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View Full Version : KW suggests the NL stinks


Fenway
11-16-2009, 05:44 PM
Hard not to agree with KW

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/16/sports/baseball/16baseball.html

DumpJerry
11-16-2009, 05:57 PM
We've been saying that for years.

Twins_Morneau
11-16-2009, 11:49 PM
NL sucks because the sCrUBS are in it.

DrCrawdad
11-17-2009, 01:29 AM
We've been saying that for years.

And with this article Les Grobstein's (and other Cubbie fans) hair starts on fire.

Fenway
11-17-2009, 02:47 AM
We've been saying that for years.

The Phillies have figured this out. They are an AL team in the NL

DumpJerry
11-17-2009, 07:46 AM
NL sucks because the sCrUBS are in it.

And with this article Les Grobstein's (and other Cubbie fans) hair starts on fire.
You guy do realize that there are 16 teams in the National League?










Yeah, just as I thought. You didn't.:rolleyes:

DrCrawdad
11-17-2009, 08:13 AM
You guy do realize that there are 16 teams in the National League?

Yeah, just as I thought. You didn't.:rolleyes:

Haha very funny. Where can I catch your act at a local comedy club?

But considering I live in the Chicago-area most of my conversations about baseball are with fans of either Chicago team. And the contention of fans of the Chicago NL team is that the AL is no better than the NL. In fact, the article strikes a chord with me because when the Phillies won game one I heard Les going on and on about how this was somehow proof that the AL was not any better than the NL.

* AL has won 13 straight All-Star Games
* AL has won 8 of the last 12 World Series
* AL has won .566 of interleague games since 2005

These facts have a well-known AL bias...

SOXSINCE'70
11-17-2009, 10:25 AM
NL sucks because the sCrUBS are in it.

In my opinion, the NL sucks because there is no DH.

UChicagoHP
11-17-2009, 11:46 AM
The AL is slightly better due to the DH, certainly not leaps and bounds better, although one could argue that due to the ridiculously deep pockets of the New York, Boston, Los Angeles, Seattle, Detroit, Toronto, and yes, the Chicago franchises, the balance of power will continue to slide towards the AL.

twsoxfan5
11-17-2009, 12:22 PM
The AL is slightly better due to the DH, certainly not leaps and bounds better, although one could argue that due to the ridiculously deep pockets of the New York, Boston, Los Angeles, Seattle, Detroit, Toronto, and yes, the Chicago franchises, the balance of power will continue to slide towards the AL.

I disagree. I would say that the AL is leaps and bounds better and it is not just the DH.

downstairs
11-17-2009, 01:49 PM
I disagree. I would say that the AL is leaps and bounds better and it is not just the DH.

I think its mostly luck. This stuff goes in cycles, and has even after the DH. The NL will be dominant again one of these years- and will hold on to it for a decade or so.

Pear-Zin-Ski
11-17-2009, 02:17 PM
I was tempted to say, "Well of course the NL is weaker! The Yanks and the Red Sox play in the AL and the Pirates and Nationals play in the NL." But it's not as obvious as you would think. Just for fun let's take a look at what have been the 5 "worst" teams this decade in each league, IMO of course.

NL
SD: 769-852 .474
Cincy: 751-869 .464
Milw: 741-878 .458
MTL/Wash: 711-908 .439
Pit: 681-936 .421

AL
TOR: 805-814 .497
TEX: 776-844 .479
BAL: 698-920 .431
TB: 694-923 .429
KC: 672-948 .415

The worst record this decade belongs to the Royals, but the Pirates are not far behind. What is surprising is that the Jays and to less an extent the Orioles have been able to somewhat compete against the might of the AL East powerhouses. What excuse do the Brewers, the Reds and the Pirates have? I guess one could make the claim that the Cards and Cubs have been great teams this decade, but nowhere near as good as the AL East. If you want to expand that argument past teams within the AL Central, well isn't the whole argument that the AL is far superior to the NL? If the Brewers, the Reds and Pirates have played that bad, for this long, against the NL maybe we do have a problem.

twsoxfan5
11-17-2009, 02:30 PM
I was tempted to say, "Well of course the NL is weaker! The Yanks and the Red Sox play in the AL and the Pirates and Nationals play in the NL." But it's not as obvious as you would think. Just for fun let's take a look at what have been the 5 "worst" teams this decade in each league, IMO of course.

NL
SD: 769-852 .474
Cincy: 751-869 .464
Milw: 741-878 .458
MTL/Wash: 711-908 .439
Pit: 681-936 .421

AL
TOR: 805-814 .497
TEX: 776-844 .479
BAL: 698-920 .431
TB: 694-923 .429
KC: 672-948 .415

The worst record this decade belongs to the Royals, but the Pirates are not far behind. What is surprising is that the Jays and to less an extent the Orioles have been able to somewhat compete against the might of the AL East powerhouses. What excuse do the Brewers, the Reds and the Pirates have? I guess one could make the claim that the Cards and Cubs have been great teams this decade, but nowhere near as good as the AL East. If you want to expand that argument past teams within the AL Central, well isn't the whole argument that the AL is far superior to the NL? If the Brewers, the Reds and Pirates have played that bad, for this long, against the NL maybe we do have a problem.

Did you know that during that 10 year span when the Royals have had the worst record they are well over .500 against NL teams?

Pear-Zin-Ski
11-17-2009, 02:35 PM
Did you know that during that 10 year span when the Royals have had the worst record they are well over .500 against NL teams?

Did not know that. I just looked up all these stats on wikipedia :o:. But I guess that just furthers my point. No myth - the NL truly sucks.

Patrick134
11-17-2009, 05:30 PM
I was tempted to say, "Well of course the NL is weaker! The Yanks and the Red Sox play in the AL and the Pirates and Nationals play in the NL." But it's not as obvious as you would think. Just for fun let's take a look at what have been the 5 "worst" teams this decade in each league, IMO of course.

NL
SD: 769-852 .474
Cincy: 751-869 .464
Milw: 741-878 .458
MTL/Wash: 711-908 .439
Pit: 681-936 .421

AL
TOR: 805-814 .497
TEX: 776-844 .479
BAL: 698-920 .431
TB: 694-923 .429
KC: 672-948 .415

The worst record this decade belongs to the Royals, but the Pirates are not far behind. What is surprising is that the Jays and to less an extent the Orioles have been able to somewhat compete against the might of the AL East powerhouses. What excuse do the Brewers, the Reds and the Pirates have? I guess one could make the claim that the Cards and Cubs have been great teams this decade, but nowhere near as good as the AL East. If you want to expand that argument past teams within the AL Central, well isn't the whole argument that the AL is far superior to the NL? If the Brewers, the Reds and Pirates have played that bad, for this long, against the NL maybe we do have a problem.


Aren't these results skewed because the NL teams are playing mostly NL foes? In my mind I'd rank KC over Pitt because they play much tougher competition.

Pear-Zin-Ski
11-17-2009, 05:34 PM
Aren't these results skewed because the NL teams are playing mostly NL foes? In my mind I'd rank KC over Pitt because they play much tougher competition.

Well that's my point. If crappy NL teams are playing crappy NL teams and you still have records like so, doesn't that show something is wrong?

Granted I think this lame-duck analysis of mine is pretty poor and it doesn't show a huge difference between the AL and the NL. Just thinking I guess.

Waysouthsider
11-18-2009, 02:33 PM
I've seen lots of analysis on this....the best one done by BP guys....they cite the DH as being a critical factor and make the comparison of relative strength using data from interleague play.

The money factor is somewhat negated by the fact that the NL has teams with deep pockets as well...although not as deep as NY!