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32nd&Wallace
06-28-2009, 01:50 PM
I was at the game yesterday and sat in section 508. During the course of the game, there were at least four fights in the four sections around us. What bothered me was not the fights or the drunken yahoos, because obviously its what you expect at a Cubs/Sox game, but the lag time between the fights broke out and when security arrived. It took one fan who was sitting in row 32 to walk down into the concourse and hail security.

What really bothered me was the lack of security overall in the 500 level and the failure to really step up security after that first fight. Its even more bothersome when you consider how security is more pronounced in the 100 level where the fan make-up is less likely to engage in fights.

Anyone else notice this and have concerns?

Garland_IS_God
06-28-2009, 03:01 PM
I worked security in the parking lot at the Cell last year as a side job, and I can honestly tell you I would never respond to a fight until I had some extra man power. The guys on the inside all say the same thing. Its expensive to have security in every patrolling every section of the stadium.

Soxfanspcu11
06-28-2009, 03:12 PM
After all the games I have been to over the years, including the many Sox/scrubs games, I have been very impressed with the way that security responds to fights. They are usually right on top of things when something breaks out.

Keep in mind that it is a big stadium and they can't be everywhere at once. Especially in the upperdeck where the slope of the seats makes it hard to navigate and get to a certain section quickly.

The Sox security may not be perfect but when compared to the "security" or retirement home workers at the urinal, it is impecable.

As a side note, I am still amazed that people still fight at games. I mean, what exactly does punching a scrubs fan in the face accomplish? Aside from getting booted from the stadium and possibly getting arrested. I have wanted to beat the **** out of many a scrubs fan, even more so after having a few adult beverages but I never have. It's just not worth it at all. And to the fact that unless you are a season ticket holder, the tickets cost an arm and a leg (heck, even as a season ticket holder myself, they still cost a lot) and so when you decide to show strangers how TOUGH you are, you end up listening to the game in your car or deprived of the game all together while sitting in a drunk tank. Great decision making people! :rolleyes: Are you the same ones making important decisions in your career? Here's to hoping that you are not a surgeon or air traffic controller. :scratch:

Sox
06-28-2009, 04:37 PM
After all the games I have been to over the years, including the many Sox/scrubs games, I have been very impressed with the way that security responds to fights. They are usually right on top of things when something breaks out.

Keep in mind that it is a big stadium and they can't be everywhere at once. Especially in the upperdeck where the slope of the seats makes it hard to navigate and get to a certain section quickly.

The Sox security may not be perfect but when compared to the "security" or retirement home workers at the urinal, it is impecable.

As a side note, I am still amazed that people still fight at games. I mean, what exactly does punching a scrubs fan in the face accomplish? Aside from getting booted from the stadium and possibly getting arrested. I have wanted to beat the **** out of many a scrubs fan, even more so after having a few adult beverages but I never have. It's just not worth it at all. And to the fact that unless you are a season ticket holder, the tickets cost an arm and a leg (heck, even as a season ticket holder myself, they still cost a lot) and so when you decide to show strangers how TOUGH you are, you end up listening to the game in your car or deprived of the game all together while sitting in a drunk tank. Great decision making people! :rolleyes: Are you the same ones making important decisions in your career? Here's to hoping that you are not a surgeon or air traffic controller. :scratch:

Excellent points all.....I especially liked this one.
Great decision making people! :rolleyes: Are you the same ones making important decisions in your career? Here's to hoping that you are not a surgeon or air traffic controller. :scratch: That comment is spot on.:thumbsup:

Brian26
06-28-2009, 05:14 PM
And to the fact that unless you are a season ticket holder, the tickets cost an arm and a leg (heck, even as a season ticket holder myself, they still cost a lot) and so when you decide to show strangers how TOUGH you are, you end up listening to the game in your car or deprived of the game all together while sitting in a drunk tank.

This is an ironic statement since most of these fights are alcohol-fueled to begin with. I'd say the upper deck is as much of a drunk tank as any jail cell.

Yet, alcohol's never going to be banned from the ballpark and people aren't going to stop drinking anyway, so this is the kind of knucklehead behavior that's always going to be present and should be expected as the norm. It's not going away anytime soon.

kevingrt
06-28-2009, 09:11 PM
Today there were plenty of fights from the sixth inning on in the outfield. Specifically sections 163 and 101. Security did a pretty decent job in my opinion though.

Warriorjan
06-28-2009, 09:15 PM
I was in 508, and one broke out in 509, and I did think security wasn't real quick getting up there, probably about 15 rows up (we were in 14). Anyone know what the deal was with the person who it appeared threw a beer bottle into the Cubs bullpen?

BadBobbyJenks
06-28-2009, 09:22 PM
What I hate is the chuckleheads who have to watch these fights happen in the upperdeck from the lowerdeck. I had to yell at my section in the 9th yesterday, THE WINNING RUN IS ON 2ND because everyone was like hey look Sox fans and Cubs fans are fighting.

Shoeless
06-28-2009, 09:59 PM
What I hate is the chuckleheads who have to watch these fights happen in the upperdeck from the lowerdeck. I had to yell at my section in the 9th yesterday, THE WINNING RUN IS ON 2ND because everyone was like hey look Sox fans and Cubs fans are fighting.

Same situation in my section. People were like "Fight! Fight", and I was trying to yell "Baseball! Baseball!". I love hockey as much as the next guy, but these weren't benches clearing; just a couple of drunk frat boys with one fan gloating towards others in their section.

BV2005
06-28-2009, 10:18 PM
wow im surprised to hear this. I thought today was the tamest it had ever been for a Sox/Cubs game. There were no fights that I saw in the parking lots or in the stadium today.

DSpivack
06-28-2009, 10:27 PM
Same situation in my section. People were like "Fight! Fight", and I was trying to yell "Baseball! Baseball!". I love hockey as much as the next guy, but these weren't benches clearing; just a couple of drunk frat boys with one fan gloating towards others in their section.

What I hate is the chuckleheads who have to watch these fights happen in the upperdeck from the lowerdeck. I had to yell at my section in the 9th yesterday, THE WINNING RUN IS ON 2ND because everyone was like hey look Sox fans and Cubs fans are fighting.

I have only been to one crosstown game and that was in 2001, but from what I hear it seems to me that Sox-Cubs games are amateur hour.

kevingrt
06-28-2009, 10:33 PM
I have only been to one crosstown game and that was in 2001, but from what I hear it seems to me that Sox-Cubs games are amateur hour.

Understatement especially in the outfield and upper deck.

kitekrazy
06-28-2009, 10:47 PM
Sad how things have become in the world of sports. In a Yankees-Red Sox series, lives are lost.

There's really no logic for Sox and Cub fans to hate each other.

DSpivack
06-29-2009, 12:01 AM
Sad how things have become in the world of sports. In a Yankees-Red Sox series, lives are lost.

There's really no logic for Sox and Cub fans to hate each other.

It's not really about Sox vs. Cubs. It's drunk idiots seeking an excuse to start a fight in a public place.

And this country is relatively relaxed when it comes to sporting events. Thankfully, our rivalries don't reflect deep-seated ancient hatred, nor do we have organized groups of fans that at their worst can become armed gangs of idiots seeking trouble [or, even worse, paramilitary organizations].

If the worst that happens is an alcohol-fueled fight between two overserved buffoons, I really don't think that is all that bad.

Law11
06-29-2009, 09:04 AM
Today there were plenty of fights from the sixth inning on in the outfield. Specifically sections 163 and 101. Security did a pretty decent job in my opinion though.

I was standing on the Miller Lite Terrace and had a great view of all the OF fights and you could see the army of security all over. Whats funny is how everyone stands up (like whole sections over). We had a moment in the terrace suite when this obnoxious drunk sox fan (he was bad) just kept taunting the Cub Fans and this women had to be in her 60's at least threw 2 beers in his face. Of course the splatter hit us but he just stood there quiet until security came to toss him out.

I have to say at one point there was a Lets, Go White Sox,... Lets Go Cubbies chant going on. I was commenting on how polite the chant was that each set of fans was letting the other have their turn. It reminded me of the Ill-Ini chant.

The Milkman
06-29-2009, 10:13 AM
What was going on in Right-Center yesterday around the 7th-8th inning? It looked like people were dumping beer on the Scrubs bullpen pitchers...

OldRomanPizza
06-29-2009, 10:53 AM
The worst Sox/Cubs fighting I've ever seen took place in the outfield at a Sox/Rangers game. Half price Monday, about a week after colleges let out for the summer, a handful of guys in Cubs shirts either. Do the math! :)

jshanahanjr
06-29-2009, 01:19 PM
It's a waste of time and energy. I used to go every year, but have not been back since 2005. Why get worked up for a game that has less meaning than the Sox vs. the Royals? Interleague sucks and needs to go!

PennStater98r
06-29-2009, 01:34 PM
I was in section 508 as well - row 10. I was shocked at how many fights broke out around us - but even more shocked that it was 2 fights in which Cubs fans fought one another, 1 fight in which Sox fans fought one another and only one fight between a Cubs and Sox fan...

Also, on the way out - after the game - two fights broke up on the way down the ramps - one was between two men and one was between two women (all Cubs fans fighting one another).

Another interesting tidbit was that there were three people sitting right in front of me (not with one another either) were thrown out for NOT HAVING A TICKET. How do you not have a ticket and get in to the game - and then choose possibly the worst seats in the park?

soxfan43
06-29-2009, 01:36 PM
It's a waste of time and energy. I used to go every year, but have not been back since 2005. Why get worked up for a game that has less meaning than the Sox vs. the Royals? Interleague sucks and needs to go!


I try to go to at least one every year. They are a different environment but I think it's still a lot of fun. But people really take it too far. I was in sec 115 on Saturday and it seemed like once and inning we'd see an entire section of people standing up and a group fighting in the middle. I do love interleague and don't really understand the backlash. you get to see other teams and certain players that you don't normally see. I guess it's different here with having a team in each league but overall I'm a big fan of it. However I wouldn't mind seeing them schedule only 3 Cubs/Sox games every year.

35th&Shields
06-29-2009, 03:09 PM
Today there were plenty of fights from the sixth inning on in the outfield. Specifically sections 163 and 101. Security did a pretty decent job in my opinion though.

I was in 157 and there were two groups of Cubs fans that kept getting into it with a handful of Sox fans. I was with my wife and I told her in the 2nd inning that I would be MORE surprised if they didn't get in a fight. They all ended up getting so drunk they stumbled out. They were pretty entertaining.

I thought things would be pretty chill yesterday, it being Sunday and all. But fans were going at it jawing at one another all game. There was a nasty vibe going on. I think fans' frustration with both teams is really setting in.

35th&Shields
06-29-2009, 03:13 PM
I was in section 508 as well - row 10. I was shocked at how many fights broke out around us - but even more shocked that it was 2 fights in which Cubs fans fought one another, 1 fight in which Sox fans fought one another and only one fight between a Cubs and Sox fan...

Also, on the way out - after the game - two fights broke up on the way down the ramps - one was between two men and one was between two women (all Cubs fans fighting one another).

Agreed. I went to the Thursday game at Wrigley and 4 Cubs fans in front of me got in my face and I wasn't doing anything but cheering for the Sox. I think they were a little startled when I didn't back down and that blew over.

Then yesterday it was the Cubs fans around me that were causing problems. It's ironic b/c its the Sox fans that have the reputation as being the trouble makers.

tacosalbarojas
06-29-2009, 04:04 PM
Another interesting tidbit was that there were three people sitting right in front of me (not with one another either) were thrown out for NOT HAVING A TICKET. How do you not have a ticket and get in to the game - and then choose possibly the worst seats in the park?Probably so tanked they lost their tix somewhere along the way after getting in. There's no getting in without a ticket unless you are comped. You'd hope they could explain that and have proof of it if that was the case.

ewokpelts
06-29-2009, 04:53 PM
I talked to security yesterday. They had a LOT of issues saturday, adn were clamping down as hard as they could.

Ron Karkovice
06-29-2009, 05:55 PM
It's a waste of time and energy. I used to go every year, but have not been back since 2005. Why get worked up for a game that has less meaning than the Sox vs. the Royals? Interleague sucks and needs to go!

I agree that a division opponent is more important, but i think that interleague games are a very nice change of pace in the long 162 game season.

mrfourni
06-29-2009, 06:04 PM
I was there sunday. i was pleasantly surprised that they closed access to the outfield concourse to those without tickets. Made for a much better experience when I used the bathroom/bought concessions.

Tragg
06-29-2009, 06:15 PM
I agree that a division opponent is more important, but i think that interleague games are a very nice change of pace in the long 162 game season.
I agree.

Warriorjan
06-29-2009, 07:46 PM
They closed access to the outfield concourse? I was upstairs so didn't have access to downstairs anyway, but what if you had really expensive seats and wanted to access the rain room or the shower? Isn't the fan deck supposed to be open? How did families access the kids section?

tacosalbarojas
06-29-2009, 10:25 PM
I was able to get on to the concourse with infield tickets. I believe they were just checking lower bowl tix and controlling crowd flow.

Viva Medias B's
06-30-2009, 11:20 AM
Could this get to a point where sales of alcohol gets banned for these games? Granted, people could get themselves half lit in the pregame tailgate, but would the White Sox make that drastic a step and be willing to take the financial hit for no beer sales in the interest of order?

kittle42
06-30-2009, 11:21 AM
Could this get to a point where sales of alcohol gets banned for these games? Granted, people could get themselves half lit in the pregame tailgate, but would the White Sox make that drastic a step and be willing to take the financial hit for no beer sales in the interest of order?

Not a chance.

ewokpelts
06-30-2009, 04:39 PM
I was there sunday. i was pleasantly surprised that they closed access to the outfield concourse to those without tickets. Made for a much better experience when I used the bathroom/bought concessions.
they should do this for all games.

KenBerryGrab
06-30-2009, 04:47 PM
they should do this for all games...
(meaning close the outfield concourse)

I disagree. Walking the outfield during batting practice should be allowed for all 100-level seat holders, and unless the Fan Deck is reserved for a party, that's GA seating.

Kids should have a chance to get in the Rain Room, and there's the New Era store out there, not to mention the statues. That outfield concourse is the one "living room" section of the park, and it should stay accessible.

kittle42
06-30-2009, 04:50 PM
(meaning close the outfield concourse)

I disagree. Walking the outfield during batting practice should be allowed for all 100-level seat holders, and unless the Fan Deck is reserved for a party, that's GA seating.

Kids should have a chance to get in the Rain Room, and there's the New Era store out there, not to mention the statues. That outfield concourse is the one "living room" section of the park, and it should stay accessible.

I'm with you. Sometimes, I enjoy watching a few innings from the concourse. Also, walking the open councourse is one of the few feautures of the Cell that anyone else ever bothered using in later parks. You know why? Because it's a good experience. It should not be limited to those with OF seats.

I love these restrictions that get enforced which hurt those of us who don't feel the need to get into physical altercations when drunk and/or at a ballgame.

hula
06-30-2009, 04:51 PM
Could this get to a point where sales of alcohol gets banned for these games? Granted, people could get themselves half lit in the pregame tailgate, but would the White Sox make that drastic a step and be willing to take the financial hit for no beer sales in the interest of order?

Sounds like a smart idea to me. I think the White Sox organization has gone beyond tolerating this kind of behavior to a point of expecting it and accepting it by the sounds of the slow response of security.

Here's another thing that is sure to start some fights, wearing a t-shirt that says Cubs fans are gay because they have the Pride parade on the North Side. This really insults me as a WS fan. If this doesn't show immaturity and backing up the bad opinion many Chicagoians have of Sox fans, I don't know what does! If anyone thinks wearing a t-shirt like this is funny or makes a statement that says "we're better than you" they're idiots who are wearing their homophobia on their chests!

http://www.suntimes.com/news/roeper/1644778,CST-NWS-roep30.article

ewokpelts
06-30-2009, 05:13 PM
(meaning close the outfield concourse)

I disagree. Walking the outfield during batting practice should be allowed for all 100-level seat holders, and unless the Fan Deck is reserved for a party, that's GA seating.

Kids should have a chance to get in the Rain Room, and there's the New Era store out there, not to mention the statues. That outfield concourse is the one "living room" section of the park, and it should stay accessible.speaking as a bleacher st holder, you dont see what i see. or endure what i endure

Law11
06-30-2009, 05:37 PM
(meaning close the outfield concourse)

I disagree. Walking the outfield during batting practice should be allowed for all 100-level seat holders, and unless the Fan Deck is reserved for a party, that's GA seating.

Kids should have a chance to get in the Rain Room, and there's the New Era store out there, not to mention the statues. That outfield concourse is the one "living room" section of the park, and it should stay accessible.

Im with you. Ive sat in the OF seats for years with my season tickets I had and yes some of the stuff going on that you have to deal with on big game days is nuts but to close it off isnt right IMO for some of the reasons you stated. Now noted that on a sell out day there isnt much room to move anyway let alone enjoy some of what you speak but it should still be made available.

Harry Chappas
06-30-2009, 06:05 PM
I'm glad I didn't make any of the Cubs games at the Cell.

This may sound odd, but I would probably have been more annoyed with the drunken/combative Sox fans. As a Northsider with mostly friends that root for the Cubs, I spend a lot of time defending our park, fans, neighborhood, team, etc. I really don't need some mouth-breather that looks like Dan Pasqua's twin laying waste to my PR efforts and reinforcing lame stereotypes.

I went to a few of the cross-town games at Wrigley a few years ago (I think Derrek Lee hit a grand slam in a rout), and was verbally abused for 9 innings. I didn't say a word. Then, upon leaving the game, my friend and I were confronted by no less than 20 floppy-hat-wearin,' cargo-shorted, 'heroes' who were looking to throw down. There was just 2 of us. After that, I made the decision to avoid these games like the plague.

Seriously, I wish like hell we would leave the fighting, ball-throwing, cursing, etc. to our neighbors to the north. We're supposed to be the family-friendly, thinking-man's team.

tacosalbarojas
06-30-2009, 09:13 PM
I'm with you. Sometimes, I enjoy watching a few innings from the concourse. Also, walking the open councourse is one of the few feautures of the Cell that anyone else ever bothered using in later parks. You know why? Because it's a good experience. It should not be limited to those with OF seats.

I love these restrictions that get enforced which hurt those of us who don't feel the need to get into physical altercations when drunk and/or at a ballgame.I got on the concourse all weekend with tickets from section 116...it wasn't restricted that I could tell.

fox23
07-01-2009, 09:45 AM
I got on the concourse all weekend with tickets from section 116...it wasn't restricted that I could tell.


They did restrict it, they just did a poor job at enforcing it.

And I am also against restricting the concourse, it is the best part of the park. The Sox don't restrict you from walking around the rest of the lower deck so I don't see how bleacher seat holders are any more entitled than the rest of the LD.

mrfourni
07-01-2009, 09:56 AM
They did restrict it, they just did a poor job at enforcing it.

And I am also against restricting the concourse, it is the best part of the park. The Sox don't restrict you from walking around the rest of the lower deck so I don't see how bleacher seat holders are any more entitled than the rest of the LD.

I don't mind there being no restrictions for most of the season, but during big games like opening day/cubs series, i think it is neccessary to have some sort of order. I'd be ok with allowing access, just let people know that the outfield is not standing room only, you're not allowed to smoke out there, and there are 4 more mens bathrooms on the lower deck to use.

tacosalbarojas
07-01-2009, 02:08 PM
They did restrict it, they just did a poor job at enforcing it.

And I am also against restricting the concourse, it is the best part of the park. The Sox don't restrict you from walking around the rest of the lower deck so I don't see how bleacher seat holders are any more entitled than the rest of the LD.
Must have been real poor, because I went on and off it four times in the two days with my 116 ticket without a hitch.

JimmyJames
07-01-2009, 02:43 PM
They did restrict it, they just did a poor job at enforcing it.

And I am also against restricting the concourse, it is the best part of the park. The Sox don't restrict you from walking around the rest of the lower deck so I don't see how bleacher seat holders are any more entitled than the rest of the LD.

Agreed. My GF is on a quest to attend a game in every major league ballpark and buy a shot glass from each one. In our travels, I can't think of many parks have a concourse that allows you to walk entirely around the ballpark and see it from all angles. It' a nice feature to have and friends of mine from out town have taken walks around the park to get different photos of the field and the game.

John Barrett
07-01-2009, 03:16 PM
I worked security in the parking lot at the Cell last year as a side job, and I can honestly tell you I would never respond to a fight until I had some extra man power. The guys on the inside all say the same thing. Its expensive to have security in every patrolling every section of the stadium.

Then you should not be hired --- tell them that you need to be on the buddy plan :fail:

JC456
07-02-2009, 11:09 AM
They did restrict it, they just did a poor job at enforcing it.

And I am also against restricting the concourse, it is the best part of the park. The Sox don't restrict you from walking around the rest of the lower deck so I don't see how bleacher seat holders are any more entitled than the rest of the LD.

Well you obviously haven't been to a game where everyone is allowed on that concourse during a sell out game. As a season ticket holder in the outfield, I will tell you the vast majority of those fans on the concourse are not watching the game. To move around is difficult and to use the facilities is very difficult.

I will only say that access to the outfield concourse is nothing more than meeting place for people to have discussions about anything other than a baseball game. If that is your intentions while walking there then I suggest you go to a bar. The purpose of the park is for a baseball game and those who have seats in that area ought to have the right to enjoy their seats and surroundings without having to get bounced around like a pin ball while trying to get to the lavaratory, or get food and drink.

My hats off to the White Sox for limiting the access during the Cub series. I hope they do it for Boston, and NY as well.

kittle42
07-02-2009, 11:45 AM
Well you obviously haven't been to a game where everyone is allowed on that concourse during a sell out game. As a season ticket holder in the outfield, I will tell you the vast majority of those fans on the concourse are not watching the game. To move around is difficult and to use the facilities is very difficult.

I will only say that access to the outfield concourse is nothing more than meeting place for people to have discussions about anything other than a baseball game. If that is your intentions while walking there then I suggest you go to a bar. The purpose of the park is for a baseball game and those who have seats in that area ought to have the right to enjoy their seats and surroundings without having to get bounced around like a pin ball while trying to get to the lavaratory, or get food and drink.

My hats off to the White Sox for limiting the access during the Cub series. I hope they do it for Boston, and NY as well.

Many casual fans, and even some non-casual ones who go to many games, go to ballgames with friends to not only partake in the fun of a game, but to have a social experience. I know as Sox fans we pride ourselves on "watching the game," but come on, this isn't a golf or tennis match.

JC456
07-02-2009, 01:18 PM
Many casual fans, and even some non-casual ones who go to many games, go to ballgames with friends to not only partake in the fun of a game, but to have a social experience. I know as Sox fans we pride ourselves on "watching the game," but come on, this isn't a golf or tennis match.

So your saying that fundamental rights ought to be involked for the fans. The heck with everyone else let everyone socialize. Why have any rules in the park at all then. Let everyone in the stadium club and have open seating. Let's let everyone have fundamental rights because they have a ticket.

kittle42
07-02-2009, 01:39 PM
So your saying that fundamental rights ought to be involked for the fans. The heck with everyone else let everyone socialize. Why have any rules in the park at all then. Let everyone in the stadium club and have open seating. Let's let everyone have fundamental rights because they have a ticket.

Your slippery slope argument is nonsense.

Many parks do not even close lower-deck concourse access to upper deck holders. You're lucky the Cell does even that.

If you block one part of a park off and charge more money to get into it (i.e. lower deck period, stadium club, jim beam seats, party deck when it's rented) or one part is blocked off without access to the others regardless of pricing (Wrigley or old Yankee bleachers), I have no problem with it.

The concourse at the Cell should be considered an open walkway for anyone having 100 level seats. It's a part of the park experience for people in the 100 level.

In fact, everyone in the 100 level you condone blocking out of the councourse paid more money than you did for your OF tickets - maybe they should just lock you guys inside the OF and let the rest of us wander where we want.

areilly
07-02-2009, 01:40 PM
So your saying that fundamental rights ought to be involked for the fans. The heck with everyone else let everyone socialize. Why have any rules in the park at all then. Let everyone in the stadium club and have open seating. Let's let everyone have fundamental rights because they have a ticket.

What do you mean by "fundamental rights"? Unrestricted access to every area of the park? A trip to the Fundamentals deck? Food, clothing and shelter? I'm confused.

kittle42
07-02-2009, 01:47 PM
What do you mean by "fundamental rights"? Unrestricted access to every area of the park? A trip to the Fundamentals deck? Food, clothing and shelter? I'm confused.

I was just going to let him go on that because it was obvious he didn't know what he was talking about. Perhaps the right to vote...for the All-Star Game?

mrfourni
07-02-2009, 01:57 PM
Your slippery slope argument is nonsense.

Many parks do not even close lower-deck concourse access to upper deck holders. You're lucky the Cell does even that.

If you block one part of a park off and charge more money to get into it (i.e. lower deck period, stadium club, jim beam seats, party deck when it's rented) or one part is blocked off without access to the others regardless of pricing (Wrigley or old Yankee bleachers), I have no problem with it.

The concourse at the Cell should be considered an open walkway for anyone having 100 level seats. It's a part of the park experience for people in the 100 level.

In fact, everyone in the 100 level you condone blocking out of the councourse paid more money than you did for your OF tickets - maybe they should just lock you guys inside the OF and let the rest of us wander where we want.

How about a compromise? Instead of restricting access, enforce a rule where nobody is allowed to stand in front of the aisles, and a walkway is cleared for people to walk through. And this is only done during the busy games (Cubs/Sox, Opening day)

JC456
07-02-2009, 02:12 PM
What do you mean by "fundamental rights"? Unrestricted access to every area of the park? A trip to the Fundamentals deck? Food, clothing and shelter? I'm confused.

fundamental right. A fan purchases a ticket and therefore can go where ever in the park with no limitations.

i.e. If you don't have a ticket for the lower level you can't get there unless you have season tickets for the upper deck. They did that because of Cubs games. Now is every game. Why? you have a ticket for the game you're in the park. Everyone should be allowed everywhere. That's what someone is saying. Socialize!

Heck the Sox provided this nice big piece of concrete behind the outfield seats and therefore everyone ought to congregate there to socialize. It doesn't matter how much it inconviences others or upsets their experience at the park.

I for one, applaud the Sox for taking some incentive and perform some crowd control.

DumpJerry
07-02-2009, 02:21 PM
fundamental right. A fan purchases a ticket and therefore can go where ever in the park with no limitations.

i.e. If you don't have a ticket for the lower level you can't get there unless you have season tickets for the upper deck. They did that because of Cubs games. Now is every game. Why? you have a ticket for the game you're in the park. Everyone should be allowed everywhere. That's what someone is saying. Socialize!

Heck the Sox provided this nice big piece of concrete behind the outfield seats and therefore everyone ought to congregate there to socialize. It doesn't matter how much it inconviences others or upsets their experience at the park.

I for one, applaud the Sox for taking some incentive and perform some crowd control.
Look, I know some of us think very highly of the White Sox, but we must remember they are a private enterprise. They are not able to bestow or deny rights to anyone. That is what the government is empowered to do.

Your ticket gives you a license to access to a baseball game under whatever terms the team deems appropriate. That's all.

Warriorjan
07-02-2009, 02:22 PM
I enjoy walking around the park, looking at the statues, etc. It's one reason why I try to buy lower-deck seats when I'm not in the season seats I split with other people. When I buy upper-deck I fully understand that I can't access the lower deck. But I often tell visitors to the park to go see the statues, etc. The concourse back there is nice and open. I always took my niece and nephew to the rain room when younger - in fact I think they advertised it on the scoreboard during the game on Sunday. So I'm against limiting access during any games - just control what goes on out there better. If they do it for Cubs, then they'll eventually do it more, just like it was pointed out they did with limiting access to the lower deck. And if people want to stand there and socialize, so what? Better do it on the concourse than sit in the seats and talk about everything but the game. And if can't visit with other friends at the game in the concourse, where would you have people meet up if you're not sitting together?Who is the person to give feedback to, now that Dave is retired from Stadium Operations?

Parrothead
07-02-2009, 02:32 PM
I enjoy walking around the park, looking at the statues, etc. It's one reason why I try to buy lower-deck seats when I'm not in the season seats I split with other people. When I buy upper-deck I fully understand that I can't access the lower deck. But I often tell visitors to the park to go see the statues, etc. The concourse back there is nice and open. I always took my niece and nephew to the rain room when younger - in fact I think they advertised it on the scoreboard during the game on Sunday. So I'm against limiting access during any games - just control what goes on out there better. If they do it for Cubs, then they'll eventually do it more, just like it was pointed out they did with limiting access to the lower deck.

that is the problem, people like to look at the statues, get a look from the park at all angles (I do both of these at all of the parks I have went to -58 MLB and minor league parks), go to the rain room, ect...the Cell is one of the few that restrict access to the lower deck. I think the policy sucks. Maybe they could build a separate walkway for access around the whole park that has access to the whole park. Also, they should put some of the statues in the UD too.

JC456
07-02-2009, 02:40 PM
I enjoy walking around the park, looking at the statues, etc. It's one reason why I try to buy lower-deck seats when I'm not in the season seats I split with other people. When I buy upper-deck I fully understand that I can't access the lower deck. But I often tell visitors to the park to go see the statues, etc. The concourse back there is nice and open. I always took my niece and nephew to the rain room when younger - in fact I think they advertised it on the scoreboard during the game on Sunday. So I'm against limiting access during any games - just control what goes on out there better. If they do it for Cubs, then they'll eventually do it more, just like it was pointed out they did with limiting access to the lower deck. And if people want to stand there and socialize, so what? Better do it on the concourse than sit in the seats and talk about everything but the game. And if can't visit with other friends at the game in the concourse, where would you have people meet up if you're not sitting together?Who is the person to give feedback to, now that Dave is retired from Stadium Operations?

There are plenty of places in the park to meet and socialize instead of watching the game. Behind your own seats is a good place, there is a concourse there as well under the upper deck. Heck, they even have the museum and gift shops. There is the bar under the right field seats as well or the walkways into the stadium that everyone has access to or the stium club if you have tickets.

They did this for the Cub game because too many people have congregated there in the past and I would say that there were most likely complaints. Again it is a form of crowd control.

TomBradley72
07-02-2009, 03:10 PM
I've had the chance to visit many major league ballparks and would have to say that the overall quality of "security" at White Sox games (ie.professionalism, responsiveness, proactively and reactively addressing problems) is the lowest of any ballpark I've visited. Any situations that I have witnessed or had occur near me at other parks have been addressed very quickly and efficiently.

At the Cell? Well, I was in the Patio Area one night while a beer soaked brawl broke out and the group of fighters rolled from one end of the Patio area and back again 3-4 times over the course of 10-15 minutes before ANYONE responded. When they did respond it was with a keystone cops level of competency. Similar scenarios with individual fights in the bleachers or the upper deck more times than I could count.

kittle42
07-02-2009, 03:27 PM
At the Cell? Well, I was in the Patio Area one night while a beer soaked brawl broke out and the group of fighters rolled from one end of the Patio area and back again 3-4 times over the course of 10-15 minutes before ANYONE responded. When they did respond it was with a keystone cops level of competency. Similar scenarios with individual fights in the bleachers or the upper deck more times than I could count.

This is why OF access is restricted during Cubs games - that is where almost ALL the lower-deck fights start. It has nothing to do with the convenience of people sitting in the OF (except, of course, the convenience of not being around as many brawling idiots).

Those concerns are decreased during your run-of-the-mill game, or even your run-of-the-mill, non-Cubs sellout, generally.

This thread is making me want to make a point of meeting friends at the game on the OF councourse every single game for a beer or 6.

TomBradley72
07-02-2009, 03:35 PM
This is why OF access is restricted during Cubs games - that is where almost ALL the lower-deck fights start. It has nothing to do with the convenience of people sitting in the OF (except, of course, the convenience of not being around as many brawling idiots).

Those concerns are decreased during your run-of-the-mill game, or even your run-of-the-mill, non-Cubs sellout, generally.

This thread is making me want to make a point of meeting friends at the game on the OF councourse every single game for a beer or 6.

I'm not sure I really understand your point. To me the problem isn't having all 100 level ticketholders having access to the concourse. The problem is having a mediocre, incompetent security team/strategy. Alot of ballparks have areas where people like to congregate, etc...the concourse is one of the few things they got right when they built the new park...plus they've added the shower, the statues, a few shops, etc...so if they have to limit access to control security, in my opinion, they've failed.

Every example I sited in my post occurred at run of the mill/non sell out/non Cubs games.

kittle42
07-02-2009, 03:48 PM
I'm not sure I really understand your point. To me the problem isn't having all 100 level ticketholders having access to the concourse. The problem is having a mediocre, incompetent security team/strategy. Alot of ballparks have areas where people like to congregate, etc...the concourse is one of the few things they got right when they built the new park...plus they've added the shower, the statues, a few shops, etc...so if they have to limit access to control security, in my opinion, they've failed.

Every example I sited in my post occurred at run of the mill/non sell out/non Cubs games.

I was agreeing with you, then elaborating on my earlier points.

TomBradley72
07-02-2009, 04:10 PM
I was agreeing with you, then elaborating on my earlier points.

I think I need a beer.

TomBradley72
07-02-2009, 04:14 PM
I will only say that access to the outfield concourse is nothing more than meeting place for people to have discussions about anything other than a baseball game. If that is your intentions while walking there then I suggest you go to a bar. The purpose of the park is for a baseball game and those who have seats in that area ought to have the right to enjoy their seats and surroundings without having to get bounced around like a pin ball while trying to get to the lavaratory, or get food and drink.

My hats off to the White Sox for limiting the access during the Cub series. I hope they do it for Boston, and NY as well.

If you hate crowds, then I suggest you stay home and watch the game on TV. Crowds are part of the deal with popular/successful baseball teams...and with that comes alot of casual fans who are there as much for the social experience as they are for the game itself. If the concourse crowds bother you that much, go with seats in a different area of the ballpark.

JC456
07-02-2009, 04:42 PM
If you hate crowds, then I suggest you stay home and watch the game on TV. Crowds are part of the deal with popular/successful baseball teams...and with that comes alot of casual fans who are there as much for the social experience as they are for the game itself. If the concourse crowds bother you that much, go with seats in a different area of the ballpark.

I love crowds, just don't like idiots who don't know how to act in public! Especially at Cub games. So boo hoo to those who couldn't go stand on concrete in the outfield.

The Sox are controlling the crowds and that's their's to do!

Warriorjan
07-02-2009, 07:02 PM
Even non-casual fans like me like to walk around and see what's new, just check out other angles, etc. - have done it at several other parks. I don't have to be tied to my seat to be a serious fan. Why else would they build the concourse so wide - agree that the concourse was one of the few things they got right from the start. They need to improve how security handles potentially problematic situations, restricting access is not the way to do it. Simply going around saying, well, they're private, they did it for security, I don't like fans on the concourse, keep them off my lawn, doesn't make it right. People who want to be insulated from the crowds sit in the club section, Jim Beam, etc.

areilly
07-03-2009, 10:48 AM
There are plenty of places in the park to meet and socialize instead of watching the game. Behind your own seats is a good place, there is a concourse there as well under the upper deck. Heck, they even have the museum and gift shops. There is the bar under the right field seats as well or the walkways into the stadium that everyone has access to or the stium club if you have tickets.

They did this for the Cub game because too many people have congregated there in the past and I would say that there were most likely complaints. Again it is a form of crowd control.

So if you're in favor of restricting outfield concourse access to outfield ticket holders, would you also be in favor of restricting the area between sections 155 and 109 to those sections ticket holders as well?

DumpJerry
07-03-2009, 10:56 AM
We should be restricted to our seats only. If you have to go to the bathroom, you will be escorted to and from the bathroom.

sachin
07-03-2009, 12:12 PM
Well you obviously haven't been to a game where everyone is allowed on that concourse during a sell out game. As a season ticket holder in the outfield, I will tell you the vast majority of those fans on the concourse are not watching the game. To move around is difficult and to use the facilities is very difficult.

I will only say that access to the outfield concourse is nothing more than meeting place for people to have discussions about anything other than a baseball game. If that is your intentions while walking there then I suggest you go to a bar. The purpose of the park is for a baseball game and those who have seats in that area ought to have the right to enjoy their seats and surroundings without having to get bounced around like a pin ball while trying to get to the lavaratory, or get food and drink.

My hats off to the White Sox for limiting the access during the Cub series. I hope they do it for Boston, and NY as well.


Oh no! People at a baseball game are discussing things other than baseball! Everyone should know that you must look only at the game, and not talk about anything other than the sport! How could we have ever been so ignorant of this, and wish to speak of things like our lives, our families, jobs, etc? We as fans must clear our actions with the baseball season ticket holders, because they are much MUCH more important than us dogs who bought tickets from the ticket window!

Many, many apologies JC465! Do you think you can overcome this injustice?

Warriorjan
07-03-2009, 04:27 PM
Okay, we should pick a game and have everyone from WSI meet by the Fisk statue or behind right field or something and have a beer together!

ewokpelts
07-04-2009, 02:27 AM
Well you obviously haven't been to a game where everyone is allowed on that concourse during a sell out game. As a season ticket holder in the outfield, I will tell you the vast majority of those fans on the concourse are not watching the game. To move around is difficult and to use the facilities is very difficult.

I will only say that access to the outfield concourse is nothing more than meeting place for people to have discussions about anything other than a baseball game. If that is your intentions while walking there then I suggest you go to a bar. The purpose of the park is for a baseball game and those who have seats in that area ought to have the right to enjoy their seats and surroundings without having to get bounced around like a pin ball while trying to get to the lavaratory, or get food and drink.

My hats off to the White Sox for limiting the access during the Cub series. I hope they do it for Boston, and NY as well.word

ewokpelts
07-04-2009, 02:28 AM
Your slippery slope argument is nonsense.

Many parks do not even close lower-deck concourse access to upper deck holders. You're lucky the Cell does even that.

If you block one part of a park off and charge more money to get into it (i.e. lower deck period, stadium club, jim beam seats, party deck when it's rented) or one part is blocked off without access to the others regardless of pricing (Wrigley or old Yankee bleachers), I have no problem with it.

The concourse at the Cell should be considered an open walkway for anyone having 100 level seats. It's a part of the park experience for people in the 100 level.

In fact, everyone in the 100 level you condone blocking out of the councourse paid more money than you did for your OF tickets - maybe they should just lock you guys inside the OF and let the rest of us wander where we want.maybe they should SIT in those more expensive seats.

Parrothead
07-04-2009, 09:31 AM
Okay, we should pick a game and have everyone from WSI meet by the Fisk statue or behind right field or something and have a beer together!

Can't I have UD seats ! :D:

Warriorjan
07-04-2009, 11:33 AM
Argh, no standing in the outfield concourse for you! Can you imagine what the payroll would be if everyone was told they couldn't leave their seat and spend money on concessions? I never knew that my 40plus years of attending games counted for nothing towards being a serious fan since I usually leave my seat at least once a game to stretch my legs and walk around. My father, in the days of general admission, used to change his outfield seats every few innings. Guess he's be on the blacklist too.

kittle42
07-04-2009, 01:18 PM
maybe they should SIT in those more expensive seats.

Man, some of you guys are curmudgeons. I wouldn't be surprised if the complainers are the same folks who yearned for the days of 14,000 a night when the Sox were selling out a bunch.

Here's an idea - when anyone is up from their seats, perhaps we should have ushers escort them to the bathroom, concession stand, etc. and then directly back to their seats so that they are forced to sit down. I mean, come on, it's a baseball game, and they paid for their seat.

Restricting concourse access is completely stupid. The only reason it was done during the Cubs series is because it's cheaper than paying for extra security, and look how many goddamn fights there were, anyway. If this policy ever becomes more than an occasional thing, I'd seriously re-think my season ticket holder status.

kittle42
07-04-2009, 01:19 PM
My father, in the days of general admission, used to change his outfield seats every few innings. Guess he's be on the blacklist too.

Let's not even get into the "sit in your exact seats when the park is nowhere near filled" nazis.