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thedudeabides
02-27-2010, 12:02 PM
CSN CHICAGO (http://www.csnchicago.com/02/26/10/Mooney-White-Sox-Taking-Notice-of-CF-Mit/landing.html?blockID=187726&feedID=621)

asindc
02-27-2010, 12:12 PM
Mitchell really impressed me during the College World Series. I'm hoping he can improve enough to come up for good sometime next year.

DirtySox
02-27-2010, 12:18 PM
Mitchell really impressed me during the College World Series. I'm hoping he can improve enough to come up for good sometime next year.

I'm going to guess 2012 at the earliest as he has many things he needs to refine. Base stealing, reducing the K-rate, and hitting lefties all need work.

It sure is fun to have a player with his upside though. Hopefully we draft more of them in the future.

broker3d
03-10-2010, 10:20 AM
I was at game on Saturday and Monday and Mitchell was easily the most impressive white sox player over those 2 days, easily. The kid will be called up at the very least as a September call up this year. He is a good sized kid who can fly. He showed his speed on a triple that was to the left field gap. Pretty impressive to see someone leg out a triple to left field. I was surprised how big he is.

I also thought De Aza looked pretty good as a 4th/5th OF. Good skills to have on bench.

JermaineDye05
03-10-2010, 11:01 AM
I was at game on Saturday and Monday and Mitchell was easily the most impressive white sox player over those 2 days, easily. The kid will be called up at the very least as a September call up this year. He is a good sized kid who can fly. He showed his speed on a triple that was to the left field gap. Pretty impressive to see someone leg out a triple to left field. I was surprised how big he is.

I also thought De Aza looked pretty good as a 4th/5th OF. Good skills to have on bench.

Idk about this year. I've heard he still has a lot of work to do on his swing. Also, he won't be ready for at least a couple years. At least, that's what I've heard.

Craig Grebeck
03-10-2010, 11:12 AM
Haha. Mitchell will not be up this year. Good tools, but not many skills. Not yet at least. I'm a big fan though.

DirtySox
03-10-2010, 11:25 AM
Idk about this year. I've heard he still has a lot of work to do on his swing. Also, he won't be ready for at least a couple years. At least, that's what I've heard.

You would be correct in that he has plenty to work on. Most importantly I want to see a big cut in the K-rate.

broker3d
03-10-2010, 12:22 PM
Haha. Mitchell will not be up this year. Good tools, but not many skills. Not yet at least. I'm a big fan though.


He will be a September call up.

Craig Grebeck
03-10-2010, 01:01 PM
He will be a September call up.
Are you basing this on the two spring training games you saw or, you know, logic?

He could be a September call-up, maybe for the last week, to dangle a carrot, but by all indications he is extremely unlikely to see any meaningful time this season, and fairly unlikely to see garbage time.

broker3d
03-10-2010, 01:31 PM
Are you basing this on the two spring training games you saw or, you know, logic?

He could be a September call-up, maybe for the last week, to dangle a carrot, but by all indications he is extremely unlikely to see any meaningful time this season, and fairly unlikely to see garbage time.

Yep, based on a whole 2 spring training games. It's not like I had a sit down with Kenny.

IMO, he will get a Tyler Flowers Taste of the Bigs September callup.

Craig Grebeck
03-10-2010, 01:50 PM
Yep, based on a whole 2 spring training games. It's not like I had a sit down with Kenny.

IMO, he will get a Tyler Flowers Taste of the Bigs September callup.
The only reason I ask is this: there is a ton of evidence that points to Mitchell being a "take-it-slow" sort of guy. Your report does nothing to refute what everyone has said, and that's that Mitchell is raw as hell, talented as hell, but nowhere near ready. Flowers was polished. Mitchell is not.

Domeshot17
03-10-2010, 01:59 PM
No way is he a call up this year. Heck, Jordan Danks may not taste much of the bigs this year. Mitchell is a project. IF WE RUSH HIM, WE WILL LOSE HIM. He is not a Gordon Beckham prospect, or even a Jordan Danks prospect, that has the defined skill to rise fast. He is a prospect who has 5 good tools and has to learn how to use them. In a way, the White Sox are working on breaking him down to build him back up. For his size, the kid had no idea how to square up a ball, hence the lack of power in College. However, he has the chance to hit 35-40 doubles AND 20-30 homers if he can hone in his power.

This kid has a chance to be really good. But he is still really raw. ZERO POINT in rushing him and hurting his development. All we need is him to come up still as a high strike out hitter, strike out the bulk of 15-20 at bats and mess with his confidence.

sox1970
03-10-2010, 02:29 PM
Mitchell will not be in the majors this year. No way. No chance.

broker3d
03-10-2010, 03:17 PM
Rushing the kid and giving him a taste of the bigs in September are two totally different things. The kid was extremely impressive (yes in only 2 games). I by no means think he is going to be a contributor to our season this year, simply a September call up. After what I saw this weekend, both physically and skills, that is not a stretch. It'll be 2011 or 2012 before he is a regular but I fully thinks he gets his September cuf of coffee in 2010.

I'm not trying to compare Jared to Tyler Flowers or anybody else. I bring up Flowers because I believe that is the type of trip to the big leagues I think he will get. It'll be a taste of the show and not big expectations to be on roster coming out of spring training in 2011. Just like Tyler Flowers. Mitchell has a body of a guy who I could see growing into a corner outfielder. Jordan Danks also looked more the size of a corner outfielder than a CF.

And let's be realistic, in seeing Jared Mitchell for only 2 games in early spring training there is no argument that I will be able to provide you to make you think he would get a September call up if you already think otherwise.

I love how Kenny went out and got Jared Mitchell on the high ceiling. I hope he continues to do that with many of his position draft choices.

doublem23
03-10-2010, 03:29 PM
He will be a September call up.

If that's the case we should be cruising to a nice 90+ loss season.

voodoochile
03-10-2010, 03:55 PM
If that's the case we should be cruising to a nice 90+ loss season.

Why? He could be a designated base stealer down the stretch if nothing else. All teams call minor league players up, not because they will play a lot but because they might fill a niche need and help keep players fresh or to get a taste of life in the bigs after the minor league season ends.

I'm not saying he should or should not be called up, but assuming that because he would be called up implies a failed season for the Sox seems a stretch...

doublem23
03-10-2010, 04:07 PM
Why? He could be a designated base stealer down the stretch if nothing else. All teams call minor league players up, not because they will play a lot but because they might fill a niche need and help keep players fresh or to get a taste of life in the bigs after the minor league season ends.

I'm not saying he should or should not be called up, but assuming that because he would be called up implies a failed season for the Sox seems a stretch...

Because if Mitchell makes an appearance in Chicago (which is just not going to happen), his arbitration clock starts, so I'd guess the Sox don't want to burn through those arb years to see if he's a good baserunner.

If Mitchell is here in September, its because of a combination of him having a great year in the minors (that's good!) and also we're playing for absolutely nothing but looking forward to next season (that's bad!). At most, maybe they'll let Mitchell come sit on the bench in September, but he's not seeing the field.

asindc
03-10-2010, 04:08 PM
If that's the case we should be cruising to a nice 90+ loss season.

Why can't we be cruising to a nice 95+ win season if he is called up?

DumpJerry
03-10-2010, 04:15 PM
They were drooling on their shoes over him this morning on The Score. Said he is ahead of Jordan Danks (and could make Danks trade bait). They said he might be a Sept. callup, but is really 2-3 years from The Show.

sox1970
03-10-2010, 04:22 PM
They were drooling on their shoes over him this morning on The Score. Said he is ahead of Jordan Danks (and could make Danks trade bait). They said he might be a Sept. callup, but is really 2-3 years from The Show.

Why would a guy be a September callup, but 2-3 years away? That makes no sense at all. When a young player with no major league experience gets a September callup, he better be ready to play on opening day the following year. I'm not doubting that Mitchell will be a better player than Jordan Danks, but I don't think they'll be rushing this guy. Even Birmingham seems like a stretch to start this season, but it looks like that's where he'll be going. So AA this year, and start 2011 at Charlotte, and then go from there. There's no need to start the clock with this guy this year.

Craig Grebeck
03-10-2010, 05:06 PM
Why? He could be a designated base stealer down the stretch if nothing else. All teams call minor league players up, not because they will play a lot but because they might fill a niche need and help keep players fresh or to get a taste of life in the bigs after the minor league season ends.

I'm not saying he should or should not be called up, but assuming that because he would be called up implies a failed season for the Sox seems a stretch...
If I remember correctly, his base-stealing skills are non-existent at this point.

Daver
03-10-2010, 05:23 PM
Because if Mitchell makes an appearance in Chicago (which is just not going to happen), his arbitration clock starts, so I'd guess the Sox don't want to burn through those arb years to see if he's a good baserunner.

If Mitchell is here in September, its because of a combination of him having a great year in the minors (that's good!) and also we're playing for absolutely nothing but looking forward to next season (that's bad!). At most, maybe they'll let Mitchell come sit on the bench in September, but he's not seeing the field.

The clock doesn't start till you are placed on the 25 man roster, unless that changed in the last CBA.

wilburaga
03-10-2010, 05:46 PM
I don't think the arbitration clock is the issue here, it's option years. If Jared (who was reassigned today) were to be called up in September, he'd have to be optioned out next spring, assuming, of course, he doesn't make the team. If he wasn't a September call up, he could be reassigned.

So the Sox would lose one year of options on Jared, but if they're pretty sure he'll arrive within 3-4 years, the pont would be moot.

W

thedudeabides
03-10-2010, 06:15 PM
The clock doesn't start till you are placed on the 25 man roster, unless that changed in the last CBA.

September call ups do count as days on the arbitration clock, even if you are only on the 40-man. It's why a lot of teams don't call many guys up.

I don't think the arbitration clock is the issue here, it's option years. If Jared (who was reassigned today) were to be called up in September, he'd have to be optioned out next spring, assuming, of course, he doesn't make the team. If he wasn't a September call up, he could be reassigned.

So the Sox would lose one year of options on Jared, but if they're pretty sure he'll arrive within 3-4 years, the pont would be moot.

W

He's not even on the 40-man roster. They first would have to make a move to clear a space on the 40-man. But then it would eat up an option if he is re-assigned the next year.

This adds to the unlikely scenario that he would be called up this September, but a lot can happen through the course of the year.

DirtySox
03-10-2010, 07:44 PM
More on Mitchell.

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100310&content_id=8747090&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

Interestingly, Walker notes he has some issues with his legs in his swing mechanics. It also says that Mitchell will start in Birmingham. This is the second mention of him starting in AA that I've read. That seems a bit too aggressive to me, but hopefully he proves me wrong.

canOcorn
03-10-2010, 08:25 PM
It also says that Mitchell will start in Birmingham. This is the second mention of him starting in AA that I've read. That seems a bit too aggressive to me, but hopefully he proves me wrong.

Yeah, I'm not sure I understand this plan. I know Danks went down to W-S and was tearing it up for 125 AB's (minus the K's), but he was much more advanced in all areas and I would have made him stay down longer to work on reducing those K's. I don't know why they wouldn't at least make him start in A+ and prove he's too advanced for that league. Hopefully, Buddy knows what he's doing with this guy.

BoKnowsBest
03-10-2010, 08:37 PM
I think the whole reason for having him in the major league camp to begin with was to give him a taste of what could come in his future. I've actually been more impressed by Jordan Danks, because while Mitchell is a better overall athlete, Danks at this point is a better baseball player. Who knows how long this will stay true, ideally not very long as Mitchell was a first rounder, but in my opinion its true right now.

DrCrawdad
03-10-2010, 09:30 PM
If I remember correctly, his base-stealing skills are non-existent at this point.

In 34 games: (http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=mitche001jar)

5 SB
3 CS

Is that "non-existent"?

Craig Grebeck
03-10-2010, 09:40 PM
In 34 games: (http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=mitche001jar)

5 SB
3 CS

Is that "non-existent"?
You're asking me if 5/8 in A-ball for a college player is indicative of non-existent skills? Yes. Jared could not pinch run this year for base-stealing ability.

DrCrawdad
03-10-2010, 09:49 PM
You're asking me if 5/8 in A-ball for a college player is indicative of non-existent skills? Yes.

Merkin's column mentioned that Mitchell has two SB in six at bats this spring. When I read your swipe at Mitchell's SB skills, I read the stats and while not impressive I don't think your assessment is fair. Room for improvement? Sure but non-existent? In a mere 34 games, his first in professional ball? Come on.

DirtySox
03-10-2010, 09:59 PM
Merkin's column mentioned that Mitchell has two SB in six at bats this spring. Your negative swipe of Mitchell's base-stealing skills is not based on facts, nor a surprise from you.

CG's assessment isn't that far off. The skills might not be "non-existent" but they certainly aren't honed very well. It's one of the many facets of his game that he needs to work on. It's been documented in many places other than this.

BoKnowsBest
03-10-2010, 10:19 PM
From what I've seen to this point he's made up for his raw skills by utilizing his pure speed. Once he refines his technique and learns the tendencies of pitchers, sure, he could be a great base stealer, but at this point he's stealing bases despite those aspects rather than because of them.

DrCrawdad
03-10-2010, 10:25 PM
CG's assessment isn't that far off. The skills might not be "non-existent" but they certainly aren't honed very well. It's one of the many facets of his game that he needs to work on. It's been documented in many places other than this.

By comparison Johnny Damon at 20 yrs old, in his 3rd year of "professional" baseball Damon had a 0.093 SB/AB. Mitchell's .0434 in his first year of "professional" baseball.

I agree with you. But "non-existent" is an over-the-top negative assessment IMHO.

BoKnowsBest
03-10-2010, 10:53 PM
I think that the sample size for Mitchell is still far too small to really be able to make that comparison. Give it a handful of games and that SB/AB can change radically.

Nobody's arguing that he doesn't have the tools to become a great base stealer, just that at this point in his development he's not worth calling up to be a base stealing specialist at the end of the year. They'd be better off having De Aza in that role cause they don't have to worry about his arbitration clock starting with the call up, he's got a little more experience, and he's incredibly quick as well

DrCrawdad
03-11-2010, 12:05 AM
I think that the sample size for Mitchell is still far too small to really be able to make that comparison. Give it a handful of games and that SB/AB can change radically.

Nobody's arguing that he doesn't have the tools to become a great base stealer, just that at this point in his development he's not worth calling up to be a base stealing specialist at the end of the year. They'd be better off having De Aza in that role cause they don't have to worry about his arbitration clock starting with the call up, he's got a little more experience, and he's incredibly quick as well

I agree it is a small sample size and to seize on it and exclaim that Mitchell has no skills for base stealing is ridiculous. 35 games is a small sample size, true. If in those mere 35 games he'd stolen 35 bases I would argue that it would be too soon to proclaim him the next Ricky Henderson.

Craig Grebeck
03-11-2010, 12:12 AM
Stealing bases in minor league games is meaningless, for one. Secondly, non-existent at this point. Tools do not equal skills.

DrCrawdad
03-11-2010, 12:17 AM
Stealing bases in minor league games is meaningless, for one. Secondly, non-existent at this point. Tools do not equal skills.

So you're point is? That if confronted with stats or evidence contrary to your negative, pessimistic opinion you're still right?

Craig Grebeck
03-11-2010, 12:19 AM
So you're point is? That if confronted with stats or evidence contrary to your negative, pessimistic opinion you're still right?
And your point is what exactly? A poster said he could come up and provide value as a pinch runner. I said he can't steal bases at the major league level, yet. You threw out a 5/8 stealing bases in A ball as though it was a counter to my argument.

Citing 5/8 in A ball for a college player and 2 SB in spring training certainly doesn't qualify as evidence. More like noise.

voodoochile
03-11-2010, 12:20 AM
Maybe you two could simply put each other on ignore, you know, walk away. The next constructive argument you two have will be the first. It's time to put it down...

Craig Grebeck
03-11-2010, 12:22 AM
Maybe you two could simply put each other on ignore, you know, walk away. The next constructive argument you two have will be the first. It's time to put it down...
I still see no reason why this can't be a rational discussion about the utter lack of utility provided by A ball stolen base numbers.

DrCrawdad
03-11-2010, 12:24 AM
And your point is what exactly? A poster said he could come up and provide value as a pinch runner. I said he can't steal bases at the major league level, yet. You threw out a 5/8 stealing bases in A ball as though it was a counter to my argument.

Citing 5/8 in A ball for a college player and 2 SB in spring training certainly doesn't qualify as evidence. More like noise.

Maybe that is what you meant, but it's not what you said.

"If I remember correctly, his base-stealing skills are non-existent at this point."

I don't think JM is ready for MLB. I look forward to seeing him when he's ready and I'll enjoy even more every time he steals a base.

Craig Grebeck
03-11-2010, 12:25 AM
Maybe that is what you meant, but it's not what you said.

"If I remember correctly, his base-stealing skills are non-existent at this point."

I don't think JM is ready for MLB. I look forward to seeing him when he's ready and I'll enjoy even more every time he steals a base.
I stand by my comment.

DrCrawdad
03-11-2010, 01:30 AM
I still see no reason why this can't be a rational discussion about the utter lack of utility provided by A ball stolen base numbers.

I wish this to be non-personal, I am curious as to what you base that opinion of yours on, if not his sole year in professional baseball then what?

For the record, here are Jared Mitchell's college SB stats.

'07 209AB 18SB 2CS .086SB/AB
'08 175AB 16SB 2CS .091SB/AB
'09 226AB 36SB 9CS .159SB/AB

As a reference, Ricky Henderson had a 0.128 career SB/AB ratio.

Craig Grebeck
03-11-2010, 01:51 AM
I wish this to be non-personal, I am curious as to what you base that opinion of yours on, if not his sole year in professional baseball then what?

For the record, here are Jared Mitchell's college SB stats.

'07 209AB 18SB 2CS .086SB/AB
'08 175AB 16SB 2CS .091SB/AB
'09 226AB 36SB 9CS .159SB/AB

As a reference, Ricky Henderson had a 0.128 career SB/AB ratio.
Scouting reports. I don't care for college stats.

DrCrawdad
03-11-2010, 07:21 AM
Scouting reports. I don't care for college stats.

Scouting reports? Where do you get the scouting reports? I'd be interested to read the scouting reports on JM.

DumpJerry
03-11-2010, 07:59 AM
When he was coming out of high school, he turned down a $700,000 bonus from the Twins. Given that the Twins have some of the best scouts in the world, this speaks volumes about his potential.

Craig Grebeck
03-11-2010, 10:30 AM
Scouting reports? Where do you get the scouting reports? I'd be interested to read the scouting reports on JM.
I'll PM you.

oeo
03-12-2010, 05:21 PM
Cowley just tweeted that Mitchell was taken off on a cart after "messing up" his ankle making a catch at the wall.

thomas35forever
03-12-2010, 05:24 PM
His right leg was straight when he left on the cart.

Hitmen77
03-12-2010, 08:49 PM
It might be only a sprained ankle for Mitchell...but they're still "checking the ligaments" according to Joey Cora.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/al/2010-03-12-383582598_x.htm

russ99
03-12-2010, 10:44 PM
It might be only a sprained ankle for Mitchell...but they're still "checking the ligaments" according to Joey Cora.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/al/2010-03-12-383582598_x.htm

Man, I hope Jared's OK. This is a big year for him development-wise.

Sockinchisox
03-12-2010, 10:57 PM
Torn tendon, surgery next week.

****.

http://twitter.com/InsideTheSox/statuses/10405980740

DirtySox
03-12-2010, 11:01 PM
****ty.

cws05champ
03-13-2010, 08:56 AM
Torn tendon, surgery next week.

****.

http://twitter.com/InsideTheSox/statuses/10405980740

How long will he be out?

Nutriaitch
03-13-2010, 12:22 PM
dammit! hate to hear that.

thomas35forever
03-13-2010, 02:04 PM
Sucks. He won't be with the big-league club for at least a couple of years now.

russ99
03-13-2010, 02:38 PM
Sucks. He won't be with the big-league club for at least a couple of years now.

Well that's a bummer. At least we have Jordan Danks in the meantime.

Aaron Rowand messed himself up far worse with that motorcycle stunt, and he's had a really nice career so far. This may delay Jared's arrival on the South Side, but shouldn't derail it.

broker3d
03-15-2010, 03:11 PM
That sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I really feel bad for Jared. There was nothing but rave reviews about his ability, but also about his willingness & desire to learn.

On a side note, there goes my prediction. Poof.

DirtySox
03-16-2010, 03:14 PM
InsideTheSox (http://twitter.com/InsideTheSox)
Jared Mitchell's surgery successful this morning. Rehab in 4-6 weeks. Out for entire season. Prognosis is for full recovery.[/URL][URL="http://www.tweetdeck.com/"] (http://twitter.com/InsideTheSox/status/10582660153)

#1swisher
03-16-2010, 04:02 PM
InsideTheSox (http://twitter.com/InsideTheSox)
Jared Mitchell's surgery successful this morning. Rehab in 4-6 weeks. Out for entire season. Prognosis is for full recovery.

Good News!

Pablo_Honey
03-16-2010, 07:05 PM
InsideTheSox (http://twitter.com/InsideTheSox)
Jared Mitchell's surgery successful this morning. Rehab in 4-6 weeks. Out for entire season. Prognosis is for full recovery.
I'm happy that the surgery went well and he's expected to recover fully already but it's very frustrating that his development time will be delayed by one season. He really needed all the playing time in the minors he can get to refine his game.

SoxSpeed22
03-16-2010, 07:58 PM
It's the best we could hope for. Just as long as he makes a full recovery.

sullythered
03-17-2010, 05:30 AM
It's funny that now Jared Mitchell falls into the category of "dudes Kenny Williams would be likely to try an acquire." First round pick with tons of upside who has had injury problems and is now undervalued. I hope he comes back better than ever, as I think he has near limitless potential.