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Sufferin
04-21-2010, 09:14 PM
The play by play guy is an annoying, name dropping (Yaz!) egotistical jerk.

The manager plays one of the best defensive CF in history at DH, with defensively challenged players in LF and RF.

The team can't handle fundamental plays like catching a foul pop, hitting the cutoff man, and getting in proper position to throw when catching a fly ball. These are all things I have my 11-12 year old rec league players doing fairly well right now in practice. What the Hell do they do in spring training? I was only thinking defense here, but while I'm at it, is it reall impossible to put the bat on the ball when there's a guy on 2nd with less than 2 outs?

Every day I have to hear about the manager ripping someone a dropping F-bombs. I'm a south side mick who is used to colorful language, but I grow tired of hearing it unnecessarily.

Every hitter on the team seems to take fastballs down the pipe and swing at breaking pitches out of the zone. Manager says "these players don't need a hitting coach". Then why do we have one?

A team that is supposedly built to play small ball but has no good contact hitters, which is the single most important facet of any small ball strategy. You can't do a hit and run if you can't be trusted to hit the ball.

Ozzie, Kenny, wake up. You've got a great pitching staff that will be wasted by bad defense and poor hitting.

Why do I keep following these guys? Maybe I'll just take May off (if only the Hawks will give me something else to focus on) and check back in June.

Rdy2PlayBall
04-21-2010, 09:18 PM
+1

But I'll keep watching like I always do.

kevingrt
04-21-2010, 09:44 PM
Why do I keep following these guys? Maybe I'll just take May off (if only the Hawks will give me something else to focus on) and check back in June.

I'll answer that question for you.

You keep on watching because you are a Sox fan. Good or bad we always watch sometimes it just really sucks, like today.

DaveFeelsRight
04-21-2010, 09:48 PM
Smell ya later. I'll happily watch this team all the way though; for better or for worse.

doublem23
04-21-2010, 09:54 PM
The manager plays one of the best defensive CF in history at DH, with defensively challenged players in LF and RF.


... He's playing CF behind a guy who is currently a better CF than he is. This isn't 1996, Jones isn't winning perennial Gold Gloves, he's lost a step. Andruw didn't log an inning in CF last year with the Rangers.

TomC727
04-21-2010, 09:55 PM
I will continue to watch because I am a White Sox fan but this team is absolutely pathetic and Walker needs to be fired. It isn't his fault alone but changes need to be made and this offense has had issues for over a year now. Absolutely embarassing. The organization should be embarassed for the few fans that actually went to the game tonight. They deserve better than this crap.

russ99
04-21-2010, 09:58 PM
I know we can't hit our way out of a wet paper bag right now, but seriously this questioning every single call, every position in the order and everyone in the lineup has got to stop.

Would it really matter tonight if Jones played LF, CF, RF or even catcher tonight?

Would it have mattered if Kotsay batted first?

Sheesh. For the second time this year, gotta pull it out: we look like the douchebag Red Sox fans we hate.

This constant whining is counterproductive. Maybe the hitters would hit better if they knew we were behind them instead of complaining every single time something doesn't go right.

Noneck
04-21-2010, 10:00 PM
Watch? Yea I will.

Pay good money if they keep playing like this? I don't think so.

october23sp
04-21-2010, 10:00 PM
I'll follow the whole season and wear shirts just to get ridiculed, even if we do lose 100 games this year.

doublem23
04-21-2010, 10:05 PM
Sheesh. For the second time this year, gotta pull it out: we look like the douchebag Red Sox fans we hate.


What?

DirtySox
04-21-2010, 10:05 PM
Watch? Yea I will.

Pay good money if they keep playing like this? I don't think so.

I'm with you on that one.

soxlady8
04-21-2010, 10:09 PM
I was born and raised in Bridgeport.
I have been a fan since I was 8 !!

I just got home from the game ... it was cold ... and everything tonight was PATHETIC... Burhls was not on at all ... the pen was bad ... the offense horrid ... the defense blah ...

but I will continue to support my team ... that is what a real fan does , not a bandwagonner or a partial fan ---

Last night was great ... tonight was not ---

still early in the season --

Tragg
04-21-2010, 10:15 PM
This constant whining is counterproductive. Maybe the hitters would hit better if they knew we were behind them instead of complaining every single time something doesn't go right.
For goodness sakes, complaining fans are causing this?

The Sox still haven't won a series.

LoveYourSuit
04-21-2010, 10:18 PM
Smell ya later. I'll happily watch this team all the way though; for better or for worse.


I can guarantee you if they play similiar to this, I don't care how much of a die hard you claim to be, you will be doing something else with your time.

LoveYourSuit
04-21-2010, 10:20 PM
This constant whining is counterproductive. Maybe the hitters would hit better if they knew we were behind them instead of complaining every single time something doesn't go right.


Dear Lord, please tell me you are not serious?:?:

DaveFeelsRight
04-21-2010, 10:25 PM
I can guarantee you if they play similiar to this, I don't care how much of a die hard you claim to be, you will be doing something else with your time.i stomached through 2007 (though i missed the last couple of weeks cause i was out of the country) so i can handle bad baseball, though it's frustrating.

it's too early to determine if the season is over. april isn't even over yet.

Lillian
04-21-2010, 10:27 PM
Many of us have remarked how poorly the Sox do against pitchers whom they're facing for the first time.
In addition, Sox offenses have rarely demonstrated an ability to approach any pitcher, familiar or unfamiliar, with a good game plan.
The way the Rays came into tonight's game with a very sound game plan against Buehrle, is just the kind of thing to which I'm alluding.
Their right handed hitters took away that outside pitch by going the other way. The absence of any similar kind of sound preparation to face either an unfamiliar pitcher, or to just have a game plan, suggests to me that Sox teams are not as prepared as they should be.
I just don't see other teams demonstrating the same consistent lack of preparation. Why is it that other teams don't struggle against any pitcher whom they have never seen?

GoGoCrede
04-21-2010, 10:28 PM
This constant whining is counterproductive. Maybe the hitters would hit better if they knew we were behind them instead of complaining every single time something doesn't go right.

Please. I really doubt they have us in mind every time they go up to bat. I think our complaints are pretty valid ones.

russ99
04-21-2010, 10:30 PM
Dear Lord, please tell me you are not serious?:?:

No, tongue is firmly in cheek, but it's not tealworthy.

I made my point. I've never seen a Sox team were every single thing they do is criticized. It's out of hand.

I'm all for second-guessing, but every single thing? There hasn't been one game this year where something happened that fans like?

Lip Man 1
04-21-2010, 10:32 PM
Lillian:

I can only repeat what I've been told by folks in the organization and in the media, that the Sox advance scouting staff (Bryan Little and company) do a great job of getting video regardless of how little an opposing pitcher has thrown.

The Sox get that info in plenty of time and that Greg Walker goes over the information and makes the video available to the hitters.

They prepare but something happens from the time they leave the clubhouse to the time they get in the batters box.

I'm not defending Walker or running down the Sox players, I'm only passing along what I'm getting from multiple sources.

Your guess is as good as mine as to what happens.

Lip

TDog
04-21-2010, 10:32 PM
...

Why do I keep following these guys? Maybe I'll just take May off (if only the Hawks will give me something else to focus on) and check back in June.

This team is much better than the ones I grew up with. I'm into my fifth decade as a White Sox fan, and this team is in the top half of the teams I've followed.

I'm not saying this is a great team or even saying is in the top half of the teams in the league, although I think they are much better than they are playing right now. I'm saying that if you want to be a White Sox fan, history has shown you that it can get much, much worse.

Baseball is the only sport that matters. And those of us over 50 who have stuck it out putting the White Sox first have been rewarded occasionally for surviving.

I didn't start following for the White Sox because they were winning. And I'm not going to stop because they're losing.

Lip Man 1
04-21-2010, 10:34 PM
Russ:

When you're coming off two losing seasons in three years and are off to a 5-10 start, basically the answer is "no" to your question.

If nothing changes I shudder to think what the park will be like come July, half empty and those that do show up will get on the players unmercifully (and it will be hard to blame them...)

Lip

LoveYourSuit
04-21-2010, 10:34 PM
Lillian:

I can only repeat what I've been told by folks in the organization and in the media, that the Sox advance scouting staff (Bryan Little and company) do a great job of getting video regardless of how little an opposing pitcher has thrown.

The Sox get that info in pleanty of time and that Greg Walker goes out the information and makes the video available to the hitters.

They prepare but something happens from the time they leave the clubhous to the time they get in the batters box.

I'm not defending Walker or running down the Sox players, I'm only passing along what I'm getting from multiple sources.

Your guess is as good as mine as to what happens.

Lip

It's the negative vibes coming from the fans which erases their memories.

russ99
04-21-2010, 10:38 PM
Russ:

When you're coming off two losing seasons in three years and are off to a 5-10 start, basically the answer is "no" to your question.

If nothing changes I shudder to think what the park will be like come July, half empty and those that do show up will get on the players unmercifully (and it will be hard to blame them...)

Lip

Well, Lip I guess that's my issue. Plenty of teams have poor starts. Lots of Sox teams I've followed have had much worse stretches than this.

Since when do we expect that the Sox are going to win all the time, everyone's going to produce, Jerry's going to spend like crazy and and bring in more stars...

We won one title in 82 years and one division title since. How does that qualify us to act like Yankee or Red Sox fans and have the same unrealistic expectations?

Domeshot17
04-21-2010, 10:40 PM
Well, Lip I guess that's my issue. Plenty of teams have poor starts. Lots of Sox teams I've followed have had much worse stretches than this.

Since when do we expect that the Sox are going to win all the time, everyone's going to produce, Jerry's going to spend like crazy and and bring in more stars...

We won one title in 82 years and one division title since. How does that qualify us to act like Yankee or Red Sox fans and have the same unrealistic expectations?

When your GM runs his mouth about commitments to winning and having championship expectations, it starts to add up. The Sox haven't been committed to winning since 2006.

thomas35forever
04-21-2010, 10:41 PM
i stomached through 2007 (though i missed the last couple of weeks cause i was out of the country) so i can handle bad baseball, though it's frustrating.

it's too early to determine if the season is over. april isn't even over yet.
The difference is we got off to decent start that April. It all went downhill after that.

LoveYourSuit
04-21-2010, 10:43 PM
Well, Lip I guess that's my issue. Plenty of teams have poor starts. Lots of Sox teams I've followed have had much worse stretches than this.

Since when do we expect that the Sox are going to win all the time, everyone's going to produce, Jerry's going to spend like crazy and and bring in more stars...

We won one title in 82 years and one division title since. How does that qualify us to act like Yankee or Red Sox fans and have the same unrealistic expectations?


When we have a payroll the size we have and when our tickets are priced as high as they are ..... I think fans have very high expectations for this team.

Lip Man 1
04-21-2010, 10:44 PM
Dome:

That's a good point you bring up. The Sox organization "expects" to win (as well they should), so why can't the fans expect the same thing?

And Russ to answer your question - from 2000 through 2008 the Sox won a world championship, made the playoffs three times and had seven winnings seasons.

That's not Yankee-like but that's pretty damn good...expectations have been raised, again as well they should. This is Chicago... not Pittsburgh, Kansas City, San Diego or Washington last I looked.

Lip

Noneck
04-21-2010, 10:45 PM
This team is much better than the ones I grew up with. I'm into my fifth decade as a White Sox fan, and this team is in the top half of the teams I've followed.

I'm not saying this is a great team or even saying is in the top half of the teams in the league, although I think they are much better than they are playing right now. I'm saying that if you want to be a White Sox fan, history has shown you that it can get much, much worse.

Baseball is the only sport that matters. And those of us over 50 who have stuck it out putting the White Sox first have been rewarded occasionally for surviving.

I didn't start following for the White Sox because they were winning. And I'm not going to stop because they're losing.

I am in your age group and remember the down times. I also remember my family bringing a picnic basket and going to Sunday doubleheaders. That was 6 hours of family entertainment for under 10 bucks. (that included free parking a block away)

So what I am really saying is, Of course I will follow them but they wont see my long green unless they earn it.

Edit: That was a family of 5.

JB98
04-21-2010, 10:48 PM
I know we can't hit our way out of a wet paper bag right now, but seriously this questioning every single call, every position in the order and everyone in the lineup has got to stop.

Would it really matter tonight if Jones played LF, CF, RF or even catcher tonight?

Would it have mattered if Kotsay batted first?

Sheesh. For the second time this year, gotta pull it out: we look like the douchebag Red Sox fans we hate.

This constant whining is counterproductive. Maybe the hitters would hit better if they knew we were behind them instead of complaining every single time something doesn't go right.

People whine where I work, too. I never get any words of thanks from my boss. I still get my job done.

These guys are millionaires. There's no excuse for this type of suckage. None.

Lip Man 1
04-21-2010, 10:58 PM
Lillian:

Ironically Mark Gonzales' answers a question about this in this week's 'mail bag'

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/chi-ask-mark-gonzales-apr21,0,6410317.story?page=1

Lip

Crede24Thome25
04-21-2010, 11:16 PM
People whine where I work, too. I never get any words of thanks from my boss. I still get my job done.

These guys are millionaires. There's no excuse for this type of suckage. None.

This is exactly why I say no player in the game of baseball or any sport should be making the money they are making unless they can guarantee us fans who pay they're salary wins or titles. They should be ashamed to take our money the way they are playing.:angry:

Rikirk
04-21-2010, 11:54 PM
What if we offered the players an incentive to get on base, say maybe a little bit of cash,...or free trips to the golf course,...or at least a ham on rye.

Nellie_Fox
04-21-2010, 11:59 PM
I can guarantee you if they play similiar to this, I don't care how much of a die hard you claim to be, you will be doing something else with your time.You do not speak for me. I've continued to watch much worse White Sox teams than this in my time. If some of you want to bail, go ahead. But don't tell me what you guarantee I'll be doing.

LoveYourSuit
04-22-2010, 12:02 AM
You do not speak for me. I've continued to watch much worse White Sox teams than this in my time. If some of you want to bail, go ahead. But don't tell me what you guarantee I'll be doing.


Good for you.

johnnyg83
04-22-2010, 12:19 AM
1976 and 1986 were pretty bad ... But I don't remember feeling this down on the team so early.

It has to be close to our worst start after 15 games.

JB98
04-22-2010, 12:25 AM
1976 and 1986 were pretty bad ... But I don't remember feeling this down on the team so early.

It has to be close to our worst start after 15 games.

That worthless piece of **** Bevington presided over a 4-12 start in 1997.

NLaloosh
04-22-2010, 05:02 AM
I've been watching the Sox since 1970. In the 70's there were so many less talented Sox teams than this.

But, this has been a very frustrating start to the season. It's been a while since I've seen a Sox team like this bad - especially right out of the gate and especially one with so much talent and high expectations.

I'm not throwing in the towel before the first three weeks is up but they better wake up soon or the stands will be empty come JUNE 1st and it will be disastrous.

Unfortunately, the Sox biggest rival is the most professional major league baseball organization that comes to play the game the right way almost every day. And, in contrast the Sox organization looks like a joke.

Jurr
04-22-2010, 06:33 AM
Great thread, guys! Good reading! Yup, the Sox suck pretty bad. Kenny needs to shut his mouth about how good his team is. It makes him look like a moron when his team is getting pasted by the Indians.

This team is loaded with guys trying to hang on in the bigs. It isn't working out. Next year, hopefully we aren't placing our hopes and dreams on Kotsay, Pierre, and other guys that really belong on a bench at this point in their careers. Ugh.

harwar
04-22-2010, 06:45 AM
This team is much better than the ones I grew up with. I'm into my fifth decade as a White Sox fan, and this team is in the top half of the teams I've followed.

I'm not saying this is a great team or even saying is in the top half of the teams in the league, although I think they are much better than they are playing right now. I'm saying that if you want to be a White Sox fan, history has shown you that it can get much, much worse.

Baseball is the only sport that matters. And those of us over 50 who have stuck it out putting the White Sox first have been rewarded occasionally for surviving.

I didn't start following for the White Sox because they were winning. And I'm not going to stop because they're losing.

excellent post sir ..

Jiddy78
04-22-2010, 08:35 AM
I'll always love this team...Excited to be bringing my son to his first Sox game (and first baseball game altogether...How's that for beginning the brainwash...LOL) in May. It'll be a great time regardless of where we are in the standings.

But yeah, after 10% of the season done, having less losses than only 1 team in the majors is a bad sign. Nail on the head regarding hitting and defense...moreso hitting IMO...Damn shame too cuz we've got some arms and that's, from my perspective, usually the hard part.

Keepin' fingers crossed that we can win today and salvage a series win vs. one of the better teams out there and then get another series win vs. Seattle...Kinda get some good juju rollin'.

SoxGirl4Life
04-22-2010, 08:47 AM
Smell ya later. I'll happily watch this team all the way though; for better or for worse.

I agree with you 100%. They may frustrate me, or make me want to choke the living daylights out of them, but I wear my Sox jacket every day!

Go SOX!

chisox616
04-22-2010, 09:32 AM
At least you guys get to watch this team...even if they're losing. It's not like you're losing money out of it.

I'd do anything just to watch the Sox lose...let alone catching the occasional game that they might win. If I want winning baseball, I'll go watch the Cards. But I just wanna watch my Sox play...

I haven't even gotten to see Andruw Jones bat yet in a live game! Let alone seeing Rios on his tear and Danks acting like the perfect K machine.

So at least you all have the option not to watch them. For me, it's not a choice. :\

Harry Chappas
04-22-2010, 09:38 AM
I've been watching the Sox since 1970. In the 70's there were so many less talented Sox teams than this.

But, this has been a very frustrating start to the season. It's been a while since I've seen a Sox team like this bad - especially right out of the gate and especially one with so much talent and high expectations.

I'm not throwing in the towel before the first three weeks is up but they better wake up soon or the stands will be empty come JUNE 1st and it will be disastrous.

Unfortunately, the Sox biggest rival is the most professional major league baseball organization that comes to play the game the right way almost every day. And, in contrast the Sox organization looks like a joke.

That's part of the problem. On paper, we should be able to contend. There's talent on this team which is what makes this putrid start so hard to stomach. The biggest question mark coming into the season was DH. So far (very early, I know), Kenny has hit it out of the park with Andruw Jones. Rios has been solid in the field and at the dish. Teahen has been, at best, average, but is hardly the reason we're struggling. It's the guys we've come to count on - TCQ, TCM, Gordon, and A.J. that have been awful and are largely responsible for our 5-10 record.

I have faith that we'll get it together, but what worries me is that the Twins will simply run away with this thing. I don't really buy into the "it's early" mantra - not when Minnesota is playing .700 baseball.

SI1020
04-22-2010, 10:40 AM
Lillian:

Ironically Mark Gonzales' answers a question about this in this week's 'mail bag'

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/chi-ask-mark-gonzales-apr21,0,6410317.story?page=1

Lip It's the same old broken record. The coaches and scouts are doing their jobs, the players just don't take their advice. I have to think that when the same mistakes happen year in and year out that someone is trying to pull a fast one on us fans. I just no longer buy that tired old explanation.

kufram
04-22-2010, 10:45 AM
This is exactly why I say no player in the game of baseball or any sport should be making the money they are making unless they can guarantee us fans who pay they're salary wins or titles. They should be ashamed to take our money the way they are playing.:angry:

I'm sure the Konerkos, Beckhams, and Buerles of this world don't feel great about how they are doing right now. The problem with your theory is that there is only one title winner each year so 29 out of 30 teams have to go home losers. There are no guarantees. You pays your money you takes your chances.

Fans have every right to be disappointed, even disgusted. I am both sometimes but I, too, remember the decades of no titles and few chances. I've never thought of booing my own team and I never called them names. The guys on this team are not bums. They are losing baseball games. If I ever get to the point that I want to boo the White Sox or think they are not trying to win... that's when I'll go, but we aren't even near that point.

Maybe one needs the years of no titles to still savour 2005 and keep hoping we can get back to that summit again. Just not today.

I'm interested that the super-negatories that keep threatening to leave just keep threatening.... why don't they leave. The Yankees win a lot and will always accept the money.

tony1972
04-22-2010, 11:07 AM
I wont buy another ticket to a Sox game as long as Walker remains hitting coach..

soxfanatlanta
04-22-2010, 11:14 AM
I wont buy another ticket to a Sox game as long as Walker remains hitting coach..

:rolleyes:

kittle42
04-22-2010, 11:15 AM
Perhaps if Williams had not listened to his idiotic manager and acquired real hitters and not the 2002 All-Star team this offseason, we wouldn't be already having this conversation 15 games into the season.

GoGoCrede
04-22-2010, 11:21 AM
I wont buy another ticket to a Sox game as long as Walker remains hitting coach..

Haha. I think you'll be waiting for a long time (although I'd also like to see Walker go).

Harry Chappas
04-22-2010, 11:35 AM
Perhaps if Williams had not listened to his idiotic manager and acquired real hitters and not the 2002 All-Star team this offseason, we wouldn't be already having this conversation 15 games into the season.

What exactly about Andruw Jones has disappointed you? DH isn't the problem...

jabrch
04-22-2010, 11:37 AM
This is a personal issue...if you don't enjoy watching baseball, and don't enjoy watching this team, don't do it... It's not for anyone else to judge... But don't expect me to give a crap either. You are more than welcome to jump on and off anytime you so desire.

For me, I enjoy the game and will always watch...but I know some people are more into the results and that has more impact on their enjoyment. I'll turn off a game like last night when it's a blowout and go do something else - but I'll still come back again tomorrow or so and watch the next game. Personal preference.

Carolina Kenny
04-22-2010, 11:39 AM
This team is not only hard to watch but hard to find. Lord only knows what cable channel tonight's game is on.

With high expectations from a fairly successful winning percentage since the 1990's I just don't feel the buzz from this group.

The appear to be flat as a pancake, and moving towards a Bataan Death March to obscurity this year.

I am hardcore Sox fan to the end and will still watch and go to games as much I can, but this team is not firing up the imagination of the city or nation.

Having watched the Sox for over fifty years, it just appears that this is going to be one of those crap seasons unless someone or something awakens this team from its slumber.

jabrch
04-22-2010, 11:44 AM
I wont buy another ticket to a Sox game as long as Walker remains hitting coach..

That's your right. Thanks for sharing.

If your enjoyment is tied to who the hitting coach is - then so be it.

Hitmen77
04-22-2010, 11:46 AM
What exactly about Andruw Jones has disappointed you? DH isn't the problem...

That Ozzie hasn't been playing him every day? :dunno:

Our best hitter so far and he is a part-timer on Ozzie's team.

This team is a joke. People were counting on lights-out pitching to overcome our weak offense. Our pitching is good, but people are seeing now that we don't have 4 aces that can carry this club despite the poor offense.

No, we won't have a .333 winning pct once Alexei and Pierre start hitting at their career norms, but we won't be that great either.....and probably not 5 or 6 games better than the Twins from here on out.

kittle42
04-22-2010, 11:47 AM
What exactly about Andruw Jones has disappointed you? DH isn't the problem...

Nothing, but this team needed a guy who can hit near .300 with 40HRs more than it needed Juan Pierre.

Lip Man 1
04-22-2010, 11:59 AM
Kittle:

Very true however those guys rarely become available via the trade route, generally you get a chance when they become free agents.

And for whatever reason the Sox have decided to avoid that option a lot the past few years, to say nothing of the financial obligation.

Lip

jabrch
04-22-2010, 01:05 PM
Nothing, but this team needed a guy who can hit near .300 with 40HRs more than it needed Juan Pierre.


How many were available, where their current team was willing to pay most of the salary, where they are a lock to deliver .300/40?

**** - how many are available period?

Juan Pierre isn't this team's problem - is he? Gordon is hitting .228/.323/.333. He's our "doubles machine". Alexei...AJ....

Only Jones and PK are producing acceptably. That's the problem.

Jim Shorts
04-22-2010, 01:11 PM
I'm interested to see how long Beckham gets a pass here....

He didn't play one full season and he's already in the WSI HoF.

"Yeah, but he's playing his third position in three years...."


Everyone else on the roster gets hung in effigy at first sign of slump, but the golden boy. Frankly, I'm surprised he hasn't been nominated to replace Ozzie yet.

Craig Grebeck
04-22-2010, 01:11 PM
I'm thinking it's not outlandish to say that Juan Pierre leading off every game but one has hurt this team. Just because he's not the anointed star doesn't mean his poor performance must be excused. He's ****ing garbage out there.

Craig Grebeck
04-22-2010, 01:12 PM
I'm interested to see how long Beckham gets a pass here....

He didn't play one full season and he's already in the WSI HoF.

"Yeah, but he's playing his third position in three years...."


Everyone else on the roster gets hung in effigy at first sign of slump, but the golden boy. Frankly, I'm surprised he hasn't been nominated to replace Ozzie yet.
Perhaps it's because we're talking about fifteen games in a player's first full season. I'm much more comfortable being patient with Beckham and Quentin than with Pierre or Kotsay or even AJ. Don't see how that can be disagreed with.

Jim Shorts
04-22-2010, 01:16 PM
Perhaps it's because we're talking about fifteen games in a player's first full season. I'm much more comfortable being patient with Beckham and Quentin than with Pierre or Kotsay or even AJ. Don't see how that can be disagreed with.


Nah, half my intent was relative to Alexei. The other half was relative to the board over all.

Question for you Craig - Why does Paulie get a pass right now from you while AJ doesn't?

Sure, AJ is slumping worse...he did hit over .300 though last year....

Craig Grebeck
04-22-2010, 01:21 PM
Nah, half my intent was relative to Alexei. The other half was relative to the board over all.

Question for you Craig - Why does Paulie get a pass right now from you while AJ doesn't?

Sure, AJ is slumping worse...he did hit over .300 though last year....
1. Your first sentence doesn't make sense.
2. .245/.356/.592 is one reason why Paulie is getting a "pass."
3. AJ did do that last year, but catchers falling off a cliff isn't a new development in baseball.

harwar
04-22-2010, 01:31 PM
i'm watching the twins game right now and those guys are just WAY too happy .. i'm hoping that somewhere down the road our rolls might be reversed .. i don't happen to think that the White Sox are this bad .. everything is going wrong at once, it seems .. it could turn around .. starting tonight Peavy really needs to go out there and shut those guys down .. PERIOD! .. now lets go ..

g0g0
04-22-2010, 01:32 PM
Unfortunately (or is that fortunately) I haven't been able to watch many games as I'm not able to get them down here much.

Frankfan4life
04-22-2010, 01:47 PM
I was born and raised in Bridgeport.
I have been a fan since I was 8 !!

I just got home from the game ... it was cold ... and everything tonight was PATHETIC... Burhls was not on at all ... the pen was bad ... the offense horrid ... the defense blah ...

but I will continue to support my team ... that is what a real fan does , not a bandwagonner or a partial fan ---

Last night was great ... tonight was not ---

still early in the season --I'm with you. I'm going to the game tonight and I plan on staying to the end no matter what happens. I also stayed all 11 innings on April 8th when the temperature was 38 degrees. Some fans in this thread need to "woman-up."

We'll have little hope of getting and attracting better players if fans stop going to the games. I love baseball and for better or for worse, the Sox are my team. I wish we had a better team to root for but I'm not going to abandon the Sox just because they're not playing well.

g0g0
04-22-2010, 02:04 PM
I wish we had a better team to root for but I'm not going to abandon the Sox just because they're not playing well.

We are only 6 games back of MN. Keep the faith! :smile:

Jim Shorts
04-22-2010, 02:16 PM
1. Your first sentence doesn't make sense.


Alexei's been crucified since the beginning of his second year. He got NO sophomore slump leeway from anyone....

This board jumps all over who isn't producing right now.

Probably still doesn't make sense anywhere but my head.



Also, Paulie's numbers are below his averages. I'm not piling on PK (it would be foolish as he and Jones are the only production we see), just noticing different players get more room to improve than others.


nothing more, nothing less

TheOldRoman
04-22-2010, 02:25 PM
How many were available, where their current team was willing to pay most of the salary, where they are a lock to deliver .300/40?

**** - how many are available period?Do I have to COUNT them for you? They are everywhere. The Indians have five, the Tigers 6, and the Twins have 11. Seriously. There is no excuse for the Sox not having at least half a dozen.

Furthermore, Kenny is an idiot for not turning Jon Link and John Ely into a Pujols or Ryan Howard. It isn't just because we got Pierre, those two had so much value! It is maddening.

masloan
04-22-2010, 03:11 PM
I'm thinking it's not outlandish to say that Juan Pierre leading off every game but one has hurt this team. Just because he's not the anointed star doesn't mean his poor performance must be excused. He's ****ing garbage out there.

If Pierre plays consistently for the rest of the year, there is no reason to think he will not approach his career numbers. I think we can all agree that nobody expected him to outperform his career averages. So it is not about excusing his poor play. Its about not ****ing bitching about it every day. Whether Pierre hits .260 or .280 will not be a make or break factor for the White Sox. However, Quentin hitting .220 with 15 HR vs. .275 with 30 hr will be make or break.

Harry Chappas
04-22-2010, 04:58 PM
I'm thinking it's not outlandish to say that Juan Pierre leading off every game but one has hurt this team. Just because he's not the anointed star doesn't mean his poor performance must be excused. He's ****ing garbage out there.

Huh? Who anointed Juan Pierre a "star"? He is a serviceable, veteran, lead-off hitter. You act as if we emptied the farm and payroll for him when neither is true.

Sufferin
04-23-2010, 11:40 PM
Vented some frustration a few days ago and see the thread has become a bit of a 3 headed monster. Glad to see I hit a bit of a nerve :D:

Let me clear a few things up about me, since some assumptions and judgments appear to have been made about me:

My da' grew up in Bridgeport. My grandfather delivered ice to Comiskey and used to come home with gloves, bats, etc. he claimed were given to him (we have our doubts on that)/

My earliest memories are of listening to games featuring Ken Henderson, Carlos May, Dick Allen, Ralph Garr and later my first favorite player Brian Downing-at catcher.

So yeah I've followed this team through some lean times (otherwise known as the 70s).

My point was simply that it is difficult to watch a team that doesn't know fundamentals while the jackass announcer prattles on without acknowledging the mistakes. It's also hard to read about them when every other article is about the manager and his latest biatch session.

As for "unreasonable expectations", what's wrong with expecting our team to compete for a division title each year or if that's not the case, really going with youth, and not retread veterans? Should we be happy with years of 3rd or 4th place? Some of you sound like Cub fans (sorry that was uncalled for).

palehozenychicty
04-24-2010, 07:47 AM
Vented some frustration a few days ago and see the thread has become a bit of a 3 headed monster. Glad to see I hit a bit of a nerve :D:

Let me clear a few things up about me, since some assumptions and judgments appear to have been made about me:

My da' grew up in Bridgeport. My grandfather delivered ice to Comiskey and used to come home with gloves, bats, etc. he claimed were given to him (we have our doubts on that)/

My earliest memories are of listening to games featuring Ken Henderson, Carlos May, Dick Allen, Ralph Garr and later my first favorite player Brian Downing-at catcher.

So yeah I've followed this team through some lean times (otherwise known as the 70s).

My point was simply that it is difficult to watch a team that doesn't know fundamentals while the jackass announcer prattles on without acknowledging the mistakes. It's also hard to read about them when every other article is about the manager and his latest biatch session.

As for "unreasonable expectations", what's wrong with expecting our team to compete for a division title each year or if that's not the case, really going with youth, and not retread veterans? Should we be happy with years of 3rd or 4th place? Some of you sound like Cub fans (sorry that was uncalled for).


Indeed. This is the underlying issue in all of this. It's unclear if this lineup has the dynamics to win consistently. We have a solid staff, but even Peavy is unknown since it's a new league with new batters, pitching situations, etc. I think so far they overestimated the starters' impact. The offense really has nobody in the lineup who worries the opposition. Q and Alexei are still unreliable. We'll see, but I think we are missing key position talent.

WhiteSoxFTW
04-24-2010, 10:21 AM
Indeed. This is the underlying issue in all of this. It's unclear if this lineup has the dynamics to win consistently. We have a solid staff, but even Peavy is unknown since it's a new league with new batters, pitching situations, etc. I think so far they overestimated the starters' impact. The offense really has nobody in the lineup who worries the opposition. Q and Alexei are still unreliable. We'll see, but I think we are missing key position talent.

If the offense is stale all season, KW is going to take some major flak for focusing too much on pitching and defense and not enough on offense. (I kind of laughed when I typed defense. I don't think we've really upgraded enough in that regard for that to count.)