PDA

View Full Version : Johnny Damon?


Lip Man 1
11-01-2009, 05:47 PM
Let's hope not:

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2009/11/does-damon-make-sense-for-white-sox.html

Lip

MarkZ35
11-01-2009, 05:55 PM
I would rather Pods for cheaper with his bad defense over Damon and his bad defense. Damon made 13 mil. this year. No thanks.

JermaineDye05
11-01-2009, 06:11 PM
Pods > Damon.

Brian26
11-01-2009, 06:26 PM
Let's hope not:

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2009/11/does-damon-make-sense-for-white-sox.html

Lip

I can see Damon as the type of guy Kenny might think could be a leader in the clubhouse.

DirtySox
11-01-2009, 06:26 PM
Pods > Damon.

Really?

I would take 2009 Damon over 2009 Pods any day of the week.

Craig Grebeck
11-01-2009, 06:29 PM
Pods > Damon.
Not unless Damon commands ten times what Pods does on the open market.

Rockabilly
11-01-2009, 06:30 PM
I would take Damon over Pods in a heartbeat..

JermaineDye05
11-01-2009, 06:33 PM
Wow, I have egg on my face. I didn't even bother looking at Damon's stats.

In all honesty, I don't want Damon or Pods with the Sox next season. I would like to have a solid defensive outfield with, at least, avg arms for next season.

jamokes
11-01-2009, 06:44 PM
I thought we were getting Ellsbury for next to nothing.

DumpJerry
11-01-2009, 06:48 PM
I thought we were getting Ellsbury for next to nothing.
:tealtutor:

cards press box
11-01-2009, 06:58 PM
Let's hope not:

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2009/11/does-damon-make-sense-for-white-sox.html

Lip

The article mentioned Bobby Abreu, too. I can see the Sox signing him to DH and occasionally play LF or RF. The Sox still need lefty power, as his stats (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/a/abreubo01.shtml?redir) show, Abreu still gets on base at decent rate (.390 OBP in 2009) and steals a lot of bases (30 SB in 2009).

According to SI (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/10/15/abreu.angels/index.html), Abreu has already turned down a 2 year/16 mil deal from L.A. I wonder what price Abreu will ultimately command on the market.

ChiSox14305635
11-01-2009, 06:58 PM
http://img.slate.com/media/105000/105827/010509_ScottBoras.jpg

This should end any further thoughts about that.

Noneck
11-01-2009, 07:19 PM
http://img.slate.com/media/105000/105827/010509_ScottBoras.jpg

This should end any further thoughts about that.

Doesn't Rogers do any research? This Boston reporter probably doesn't have a clue the Sox don't deal with Boras but Rogers should know better.

GoGoCrede
11-01-2009, 07:27 PM
http://img.slate.com/media/105000/105827/010509_ScottBoras.jpg

This should end any further thoughts about that.

That settles that.

Pablo_Honey
11-01-2009, 07:37 PM
The article mentioned Bobby Abreu, too. I can see the Sox signing him to DH and occasionally play LF or RF. The Sox still need lefty power, as his stats (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/a/abreubo01.shtml?redir) show, Abreu still gets on base at decent rate (.390 OBP in 2009) and steals a lot of bases (30 SB in 2009).

According to SI (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/10/15/abreu.angels/index.html), Abreu has already turned down a 2 year/16 mil deal from L.A. I wonder what price Abreu will ultimately command on the market.

As amazing as it would be to sign Abreu, there is no way Sox sign him. Like Figgins, Abreu is a pipe dream. If the Sox were to pursue him, they would only offer slightly, very sligthly more than what Angels offered and Abreu is obviously looking for a big deal. There is no way Sox are willing to add more onto the payroll after acquiring Peavy and Rios. Sox are very tight on budget and also they need to deal with arbitration eligible players too. For the same reason, Sox won't be pursuing Damon (Of course, there's the whole Boras issue with Damon). They may sign Pods for a cheap contract and hope last season wasn't a career year.

Daver
11-01-2009, 07:54 PM
Not unless Damon commands ten times what Pods does on the open market.

Based on what?

And please keep your answer based on things that have a basis in reality.

WhiteSox5187
11-01-2009, 10:02 PM
Based on what?

And please keep your answer based on things that have a basis in reality.

C'mon, some stats have a basis in reality. I'm not even a stat head but if you completely elimate stats from the argument, what do you have?

beasly213
11-01-2009, 10:32 PM
I wouldn't mind Damon as long as he wouldn't command a huge salary. I like his bat and while his defense is bad he isn't a terrible baserunner like Pods.

JB98
11-01-2009, 11:48 PM
I'd rather have Hideki Matsui than Johnny Damon.

Craig Grebeck
11-02-2009, 01:24 AM
Based on what?

And please keep your answer based on things that have a basis in reality.
Why bother? What's the point in answering this for someone who will just tell me I'm an idiot? If you want to enter into an actually thoughtful debate, let me know; but if you want to continue to strut around here and **** all over any methodology that you don't like, I'm not going to run in circles with you.

If you can't figure out why or how Johnny Damon is better than Scott Podsednik (and ten times better was obviously hyperbolic, so I'll say six to eight times better -- OOH NUMBERS!), then what the **** are you doing on a baseball board?

Zisk77
11-02-2009, 07:12 AM
Why bother? What's the point in answering this for someone who will just tell me I'm an idiot? If you want to enter into an actually thoughtful debate, let me know; but if you want to continue to strut around here and **** all over any methodology that you don't like, I'm not going to run in circles with you.

If you can't figure out why or how Johnny Damon is better than Scott Podsednik (and ten times better was obviously hyperbolic, so I'll say six to eight times better -- OOH NUMBERS!), then what the **** are you doing on a baseball board?

No your not an idiot. Idiot is a clinical term for someone with an IQ under 25 (ruled by his ID). If you can use the Internet your not an idiot. However, here's a stat for you, what are you doing up at 4:32 am!:o:

I'm not a proponent of Damon myself but he's a better and more powerful stick than Pods. he also will command a salary that outreaches is ability and we aren't sugning a client of Borass anytime soon.

Craig Grebeck
11-02-2009, 08:33 AM
No your not an idiot. Idiot is a clinical term for someone with an IQ under 25 (ruled by his ID). If you can use the Internet your not an idiot. However, here's a stat for you, what are you doing up at 4:32 am!:o:

I'm not a proponent of Damon myself but he's a better and more powerful stick than Pods. he also will command a salary that outreaches is ability and we aren't sugning a client of Borass anytime soon.
Haha. I'm in London this semester, so I've done my fair share of posting when most of you are asleep (as you should be). I've been waiting for someone to call me out on it.

I'm not a huge proponent of him, and I'd much rather take a risk on Randy Winn as he plays tremendous defense and he can be brought in for next to nothing. I was just confused by the poster's assertion that Pods was superior.

russ99
11-02-2009, 08:50 AM
There is no way Sox are willing to add more onto the payroll after acquiring Peavy and Rios. Sox are very tight on budget and also they need to deal with arbitration eligible players too.

We don't know what the offseason budget is, so don't assume the Sox are going cheap again.

It's certainly more likely the Sox will have a slight bump in payroll this offseason, but there's also a chance they'll add payroll, most likely after cutting some salary such as with Jenks or one of the higher salaried players.

Carolina Kenny
11-02-2009, 09:10 AM
Kenny works best under the radar. The retooling of the WS will continue.
Say goodbye to some old players and welcome in the new ones.

IMHO the Sox will strike big with a blockbuster trade and we will ALL be surprised and amazed. And, no Johnny Damon will not be playing for the WS next year.

palehozenychicty
11-02-2009, 10:55 PM
Pods > Damon.


No he's not. I don't know if Damon is worth his price tag, but let's be real.

SoxNation05
11-03-2009, 04:19 PM
I can see Damon as the type of guy Kenny might think could be a leader in the clubhouse.
Joe Torre said the guy can't handle the game and nearly walked away. If he can't handle himself, he can't handle a team.

JermaineDye05
11-03-2009, 07:10 PM
No he's not. I don't know if Damon is worth his price tag, but let's be real.

Yes, I realize that now.

:redface:

doublem23
11-03-2009, 08:44 PM
Yes, I realize that now.

:redface:

You don't have to be that embarrassed about it. Damon's stats look nice, but he was hitting sandwiched between Derek Jeter, Mark Teixeira, and Alex Rodriguez. The bum should have hit .400.

When you weigh their contracts in, Damon's really not much more valuable than Pods.

Tragg
11-03-2009, 08:59 PM
We need a rightfielder - and an athletic one.
We have a left fielder.

tm1119
11-04-2009, 12:02 PM
You don't have to be that embarrassed about it. Damon's stats look nice, but he was hitting sandwiched between Derek Jeter, Mark Teixeira, and Alex Rodriguez. The bum should have hit .400.

When you weigh their contracts in, Damon's really not much more valuable than Pods.

Did you even bother to look at the rest of his stats beyond this year? The guy has an outside shot at getting 3,000 hits for his career, and is a borderline hall of fame candidate if he gets there. Pods and the 3 above average years hes had in his entire career isnt near the player Damon is.

With that said, I dont want Damon at all. Hes not very good in the field at this point, nor is he even that good of a lead off hitter either. Whatever money we do have can be spent in better ways.

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 12:24 PM
Not even mentioning slugging and driving in runs, Pods has topped Damon's lifetime .355 OBP once in his career. No one can be serious if they think Pods can hold Johnny Damon's jock. That said, I believe Boras is Damon's agent, he is getting older, maybe for 2 years, but I wouldn't be mad if the Sox passed on both.

doublem23
11-04-2009, 12:35 PM
Did you even bother to look at the rest of his stats beyond this year? The guy has an outside shot at getting 3,000 hits for his career, and is a borderline hall of fame candidate if he gets there. Pods and the 3 above average years hes had in his entire career isnt near the player Damon is.

What he did when he was 27 is not relevant to what he can do this year. Vladimir Guerrero was arguably the best hitter in baseball for 10 years, that doesn't mean I want the Sox to go out and get him for 2010.

munchman33
11-04-2009, 12:42 PM
What he did when he was 27 is not relevant to what he can do this year. Vladimir Guerrero was arguably the best hitter in baseball for 10 years, that doesn't mean I want the Sox to go out and get him for 2010.

I think the point is Damon, with his history and his season this year, is significantly more likely to be productive next year at a high level than Podsednik is.

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 12:43 PM
What he did when he was 27 is not relevant to what he can do this year. Vladimir Guerrero was arguably the best hitter in baseball for 10 years, that doesn't mean I want the Sox to go out and get him for 2010.

Damon was better than Pods in 2009, and of the 2, is the guy who is the better bet to put up the numbers again 2010, but that's why he will be more expensive. I wouldn't mind seeing him leadoff for the White Sox, but it won't break my heart if he doesn't.

tm1119
11-04-2009, 12:52 PM
What he did when he was 27 is not relevant to what he can do this year. Vladimir Guerrero was arguably the best hitter in baseball for 10 years, that doesn't mean I want the Sox to go out and get him for 2010.

Pods had his career year this year and still wasnt nearly as good as Damon. Pods is a slap hitter with only an average OBP, and declining speed. At this point they are very similar players in speed and D, but Damon still has the ability to hit 20+ HR's and drive in a bunch of runs too. Pods doesnt have that ability whatsoever.

Tragg
11-04-2009, 01:01 PM
Neither Damon nor Podsednik are what we need.

tm1119
11-04-2009, 01:08 PM
Neither Damon nor Podsednik are what we need.

I agree. However, if Pods is willing so sign back with us for under 5 mil I think we almost have to because of limited options and money. Unless KW has another trade plan to bring in another OF.

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 01:11 PM
I agree. However, if Pods is willing so sign back with us for under 5 mil I think we almost have to because of limited options and money. Unless KW has another trade plan to bring in another OF.
Anything under $5 million? The guy was out of baseball. One year contract $1.5 million guarantee max. Even that may be pushing it. He's a leadoff hitter who is a horrible baserunner.

tm1119
11-04-2009, 01:18 PM
Anything under $5 million? The guy was out of baseball. One year contract $1.5 million guarantee max. Even that may be pushing it. He's a leadoff hitter who is a horrible baserunner.

Ehh, i hope so, but some stupid team may offer him a little more money after the year he had this year. I was thinking 1 year 3mil with a club option for a 2nd year at 4mil. Probably some incentives in there as well. 1.5 mil really doesnt get you anything these days in the MLB, so doubt we can get Pods for that this year

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 01:24 PM
Ehh, i hope so, but some stupid team may offer him a little more money after the year he had this year. I was thinking 1 year 3mil with a club option for a 2nd year at 4mil. Probably some incentives in there as well. 1.5 mil really doesnt get you anything these days in the MLB, so doubt we can get Pods for that this year
Then let him walk.

tm1119
11-04-2009, 01:34 PM
Then let him walk.

And start who? Im all for upgrading over Pods, but im just not sure how realistic its going to be. The free agent OF class is pretty weak, making the price tag on what ever starting quality players that actually are available go up. I guess Im just doubting how much money we actually have to spend on 1 OF, a DH(assuming that Dye is gone), and hopefully at least 1 bullpen arm.

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 02:02 PM
And start who? Im all for upgrading over Pods, but im just not sure how realistic its going to be. The free agent OF class is pretty weak, making the price tag on what ever starting quality players that actually are available go up. I guess Im just doubting how much money we actually have to spend on 1 OF, a DH(assuming that Dye is gone), and hopefully at least 1 bullpen arm.

There's a better chance Pods is the player he was in 2006-2008 than he was in 2009, so you wouldn't have anything worthwhile anyway and you would be paying him money that could be spent elsewhere. Someone will probably pay him for what he did in 2009. I just hope it isn't the White Sox. I'll tell you one thing, I would rather have Damon for 2 years $18 million than the 5/$50 million they are talking about Figgins getting.

doublem23
11-04-2009, 02:13 PM
Pods had his career year this year and still wasnt nearly as good as Damon. Pods is a slap hitter with only an average OBP, and declining speed. At this point they are very similar players in speed and D, but Damon still has the ability to hit 20+ HR's and drive in a bunch of runs too. Pods doesnt have that ability whatsoever.

Damon hit in the middle of the best lineup in baseball. Pods hit at the front of one of the worst offenses in the American League.

I'm not saying Pods has had the career Damon has, or that on the field, he's even as good as Damon is, but can we please stop the canonization of Johnny Damon? He's really not that great, and he waaaaaay overpayed. People are actually discussing how Damon might be worth it at $10 M/year. This makes my brain bleed.

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 02:23 PM
Damon hit in the middle of the best lineup in baseball. Pods hit at the front of one of the worst offenses in the American League.

I'm not saying Pods has had the career Damon has, or that on the field, he's even as good as Damon is, but can we please stop the canonization of Johnny Damon? He's really not that great, and he waaaaaay overpayed. People are actually discussing how Damon might be worth it at $10 M/year. This makes my brain bleed.

Fangraphs had Damon's 2009 worth $12.7 million and Pods worth $8.2 million. Its the highest Pods has been in a while. The 3 previous seasons, according to them, he should have been paying teams millions to play.

doublem23
11-04-2009, 02:29 PM
Fangraphs had Damon's 2009 worth $12.7 million and Pods worth $8.2 million. Its the highest Pods has been in a while. The 3 previous seasons, according to them, he should have been paying teams millions to play.

And what is that based on?

tm1119
11-04-2009, 02:39 PM
Damon hit in the middle of the best lineup in baseball. Pods hit at the front of one of the worst offenses in the American League.

I'm not saying Pods has had the career Damon has, or that on the field, he's even as good as Damon is, but can we please stop the canonization of Johnny Damon? He's really not that great, and he waaaaaay overpayed. People are actually discussing how Damon might be worth it at $10 M/year. This makes my brain bleed.

Doesnt matter where Pods hits, he is what he is. Decent average with an average OBP and no power whatsoever.

And what exactly do you think is the going rate for good MLB OF's(which damon is) nowadays? 8-10 mil sounds just about right to me. Last years market was a 1 time thing, contracts will rise to their normal rates . Damon's contract is just about right for how he produces. Again, with that said, I dont want him.

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 02:56 PM
And what is that based on?

They have some formula that determines player worth with offense and defense built in. I think it is flawed but guys like Theo Epstein swear by it. Anyway, Damon for 2 years at $9 million per isn't bad, he's also probably good for the box office.

The only White Sox with a higher OPS than Johnny in 2009 was Thome, and that was .864 to .854.

Nellie_Fox
11-04-2009, 03:03 PM
They have some formula that determines player worth with offense and defense built in. Is that the same formula that said Nick Swisher is worth $17 million? :bs:

dickallen15
11-04-2009, 03:10 PM
Is that the same formula that said Nick Swisher is worth $17 million? :bs:
As I said I don't necessarily agree with it, I find it flawed, but to say Damon isn't worth anything near $9-10 million a year would mean that most players are well overpaid.

Tragg
11-04-2009, 03:40 PM
Fangraphs had Damon's 2009 worth $12.7 million and Pods worth $8.2 million. Its the highest Pods has been in a while. The 3 previous seasons, according to them, he should have been paying teams millions to play.
Is that factoring in the current macro economic realities?
I doubt it.
But some people have odd ideas of dollar value: someone on here was insisting a while back that 10Mill or whatever for Milton Bradley was below market.

#1swisher
11-04-2009, 08:18 PM
WS game 6 Damon leaves with a pulled calf.

WhiteSoxOnly
11-04-2009, 09:33 PM
WS game 6 Damon leaves with a pulled calf.

No problem Swish,he'll be ready for Glendale in a few months.:redneck

LongLiveFisk
11-05-2009, 06:21 PM
:tealtutor:

But what if someone actually WANTS to use this color? Should we just banish it altogether? :tongue:

Taliesinrk
11-06-2009, 06:31 PM
But what if someone actually WANTS to use this color? Should we just banish it altogether? :tongue:

You are NOT A MODERATOR and SHOULD NOT be telling them how to do their jobs!

Taliesinrk
11-06-2009, 06:33 PM
you are not a moderator and should not be telling them how to do their jobs!

and you are not a moderator and should not be telling him not to tell them how not to do their jobs!

Taliesinrk
11-06-2009, 06:35 PM
and you are not a moderator and should not be telling him not to tell them how not to do their jobs!
:tealtutor:

Taliesinrk
11-06-2009, 06:38 PM
and you are not a moderator and should not be telling him not to tell them how not to do their jobs!


And neither are you!! Until you realize this, enjoy your week off! And STOP FIXING POSTS! There is nothing:tealtutor: about this message!!!!!

soxinem1
11-06-2009, 07:14 PM
Pods > Damon.

No way. I'll take 2009 Damon over 2005 Pods. Damon does not suck, is not a scrub, and is not washed up.

Is he a great OF? No, but Damon is very solid in every other part of his game.