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View Full Version : Did anyone else see the Cubs walk-off walk?


JermaineDye05
07-03-2009, 06:17 PM
I had nothing better to do so I decided to catch the end of the Cubs-Brewers game as they were in extras tied at 1-1. The Cubs got the bases loaded with 2 outs and with Jake Fox at the plate, Mike Defelice fell behind Fox 3-1. He then gets back to 3-2 and Fox starts fouling off pitch by pitch, eventually Fox takes a pitch right down the middle and it's called...a ball? That was probably one of the worst calls I've seen behind the plate, however not nearly as bad as Jenks called 3rd strike in the dirt against the Indians this year.

You can see the call here:

Link (http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=200907035378359&c_id=chc)

per MLB.com

Heffalump
07-03-2009, 06:20 PM
yeah I saw that. Gotta agree, it was a horrible call. The Brewers pitcher threw up his arms like "what the hell!"

I don't think Macha even came out to argue. What a *****.

central44
07-03-2009, 06:26 PM
If that is the best team in the NL Central...wow.

It's got me thinking of the horrible possibility that the Sox can win more games in a tougher division than the Cubs, but the Cubs could be the team that makes the postseason. Every team in that division has major issues, and I could easily see the Cubs playing this poorly all year and still winning it.

JermaineDye05
07-03-2009, 06:35 PM
If that is the best team in the NL Central...wow.

It's got me thinking of the horrible possibility that the Sox can win more games in a tougher division than the Cubs, but the Cubs could be the team that makes the postseason. Every team in that division has major issues, and I could easily see the Cubs playing this poorly all year and still winning it.

I don't know if the AL Central is tougher than the NL Central, I mean the Royals and Indians have less wins than the Pirates :o:

The Tigers are just a better first place team than the Brewers and Cardinals, but just slightly. The Cardinals and Tigers have the same amount of wins, the Tigers just have 3 less losses.

Both divisions are dreadful.

Chicken Dinner
07-03-2009, 06:37 PM
Looked like a strike to me. The umps must of had reservations at Harry Caray's.

central44
07-03-2009, 06:47 PM
I don't know if the AL Central is tougher than the NL Central, I mean the Royals and Indians have less wins than the Pirates :o:

The Tigers are just a better first place team than the Brewers and Cardinals, but just slightly. The Cardinals and Tigers have the same amount of wins, the Tigers just have 3 less losses.

Both divisions are dreadful.

That's true, I should have said that better, and factored in that I think Minnesota is going to ultimatley be the team to beat. They seem destined to make a huge run...like they do every year.

The AL Central is awful, but I don't think the contenders really have as many holes as the Brewers or Cardinals. I admit i'm basing that on almost nothing other than what people who follow those teams tell me, though.

TDog
07-03-2009, 06:50 PM
Didn't see the game. Not interested in seeing the final pitch. I don't know if Fox had swung and missed if Cubs fans would have been whining about him swinging at ball four. But I looked at the accounts of the last inning. If the umpire blew a call, it wasn't nearly as egregious a the Brewers intentionally walking two hitters, including Soto pinch-hitting, with two outs to load the bases. It wasn't as if they needed a force at the plate to get out of a jam. It was two outs with a runner on third.

That was such incredibly bad baseball that the Brewers deserved to be punished. If it was a bad call, maybe it had to be to make the point. If you're a first-place team, you shouldn't be playing bad baseball.

ilsox7
07-03-2009, 06:53 PM
Didn't see the game. Not interested in seeing the final pitch. I don't know if Fox had swung and missed if Cubs fans would have been whining about him swinging at ball four. But I looked at the accounts of the last inning. If the umpire blew a call, it wasn't nearly as egregious a the Brewers intentionally walking two hitters, including Soto pinch-hitting, with two outs to load the bases. It wasn't as if they needed a force at the plate to get out of a jam. It was two outs with a runner on third.

That was such incredibly bad baseball that the Brewers deserved to be punished. If it was a bad call, maybe it had to be to make the point. If you're a first-place team, you shouldn't be playing bad baseball.

They pitched to Soto. I thought the final pitch was borderline, so not really a bad call.

TDog
07-03-2009, 07:08 PM
They pitched to Soto. I thought the final pitch was borderline, so not really a bad call.

I read that it was an intentional walk. Still bad baseball, although not as egregious to have a runner on third and two outs and walk in the winning run, whether or not it was a bad call.

JB98
07-03-2009, 07:31 PM
I read that it was an intentional walk. Still bad baseball, although not as egregious to have a runner on third and two outs and walk in the winning run, whether or not it was a bad call.

They threw three wide ones to Soto, then opted to make the fourth ball an intentional one.

The real crime was walking Bradley intentionally before they walked Soto.

Why walk Milton Bradley? He's hitting .192 from the left side of the plate. :scratch:

The Immigrant
07-03-2009, 08:28 PM
They walkedd Bradley to set up the force play at second, but then they told Fielder to play behind Bradley rather than trying to hold him at first. So, Bradley simply jogged into second on defensive indifference. Then they pitched around Soto.

Macha is an idiot.

BigP50
07-03-2009, 08:40 PM
with the bases loaded, in the bottom of the 10th, that pitch was to close to be called a ball. I dont think it was even close, obviously a strike, but man..........

Craig Grebeck
07-03-2009, 09:42 PM
Definitely a strike. Did anyone see an earlier bases loaded walk by the Cubs earlier in the game? I thought Hart got a similarly generous ball call.

jabrch
07-03-2009, 09:58 PM
I have no idea why they didn't pitch to Soto with 2 on and 2 out. You hate to take away any cushion your guys has. If there were less than 2 outs and 1B open - different story... But what do I know?

Tragg
07-03-2009, 10:00 PM
That's just lazy officiating.

Gavin
07-03-2009, 10:13 PM
The call was ridiculous, but after that Bobby Jenks curveball I reckon we have no place to talk.

I was at Kincade's. The Cubbie crowd took a second to pause as if to say "really??? Well, OK". Kind of in the same vein of myself with that Jenks curve.

Yet, all of this would have prevented if, say, someone other than Jeff Suppan was on 2B when Prince Fielder docked a hit into the OF. Nice "slide".

But the DH is silly, amirite.

slavko
07-03-2009, 10:17 PM
I thought it was high. The pitch that is. The camera is enough above ground level to make everything look lower than it is. You know that, right? What I don't get is how Fox could take a pitch that close on 3-2.

1908<2005
07-04-2009, 12:00 AM
Umpires helped us win the World Series in 2005. I can't complain. :cool:

BigP50
07-04-2009, 12:52 AM
Umpires helped us win the World Series in 2005. I can't complain. :cool:


haha, whatever gets that ring.

4 points
07-04-2009, 05:12 AM
I thought it was high. The pitch that is. The camera is enough above ground level to make everything look lower than it is. You know that, right? What I don't get is how Fox could take a pitch that close on 3-2.

He took it because he was completely fooled, I mean, a breaking ball on 3 and 2 with the bases loaded, in a walk-off situation was the last thing he was looking for.:gulp:

DrCrawdad
07-04-2009, 06:36 AM
Umpires helped us win the World Series in 2005. I can't complain. :cool:

I don't buy that for a second and neither should Sox fans.

The Sox were the best team in MLB in 2005. First place from game one to 162. 11-1 in the post-season. 4 consecutive complete games in the post-season.

These comments about how the '05 Sox "got lucky," and how "the umps helped us..." are usually made by jealous, bitter Cubbie fans. This talk of the umps was trumpeted by Joe Buck and Fox Sports during the '05 post-season, so much so in fact that they ignored calls that went against the Sox (there was a ball called a HR in Houston that was clearly not a HR, for one example). Plus Fox ignored that the Sox took advantage of perceived bad calls too. The whole dropped third strike to AJ. Well that wasn't luck or getting a break from the umps, that was smart baseball AND then the Sox took full advantage of it. That's what great teams do.

The Sox won because the Sox were the best. Don't fall for that anti-Sox propaganda.

SoxandtheCityTee
07-04-2009, 07:48 AM
I don't buy that for a second and neither should Sox fans.

The Sox were the best team in MLB in 2005. First place from game one to 162. 11-1 in the post-season. 4 consecutive complete games in the post-season.

These comments about how the '05 Sox "got lucky," and how "the umps helped us..." are usually made by jealous, bitter Cubbie fans. . . . Don't fall for that anti-Sox propaganda.

Nice pick up, Dr. , on the jealousy. Fall for it? Good ol' 1908< specializies in it. He's a :dtroll:. Been noticed and discussed before.

C-Dawg
07-04-2009, 08:07 AM
(there was a ball called a HR in Houston that was clearly not a HR, for one example)

I often wonder what would have happened if that ball was ruled in-play. Probably a double. But with the two pop-fouls and a groundout that followed, he'd have been stranded and the game would have eventually ended on schedule with Jon Garland the winning pitcher. Joe Buck showed the replay once or twice, and then never mentioned it again.

Damaso Marte certainly never got any "help" from the umps in Boston either.

DrCrawdad
07-04-2009, 08:36 AM
Nice pick up, Dr. , on the jealousy. Fall for it? Good ol' 1908< specializies in it. He's a :dtroll:. Been noticed and discussed before.

One other thing I missed, the '05 Sox won 99 games too!

You think any Cubbie fans are saying the Cubbies got "lucky" or how the "umps" kindly gave them the game dyesterday? Or you think any Cubbie fans are saying they got "lucky" in game 2 at Wrigley this season against the Sox?

Interesting observation about "1908." If he's a troll, and a Cubbie troll on top of it, he's not alone here in that respect.

:dtroll:

Someone should retouch this GIF and change it to Cubbie blue and red.

DrCrawdad
07-04-2009, 08:37 AM
I often wonder what would have happened if that ball was ruled in-play. Probably a double. But with the two pop-fouls and a groundout that followed, he'd have been stranded and the game would have eventually ended on schedule with Jon Garland the winning pitcher. Joe Buck showed the replay once or twice, and then never mentioned it again.

Damaso Marte certainly never got any "help" from the umps in Boston either.

Nothing could sidetrack Joe Buck and Fox Sports from their narrative on the 2005 post-season. It was all about the Sox luck and umps.

Woofer
07-04-2009, 09:25 AM
I don't buy that for a second and neither should Sox fans.

The Sox were the best team in MLB in 2005. First place from game one to 162. 11-1 in the post-season. 4 consecutive complete games in the post-season.

These comments about how the '05 Sox "got lucky," and how "the umps helped us..." are usually made by jealous, bitter Cubbie fans. This talk of the umps was trumpeted by Joe Buck and Fox Sports during the '05 post-season, so much so in fact that they ignored calls that went against the Sox (there was a ball called a HR in Houston that was clearly not a HR, for one example). Plus Fox ignored that the Sox took advantage of perceived bad calls too. The whole dropped third strike to AJ. Well that wasn't luck or getting a break from the umps, that was smart baseball AND then the Sox took full advantage of it. That's what great teams do.

The Sox won because the Sox were the best. Don't fall for that anti-Sox propaganda.


Good post. Can you imagine the uproar if that ball had been hit by an Astro? They would have an footnote on our history saying that we won the world series over a blown call. It is funny how little you hear about that blown hr call, and how much you hear about the AJ strikeout, or JD not really being HBP. We were the best team in mlb in 2005. Nuff said.

Craig Grebeck
07-04-2009, 09:50 AM
Good post. Can you imagine the uproar if that ball had been hit by an Astro? They would have an footnote on our history saying that we won the world series over a blown call. It is funny how little you hear about that blown hr call, and how much you hear about the AJ strikeout, or JD not really being HBP. We were the best team in mlb in 2005. Nuff said.
Probably because no one gives a **** about a blown call that favored the losing team in a series that, game-wise, wasn't even close (4-0). Granted, the games were fun and competitive and all, but the Astros were swept. History cares little for teams that fail to win one game.

Tragg
07-04-2009, 09:59 AM
The Sox won because the Sox were the best.
There's no question about that. And it wasn't close.

The one real favorable call we got was awarding JD first base on a ball that hit his bat, right in front of, I believe, PK's slam.

doublem23
07-04-2009, 10:23 AM
Umpires helped us win the World Series in 2005. I can't complain. :cool:

It should be noted that during the World Series, the only blown call that directly lead to runs being added on the board went against the Sox; a blown HR call in Game 3 of the World Series. I forget who hit it, but Houston was awarded a HR on a ball that was clearly on the "in play" side of the stupid yellow line that dances all over Minute Maid park's OF wall.

Did the Sox catch some breaks in their play-off run? Sure, but the Sox still had to take advantage of every of those breaks, and they did, because they were an excellent, excellent team.

The 2009 Cubs, meanwhile, need blown calls to climb back to .500. WOO! CUBS! WOO! THIRD PLACE! :thumbsup:

TDog
07-04-2009, 11:02 AM
There's no question about that. And it wasn't close.

The one real favorable call we got was awarding JD first base on a ball that hit his bat, right in front of, I believe, PK's slam.

Considering it was on a three-ball pitch and Dye was trying to get out of the way of the pitch, it would have been ball four had it not hit anything. Dye didn't offer at the pitch. He didn't consider offering at the pitch. Had the ball hit nothing, Dye would have been awarded first. Dye couldn't get out of the way of the pitch, it was so bad.

It was a tough break for the Astros that the ball wasn't called foul. It would have been a huge break for the Astros if it had been called foul.

I listened to the games on ESPN radio. Jon Miller pointed out that if the Sox were getting the breaks (and, really, they didn't get all the breaks), they came up with the big hits that turned those breaks into runs, whether it was an error (ALDS Game 2), the other team failing to notice that the umpire didn't signal a hitter out after swinging at strike three (ALCS Game 2) or a ball that should have loaded the bases if the hitter had avoided it but should have been called a foul because it hit the bat instead of his hand (WS Game 2).

In each of those plays, it wasn't the call that put game changing or deciding runs on the board. It was the drives (a home run, a double and a home run) from the hitter that followed.

Back on topic, I'm not upset about what happened to the Brewers Friday. Part of it is that I am no longer a Brewers season ticket holder. But also, the Brewers chose to load the bases (apparently I was right in the first place about the two walks before the final walk being intentional). For the Cubs to be in a position where they could win on a bad call, the Brewers had to play some pretty stupid baseball to make it possible. The Brewers deserved to lose.

Viva Medias B's
07-04-2009, 11:39 AM
That's just lazy officiating.

The ump was thinking about the steak house, I hypothesize. Meanwhile, is it me or is the media going more hog wild over the Cubs winning four of their last five against the great Pittsburgh Pirates and the great Milwaukee Brewers than our current 7-game win streak which includes two victories over the Cubs?

goon
07-04-2009, 12:02 PM
I was at the game, sitting behind homeplate, but quite a few rows back. I thought it was right down the middle, but I didn't see a replay until I got home. I was right and that was a tough call to end a game.

UofCSoxFan
07-04-2009, 12:11 PM
Do I think the pitch should have been called a strike? In that situation, where the choice is between ending the game and continuing to play....hell yes it should have been called a strike.

That being said, if that is a 1-0 pitch in the top of the third, no way is that a strike. It was a slider that crossed at the letters. It was way too close to take and way too close to end a game on but it still wasn't a strike. You can see Kendall pull his glove down 3 or 4 inches.

C-Dawg
07-04-2009, 12:16 PM
Meanwhile, is it me or is the media going more hog wild over the Cubs winning four of their last five against the great Pittsburgh Pirates and the great Milwaukee Brewers than our current 7-game win streak which includes two victories over the Cubs?

That's called "business as usual" in the media.

Brian26
07-04-2009, 02:37 PM
Umpires helped us win the World Series in 2005. I can't complain. :cool:

Don't ever crap on the accomplishments of the 2005 White Sox team. Those couple of calls they got (dropped 3rd strike and Dye HBP) pale in comparison to their offensive dominance and stellar pitching. They steamrolled through the playoffs. Nobody was going to stop them. And FWIW, the Astros got a couple of big calls handed to them, including a homerun that wasn't.

DrCrawdad
07-04-2009, 02:39 PM
Don't ever crap on the accomplishments of the 2005 White Sox team. Those couple of calls they got (dropped 3rd strike and Dye HBP) pale in comparison to their offensive dominance and stellar pitching. They steamrolled through the playoffs. Nobody was going to stop them. And FWIW, the Astros got a couple of big calls handed to them, including a homerun that wasn't.

How dare you question this posters comments. That's asinine!

FarWestChicago
07-04-2009, 02:51 PM
Umpires helped us win the World Series in 2005. I can't complain. :cool::crossdresser

I won't ask you to buy a brain. But, I will ask you to at least rent a handful of functioning neurons.

Dick Allen
07-04-2009, 02:59 PM
Just my 2 cents - the pitch was a strike. Typical Cub crap. Actually, what bothers me is that balls and strikes calls seem to be getting worse with each passing year. Strike zones seem to change from game to game, or even inning to inning, and these can obviously have huge effects on the outcomes of games.

Brian26
07-04-2009, 03:01 PM
Just my 2 cents - the pitch was a strike. Typical Cub crap.

I can't let myself get too worked-up over a call when the Brewers bullpen loaded the bases and then went 3-0 on the batter. They deserved to lose that game more than the Cubs earned a victory.

DrCrawdad
07-04-2009, 03:08 PM
:crossdresser

I won't ask you to buy a brain. But, I will ask you to at least rent a handful of functioning neurons.

The 2005 White Sox were the best team in baseball that season. That's why they won the World Series.

Comments like 1908's is dismissive trash talk that I find it hard to believe that any right-minded Sox fan would spout. I apologize for being baited, but 1908's comment is pure, unadulterated (fecal matter).