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getonbckthr
08-02-2009, 12:00 PM
In the past 20 years does lead all owners in championships? I'm trying to think of any owner that has more than 7.

voodoochile
08-02-2009, 12:09 PM
Has to be at or near the top.

Other possibilities might include the Steinbrenners, The Buss family, Jerry Jones and whoever owns the Red Wings.

Aside from the RW owner, I don't think any of the others can top him, but I don't know if any of those folks own other sports teams or where you draw the line (Do soccer championships count in the mix?)

TheMilkman
08-02-2009, 12:14 PM
Has to be at or near the top.

Other possibilities might include the Steinbrenners, The Buss family, Jerry Jones and whoever owns the Red Wings.

Aside from the RW owner, I don't think any of the others can top him, but I don't know if any of those folks own other sports teams or where you draw the line (Do soccer championships count in the mix?)

Red Wings are owned by Mike Ilitch...who also owns the Tigers. If the Tigers hadn't choked against the Cardinals a couple years ago he'd have one more championship!

getonbckthr
08-02-2009, 12:18 PM
Has to be at or near the top.

Other possibilities might include the Steinbrenners, The Buss family, Jerry Jones and whoever owns the Red Wings.

Aside from the RW owner, I don't think any of the others can top him, but I don't know if any of those folks own other sports teams or where you draw the line (Do soccer championships count in the mix?)
Ya i'm thinking the big 4 (MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL).

Frater Perdurabo
08-02-2009, 02:36 PM
No offense to Reinsdorf, but the only difference between him and Mike McCaskey is Michael Jordan.

34rancher
08-02-2009, 08:58 PM
No offense to Reinsdorf, but the only difference between him and Mike McCaskey is Michael Jordan.
You have got to be kidding me. McCaskey fired people through them reading about it in the newspaper. JR hardly fires anyone he hires. He is loyal to a fault. McCaskey drove the Bears into the ground, JR has both of his teams on the rise. There is no comparison to those two.

Frater Perdurabo
08-02-2009, 09:10 PM
You have got to be kidding me. McCaskey fired people through them reading about it in the newspaper. JR hardly fires anyone he hires. He is loyal to a fault. McCaskey drove the Bears into the ground, JR has both of his teams on the rise. There is no comparison to those two.

Would the Bulls have won six titles without Jordan?

chisoxfanatic
08-02-2009, 09:13 PM
Red Wings are owned by Mike Ilitch...who also owns the Tigers. If the Tigers hadn't choked against the Cardinals a couple years ago he'd have one more championship!
Ilitch has won four championships with the Wings and zero championships with the Tigers. That still leaves Ilitch three shy of Reinsdorf's total.

DumpJerry
08-02-2009, 09:15 PM
Would the Bulls have won six titles without Jordan?
This sets up an endless argument with no conclusion. The same question could be asked of other teams that won championship titles, either singularly or plural. The 49'ers and Joe Montanta, the Celtics and Larry Bird, the Yankees and Babe Ruth, etc., etc.

Frater Perdurabo
08-02-2009, 09:26 PM
This sets up an endless argument with no conclusion. The same question could be asked of other teams that won championship titles, either singularly or plural. The 49'ers and Joe Montanta, the Celtics and Larry Bird, the Yankees and Babe Ruth, etc., etc.

I was asking a rhetorical question. In my opinion, the Bulls would NOT have won six titles without Jordan. (Anyone is free to disagree.) Consequently, Reinsdorf likely would just have the one title (2005 Sox) without Jordan. That is as many as the McCaskeys. That is my only point.

doublem23
08-02-2009, 09:29 PM
Would the Bulls have won six titles without Jordan?

Everyone likes to point out the post-Jordan Bulls as saying "see what would have happened if we didn't have MJ?" but the truth is the entire roster was gutted following Michael's 2nd retirement. The Bulls weren't a great team without MJ, but in the 1-ish year he was gone, they were still very, very good, and were potentially 1 BS call by Hue Hollins away from getting to the Eastern Conference Finals in 1994.

Having the greatest player at his sport around for a 14-year-run helps, but let's not pretend like the Bulls were trotting MJ + 4 nobodies.

voodoochile
08-02-2009, 10:11 PM
Everyone likes to point out the post-Jordan Bulls as saying "see what would have happened if we didn't have MJ?" but the truth is the entire roster was gutted following Michael's 2nd retirement. The Bulls weren't a great team without MJ, but in the 1-ish year he was gone, they were still very, very good, and were potentially 1 BS call by Hue Hollins away from getting to the Eastern Conference Finals in 1994.

Having the greatest player at his sport around for a 14-year-run helps, but let's not pretend like the Bulls were trotting MJ + 4 nobodies.

Had a pretty decent coach too.

Oh and there is a big difference between "the McCaskeys" and Mike McCaskey. Mike was not in charge of the team in 1985. He has zero championships credited to his failed tenure as Bears' President.

munchman33
08-02-2009, 10:59 PM
Would the Bulls have won six titles without Jordan?

That's the lamest argument on the planet. You take the best player off any championship team and they probably don't win a championship.

Would Jordan have won without Jerry Krause? Scottie Pippen? Phil Jackson? Those are way more interesting questions.

voodoochile
08-02-2009, 11:06 PM
That's the lamest argument on the planet. You take the best player off any championship team and they probably don't win a championship.

Would Jordan have won without Jerry Krause? Scottie Pippen? Phil Jackson? Those are way more interesting questions.

JR's also the one who authorized the continued payment of MJ's contract when he retired the first time thus allowing MJ to step seamlessly back into basketball without needing a new contract and then signed him to the consecutive $30M/year deals to fuel the second threepeat.

He got lucky to have MJ on the team when he bought it, but he managed to hold onto MJ and all the other key pieces long enough to win 6 championships.

guillen4life13
08-02-2009, 11:19 PM
I was asking a rhetorical question. In my opinion, the Bulls would NOT have won six titles without Jordan. (Anyone is free to disagree.) Consequently, Reinsdorf likely would just have the one title (2005 Sox) without Jordan. That is as many as the McCaskeys. That is my only point.

Your point is really kind of pointless. Without Jerry Reinsdorf, it's arguable that Chicago has no championships since the Bears' SB in '85.

Reinsdorf, for all his faults, has been a great franchise owner. He paid Jordan the money and kept him. He paid Albert Belle the money. He paid Buehrle the money. Konerko, etc.

TornLabrum
08-02-2009, 11:51 PM
I was asking a rhetorical question. In my opinion, the Bulls would NOT have won six titles without Jordan. (Anyone is free to disagree.) Consequently, Reinsdorf likely would just have the one title (2005 Sox) without Jordan. That is as many as the McCaskeys. That is my only point.

And as my late father used to say about such arguments, "...and if the dog hadn't stopped to ****, he'd have caught a rabbit."

soxfanreggie
08-03-2009, 12:03 AM
I'm not sure anyone has won more championships in the past 20 years than just the Bulls alone. Throw in the Sox championship and it's even better. Most owners don't own more than one team anymore.

chisoxfanatic
08-03-2009, 12:23 AM
I'm not sure anyone has won more championships in the past 20 years than just the Bulls alone. Throw in the Sox championship and it's even better. Most owners don't own more than one team anymore.
I know we're 4 years removed from this, but seeing those words STILL excite me big time. I remember the years and years before that year thinking I'd NEVER see the Sox win it all even in my lifetime...and then, they took out some major pent-up frustrations on Boston, LA, and Houston. What fun that was, and I give most of the credit to Kenny Williams for that.

jdm2662
08-03-2009, 08:18 AM
The Lakers have won nine championships since 1980. Someone will have to confirm if the Buss family owned them at the time. If so, they win.

Voodoo, in regards to Mikey Boy, he became president in 1983 when the Old Man died. "Mugs" Halas was in line to take over the team, but he tragically died of a heart attack in 1979 at the age of 46. However, the team that was built to win the Super Bowl was already there before he took over which eventually lead to the team being ran into the ground. He actually won executive of the year in 1985 for just smiling and waving at the camera... God, I cringe the day Virgina dies. Hopefully, she put it into her will not to have Mikey Boy take over again...

skobabe8
08-03-2009, 08:38 AM
That's the lamest argument on the planet. You take the best player off any championship team and they probably don't win a championship.

Would Jordan have won without Jerry Krause? Scottie Pippen? Phil Jackson? Those are way more interesting questions.

Plus, if all it takes is Jordan, why didn't the Bulls win in the late 80s or 1990?

voodoochile
08-03-2009, 10:07 AM
The Lakers have won nine championships since 1980. Someone will have to confirm if the Buss family owned them at the time. If so, they win.

Voodoo, in regards to Mikey Boy, he became president in 1983 when the Old Man died. "Mugs" Halas was in line to take over the team, but he tragically died of a heart attack in 1979 at the age of 46. However, the team that was built to win the Super Bowl was already there before he took over which eventually lead to the team being ran into the ground. He actually won executive of the year in 1985 for just smiling and waving at the camera... God, I cringe the day Virgina dies. Hopefully, she put it into her will not to have Mikey Boy take over again...

You're going back 30 years not 20. I thought Mike didn't take over until after the SB year. I knew that Mugs was supposed to be the guy who took over and remember the famous story of Papa Bear on his death bed saying, "anyone but Mike" (I assume this is a made up rumor but don't know for sure).

It's still a bad analogy. Mike lucked into a team and coaching staff that were primed to go. Obviously the Bulls were not.

soxfanreggie
08-03-2009, 10:57 AM
Only 4 titles in the last 20 years. The other 5 titles Buss has were before the 20 year window.

jdm2662
08-03-2009, 11:05 AM
You're going back 30 years not 20. I thought Mike didn't take over until after the SB year. I knew that Mugs was supposed to be the guy who took over and remember the famous story of Papa Bear on his death bed saying, "anyone but Mike" (I assume this is a made up rumor but don't know for sure).

I heard the same story as well, but I didn't hear it until 1997 when the Bears were at rock bottom. No one was complaining in the 80s when they won five straight divisions, three appearances in the conference finals, and a Super Bowl win, however...

It's still a bad analogy. Mike lucked into a team and coaching staff that were primed to go. Obviously the Bulls were not.

Oh, I agree. Jordan was there when JR took over, but no one else was. We should've learned by now good teams win championships, not good players on teams. Everyone was so ready to hand the trophy to Lebron last year. Opps!

And yes, Mikey Boy was handed a huge gift. However, his arrogant, egotistical ass couldn't stay away from football operations. The rest is history. I just hope Virginia's will doesn't give him control of the team again...

TDog
08-03-2009, 12:24 PM
I was asking a rhetorical question. In my opinion, the Bulls would NOT have won six titles without Jordan. (Anyone is free to disagree.) Consequently, Reinsdorf likely would just have the one title (2005 Sox) without Jordan. That is as many as the McCaskeys. That is my only point.

But the Bulls had Jordan. They drafted him. They didn't trade him. They built a team around him, hired a coach that could win championships with him. It is irrelevant to speculate that he would have only won one championship without Jordan. Take away the best player from just about any championship NBA team, and you probably don't win the championship.

But having Jordan didn't ensure championships. The White Sox didn't win a championship with Jordan. In fact, they won one without him.

Oblong
08-03-2009, 02:48 PM
Bill Davidson, (owner of the Pistons- recently passed away) had 3 titles with the Pistons, 1 Stanley Cup (Tampa Bay Lightning), and I think 3 with the Detroit Shock (WNBA), if you want to count that.