PDA

View Full Version : *Official* 7-21-09 Jenks Meltdown Postgame Thread


Pages : [1] 2

Frater Perdurabo
07-21-2009, 09:43 PM
Start it here...

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 09:43 PM
Well that was one waste of a well-pitched game....:angry:

Viva Medias B's
07-21-2009, 09:43 PM
What's up with Bobby?

Craig Grebeck
07-21-2009, 09:43 PM
Nothing to see here. No need to worry.

See what happens when he's ineffective and we're not already up 3 runs?

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 09:43 PM
That sucked big time. Jenks is going to need to look smooth again to regain my confidence in him.

DC Sox Fan
07-21-2009, 09:43 PM
:chunks

DirtySox
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
Brutal.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
Start it here...


Yeah, put this thing in the roadhouse. Bobby Jenks should go there too.

Epic meltdown.

GregO23
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
Disgusting performance Bobby. I hope you are not donzo.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
With the amount of pitches he's thrown recently, Bobby should not have even been in there.

GoGoCrede
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
Thread title is awesome.

Nothing to say, really. Great job by Richard. I'm hoping it will carry over to his next start. And he's got a free steak dinner on Jenks.

This one stings.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
Well that sucked.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
I think the gamethread also belongs in the roadhouse with the stuff morons were posting int here.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
What's up with Bobby?

Bad or Hurt... one of the two.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
No way you extend Bobby. He will be moved this offseason.

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
Richard Rocks. Bobby sucks. Game Recap.

Shoeless
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
Older guys ruin it for the younger guys. Richard and Beckham had a hell of a game.

Crede24Thome25
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
How about we package Bobby in a deal to Toronto For Halladay. Who's with me.:D:

TommyGavinFloyd
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
Bobby Jenks hasn't lost anything on his fastball, he's just learned to be a pitcher. He chooses not to throw 97 anymore.

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
Well, that sucked.

But get 'em tomorrow.

And Kenny, I do believe this team needs to be tinkered with quite a bit..

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:45 PM
Bad or Hurt... one of the two.

God Awful actually.

Noneck
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
How many more opportunities do the Sox give Jenks to close at this point?

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
How about we package Bobby in a deal to Toronto For Halladay. Who's with me.:D:

Im in

Jurr
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
With a substitute going tomorrow, you cannot piss these away. The offense deserves as much of a thumbs down as Jenks for not cashing in with the bags loaded. They played with fire two nights in a row and escaped once. Hopefully Jenks, now that he has blown one, quits his timid act.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
With the amount of pitches he's thrown recently, Bobby should not have even been in there.

:rolleyes:

He's thrown 8 inning in the last 30 days .... cry me a river.


Bobby Jenks needs to be a big boy by now.

Soxman219
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
Pathetic, That's all.:angry::mad:

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
While I blame Jenks, one key factor that will be overlooked will be that the Sox loaded the bases with one out in the 7th and couldn't come through. No excuses there.

Sox83Kid
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
Who would want Jenks at this point? :angry:
How about we package Bobby in a deal to Toronto For Halladay. Who's with me.:D:

1989
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
Unbelievable how Richard battles his ass off for 8 innings and Bobby goes out and blows it with in .1 IP. Not scoring in that 7th inning killed us in the end.

I feel like I've been kicked in the balls with this loss

SoxSpeed22
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
****. That is all.

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
Why in the hell is Nix pinch-hitting for Getz, who is batting like .400 in his last 10 or whatever games? Factor in that Nix is now 0-10 as a pinch-hitter and is batting something like .200, and you have to wonder. That is not necessarily why we lost, but.....

The Sox gave away way too many scoring chances tonight. Neimann had a nasty curve, but they should have scored more runs. The strike zone was pretty tight when Jenks pitched, and a little wide for the Tampa closer, in my opinion. With that said, Jenks sucked tonight. Richard was awesome.

Dick Allen
07-21-2009, 09:46 PM
**** me!!:angry:
Just when the Sox have a chance to go for the jugular! :angry:

ode to veeck
07-21-2009, 09:47 PM
Start it here...

I agreed with Frater there, trot Richard out one more time to see what happens, even with 115 pitches for the 9th, Bobby looked like he coulda used the night off last couple of days and it showed.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:47 PM
How many more opportunities do the Sox give Jenks to close at this point?

My god, get a grip. His last blown save was June 11th, and we won that game. It's hardly an epidemic. Only 3 blown in 25 chances.

...
07-21-2009, 09:47 PM
Oh Bobby, I want to love you but I can't. **** you.

Tragg
07-21-2009, 09:47 PM
Sell low - that's the ticket.

We lost because we scored 2 lousy runs. Terrible production. Yes, we could have won. But we would have won with some decent production.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:47 PM
His Velocity is down, and so is his movement and location. Thats what happened to Billy Koch before he went into a free fall

Frater Perdurabo
07-21-2009, 09:47 PM
As others have said, the Sox offense failed to capitalize on some golden opportunities to blow the game wide open.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
Who would want Jenks at this point? :angry:

I know Jenks has sucked in his last couple outings, but come on. He's at least in the top 10 closers. Can we try and be smart baseball fans for once?

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
My god, get a grip. His last blown save was June 11th, and we won that game. It's hardly an epidemic. Only 3 blown in 25 chances.

**** this noise. He sucks.

Noneck
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
My god, get a grip. His last blown save was June 11th, and we won that game. It's hardly an epidemic. Only 3 blown in 25 chances.


And the answer to my question is?

ode to veeck
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
Why in the hell is Nix pinch-hitting for Getz, who is batting like .400 in his last 10 or whatever games? Factor in that Nix is now 0-10 as a pinch-hitter and is batting something like .200, and you have to wonder. That is not necessarily why we lost, but.....

The Sox gave away way too many scoring chances tonight. Neimann had a nasty curve, but they should have scored more runs. The strike zone was pretty tight when Jenks pitched, and a little wide for the Tampa closer, in my opinion. With that said, Jenks sucked tonight. Richard was awesome.

I woulda let Getz bat there for sure, he and Gordon have been hot with runners on lately. Tough loss after great outing by Clayton and timely hitting too

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
Oh Bobby, I want to love you but I can't. **** you.
I'm sorry it's one thing to be disappointed over a player's performance, but to say **** you to him is over the top. Go bugger off please. :dtroll: and stop being a :dumbass:

veeter
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
First time I can remember getting a lot of production from the young guys and losing. Needed the insurance runs Scotty couldn't provide. I'll always be with Bobby. Pitchers slump too. Great job by Clayton. Let's get 'em tomorrow.

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
His Velocity is down, and so is his movement and location. Thats what happened to Billy Koch before he went into a free fall
Don't you dare compare Bobby to Billy Koch. It's gonna take a few more blown saves to make your point valid.

BadBobbyJenks
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
I just cant accept that Jenks is not good anymore. If this turns into more than a rough stretch, than I will worry, but I am chalking this up to our closer having a bad week.

What a ****ing brutal loss when you get a once a season type performance from Clayton ****ing Richard.

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 09:48 PM
Direct cause of loss: Bobby

Indirect cause: Where was the hitting with RISP?!?!?

veeter
07-21-2009, 09:49 PM
With the amount of pitches he's thrown recently, Bobby should not have even been in there.This is a very good point.

WhiteSoxFan84
07-21-2009, 09:49 PM
Good news: Clayton pitched GREAT tonight.

Better news: Ricky Porcello pitched looked very bad tonight.

Great news: Cubs lose again!

GoGoCrede
07-21-2009, 09:49 PM
Direct cause of loss: Bobby

Indirect cause: Where was the hitting with RISP?!?!?

Truth. Too many blown chances.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 09:49 PM
Bobby Jenks hasn't lost anything on his fastball, he's just learned to be a pitcher. He chooses not to throw 97 anymore.

Biggest pile of **** fed to White Sox nation, ever.

Thank God I didn't fall for this noneseense.

He can still get people out but he needs to find his **** or a plan B.

Frater Perdurabo
07-21-2009, 09:49 PM
Pods, Dye, Thome and Paulie all failed tonight, big-time.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:49 PM
And the answer to my question is?


Jenks had thrown a ton of pitches latley, and shouldn't have been out there. He's the clsoer, and a damn good one. He's not perfect.

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:50 PM
I'm sorry it's one thing to be disappointed over a player's performance, but to say **** you to him is over the top. Go bugger off please. :dtroll: and stop being a :dumbass:

What? Really? I defended after he **** all over the field the last 2 outings, I'm done. Jenks sucks lately. How can you deny it?

Hitmen77
07-21-2009, 09:50 PM
Anyone who was surprised at how the 9th inning turned out was just fooling themselves. This had blown save written all over it with how Jenks has done lately and him facing the heart of their order.

....oh being unable to score with bases loaded and 1 out gave us this loss too.

(and let's not forget Podsednik's bunt right to the pitcher to double off Beckham at 2nd when we had nobody out. :angry:

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 09:50 PM
Why in the hell is Nix pinch-hitting for Getz, who is batting like .400 in his last 10 or whatever games? Factor in that Nix is now 0-10 as a pinch-hitter and is batting something like .200, and you have to wonder. .

What you wonder about is *** Kenny was thinking about in the offseason when he put this team together with NO BENCH. We have nobody to turn to in the late innings for pinch hitting.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 09:50 PM
What? Really? I defended after he **** all over the field the last 2 outings, I'm done. Jenks sucks lately. How can you deny it?
It's one thing to say a player sucks. It's another thing to say **** you to that player. Anyone who does that is a ****ing ******* and not a fan I want rooting for my team.

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 09:51 PM
Get 'em tomorrow, boys!


/end thread.

1989
07-21-2009, 09:51 PM
Sell low - that's the ticket.

We lost because we scored 2 lousy runs. Terrible production. Yes, we could have won. But we would have won with some decent production.

Doesn't matter. Good teams find a way to win these games. For example, the Yankees won 3 straight 2-1 games in the past 3 days. Did they not deserve to win because they scored 2 lousy runs 3 straight days?

We need to win these games. Period.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:51 PM
The reality of it is Bobby is extremely overweight, and his velocity is down. 9.0 ERA in the month of July. His ERA has blown over 4. How can you not be concerned?

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 09:51 PM
Anyone who was surprised at how the 9th inning turned out was just fooling themselves. This had blown save written all over it with how Jenks has done lately and him facing the heart of their order.

....oh being unable to score with bases loaded and 1 out gave us this loss too.

(and let's not forget Podsednik's bunt right to the pitcher to double off Beckham at 2nd when we had nobody out. :angry:

PODS has been good, but 3 bad at bats tonight. Plus, he let a single drop in front of him in Center that turned into a run. This is baseball though. We will be fine.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:51 PM
What you wonder about is *** Kenny was thinking about in the offseason when he put this team together with NO BENCH. We have nobody to turn to in the late innings for pinch hitting.


The AL isn't a big pinch hitting league.

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:52 PM
It's one thing to say a player sucks. It's another thing to say **** you to that player. Anyone who does that is a ****ing ******* and not a fan I want rooting for my team.

If theres one man that deserves to say that to him it is Clayton Richard.

WhiteSoxFan84
07-21-2009, 09:52 PM
I still say tomorrow's Cubune headline will be;

"Frustrated Pierzynski Hits Opposing Pitcher After His Pitcher Blows Save"

Hartman
07-21-2009, 09:52 PM
His velocity is way down and he has no movement. What's left? Meatballs.

And it's clear he's gone mental.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
Jenks is very overweight.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
What? Really? I defended after he **** all over the field the last 2 outings, I'm done. Jenks sucks lately. How can you deny it?

So sucking lately means he will always suck?

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
Who would want Jenks at this point? :angry:


Honestly, people want to trade and unload a guy while they suck. Brilliant:rolleyes:

Woofer
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
Jenks was brutal tonight, so was the offense. We had a rookie pitch his butt off tonight, and we have a rookie going again tomorrow. This game was winable, Dotel or Thornton should have been in for the ninth. I feel sick.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
If theres one man that deserves to say that to him it is Clayton Richard.
A player like Richard has the right to say that, but of course I expect Richard to be polite unlike our moronic poster who said "**** you" to Bobby Jenks. I recall the exact same poster saying similar things about Konerko last year. Moron is the only word for that.

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
So sucking lately means he will always suck?

Hope not.

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
The reality of it is Bobby is extremely overweight, and his velocity is down. 9.0 ERA in the month of July. His ERA has blown over 4. How can you not be concerned?
When has Bobby being overweight ever been an issue? Now you're just being stupid.

PeteWard
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
The reality of it is Bobby is extremely overweight, and his velocity is down. 9.0 ERA in the month of July. His ERA has blown over 4. How can you not be concerned?

Concerned yes but didn't Nathan and Rivera have much worse spells last year?

Noneck
07-21-2009, 09:53 PM
Jenks had thrown a ton of pitches latley, and shouldn't have been out there. He's the clsoer, and a damn good one. He's not perfect.

I guess that means, you dont think he should be closing tonight or tomorrow? How about thursday? So, He shouldnt be closing? Thats my point.

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
Well let's hope that this may be a career-ish type of turnaround for Clayton...he threw 100+ pitches today!?

BleacherBandit
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
Jenks looked pretty shaky yesterday, too. I don't know why Ozzie didn't put somebody else in.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
So sucking lately means he will always suck?


And if he really outright "sucked", they would have scored at least 2 more runs in that 9th inning. He didn't let his problems get the game out of hand.

Jurr
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
Anyone who was surprised at how the 9th inning turned out was just fooling themselves. This had blown save written all over it with how Jenks has done lately and him facing the heart of their order.

....oh being unable to score with bases loaded and 1 out gave us this loss too.

(and let's not forget Podsednik's bunt right to the pitcher to double off Beckham at 2nd when we had nobody out. :angry:

In a sea of completely moronic, myopic rants about "Bobby is finished" or "Bobby sux", we get a gleaming nugget of intelligence.

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
His velocity is way down and he has no movement. What's left? Meatballs.

And it's clear he's gone mental.

I think that is an exxageration. He did strike out the side last night and had some nasty movement. He sucked tonight, yes. I still think he got squeezed on a few pitches.

hi im skot
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
The reality of it is Bobby is extremely overweight, and his velocity is down. 9.0 ERA in the month of July. His ERA has blown over 4. How can you not be concerned?

Weight has absolutely nothing to do with it.

Also, he's the same size he was in 2005. Thanks for playing, though.

Shoeless
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
Games like these make a move with Beckham even less possible. That guy was our offense tonight

PhillipsBubba
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
If the Fat Bobby Jenks keeps pitching like this, his trade value will diminish.

Also, Ozzie should wake up...he should have pinch run for the gimpy Carlos Quentin in the 7th (which I called for during the inning).

Of course, in-game strategy is OG's weakness

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 09:54 PM
Jenks is very overweight.
Hey..is Jenks overweight?

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:55 PM
When has Bobby being overweight ever been an issue? Now you're just being stupid.

He's always been big, but now he is extremely overweight!

Dick Allen
07-21-2009, 09:55 PM
Losing velocity is one thing, but the friggin walks and HBP's are the killers.

Jollyroger2
07-21-2009, 09:55 PM
Meh. This kind of game is no different than the way the Sox have been all year...mediocrity at its best. Wouldn't suprise me at all if they were several games under .500 again after this stretch vs. solid teams coming up.

Red Barchetta
07-21-2009, 09:55 PM
I knew those runners left on base would cost us, however I was also hoping for the good Bobby to show up. Once the first batter got a hit, I though oh no, not two nights in a row....:(:

Get 'em tomorrow and Thursday and win the series!

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:55 PM
Games like these make a move with Beckham even less possible. That guy was our offense tonight


No one was moving him before tonight.

Frankfan4life
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
Bobby is real shaky. It's beyond scary when he pitches with less than a three-run lead. I'm sorry but I have very little confidence in him at this point.

Why Ozzie let's Jenks stay out there and struggle like that is beyond me. You put the first two batters on and you stay in the game? After Jenks hit the second batter, that should have been a clue that Jenks was not working with his good stuff again. I hope this never happens again.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
Losing velocity is one thing, but the friggin walks and HBP's are the killers.


You can't keep walking Pat Burrell either... the guy isn't hitting his weight.

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
Losing velocity is one thing, but the friggin walks and HBP's are the killers.

This.

Shoeless
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
No one was moving him before tonight.
I know. I just listen to too much radio

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
He's always been big, but now he is extremely overweight!
You mean he's gained weight over the past two weeks? How did you notice that?

Tragg
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
What a ****ing brutal loss when you get a once a season type performance from Clayton ****ing Richard.

He's had 13 starts
5 good
7 bad
1 so-so

My question is why did Ozzie let him throw 116? He rarely lets anyone go much past 100.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
Who closes tomorrow?

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
Games like these make a move with Beckham even less possible. That guy was our offense tonight

Exactly. Roy Halliday would not have helped in the ninth inning tonight...Or hit with runners in scoring position. It's asinine to create a bunch of new holes just to fill one. Stupid.

dakotasox
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
I'm sorry it's one thing to be disappointed over a player's performance, but to say **** you to him is over the top. Go bugger off please. :dtroll: and stop being a :dumbass:
Why do you always defend everything about this team and the organization as a whole?

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
His velocity is way down and he has no movement. What's left? Meatballs.

And it's clear he's gone mental.


When he's bad he's fat.

When he's good he's big.

veeter
07-21-2009, 09:56 PM
Games like these make a move with Beckham even less possible. That guy was our offense tonightThe thought of moving Beckham under any circumstances is ridiculous.

1989
07-21-2009, 09:57 PM
Jenks better shave that piece of **** on his chin though, you can't have that there and suck ***

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 09:57 PM
He's always been big, but now he is extremely overweight!So are you telling me Jenks is overweight? Because what you're saying isn't very clear.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:57 PM
You mean he's gained weight over the past two weeks? How did you notice that?


Apparently there have been stories of him overindulging in food and drink.

DirtySox
07-21-2009, 09:57 PM
When he's bad he's fat.

When he's good he's big.

I like this post.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Why do you always defend everything about this team and the organization as a whole?
I'm not defending Jenks. I'm just saying no fan should ever say "**** you" to a player over his performance. ... is such a "fan" (and I use that term lightly). He said the same **** about Paulie and it pisses me off to see such disrespect for a player who has done so much for this team.

Patrick134
07-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Who closes tomorrow?


Not Bobby but that's more based on high pitch counts this week than any perceived problems.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Why are people complaining about Jenk's velocity. THAT IS NOT THE PROBLEM! He is having trouble locating his pitches. But who wants logic when you can just say "**** you!"

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Apparently there have been stories of him overindulging in food and drink.
Source???

october23sp
07-21-2009, 09:59 PM
Now I know why Josies on a Vacation far away.

hi im skot
07-21-2009, 09:59 PM
Who closes tomorrow?

Probably someone who's "very overweight."

Apparently there have been stories of him overindulging in food and drink.

Let's see some links.

Jurr
07-21-2009, 09:59 PM
Losing velocity is one thing, but the friggin walks and HBP's are the killers.

Bobby's always been like that. He has a rough outing or two featuring nail biters, he gets shaky, them he blows one. Suddenly he realizes that he blew a save and it didn't end his life, and he comes back strong. He's fine.

SoxandtheCityTee
07-21-2009, 09:59 PM
All blown saves are painful. Got to love the performance from Clayton, and the hitting by the bottom of the order.

Jenks is noticeably heavier. I don't know what he's eating or drinking, or if or how that affects his pitching, but anyone who thinks he weighs now what he weighed in 2005 hasn't looked at the DVDs in a while. It makes me wonder if he is generally OK.

Let's take three out of four from these guys.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 09:59 PM
Source???

It was mentioned on the SCORE. I believe Boers and Bernstein

shingo10
07-21-2009, 09:59 PM
Remember our season has been pronounced over at least 20 times already this year. Yet by this time tomorrow we could be just 1 game out of 1st place.

Closers blow saves. It happens every year. Every time it happens it sucks and hurts bad. But it's part of the game. Sometimes the offense doesn't hit, sometimes the defense makes errors. Just move on.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 10:00 PM
It was mentioned on the SCORE. I believe Boers and Bernstein

Well now we know it's true.

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 10:01 PM
It was mentioned on the SCORE. I believe Boers and Bernstein

Right. And I bet this was a story from well over 5 years ago.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 10:01 PM
Are we ever going to get 5 games over .500?

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:01 PM
It was mentioned on the SCORE. I believe Boers and Bernstein
Those two guys are just *******s. Take what they say with a lump of salt.

1989
07-21-2009, 10:01 PM
Meh. This kind of game is no different than the way the Sox have been all year...mediocrity at its best. Wouldn't suprise me at all if they were several games under .500 again after this stretch vs. solid teams coming up.

PuhLEASE. Despite the score, we were the better team tonight, as well as last night. If you can't see that this is a different team than the beginning of the season, I can't help you.

october23sp
07-21-2009, 10:01 PM
Bobby's fat isn't the problem. He's hanging pitches and pitching wildly.

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 10:02 PM
Jenks better shave that piece of **** on his chin though, you can't have that there and suck ***


Honestly, this is the most intelligent post of this thread. Agreed, shave that until you start pitching again like Bobby Jenks.

ode to veeck
07-21-2009, 10:02 PM
Right. And I bet this was a story from well over 5 years ago.

... that they replayed after tonight's game to save on costs

BadBobbyJenks
07-21-2009, 10:03 PM
He's had 13 starts
5 good
7 bad
1 so-so

My question is why did Ozzie let him throw 116? He rarely lets anyone go much past 100.

You are right I am being a little hard on him, but he had 3 good starts at the end of May and he has been very mediocre at best until tonight.

TDog
07-21-2009, 10:03 PM
What's up with Bobby?

Last night he had some bad luck and was overextended. In fact, last night they didn't hit the ball well off of him but still loaded the bases. I thought he worked so hard last night that he wouldn't come in tonight.

I said in the game thread that I thought Thornton should come in because he matches up better against the Rays lineup. I thought Richard was out of gas. I wasn't surprised Richard pitched well -- he often pitches well against the Rays. I was surprised he lasted so long.

With Thornton in, Crawford and Pena would have stayed on the bench, although their presence didn't turn out to be the decisive factor. I posted this in the game thread before the ninth inning.

I don't think Jenks' outing tonight means there is a closer crisis on the Sox. I think part of the problem is the closer mentality. The Sox are deep enough that they shouldn't need to pitch Jenks on Tuesday night if he was overextended on Monday night. Forster and Gossage used to share save duties when they were coming up with the Sox, but that was before Guillen's time.

The Twins blew a 10-run lead last night. The Tigers had an 8-1 lead at one point tonight, and their closer had the tying Mariners run at second with one out in the ninth, although he got the next two outs without incident.

When Keith Foulke lost it for the Sox, under a previous manager, he ended up going to other teams where he had greater success and even got a World Series ring before some of his former teammates on the Sox got theirs.

I think it's unfortunate Jenks came in tonight, and didn't even think he was the right man for the job, but I think he remains a very good closer and should continue to be an important part of this team.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 10:03 PM
People mocked me about my bullpen concerns, I am very concerned if Jenks can't get it together.

We don't go anywhere without an horse closing games.

Baron
07-21-2009, 10:03 PM
I'm not defending Jenks. I'm just saying no fan should ever say "**** you" to a player over his performance. ... is such a "fan" (and I use that term lightly). He said the same **** about Paulie and it pisses me off to see such disrespect for a player who has done so much for this team.

When you pay good money to see a game and they blow it like this I dont care what you call the players

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 10:03 PM
He's had 13 starts
5 good
7 bad
1 so-so

My question is why did Ozzie let him throw 116? He rarely lets anyone go much past 100.

No kidding...the kid looked damn good tonight...I was scared going into the 8th but Clayton got it done....

Shoeless
07-21-2009, 10:04 PM
Those two guys are just *******s. Take what they say with a lump of salt.

how do you figure? Today they argued that a good team is 20 games over .500. at the end of the year, that's 91-71. Is that unrealistic? That sounds about right to me.

Jollyroger2
07-21-2009, 10:04 PM
PuhLEASE. Despite the score, we were the better team tonight, as well as last night. If you can't see that this is a different team than the beginning of the season, I can't help you.

See it your way. I see a team that no matter how you slice it, has hovered around .500 the whole year, and the only reason they're not far out of first is cause the division blows. They're the textbook definition of mediocre.

Jurr
07-21-2009, 10:05 PM
Yup, the crazies are out tonight. I would've loved to have seen your thoughts on here during the Koch administration. Many Kodak moments, for sure.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:05 PM
When you pay good money to see a game and they blow it like this I dont care what you call the players
But this "fan" didn't pay **** to see the game and was watching it on his couch like the rest of us here. He posted the same **** in the game thread.

kobo
07-21-2009, 10:05 PM
Biggest pile of **** fed to White Sox nation, ever.

Thank God I didn't fall for this noneseense.

He can still get people out but he needs to find his **** or a plan B.
This is bull****. You say the same damn thing every single time Jenks has a bad outing. Jenks hasn't thrown in the upper 90's for a couple seasons now and he's done just as well if not better than what he did in 05 and 06. He's not locating his pitches right now and he's falling behind in the count. That has nothing to do with velocity. Believe what you want, but I've watched Jenks pitch and I know he doesn't need to go out and try to blow the ball past everyone to get outs.

Whitesoxfan23
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
I'm sorry it's one thing to be disappointed over a player's performance, but to say **** you to him is over the top. Go bugger off please. :dtroll: and stop being a :dumbass:




This is the second post in this thread where you have flamed other people and gotten away with it. Why don't you just shutup already?

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
Yup, the crazies are out tonight. I would've loved to have seen your thoughts on here during the Koch administration. Many Kodak moments, for sure.

THIS is the most intelligent post in the thread.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
how do you figure? Today they argued that a good team is 20 games over .500. at the end of the year, that's 91-71. Is that unrealistic? That sounds about right to me.
I'm just saying B&B are *******s. It wasn't about a specific comment they made or topic, it is just the general vibe of their show. They were good a few years ago but they have grown into asses.

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
PuhLEASE. Despite the score, we were the better team tonight, as well as last night. If you can't see that this is a different team than the beginning of the season, I can't help you.

Huh?? Is this from the Dave Wanstead 'we would have won the football game were it not four five plays' school of logic.

The better team wins. Period.

Frankfan4life
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
Jenks better shave that piece of **** on his chin though, you can't have that there and suck ***Post Of The Thread! You made me laugh in spite of how mad I am.

SoxGirl4Life
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
It was mentioned on the SCORE. I believe Boers and Bernstein

That's your first mistake

CHISOXFAN13
07-21-2009, 10:06 PM
Jenks sucked, but Podsednik's AB in the seventh also cost us this game.

Pathetic.

dakotasox
07-21-2009, 10:07 PM
I'm not defending Jenks. I'm just saying no fan should ever say "**** you" to a player over his performance. ... is such a "fan" (and I use that term lightly). He said the same **** about Paulie and it pisses me off to see such disrespect for a player who has done so much for this team.
Thanks for answering my question. :rolleyes:

hi im skot
07-21-2009, 10:07 PM
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j146/sschaaf/eeatingpopcornvi_gif1184055840-vi.gif

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 10:07 PM
Last night he had some bad luck and was overextended. In fact, last night they didn't hit the ball well off of him but still loaded the bases. I thought he worked so hard last night that he wouldn't come in tonight.

I said in the game thread that I thought Thornton should come in because he matches up better against the Rays lineup. I thought Richard was out of gas. I wasn't surprised Richard pitched well -- he often pitches well against the Rays. I was surprised he lasted so long.

With Thornton in, Crawford and Pena would have stayed on the bench, although their presence didn't turn out to be the decisive factor. I posted this in the game thread before the ninth inning.

I don't think Jenks' outing tonight means there is a closer crisis on the Sox. I think part of the problem is the closer mentality. The Sox are deep enough that they shouldn't need to pitch Jenks on Tuesday night if he was overextended on Monday night. Forster and Gossage used to share save duties when they were coming up with the Sox, but that was before Guillen's time.

The Twins blew a 10-run lead last night. The Tigers had an 8-1 lead at one point tonight, and their closer had the tying Mariners run at second with one out in the ninth, although he got the next two outs without incident.

When Keith Foulke lost it for the Sox, under a previous manager, he ended up going to other teams where he had greater success and even got a World Series ring before some of his former teammates on the Sox got theirs.

I think it's unfortunate Jenks came in tonight, and didn't even think he was the right man for the job, but I think he remains a very good closer and should continue to be an important part of this team.

Pretty well said. In the end though, I can't blame a manager for going with the odds and putting his undisputed closer in though. I am more upset about his continued useage of Nix, et al as pinch hitters. Nix, Fields, and Wise are our three bench hitters (and Castro). What a crew. All batting about .220 or below. Where is Thad Bosley when you need him?

Crede24Thome25
07-21-2009, 10:07 PM
How about we package Bobby in a deal to Toronto For Halladay. Who's with me.:D:
Bobby to Toronto, and Sherrill to the Sox make it happen Kenny.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:07 PM
This is the second post in this thread where you have flamed other people and gotten away with it. Why don't you just shutup already?
There are few things that piss me off, but disrespecting someone like Bobby Jenks because he blew a save is one of them. It's a ****ing game, you can say the player sucks, but to say "**** you" to the the player is over the top and the person deserved to be called out for it.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 10:08 PM
Huh?? Is this from the Dave Wanstead 'we would have won the football game were it not four five plays' school of logic.

The better team wins. Period.

The Nationals swept the Yankees in Yankee Stadium, who's the better team?

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 10:08 PM
10 pages in 23 minutes...sounds like a White Sox loss!

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 10:08 PM
People mocked me about my bullpen concerns, I am very concerned if Jenks can't get it together.

We don't go anywhere without an horse closing games.


Our pen leaked air the second half of last year too. You could see some cracks about a month ago.

Baron
07-21-2009, 10:08 PM
But this "fan" didn't pay **** to see the game and was watching it on his couch like the rest of us here. He posted the same **** in the game thread.

Look he is paying to watch it.This sounds just like the same crap when Grossman was the QB of the Bears and he went through a crappy performance.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:08 PM
Im a bit concerned about Torres pitching tomorrow. Our history with AAA fill in starts usually translates into a gas can pitcher and a 10-1 loss.

Whitesoxfan23
07-21-2009, 10:09 PM
Why do you always defend everything about this team and the organization as a whole?


He always does that. He thinks he has the right to call other people names too.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:09 PM
Thanks for answering my question. :rolleyes:
I don't defend everything this team does. I however do defend when the hoards of dumbass wannabe GMs and managers rag on every little mistake made. I mean people were ****ing yelling at Ozzie in the game thread for not sending Richard out in the 9th after he threw almost 120 pitches. Of course the same people were bitching about sending him out to pitch the 8th.

hi im skot
07-21-2009, 10:09 PM
There are few things that piss me off, but disrespecting someone like Bobby Jenks because he blew a save is one of them. It's a ****ing game, you can say the player sucks, but to say "**** you" to the the player is over the top and the person deserved to be called out for it.

Word.

soxnut1018
07-21-2009, 10:09 PM
There are few things that piss me off, but disrespecting someone like Bobby Jenks because he blew a save is one of them. It's a ****ing game, you can say the player sucks, but to say "**** you" to the the player is over the top and the person deserved to be called out for it.

Especially when the player is trying, but the results aren't there. If a player is dogging it I can see booing, but saying "**** you" to a player who's giving his all is ridiculous.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:09 PM
Look he is paying to watch it.This sounds just like the same crap when Grossman was the QB of the Bears and he went through a crappy performance.
You can say Grossman sucks, but you don't say "**** you Grossman" the way he said it to Jenks. It's not like either was trying to lose. If a player dogs a play, by all means call him out. Bobby wasn't dogging us and Grossman wasn't. Bobby just sucked tonight, plain and simple. He doesn't deserve the **** ... posted though.

Jurr
07-21-2009, 10:10 PM
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j146/sschaaf/eeatingpopcornvi_gif1184055840-vi.gif

Well played.

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 10:10 PM
I don't defend everything this team does. I however do defend when the hoards of dumbass wannabe GMs and managers rag on every little mistake made. I mean people were ****ing yelling at Ozzie in the game thread for not sending Richard out in the 9th after he threw almost 120 pitches. Of course the same people were bitching about sending him out to pitch the 8th.

Dude...a brutal loss will be a brutal loss - ESPECIALLY at WSI....

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 10:10 PM
Especially when the player is trying, but the results aren't there. If a player is dogging it I can see booing, but saying "**** you" is ridiculous.

I will admit to saying "**** you", and I regret it. Now that I have actually calmed down, and gone for a cigarette, I realize that Jenks may be just having a bad week. Need to give it time.

ChicagoHoosier
07-21-2009, 10:10 PM
Remember our season has been pronounced over at least 20 times already this year. Yet by this time tomorrow we could be just 1 game out of 1st place.

Closers blow saves. It happens every year. Every time it happens it sucks and hurts bad. But it's part of the game. Sometimes the offense doesn't hit, sometimes the defense makes errors. Just move on.

Some of these posts are entertaining me, but this post has some intelligence to it. Very rarely do you have a perfect closer. Bobby's working out some things. Let's HOPE it's just a bad few days at the office. How come there isn't nearly as much complaining about our nine hits and only two runs? We had SO many opportunities that it was (wait for it)... yet again... a collective loss and TB found a way to win the game.

Even in the 9th, we got the leadoff man on board. You can't ask for much more. I really thought TCQ would get him over and then we'd have Beckham to bring him in.

Let's get them tomorrow. I'll be there!

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:11 PM
Anyone else worried about Torres starting tomorrow?

TommyGavinFloyd
07-21-2009, 10:12 PM
There are few things that piss me off, but disrespecting someone like Bobby Jenks because he blew a save is one of them. It's a ****ing game, you can say the player sucks, but to say "**** you" to the the player is over the top and the person deserved to be called out for it.

Why does it matter? Unless you are Bobby Jenks, who cares? "someone like Bobby Jenks", what is he, a saint? I've met him before and he was rude, honestly. If someone wants to say **** you bobby, it's his right. These players make a hell of a lot of money to entertain us. When they don't do it, we can say whatever we want about it. I think Bobby Jenks embarrasses the franchise by having that stupid blonde goatee, are you going to tell me I can't think that too?

1989
07-21-2009, 10:12 PM
No this is from the 'we outplayed them and outhit them, and they were opportunistic' book. They were better for one inning, and they won. It happens. It doesn't mean they were better, however.

SoxGirl4Life
07-21-2009, 10:12 PM
At least we didn't blow a 10 run lead :D:

twentywontowin
07-21-2009, 10:12 PM
I'm glad I don't run a baseball team. I'd throw half this board off my team.

He got roughed up two outings in a row. Rest the guy some, run him back out there.

Whitesoxfan23
07-21-2009, 10:12 PM
Anyway, tough loss. Anybody who is STILL not worried about Jenks, needs to wake up and smell the roses. I'm not too upset about this loss though, because overall, we have done well against the Rays so far this season. Just go back out there and win tomorrow.

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 10:13 PM
I don't defend everything this team does. I however do defend when the hoards of dumbass wannabe GMs and managers rag on every little mistake made. I mean people were ****ing yelling at Ozzie in the game thread for not sending Richard out in the 9th after he threw almost 120 pitches. Of course the same people were bitching about sending him out to pitch the 8th.

Awesome. I agree, even though I am on record for bitching about sending in Nix to pinch hit (I think his 0-9 pinch hit record justifies that). You are right on. Jenks is our CLOSER. How many other mangers would not put their closer in/and or pull them in the same situation? Seriously, this game sucked, but every game lost is not Ozzie's fault. He is good, but he does not have all seeing power to perfectly predict the future, even though we all apparently do (after the fact).

kitekrazy
07-21-2009, 10:13 PM
While I blame Jenks, one key factor that will be overlooked will be that the Sox loaded the bases with one out in the 7th and couldn't come through. No excuses there.

Each hitter K'd on those outs.

GoGoCrede
07-21-2009, 10:13 PM
At least we didn't blow a 10 run lead :D:

My favorite post thus far. :D:

Baron
07-21-2009, 10:13 PM
You can say Grossman sucks, but you don't say "**** you Grossman" the way he said it to Jenks. It's not like either was trying to lose. If a player dogs a play, by all means call him out. Bobby wasn't dogging us and Grossman wasn't. Bobby just sucked tonight, plain and simple. He doesn't deserve the **** ... posted though.

Ofcourse he didnt try to lose it.But when they just plain suck you will get comments like that and you just need to deal with it.Ive been watching the Bears all my life and Im so use to it.Just deal with it.

1989
07-21-2009, 10:14 PM
Anyone else worried about Torres starting tomorrow?

I think he's going to work the Rays. I like what I've read on him. And the Rays haven't done as much scouting on him, I don't see why we can't have a pitcher that stuns a team in their first look at him.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:15 PM
I think he's going to work the Rays. I like what I've read on him. And the Rays haven't done as much scouting on him, I don't see why we can't have a pitcher that stuns a team in their first look at him.
The scouting report on Torres is that he keeps the ball down. If he does that and throws strikes, then I think he'll be fine.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:15 PM
I think he's going to work the Rays. I like what I've read on him. And the Rays haven't done as much scouting on him, I don't see why we can't have a pitcher that stuns a team in their first look at him.

Im just concerned that our history of AAA fill ins usually translates into a gas can pitcher and a 10-1 loss

dagame2005
07-21-2009, 10:16 PM
Im just concerned that our history of AAA fill ins usually translates into a gas can pitcher and a 10-1 loss

Those days will remain nameless, as they have been banned from my memory.

SoxGirl4Life
07-21-2009, 10:16 PM
You can say Grossman sucks, but you don't say "**** you Grossman" the way he said it to Jenks. It's not like either was trying to lose. If a player dogs a play, by all means call him out. Bobby wasn't dogging us and Grossman wasn't. Bobby just sucked tonight, plain and simple. He doesn't deserve the **** ... posted though.

Dude, just put those people on ignore. I have my own little system. Three strikes and they're on my list. I check every once in a while to see if they've grown a brain, if they have, they come off, if they haven't, they stay there. Makes my life a whole lot calmer. And this thread is full of people on my ignore list :wink:

kobo
07-21-2009, 10:16 PM
Im just concerned that our history of AAA fill ins usually translates into a gas can pitcher and a 10-1 loss
Thanks for repeating yourself.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:16 PM
Im just concerned that our history of AAA fill ins usually translates into a gas can pitcher and a 10-1 loss
2004 was just a bad year for us. We also had a few good fill ins before, but they are easy to overlook because 2004 was full of bad AAA fill ins

SoxGirl4Life
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM
My favorite post thus far. :D:

Go Oakland :cool:

TDog
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM
See it your way. I see a team that no matter how you slice it, has hovered around .500 the whole year, and the only reason they're not far out of first is cause the division blows. They're the textbook definition of mediocre.

If the White Sox are mediocre at best, they're in good company. Pretty much the entire league is mediocre at best. The White Sox have won four of six against the Rays this year. They should have won six of six. In the first loss they had a 5-2 lead with two out in the bottom of the sixth when Zobrist hit a grand slam against Matt Thornton in the 6-5 Rays win.

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM
I'll admit I said "**** you" to Jenks and I didn't mean it. I'm just so pissed that Richard pitched his ass off and our closer blew it like that. I'll also say I agree with Richard not going out for the 9th. He had already gone above and beyond and it was time for Bobby to do his job. He didn't. If this is indeed just a bad stretch, I'll be happy when he gets out of it. I hope it doesn't stretch to the point where we have to start looking elsewhere.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM
Dude, just put those people on ignore. I have my own little system. Three strikes and they're on my list. I check every once in a while to see if they've grown a brain, if they have, they come off, if they haven't, they stay there. Makes my life a whole lot calmer. And this thread is full of people on my ignore list :wink:
Advice taken:smile:

Brian26
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM
Why in the hell is Nix pinch-hitting for Getz, who is batting like .400 in his last 10 or whatever games? Factor in that Nix is now 0-10 as a pinch-hitter and is batting something like .200, and you have to wonder. That is not necessarily why we lost, but.....

Nix has some pop in his bat, and like the righty-lefty matchup vs. Howell as opposed to Getz in that situation. I just don't think it was that bad of a move.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM
Those days will remain nameless, as they have been banned from my memory.

Who were those pitchers? I think it was 2003-2004? I might be wrong

kitekrazy
07-21-2009, 10:18 PM
And if he really outright "sucked", they would have scored at least 2 more runs in that 9th inning. He didn't let his problems get the game out of hand.

I'm glad he finished the inning. Dotel was warming up and he's really good at icing a loss.

BigP50
07-21-2009, 10:18 PM
is everyone still drooling over the lineup? :clap:

Brian26
07-21-2009, 10:19 PM
Im just concerned that our history of AAA fill ins usually translates into a gas can pitcher and a 10-1 loss

Seriously, that was five-plus years ago. Let's move on.

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:19 PM
Who were those pitchers? I think it was 2003-2004? I might be wrong
Just off memory...

Neil Cotts, John Adkins, Jon Rauch, Jason Grilli, and there are others. Help me out here.

voodoochile
07-21-2009, 10:19 PM
I will admit to saying "**** you", and I regret it. Now that I have actually calmed down, and gone for a cigarette, I realize that Jenks may be just having a bad week. Need to give it time.

Ah shucks... I can feel the love flowing. Thanks everyone for figuring it out and not forcing me to step in. I really do appreciate it. I know these types of losses suck more than most.

Get 'em tomorrow. Group hug...

What, too soon? :tongue:

slavko
07-21-2009, 10:20 PM
With the amount of pitches he's thrown recently, Bobby should not have even been in there.

Say, you're not the guy that excused his last bad outing because "he was rusty," are you?

Jenks was brutal tonight, so was the offense. We had a rookie pitch his butt off tonight, and we have a rookie going again tomorrow. This game was winable, Dotel or Thornton should have been in for the ninth. I feel sick.

Clayton looked like a clone of our other lefties. He showed me he's better than Poreda. Dotel? Thornton? Therein lies the problem. We don't have a viable replacement for Jenks. Colon!

Jenks looked pretty shaky yesterday, too. I don't know why Ozzie didn't put somebody else in. Because there is no one else.

Each hitter K'd on those outs.
Took fastballs for strikes that could have been put in play and waved at wicked curves for strike 3.

TheOldRoman
07-21-2009, 10:20 PM
The reality of it is Bobby is extremely overweight, and his velocity is down. 9.0 ERA in the month of July. His ERA has blown over 4. How can you not be concerned?As other have said, there are many incredibly dumb posts in this thread. I will take the time to address this one. Despite what people think, Bobby is the same size he was 4 years ago. The same "ZOMG! His velocity is gone!!1!!1!" people are always rushing to claim he has put on weight. He hasn't, and his weight isn't effecting his pitching. It is amazing how any time Bobby doesn't have a 1-2-3 ninth, he is up to 350lbs in some people's eyes.

Most importantly, he hasn't lost velocity. We go through this dance every year. He is a better pitcher now than he was in 2006. He can still throw 100 when he feels like it. He has reached 100 a few times this year, and he was throwing that hard at the end of last season and the playoffs. He was horrible tonight, no doubt. I don't know how hard he was throwing, but walking people was his biggest problem.

And the most ridiculous of all the posts are the ones either clamoring to trade Jenks and regretting we didn't trade him because he has no value. If you have been a fan for more than a few months, you will recall that Bobby has gone through rough stretches every season. I believe his worst was in 07, right before he started in MLB record streak. That was the cold spell that prompted someone to claim Kevin Gregg and Jeremy Accardo were better than Bobby. He will be out of his funk shortly.

But it is a good thing for the offense that Bobby blew it in the ninth. If Richard would have given up those three runs instead, we would have started hearing about the unseasonably cool weather affecting our bats. I tell ya, feisty, if you can't win scoring two runs, you've got a problem. Let's hope we don't tip our caps again this time tomorrow.

Brian26
07-21-2009, 10:20 PM
Who were those pitchers? I think it was 2003-2004? I might be wrong

Felix Diaz, Danny Wright, David Saunders, Josh Stewart, Jon Rauch...

Different era in Sox history.

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 10:20 PM
Just off memory...

Neil Cotts, John Adkins, Jon Rauch, Jason Grilli, and there are others. Help me out here.
Josh Stewart, Felix Diaz, Gary Glover

PeoriaSoxFan
07-21-2009, 10:20 PM
Nix has some pop in his bat, and like the righty-lefty matchup vs. Howell as opposed to Getz in that situation. I just don't think it was that bad of a move.

Maybe not, but still 0-10 as a Pinch Hitter and a sub .230 batting average, with 68 total games in MLB, don't exactly inspire you in these kind of situations. Getz has been hot. I was hoping of a HR as well. TCQ had a bad at bat, although I thought he had 1 bad strike call on him that turned the AB. He will get it going again. Nix, I am not so sure of.

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 10:21 PM
Nix has some pop in his bat, and like the righty-lefty matchup vs. Howell as opposed to Getz in that situation. I just don't think it was that bad of a move.

Nix has warning track power and should cut down on his swing and not concern himself with home runs. As far as the "pop" is concerned, is it the .228 average and 12 RBIs that you were referring to?

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:21 PM
Felix Diaz, Danny Wright, David Saunders, Josh Stewart, Jon Rauch...

Different era in Sox history.
I think we got them all if you combine my list with yours. I forgot about Saunders, Diaz, and Stewart. I actually had high hopes for Diaz too. Didn't they begin with Wright as their 5th starter?

dagame2005
07-21-2009, 10:21 PM
Just off memory...

Neil Cotts, John Adkins, Jon Rauch, Jason Grilli, and there are others. Help me out here.

Oh, there have been much worse. Lest we forget Felix Diaz (though he did have one good start!) and (dear god) Arnie Munoz

kittle42
07-21-2009, 10:22 PM
I stopped reading after 3 pages. People are stupid.

The best post was the one that asked how people didn't see this blown save coming. Like many Sox failures, I wish someone had bet me on it before it happened.

Baron
07-21-2009, 10:22 PM
Advice taken:smile:


lol Im not that bad :wink:

kittle42
07-21-2009, 10:22 PM
is everyone still drooling over the lineup? :clap:

You know, BigP, I really don't agree with you usually, but excellent post.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:23 PM
Oh, there have been much worse. Lest we forget Felix Diaz (though he did have one good start!) and (dear god) Arnie Munoz

Arnie Munoz was the classic start. I believe it was against the Expos where he litereally couldnt get anyone out. I think he gave up like 10 runs in 1 or 2 innings. Ozzie couldnt pull him cause the bullpen was taxed. Bad history.

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 10:24 PM
Arnie Munoz was the classic start. I believe it was against the Expos where he litereally couldnt get anyone out. I think he gave up like 10 runs in 1 or 2 innings. Ozzie couldnt pull him cause the bullpen was taxed. Bad history.

I think he has been reincarnated as Gio Gonzalez

dagame2005
07-21-2009, 10:25 PM
Arnie Munoz was the classic start. I believe it was against the Expos where he litereally couldnt get anyone out. I think he gave up like 10 runs in 1 or 2 innings. Ozzie couldnt pull him cause the bullpen was taxed. Bad history.

All I remember hearing is how good his curve was. He was so nervous up in the big leagues that it had next to no movement at all. This thread has amazingly helped me cool down. Jenks' problems stem mainly from location and not stuff. He has figured it out before and will again. So basically, the end to this game sucked. But, what else is there to do but lace them up again and get them tomorrow?

WhiteSox1989
07-21-2009, 10:26 PM
Ah shucks... I can feel the love flowing. Thanks everyone for figuring it out and not forcing me to step in. I really do appreciate it. I know these types of losses suck more than most.

Get 'em tomorrow. Group hug...

What, too soon? :tongue:

Hey I said get 'em tomorrow, and closed the thread ten pages back.:D:

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:27 PM
All I remember hearing is how good his curve was. He was so nervous up in the big leagues that it had next to no movement at all. This thread has amazingly helped me cool down. Jenks' problems stem mainly from location and not stuff. He has figured it out before and will again. So basically, the end to this game sucked. But, what else is there to do but lace them up again and get them tomorrow?

Just when you get hot at Bobby "Remember Arnie Munoz"

Lip Man 1
07-21-2009, 10:27 PM
A tough loss...really a bad loss.

You blow a game and fall another game back in the standings which is big because you have to go to the divisional leader over the weekend and you want to be as close as you possibly can to them in the standings...and you blow a stunning performance by a starting pitcher who doesn't give you many of those.

This is the 5th game the Sox lost when having the lead in the 7th inning or later this year and the 2nd directly caused by Jenks (5/24 was the other one...)

Someone else mentioned it but it bears repeating, this offense appears to be going into a funk again. 12 runs in the last four games, and they are leaving a ton of guys on base. It didn't catch up to them yesterday but it did tonight.

Whole different game if they can get one or two home in the 7th inning.

With a rookie going tomorrow for the Sox this one needed to be locked up...period.

Lip

gobears1987
07-21-2009, 10:27 PM
I think he has been reincarnated as Gio Gonzalez
We almost came back too in that Expos game.

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:29 PM
A tough loss...really a bad loss.

You blow a game and fall another game back in the standings which is big because you have to go to the divisional leader over the weekend and you want to be as close as you possibly can to them in the standings...and you blow a stunning performance by a starting pitcher who doesn't give you many of those.

This is the 5th game the Sox lost when having the lead in the 7th inning or later this year and the 2nd directly caused by Jenks (5/24 was the other one...)

Someone else mentioned it but it bears repeating, this offense appears to be going into a funk again. 12 runs in the last four games, and they are leaving a ton of guys on base. It didn't catch up to them yesterday but it did tonight.

Whole different game if they can get one or two home in the 7th inning.

With a rookie going tomorrow for the Sox this one needed to be locked up...period.

Lip

Calm down and "Remember Arnie Munoz" it could be worse.

tsoxman
07-21-2009, 10:30 PM
A tough loss...really a bad loss.

You blow a game and fall another game back in the standings which is big because you have to go to the divisional leader over the weekend and you want to be as close as you possibly can to them in the standings...and you blow a stunning performance by a starting pitcher who doesn't give you many of those.

This is the 5th game the Sox lost when having the lead in the 7th inning or later this year and the 2nd directly caused by Jenks (5/24 was the other one...)

Someone else mentioned it but it bears repeating, this offense appears to be going into a funk again. 12 runs in the last four games, and they are leaving a ton of guys on base. It didn't catch up to them yesterday but it did tonight.

Whole different game if they can get one or two home in the 7th inning.

With a rookie going tomorrow for the Sox this one needed to be locked up...period.

Lip
Top 5 guys in the lineup 1/20

dagame2005
07-21-2009, 10:30 PM
For the record, A nice Fat Tire Ale helps dull the pain of this loss as well.

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-21-2009, 10:30 PM
A tough loss...really a bad loss.

You blow a game and fall another game back in the standings which is big because you have to go to the divisional leader over the weekend and you want to be as close as you possibly can to them in the standings...and you blow a stunning performance by a starting pitcher who doesn't give you many of those.

This is the 5th game the Sox lost when having the lead in the 7th inning or later this year and the 2nd directly caused by Jenks (5/24 was the other one...)

Someone else mentioned it but it bears repeating, this offense appears to be going into a funk again. 12 runs in the last four games, and they are leaving a ton of guys on base. It didn't catch up to them yesterday but it did tonight.

Whole different game if they can get one or two home in the 7th inning.

With a rookie going tomorrow for the Sox this one needed to be locked up...period.

Lip

What really hurt was that Scotty Pods (Mr. Consistency) went 0-4 and two of those missed opportunities could've instantly turned this one into a winner...I guess we'll have these days....

soxyess
07-21-2009, 10:32 PM
I jnow we are all ticked at Bobby and aggrivated about tonight's game, but Im advocating that we all relax grab a cold one, and "Remember Arnie Munoz" it could be worse!!!

BigP50
07-21-2009, 10:32 PM
You know, BigP, I really don't agree with you usually, but excellent post.


+ this was pretty much the same exact team as we had on opening day except swap Pods and Wise. Yes Pods is way better then Wise but before the season people thought we had no chance and now people are drooling over the lineup?

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 10:35 PM
A tough loss...really a bad loss.

You blow a game and fall another game back in the standings which is big because you have to go to the divisional leader over the weekend and you want to be as close as you possibly can to them in the standings...and you blow a stunning performance by a starting pitcher who doesn't give you many of those.

This is the 5th game the Sox lost when having the lead in the 7th inning or later this year and the 2nd directly caused by Jenks (5/24 was the other one...)

Someone else mentioned it but it bears repeating, this offense appears to be going into a funk again. 12 runs in the last four games, and they are leaving a ton of guys on base. It didn't catch up to them yesterday but it did tonight.

Whole different game if they can get one or two home in the 7th inning.

With a rookie going tomorrow for the Sox this one needed to be locked up...period.

Lip
The most intelligent post in the thread. I'm not concerned about the offense yet, but if it continues for the rest of the series, then I'll start to get worried. We needed to win this game after a strong outing from a young pitcher. There's nothing we can do about it now though. We'll get that win back later this year.

sox230
07-21-2009, 10:36 PM
The worst part of this is that Clayton Richard threw well and we still lost...now Richard will stay around and suck some more down the stretch....unless we make a trade

Lip Man 1
07-21-2009, 10:36 PM
Soxyess:

I thought I was being calm. There's nothing over the top or unreasonable in the statements.

It was a very bad loss and a game that could have been won fairly easily.

Sox 230...that's a good point. Some (Ozzie?) will start to think this guy can pitch and the past year and a half seems to show it was more of an abberation.

Lip

BigP50
07-21-2009, 10:38 PM
Honestly when Bartlett got on base I knew the game was over, with Longoria coming up and pinch hitters they had, it gave me a bad feeling.

FielderJones
07-21-2009, 10:46 PM
Wow, I fully expected to find this in the Roadhouse -- in fact, had I been at home instead of at this crapfest, I would have started the thread in the Roadhouse.

As for Bobby, dead arm is another possibility besides hurt or washed up.

Hardly mentioned: our 1, 3, 4, and 5 hitters were 0-16. Need more than that out of that part of the lineup.

Sucks to lose this, I hope Coop can fix whatever's broken with Bobby, and on with the season. There are more games ahead.

JB98
07-21-2009, 10:46 PM
Honestly when Bartlett got on base I knew the game was over, with Longoria coming up and pinch hitters they had, it gave me a bad feeling.

Yeah, Jenks missed location to Bartlett and you just knew trouble was coming. Getting the leadoff hitter is always important, but especially so in a one-run game.

If you get the leadoff man, you can walk the bases loaded and still get out of the inning with a ground ball.

Jenks has no control of his fastball right now.

FielderJones
07-21-2009, 10:50 PM
One other thing: what's the deal with walking Pat ****ing Burrell? It's not just Bobby. Our starters have been walking him as well. The guy is hitting .227 -- just throw the ball over the plate and he'll get himself out.

voodoochile
07-21-2009, 10:51 PM
+ this was pretty much the same exact team as we had on opening day except swap Pods and Wise. Yes Pods is way better then Wise but before the season people thought we had no chance and now people are drooling over the lineup?

We've also got Beckham instead of Fields and Getz has proven to be an effective player. So the Team went from having 3 major question marks (Wise, Fields Getz) and no established leadoff hitter to having a very solid leadoff hitter and 9 solid bats.

In addition, PK is having a nice bounce back year from a year he struggled with injuries and didn't produce much and Thome has proven he's not completely washed up. Add in TCM not having a sophmore jinx and yeah, I can see why people are a LOT more excited about this lineup than they were on opening day and no, it's not the same, not even close, no matter how much you want to dismiss it with "just Pods for Wise swap".

Basing the results on one bad game is just plain silly. Are you honestly saying you don't think this lineup is a good one? :scratch:

I gotta admit, I find that hard to believe.

Since you seem hellbent on dismissing this lineup as not as good as people say it is, can you elaborate why?

Gavin
07-21-2009, 10:54 PM
I think it's stupid to argue the offensive lineup in a game when a guy's whose only job is to get 3 outs without an ER failed after a night he almost failed.

BigP50
07-21-2009, 10:56 PM
Show me where I say this isn't a good lineup.


Its good, but I just dont see why someone would drool over this line up.

voodoochile
07-21-2009, 10:56 PM
I think it's stupid to argue the offensive lineup in a game when a guy's whose only job is to get 3 outs without an ER failed after a night he almost failed.

Well thanks for your input. Should we just shut up now and let you get on with your discussion of Bobby and his sinful ways or maybe if you don't want to talk about a topic that some might find pertinent that you simply not comment on that topic. I know... it's tough... So many people to tell to shut up so little time...

JB98
07-21-2009, 10:57 PM
Niemann pitched a good game, too. His curve ball is pretty tough, and he snapped off some good ones to get out of that seventh-inning jam. That was one of the key moments of the game in retrospect.

Hopefully, we have another ninth-inning lead tomorrow, and Jenks can right his wrongs.

voodoochile
07-21-2009, 10:58 PM
Show me where I say this isn't a good lineup.


Its good, but I just dont see why someone would drool over this line up.

No, you made the claim it isn't a good lineup and is effectively no better than opening day with a bunch of unproven bats and some players coming off a bad season and no effective leadoff hitter.

Please. I defer the floor to you. Back that **** up...

SOXfnNlansing
07-21-2009, 10:58 PM
No way you extend Bobby. He will be moved this offseason.


:tealpolice:

ode to veeck
07-21-2009, 10:59 PM
Sox 230...that's a good point. Some (Ozzie?) will start to think this guy can pitch and the past year and a half seems to show it was more of an abberation.

Lip

Actually, Clayton didn't pitch bad at all in his 1st few starts when given the ball after Barto went down, then was caving in like the 4th or 5th inning recently, so I'm not at all surprized to see him post another quality start.

There could be upside for Richard as a starter yet (at least that's how us glass half full folks see it Lip ;-)

BigP50
07-21-2009, 10:59 PM
I think it's stupid to argue the offensive lineup in a game when a guy's whose only job is to get 3 outs without an ER failed after a night he almost failed.


dude, we had 2 runs

Gavin
07-21-2009, 10:59 PM
Well thanks for your input. Should we just shut up now and let you get on with your discussion of Bobby and his sinful ways or maybe if you don't want to talk about a topic that some might find pertinent that you simply not comment on that topic. I know... it's tough... So many people to tell to shut up so little time...

Why blame the obvious?

There's so many little things to nibble on for discussion. I guess this is a message board, after all. Sorry to disrupt your bullet points.

dude, we had 2 runs

We had a one run advantage and lost in the top of the 9th inning. It's going to happen, but anyone who is still blaming the offense and not Bobby Jenks after his last two outings is deluded.

ShoelessJoeS
07-21-2009, 10:59 PM
Way to let your teammates down Bobby. This one hurts.

JB98
07-21-2009, 11:00 PM
Actually, Clayton didn't pitch bad at all in his 1st few starts when given the ball after Barto went down, then was caving in like the 4th or 5th inning recently, so I'm not at all surprized to see him post another quality start.

There could be upside for Richard as a starter yet (at least that's how us glass half full folks see it Lip ;-)

I'm really glad Richard pitched well. I don't think much of Colon at this stage of his career, and I'm rooting for Clayton to keep his spot in the rotation.

I think Richard has a nice assortment of pitches. If he gets them over more consistently, he can be a nice No. 4 starter, IMO.

voodoochile
07-21-2009, 11:04 PM
I'm really glad Richard pitched well. I don't think much of Colon at this stage of his career, and I'm rooting for Clayton to keep his spot in the rotation.

I think Richard has a nice assortment of pitches. If he gets them over more consistently, he can be a nice No. 4 starter, IMO.

I'm starting to wonder if he just doesn't have the arm stamina to do it consistently. Tonight after a long layoff his fastball was popping better and he had better placement on his off speed pitch. A couple of his changeups that stayed up and outside were almost Buehrlesque. After a few starts last time he came down to Earth as he lost pop on his fast ball and stopped placing the other pitches as well.

I have no idea if this is true or not, just something that occurred to me.

BigP50
07-21-2009, 11:06 PM
I'm starting to wonder if he just doesn't have the arm stamina to do it consistently. Tonight after a long layoff his fastball was popping better and he had better placement on his off speed pitch. A couple of his changeups that stayed up and outside were almost Buehrlesque. After a few starts last time he came down to Earth as he lost pop on his fast ball and stopped placing the other pitches as well.

I have no idea if this is true or not, just something that occurred to me.



I didn't even think of that, but it makes perfect sense. He started the season very well if I remember then started to tail off, now since he had a break, he gained some arm strength. Interesting.

voodoochile
07-21-2009, 11:07 PM
We had a one run advantage and lost in the top of the 9th inning. It's going to happen, but anyone who is still blaming the offense and not Bobby Jenks after his last two outings is deluded.

Bit of both, really. If the Sox had scored more runs (especially in the 8th) Bobby would have had a bigger cushion and the game might have ended after the top of the ninth or gone to extras.

When you give your closer the slimmest of margins especially when he has been struggling a bit you don't leave any room for mistakes. So yeah, you can blame the offense a bit for tonight too. Yes, you want and expect your closer to not blow games but for the most part they all do and the smaller the lead the more likely it is to happen.

Tonight was one of Bobby's blown saves. It won't be his last, probably not even this year.

Gavin
07-21-2009, 11:14 PM
Bit of both, really. If the Sox had scored more runs (especially in the 8th) Bobby would have had a bigger cushion and the game might have ended after the top of the ninth or gone to extras.

When you give your closer the slimmest of margins especially when he has been struggling a bit you don't leave any room for mistakes. So yeah, you can blame the offense a bit for tonight too. Yes, you want and expect your closer to not blow games but for the most part they all do and the smaller the lead the more likely it is to happen.

Tonight was one of Bobby's blown saves. It won't be his last, probably not even this year.

I agree it would have been nice to have more runs. But I also think a closer shouldn't be facing first and second with no outs after throwing a total of three pitches. He's got zero confidence in his pitches. Besides, you're arguing hypothetical; yeah, a two or three run lead would have been a different situation than a one run lead.. but let's talk about what actually happened. I'm just tired of seeing this predicable **** unfold. What do you do with a closer that can't throw strikes for outs?

ode to veeck
07-21-2009, 11:17 PM
I didn't even think of that, but it makes perfect sense. He started the season very well if I remember then started to tail off, now since he had a break, he gained some arm strength. Interesting.

As a guy who's really just coming into the starting role since in the middle 3rd of the season, he looks like he might be coming around well -- it takes time to make the converson to consistent starter

TDog
07-21-2009, 11:17 PM
I think he has been reincarnated as Gio Gonzalez

But Gio Gonzalez never started for the White Sox. After great consternation of trading this future Hall of Famer, he actually had a promising debut against the Blue Jays, who apparently have trouble with pitchers they have never seen before. Then he came home to Oakland, and the White Sox ripped into him. And he looked even worse against the Twins last night.

If a pitcher has good stuff and keeps it together under the pressure of pitching in the majors for the first time, he has a good shot at doing well. A lot of it is mental.

You could see it when the Sox faced Vin Mazzaro in his major league debut for the A's. He started out shaky, but after picking off Podsednik in the first he calmed down. He pitched even better against the Orioles in his next outing -- no runs, fewer baserunners, more innings. But he hasn't been the same pitcher since he gave up his first runs in a loss to Tim Lincecum.

You scout a guy in AAA or AA (Mark Buehrle never pitched in AAA), and you can see what kind of stuff he has. You might be able to see what kind of competitor he is. But you don't know how he'll deal with pitching in the majors.

JB98
07-21-2009, 11:18 PM
I'm starting to wonder if he just doesn't have the arm stamina to do it consistently. Tonight after a long layoff his fastball was popping better and he had better placement on his off speed pitch. A couple of his changeups that stayed up and outside were almost Buehrlesque. After a few starts last time he came down to Earth as he lost pop on his fast ball and stopped placing the other pitches as well.

I have no idea if this is true or not, just something that occurred to me.

Without a doubt, Richard's location with the offspeed stuff was much, much improved tonight. I like the variation between his heater and his change. Like every other lefty with a changeup, he needs to keep it down and he needs to be ahead in the count to maximize its effectiveness. He did a real nice job with that tonight. His breaking ball was working, too.

I actually thought Richard was overthrowing his fastball in previous outings. It was flat. It was high and out of the zone. It wasn't sinking. He's gotta have a good fastball to set up his other stuff. It will be interesting to see if he can put together some good outings in a row. He had a couple good ones consecutively in May, and then things took a tumble.

I like the kid a lot more than I like Colon at this point. I'm rooting hard for Clayton. I don't think Fat Bart can do it anymore.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 11:20 PM
We had a one run advantage and lost in the top of the 9th inning. It's going to happen, but anyone who is still blaming the offense and not Bobby Jenks after his last two outings is deluded.


I couldn't agree more.

We faced a pretty damn good pitcher out there tonight. The offense has been picking up more than it's share during our hot run. It was tough night for them.

The bullpen has imploded big time here. If this was Bobby's first bad outing in a few weeks, then turn the page and move on. But this is his 5th straight time out there he has been bad (twice in Min, Balt, twice so far here vs TB).

Something is seriously wrong with Bobby. He has not had 5 straight outings like this in his entire career here.

That said, if Bobby doesn't get his **** right, I am throwing in the towel. We need Bobby in order to win this thing. I thought Thornton could pick things up had Bobby been moved, Thornton is human too. He would also leave a huge void in the set up department.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 11:22 PM
I'm really glad Richard pitched well. I don't think much of Colon at this stage of his career, and I'm rooting for Clayton to keep his spot in the rotation.

I think Richard has a nice assortment of pitches. If he gets them over more consistently, he can be a nice No. 4 starter, IMO.


I think if Richard can solidify our 2nd lefty out of the pen situation and Colon/Garcia can give us a quality start every other night out there ..... This would make our team so much better.

JB98
07-21-2009, 11:27 PM
I think if Richard can solidify our 2nd lefty out of the pen situation and Colon/Garcia can give us a quality start every other night out there ..... This would make our team so much better.

I don't think much of Colon anymore. He has to be pinpoint with his fastball, because he doesn't have the velocity he used to have. He's never had anything more than a show-me breaking ball. That makes it tough.

Garcia is an unknown at this point. I think it's folly to count on Freddy, given the injuries he has had. But Garcia does know how to win. Is he healthy enough to make an impact this season?

I think Richard has a higher upside than second lefty out of the bullpen, but I'm sure he'll be back in that role if the Sox think they can get something out of Colon or Garcia.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 11:35 PM
I don't think much of Colon anymore. He has to be pinpoint with his fastball, because he doesn't have the velocity he used to have. He's never had anything more than a show-me breaking ball. That makes it tough.

Garcia is an unknown at this point. I think it's folly to count on Freddy, given the injuries he has had. But Garcia does know how to win. Is he healthy enough to make an impact this season?

I think Richard has a higher upside than second lefty out of the bullpen, but I'm sure he'll be back in that role if the Sox think they can get something out of Colon or Garcia.


No one is going to deny that the upside on Richard is so much higher that the other two guys.

But the Sox are not looking for upside right now. They are looking to win games and make the team better. Richard in the bullpen right now brings more value to them than getting a 50/50 quality start from him every other night. For that, Colon and Garcia are more than capable of giving this to the Sox every other night as a 5th starter. That's what Colon was when he went down. One good start, one bad start. You can live with that from the 5th starter IMO.


Keep in mind that Colon was looked at in an ugly way because those 50/50 quality starts were coming when the team needed him most since Gavin and Contreras were God awful in the early going. If Colon as a 5th starter can give us what he was giving us in April and May right now when the other 4 starter are clicking .... everyone would be so happy.

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 11:37 PM
I couldn't agree more.

We faced a pretty damn good pitcher out there tonight. The offense has been picking up more than it's share during our hot run. It was tough night for them.

The bullpen has imploded big time here. If this was Bobby's first bad outing in a few weeks, then turn the page and move on. But this is his 5th straight time out there he has been bad (twice in Min, Balt, twice so far here vs TB).

Something is seriously wrong with Bobby. He has not had 5 straight outings like this in his entire career here.

That said, if Bobby doesn't get his **** right, I am throwing in the towel. We need Bobby in order to win this thing. I thought Thornton could pick things up had Bobby been moved, Thornton is human too. He would also leave a huge void in the set up department.
:chickenlittle

Noneck
07-21-2009, 11:41 PM
That said, if Bobby doesn't get his **** right, I am throwing in the towel. We need Bobby in order to win this thing.

I understand what you are saying but it is so much deeper than that with this team. Its not only Jenks, its JD, PK, AJ, Pods, Ramirez, Burls, Beckham, Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Thome. If any of these go down at this point, close up the shop and lock the door.

kevingrt
07-21-2009, 11:43 PM
Still wondering about a couple things after coming home from the game:

-Where did that start from Clayton Richard come from?

-Why was Ozzie not pinch-running Wise for Quentin in the 7th? TCQ got a terrible read on the single by Bacon and there is a 75% chance Wise would have scored on the play(I did the math).

-Why did Ozzie keep Jenks in even after he tied the game? I am assuming Thornton was not available. If he was I would have been mad. But what about Octavio?

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 11:45 PM
:chickenlittle


Very creative :rolleyes:

BigP50
07-21-2009, 11:47 PM
Still wondering about a couple things after coming home from the game:

-Where did that start from Clayton Richard come from?

Rest? thats just my theory.

-Why was Ozzie not pinch-running Wise for Quentin in the 7th? TCQ got a terrible read on the single by Bacon and there is a 75% chance Wise would have scored on the play(I did the math).

Wanted to keep his bat in the game?

-Why did Ozzie keep Jenks in even after he tied the game? I am assuming Thornton was not available. If he was I would have been mad. But what about Octavio?

Probably figured that they would lose the lead anyway so he wanted to see how Bobby handled it.

ode to veeck
07-21-2009, 11:48 PM
I understand what you are saying but it is so much deeper than that with this team. Its not only Jenks, its JD, PK, AJ, Pods, Ramirez, Burls, Beckham, Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Thome. If any of these go down at this point, close up the shop and lock the door.

yeah right, and Quentin woulda been on the list before he went down too, and look what we did without him the last 45 days

thomas35forever
07-21-2009, 11:50 PM
Very creative :rolleyes:
Look, I respect your opinion of Jenks, but after cooling down, I don't think it's the end for him just yet. We'll have to agree to disagree.

BigP50
07-21-2009, 11:51 PM
yeah right, and Quentin woulda been on the list before he went down too, and look what we did without him the last 45 days


There are certain players we could probably do with out but some we probably couldn't.

I think it would be fine if Alexei went down, and maybe JD if TCQ is healthy but guys like Gavin, Danks, Burls are must haves.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 11:51 PM
I understand what you are saying but it is so much deeper than that with this team. Its not only Jenks, its JD, PK, AJ, Pods, Ramirez, Burls, Beckham, Danks, Floyd, Thornton, Thome. If any of these go down at this point, close up the shop and lock the door.


I just agree with Hawk.

Jenks is the key to our pitching staff.

The bullpen meltdown last season started when Bobby got hurt. That's how important Bobby is.

LoveYourSuit
07-21-2009, 11:52 PM
Look, I respect your opinion of Jenks, but after cooling down, I don't think it's the end for him just yet. We'll have to agree to disagree.


Where did I say it was the end of him?

1989
07-21-2009, 11:52 PM
:chickenlittle

He's absolutely right. If Bobby can't get the job done in this 2nd half, we're done. We need to be able to rely on him to nail down these 1 and 2 run leads in the 9th. With the division as tight as it is, we need every win that we should get. If Bobby is blowing games that should be won, we'll need to be damn perfect and win most of the others to compensate for that. And we haven't shown the ability to do that all season.