mediocre defensively and it's not like he has lit the world on fire offensively. Jaramillo hasn't done much. They missed on a bunch of other guys in the 2nd round that year. Liotta and Whistler haven't done a damn thing, while Vargas, Pence and Pedroia all would have looked nice in Sox uni's.

That 2004 draft ended up being a huge failure. Just brutal how little they got out of it, although Brandon Allen, Gio Gonzalez, Fields, and Russell were parts of trades.
I'm talking Suzuki. Is he really mediocre? I wasn't aware.

doublem23
05-04-2010, 02:50 PM
Most but not all of them. If Beckham washes out I will be more than a little disappointed. This team's inability or unwillingness to teach and develop young talent is frustrating to say the least. Of course I realize that this particular move is hardly going to make or break the Sox.

Beckham is a special case, since he spent all of what... 5 months in the Sox minor league system? It appears that the less time you spend with the Sox developmental staff, the better off you are.

Randar68
05-04-2010, 02:53 PM
I'm talking Suzuki. Is he really mediocre? I wasn't aware.

Lucy was taken #59, Jaramillo #62, and Suzuki #67. Lots of catchers went in the top 200 picks that draft, but only a few have even had MLB at bats at this point, let alone any real success. Landon Powell went 24th overall and is a 27 year old back-up to Suzuki, Curtis Thigpen (57) washed out of baseball after a few MLB AB's, Lucy (#59), Suzuki (#67), Chris Ianetta (#110)...

Not much to get excited about anywhere in there, honestly.

Craig Grebeck
05-04-2010, 02:58 PM
Lucy was taken #59, Jaramillo #62, and Suzuki #67. Lots of catchers went in the top 200 picks that draft, but only a few have even had MLB at bats at this point, let alone any real success. Landon Powell went 24th overall and is a 27 year old back-up to Suzuki, Curtis Thigpen (57) washed out of baseball after a few MLB AB's, Lucy (#59), Suzuki (#67), Chris Ianetta (#110)...

Not much to get excited about anywhere in there, honestly.
I meant defensively. I'm a big fan of Suzuki -- do you think Lucy was a better pick? I'm curious.

Tragg
05-04-2010, 03:04 PM
I think it's a lesson of "When in doubt, take the lousy veteran with no upside because they have that positive attitude".

Randar68
05-04-2010, 03:52 PM
I meant defensively. I'm a big fan of Suzuki -- do you think Lucy was a better pick? I'm curious.

Suzuki is a middle of the road everyday catcher, so he has definitely been the better pick. I wanted Suzuki at the time of the draft but I did understand why they took Lucy. He had more upside and was playing behind Ryan Garko until his Junior year when he had his first everyday playing time and was All PAC-10. Didn't turn out the way the Sox had hoped, sure, but I did understand the pick at the time. There were questions if Suzuki would even stick behind the plate at that time.