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View Full Version : What would be a good return for Jenks?


GAsoxfan
09-23-2009, 02:50 PM
There has been a lot of speculation that Jenks will be shopped this offseason, but I haven't heard anything about the expected return. I was wondering what posters here are expecting Kenny to get in return for Jenks?

eriqjaffe
09-23-2009, 02:51 PM
Alex Rodriguez

Rockabilly
09-23-2009, 03:05 PM
Howie Kendrick

Scottiehaswheels
09-23-2009, 03:31 PM
Something comparable to the package the O's got for Sherrill...

munchman33
09-23-2009, 03:39 PM
I'd send Jenks and any number of minor leaguers necessary to Washington (or trade Jenks for minor leaguers to spin) for Ryan Zimmerman.

Craig Grebeck
09-23-2009, 04:07 PM
Pitching prospects. We are sorely lacking in that department.

I feel, currently, we can sign Figgins and Byrd to plug 3B and RF without worrying about Jenks. Just keep him and let him rebuild his value for a year.

mzh
09-23-2009, 04:37 PM
Pitching prospects. We are sorely lacking in that department.


How can you say that when guys like Carlos Torres and Dan Hudson have risen before our eyes? We got a nice mid-level prospect for Thome in Brandon Hynick, and John Ely put up ridiculous numbers in Double A. Especially with what the 2010 front 4 is shaping up to be, I think that we are perfectly fine.

kjhanson
09-23-2009, 05:20 PM
How can you say that when guys like Carlos Torres and Dan Hudson have risen before our eyes? We got a nice mid-level prospect for Thome in Brandon Hynick, and John Ely put up ridiculous numbers in Double A. Especially with what the 2010 front 4 is shaping up to be, I think that we are perfectly fine.

If Jenks is going, which I do not advocate, you have to get pitching in return. None of the guys you mentioned is likely to be an above average reliever. I believe Hudson is going to be an excellent complement to the big four over the next four years, but the other three guys you mentioned are all question marks. If Jenks is gone, we're short at least three quality relievers, which is why pitching would be the highest organizational need.

Hitmen77
09-23-2009, 05:34 PM
Pitching prospects. We are sorely lacking in that department.

I feel, currently, we can sign Figgins and Byrd to plug 3B and RF without worrying about Jenks. Just keep him and let him rebuild his value for a year.

That sounds good, but I wouldn't be surprised if there isn't enough room in our payroll to accommodate that. If we're adding two free agents as you suggest (or even just one free agent perhaps), then some of our committed-to salary is likely to depart via trade.

Of course, it doesn't have to be Jenks, but one of the regulars may have to go. .....and I think it's safe to assume that the Sox won't be able to unload Linebrink's salary.

Zisk77
09-23-2009, 05:45 PM
Why not Carl Crawford (not necessarily straight up)...Rays need a closer and probably can't afford to keep Carl. Not that I advocate trading Jenks.

Rockabilly
09-23-2009, 05:49 PM
Why not Carl Crawford (not necessarily straight up)...Rays need a closer and probably can't afford to keep Carl. Not that I advocate trading Jenks.


I think the Rays would asked for a lot more than just Jenks for Crawford. I would love to see Carl in a Sox uniform though

DumpJerry
09-23-2009, 06:17 PM
Pitching prospects. We are sorely lacking in that department.

I feel, currently, we can sign Figgins and Byrd to plug 3B and RF without worrying about Jenks. Just keep him and let him rebuild his value for a year.
There already is a 3B here. Ever hear of Gordon Beckham? He's kinda good. Quentin will play RF next year.

We are pretty deep in pitching prospects, by the way.

Other than that, your post is spot-on.

Craig Grebeck
09-23-2009, 07:01 PM
There already is a 3B here. Ever hear of Gordon Beckham? He's kinda good. Quentin will play RF next year.

We are pretty deep in pitching prospects, by the way.

Other than that, your post is spot-on.
I'd move him back to the middle infield, but why bother improving the defense? And since we don't care about infield defense, let's just throw a below average LF in RF.

Deep in pitching prospects? Are you serious? That's lunacy.

BadBobbyJenks
09-23-2009, 07:31 PM
Soooooooooo who are these pitching prospects not named Dan Hudson, and please don't mention Carlos Torres.

JB98
09-23-2009, 07:46 PM
Soooooooooo who are these pitching prospects not named Dan Hudson, and please don't mention Carlos Torres.

I believe John Ely had a helluva year at Birmingham. After that, I'd have to do some research....

Zisk77
09-23-2009, 08:22 PM
I'd move him back to the middle infield, but why bother improving the defense? And since we don't care about infield defense, let's just throw a below average LF in RF.

Deep in pitching prospects? Are you serious? That's lunacy.

What makes you think Beckham will be an improvement at middle infield? The biggest knock on him coming out of college was his glove.

It seems a moot point anyway as the organization seems set on Gordon on 3b, alexei ss, & Getz at 2b.

Totally agree that the organization can never have too much pitching depth.

I don't like Byrd. I like the idea of getting a new rf & lf and putting TCQ at DH to keep him healthy and our defense better.

cws05champ
09-23-2009, 08:51 PM
Soooooooooo who are these pitching prospects not named Dan Hudson, and please don't mention Carlos Torres.
Jon Link and Jhonny Nunez should be future bullpen arms very soon, and John Ely as mentioned had a very good year(hmmm three Johns all with it spelled a different way). Clevelan Santeliz (4-0, 0.96 ERA in 56IP), Greg Infante (3.26), Charlie Leesman(3.08) and Charlie Shirek are ones to keep an eye on.

Craig Grebeck
09-23-2009, 08:58 PM
Jon Link and Jhonny Nunez should be future bullpen arms very soon, and John Ely as mentioned had a very good year(hmmm three Johns all with it spelled a different way). Clevelan Santeliz (4-0, 0.96 ERA in 56IP), Greg Infante (3.26), Charlie Leesman(3.08) and Charlie Shirek are ones to keep an eye on.
Okay, so we have depth in that we have baseball pitchers in the system, but in terms of pitching prospects, these guys don't cut it. Link isn't as likely to pitch in the pen as others think, and the rest (save Nunez and perhaps Shirek) will have to make serious leaps and bounds to become anything but organizational fodder. If these are the names we're rattling off, it's pretty clear we're in an undesirable position.

veeter
09-24-2009, 09:53 AM
I'd rather see Alexei shipped out.

Craig Grebeck
09-24-2009, 11:33 AM
I'd rather see Alexei shipped out.
I'd only be okay with that in the event that we receive a young, athletic OF in return, while also getting some decent pitching prospects.

But Alexei hasn't been near as bad as the hyperbolic, group-thinking masses believe.

kjhanson
09-24-2009, 12:02 PM
I'd rather see Alexei shipped out.

That's an excellent idea. After all, starting shortstops who average .285/18/72/14 SB grow on trees.

Even if those numbers seem pedestrian (13th in BA among SS, 7th in HR, 9th in RBI, 15th in SB in 2009), consider that his BB:K ratio ranks 5th and improved from 0.30 to 0.76.

Still not sold? He's signed for $1.1MM in 2010 and 2011. Ramon Castro is making more than twice that. Orlando Cabrera, who set the bar for slightly above average shortstops (in the current market), signed a $4MM contract. He's seven years older than Alexei and has committed more errors, despite playing on carpet for 1/3 of the year.

What does this all mean? If Alexei is gone - just to replace his production - you have to spend at least four times as much money as he'll be making next year.

But wait, let's sign Figgins and move Gordon to SS.
So we sign Figgins for $8MM/year, which is eight times the amount being spent on Alexei, and make Gordon learn SS at the Major League level. That doesn't solve any problems. The difference between Figgins production and Ramirez production is much, much less than $7MM and the effort of having to move the organization's best young player to another new position in the big leagues.

Keeping Alexei is a no-brainer. He's a bargain.

veeter
09-24-2009, 01:38 PM
That's an excellent idea. After all, starting shortstops who average .285/18/72/14 SB grow on trees.

Even if those numbers seem pedestrian (13th in BA among SS, 7th in HR, 9th in RBI, 15th in SB in 2009), consider that his BB:K ratio ranks 5th and improved from 0.30 to 0.76.

Still not sold? He's signed for $1.1MM in 2010 and 2011. Ramon Castro is making more than twice that. Orlando Cabrera, who set the bar for slightly above average shortstops (in the current market), signed a $4MM contract. He's seven years older than Alexei and has committed more errors, despite playing on carpet for 1/3 of the year.

What does this all mean? If Alexei is gone - just to replace his production - you have to spend at least four times as much money as he'll be making next year.

But wait, let's sign Figgins and move Gordon to SS.
So we sign Figgins for $8MM/year, which is eight times the amount being spent on Alexei, and make Gordon learn SS at the Major League level. That doesn't solve any problems. The difference between Figgins production and Ramirez production is much, much less than $7MM and the effort of having to move the organization's best young player to another new position in the big leagues.

Keeping Alexei is a no-brainer. He's a bargain.I agree. Alexei is a bargain.

munchman33
09-24-2009, 02:02 PM
There already is a 3B here. Ever hear of Gordon Beckham? He's kinda good. Quentin will play RF next year.

We are pretty deep in pitching prospects, by the way.

Other than that, your post is spot-on.

No, there is a good middle infielder holding down the 3B position only adequately. Otherwise your post is spot-on.

Tragg
09-24-2009, 09:10 PM
How can you say that when guys like Carlos Torres and Dan Hudson have risen before our eyes? We got a nice mid-level prospect for Thome in Brandon Hynick, and John Ely put up ridiculous numbers in Double A. Especially with what the 2010 front 4 is shaping up to be, I think that we are perfectly fine.
That's still awfully thin (and your evaluation of Hynick is awfully optimistic).
Torres and Hudson should be in our pen NEXT year (which would preclude the need to trade young prospects for career middle relievers), which would leave us really light.

mzh
09-24-2009, 09:18 PM
That's still awfully thin (and your evaluation of Hynick is awfully optimistic).
Torres and Hudson should be in our pen NEXT year (which would preclude the need to trade young prospects for career middle relievers), which would leave us really light.

Your points are correct, but the point of my post was meant to be that when you have as strong a front four as we do plus Freddy, we can live with only having mid-level prospects like Torres and Hynick.

soxfanreggie
09-25-2009, 09:54 PM
Your points are correct, but the point of my post was meant to be that when you have as strong a front four as we do plus Freddy, we can live with only having mid-level prospects like Torres and Hynick.

What do you do with (knock on wood) an injury or in a couple years when our starters are in line for pretty big contracts?

Frater Perdurabo
09-25-2009, 09:58 PM
I would be reluctant to deal Jenks, unless he could be part of a package to acquire Carl Crawford.

Brian26
09-25-2009, 10:10 PM
No, there is a good middle infielder holding down the 3B position only adequately. Otherwise your post is spot-on.

The Sox never projected Beckham to play SS on the major league level. This has come out over the past couple of weeks. He's not going anywhere.

munchman33
09-25-2009, 10:12 PM
The Sox never projected Beckham to play SS on the major league level. This has come out over the past couple of weeks. He's not going anywhere.

I'd be willing to bet a six pack of Ham's he's playing 2B on opening day next spring. :D:

Chez
09-26-2009, 09:45 AM
How can you say that when guys like Carlos Torres and Dan Hudson have risen before our eyes? We got a nice mid-level prospect for Thome in Brandon Hynick, and John Ely put up ridiculous numbers in Double A. Especially with what the 2010 front 4 is shaping up to be, I think that we are perfectly fine.

Not to pick nits, but I believe we got Hynick from Colorado for Jose Contreras.

russ99
09-26-2009, 11:28 AM
What makes you think Beckham will be an improvement at middle infield? The biggest knock on him coming out of college was his glove.

It seems a moot point anyway as the organization seems set on Gordon on 3b, alexei ss, & Getz at 2b.

Totally agree that the organization can never have too much pitching depth.

I don't like Byrd. I like the idea of getting a new rf & lf and putting TCQ at DH to keep him healthy and our defense better.

Yes, but those things change when certain players can be acquired.

Having the flexibility to move Beckham to SS (his natural position) or 2B, or move Ramirez to 2B is a good thing. I don't think we need to ditch Getz either, he's a had a nice year, but he's a number 9 hitter and if we can improve the offense, he can platoon/sub, especially if we get Figgins - with his injury history.

Pitching depth has taken a big hit the last 2 years in the system. More prospects wouldn't hurt. We could also use a power bat/outfielder in the system, if we're dealing Jenks for a high-end prospect.

Byrd is an OK player, but I wouldn't break the bank for him. I'd like to see Kenny go more outside the mainstream on acquisitions this offseason, like he did in 2005 with a lesser FA in Dye, a catcher no one wanted in A.J. and a Japanese import in Iguchi.

shes
09-26-2009, 08:28 PM
I'd be willing to bet a six pack of Ham's he's playing 2B on opening day next spring. :D:

That's a lot of meat. How 'bout some beer instead?