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View Full Version : *Official* 'Swift Kick In The Astrubal' White Sox vs. CLE 4/17 Postgame Thread


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soxinem1
04-17-2010, 06:34 PM
Can we ever hold a lead?? ***???:angry::angry::angry:

On National TV to boot.........

thomas35forever
04-17-2010, 06:34 PM
This team sucks. That is all.:whiner:

KnightSox
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
What a waste.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
:fireozzie

Hartman
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
Changes need to be made to the coaching staff.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
**** this team. Seriously. More half-assed offense against a **** pitcher, Ozzie refuses to pull Peavy in the 8th, and he promptly gives up the lead. Only THEN does he go to Thornton, who promptly makes Ozzie's **** up irrelevant by giving Cleveland the lead anyway.

I'm sick of this bull****.

F4L
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
**** Cleveland. **** Ozzie. **** this team.

Crede24Thome25
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
I want ozzie's ****ing head on a platter, IDK what anyone says he blew the game for us.

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:35 PM
Do any of you honestly believe Ozzie is a good in-game manager?

Hartman
04-17-2010, 06:36 PM
In for Ozzie rant about us plebs who talk **** about his terrible game decisions.

JermaineDye05
04-17-2010, 06:36 PM
Peavy did his job and the offense did just enough to be able to win this game.

Ozzie made a horrible decision.

KMcMahon817
04-17-2010, 06:36 PM
Ugh. 4-8 is not good.:(:

HangWiffum
04-17-2010, 06:36 PM
:fireozzie

I can't wait to hear his asinine reason for leaving Peavy out there.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 06:36 PM
It's going to be a long season.

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 06:36 PM
3 runs against the vaunted Indian pitching staff this series.

Players keep letting you down, Walk. If only they'd buy into your system.

CHISOXFAN13
04-17-2010, 06:37 PM
Not a fan of Ozzie, but Thornton wasn't exactly stellar when he came into the game. They hit him hard, so let's no assume we hold that lead anyway,

**** all around.

CHISOXFAN13
04-17-2010, 06:37 PM
The only solace I have in all of this, is that the St. Louis Cardinals are my second favorite team. Glad they don't blow chunks like this team does.

Who gives a ****?

Rdy2PlayBall
04-17-2010, 06:38 PM
Do any of you honestly believe Ozzie is a good in-game manager?I don't honestly think any of those people would come out of their hole to say it... He kind of blew the game.

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:38 PM
I hate this team. First off...I'm so mad I don't know where to start. Peavy shouldn't have been out there for the ****ing eighth. Thornton didn't get the job done and finally, Quentin is just not the same guy we saw in 2008. He is not going to get it done.

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:38 PM
Who gives a ****?

I do. Wish the White Sox didn't suck.

tstrike2000
04-17-2010, 06:38 PM
Just saw the highlights, glad I missed this game.

doublem23
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
The only solace I have in all of this, is that the St. Louis Cardinals are my second favorite team. Glad they don't blow chunks like this team does.

**** the Cardinals.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
KW has quite the list of chores right now...

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
I hate this team. First off...I'm so mad I don't know where to start. Peavy shouldn't have been out there for the ****ing eighth. Thornton didn't get the job done and finally, Quentin is just not the same guy we saw in 2008. He is not going to get it done.


Carlos may never get back to where he was.

soxfan21
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
I'm really getting tired of this ****. We better get on track soon, or it will be a very long season. Someone has to step up on this team and tell everyone else to get their **** together.

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
We did get Beckham because of the 2007 season. So maybe we can get another great hitter that Walk can mesmerize at the draft next year.

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
Honestly, I had nothing against Guillen leaving Peavy in. It's not like the pen has been holding seventh and eighth inning leads.

But watching the lefty-lefty thing fail, again, well, what can you say.

Right now I'm suprised Guillen didn't bring Randy Williams in to start the inning.

Rikirk
04-17-2010, 06:39 PM
It seems like, more or less, that the other team always pulls out one or two runs to go ahead of us in late innings...
and quite frankly.... im getting sick of it.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 06:40 PM
The only solace I have in all of this, is that the St. Louis Cardinals are my second favorite team. Glad they don't blow chunks like this team does.

http://9001chan.org/b/29/cool_story_bro.jpg

Crede24Thome25
04-17-2010, 06:40 PM
where can we pissed off fans check out postgame live I want to see what this dumb **** has to say for himself.:angry:

thomas35forever
04-17-2010, 06:40 PM
:fireozzie

I'm not advocating that, but my confidence in him is sure shaken after today's piss-poor decision. I hope the fans aren't the only people who know this team is seriously flawed and changes have to be made in order to get back in contention.

Noneck
04-17-2010, 06:40 PM
At least Peavy did look better.

Rdy2PlayBall
04-17-2010, 06:41 PM
I hate this team. First off...I'm so mad I don't know where to start. Peavy shouldn't have been out there for the ****ing eighth. Thornton didn't get the job done and finally, Quentin is just not the same guy we saw in 2008. He is not going to get it done.All he does is swing for the fences and swear on live TV. At least in 2008 he would swing for good contact (resulting in HRs, doubles, and good average).

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:41 PM
http://9001chan.org/b/29/cool_story_bro.jpg


Don't have to jump down my throat over one post. Plenty of posters here have second favorite teams. Just trying to make myself feel better, even though it isn't working much.

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 06:41 PM
Changes need to be made to the coaching staff.

Changes need to be made to the on-field personnel.

F4L
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
The scariest part about all of this...this is the team we are SUPPOSED TO BEAT. What happens when we got to Detroit, or to Minnesota, or travel over and face the rest of the East.

We're ****ed right now. Royally ****ed.

doublem23
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
Don't have to jump down my throat over one post. Plenty of posters hare have second favorite teams. Just trying to make myself feel better, even though it isn't working much.

None of us give a **** about the Cardinals on the Clubhouse forum, especially in the Sox post-game thread.

october23sp
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
This team could lose 100 games.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
Don't have to jump down my throat over one post. Plenty of posters hare have second favorite teams. Just trying to make myself feel better, even though it isn't working much.

1) Check the URL of the site you're on.

2) Check what thread you're posting in.

3) Nobody gives a **** if you like the Cards.

MarySwiss
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
I'm actually glad--based on this thread--that I wasn't able to see this game.

JermaineDye05
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
Honestly, I had nothing against Guillen leaving Peavy in. It's not like the pen has been holding seventh and eighth inning leads.

But watching the lefty-lefty thing fail, again, well, what can you say.

Right now I'm suprised Guillen didn't bring Randy Williams in to start the inning.

The bullpen was leading the AL in ERA and had about a 20 scoreless inning streak. Our guys struck out 9 in Toronto through 3 innings during the Freddy game.

Crede24Thome25
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
Honestly, I had nothing against Guillen leaving Peavy in. It's not like the pen has been holding seventh and eighth inning leads.

But watching the lefty-lefty thing fail, again, well, what can you say.

Right now I'm suprised Guillen didn't bring Randy Williams in to start the inning.

are you under the influence or something,Ozzie saw peavy struggling to get out of the 7th that should have been enough, if we want to keep the lead williams will come no where near the mound in a game like todays

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
:fireozzie

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 06:42 PM
Don't have to jump down my throat over one post. Plenty of posters hare have second favorite teams. Just trying to make myself feel better, even though it isn't working much.

And when folks want to talk about their second favorite teams, Talking Baseball is usually where it takes place.

I don't give a **** about the Cardinals.

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:43 PM
Honestly, I had nothing against Guillen leaving Peavy in. It's not like the pen has been holding seventh and eighth inning leads.

But watching the lefty-lefty thing fail, again, well, what can you say.

Right now I'm suprised Guillen didn't bring Randy Williams in to start the inning.

What? The bullpen has been fantastic this year! I'm a big fan of Ozzie, but even I was perplexed by that move.

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:43 PM
1) Check the URL of the site you're on.

2) Check what thread you're posting in.

3) Nobody gives a **** if you like the Cards.


You obviously gave a **** if you chose to respond. Move along now.:rolleyes:

russ99
04-17-2010, 06:44 PM
Don't have to jump down my throat over one post. Plenty of posters here have second favorite teams. Just trying to make myself feel better, even though it isn't working much.

Understand, but the wild, angry venting post-game thread may not be the best place to do that...

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:44 PM
Changes need to be made to the on-field personnel.

No shortage of changes to be made!

sox1970
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
Hey, we've only scored 3 or less runs in 8 out of 12 games. That ain't bad. :redneck

Seriously, it's over. The Twins are going to win 92-95 games, and the Sox won't.

Tragg
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
This is ridiculous.

russ99
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
What? The bullpen has been fantastic this year! I'm a big fan of Ozzie, but even I was perplexed by that move.

Ditto.

But we're going to get that a lot if we expect 2 runs and 4 hits is enough to win a game in the AL.

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
Understand, but the wild, angry venting post-game thread may not be the best place to do that...


Fair enough. I deleted my post.

JB98
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
The pitching matchups in the first two games of this series:

Mark Buehrle vs. Mitch Talbot
Jake Peavy vs. Jake Westbrook

So, the Sox threw their two aces. The Indians threw their fifth starter who had never won a game before in the bigs, and a rag arm coming off elbow surgery who basically hasn't pitched in two years.

Naturally, the Indians won both. Four straight losses to Cleveland, which is rebuilding by its own admission. 2-6 record against division foes.

:anon:

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
Who to keep is the shorter list.

EDIT: I take that back. I'll keep our pitching staff.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 06:45 PM
Pretty ****ing lame. Peavy was good enough to have won this.

I don't know what the solution is. Would some home cooking help? I hope so. This has gotten very old.

Marqhead
04-17-2010, 06:46 PM
Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I've seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked.

HangWiffum
04-17-2010, 06:46 PM
can't wait to hear rongey try to defend ozzie on the post game show. this is gonna be another classic. that guy has his lips permanently attached to ozzie's rear.

Crede24Thome25
04-17-2010, 06:47 PM
Pretty ****ing lame. Peavy was good enough to have won this.

I don't know what the solution is. Would some home cooking help? I hope so. This has gotten very old.
Nope someone needs to light a match under these guys, firing ozzie would do the trick, the joey cora era begins now:D:

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:47 PM
can't wait to hear rongey try to defend ozzie on the post game show. This is gonna be another classic. That guy has his lips permanently attached to ozzie's rear.


qft.

JermaineDye05
04-17-2010, 06:47 PM
can't wait to hear rongey try to defend ozzie on the post game show. this is gonna be another classic. that guy has his lips permanently attached to ozzie's rear.

I think even Rongey would scratch his head on that move. I, too, am an avid Ozzie supporter. Looking around the thread you'll see many Ozzie defenders scratching their heads after that 8th inning.

Hartman
04-17-2010, 06:47 PM
Brian Anderson is going to have a field day when we play the Royals.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 06:48 PM
A+ postgame thread title, by the way. If it wasn't so chilly out, I might have been pissed that I sat inside to watch this.

Rdy2PlayBall
04-17-2010, 06:49 PM
Brian Anderson is going to have a field day when we play the Royals.When did he get brought up?

russ99
04-17-2010, 06:50 PM
when did he get brought up?

lol :D:

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:51 PM
I think even Rongey would scratch his head on that move. I, too, am an avid Ozzie supporter. Looking around the thread you'll see many Ozzie defenders scratching their heads after that 8th inning.

Rongey just said that Cabrera was hitting .194 against righties...ok...I still don't get why Peavy was in there. He was running out of gas. If you want him to face a righty, bring in Putz or Santos!

JermaineDye05
04-17-2010, 06:52 PM
Rongey just said that Cabrera was hitting .194 against righties...ok...I still don't get why Peavy was in there. He was running out of gas. If you want him to face a righty, bring in Putz or Santos!

Yeah, I mean, even following on gameday, I could tell he was running out of gas. He had walked back-to-back guys in the 7th inning, his location just wasn't what it had been. Throwing a pitcher back out there who's struggling with his location is asking for trouble.

Danielgosox38
04-17-2010, 06:53 PM
Jake pitched well enough to win today, he was just left in too long. Not faulting the pen either, because they have been amazing.

JB98
04-17-2010, 06:53 PM
We can argue about the management of the pitching staff all we want.

The Sox scored two runs today. That makes eight out of 12 games with three runs scored or fewer.

The offense sucks. The offense is losing games, and will continue to lose games.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 06:54 PM
Yeah, I mean, even following on gameday, I could tell he was running out of gas. He had walked back-to-back guys in the 7th inning, his location just wasn't what it had been. Throwing a pitcher back out there who's struggling with his location is asking for trouble.

I was surprised when I saw Peavy out there that inning. I assumed he was done and Thornton was coming in. I'm not sure what the rationale was for that choice...does anyone have any guesses? Honest question.

Great day of sports....for Cleveland fans.


Today's game was on the offense, IMO.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 06:54 PM
Today was certainly my breaking point. I no longer care if Ozzie manages this team anymore. There was zero reason, other than ego (be it Peavy's or Ozzie's), to keep Peavy in the game. He did his job, you let the bullpen do its job. I guess that's too hard to comprehend.

Viva Medias B's
04-17-2010, 06:54 PM
It's a good thing I'm at work and did not see what the hell happened here. The game has only been over about a half hour, and there are already five pages of posts.

I do not know what Ozzie did or did not do, but keep in mind that every manager in the major leagues will win his team ten games and lose his team ten games with his decisions. Perhaps this is one of the ten Ozzie lost for us. Having said that, I am getting very increasingly tired of his attitude and his antics. A continued poor start by the team he manages will have a direct influence upon me as far as jumping on the "FIRE OZZIE!" bandwagon is concerned.

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 06:54 PM
The bullpen was leading the AL in ERA and had about a 20 scoreless inning streak. Our guys struck out 9 in Toronto through 3 innings during the Freddy game.

And how many leads have been blown in the seventh and eighth inning so far?:scratch:

And how many ties have been broken??

HangWiffum
04-17-2010, 06:55 PM
Yeah, I mean, even following on gameday, I could tell he was running out of gas. He had walked back-to-back guys in the 7th inning, his location just wasn't what it had been. Throwing a pitcher back out there who's struggling with his location is asking for trouble.

"you know nothing! you sell hot dogs and hamburgers and waste your time on sports radio and sports websites while i'm someone who should NEVER EVER be questioned for my moves!!!"

-ozzie guillen

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 06:55 PM
Today was certainly my breaking point. I no longer care if Ozzie manages this team anymore. There was zero reason, other than ego (be it Peavy's or Ozzie's), to keep Peavy in the game. He did his job, you let the bullpen do its job. I guess that's too hard to comprehend.

I feel the same way. I love Ozzie, but this is rock bottom.

tick53
04-17-2010, 06:55 PM
Peavy should have never returned to the game after a good outing

SHAKE UP THIS ORGANIZATION KENNY.

This sucks. Last place :angry:

cheezheadsoxfan
04-17-2010, 06:55 PM
We can argue about the management of the pitching staff all we want.

The Sox scored two runs today. That makes eight out of 12 games with three runs scored or fewer.

The offense sucks. The offense is losing games, and will continue to lose games.

Exactly.

cws05champ
04-17-2010, 06:55 PM
Nope someone needs to light a match under these guys, firing ozzie would do the trick, the joey cora era begins now:D:
I have never been one to over react by saying fire ozzie, but this loss just feels worse...and likely could have been prevented. Ozzie just doesn't seem to learn. Has he even looked at tape of Peavy over the last few years to see when he is tiring and when to pull the plug? I'm not ready to fire Ozzie, but a few more like this and he should hit the streets by the end of May.

You have a rookie LH hitter late in the game leading off the inning....if Randy Williams can't get that guy out he shouldn't be on the team. Then you have Santos, Putz, Pena Jenks and Thornton to match up if you want.

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:56 PM
We can argue about the management of the pitching staff all we want.

The Sox scored two runs today. That makes eight out of 12 games with three runs scored or fewer.

The offense sucks. The offense is losing games, and will continue to lose games.

This is certainly true, but we just needed six outs to get a win...so, that's why this is so glaring. But the lack of the offense has been a story ALL season. This really is the first loss I blame on Ozzie (though this is "Ozzie's team" so he should get some blame for a losing season...a lot in fact).

Dibbs
04-17-2010, 06:56 PM
Where is all the smarmy attitudes of the Ozzie defenders now?

I had to step out after the 7th inning. Now that I have seen they lost AND Peavy went into the 8th...I am at a complete loss for words. Ozzie needs to go. Bad managing combined with tireless off field antics has me exhausted.

BringHomeDaBacon
04-17-2010, 06:56 PM
We can argue about the management of the pitching staff all we want.

The Sox scored two runs today. That makes eight out of 12 games with three runs scored or fewer.

The offense sucks. The offense is losing games, and will continue to lose games.

Yes

Why use Thornton last night down 6-2?

Slappy
04-17-2010, 06:56 PM
Jake ****ing Westbrook? That guy shouldn't be an ace on a collegiate team. What is wrong with our freaking offense? Guys look completely confused up there.

JermaineDye05
04-17-2010, 06:57 PM
I was surprised when I saw Peavy out there that inning. I assumed he was done and Thornton was coming in. I'm not sure what the rationale was for that choice...does anyone have any guesses? Honest question.

Great day of sports....for Cleveland fans.


Today's game was on the offense, IMO.

Ozzie picked rock and Jake picked paper.

Paulwny
04-17-2010, 06:57 PM
This is ridiculous.

Why ?, many, and I believe also you saw a bad offense before the season started and here it is.

tstrike2000
04-17-2010, 06:58 PM
The pitching matchups in the first two games of this series:

Mark Buehrle vs. Mitch Talbot
Jake Peavy vs. Jake Westbrook

So, the Sox threw their two aces. The Indians threw their fifth starter who had never won a game before in the bigs, and a rag arm coming off elbow surgery who basically hasn't pitched in two years.

Naturally, the Indians won both. Four straight losses to Cleveland, which is rebuilding by its own admission. 2-6 record against division foes.

:anon:

Who knows where it will go from here. In stretches like this, it sometimes amazes me how the Sox can go from a good team to looking like a bunch of has been's and never will be's.

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 06:58 PM
Rongey just said that Cabrera was hitting .194 against righties...ok...I still don't get why Peavy was in there. He was running out of gas. If you want him to face a righty, bring in Putz or Santos!

Maybe this year, I looked and he was hitting .318 against RHP from 2007-2009.

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:59 PM
Ozzie picked rock and Jake picked paper.

How does paper beat rock?

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 06:59 PM
Maybe this year, I looked and he was hitting .318 against RHP from 2007-2009.

I assume it was for this year, yea.

Rikirk
04-17-2010, 07:00 PM
They say good pitching beats good hitting,...with regards to our team, im not seeing it.

sox1970
04-17-2010, 07:00 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 07:00 PM
Ozzie picked rock and Jake picked paper.

Jake picked paper and Cabrera picked scissors.

Scissors shredded paper.

WhiteSox5187
04-17-2010, 07:00 PM
Who knows where it will go from here. In stretches like this, it sometimes amazes me how the Sox can go from a good team to looking like a bunch of has been's and never will be's.

There has been one game where the Sox have looked good at that was opening day. Every other win has been iffy at best.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 07:01 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.

I saw this too. :rolleyes:

For those who can't view Twitter:

OzzieGuillen (http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen)
Thanks god the bears not playing the browns they might get they're but kick to

Crede24Thome25
04-17-2010, 07:01 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.
I really just got even more pissed

mcsoxfan
04-17-2010, 07:02 PM
The Sox have gone from losing 13-11 to losing 3-2. With the type of pitching the Sox have, we should talking first place finishes and world series appearences. On a team owned by a business man and not a sportsman, you are talking the most 1 run losses in history. And if you think a Reinsdorf-run management can't do worse, wait until the summer and the Bulls end up with third tiered players in the great free agent pursuit.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:02 PM
How does paper beat rock?

You don't win many Rock-Paper-Scissors tournaments, do you? :P

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 07:02 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.

Especially when you spell butt wrong.

He should spend more time twitting hitters to trade for, not talking about a sport that won't even play for over five months.

doublem23
04-17-2010, 07:03 PM
How does paper beat rock?

Good old rock, nothing beats rock.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 07:03 PM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l0wfiuPTGy1qzq9m4o1_500.jpg

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 07:04 PM
Good old rock, nothing beats rock.

I needed that. Thank you.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:04 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.

Bad managing combined with tireless off field antics

Dude needs to get the axe ASAP. No business managing this team anymore. That world series ring has created a monster.

BringHomeDaBacon
04-17-2010, 07:05 PM
I saw this too. :rolleyes:

For those who can't view Twitter:

OzzieGuillen (http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen)
Thanks god the bears not playing the browns they might get they're but kick to

barely literate

JermaineDye05
04-17-2010, 07:05 PM
http://ftwzone.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/tobias.jpg

"Well, I don't want to blame it all on 9/11, but it certainly didn't help."

Rikirk
04-17-2010, 07:05 PM
Well...theres always the Blackhawks,....wait.....they lost yesterday too...hmmm.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:05 PM
I needed that. Thank you.

Ditto. My face is probably as red as a tomato right now.

BainesHOF
04-17-2010, 07:06 PM
Ozzie just doesn't seem to learn. Has he even looked at tape of Peavy over the last few years to see when he is tiring and when to pull the plug?

There's no way Ozzie would ever do such research.

russ99
04-17-2010, 07:07 PM
Dude needs to get the axe ASAP. No business managing this team anymore. That world series ring has created a monster.

Again, do you want a manager to be quiet and do everything by the book? That's Jerry Manuel...

Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us. And if you can't take Ozzie's personality which has been the same since day one, find some other team to cheer for, like those warm and fuzzy guys up north who spout the same boring cliches every day.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 07:07 PM
Well...theres always the Blackhawks,....wait.....they lost yesterday too...hmmm.

:rolleyes:

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:08 PM
There's no way Ozzie would ever do such research.

I would say getting bailed out of a two walk inning with a caught stealing is enough of an indicator to not require research.

Tragg
04-17-2010, 07:09 PM
firing ozzie would do the trick, the joey cora era begins now:D:

And therein lies the problem....fire Ozzie only to have his chief yes-man take over.

What did Ozzie do wrong today?

SoxFan89
04-17-2010, 07:09 PM
Again, do you want a manager to be quiet and do everything by the book? That's Jerry Manuel...

Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us. And if you can't take Ozzie's personality which has been the same since day one, find some other team to cheer for, like those warm and fuzzy guys up north.

That argument is such pathetic garbage.

Ozzie's attitude is, "if you don't like it, **** you." Are you telling me we should put up with that? And if we don't like it, root for the Cubs? Thats bull****.

BainesHOF
04-17-2010, 07:10 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.

Seven grammatical errors in his Tweet, four if you allow for the typical use of lowercase letters.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:10 PM
Again, do you want a manager to be quiet and do everything by the book? That's Jerry Manuel...

Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us. And if you can't take Ozzie's personality which has been the same since day one, find some other team to cheer for, like those warm and fuzzy guys up north who spout the same boring cliches every day.

If "by the book", you mean "pulls his starter with a one run lead in the 8th when he's struggling", then HELL YES.

This game should have been a win. No excuses.

sox1970
04-17-2010, 07:11 PM
Again, do you want a manager to be quiet and do everything by the book? That's Jerry Manuel...

Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us. And if you can't take Ozzie's personality which has been the same since day one, find some other team to cheer for, like those warm and fuzzy guys up north who spout the same boring cliches every day.

:o:

So it's one or the other? Jerry Manuel or Ozzie Guillen.

Yeah, that makes sense.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 07:11 PM
Seven grammatical errors in his Tweet, four if you allow for the typical use of lowercase letters.

Must be a record for a sentence less than 140 characters. Yikes.

Anyway, from his postgame comments, it seems that Ozzie's plan was to have Peavy face Cabrera, then have Thornton face Sizemore.

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 07:11 PM
Love the thread title.

Also, the only thing worse than the Sox offense and Ozzie's "managing" were those hats Cleveland was wearing; what the hell were those?

JB98
04-17-2010, 07:12 PM
That argument is such pathetic garbage.

Ozzie's attitude is, "if you don't like it, **** you." Are you telling me we should put up with that? And if we don't like it, root for the Cubs? Thats bull****.

It is bull****, but here's the thing: Ozzie might have wanted this team, but Kenny let him have it.

Kenny is Ozzie's boss. Not the other way around.

Kenny Williams created this mess. He'll have to fix it.

russ99
04-17-2010, 07:12 PM
That argument is such pathetic garbage.

Ozzie's attitude is, "if you don't like it, **** you." Are you telling me we should put up with that? And if we don't like it, root for the Cubs? Thats bull****.

Yep. That's exactly what I'm saying.

Some of you can't look at the big picture because you've convinced yourselves that Ozzie's some kind of lazy, obnoxious idiot.

F4L
04-17-2010, 07:12 PM
And therein lies the problem....fire Ozzie only to have his chief yes-man take over.

What did Ozzie do wrong today?

Is that a serious question? Prepare to get flamed.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:13 PM
Yep. That's exactly what I'm saying.

Some of you can't look at the big picture because you've convinced yourselves that Ozzie's some kind of lazy, obnoxious idiot.

I don't know about lazy...

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:13 PM
Again, do you want a manager to be quiet and do everything by the book? That's Jerry Manuel...

Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us. And if you can't take Ozzie's personality which has been the same since day one, find some other team to cheer for, like those warm and fuzzy guys up north who spout the same boring cliche's every day.

You mean the Yankees?

I might order a Jeter jersey today after watching that game.

F4L
04-17-2010, 07:13 PM
Must be a record for a sentence less than 140 characters. Yikes.

Anyway, from his postgame comments, it seems that Ozzie's plan was to have Peavy face Cabrera, then have Thornton face Sizemore.

That plan worked out real well.

****.

Tragg
04-17-2010, 07:14 PM
Is that a serious question? Prepare to get flamed.
Yes, it's serious.
I just saw the score of the game.
What did he do?

hi im skot
04-17-2010, 07:15 PM
You mean the Yankees?

I might order a Jeter jersey today after watching that game.

DO IT!

:thumbsup:

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:15 PM
Yes, it's serious.
I just saw the score of the game.
What did he do?

He left Peavy in for the 8th after giving up two walks in the 7th, and Peavy promptly gave up the tying HR.

SoxFan89
04-17-2010, 07:16 PM
Yep. That's exactly what I'm saying.

Some of you can't look at the big picture because you've convinced yourselves that Ozzie's some kind of lazy, obnoxious idiot.

The big picture = this team is bleeding out faster than you can say "I love Ozzie Guillen"

Lip Man 1
04-17-2010, 07:16 PM
Not much to say. One fan said it best earlier in this thread, "it's going to be a long season..."

Terrible offense again, 4th game this season where they took a lead into the 7th inning or later and lost.

My attitude is turning into like some others have said, **** 'em, they're not going to ruin my summer.

Lip

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:17 PM
I love how even the announcers made an observation that Peavy was continually getting louder with his grunting during release as the innings wore on.

F4L
04-17-2010, 07:17 PM
Yes, it's serious.
I just saw the score of the game.
What did he do?

He let Peavy start the 8th with 104 pitches logged already, with 4 lefties coming to the plate for the Tribe. Not to mention Peavy had trouble finding his location in the 7th handing out back-to-back walks before getting out of the jam. Of course, Cabrera hits a 1 out HR, Ozzie pulls Peavy, Thornton blows the game.

So yes, Ozzie is at blame.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 07:17 PM
Gonzales just wrote that the last time we began 4-8 was 2001.

It's Dankerific
04-17-2010, 07:21 PM
My biggest surprise is that people are surprised. (by this team, by Ozzie.)

Tragg
04-17-2010, 07:22 PM
So yes, Ozzie is at blame.

it's odd...he usually doesn't leave pitchers in that long and he loves his left-righty stuff. Picked a great time to abandon both.

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 07:23 PM
it's odd...he usually doesn't leave pitchers in that long and he loves his left-righty stuff. Picked a great time to abandon both.

It was a switch hitter so not totally applicable.

hawkjt
04-17-2010, 07:24 PM
I was shocked when Peavy came out in the 8th...I thought we were going to try to baby him a bit this year? And against 4 leftys? Makes no sense,Ozzie. I am a Ozzie supporter,but this one was hard to understand.

Of course thornton then gives it up anyway. If he had brought out thornton to open the 8th and thornton gets hammered,Ozzie is off the hook and we are screaming at an inept offense. Bottom line...this offense is the worst in baseball,so all the pitching in the world will not matter if this keeps up...ouch.:redface:

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:24 PM
It was a switch hitter so not totally applicable.

Peavy was running on fumes. Anyone not named Randy Williams was preferable in that situation.

white sox bill
04-17-2010, 07:24 PM
12 games into a 162 game season, no need to panic. As with some earlier Sox teams, maybe just maybe this will be a warm weather hitting team.

So no dark clouds on my horizon...yet

DickAllen72
04-17-2010, 07:25 PM
Another boring loss by a boring team.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:27 PM
12 games into a 162 game season, no need to panic. As with some earlier Sox teams, maybe just maybe this will be a warm weather hitting team.

So no dark clouds on my horizon...yet

It's not normally my M.O., but a .333 record, dead last in the division and five games back after 12 games is pretty hard to smile through.

Baltimore, the Mets, and the Astros are the only teams with a worse record.

JB98
04-17-2010, 07:29 PM
It's not normally my M.O., but a .333 record, dead last in the division and five games back after 12 games is pretty hard to smile through.

I guess the key thing is trying to determine whether this is a good team in a slump, or if it's a bad team doing what bad teams do.

Based on last year, I tend to believe it's the latter. I'm not optimistic.

F4L
04-17-2010, 07:31 PM
12 games into a 162 game season, no need to panic. As with some earlier Sox teams, maybe just maybe this will be a warm weather hitting team.

So no dark clouds on my horizon...yet

These excuses have to stop. 12 games or not, they are in the book, and 8 of them have been losses. Are we going to continue making excuses when we're 30 games in? Or 50? How about 81 in? No. The **** needs to stop, and it needs to stop right now. Are Twins fans making excuses right now?

Bottom line is win, or die trying. We're not doing either right now.

Lip Man 1
04-17-2010, 07:32 PM
Bill:

I hope your right but this team hit better in the warmewr weather in 2007 and 2009 and still had a losing season.

I just don't see any reason right now, like JB said, any indications that things are going to change.

Lip

Rikirk
04-17-2010, 07:33 PM
Were worse than the Mets and Astros?...

...nice...real nice.

doublem23
04-17-2010, 07:33 PM
You mean the Yankees?

I might order a Jeter jersey today after watching that game.

What loyalty!

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:33 PM
It's not normally my M.O., but a .333 record, dead last in the division and five games back after 12 games is pretty hard to smile through.

Baltimore, the Mets, and the Astros are the only teams with a worse record.

How bout those Pirates?

white sox bill
04-17-2010, 07:36 PM
I just had a hunch this team would be slow out of the gate. This sucks without doubt. But no need to climb the John Hancock Center just yet.

Maybe Ozzie can tear a page out of Jerry's book, tinker and find a line up that can score.

If not, gonna be a long long Summer.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 07:36 PM
You mean the Yankees?

I might order a Jeter jersey today after watching that game.

Implied teal? :?: Jeez.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 07:38 PM
Ozzie explains his decision. (http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/04/ozzie_explains_his_decision_in.html)

sox1970
04-17-2010, 07:39 PM
Ozzie, go to Miami and enjoy your boat. Leave.

twinslayer
04-17-2010, 07:39 PM
This game was god awful. Please give me a win tomorrow or I'm gonna be pissed.

BainesHOF
04-17-2010, 07:40 PM
The biggest cause of our embarrassing 4-8 start is obviously the offense, but Ozzie has contributed greatly to that record. A good manager would be minimizing the damage, but Ozzie is increasing it.

Ozzie has never been good with pitching and today was another prime example. I could maybe understand sending Peavy back out in the eighth if he was on a roll in the middle of the season, but no way with him struggling so far this year. His pitch count was more than high enough for the third week of April. I don't think there's any justification for Ozzie leaving him in. We had plenty of righties in the bullpen to use before bringing in Thornton. Maybe Ozzie was afraid of Peavy.

I'm written about this a couple times lately so I'll keep this point short. Only an idiot would not have Andruw Jones in the lineup everyday on this weak-hitting team.

Instead of questioning the fans' intelligence, Ozzie needs to look in the mirror and ask himself why so many of his teams have been so unprepared to start the season.

Changes need to be made quickly if we hope to turn things around and make this a good season. Pierre, Beckham and Quentin are not getting it done at the top of the order. At least give Beckham a mental break and move him down in the order. I don't know what you do with Pierre. He looks overmatched in the American League. At this point, I'd rather have Kotsay bat than Pierre. Quentin is swinging every bit as ridiculously as Alexei Ramirez. This is extremely disappointing. It looks like Quentin hasn't learned anything over the years. If anything, he's regressed. I'm not sure why you keep sending Quentin and Ramirez out there day after day when they do not adjust their approach whatsoever, especially when their offense is supposed to be the strength of their game. At this point, I'm not sure you even blame Quentin and Ramirez anymore. They are what they are. I blame the people who continue to play them hoping that they're somehow going to change.

The pitching staff was ready to start the season. Kudos to Don Cooper. Why are the hitters so woefully unprepared?

Our defense remains a liability. We've failed to turn far too many double plays already. We have to live with Beckham's growing pains because second is his position and he's eventually going to be a good defensive player. Ramirez is a circus at shortstop, making some great plays while regularly botching routine ones. You need a steady defender at short. Ramirez is clearly not that.

Changes need to be made now. Things aren't going to magically get better on their own.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:41 PM
Implied teal? :?: Jeez.

I'm done. Goodbye second city, hello first! :)

Dirty30
04-17-2010, 07:42 PM
**** you Ozzie!

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:42 PM
Ozzie explains his decision. (http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/04/ozzie_explains_his_decision_in.html)

That's bull****. Peavy was not throwing the ball well! He would have had two on with one out in the 7th if Valbuena didn't get caught stealing. If you're so worried about LaPorta coming up, you put in Putz, not keep Peavy in.

A. Cavatica
04-17-2010, 07:43 PM
Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us.

Bull****.

With the talent he's had, in the weak division he's been in, he's had it pretty easy. I can only remember a few games in his career where he outmanaged the other guy and won a game for us.

white sox bill
04-17-2010, 07:44 PM
Ozzie explains his decision. (http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/04/ozzie_explains_his_decision_in.html)

OMG the Fat Guy....the Cleveland media will love that one

Craig Grebeck
04-17-2010, 07:46 PM
Again, do you want a manager to be quiet and do everything by the book? That's Jerry Manuel...

Bottom line, Ozzie's won us more games than he's lost us. And if you can't take Ozzie's personality which has been the same since day one, find some other team to cheer for, like those warm and fuzzy guys up north who spout the same boring cliches every day.
Yes, Ozzie never speaks in cliches. :?:

Bottom line, if you think Ozzie is bigger than this organization (like the man himself), your perspective needs to change.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:46 PM
Remember what Oney said? "The Guillen family has it's own way of getting even?" (or something like that)

Guys, is Ozzie purposefully sabotaging the team for the first couple weeks to get back at the organization for putting a halt to the Guillen family's plans for a website, thus costing them thousands of dollars?

Once Ozzie is satisfied with his revenge, things will be back to normal.

A. Cavatica
04-17-2010, 07:46 PM
I guess the key thing is trying to determine whether this is a good team in a slump, or if it's a bad team doing what bad teams do.

Based on last year, I tend to believe it's the latter. I'm not optimistic.

This team had some big changes since last year. And in spring training, they looked just as bad as they do now.

The offense blows unusually large chunks. And they still haven't filled the hole at Manager.

JB98
04-17-2010, 07:47 PM
The biggest cause of our embarrassing 4-8 start is obviously the offense, but Ozzie has contributed greatly to that record. A good manager would be minimizing the damage, but Ozzie is increasing it.

Ozzie has never been good with pitching and today was another prime example. I could maybe understand sending Peavy back out in the eighth if he was on a roll in the middle of the season, but no way with him struggling so far this year. His pitch count was more than high enough for the third week of April. I don't think there's any justification for Ozzie leaving him in. We had plenty of righties in the bullpen to use before bringing in Thornton. Maybe Ozzie was afraid of Peavy.

I'm written about this a couple times lately so I'll keep this point short. Only an idiot would not have Andruw Jones in the lineup everyday on this weak-hitting team.

Instead of questioning the fans' intelligence, Ozzie needs to look in the mirror and ask himself why so many of his teams have been so unprepared to start the season.

Changes need to be made quickly if we hope to turn things around and make this a good season. Pierre, Beckham and Quentin are not getting it done at the top of the order. At least give Beckham a mental break and move him down in the order. I don't know what you do with Pierre. He looks overmatched in the American League. At this point, I'd rather have Kotsay bat than Pierre. Quentin is swinging every bit as ridiculously as Alexei Ramirez. This is extremely disappointing. It looks like Quentin hasn't learned anything over the years. If anything, he's regressed. I'm not sure why you keep sending Quentin and Ramirez out there day after day when they do not adjust their approach whatsoever, especially when their offense is supposed to be the strength of their game. At this point, I'm not sure you even blame Quentin and Ramirez anymore. They are what they are. I blame the people who continue to play them hoping that they're somehow going to change.

The pitching staff was ready to start the season. Kudos to Don Cooper. Why are the hitters so woefully unprepared?

Our defense remains a liability. We've failed to turn far too many double plays already. We have to live with Beckham's growing pains because second is his position and he's eventually going to be a good defensive player. Ramirez is a circus at shortstop, making some great plays while regularly botching routine ones. You need a steady defender at short. Ramirez is clearly not that.

Changes need to be made now. Things aren't going to magically get better on their own.

Because the alternatives are Kotsay and Vizquel.

It's ridiculous that talented players like Quentin and Ramirez are swinging like this. I've said it for three years: Fire Greg Walker. Time for someone new to take a fresh look at this group of hitters.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 07:47 PM
Remember what Oney said? "The Guillen family has it's own way of getting even?" (or something like that)

Guys, is Ozzie purposefully sabotaging the team for the first couple weeks to get back at the organization for putting a halt to the Guillen family's plans for a website, thus costing them thousands of dollars?

Once Ozzie is satisfied with his revenge, things will be back to normal.

Potentially risking his own job is no way to get revenge. He's smarter than that.

Dirty30
04-17-2010, 07:48 PM
Potentially risking his own job is no way to get revenge. He's smarter than that.

Doubt it.

johnnyg83
04-17-2010, 07:48 PM
The fact that he doesn't know the name (or is pretending he doesn't) of LaPorta is a glimpse into his arrogance or ignorance or both.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 07:49 PM
Do I really have to start doing this teal thing? That's so...so....lame?

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 07:49 PM
Doubt it.

Come on now...I know everyone's pissed, but this a bit of a stretch.

edit - I knew it was a joke! :)

A. Cavatica
04-17-2010, 07:50 PM
Potentially risking his own job is no way to get revenge. He's smarter than that.

He and his whole coaching staff -- minus Coop -- should be given fake travel documents after tomorrow's game.

soxlady8
04-17-2010, 07:52 PM
Jake against Superior Jake ... at the New Jake = BLAHHHHHHHHH

--I have no clue why Ozzie left Peavy in there w over a hundo pitches ...
--Why did the Thorntonator fail ????

This team seriously needs to get it together as the talent and ability (for the most part ) is THERE !!!

:angry:

BleacherBandit
04-17-2010, 07:57 PM
Jake against Superior Jake ... at the New Jake = BLAHHHHHHHHH

--I have no clue why Ozzie left Peavy in there w over a hundo pitches ...
--Why did the Thorntonator fail ????

This team seriously needs to get it together as the talent and ability (for the most part ) is THERE !!!

:angry:

:scratch:

Although I agree with your observations.

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 08:04 PM
Bill:

I hope your right but this team hit better in the warmewr weather in 2007 and 2009 and still had a losing season.

I just don't see any reason right now, like JB said, any indications that things are going to change.

Lip

The warm weather argument should not ever be used........ Unless you plan on your season ending October 1, because the weather in the post-season can be pretty damn cold!!

That expression is a cop out, excuse, and just outright weak.

You don't want 'warm-weather hitting team' in your scouting report for the post-season.

soxinem1
04-17-2010, 08:07 PM
OMG the Fat Guy....the Cleveland media will love that one

So will CLE when they go for the sweep tomorrow.........

And each time they play the White Sox this year!!

Hitmen77
04-17-2010, 08:09 PM
April 17 and already 5 games behind the Twins. WOW.:(:

With all these one run loses, I'm glad the Sox felt they didn't need any more hitting this year. The Twins were obviously fools to add more offense to their lineup.

But, that's okay because games in April don't count as much as games later in the year.

White Sox Fever, Catch It!!!!!!!!!

Blueprint1
04-17-2010, 08:10 PM
12 games into a 162 game season, no need to panic. As with some earlier Sox teams, maybe just maybe this will be a warm weather hitting team.

So no dark clouds on my horizon...yet

Just let me know when its time to panic. I think the time is now.

Dibbs
04-17-2010, 08:22 PM
I'm written about this a couple times lately so I'll keep this point short. Only an idiot would not have Andruw Jones in the lineup everyday on this weak-hitting team.

That is obviously not true. Ranger Rongey would rather have Kotsay batting 5th, so it must be true. He and many followers questioned why they would listen or take anyone seriously who thought Andruw Jones batting in his place would be a better lineup.

It was obvious to me before the season started that we have an 80 win team on our hands. Unfortunately, I am starting to question my preseason optimism.

TDog
04-17-2010, 08:22 PM
Peavy did his job and the offense did just enough to be able to win this game.

Ozzie made a horrible decision.

I think it's second-guessing to say Guillen made bad decisions today. I don't think there were any right ones to be made.

I posted in the game thread that I expected Thornton to come in. Anyone who says they would have brought in someone other than Thornton isn't being honest. Thornton was the obvious man to bring in. And, be honest, there were probably some that thought before Peavy came out that Guillen should go against the book and leave Thornton in for the ninth because Jenks can't be trusted. Today Thornton couldn't be trusted after coming in with one out and none on.

I was surprised with Peavy staying in and disappointed that he gave up the home run, but Thornton didn't have anything today, and it was Thornton who lost the game.

Peavy, of course, should have had more runs to work with going into the eighth.

Again, this might be the fourth time this year, the Sox lost a one run-or-extra-inning game after failing to bring home a runner from third with less than two outs. The White Sox offense gets runners to third with less than two outs, but consistently can't score them, which is one thing this offense should be doing.

You should want a man on third and one out for Beckham or first and third with one out for Quentin -- you should be wanting that all day. But Beckham (before today when he wasn't given the chance) has joined the parade of hitters who can't get that runner home, and Quentin has become the big GDIP man on the team.

I single out those two not to pick on them, but because I don't believe they are offensive liabilities on the team. Yet they have in the last few games been a big part of the offensive problem for this team.

Some of it may be bad luck. The coaches are obviously working on this. Guillen is managing to get the runner on third with less than two outs, and in that, he has been doing a good job. This team hasn't needed hits with runners in scoring position to score more runs. They don't need a higher team batting average. They need to score the runs that are out there on third with less than two outs. The offense seemed to be built to do that, and it's discouraging to see them fail so often at it.

Nelfox02
04-17-2010, 08:24 PM
dont think anyone mentioned this yet----but a key moment

Man on third----one out they pitch around beckham to bring up Quentin Westbrook on the ropes---and Quentin falls for it-----FIRST PITCH, rolls it over GIDP

that is such poor approach right there that late in the game---you know what westbrook is featuring

I just hung my head will that happen from time to time? sure, cant always succeed but just an awful approach/at bat in a key spot, and it happens with this team over and over and over for years now

wassagstdu
04-17-2010, 08:26 PM
I think this team has been built in recent years like a new expansion team, like the original Mets. Some name players, good once upon a time. And a lot of everyone else's castoffs. Anything above last place will be a positive -- as long as we beat the good teams a few times. All things considered, Ozzie deserves kudos for keeping them out of last place until now.

Corlose 15
04-17-2010, 08:27 PM
You know it's funny, I'm pissed about the Sox losing and I come here and it actually calms me down to read some of what you lunatics are posting.

Haha, that's WSI for ya.


Also, as long as Pierre isn't hitting this offense will continue to do nothing.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 08:31 PM
You know it's funny, I'm pissed about the Sox losing and I come here and it actually calms me down to read some of what you lunatics are posting.

Haha, that's WSI for ya.


Also, as long as Pierre isn't hitting this offense will continue to do nothing.

Kotsay, Alexei, AJ, Teahen and Beckham are all relieved to hear that it isn't their fault.

Nelfox02
04-17-2010, 08:31 PM
bigger picture----as we broke camp and KW looked at this roster did he honestly feel that he had a team that could win it all?

did he honestly feel he had a team that could even win the division?

thomas35forever
04-17-2010, 08:34 PM
I still don't get Ozzie's logic for keeping Peavy in after 104 pitches, but now that I've had some time to cool down, I also do think Thornton is to blame for not doing his job. Would he have done the same thing if he started the inning? Who knows? However, that doesn't change my thinking that poor managing is the reason we lost today's game.

I'm also making my way back towards the "Fire Greg Walker" crowd. This anemic offense is leaving the pitching staff with very little room for error and today, we all saw what happens when given that room. The staff has to be perfect for us to have a chance. That puts a lot of pressure on them. Cy Young and Nolan Ryan could be on the staff and even they would feel the pressure of always having to protect a one-run lead.

All things considered, this team better get its **** together or we're in for a long year.

Corlose 15
04-17-2010, 08:35 PM
Kotsay, Alexei, AJ, Teahen and Beckham are all relieved to hear that it isn't their fault.

Teahen, is the 8th hitter and despite his low average has actually been getting on base at a decent amount.

The other guys share the blame too but Pierre is the key to the whole lineup since he's the one whose game is exactly what Ozzie was looking for this year. If this team is going to go more with a dynamic style of offense its never going to get started as long as Pierre isn't getting on base, stealing bases, and pushing the defense in front of Beckham, Quentin, and Konerko.


Quentin and Konerko need to turn it around but it won't make any difference if there isn't ever anybody on base in front of them.

Dibbs
04-17-2010, 08:37 PM
You know it's funny, I'm pissed about the Sox losing and I come here and it actually calms me down to read some of what you lunatics are posting.

Haha, that's WSI for ya.

Think what you want. I feel the same way about people like you who say the same thing during seasons like 2007, 2009, 2004 etc...

I thought it was obvious before the season started this is not a playoff team. I think it is becoming more clear to many others. I guess anything is possible though.

Boondock Saint
04-17-2010, 08:40 PM
Teahen, is the 8th hitter and despite his low average has actually been getting on base at a decent amount.

The other guys share the blame too but Pierre is the key to the whole lineup since he's the one whose game is exactly what Ozzie was looking for this year. If this team is going to go more with a dynamic style of offense its never going to get started as long as Pierre isn't getting on base, stealing bases, and pushing the defense in front of Beckham, Quentin, and Konerko.


Quentin and Konerko need to turn it around but it won't make any difference if there isn't ever anybody on base in front of them.

I'll give you Teahen, but the only guys hitting above .222 with RISP are Teahen, Jones and Quentin, which includes Paulie and Beckham's 2 for 9, Pierre's 1 for 8, Rios' 1 for 6, AJ's 1 for 5, Alexei's 0 for 4 and Kotsay's 0 for 5. Those are awful numbers.

TDog
04-17-2010, 08:40 PM
You know it's funny, I'm pissed about the Sox losing and I come here and it actually calms me down to read some of what you lunatics are posting.

Haha, that's WSI for ya.


Also, as long as Pierre isn't hitting this offense will continue to do nothing.

I agree.

And I posted today that I expect the offense will begin clicking when Pierre starts hitting.

TDog
04-17-2010, 08:42 PM
I'll give you Teahen, but the only guys hitting above .222 with RISP are Teahen, Jones and Quentin.

The funny thing is, the Sox easily could have four more wins (and four less losses) without having a higher batting average with runners in scoring position.

Corlose 15
04-17-2010, 08:43 PM
Think what you want. I feel the same way about people like you who say the same thing during seasons like 2007, 2009, 2004 etc...

I thought it was obvious before the season started this is not a playoff team. I think it is becoming more clear to many others. I guess anything is possible though.

I don't care if you guys think this isn't a playoff team, I'm not even really disagreeing with those who think so. I'm just laughing at the reactions and meltdowns people have when the Sox play like **** for an extended period.

For what it's worth, It would've been interesting to see 2004 play out without Maggs and Frank going down.

Gavin
04-17-2010, 08:48 PM
All I want to know was... what the hell was the joke someone told Andruw Jones right before he was about to bat? Or does he always have a stoner's look of glee on his face?

Rdy2PlayBall
04-17-2010, 09:16 PM
All I want to know was... what the hell was the joke someone told Andruw Jones right before he was about to bat? Or does he always have a stoner's look of glee on his face?Was that necessary?

guillensdisciple
04-17-2010, 09:21 PM
I still have hope, but we ****ing suck. Jesus christ, do we ****ing suck.

SI1020
04-17-2010, 09:23 PM
The funny thing is, the Sox easily could have four more wins (and four less losses) without having a higher batting average with runners in scoring position. A .220 batting average going into today's game where they managed a grand total of five hits. Sorry, this is not the reincarnation of the 67 team.

It's Dankerific
04-17-2010, 09:31 PM
Ozzie thought Peavy was pitching well to go to the 8th. Thats all you need to know about his judgement.

Its piss poor.

mcsoxfan
04-17-2010, 09:55 PM
No one wants to discuss it, but we have to face it. Until there is a philosophical change in how the Chicago American League Ball Club operates, this lack of consistent quality is what we're going to faced with year in and year out.

We are the fans of a major sports team who can't even discuss meaningful changes in personnel without discussing budgetary constraints. We are in the third largest market in the US. There's is no reason on earth why the Sox payroll can't be at least on par with the 160 million of the Boston Red Sox.

We have the best starting pitching in baseball and worse offense in baseball. What first class operation leaves their product in that type of condition? It's ridiculous. It is not the fans responsibility to fill the seats in US Cellular Field. It is Reinsdorf's responsibility to put a compelling product on the field. He's done so at best 3 times in his tenure. If he can't or won't do that, he and those other cheap billionaires that own that team need to start trading toxic assets like Paulson to get richer. But for our sanity, we need a wealthy and committed life-long Sox fan as owner.

HomeFish
04-17-2010, 09:58 PM
bigger picture----as we broke camp and KW looked at this roster did he honestly feel that he had a team that could win it all?

did he honestly feel he had a team that could even win the division?

Even I honestly believed that we had a team that could win the division. The pitching was there. There were question marks, and thus far all of them except maybe Jones are blowing up.

BainesHOF
04-17-2010, 10:02 PM
Because the alternatives are Kotsay and Vizquel.

It's ridiculous that talented players like Quentin and Ramirez are swinging like this. I've said it for three years: Fire Greg Walker. Time for someone new to take a fresh look at this group of hitters.

Well, that's part of my point. Ramirez was benched last season and it didn't seem to have much effect on him. I think it's time to try that with Quentin, though, and see how he responds. That means Kotsay, at least for a couple games in the short term. It wouldn't be so much to try to get a lot out of Kotsay as it would be to wake Quentin up. Really, at this point, what do you have to lose?

Also, for the short term, put Vizquel at short for his defense. There's a school of thought, which Jeff Torborg used to adhere to, is that when your offense is struggling you put your best defensive team on the field.

The longer-term solution is to find permanent replacements.

bacon
04-17-2010, 10:04 PM
Usually i just read the posts to know that i'm not the only one who is thoroughly disappointed with this team. I didn't even watch the game today and i'm fired up. I would like to hear KW speak about our piss poor record. Just giving us a little insight into his off season decisions now that the season has started. We've had a chance to sample the product and to me (even though it is a small sample) we look just like we have for the last 2-3 seasons. Same offense, different names. I agree 100% that the moves Ozzie makes are ridiculous at times, and i am starting to think we need a change. But the bottom line is if we had some f*****g hitters we wouldn't be talking about this s**t every night. IMO when your pitching staff only allows three runs your team should win. That hasn't been the case with the White Sox over the last few years. Same s**t different season.

Thank you Mr. Kenny Williams for ruining another one of my summers.

BainesHOF
04-17-2010, 10:05 PM
By the way, it's an indictment of Ozzie's inability to teach that Ramirez remains so poor fundamentally and mentally at shortstop.

I wonder if Ozzie ever even tries to teach anyone anything.

GoGoCrede
04-17-2010, 10:05 PM
Thank you Mr. Kenny Williams for ruining another one of my summers.

As much as I'm probably going to get flamed for this...I still think we can get it together and win the division. It's a long season. And the pitching is just too damn good.

Just my opinion.

JB98
04-17-2010, 10:06 PM
By the way, it's an indictment of Ozzie's inability to teach that Ramirez remains so poor fundamentally and mentally at shortstop.

I wonder if Ozzie ever even tries to teach anyone anything.

I'm under the impression that Cora is the infield instructor. Not sure how heavily Ozzie is involved, if at all.

bacon
04-17-2010, 10:11 PM
As much as I'm probably going to get flamed for this...I still think we can get it together and win the division. It's a long season. And the pitching is just too damn good.

Just my opinion.

I still have hope as well, but its fading fast. just very frustrated with this team over the last 3 1/2 years. i also cant stand the fact the twins are good and we are......offensively challenged.

guillensdisciple
04-17-2010, 10:16 PM
Even though I am biased to hell towards Ozzie (look at my name), maybe it's time to move on. No one plays for him anymore, or maybe these players suck ass. I mean, Quentin might suck, so might Juan, so might Konerko, so might Jones, so might Teahen, so might Rios, and so might Ramirez.

The only one who might not suck is Beckham.

Maybe we just have a ****ty team.

2 runs against the Indians guys, we can't hit the ****ING Indians!!! Before we talk about the decision, lets not forget we got shut out last night and only score two today, against the ****ING Indians.

We suck.

Quentin08
04-17-2010, 10:17 PM
By the way, it's an indictment of Ozzie's inability to teach that Ramirez remains so poor fundamentally and mentally at shortstop.

I wonder if Ozzie ever even tries to teach anyone anything.

Have you tried to read Ozzie's tweets? I've been following this team way before 2004, and even I don't know what the hell he's trying to say most of the time, how on earth are the new guys supposed to get anything out of him.

veeter
04-17-2010, 10:22 PM
Gonzales just wrote that the last time we began 4-8 was 2001.Yuck. The dreaded, 'David Wells/Sandy Alomar are going to put us over the top', season. I think the Sox tied or set a record for returning to .500, after being 15 games below, that year. They then ran out of steam.

SI1020
04-17-2010, 10:27 PM
Yuck. The dreaded, 'David Wells/Sandy Alomar are going to put us over the top', season. I think the Sox tied or set a record for returning to .500, after being 15 games below, that year. They then ran out of steam. They started out 14-29, fought to .500 at 36-36 and ended up 83-79.

TDog
04-17-2010, 10:28 PM
A .220 batting average going into today's game where they managed a grand total of five hits. Sorry, this is not the reincarnation of the 67 team.

Batting average is irrelevant if you score runs. And this team has had the ability to score plenty of runs in a way that would not increase their batting average.

Today they should have been able to win with five hits. Today the best of the bullpen lost this game. The Sox might have had a better chance if Guillen had left Peavy in to finish the eighth.

veeter
04-17-2010, 10:33 PM
They started out 14-29, fought to .500 at 36-36 and ended up 83-79.So they put up a 22-7 run and STILL had 90 to go. I can't lose hope at 4-8, I'm sorry.

SI1020
04-17-2010, 10:38 PM
So they put up a 22-7 run and STILL had 90 to go. I can't lose hope at 4-8, I'm sorry. Don't be sorry. Hope is a very good thing.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 10:39 PM
It'd be easier to not lose hope if the Twins weren't doing what they've been doing since day 1.

Lip Man 1
04-17-2010, 10:40 PM
Veeter:

They became only the second team in MLB history to be fifteen under .500 and come back for a winning season. Milwaukee was the first in 91.

That team was doomed from the start due to half the pitchers being either on the DL or coming off, off season surgery.

When they were pitching on fumes the second half of 2000, due to the injuries to guys like Baldwin and Cal Eldred, Ron Schueler did nothing to get help at the deadline, that forced guys like Simas, Wunsch and Howry into a heavier work load than they got hurt!

In fact that's how Mark Buehrle got his chance. Manager Gandhi had him slated for relief but didn't have enough healthy starters in the spring so he gave him a shot.

The rest is history.

That team did have a lot more offensive options though even without Frank Thomas who tore up his tricep in late April.

Lip

veeter
04-17-2010, 10:49 PM
Veeter:

They became only the second team in MLB history to be fifteen under .500 and come back for a winning season. Milwaukee was the first in 91.

That team was doomed from the start due to half the pitchers being either on the DL or coming off, off season surgery.

When they were pitching on fumes the second half of 2000, due to the injuries to guys like Baldwin and Cal Eldred, Ron Schueler did nothing to get help at the deadline, that forced guys like Simas, Wunsch and Howry into a heavier work load than they got hurt!

In fact that's how Mark Buehrle got his chance. Manager Gandhi had him slated for relief but didn't have enough healthy starters in the spring so he gave him a shot.

The rest is history.

That team did have a lot more offensive options though even without Frank Thomas who tore up his tricep in late April.

LipIIRC, Schuler resisted trading prospects like Kip Wells and others, for veteran help. Then '02 rolled around and Kenny traded Wells and Josh Fogg for Todd Ritchie. Man, was I pissed. As it turned out none of them really panned out. Kenny did score Damaso Marte from the Pirates for current Twin, Matt Guerrier.

thomas35forever
04-17-2010, 10:50 PM
Before we talk about the decision, lets not forget we got shut out last night and only score two today, against the ****ING Indians.

False. We scored two runs last night.

Lillian
04-17-2010, 10:58 PM
Yes

Why use Thornton last night down 6-2?

I agree completely. I was screaming last night when Ozzie brought in Thornton. My argument was that he was going to wear out Matt's arm for nothing. I couldn't stop complaining about it, and wondered why Ozzie wasn't saving him for today's game. I knew Ozzie would be running the risk of overtaxing Thornton if he had to pitch in a day game following an appearance the previous night. It is likely the reason the Matt was so ineffective today.

We may have a great bullpen, but if Ozzie continues to mismanage it, the pen will likely become much less effective as the season progresses.

I can't ever remember second guessing a Sox manager more in such a short period of time. What a mess!!!!

Hegewisch
04-17-2010, 11:07 PM
My comment on todays game is......*** ??????!!!!!!?????????:scratch:

doublem23
04-17-2010, 11:15 PM
As much as I'm probably going to get flamed for this...I still think we can get it together and win the division. It's a long season. And the pitching is just too damn good.

Just my opinion.

Love the optimism, but we had a very good pitching staff last year, too (#2 overall in the AL) and we couldn't even salvage a .500 season.

Nothing left to do except sleep this one off and salvage the series tomorrow.

BRDSR
04-17-2010, 11:22 PM
I'm under the impression that Cora is the infield instructor. Not sure how heavily Ozzie is involved, if at all.

Ozzie Guillen won a gold glove at shortstop. Joey Cora was (primarily) a second basemen, and as far as I remember, was adequate but nothing too special. I don't care what Ozzie Guillen's title is, if he's not involved in instructing Ramirez, I'd fire him just for that even if the Sox were 12-0. No sarcasm at all.

On a related note, Jerry Manuel just out-managed Tony Larussa. Kenny, make him an offer!

Edit: Fairly off-topic, but just had Joey Cora's career stats up for fun...was anyone else aware that he was an All-Star with the Mariners in 97? Finished the season with 105 runs, a .300 batting average, and an .800 OPS. Shift Beckham to short and put JC back at 2B!

doublem23
04-17-2010, 11:32 PM
Ozzie Guillen won a gold glove at shortstop. Joey Cora was (primarily) a second basemen, and as far as I remember, was adequate but nothing too special. I don't care what Ozzie Guillen's title is, if he's not involved in instructing Ramirez, I'd fire him just for that even if the Sox were 12-0. No sarcasm at all.

Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you can teach it. I'm sure we're all aware that Ted Williams was almost 100 games under .500 in his managerial career in just 4 seasons.

soltrain21
04-17-2010, 11:33 PM
I'm tired of Guillen and I'm tired of this team trying to always find lightening in a bottle. I'm just tired of it all.

Today blew.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 11:35 PM
Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you can teach it.

And just because you can't do something, doesn't mean you can't teach it. i.e. Greg Walker

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:36 PM
At least Peavy did look better.

I just sat down and watched the entire game on DVR.

Peavy was getting hit hard ALL DAY. Cleveland was smoking him all over the ballpark, and by the grace of god their balls were hit right at Sox players. Peavy's lucky he only gave up two runs today.

I'll give Ozzie credit for having Andruw Jones in motion on AJ's groundout in the seventh. Otherwise, that's a double play and Rios doesn't drive in the lead run. So, with that in mind, I don't place all the blame on Ozzie.

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:37 PM
I'm actually glad--based on this thread--that I wasn't able to see this game.

Terrible ending, but it was actually a pretty good baseball game. It moved pretty quickly until the 8th inning too.

doublem23
04-17-2010, 11:37 PM
And just because you can't do something, doesn't mean you can't teach it. i.e. Greg Walker

True, though, FWIW, making it to the Major Leagues still puts Walker in the top 1 percentile of all Americans in terms of baseball hitting expertise.

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:40 PM
Pretty ****ing lame. Peavy was good enough to have won this.

Peavy was lucky enough to have left the game with it being tied. His stuff wasn't fooling many Indian batters today. Look at the type of outs that were made.

PhillipsBubba
04-17-2010, 11:41 PM
Ozzie explains his decision. (http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/04/ozzie_explains_his_decision_in.html)

Never explain...never complain

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:42 PM
Jake ****ing Westbrook? That guy shouldn't be an ace on a collegiate team.

Silly, foolish comment.

Slappy
04-17-2010, 11:42 PM
True, though, FWIW, making it to the Major Leagues still puts Walker in the top 1 percentile of all Americans in terms of baseball hitting expertise.

Not worth much, but then again, I guess there aren't enough ex MLB players that were good hitters to go around.

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:44 PM
http://twitter.com/OzzieGuillen/status/12365090878

**** off, Ozzie.

I'm glad he's taking it so seriously.

Noneck
04-17-2010, 11:44 PM
I just sat down and watched the entire game on DVR.

Peavy was getting hit hard ALL DAY. Cleveland was smoking him all over the ballpark, and by the grace of god their balls were hit right at Sox players. Peavy's lucky he only gave up two runs today.

I'll give Ozzie credit for having Andruw Jones in motion on AJ's groundout in the seventh. Otherwise, that's a double play and Rios doesn't drive in the lead run. So, with that in mind, I don't place all the blame on Ozzie.

Why did you have to tell me that? I was looking for something to keep my hopes up.

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:47 PM
Love the thread title.

Also, the only thing worse than the Sox offense and Ozzie's "managing" were those hats Cleveland was wearing; what the hell were those?

The khaki hats with the red "C"? Those are the worst hats I've ever seen worn in a major league game.

BringHomeDaBacon
04-17-2010, 11:47 PM
Batting average is irrelevant if you score runs. And this team has had the ability to score plenty of runs in a way that would not increase their batting average.


Unless you are relying on walks, errors and catchers interferences followed by wild pitches, balks and outs you have to get hits to score runs. Which, by definition raise your batting average.

Call me crazy but I think the teams that rely on the hits are going to do better.

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:48 PM
Gonzales just wrote that the last time we began 4-8 was 2001.

Time again to pick up Canseco off waivers.

BringHomeDaBacon
04-17-2010, 11:51 PM
Time again to pick up Canseco off waivers.


Are there any other former Indians left? Manny's still got a couple of good years left so KW will sign him in 4 or 5

Brian26
04-17-2010, 11:56 PM
dont think anyone mentioned this yet----but a key moment

Man on third----one out they pitch around beckham to bring up Quentin Westbrook on the ropes---and Quentin falls for it-----FIRST PITCH, rolls it over GIDP

that is such poor approach right there that late in the game---you know what westbrook is featuring

I just hung my head will that happen from time to time? sure, cant always succeed but just an awful approach/at bat in a key spot, and it happens with this team over and over and over for years now

Excellent post.

Lip Man 1
04-18-2010, 12:01 AM
Veeter:

And that unwillingness to trade any of his "prized prospects" who never did **** with the Sox cost his team potential post season appearances in 1991 and 1996.

For all his faults Kenny is 100 times better than Schueler.

Lip

Hegewisch
04-18-2010, 12:02 AM
As much as I'm probably going to get flamed for this...I still think we can get it together and win the division. It's a long season. And the pitching is just too damn good.

Just my opinion.

I hope you are right..................:D:

doublem23
04-18-2010, 12:15 AM
The khaki hats with the red "C"? Those are the worst hats I've ever seen worn in a major league game.

They were made of recycled materials, April 17 is Green Awareness Day.

The Indians gave away postrecycled hats to fans today, too, but they weren't nearly as ugly.

http://media.cleveland.com/metro/photo/green-hatjpg-ba0cca26feeeb6d3_medium.jpg

SI1020
04-18-2010, 12:24 AM
Batting average is irrelevant if you score runs. And this team has had the ability to score plenty of runs in a way that would not increase their batting average.

Today they should have been able to win with five hits. Today the best of the bullpen lost this game. The Sox might have had a better chance if Guillen had left Peavy in to finish the eighth. Please tell me when a team with a batting average approaching the Mendoza line won anything? Even the 1906 "Hitless Wonders" batted .230 against a league average of .249.

RockJock07
04-18-2010, 12:35 AM
bigger picture----as we broke camp and KW looked at this roster did he honestly feel that he had a team that could win it all?

did he honestly feel he had a team that could even win the division?

Honestly, he probably did. Remember, this pitching staff was supposed to be dominating and still could be. 12 games in, the pitching hasn't been an issue for the most part.

There were serious questions about if Rios could bounce back, If Carlos could get back to MVP form, If Beckham could develop, if Pierre could another year like he did last year, what is Mark Teahen going to provide, and is Alexei going to progress.

Like people have mentioned, the offense was always a question mark and so far it has been brutally bad. Kenny probably felt that with the pitching staff he assembled that he would need minimal offense, problem is that no player has really gotten hot and clutch hitting has been non-existent.

If your KW I feel like you can buy yourself a couple of weeks without changing on-field personal by firing Walker. I really don't know what he'd do otherwise, the season is still early for everyone else and he's not going to be able to go out and get a 1 guy that is going to make a difference. Flowers needs to be the full-time DH, what's the sense of waiting with that? Will he carry this team, probably not but at this point this team needs a shot in the arm.

ChiSoxGirl
04-18-2010, 01:14 AM
Well, there's no "Winning Pick to Click" thread, so I'll just post the TBGR (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/rwas/index.php?category=4&id=3925) here. ChiSoxGirl writes, Sox lose. I'm writing again tomorrow, so prepare yourself for the sweep.

Foulke You
04-18-2010, 01:18 AM
As much as I'm probably going to get flamed for this...I still think we can get it together and win the division. It's a long season. And the pitching is just too damn good.

Just my opinion.
I am certainly concerned with what I've seen but I don't disagree with you GoGoCrede. The starting pitching and bullpen have kept us in every game save one in Toronto and this is with the team hitting .220 and scoring 3 runs or less in every game. I'd be more worried if we were getting bombed out there like we were in 2007. My big fear is that this could be a sequel to 2009 but I think there are just too many veteran hitters with positive offensive history to think they are all going to remain at the Mendoza line for the whole of 2010.

Alexei Ramirez is in his usual April doldrums and will heat up eventually, Pierre is a .300 career hitter getting adjusted to a new league, Quentin hasn't gotten locked in yet, Kotsay is a career .281 hitter who is hitting .136 right now, and AJ is a career .285 hitter who is hitting .206 at the moment. The sky is the limit with Gordon Beckham's ability and he is better than he has shown as well. Most of these players are likely to revert to their career norms or at the very least climb to a more respectable number. If the pitching holds the line, this could be enough offense to take the division or at the very least, keep us in contention and allow Kenny a chance to add offense at the trade deadline. There are still 150 games to be played. I'll wait until at least the 50 game mark before passing judgment on this club.

GoGoCrede
04-18-2010, 01:40 AM
Love the optimism, but we had a very good pitching staff last year, too (#2 overall in the AL) and we couldn't even salvage a .500 season.

Nothing left to do except sleep this one off and salvage the series tomorrow.

I think our staff is much better this season and our record at the end of season will prove it. Last season's 5th starter fiasco (Hudson, Colon, Garcia, Richard, am I missing anyone?) had quite an effect on things, as did Buehrle's dismal second-half performance.

Because of how much better our staff is this year, I don't think we'll be seeing the same results as 2009, by far.

And also...didn't last year's OD roster include the likes of Betemit and Fields? Oh lawd.

Nellie_Fox
04-18-2010, 01:42 AM
Seven grammatical errors in his Tweet, four if you allow for the typical use of lowercase letters.

Must be a record for a sentence less than 140 characters. Yikes. How's your Spanish?

I get jumped on when I comment on the grammar and spelling of WSI posters for whom English is their first language, but nobody has ripped you for criticizing Ozzie's?

Love the thread title.

Also, the only thing worse than the Sox offense and Ozzie's "managing" were those hats Cleveland was wearing; what the hell were those?Some "green" thing. They were made entirely from recycled plastic bottles.

But, that's okay because games in April don't count as much as games later in the year.This crap is seriously tired. You know what? It IS easier to overcome being 5 games back in April than it is in September.

We are the fans of a major sports team who can't even discuss meaningful changes in personnel without discussing budgetary constraints. We are in the third largest market in the US. There's is no reason on earth why the Sox payroll can't be at least on par with the 160 million of the Boston Red Sox. We SHARE the third-largest market with another team that is, unfortunately, much more popular. That makes the Sox more like Houston. If the Sox were the only team in Chicago, or they were far-and-away the most popular team in Chicago, then I'd agree with you.

GoGoCrede
04-18-2010, 01:43 AM
How's your Spanish?

I get jumped on when I comment on the grammar and spelling of WSI posters for whom English is their first language, but nobody has ripped you for criticizing Ozzie's?



You're right, and I should have been more sensitive about this.

HomeFish
04-18-2010, 02:07 AM
Unless you are relying on walks, errors and catchers interferences followed by wild pitches, balks and outs you have to get hits to score runs. Which, by definition raise your batting average.

Call me crazy but I think the teams that rely on the hits are going to do better.

Now that I've seen a perfect game in person, my new baseball goal is to see a catcher's balk in person.

october23sp
04-18-2010, 02:15 AM
Here's the thing, I think we are royally ****ed this season. But, the Houston Astros in 2005 started out 15-30 and made the World Series. What's one great thing they had? Starting Pitching. What's something great that we have?

MtGrnwdSoxFan
04-18-2010, 02:42 AM
Here's the thing, I think we are royally ****ed this season. But, the Houston Astros in 2005 started out 15-30 and made the World Series. What's one great thing they had? Starting Pitching. What's something great that we have?

The love shared between all of us here at WSI?

Sam Spade
04-18-2010, 05:06 AM
Here's the thing, I think we are royally ****ed this season. But, the Houston Astros in 2005 started out 15-30 and made the World Series. What's one great thing they had? Starting Pitching. What's something great that we have?

Southpaw?

Scottiehaswheels
04-18-2010, 05:28 AM
What's something great that we have?Sense of humor? Just have to laugh at how bad they are. Oh and heading for a really high draft pick. Yippee!!!!!!!!!

cards press box
04-18-2010, 07:35 AM
Here's the thing, I think we are royally ****ed this season. But, the Houston Astros in 2005 started out 15-30 and made the World Series. What's one great thing they had? Starting Pitching. What's something great that we have?

Starting pitching, for sure, and that should actually improve when the Sox eventually call up Dan Hudson. And the 2010 Sox have a deeper bullpen than the 2005 Astros, too.

Still, the Sox could use a hitter bringing pop from the left side. Following this Astros theme, if Houston continues to stumble, Lance Berkman (who is in the last year of his contract) will likely become available. Berkman is a switch hitter and still has power from the left side. He would help.

ndgt10
04-18-2010, 09:26 AM
His team will finish last in the Central. I didn't want to believe it but they are flat out terrible.

Jerko
04-18-2010, 09:50 AM
Bullpen, pitch in close games like you do when the Sox are losing 7-0. Seems the tighter the game, the tighter their *******s are.

Yeah the offense sucks but to keep blowing leads in the 7th and 8th innings on a consistent basis is on the bullpen/manager IMO.

cards press box
04-18-2010, 10:53 AM
Bullpen, pitch in close games like you do when the Sox are losing 7-0. Seems the tighter the game, the tighter their *******s are.

Yeah the offense sucks but to keep blowing leads in the 7th and 8th innings on a consistent basis is on the bullpen/manager IMO.

Good point. Thornton, for example, looked a lot more dominant in a game where the Sox trailed 6-2 than in the 2-2 tie he entered on Saturday.

Tragg
04-18-2010, 11:07 AM
Another series loss
4 Series.
3 losses; 1 push
3 of the 4 series against likely 2nd division teams.

Frankfan4life
04-18-2010, 02:45 PM
I'm afraid this could get as ugly as 2007. I can't be more disappointed in this team than I am at this moment. Please let there be a turnaround on the horizon. :praying: