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DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 03:52 PM
I forgot who issued the report.

oeo
02-19-2010, 03:53 PM
Next time you have to make the new thread before closing the old one. I was dying for 20 seconds.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 03:53 PM
Next time you have to make the new thread before closing the old one. I was dying for 20 seconds.

:tongue:
I was confused about that as well.

KRS1
02-19-2010, 03:53 PM
Love Kenny for not playing the fool here. Yes, I would still really like to add Johnny to our lineup, and no, I don't want to lose out to ****ing Detroit in anything. However, this is a pretty clear statement to Boras and all his clients that we will not be held hostage and leveraged by his media **** storm negotiation strategy, and that I LOVE.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 03:53 PM
Next time you have to make the new thread before closing the old one. I was dying for 20 seconds.

It's really fun watching the number of people viewing this thread blow up, though.

Our beat reporters are pretty bad in reporting anything in a timely matter it seems.

As someone on here once said (I forgot who), "Cowley is good at promoting Cowley." Way to be on top of things, guys!

asindc
02-19-2010, 03:54 PM
Soltrain: "I don't understand this reasoning whatsoever. Is he not allowed to think about his life and weigh the pros and cons of what he may want to do? It was a week at most."

It is not about Damon weighing his options, its about Boras trying to create a bidding war between the Sox and Detroit when it seemed clear that neither side would go along with that.

Rdy2PlayBall
02-19-2010, 03:54 PM
Well then add NYY and Atlanta to the list as well since they also pulled offers to Damon off the table this season. Pulling has nothing to do with it. It's that KW probably hates Boras even more now then before.

getonbckthr
02-19-2010, 03:55 PM
The Buster Tweets are proof that KW busted Boras playing his BS games.

JermaineDye05
02-19-2010, 03:56 PM
With pitchers and catchers reporting in 2 days, I figure today was the deadline and KW felt that the club had more pressing needs to focus on than worry about this situation. I'm sure if Damon doesn't like what he's getting from Detroit, he can always come back here (if he really wants to win and play in Chicago) but at great risk of losing some of the money that was originally offered.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 03:58 PM
Everyone's favorite beat reporter weighs in:

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
The Johnny Damon talks died the last two hours ... more to details to come in a few. What we do know is A.J. Pierzynski is no Urban Meyer.

getonbckthr
02-19-2010, 03:58 PM
Levine is gonna be on ESPN 1000 in moments.

Jim Shorts
02-19-2010, 03:59 PM
Everyone's favorite beat reporter weighs in:

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
The Johnny Damon talks died the last two hours ... more to details to come in a few. What we do know is A.J. Pierzynski is no Urban Meyer.


He's just not good

mzh
02-19-2010, 03:59 PM
I think Kenny made the right move on this one- it sounds to me that Boras is the one literally controlling everything, and KW called him. I think that Damon wanted to sign with us, but Borass told him to hold out for an extra mil or so. Who knows how long we would have waited or how much more we would have had to pay. Now Damon (and hopefully Boras) knows that KW isn't going to take that **** and if he really wants to come here he's going to have to call Kenny himself and negotiate without Boras being the middleman.

soltrain21
02-19-2010, 04:00 PM
With pitchers and catchers reporting in 2 days, I figure today was the deadline and KW felt that the club had more pressing needs to focus on than worry about this situation. I'm sure if Damon doesn't like what he's getting from Detroit, he can always come back here (if he really wants to win and play in Chicago) but at great risk of losing some of the money that was originally offered.

I think our biggest matter is getting another outfielder who can hit so Andruw Jones isn't our full time DH. So...where KW goes from here is beyond me.

When is Carlos Delgado ready?

Noneck
02-19-2010, 04:00 PM
I know others have said it but now I think some other team laying in the weeds will snag Damon. The Sox and Tigers both probably have had enough of the Borass chicanery.

Danielgosox38
02-19-2010, 04:01 PM
Just ****ing re-sign Jermaine Dye already. It's better than going through the season with this garbage rotating DH we have set up right now.

russ99
02-19-2010, 04:01 PM
Can't blame Kenny on this, typical Boras...

Maybe he'll get in on Branyan late in the game.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:01 PM
I know other have said it but now I think some other team laying in the weeds will snag Damon. The Sox and Tigers both probably have had enough of the Borass chicanery.

I doubt it. Unless the Braves want to get back in it. It still looks to me like he's either going to be in a Tigers uniform or a Sox.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:02 PM
Can't blame Kenny on this, typical Boras...

Maybe he'll get in on Branyan late in the game.


Signed by the Indians according to Olney http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN/status/9349695307

getonbckthr
02-19-2010, 04:02 PM
Can't blame Kenny on this, typical Boras...

Maybe he'll get in on Branyan late in the game.
Sounds like he is just about an Indian

asindc
02-19-2010, 04:02 PM
Pulling has nothing to do with it. It's that KW probably hates Boras even more now then before.

I hear you, but I don't think KW will let this episode get in the way of going after any other Boras client if he thinks it will help the ball club.

spawn
02-19-2010, 04:03 PM
Everyone's favorite beat reporter weighs in:

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
The Johnny Damon talks died the last two hours ... more to details to come in a few. What we do know is A.J. Pierzynski is no Urban Meyer.
Cowley sucks. He's just terrible.

oeo
02-19-2010, 04:03 PM
I know others have said it but now I think some other team laying in the weeds will snag Damon. The Sox and Tigers both probably have had enough of the Borass chicanery.

I think unless the Tigers meet Boras' new demands, he's coming to the Sox. Unless, and I guess it could be true, Boras planted these demands, as well. The Sox offer is still there, Kenny said it himself. He's just not negotiating anymore, that's his final offer.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:03 PM
Cowley sucks. He's just terrible.

The Sox need some new beat reporters... Cowley is a straight up clown.

russ99
02-19-2010, 04:04 PM
I think unless the Tigers meet Boras' new demands, he's coming to the Sox. The Sox offer is still there, Kenny said it himself. He's just not negotiating anymore, that's his final offer.

Doesn't fill me with confidence that things can get done.

Boras will probably wring $1M more out of Detroit, and call it a victory.

dwalteroo
02-19-2010, 04:05 PM
just ****ing re-sign jermaine dye already. It's better than going through the season with this garbage rotating dh we have set up right now.

+1.

LongLiveFisk
02-19-2010, 04:07 PM
You gotta love these threads where there are almost as many guests viewing as there are members. :lol:

Corlose 15
02-19-2010, 04:08 PM
Just ****ing re-sign Jermaine Dye already. It's better than going through the season with this garbage rotating DH we have set up right now.

Would you say that if Dye had had his 2nd half last year with any other team besides the Sox?

He was truly woeful after the break.

russ99
02-19-2010, 04:08 PM
Guys, wake up. Dye of 2006-7 is not what we'd see if we re-sign him.

The reason no one's picked him up is he needs to play the field full time to feel confident at the plate and hit well. As a part time OF/DH with no defined role, we'll more than likely see the same Dye as the second half of last year.

At this point I'd think the Sox will take their chances and see if either Jones/Kotsay can handle it over the spring then make a trade if needed.

PatK
02-19-2010, 04:09 PM
I doubt it. Unless the Braves want to get back in it. It still looks to me like he's either going to be in a Tigers uniform or a Sox.


Sox pulled their offer

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/white-sox-withdraw-offer-to-damon.html

Sargeant79
02-19-2010, 04:09 PM
I love what Kenny just did. He just managed to say two things all at once and very publicly:

"Johnny Damon - If you still want to come here, we're interested."
"**** you, Scott Boras."

ilsox7
02-19-2010, 04:12 PM
For all of those ripping on the beat reporters, I don't think you can blame them for not breaking this one. It seems pretty clear this was a calculated move by KW. He chose who he wanted to break this story to. ESPN makes sense since it would make the biggest splash there.

CWSpalehoseCWS
02-19-2010, 04:12 PM
I think Kenny made the right move on this one- it sounds to me that Boras is the one literally controlling everything, and KW called him. I think that Damon wanted to sign with us, but Borass told him to hold out for an extra mil or so. Who knows how long we would have waited or how much more we would have had to pay. Now Damon (and hopefully Boras) knows that KW isn't going to take that **** and if he really wants to come here he's going to have to call Kenny himself and negotiate without Boras being the middleman.

That's what make this great. Detroit is bidding against themselves now. They can turn around and say the same thing. KW pretty much screwed Damon/Boras in getting anymore money IMO. Detroit is in more 'financial problems' then the Sox are, I don't see how they could offer more or give in to Boras' demands.

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 04:12 PM
Cowley sucks. He's just terrible.
He doesn't even realize that this is just KW taking leverage away from Boras over the Tigers while at the same time letting Damon know that if he wants to play for the Sox all he has to do is call and agree to the "pulled" $6M offer.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:13 PM
For all of those ripping on the beat reporters, I don't think you can blame them for not breaking this one. It seems pretty clear this was a calculated move by KW. He chose who he wanted to break this story to. ESPN makes sense since it would make the biggest splash there.

Joe? Is that you?

soltrain21
02-19-2010, 04:13 PM
I love what Kenny just did. He just managed to say two things all at once and very publicly:

"Johnny Damon - If you still want to come here, we're interested."
"**** you, Scott Boras."

I must be missing where withdrawing an offer screams, "Hey - you can still come here."

"This is our final offer - take it or leave it." and, "We are withdrawing our offer." are two completely different things.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 04:14 PM
For all of those ripping on the beat reporters, I don't think you can blame them for not breaking this one. It seems pretty clear this was a calculated move by KW. He chose who he wanted to break this story to. ESPN makes sense since it would make the biggest splash there.

You make a good point, but this isn't necessarily the first time one of our reporters has fallen down on the job reporting something this huge. Hell, Cowley broke the Damon story hours after we'd all heard about it. He spends much of his time on Twitter bitching about Reifert.

Oh, and here's his latest update:

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
If the Sox were done dealing with Boras before this, well, expect the cold war downgraded to frigid.

He's just a wealth of information, isn't he?

Noneck
02-19-2010, 04:14 PM
Sox pulled their offer

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/white-sox-withdraw-offer-to-damon.html

Levine broke this and said on 1000, that Damon may realize that there is no 2nd year and only 1m between Sox and Tigers offer. And then he has to pick between Chicago and Detroit. He said Chicago would make sense.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:14 PM
I must be missing where withdrawing an offer screams, "Hey - you can still come here."

"This is our final offer - take it or leave it." and, "We are withdrawing our offer." are two completely different things.

"As you can see by the way that we kept going after this situation, we are very much interested in the player. All I can say is that I reiterate at this time that this offer for now is off the table."

He spoke in present tense.

ilsox7
02-19-2010, 04:15 PM
I must be missing where withdrawing an offer screams, "Hey - you can still come here."

"This is our final offer - take it or leave it." and, "We are withdrawing our offer." are two completely different things.

Did you read the story? It was made very clear that the Sox would still sign Damon.

soltrain21
02-19-2010, 04:16 PM
"As you can see by the way that we kept going after this situation, we are very much interested in the player. All I can say is that I reiterate at this time that this offer for now is off the table."

He spoke in present tense.

I didn't see that quote. I just saw the one from Gonzalez' article.

WhiteSox5187
02-19-2010, 04:16 PM
Well, if the Sox are "still interested" in Damon, then I don't think they really withdrew their offer, am I wrong? If Boras came to Kenny and said "Damon would like to sign with you guys for the offer you gave us..." would Kenny say "Too bad?" Either way, the power is now firmly in Detroit's hands. If they want Damon, they can have him for whatever price cuz there is no way Boras can spin this now.

ilsox7
02-19-2010, 04:16 PM
You make a good point, but this isn't necessarily the first time one of our reporters has fallen down on the job reporting something this huge. Hell, Cowley broke the Damon story hours after we'd all heard about it. He spends much of his time on Twitter bitching about Reifert.

Oh, and here's his latest update:

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
If the Sox were done dealing with Boras before this, well, expect the cold war downgraded to frigid.

He's just a wealth of information, isn't he?

Cowley is an idiot, I agree. And has definitely dropped the ball more times than not. I was just commenting on this one instance. It is clear KW was very calculated and controlled this process.

kobo
02-19-2010, 04:17 PM
You make a good point, but this isn't necessarily the first time one of our reporters has fallen down on the job reporting something this huge. Hell, Cowley broke the Damon story hours after we'd all heard about it. He spends much of his time on Twitter bitching about Reifert.

Oh, and here's his latest update:

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
If the Sox were done dealing with Boras before this, well, expect the cold war downgraded to frigid.

He's just a wealth of information, isn't he?
What do you expect him to say on twitter?

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:17 PM
Well, if the Sox are "still interested" in Damon, then I don't think they really withdrew their offer, am I wrong? If Boras came to Kenny and said "Damon would like to sign with you guys for the offer you gave us..." would Kenny say "Too bad?" Either way, the power is now firmly in Detroit's hands. If they want Damon, they can have him for whatever price cuz there is no way Boras can spin this now.

Essentially what Kenny has done is said I'm leaving the table - but you know where to reach me, Johnny.

There is still an offer there.

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 04:17 PM
I must be missing where withdrawing an offer screams, "Hey - you can still come here."

"This is our final offer - take it or leave it." and, "We are withdrawing our offer." are two completely different things.
Read Levine's article. KW said he still has interest in Damon. But he's not going to leave his offer open so Boras can keep it in his hip pocket while going around trying to squeeze more money out of someone else.

The article also mentions how there never was a two year, fourteen million dollar offer from Detroit. Boras was just lying trying to get the two teams to bid against a phantom offer.

KW is playing this well, regardless of how it turns out. Personally, I'm optimistic Damon will be a White Sox in a few days.

JermaineDye05
02-19-2010, 04:19 PM
I think our biggest matter is getting another outfielder who can hit so Andruw Jones isn't our full time DH. So...where KW goes from here is beyond me.

When is Carlos Delgado ready?

FWIW, on CTL the other night, Dave Van Dyck said that he's heard that some feel that Jones will be the surprised comeback player of the year in the AL.

Now I'd be ecstatic if that were indeed true. Hell, I'd be ecstatic if he winds up hitting .260 with 20+ HRs.

All I'm saying is let's not write off Andruw just yet. Let's let him prove himself in ST first. If he shows us the same horrid plate discipline and fat body we've seen the past couple of years, then we can discard him into the junk pile with the likes of Brent Lillibridge and Dewon Day.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 04:19 PM
What do you expect him to say on twitter?

Perhaps be a bit more professional, is all I'm saying. Although he and Reifert both like to talk about the other on their pages, so he's not the only one guilty of that.

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 04:21 PM
Well, if the Sox are "still interested" in Damon, then I don't think they really withdrew their offer, am I wrong? If Boras came to Kenny and said "Damon would like to sign with you guys for the offer you gave us..." would Kenny say "Too bad?"
Kenny would say, "Well, there is no offer on the table from us, but if you are making us a firm offer for $6M, we accept."

TheOldRoman
02-19-2010, 04:22 PM
Kenny did the right thing here. He outsmarted Boras. And now it comes out that the Tigers never really offered the 2/$14 deal. I'm shocked! He had his people planting BS intel this last week to try to get the Sox to bid against themselves. Who knows if the Tigers ever even made an offer before yesterday. We'll see if the Tigers increase their offer enough to where Damon and his wife will want to live in that ****hole. If not, Damon is ours.

munchman33
02-19-2010, 04:24 PM
Read Levine's article. KW said he still has interest in Damon. But he's not going to leave his offer open so Boras can keep it in his hip pocket while going around trying to squeeze more money out of someone else.

The article also mentions how there never was a two year, fourteen million dollar offer from Detroit. Boras was just lying trying to get the two teams to bid against a phantom offer.

KW is playing this well, regardless of how it turns out. Personally, I'm optimistic Damon will be a White Sox in a few days.

I'd rather have a poorly played victory than a well played defeat. I'd think in this situation slightly overpaying for Johnny Damon (not really overpaying, all things considered) AND keeping him away from a division rival would trump playing the negotiations well.

I like what Kenny's doing. But if he fails to sign Damon, and his offer was in the neighborhood, it's completely his fault and completely a failure.

johnnyg83
02-19-2010, 04:25 PM
I love seeing Boras get his leverage taken out.

I think aspect was well-played by KW, but I still want Damon.

Jim Shorts
02-19-2010, 04:26 PM
Anyone else notice how abscent Heyman is today?

soltrain21
02-19-2010, 04:27 PM
I love seeing Boras get his leverage taken out.

I think aspect was well-played by KW, but I still want Damon.

I'd much rather have Johnny Damon on our team than watch Scott Boras get Scooby Doo'd.

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 04:27 PM
I like what Kenny's doing. But if he fails to sign Damon, and his offer was in the neighborhood, it's completely his fault and completely a failure.
What if JR told Kenny he has $6M tops to spend on Damon? Would that be Kenny's fault?

oeo
02-19-2010, 04:28 PM
I must be missing where withdrawing an offer screams, "Hey - you can still come here."

"This is our final offer - take it or leave it." and, "We are withdrawing our offer." are two completely different things.

Did you read the rest of his quotes? He also says they're still very interested.

As you can see by the way that we kept going after this situation, we are very much interested in the player. All I can say is that I reiterate at this time that this offer for now is off the table.

That sounds exactly like, 'this is our final offer--take it or leave it.'

DirtySox
02-19-2010, 04:28 PM
According to Williams, the Sox waited long enough for Damon and asked for a bottom line. Bottom line was "unrealistic.''

http://twitter.com/cst_sox/statuses/9355724629

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 04:29 PM
I love seeing Boras get his leverage taken out.

I think aspect was well-played by KW, but I still want Damon.
I think the Sox now have a better chance at signing Damon than they did before KW publicly "pulled" his offer.

soltrain21
02-19-2010, 04:29 PM
Did you read the rest of his quotes? He also says they're still very interested.

I already said I had only read the Gonzalez article at the time.

Noneck
02-19-2010, 04:29 PM
I'd rather have a poorly played victory than a well played defeat. I'd think in this situation slightly overpaying for Johnny Damon (not really overpaying, all things considered) AND keeping him away from a division rival would trump playing the negotiations well.

I like what Kenny's doing. But if he fails to sign Damon, and his offer was in the neighborhood, it's completely his fault and completely a failure.

I see what you are saying but according to Levine this one the($)part is going through Reinsdorf. Williams hands may be tied.

Rdy2PlayBall
02-19-2010, 04:29 PM
What if JR told Kenny he has $6M tops to spend on Damon? Would that be Kenny's fault?Ask Konerko nicely to lend him 1 or 2 mil? In return, the Sox sign him again after this season. It's good for everyone.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 04:30 PM
24 hours, people.

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
KW did leave the door open and say if Johnny Damon changes his mind in the next 24 hours, "we would love to have him.''

DirtySox
02-19-2010, 04:30 PM
KW says that Damon and Boras showed a willingness to be creative but ''the total dollars and cents didn't make sense to us.''


http://twitter.com/MDGonzales/status/9355614154

SoxGirl4Life
02-19-2010, 04:31 PM
24 hours, people.

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
KW did leave the door open and say if Johnny Damon changes his mind in the next 24 hours, "we would love to have him.''

http://twitter.com/MDGonzales/status/9355614154

I see 500 more posts before 10:00 pm

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 04:31 PM
24 hours, people.

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
KW did leave the door open and say if Johnny Damon changes his mind in the next 24 hours, "we would love to have him.''
And there you have it.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:31 PM
24 hours, people.

cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
KW did leave the door open and say if Johnny Damon changes his mind in the next 24 hours, "we would love to have him.''

Nooooo. Oh well :(:

DirtySox
02-19-2010, 04:31 PM
I see 500 more posts before 10:00 pm

I think this thread needs a round of beers again. Even if some of us have exams in an hour.

Hitmen77
02-19-2010, 04:32 PM
Well, if the Sox are "still interested" in Damon, then I don't think they really withdrew their offer, am I wrong? If Boras came to Kenny and said "Damon would like to sign with you guys for the offer you gave us..." would Kenny say "Too bad?" Either way, the power is now firmly in Detroit's hands. If they want Damon, they can have him for whatever price cuz there is no way Boras can spin this now.

Indeed KW's wording is very interesting. We've "withdrawn our offer" but yet we're "still interested" in acquiring this player.

It sounds contradictory, but I think you guys summed it up well on this thread. KW has pulled out the rug from under Boras and ended his negotiating tactics. Now Detroit knows that they are the only ones negotiating with Boras and Damon.

I still say he's signing with Detroit, but the Sox did leave the door open if Damon really wants to play in Chicago. Ultimately it's his decision and not Boras's.

oeo
02-19-2010, 04:32 PM
FWIW, on CTL the other night, Dave Van Dyck said that he's heard that some feel that Jones will be the surprised comeback player of the year in the AL.

Now I'd be ecstatic if that were indeed true. Hell, I'd be ecstatic if he winds up hitting .260 with 20+ HRs.

All I'm saying is let's not write off Andruw just yet. Let's let him prove himself in ST first. If he shows us the same horrid plate discipline and fat body we've seen the past couple of years, then we can discard him into the junk pile with the likes of Brent Lillibridge and Dewon Day.

.260 was about all Jones could hit even in his best years.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 04:32 PM
I see 500 more posts before 10:00 pm

Dream big! I say 800. Remember KW's quote from last year? "We're here to dream, and to dream big, and to win."

More from Cowley:
cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
Once camp starts on Sunday, however, "Never a good productive thing for everyone to be watching the door.'' In other words, the door is shut

ilsox7
02-19-2010, 04:32 PM
I think this thread needs a round of beers again. Even if some of us have exams in an hour.

More Edmund Fitzgerald!

TheOldRoman
02-19-2010, 04:33 PM
Anyone else notice how abscent Heyman is today?Boras hasn't decided when Heyman should say next.

DirtySox
02-19-2010, 04:33 PM
Boras hasn't decided when Heyman should say next.

Without question.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 04:33 PM
I think this thread needs a round of beers again. Even if some of us have exams in an hour.

Boras isn't worth this. Go study. An exam on a Friday? Blech.

Boras hasn't decided when Heyman should say next.

:tongue: Awesome.

oeo
02-19-2010, 04:38 PM
cst_sox (http://twitter.com/cst_sox)
Once camp starts on Sunday, however, "Never a good productive thing for everyone to be watching the door.'' In other words, the door is shut

I don't agree with this and I think Kenny is playing the media yet again. Kenny is always talking about how he's always looking to improve the team. The start of Spring Training should not change that. If Boras and Damon come running back on Monday, I guarantee he still makes a deal.

Rohan
02-19-2010, 04:40 PM
Boras hasn't decided when Heyman should say next.

:rolling:
Okay. I'm going out. I shall continue to follow the drama via cellular phone (On WSI of course, where else?!).

getonbckthr
02-19-2010, 04:41 PM
I don't agree with this and I think Kenny is playing the media yet again. Kenny is always talking about how he's always looking to improve the team. The start of Spring Training should not change that. If Boras and Damon come running back on Monday, I guarantee he still makes a deal.
He's out-Borasing Boras.

oeo
02-19-2010, 04:43 PM
He's out-Borasing Boras.

All he's doing is trying to speed things up. I see what he's saying, he wants to focus on the season and doesn't want this dragging on into March, but if Damon is still out there on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, you better believe the Sox are still interested.

LoveYourSuit
02-19-2010, 04:49 PM
"The Sox will not negotiate with Scot Borass" will become an under-statement after this fiasco.

This is classic.

Over By There
02-19-2010, 04:51 PM
After all the virtual fist-pumping over the badass move by KW, this means very little. If anything, I see it as KW trying to put a little pressure on "the player" himself, as others have alluded to.

asindc
02-19-2010, 04:51 PM
I wonder what Mrs. Damon's reaction was upon hearing that the Sox pulled their offer.
:?::o::mad:

Noneck
02-19-2010, 04:53 PM
I wonder what Mrs. Damon's reaction was upon hearing that the Sox pulled their offer.
:?::o::mad:


Hopefully she is showing him the couch he will be sleeping on Detroit.

The Immigrant
02-19-2010, 04:53 PM
Boras hasn't decided when Heyman should say next.

Hammer meets nail.

MtGrnwdSoxFan
02-19-2010, 04:55 PM
Hopefully she is showing him the couch he will be sleeping on Detroit.

If it hasn't been ripped off by the Detroit "Welcoming Committee" by then.

oeo
02-19-2010, 04:56 PM
After all the virtual fist-pumping over the badass move by KW, this means very little. If anything, I see it as KW trying to put a little pressure on "the player" himself, as others have alluded to.

I still think the Sox are bidding against themselves. This is what Boras does. I would not be surprised if the Sox offer is actually higher than the Tigers, or if the Tigers pulled their offer a week ago.

Domeshot17
02-19-2010, 04:56 PM
Take this with a grain of salt I don't know the validity:

I have a buddy whos good friends with a guy who works for the braves. He just called me saying Damon is finalizing the deal with the Tigers. Damon's wife wanted Chicago, Boras wanted Damon to take the best Financial Offer and the Tigers were more willing to play ball financially.

He said it sounds as if there was a bit of disagreement between Boras and Damon and thats what is dragging it out.

Could be nothing, could be right, just figured with 4 threads of chaos, it isn't the biggest pile of **** posted in the thread :redneck

soxinem1
02-19-2010, 04:57 PM
Hopefully she is showing him the couch he will be sleeping on Detroit.

Or ATL, perhaps.

I still say if he wants to play here he will. KW just wants to end the distraction and have him in uniform by next week, if it happens.

Noneck
02-19-2010, 04:58 PM
I still think the Sox are bidding against themselves. This is what Boras does. I would not be surprised if the Sox offer is actually higher than the Tigers, or if the Tigers pulled their offer a week ago.

If thats the case, then he is a Sox.

Over By There
02-19-2010, 05:00 PM
Take this with a grain of salt I don't know the validity:

I have a buddy whos good friends with a guy who works for the braves. He just called me saying Damon is finalizing the deal with the Tigers. Damon's wife wanted Chicago, Boras wanted Damon to take the best Financial Offer and the Tigers were more willing to play ball financially.

He said it sounds as if there was a bit of disagreement between Boras and Damon and thats what is dragging it out.

Could be nothing, could be right, just figured with 4 threads of chaos, it isn't the biggest pile of **** posted in the thread :redneck

Wouldn't be surprised. Batten down the hatches if true, because the "Damon Signs with Tigers" thread will undoubtedly enter the pantheon of legendary threads following a division rival signing.

Slappy
02-19-2010, 05:00 PM
I see him finalizing a deal with the Tigers soon. The article at the Tigers' website shows Dombrowski pretty confident.

Danielgosox38
02-19-2010, 05:01 PM
Yeah, I think it's over.

johnnyg83
02-19-2010, 05:02 PM
Here's a conspriacy theory: KW gets wind Damon's going to sign with Tigers, he then publicly pulls Sox offer, KW then leaks that his (sox) offer was $6 million. Damon signs with Detroit for $6 million or less and Boras looks incompetent.

Anyway.

Danielgosox38
02-19-2010, 05:03 PM
So does anybody think KW has a plan B, or are we stuck with the awful rotating DH?

getonbckthr
02-19-2010, 05:04 PM
Here's a conspriacy theory: KW gets wind Damon's going to sign with Tigers, he then publicly pulls Sox offer, KW then leaks that his (sox) offer was $6 million. Damon signs with Detroit for $6 million or less and Boras looks incompetent.

Anyway.
Boras wouldn't hesitate to make it known the Sox offer was not 6 million.

johnnyg83
02-19-2010, 05:06 PM
Boras wouldn't hesitate to make it known the Sox offer was not 6 million.

True, but is there a disclosure rule? Boras without some corroborating documents isn't exactly a credible source.

Rdy2PlayBall
02-19-2010, 05:13 PM
I imagine this being the last deal of the offseason, it will be over hyped. If we got Pierre today, everyone would have the Sox as favorites this year... The fact that they got done so quickly, the hype fades really fast. The Tigers will be the new favorite even though they weren't even in consideration before the Damon talk started.

Domeshot17
02-19-2010, 05:14 PM
Atleast Sunday we can probably hear Kenny say he can't spend a dollar when you only have 50 cents. That means baseball season is about to hit full swing!

Craig Grebeck
02-19-2010, 05:27 PM
I imagine this being the last deal of the offseason, it will be over hyped. If we got Pierre today, everyone would have the Sox as favorites this year... The fact that they got done so quickly, the hype fades really fast. The Tigers will be the new favorite even though they weren't even in consideration before the Damon talk started.
I don't think Pierre is as well regarded as you think. Same for the Tigers -- they'll probably suck with or without Johnny. But, who knows? They may overperform again.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 05:30 PM
Indeed KW's wording is very interesting. We've "withdrawn our offer" but yet we're "still interested" in acquiring this player.

It sounds contradictory, but I think you guys summed it up well on this thread. KW has pulled out the rug from under Boras and ended his negotiating tactics.
It's not at all contradictory. The Sox pulled their offer from the table. The Sox let Damon know that if he wants to play on the South Side, he needs to make an offer because they are too proud to beg.


People, this is Johnny Damon we're talking about. Not a superstar player. He's been in two All-Star games. The closest he came to winning MVP was coming in 13th place (2005) despite playing for two of God's Chosen Teams (Red Sox, Yankees). He has led the American League once in runs scored (in 2000), triples (in 2002), stolen bases (in 2000) and is the current active leader in triples in AL. In other words, he is not what some people are making him out to be.

Craig Grebeck
02-19-2010, 05:30 PM
It's not at all contradictory. The Sox pulled their offer from the table. The Sox let Damon know that if he wants to play on the South Side, he needs to make an offer because they are too proud to beg.


People, this is Johnny Damon we're talking about. Not a superstar player. He's been in two All-Star games. The closest he came to winning MVP was coming in 13th place (2005) despite playing for two of God's Chosen Teams (Red Sox, Yankees). He has led the American League once in runs scored ( in 2000), triples (in 2002), stolen bases (in 2000) and is the current active leader in triples in AL. In other words, he is not what some people are making him out to be.
I don't think that people think Damon is a superstar, they just see a gulf between Kotsay/Jones and Damon.

GoGoCrede
02-19-2010, 05:32 PM
People, this is Johnny Damon we're talking about. Not a superstar player. He's been in two All-Star games. The closest he came to winning MVP was coming in 13th place (2005) despite playing for two of God's Chosen Teams (Red Sox, Yankees). He has led the American League once in runs scored (in 2000), triples (in 2002), stolen bases (in 2000) and is the current active leader in triples in AL. In other words, he is not what some people are making him out to be.

This all true and makes good points, but fans don't like being snubbed or played by Boras. I think that's what some of the hubbub in these threads is about. God, I can already hear the boos from the first time he'll face us if he becomes a Tiger.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 05:32 PM
I don't think that people think Damon is a superstar, they just see a gulf between Kotsay/Jones and Damon.
I agree with your perception of what people think. I think it is more a creek than a gulf. The DH by committee will work fine.

Craig Grebeck
02-19-2010, 05:33 PM
I think it is more a creek than a gulf. The DH by committee will work fine.
Why though? I have much more confidence in Damon than Kotsay and Jones. The latter two are lucky to have major league contracts at this point.

Craig Grebeck
02-19-2010, 05:34 PM
I agree with your perception of what people think. I think it is more a creek than a gulf. The DH by committee will work fine.
And to clarify: a creek, for me, would have been someone like Garret Anderson -- though he's probably on the same level as Jonesay.

Zisk77
02-19-2010, 05:35 PM
I think if we don't sign Damon, Kw just bides his time and sees how Jones/Kotsay are doing. If its not good he makes a trade for Gonzalez, or Dunn, or some expendable slugger from a losing team that will probably be a better acquistion than Damon anyway.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 05:35 PM
Why though? I have much more confidence in Damon than Kotsay and Jones. The latter two are lucky to have major league contracts at this point.
Jones, maybe is lucky. Kotsay has value. I've always felt Jones is a placeholder for Jordan Danks unless he catches lightning in a bottle. If the Sox get three months from him at a satisfactory level of production while Danks is getting seasoned at Charlotte, the small contract he signed with the Sox is a great value to the team.

LoveYourSuit
02-19-2010, 05:36 PM
I agree with your perception of what people think. I think it is more a creek than a gulf. The DH by committee will work fine.


DH by committe is not a bad thing when their is a glut of good hitting talent sitting there to be part of that rotation.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 05:37 PM
DH by committe is not a bad thing when their is a glut of good hitting talent sitting there to be part of that rotation.
Their what is a glut?

Craig Grebeck
02-19-2010, 05:37 PM
Jones, maybe is lucky. Kotsay has value. I've always felt Jones is a placeholder for Jordan Danks unless he catches lightning in a bottle. If the Sox get three months from him at a satisfactory level of production while Danks is getting seasoned at Charlotte, the small contract he signed with the Sox is a great value to the team.
I understand that. I guess the difference between one thought and the other is that I don't see Danks being MLB ready in 2010, if ever. He just doesn't get it done for me.

To me, if we were going to have a placeholder who could step aside in August and wouldn't be depended on for much, I would've just stuck with Thome or Dye. Kotsay is a serious step-down, and much of his value is marred by the fact that his back is pretty flimsy at this point.

LoveYourSuit
02-19-2010, 05:37 PM
I think if we don't sign Damon, Kw just bides his time and sees how Jones/Kotsay are doing. If its not good he makes a trade for Gonzalez, or Dunn, or some expendable slugger from a losing team that will probably be a better acquistion than Damon anyway.


Right, and unload from what already is a very thin farm system.

kruzer31
02-19-2010, 05:38 PM
Detroit will be a tad better if they get Damonbut they are relying on a rookie in CF in Austin Jackson who is more raw then Mike Cameron was when he came up with us. He will struggle with strikeouts and be sent down by the All Star break.

Dont get me wrong, Adam Everett is good on defense but he might be one of the worst hitters I have ever watched at the plate.

There 4 and 5 pitchers are suspect in Bonderman and Galarraga. Losing Edwin Jackson will hurt them.

Losing Placido Polanco will effect this team more then people think.

It is not the Tigers with or without Damon we should worry about. The Twins are are biggest competition in this division. I like our team on paper to win this AL Central, but that is on paper, soon it is time to perform.

JEFF

white sox bill
02-19-2010, 05:39 PM
By mid season Damons numbers may look like this:
6 hr, 35 rbi and .254 BA

This makes KW look pretty darn good as we sift thru the available players on non-contending teams. Of course, unless we happen to be on that list..

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 05:39 PM
To me, if we were going to have a placeholder who could step aside in August and wouldn't be depended on for much, I would've just stuck with Thome or Dye.
Except Thome or Dye would be more than $500,000. Would their production be that much better than Jones' to justify the price difference. Also, imagine how quickly Comiskey would be burned down to the ground if Thome or Dye were DFA'd mid-season.......

Lip Man 1
02-19-2010, 05:40 PM
Zisk:

The risk of course is that without a decent to good offense at the start of the season to back a strong starting rotation it may not matter who is available come July.

Kenny has to weigh the risks-rewards in taking the approach you suggest.

Lip

LoveYourSuit
02-19-2010, 05:40 PM
By mid season Damons numbers may look like this:
6 hr, 35 rbi and .254 BA

This makes KW look pretty darn good as we sift thru the available players on non-contending teams. Of course, unless we happen to be on that list..


And if had we signed Damon, your prediction would be:

15 HRs, 50 RBIs and a .290 hitter.

white sox bill
02-19-2010, 05:46 PM
And if had we signed Damon, your prediction would be:

15 HRs, 50 RBIs and a .290 hitter.

Absolutely!!

soxinem1
02-19-2010, 06:00 PM
And if had we signed Damon, your prediction would be:

15 HRs, 50 RBIs and a .290 hitter.

And if that happens, we will be 12 games in first place at the break!!

Especially if Damon was batting second!!

DickAllen72
02-19-2010, 06:10 PM
"The Sox will not negotiate with Scot Borass" will become an under-statement after this fiasco.

This is classic.
KW is quoted as saying that although he didn't come to an agreement with Boras this time the silver lining is that their meetings may have laid the groundwork for future deals.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/02/damon_talks_all_but_over.html

soltrain21
02-19-2010, 06:12 PM
KW is quoted as saying that although he didn't come to an agreement with Boras this time their meetings may have laid the groundwork for future deals.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/02/damon_talks_all_but_over.html

I don't get the phrase "all but..." like used in that article. "Damon talks all but over." But...they are over - and that phrase always makes it sound like they are everything BUT over.

sullythered
02-19-2010, 06:20 PM
Hey, did you guys hear anything about the Sox being interested in Johnny Damon?

TheOldRoman
02-19-2010, 06:31 PM
Atleast Sunday we can probably hear Kenny say he can't spend a dollar when you only have 50 cents. That means baseball season is about to hit full swing!ZOMG!! I NO!:rolleyes:

NLaloosh
02-19-2010, 06:45 PM
Wow. What a surprise. The Sox weren't the high bidder and Damon and Boras wouldn't go with the lower bid.

Next will find out that water is wet.

HBaines03
02-19-2010, 06:56 PM
When are the players going to realize that Boras is not doing what is in their best interest? Damon could have stayed in New York for 2yr 14M. Boras got greedy and screwed Damon potentially 7M+. How can he not be pissed at him? There is no guarantee for Damon next year unless he has a very productive year.

KW played this perfectly by walking away and handcuffing Boras. The only way Boras looks ok out of this is if another team comes in and starts the bidding again.

Boras needs to be fired by more of his clients.

JohnTucker0814
02-19-2010, 06:58 PM
When are the players going to realize that Boras is not doing what is in their best interest? Damon could have stayed in New York for 2yr 14M. Boras got greedy and screwed Damon potentially 7M+. How can he not be pissed at him? There is no guarantee for Damon next year unless he has a very productive year.

KW played this perfectly by walking away and handcuffing Boras. The only way Boras looks ok out of this is if another team comes in and starts the bidding again.

Boras needs to be fired by more of his clients.

Boras is the guy you want if you're ARod, Teixeira, etc... but if you're a guy that might only have 1 or 2 offers, then you probably want to go with someone else.

asindc
02-19-2010, 06:59 PM
Wow. What a surprise. The Sox weren't the high bidder and Damon and Boras wouldn't go with the lower bid.

Next will find out that water is wet.

We don't know any of that yet.

MtGrnwdSoxFan
02-19-2010, 07:01 PM
When are the players going to realize that Boras is not doing what is in their best interest?

Precisely...he gets the most for his clients, because that means more for him. But sometimes, he REALLY overplays his hand, and he gets stuck in a situation like this, with only one team bidding on him, and everyone KNOWS it, so that one team is not going to get into a phantom bidding war.

If I were the Tigers, I'd offer 1Y at $5.5M. No more. If he doesn't accept, then he can have fun watching this season on the sidelines.

asindc
02-19-2010, 07:04 PM
Boras is the guy you want if you're ARod, Teixeira, etc... but if you're a guy that might only have 1 or 2 offers, then you probably want to go with someone else.


Good point. Boras relies on having at least two desperate teams (or one desperate team gullible enough to think there is a second team) trying to outbid each other (or itself). Since neither KW or Dombrowski is that desperate in this case, he is left scrambling and Damon is sitting at home pissed at Boras and probably dealing with a pissed off wife.

Corlose 15
02-19-2010, 07:09 PM
The other thing that works against Damon's favor in going to Detroit is that he most likely will put up better numbers in Chicago and do it with a higher profile than he would in Detroit. The only thing that Detroit really had going for it was the stability of that 2nd year, which apparently was never on the table.

If both offers are within a million or so and only for one year Damon would be able to make up the difference and come out ahead next year in free agency with a better year in Chicago.

Domeshot17
02-19-2010, 07:10 PM
For those who don't see the difference between Damon and the putrid Jones Kotsay platoon, Damon would have been top 3 in most major offensive categories for us last year.

Jones/Kotsay is just as likely to be the least productive DH position in the AL as it is to be any good. Damon is a massive addition. Not because hes incredibly good, but those 2, and our offense as a whole, is near the bottom of the AL.

Brian26
02-19-2010, 07:15 PM
http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2010/02/damon_talks_all_but_over.html

I really like everything Kenny said there. There's nothing to be mad about. The ball is in Damon's court, and we'll see what he's made of. I don't want him here if we have to overpay.

Jurr
02-19-2010, 07:22 PM
I really like everything Kenny said there. There's nothing to be mad about. The ball is in Damon's court, and we'll see what he's made of. I don't want him here if we have to overpay.

That's true. ESPN reports that the Braves may be in the running. Sounds totally like a Boras "plant" right there.

Zisk77
02-19-2010, 07:24 PM
Right, and unload from what already is a very thin farm system.

A minor league system is there to help the big league club whether its developing prospects for the big club or for trade fodder. Or we could just jealously horde our prospects and watch as most don't amount to anything.

Besides not every slugger is going to gut the farm, yet every year we get draft more.

Danielgosox38
02-19-2010, 07:27 PM
Mlbtraderumors says that the Rays and Braves could be under the radar to go after Damon.

Zisk77
02-19-2010, 07:28 PM
Zisk:

The risk of course is that without a decent to good offense at the start of the season to back a strong starting rotation it may not matter who is available come July.

Kenny has to weigh the risks-rewards in taking the approach you suggest.

Lip


True that is always a risk, but I would take that risk knowing our talent and our divisions talent that we still will be in it.

Also, Kenny won't necessarily wait to July 31 to make a move. He's been known to get someone in May or June. We just do not know which teams will be sellers right now.

oeo
02-19-2010, 07:32 PM
I don't get the phrase "all but..." like used in that article. "Damon talks all but over." But...they are over - and that phrase always makes it sound like they are everything BUT over.

I still don't think they are. Kenny says, "We asked for their bottom line and obviously we underestimated on what the market is for him because we thought we were competitive with what the rumors were out there."

He mentions the rumors and thought their offer was competitive enough and then Boras comes back with some obscene number as the 'bottom line.' Sounds like Boras is still trying to drive the price up. Now the Braves are back in after being out for a week because they couldn't compete with the Sox and Tigers? This is all just a bunch of BS. There isn't a market and Boras is trying to create one, get someone to pay more than they need to.

asindc
02-19-2010, 07:32 PM
Mlbtraderumors says that the Rays and Braves could be under the radar to go after Damon.

If you don't mind, allow me. That should be read as such:

Mlbtraderumors repeated what Boras' camp told them to say.

thomas35forever
02-19-2010, 07:39 PM
How the Damon discussion could get to four threads is beyond me. Anyway, I'm about to accept that we won't see him on the South Side this year unless it's with another team. If Bora$$ meant to get so many teams wanting his client, he's doing a great job. Let Damon make his own decision so this can just die.

WhiffleBall
02-19-2010, 07:44 PM
Until today I did not know that Damon has four kids. Two by his first wife who are of school age and attend school near his home in Florida and two very young ones with his current wife. Choosing the tigers gives him six extra weeks near his children. I'm sure that will factor into his final decision.

Hitmen77
02-19-2010, 07:47 PM
So does anybody think KW has a plan B, or are we stuck with the awful rotating DH?

Plan B is to see if we're still in contention in June or July and hope we can pull off a trade for a big bat.

The good news is that we'd have more to spend only paying for a 1/2 season of someone's services, the bad news is that it's not a given that the Sox can outbid other teams for wanted players.

...by the way, I don't think Johnny Damon was ever in any of the Sox plans. They had no idea this scenario would unfold. It was really Jones/Kotsay as Plan A and hope to find a bat if we're still close to first place as Plan B.

mzh
02-19-2010, 09:34 PM
Two hours without a post :o:

Life returns to normal :tongue:

soxinem1
02-19-2010, 09:43 PM
Mlbtraderumors says that the Rays and Braves could be under the radar to go after Damon.


As numerous rumored to-be-going-after Damon stories slip through the hourglass, so do the:


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_F3TPByD_2rY/SRtJVh4txkI/AAAAAAAAA-c/XLK-HQzLAss/s320/days.jpg

gosox41
02-19-2010, 10:00 PM
I think Kenny made the right move on this one- it sounds to me that Boras is the one literally controlling everything, and KW called him. I think that Damon wanted to sign with us, but Borass told him to hold out for an extra mil or so. Who knows how long we would have waited or how much more we would have had to pay. Now Damon (and hopefully Boras) knows that KW isn't going to take that **** and if he really wants to come here he's going to have to call Kenny himself and negotiate without Boras being the middleman.


Not that I needed any confirmation about Boras being a lot of things that I could get banned for saying here but this further proves it. He has a player that has madea ton of money over his career, who's wife doesn't want to go to Detroit, and who I think wants to win. So Boras is going to play his games over $1 million dollars when in reality, if Damon signs with the Sox he has a much better chance of putting up better offensive numbers and thus signing a bigger contract after this season.

Instead he could enjoy his time in Det. I hope he likes third place, an unhappy wife, and the last big contract ($6Million is still big in my world.)

Heck with Damon's personality, he can make back some of that $1 million in endorsements.


Bob

jabrch
02-19-2010, 10:09 PM
I hope we get Damon - he's probably worth a handful of wins more than the guys we have. But if we don't, I won't cry too long. The 6mm that is reported to be spent on Damon will go a long way at the trade deadline or sooner.

If the Pads really will trade Adrian Gonzalez, I'd happily strip the rest of the farm for him.

sullythered
02-19-2010, 10:10 PM
Stupid Comcast Sports Net just said the Sox "took the Damon deal off the table." They then said that if Damon decides to take the offer they made in the next 24 hours, they will sign him. I don't think Gail Fisher knows what "off the table" means.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 10:28 PM
Stupid Comcast Sports Net just said the Sox "took the Damon deal off the table." They then said that if Damon decides to take the offer they made in the next 24 hours, they will sign him. I don't think Gail Fisher knows what "off the table" means.
Gail Fischer is reading a script written by someone else, so don't cast aspersions at her.

"Off the table" means the deal is still alive. All it means is that the Sox are no longer negotiating, but if the other side wants to make a deal happen, they need to make a bona fide offer which will either be accepted or rejected, but not negotiated.

"Dead, dead, dead, go away" means the door is closed, locked and the key is on the bottom of the deepest part of the Pacific Ocean.

cards press box
02-19-2010, 10:49 PM
Mlbtraderumors says that the Rays and Braves could be under the radar to go after Damon.

No, that's not really accurate. The article (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/MLB-spring-training-buzz-021510) by Ken Rosenthal and Jon Paul Morosi essentially says that neither the White Sox nor the Tigers seemed inclined to amend their current respective offers to Damon and that Damon is weighing the pros and cons that of playing with either team. The tag line of the article about the Rays and Braves (noting that this whole situation has been so up in the air that maybe some other teams associated with Damon might sneak back into this) was meant as a joke.

sullythered
02-19-2010, 10:57 PM
Gail Fischer is reading a script written by someone else, so don't cast aspersions at her.

"Off the table" means the deal is still alive. All it means is that the Sox are no longer negotiating, but if the other side wants to make a deal happen, they need to make a bona fide offer which will either be accepted or rejected, but not negotiated.

"Dead, dead, dead, go away" means the door is closed, locked and the key is on the bottom of the deepest part of the Pacific Ocean.
I actually like Gail Fischer, and I didn't mean to knock her as much as the show, in general. In my experience, saying you are pulling a deal off the table means exactly that. There is no longer a deal on the table being offered.

oeo
02-19-2010, 11:18 PM
I actually like Gail Fischer, and I didn't mean to knock her as much as the show, in general. In my experience, saying you are pulling a deal off the table means exactly that. There is no longer a deal on the table being offered.

Read Kenny's quotes. He says the deal is currently off the table, but they're still very interested and can come back to it if Boras and Damon want. All Kenny is basically saying is what DumpJerry said, this is our final offer, take it or leave it.

I hate Fischer, she's a Cubs fan who is not afraid to get that in the way when she has to report on the Sox. See: Schanowski, Mark as well.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 11:23 PM
I actually like Gail Fischer, and I didn't mean to knock her as much as the show, in general. In my experience, saying you are pulling a deal off the table means exactly that. There is no longer a deal on the table being offered.

Read Kenny's quotes. He says the deal is currently off the table, but they're still very interested and can come back to it if Boras and Damon want. All Kenny is basically saying is what DumpJerry said, this is our final offer, take it or leave it.

I hate Fischer, she's a Cubs fan who is not afraid to get that in the way when she has to report on the Sox.
Fischer is a total Cub tool. I'm sure she burns her clothing when she is forced to go to Comiskey. A friend of mine is a cousin of Chuck Garfien. He tells me Chuck is a big Sox fan.

Saying the offer is off the table is not killing the deal, it is playing hardball with a caste iron stomach. This tells me that Kenny can take Damon or leave him. He is not desperate to land the guy and he is letting Borass know that.

Brian26
02-19-2010, 11:25 PM
Fischer is a total Cub tool.

Not true. Gail's a class act. No Gail Fischer basing allowed here.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 11:25 PM
I won't tolerate any Gail Fischer bashing. That's everyone's last warning.
Your post appeared while I was writing mine.





I stand by what I said. :duel:

Brian26
02-19-2010, 11:27 PM
Your post appeared while I was writing mine.





I stand by what I said. :duel:

I'm biased. I used to see her at church on Sundays. I think she's ok.

DumpJerry
02-19-2010, 11:28 PM
I'm biased. I used to see her at church on Sundays. I think she's ok.
Was she praying for a Cub World Series title?:redneck

oeo
02-19-2010, 11:37 PM
Fischer is a total Cub tool. I'm sure she burns her clothing when she is forced to go to Comiskey. A friend of mine is a cousin of Chuck Garfien. He tells me Chuck is a big Sox fan.

You can tell Chuck is a huge Sox fan. I don't think he's biased on air, though. If you follow him on Twitter, he's definitely biased, however.

JermaineDye05
02-19-2010, 11:49 PM
I imagine that after KW decided to stop playing Boras' games and take the offer off the table, the phone call between him and Boras went something like this...

4GGL3oCZkyY


the late great John Candy, quite obviously, representing Borass.

JermaineDye05
02-19-2010, 11:50 PM
You can tell Chuck is a huge Sox fan. I don't think he's biased on air, though. If you follow him on Twitter, he's definitely biased, however.

I don't think he is either. I naturally assumed he was a Sox fan considering he's always been doing White Sox postgame, as well as covering the team during ST.

Rdy2PlayBall
02-19-2010, 11:52 PM
You can tell Chuck is a huge Sox fan. I don't think he's biased on air, though. If you follow him on Twitter, he's definitely biased, however.I remember in 2008, the Cubs were playing the Sox, and he was in the outfield stands watching the game. When the Cubs won, the crowd in the background included him in the newspaper. It was funny, because the other reporters joked around sayings stuff like "look at this guy, he doesn't look to happy" ... I always remember him for that. That kind of proves hes a Sox fan if he isn't happy in a walk-off win if it's against the Sox.

Also, he does the Sox Drawer. I think everyone knows he's a Sox fan, but he's also a good reporter and doesn't show bias when it's comes between the two teams and his analysis. Pat Boyle and Garfien never really disappoint me... it's that David Kaplan that gets on my nerves sometimes.

JermaineDye05
02-19-2010, 11:54 PM
I remember in 2008, the Cubs were playing the Sox, and he was in the outfield stands watching the game. When the Cubs won, the crowd in the background included him in the newspaper. It was funny, because the other reporters joked around sayings stuff like "look at this guy, he doesn't look to happy" ... I always remember him for that. That kind of proves hes a Sox fan if he isn't happy in a walk-off win if it's against the Sox.

Also, he does the Sox Drawer. I think everyone knows he's a Sox fan, but he's also a good reporter and doesn't show bias when it's comes between the two teams and his analysis. Pat Boyle and Garfien never really disappoint me... it's that David Kaplan that gets on my nerves sometimes.

I missed this one. I assume this was the game where Ramirez hit the walk-off off of Linebrink. I called that one, as well as the brutal inning by Dotel. However, it doesn't take much to predict a walk-off homerun when you have Linebrink pitching the 9th.

Rdy2PlayBall
02-19-2010, 11:58 PM
I missed this one. I assume this was the game where Ramirez hit the walk-off off of Linebrink. I called that one, as well as the brutal inning by Dotel. However, it doesn't take much to predict a walk-off homerun when you have Linebrink pitching the 9th.Very true. :tongue:
I sure hope he produces to his capabilities this year, because if he does, the Sox pitching staff will be unstoppable.
And I'm pretty sure it was that game.

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 12:03 AM
I missed this one. I assume this was the game where Ramirez hit the walk-off off of Linebrink. I called that one, as well as the brutal inning by Dotel. However, it doesn't take much to predict a walk-off homerun when you have Linebrink pitching the 9th.

That was a complete and utter fail of a game. I thought the postgame thread would explode.

Although at that point in time, Linebrink was still very good. He just wasn't a closer.

Rohan
02-20-2010, 12:10 AM
I hate the name of this thread. It's so misleading. :mad:

Tragg
02-20-2010, 12:13 AM
I open this up to get some info on the Damon signing, and I have to wade through pages about some dude named Chuck, and still don't know exactly what's going on.
Opening this thread is like a parallel universe.
LOL
Sign Johnny, Sign.
But most of all:

Play Ball!

DSpivack
02-20-2010, 12:20 AM
I remember in 2008, the Cubs were playing the Sox, and he was in the outfield stands watching the game. When the Cubs won, the crowd in the background included him in the newspaper. It was funny, because the other reporters joked around sayings stuff like "look at this guy, he doesn't look to happy" ... I always remember him for that. That kind of proves hes a Sox fan if he isn't happy in a walk-off win if it's against the Sox.

Also, he does the Sox Drawer. I think everyone knows he's a Sox fan, but he's also a good reporter and doesn't show bias when it's comes between the two teams and his analysis. Pat Boyle and Garfien never really disappoint me... it's that David Kaplan that gets on my nerves sometimes.

Sometimes? That ****ing jagbag ******* is the reason I don't watch Chicago Tribune Live. He comes off as a smarmy know-it-all who thinks his **** don't stink. Almost as obnoxious as Mark Giangreco.

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 12:23 AM
Sometimes? That ****ing jagbag ******* is the reason I don't watch Chicago Tribune Live. He comes off as a smarmy know-it-all who thinks his **** don't stink. Almost as obnoxious as Mark Giangreco.

I don't think we really know how you feel about him. :redneck

And Kaplan's name is strikingly similar to one of my professors last semester, so whenever he's mentioned, I think, "What's my Advanced Seminar professor got to do with the Sox?" I do a double take every time!

oeo
02-20-2010, 12:28 AM
I open this up to get some info on the Damon signing, and I have to wade through pages about some dude named Chuck, and still don't know exactly what's going on.
Opening this thread is like a parallel universe.
LOL
Sign Johnny, Sign.
But most of all:

Play Ball!

To get you up to date: Kenny pulled the Sox offer because he says what Boras is asking for is "unrealistic". However, he says they're still very interested and if Boras/Damon would like to make the deal, the Sox would be willing, but negotiations are finished. Which seems to be Kenny telling Damon that they want him, you just need to tell your agent to stop ****ing around.

Also, after that happened, suddenly the Braves were back in and the Rays could be looking to sign him under the radar. No one knows what the hell is going on.

Tragg
02-20-2010, 12:38 AM
To get you up to date: Kenny pulled the Sox offer because he says what Boras is asking for is "unrealistic". However, he says they're still very interested and if Boras/Damon would like to make the deal, the Sox would be willing, but negotiations are finished. Which seems to be Kenny telling Damon that they want him, you just need to tell your agent to stop ****ing around.

Also, after that happened, suddenly the Braves were back in and the Rays could be looking to sign him under the radar. No one knows what the hell is going on.
Thanks - sounds like the usual Boras dog and pony show, playing everyone off against each other.
I'll check back on it in a couple of days - probably be on thread 8 then.
We could use Johnny, though.

GoSox2K3
02-20-2010, 12:38 AM
So does anybody think KW has a plan B, or are we stuck with the awful rotating DH?

Plan A for this year is to stick with the awful rotating DH lineup and hope that Andruw Jones is magically rejuvenated.

Plan B is to hope we can get some hitter in a mid season trade for some top prospects (and say it's okay because our prospects never amount to anything anyway).

Plan C is that if the Sox are far enough out of the race in June or July they'll say getting another hitter won't make a difference.

NLaloosh
02-20-2010, 01:32 AM
I love the WHITE SOX !!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry. I just had too get that out.

DonnieDarko
02-20-2010, 01:35 AM
Now it just seems that everything is in a "wait and see" mode. I now get the feeling that we simply won't land him. Shame.

StillMissOzzie
02-20-2010, 01:57 AM
Here's my new hypothetical scenario:
Damon & Bora$ take the $7M offer from Detroit instead of the Sox' $6M.
Mrs. Damon tells Johnny AGAIN that she doesn't want to live in Detroit, dumps his ass, and takes half of the $7M
Johnny ends up alone with $3.5M and mired in Detroit instead of $6M from the Sox and living large in Chicago, remaining happily married.

You read it here first. :redneck

SMO
:o::bandance::gulp:

KRS1
02-20-2010, 01:59 AM
Here's my new hypothetical scenario:
Damon & Bora$ take the $7M offer from Detroit instead of the Sox' $6M.
Mrs. Damon tells Johnny AGAIN that she doesn't want to live in Detroit, dumps his ass, and takes half of the $7M
Johnny ends up alone with $3.5M and mired in Detroit instead of $6M from the Sox and living large in Chicago, remaining happily married.

You read it here first. :redneck

SMO
:o::bandance::gulp:

That was... ummm... horrible?

NLaloosh
02-20-2010, 08:51 AM
KW: So, what did he say?
Rick Hahn: Detroit made the offer.
KW: how much?
RH: 7 mil. for one.
KW: are you positive?
RH: yes
KW: your source is absolutely certain ?
RH: yes and he says 3 mil. is deferred
KW: really? Awesome!
RH: yeah. he gets 2 more in 2011 and the last mil. in 2012
KW: oh this is great! We can really **** with them both now!
RH: what are you gonna do?
KW: watch..ha ha ha...this...let's make them an offer...ha ha ha
RH: are you serious?
KW: hell yeah..this is great..ha ha ha...let's offer 6 mil...ha ha ha... with 3 mil. in 2010, 1 in 2011, 1 in ha ha ha 2012 and the last in 2013...ha ha ha
RH: ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

KW: then...ha ha ha....when Detroit either increases their offer or all the media's reported our offer...then..ha ha ha...this is the best part..ha ha ha.....we'll pull the offer....ha ha ha ha ha.......
RH: a ha ha ha ha ha aha ha .....

The Dude
02-20-2010, 09:12 AM
KW: So, what did he say?
Rick Hahn: Detroit made the offer.
KW: how much?
RH: 7 mil. for one.
KW: are you positive?
RH: yes
KW: your source is absolutely certain ?
RH: yes and he says 3 mil. is deferred
KW: really? Awesome!
RH: yeah. he gets 2 more in 2011 and the last mil. in 2012
KW: oh this is great! We can really **** with them both now!
RH: what are you gonna do?
KW: watch..ha ha ha...this...let's make them an offer...ha ha ha
RH: are you serious?
KW: hell yeah..this is great..ha ha ha...let's offer 6 mil...ha ha ha... with 3 mil. in 2010, 1 in 2011, 1 in ha ha ha 2012 and the last in 2013...ha ha ha
RH: ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

KW: then...ha ha ha....when Detroit either increases their offer or all the media's reported our offer...then..ha ha ha...this is the best part..ha ha ha.....we'll pull the offer....ha ha ha ha ha.......
RH: a ha ha ha ha ha aha ha .....

ha ha ha ha ha aha ha

Jaysox
02-20-2010, 09:13 AM
KW: So, what did he say?
Rick Hahn: Detroit made the offer.
KW: how much?
RH: 7 mil. for one.
KW: are you positive?
RH: yes
KW: your source is absolutely certain ?
RH: yes and he says 3 mil. is deferred
KW: really? Awesome!
RH: yeah. he gets 2 more in 2011 and the last mil. in 2012
KW: oh this is great! We can really **** with them both now!
RH: what are you gonna do?
KW: watch..ha ha ha...this...let's make them an offer...ha ha ha
RH: are you serious?
KW: hell yeah..this is great..ha ha ha...let's offer 6 mil...ha ha ha... with 3 mil. in 2010, 1 in 2011, 1 in ha ha ha 2012 and the last in 2013...ha ha ha
RH: ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

KW: then...ha ha ha....when Detroit either increases their offer or all the media's reported our offer...then..ha ha ha...this is the best part..ha ha ha.....we'll pull the offer....ha ha ha ha ha.......
RH: a ha ha ha ha ha aha ha .....

LOL... oh lordy do we EVER need ST to get here soon...

DumpJerry
02-20-2010, 11:24 AM
I hate the name of this thread. It's so misleading. :mad:
Thank you. I am evil.:D:

Vestigio
02-20-2010, 11:40 AM
In response to the Sox 'pulling the offer from the table', the Braves GM said "Nothing has changed on our end." Yep, Boras is fictiously opening up the market again for Damon

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100219&content_id=8103326&vkey=news_atl&fext=.jsp&c_id=atl

DumpJerry
02-20-2010, 11:54 AM
If I see Damon working the drive-through at my local Wendy's I'll tell him I'll take some fries with that.

CLR01
02-20-2010, 11:54 AM
In response to the Sox 'pulling the offer from the table', the Braves GM said "Nothing has changed on our end." Yep, Boras is fictiously opening up the market again for Damon

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100219&content_id=8103326&vkey=news_atl&fext=.jsp&c_id=atl

How long before Borass starts whining that the teams are unfairly using the media to negotiate?

cards press box
02-20-2010, 11:55 AM
Man, this Johnny Damon soap opera has certainly dragged out, almost beyond reason. I find the difference between Damon and his former Yankee teammate Hideki Matsui quite interesting. Both players were essentially looking at the same market (i.e., primary DH with occasional starts in the outfield). Both are lefty hitters. Matsui brings a little more power; Damon brings a little more speed.

Matsui surveyed the market and made his decision rather promptly. Damon is dragging this whole process out perhaps into spring training. And you know what? With regard to the financial terms, Damon may do as well as Matsui but (with talks of deferred money from all potential suitors) will probably do worse. What's more, Matsui ended up on the L.A. Angels, a perennial contender. Unless Damon signs with the Sox, he won't end up with a club as good or better than the Angels.

At this point, Matsui's approach to free agency appears much more sound than Damon's approach.

DumpJerry
02-20-2010, 12:05 PM
Damon's strongest skill is charisma. Unfortunately, charisma is not a baseball skill.

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 12:07 PM
In response to the Sox 'pulling the offer from the table', the Braves GM said "Nothing has changed on our end." Yep, Boras is fictiously opening up the market again for Damon

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100219&content_id=8103326&vkey=news_atl&fext=.jsp&c_id=atl

Ha. What an idiot. I hope everything continues to blow up in Boras' face. It would give me a grim sense of satisfaction if Damon ends up not signing here.

Hitmen77
02-20-2010, 12:07 PM
....and meanwhile, Tigers players are keeping a candlelight vigil by that empty locker in their spring training clubhouse. :lol:

TheOldRoman
02-20-2010, 12:12 PM
KW: So, what did he say?
Rick Hahn: Detroit made the offer.
KW: how much?
RH: 7 mil. for one.
KW: are you positive?
RH: yes
KW: your source is absolutely certain ?
RH: yes and he says 3 mil. is deferred
KW: really? Awesome!
RH: yeah. he gets 2 more in 2011 and the last mil. in 2012
KW: oh this is great! We can really **** with them both now!
RH: what are you gonna do?
KW: watch..ha ha ha...this...let's make them an offer...ha ha ha
RH: are you serious?
KW: hell yeah..this is great..ha ha ha...let's offer 6 mil...ha ha ha... with 3 mil. in 2010, 1 in 2011, 1 in ha ha ha 2012 and the last in 2013...ha ha ha
RH: ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

KW: then...ha ha ha....when Detroit either increases their offer or all the media's reported our offer...then..ha ha ha...this is the best part..ha ha ha.....we'll pull the offer....ha ha ha ha ha.......
RH: a ha ha ha ha ha aha ha .....:rolleyes: Appealing to the intellectually deficient? It obviously worked.

Rockabilly
02-20-2010, 01:00 PM
Since the Sox had 6M to spend on Damon.. I like to see them use that money and sign Dye for about 3.5m and than use the rest to sign a vet pitcher.

soxinem1
02-20-2010, 01:06 PM
Since the Sox had 6M to spend on Damon.. I like to see them use that money and sign Dye for about 3.5m and than use the rest to sign a vet pitcher.

Other than Kiko Calero, who many think has arm issues as we speak, are there any vet pitchers still available we would even want?

We need a LH HR bat. I'd rather gamble on Blalock if the Damon soap opera ends up with him putting his **** in the reserved locker DET has waiting for him.

Rockabilly
02-20-2010, 01:12 PM
Other than Kiko Calero, who many think has arm issues as we speak, are there any vet pitchers still available we would even want?

We need a LH HR bat. I'd rather gamble on Blalock if the Damon soap opera ends up with him putting his **** in the reserved locker DET has waiting for him.


Pedro Martinez is the pitcher I would like to get. I can't trust Freddy being 100% healthy for a full season.

I like to see the Sox make a trade for Scott Downs of the Blue Jays. We need another lefty in the pen.

DumpJerry
02-20-2010, 01:17 PM
I won't believe any of these rumors that the Sox were/are pursuing Damon until Otis tells us that it is happening.

Corlose 15
02-20-2010, 01:18 PM
Pedro Martinez is the pitcher I would like to get. I can't trust Freddy being 100% healthy for a full season.

I like to see the Sox make a trade for Scott Downs of the Blue Jays. We need another lefty in the pen.

So you're concerned about Freddy's ability to stay healthy and your solution is Pedro Martinez?:?:

I don't understand why people are so convinced that Freddy is going to break down. It's not like he's been dealing with injuries for the past two years. He had one injury which was supposed to take about 18 months to get healthy and he tried to rush back at the end of 2008. If that shoulder is finally healthy like we've been told and he's gotten another offseason of work to strenghten it, then its not unreasonable to assume he could stay healthy for the whole season.

Even if he does break down, the Sox aren't going to waste money on Martinez, they'll just either slide Hudson into the rotation or call him up from Charlotte.

This team needs another LH bat WAY more than they need a 7th starter.

JermaineDye05
02-20-2010, 01:22 PM
Pedro Martinez is the pitcher I would like to get. I can't trust Freddy being 100% healthy for a full season.

I like to see the Sox make a trade for Scott Downs of the Blue Jays. We need another lefty in the pen.

Save the money and give Hudson a shot before you go to Pedro.

Rockabilly
02-20-2010, 01:24 PM
So you're concerned about Freddy's ability to stay healthy and your solution is Pedro Martinez?:?:

I don't understand why people are so convinced that Freddy is going to break down. It's not like he's been dealing with injuries for the past two years. He had one injury which was supposed to take about 18 months to get healthy and he tried to rush back at the end of 2008. If that shoulder is finally healthy like we've been told and he's gotten another offseason of work to strenghten it, then its not unreasonable to assume he could stay healthy for the whole season.

Even if he does break down, the Sox aren't going to waste money on Martinez, they'll just either slide Hudson into the rotation or call him up from Charlotte.

This team needs another LH bat WAY more than they need a 7th starter.

This teams needs another lefty on the pen before they need a LH bat.

Can never have to many starters on a team for a full season.

Rockabilly
02-20-2010, 01:25 PM
Save the money and give Hudson a shot before you go to Pedro.

I like to see Hudson in the pen for a full season. Sorta like Buehrle did in 2000.

Pablo_Honey
02-20-2010, 01:26 PM
Pedro Martinez is the pitcher I would like to get. I can't trust Freddy being 100% healthy for a full season.
Dan Hudson says hi. A backup 5th starter is a luxury we don't need to afford at the moment. We are set for the rotation and offense is a bigger need. Besides, Pedro looked uninspiring in the world series. He has lost every bit of velocity he had in the past and at this point, he is just as reliable as Freddy. Freddy's our 5th starter and if he goes down, Hudson steps in and if he stinks, THEN sign Pedro. I won't have any issues with that.

I like to see the Sox make a trade for Scott Downs of the Blue Jays. We need another lefty in the pen.
That would be nice but it's unclear what return Jays want for Downs. I'd assume they would want hefty return for him given that there is no need to trade him.

DirtySox
02-20-2010, 02:19 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html

Noneck
02-20-2010, 02:20 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html


Thats not good news.

soltrain21
02-20-2010, 02:21 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html

Well, at least we socked it to Boras! That's what really counts.

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 02:23 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html

Drat.

MtGrnwdSoxFan
02-20-2010, 02:25 PM
Drat.

Look at it this way....who needs Damon when we got Kotsay and Jones? Two players are always better than one, right?

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 02:25 PM
Look at it this way....who needs Damon when we got Kotsay and Jones? Two players are always better than one, right?

Ha...I feel so much better now. :cool:

cards press box
02-20-2010, 02:28 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html

In his answer, AJ says he hasn't spoken with Damon and doesn't know where he is going to sign. The whole exchange doesn't reveal much information other than AJ growing weary of being asked where Damon is going to sign. Come to think of it, I've grown weary of the topic myself.

The Sox deadline is the opening of camp tommorrow, right? Let's see if Damon makes a decision between the Sox and Tigers by then.

DirtySox
02-20-2010, 02:31 PM
Look at it this way....who needs Damon when we got Kotsay and Jones? Two players are always better than one, right?

More like 3. Don't forget Omar. Ozzie said he will DH too!



Mod Edit: Don't copy pictures from other Sox sites.

ilsox7
02-20-2010, 02:37 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html

I don't think Damon will end up here, but Merkin said AJ was not serious when he said that.

asindc
02-20-2010, 02:52 PM
AJ says it's a no go on Damon.

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/02/pierzynski-doubtful-of-damon-signing-with-sox.html

That is not what that article quotes him as saying.

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 02:55 PM
That is not what that article quotes him as saying.

He says he doesn't know where Damon's signing, "but it's not going to be here." :?:

edit - Never mind, I'm all confused now...

oeo
02-20-2010, 02:56 PM
That is not what that article quotes him as saying.

Nice to see Mark Gonzalez took a page out of Joe Cowley's book.

He says he hasn't talked to him, but he's not signing here. That means the only thing that could possibly be telling AJ that Damon is not signing here is Kenny's "pulling the deal off the table." This means nothing.

ilsox7
02-20-2010, 02:59 PM
FWIW, someone at Motownsports said the Detroit radio station reports the Tigers have given Damon until tomorrow to sign.

Slappy
02-20-2010, 02:59 PM
Well, at least we socked it to Boras! That's what really counts.

:redneck

skobabe8
02-20-2010, 03:00 PM
He says he doesn't know where Damon's signing, "but it's not going to be here." :?:

edit - Never mind, I'm all confused now...

I dont think AJ knows.

JD probably wont sign with us, but its not for sure yet.

GoGoCrede
02-20-2010, 03:01 PM
I dont think AJ knows.

JD probably wont sign with us, but its not for sure yet.

Thanks. I'll be glad when this circus is over.

SoxGirl4Life
02-20-2010, 03:03 PM
Thanks. I'll be glad when this circus is over.

You and me both. Its like something I really really want, then halfway through the process wonder if I ever really wanted it in the first place. Then its usually followed by cheesecake, which I always know I want! :tongue:

LoveYourSuit
02-20-2010, 03:04 PM
If the Sox would have pursued Matsui aggresively, all this nonesense and circus with Boras could have been avoided.

asindc
02-20-2010, 03:07 PM
If the Sox would have pursued Matsui aggresively, all this nonesense and circus with Boras could have been avoided.

How do you know they did not?

oeo
02-20-2010, 03:08 PM
How do you know they did not?

IIRC, they did, he just didn't want to come here.

LoveYourSuit
02-20-2010, 03:12 PM
How do you know they did not?

Because he did not sign here.

guillen4life13
02-20-2010, 03:14 PM
I guess it's alright for me to do this. The Johnny Damon Threads now are at:
:tomatoawardX 17. Can you believe it?

voodoochile
02-20-2010, 03:15 PM
If the Sox would have pursued Matsui aggresively, all this nonesense and circus with Boras could have been avoided.

The past is for losers and cowards.

oeo
02-20-2010, 03:28 PM
Because he did not sign here.

That's the only reasoning? :?:

I remember the Sox being very interested in December, Matsui did not seem to return that interest.

kobo
02-20-2010, 03:30 PM
Because he did not sign here.
So that indicates the Sox didn't aggressively pursuit him? Yeah, that makes sense.

LoveYourSuit
02-20-2010, 03:38 PM
The past is for losers and cowards.


Why, because you say so?

Expand on this thought please....:scratch:

asindc
02-20-2010, 03:40 PM
Because he did not sign here.

Reasoning fail.

LoveYourSuit
02-20-2010, 03:42 PM
That's the only reasoning? :?:

I remember the Sox being very interested in December, Matsui did not seem to return that interest.


The Sox were mentioned having interest, even the Japan media took note of it but nothing came out of it. I heard no buzz or anything regarding it, or even this back and forth circus we are seeing with Damon today.

IMO, Matsui filled the Sox need 10X more than what Damon does. They should have gone the "full court press" on him, and paid the extra bucks to get him here. It's all about the money for these guys, that's the bottom line.

voodoochile
02-20-2010, 03:44 PM
Why, because you say so?

Expand on this thought please....:scratch:

Just a different way of saying "no use crying over spilled milk". I don't see any point in dwelling on things that didn't happen and cannot happen now. It's pointless.

In addition, as others have pointed out, there is no way to prove that KW didn't pursue Matsui aggressively and just got outbid or not selected for other reasons.

The comment was actually made famous by Mike Ditka.

Daver
02-20-2010, 03:45 PM
Because he did not sign here.

Brilliant!

voodoochile
02-20-2010, 03:45 PM
The Sox were mentioned having interest, even the Japan media took note of it but nothing came out of it. I heard no buzz or anything regarding it, or even this back and forth circus we are seeing with Damon today.

IMO, Matsui filled the Sox need 10X more than what Damon does. They should have gone the "full court press" on him, and paid the extra bucks to get him here. It's all about the money for these guys, that's the bottom line.

They've got 105M invested currently and were willing to add to it and you're whining about them being cheap.

It boggles the mind...

soxinem1
02-20-2010, 03:49 PM
So that indicates the Sox didn't aggressively pursuit him? Yeah, that makes sense.

No use crying over a guy we did not get.

If Damon falls through, we can start threads on Delgado and Blalock.

Thing is, will they generate 700+ responses over four or five threads????

doublem23
02-20-2010, 03:50 PM
They've got 105M invested currently and were willing to add to it and you're whining about them being cheap.

It boggles the mind...

Not that I agree with the Matsui Didn't Sign Here so they didn't try line of thought, BUT, this is still a woefully incomplete team. It'd be like buying a Lamborghini and then driving around on the rims because you didn't want to spend any more on tires.

We have a Lamborghini pitching staff and no wheels for an offense.

ilsox7
02-20-2010, 03:51 PM
No use crying over a guy we did not get.

If Damon falls through, we can start threads on Delgado and Blalock.

Thing is, will they generate 700+ responses over four or five threads????

Delgado is out for 4 more months.

LoveYourSuit
02-20-2010, 03:52 PM
They've got 105M invested currently and were willing to add to it and you're whining about them being cheap.

It boggles the mind...


Not calling them cheap, but more like a half ass effort to complete the package. What they have done with the offense it's a complete dis-service to the pitching staff which on paper looks to be as good as any.


What's the difference from going from $105m to $110m?

If it solves the HUGE hole which i the middle of the order, then go for it.

Give yourself the best chance to win a championship out of the gate, that's all I'm saying.

LoveYourSuit
02-20-2010, 03:57 PM
Not that I agree with the Matsui Didn't Sign Here so they didn't try line of thought, BUT, this is still a woefully incomplete team. It'd be like buying a Lamborghini and then driving around on the rims because you didn't want to spend any more on tires.

We have a Lamborghini pitching staff and no wheels for an offense.

Good analogy, couldn't have said it better.

Not saying Damon will solve all issues, but it's so much better than the ridiculous plan in place right now. But it's almost like the Sox are stuck in this Damon/Boras circus as a sign of desparation because of other moves they failed to do in the past.

voodoochile
02-20-2010, 03:59 PM
Not that I agree with the Matsui Didn't Sign Here so they didn't try line of thought, BUT, this is still a woefully incomplete team. It'd be like buying a Lamborghini and then driving around on the rims because you didn't want to spend any more on tires.

We have a Lamborghini pitching staff and no wheels for an offense.

Well, I disagree that the team doesn't have any tires on offense, but we can beat that horse to death and neither of us will change our minds.

I also think the melodramatic statements that get thrown around like "woefully incomplete" make it hard to take the conversation seriously. This is the most complete team KW has put together since 2005.

It might be missing a bat, but then again, it might not be. In addition, for all we know by this time tomorrow or Monday Damon will be Sox property or Dye will a month from now. The point is KW is staying active and if he thinks it's a huge problem, he'll find a way to fix it.

doublem23
02-20-2010, 04:04 PM
Not saying Damon will solve all issues, but it's so much better than the ridiculous plan in place right now. But it's almost like the Sox are stuck in this Damon/Boras circus as a sign of desparation because of other moves they failed to do in the past.

Really, I don't even give a **** what Damon brings to the Sox, at this point I just need some peace of mind that they haven't lost their god damn minds. There have been other times I've disagreed with the decisions made regarding personnel, but at least I always understood their rationale. Take Josh Fields last year, for example, I am sure if you go back through my posts from last off-season, I was not too wild about the Josh Fields Experience, but I understood why they were doing it... He showed some skills his rookie season, he put his dues in in the minors, he was a former 1st round pick, OK, fine, I got that. This DH thing boggles my mind, (A) because they don't seem to be worried about it and (B) Ozzie seems to prefer this.

decolores9628
02-20-2010, 04:06 PM
Really, I don't even give a **** what Damon brings to the Sox, at this point I just need some peace of mind that they haven't lost their god damn minds. There have been other times I've disagreed with the decisions made regarding personnel, but at least I always understood their rationale. Take Josh Fields last year, for example, I am sure if you go back through my posts from last off-season, I was not too wild about the Josh Fields Experience, but I understood why they were doing it... He showed some skills his rookie season, he put his dues in in the minors, he was a former 1st round pick, OK, fine, I got that. This DH thing boggles my mind, (A) because they don't seem to be worried about it and (B) Ozzie seems to prefer this.

I have nothing to add to this but I completely agree

doublem23
02-20-2010, 04:07 PM
I also think the melodramatic statements that get thrown around like "woefully incomplete" make it hard to take the conversation seriously. This is the most complete team KW has put together since 2005.

Except for that 2006 team that was, on paper, way better than the 2005 team.

This team is complete? There's 1 reliable arm in the bullpen, our offense is centered around a past-his-prime 1B, an OF whose career has been plagued by injuries, another OF whose turned into a lazy $60 million liability since signing a huge deal, and a DH whose career has fallen off a cliff since MLB started testing for steroids and couldn't even hit in Texas.

If any other team in the Central assembled this ragtag crew, we'd be laughing them into 3rd place, at best.

voodoochile
02-20-2010, 04:12 PM
Except for that 2006 team that was, on paper, way better than the 2005 team.

This team is complete? There's 1 reliable arm in the bullpen, our offense is centered around a past-his-prime 1B, an OF whose career has been plagued by injuries, another OF whose turned into a lazy $60 million liability since signing a huge deal, and a DH whose career has fallen off a cliff since MLB started testing for steroids and couldn't even hit in Texas.

If any other team in the Central assembled this ragtag crew, we'd be laughing them into 3rd place, at best.

Like I said, we will have to agree to disagree. I think this outlook highlights all of the potential negatives to an extreme at the expense of the potential positives that are as equally likely to happen and leaves no room for discussion.

I could start listing all the opposite viewpoints to everything you've typed, but you already know them and choose to see things the other way. There's no point in continuing the discussion.

BRDSR
02-20-2010, 04:16 PM
Not calling them cheap, but more like a half ass effort to complete the package. What they have done with the offense it's a complete dis-service to the pitching staff which on paper looks to be as good as any.


What's the difference from going from $105m to $110m?

If it solves the HUGE hole which i the middle of the order, then go for it.

Give yourself the best chance to win a championship out of the gate, that's all I'm saying.

Just to play devil's advocate, they may have reliable indicators that suggest it is the difference between breaking even and taking a $5 million loss.

That said, if Damon really is the piece of the puzzle that gets you from 2nd or 3rd to 1st, I can't imagine that the increased revenue from the playoff run/playoffs wouldn't make up the difference.

Frater Perdurabo
02-20-2010, 04:18 PM
The door hasn't been shut on Damon. Well, maybe it's been closed but it sure isn't locked. It's not locked until he signs elsewhere.

Even if the Sox go into the season with this roster, which I expect will win 85 games, they still have the ability to add an impact bat midseason. And if it's the right bat, it could push them over the top.

KW often makes his move before July 31: Carl Crawford by June 15!

Corlose 15
02-20-2010, 04:19 PM
http://www.freep.com/article/20100220/SPORTS02/100220015/1050/rss15

If the Tigers are offering 1/7 and the Sox are offering 1/6 and both have deferrals, Damon would be a fool not to come to Chicago.

BRDSR
02-20-2010, 04:27 PM
http://www.freep.com/article/20100220/SPORTS02/100220015/1050/rss15

If the Tigers are offering 1/7 and the Sox are offering 1/6 and both have deferrals, Damon would be a fool not to come to Chicago.

If representing an athlete as agent is anything like representing a client as a lawyer (and I imagine it is), then Boras has control over the means and methods of negotiations but Damon (obviously) has control over who he ultimately signs with and for how much. Maybe he's expressed a desire to sign with the Sox under the terms offered but Boras is asking him for some time to see if he can get the Sox offer higher.

I'm not at all discouraged.

asindc
02-20-2010, 04:29 PM
Except for that 2006 team that was, on paper, way better than the 2005 team.

This team is complete? There's 1 reliable arm in the bullpen, our offense is centered around a past-his-prime 1B, an OF whose career has been plagued by injuries, another OF whose turned into a lazy $60 million liability since signing a huge deal, and a DH whose career has fallen off a cliff since MLB started testing for steroids and couldn't even hit in Texas.

If any other team in the Central assembled this ragtag crew, we'd be laughing them into 3rd place, at best.

This team is complete? There's 1 reliable arm in the bullpen, our offense includes a weak-hitting 3B, an OF whose career has been plagued by injuries, another OF whose turned into a lazy high-profile liability since being traded for, and a 2B who got benched for fat Ronnie Belliard in the heat of a pennant race.

If any other team in the Central assembled this ragtag crew, we'd be laughing them into 3rd place, at best.




This is the Twinkees' fan's version of your post. Note that it does not even mention their starting rotation, which might turn out to be the 2nd worst in the division.

asindc
02-20-2010, 04:31 PM
If representing an athlete as agent is anything like representing a client as a lawyer (and I imagine it is), then Boras has control over the means and methods of negotiations but Damon (obviously) has control over who he ultimately signs with and for how much. Maybe he's expressed a desire to sign with the Sox under the terms offered but Boras is asking him for some time to see if he can get the Sox offer higher.

I'm not at all discouraged.

The client in any agent/client relationship, legal or otherwise, is the boss. Some clients either forget this or were never sure of it in the first place.

BRDSR
02-20-2010, 04:34 PM
The client in any agent/client relationship, legal or otherwise, is the boss. Some clients either forget this or were never sure of it in the first place.

Ha, good point. If any sleezeball agent could/would manipulate a client like that, I bet it'd be Boras.

mzh
02-20-2010, 04:42 PM
The client in any agent/client relationship, legal or otherwise, is the boss. Some clients either forget this or were never sure of it in the first place.
I remember a few years ago when Boras was negotiating an extension for A-Rod, he decided to tell everybody that they were opting out of the last 3 years of the 2000 deal. Rodriguez then got pretty pissed off, told Boras to shut it, and negotiated a huge extension himself.

Hopefully we get a similar situation in which Damon makes his own decision after realizing Boras screwed the pooch twice playing hardball first with the Yankees, and then with us at the wrong time.

Maybe he's holding out to see if he can break Peavy's post record. 270 to go!

Sockinchisox
02-20-2010, 04:43 PM
Damon and Tigers near agreement.

http://twitter.com/TBrownYahoo/status/9401993648

Corlose 15
02-20-2010, 04:46 PM
Damon and Tigers near agreement.

http://twitter.com/TBrownYahoo/status/9401993648

Unless the Tigers upped their offer I say Damon comes out behind in all of this.

beasly213
02-20-2010, 04:47 PM
Damon and Tigers near agreement.

http://twitter.com/TBrownYahoo/status/9401993648

They have been close for weeks now. :rolleyes:

Sockinchisox
02-20-2010, 04:48 PM
Done.

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX/status/9402198203

mzh
02-20-2010, 04:49 PM
Done.

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX/status/9402198203
Anyone else reporting this?

beasly213
02-20-2010, 04:50 PM
Done.

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX/status/9402198203

Oh snap.

Rohan
02-20-2010, 04:50 PM
Damon and Tigers near agreement.

http://twitter.com/TBrownYahoo/status/9401993648

WWJJD? What does that even mean?

mzh
02-20-2010, 04:50 PM
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/02/tigers-to-sign-damon.html

Meh :shrug:

SoxGirl4Life
02-20-2010, 04:50 PM
Done.

http://twitter.com/JimBowdenXMFOX/status/9402198203

Thank GOD! :gulp: