PDA

View Full Version : N.Y. Times: Sammy Sosa tested positive for PED in 2003


It's Time
06-16-2009, 03:25 PM
Stunner. Bye, bye to the HOF, Sammy.

VenturaFan23
06-16-2009, 03:28 PM
ESPN radio just broke in that the New York Times said that Sosa is on the list of players using PED's in 2003.

The Milkman
06-16-2009, 03:28 PM
Stunner. Bye, bye to the HOF, Sammy.

He has a doctorate? Link?

GoGoCrede
06-16-2009, 03:28 PM
I found a link

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/sports/baseball/17doping.html?_r=1&ref=sports

It's Time
06-16-2009, 03:29 PM
He has a doctorate? Link?


http://www.nytimes.com/pages/sports/

The Milkman
06-16-2009, 03:29 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/sports/baseball/17doping.html?_r=1&ref=sports

Madvora
06-16-2009, 03:30 PM
I found something

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/sports/baseball/17doping.html

It's Time
06-16-2009, 03:37 PM
Change the thread title if you wouldn't mind, Mods. :redface:

spawn
06-16-2009, 03:42 PM
Sorry, throw an H in the thread title if you wouldn't mind, Mods. :redface:
I already changed it to PED. Now, unless you have information that states he has a doctorate, I'll gladly change it back to PHD. :wink:

It's Time
06-16-2009, 03:43 PM
I already changed it to PED. Now, unless you habve information that states he has a doctorate, I'll gladly change it back to PHD. :wink:

I know!! I meant to say I "threw" an H in the thread title. I was way excited when I heard this news. :wink:

It's Time
06-16-2009, 03:46 PM
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/si/2008/writers/joe_lemire/09/26/lemire.mcgwire/SosaMcGwireCongress2.jpg

RadioheadRocks
06-16-2009, 03:51 PM
"Que cosa?"

rocky biddle
06-16-2009, 03:54 PM
I wonder if he's still calmly waiting for the HOF to call?

Boondock Saint
06-16-2009, 03:55 PM
Sammy, the world is shocked and stunned at this revelation. Do you have anything to say for yourself?

:shammy:

"Yo no hablo InglÚs".

beasly213
06-16-2009, 03:56 PM
HAHAHAH. The Score is playing his statement from those congress hearings on now. "To be clear I have never taken performance enhancing drugs."

mantis1212
06-16-2009, 03:57 PM
Sammy, the world is shocked and stunned at this revelation. Do you have anything to say for yourself?

:shammy:

"Yo no hablo InglÚs".

:kneeslap:

khan
06-16-2009, 03:57 PM
Excellent.

Between the SOX winning the World Series and the steroid investigation so pictured in this thread, the memories of 2005 just keep getting better and better.:D::D:

It's Time
06-16-2009, 04:05 PM
Forgive my ignorance, but is Sosa facing Perjury charges as well?

DumpJerry
06-16-2009, 04:08 PM
Forgive my ignorance, but is Sosa facing purgury charges as well?
For what? He did not say anything. His lawyer read a statement. You have to say something to expose yourself to perjury. Slick move on his part that day. Rather, I should say his lawyers earned their fee that day.

It's Time
06-16-2009, 04:11 PM
For what? He did not say anything. His lawyer read a statement. You have to say something to expose yourself to perjury. Slick move on his part that day. Rather, I should say his lawyers earned their fee that day.

Which means he lied on his statement.

mantis1212
06-16-2009, 04:11 PM
For what? He did not say anything. His lawyer read a statement. You have to say something to expose yourself to perjury. Slick move on his part that day. Rather, I should say his lawyers earned their fee that day.

Really? So you can have your lawyer read a statement by you, and it doesn't count as perjury? What kind of law is that where its that easy to get around?

Palehose Pete
06-16-2009, 04:11 PM
You know, you wait for a moment like this in life and when it happens...you didn't think this kind of joy was possible.

As for the perjury charges, yes, it's possible that since the report has Sosa taking the PEDs before his sworn Congressional testimony where he denied taking PEDs, perjury charges can be brought against him.

Railsplitter
06-16-2009, 04:12 PM
I'm shocked, shocked.

wilburaga
06-16-2009, 04:12 PM
Forgive my ignorance, but is Sosa facing purgury charges as well?

I would think that's a distinct possibility. Congress does not like being lied to. McGuire's performance, though pathetic, was probably the wiser choice and will help shield him from further prosecution.

On another subject, I'd love to know who the Deep Throats are on these revelations. Neither the Times nor Selena Roberts would print these stories without multiple sourcing. The Players Union really screwed up letting these cats out of the bag.

W

The Milkman
06-16-2009, 04:13 PM
For what? He did not say anything. His lawyer read a statement. You have to say something to expose yourself to perjury. Slick move on his part that day. Rather, I should say his lawyers earned their fee that day.

So you're telling me, if you don't speak any English, you can just go into court and say whatever you want...and there are no legal repurcussions?

Risk
06-16-2009, 04:13 PM
Hey Sammy. I hope you enjoy waiting by the phone, b/c it's going to be a long, long time before the HOF calls.:D::gulp:

Risk

jdm2662
06-16-2009, 04:16 PM
On another subject, I'd love to know who the Deep Throats are on these revelations. Neither the Times nor Selena Roberts would print these stories without multiple sourcing. The Players Union really screwed up letting these cats out of the bag.

W

If they weren't arrogant and full of themselves, it wouldn't had happened. The feds wanted five tests during the BALCO investigation. The MLBPA, said no no no, they are private. How dare you!!!! We are above the law!!! Pissing off the feds isn't a good idea. So, the feds got a warrant, give them all to us.

WhiteSoxFTW
06-16-2009, 04:18 PM
So you're telling me, if you don't speak any English, you can just go into court and say whatever you want...and there are no legal repurcussions?

Testimony in front of Congress isn't exactly the same as being under oath in a court of law. I'm sure Congress will have the JD investigate though.

mantis1212
06-16-2009, 04:18 PM
If they weren't arrogant and full of themselves, it wouldn't had happened. The feds wanted five tests. The MLBPA, said no no no, they are private. How dare you!!!! Pissing off the feds isn't a good idea. So, the feds got a warrant, give them all to us.

We already knew this by now, but its another reminder what a colossal failure the MLBPA's handling of these tests were- if they were destroyed like they were supposed to be, none of this would ever be known.

It's Time
06-16-2009, 04:21 PM
http://www.mouthpiecesports.com/blogmedia/2009/03/dustybaker.jpg
"Whistles"

BringBackBlkJack
06-16-2009, 04:21 PM
Really? So you can have your lawyer read a statement by you, and it doesn't count as perjury? What kind of law is that where its that easy to get around?

It's total bull**** but I bet it has something to do with attorney-client confidentiality. I'm no law expert but I bet the defense would go as follows: The attorney claims ownership of the statement that was read, and also claims that he had no knowledge or Sosa had never admitted to him that he had taken PEDs or had tested positive. This would effectively shield Sosa from a perjury charge because they know that the conversations that took place between Sosa and his attorney must remain confidential.

DumpJerry
06-16-2009, 04:24 PM
One more time: Scammy did not make any statements to Congress. His lawyer read a statement. Not the same thing. Palmiero made a statement, that is the difference.

DumpJerry
06-16-2009, 04:25 PM
It's total bull**** but I bet it has something to do with attorney-client confidentiality. I'm no law expert but I bet the defense would go as follows: The attorney claims ownership of the statement that was read, and also claims that he had no knowledge or Sosa had never admitted to him that he had taken PEDs or had tested positive. This would effectively shield Sosa from a perjury charge because they know that the conversations that took place between Sosa and his attorney must remain confidential.
It has nothing to do with Scammy's communications with his attorneys. The only issue is what did he say to Congress?

seventyseven
06-16-2009, 04:26 PM
One more time: Scammy did not make any statements to Congress. His lawyer read a statement. Not the same thing. Palmiero made a statement, that is the difference.

Raffy was never charged with perjury anyway, FWIW.

Big D
06-16-2009, 04:28 PM
I don't have any sympathy for A-Rod or Sosa, but it's bull**** that they're the only ones who's names have been leaked from this list of 104. If anyone's name is going to be released, than all 104 names should come out.

mantis1212
06-16-2009, 04:31 PM
Raffy was never charged with perjury anyway, FWIW.

...because he only tested positive AFTER that statement, which is not proof at all.

mantis1212
06-16-2009, 04:32 PM
I don't have any sympathy for A-Rod or Sosa, but it's bull**** that they're the only ones who's names have been leaked from this list of 104. If anyone's name is going to be released, than all 104 names should come out.

I bet they all end up coming out anyway.

DumpJerry
06-16-2009, 04:32 PM
Perjury is an extremely difficult charge to prove in court. There are many elements to the offense which must be proven. This is why it is rarely charged even when it is obvious that person lied under oath.

SOXPHILE
06-16-2009, 04:33 PM
So even if he's charged with perjury, big deal. He'll just remain at his palacial estate in the D.R.

I wonder how the Tribune is going to report this now ? I'm looking directly at Dan McGrath, Rick Morrissey, Paul Sullivan, Dave Van Dyke, and all the others. While Sosa was puffing up like a cartoon character and putting up absurd numbers for the team that's owned by the media conglomerate they work for, they said nothing, never raised a question. Just last week, all of them save for Phil Hersch- (the only one with any balls) - continued to say they would still have to vote him into the HOF, because there still wasn't any real concrete proof.

BringBackBlkJack
06-16-2009, 04:33 PM
It has nothing to do with Scammy's communications with his attorneys. The only issue is what did he say to Congress?

It definitely does have something to do with his communications with his attorneys. From what do you think the attorneys formulate the statements they make on behalf of their clients?

Regardless of that, the NY Times article quotes Sosa himself as vehemently denying he had ever used PEDs, and not through an attorney. I think Congress has a case here.

thomas35forever
06-16-2009, 04:36 PM
Haha! It was bound to happen sooner or later. Thank God it's finally come out, and right before a crosstown series too.

This city owes Frank an apology for the lack of respect he received during the whole Sosa-mania.

wsgdf
06-16-2009, 04:40 PM
One more time: Scammy did not make any statements to Congress. His lawyer read a statement. Not the same thing. Palmiero made a statement, that is the difference.


Any chance you could link to something that states that? I keep reading that he did speak to Congress, though he used an interpretor and pretended he didn't speak English. Are you saying he didn't make a statement and also didn't answer any questions?

Here's a quick paragraph from Slate.com:

"Sosa's strategy as a witness: Speak softly and deny carrying the stick. The Dominican slugger talks about his hard-luck childhood—"We sold oranges and shined shoes to get by"—before saying that he hasn't taken performance-enhancing drugs: "I have never injected myself or had anyone inject me with anything." For the rest of the hearing, reporters pretzel themselves forward to hear his inaudible whispers."

Big D
06-16-2009, 04:43 PM
Any chance you could link to something that states that. I keep reading that he did speak to Congress, though he used an interpretor and pretended he didn't speak English. Are you saying he didn't make a statement and also didn't answer any questions?

Here's a quick paragraph from Slate.com:

"Sosa's strategy as a witness: Speak softly and deny carrying the stick. The Dominican slugger talks about his hard-luck childhood—"We sold oranges and shined shoes to get by"—before saying that he hasn't taken performance-enhancing drugs: "I have never injected myself or had anyone inject me with anything." For the rest of the hearing, reporters pretzel themselves forward to hear his inaudible whispers."

Boy, he worded that very carefully there. "I've never injected anything" - that may actually be true, if the steroids he took were in oral form. As much as everybody made fun of him for his testimony, he may have given himself some wiggle room. The part about being unable to speak English was pretty slick too, since those congressmen didn't want to look insensitive by being tough on someone they thought hardly knew the language.

RKMeibalane
06-16-2009, 04:44 PM
This only confirms what so many of us have long suspected. I wonder what Rick Reilly thinks about this (remember his 2002 article?).

UofCSoxFan
06-16-2009, 04:44 PM
This city owes Frank an apology for the lack of respect he received during the whole Sosa-mania.

While I would be very suprised to learn that Frank ever used steroids, I am far past the point of apologizing to "clean players." It is now impossible to unequivocally say that player x never took roids.

Guys like Pablo Ozuna and Neffi Perez (twice) both are positive tests. I think that alone says sadly that until there is blood testing, no one is beyond suspicion. Maybe I hold a sad view of the baseball world, but I have heard from a very realiable source that in the late 90s roughly 40% of baseball was on something.

Big D
06-16-2009, 04:48 PM
While I would be very suprised to learn that Frank ever used steroids, I am far past the point of apologizing to "clean players." It is now impossible to unequivocally say that player x never took roids.

Guys like Pablo Ozuna and Neffi Perez (twice) both are positive tests. I think that alone says sadly that until there is blood testing, no one is beyond suspicion. Maybe I hold a sad view of the baseball world, but I have heard from a very realiable source that in the late 90s roughly 40% of baseball was on something.

Hell, about 10% of players tested positive in 2003 (for a test they all knew was coming!), and I believe they were only tested once all season. Drug tests aren't particularly difficult to beat, either.

goon
06-16-2009, 04:49 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/goon31/omgwtf.gif

+

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/goon31/SosaBandA3.jpg

=

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/goon31/grindingsausage.gif

asboog
06-16-2009, 04:50 PM
Sosa evidently tested positive back in 2003.

link (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/sports/baseball/17doping.html?_r=1&ref=sports)

Foulke You
06-16-2009, 04:52 PM
I've been waiting for this day since 1998. Remember all those Cubs fans who called us "jealous" whenever any Sox fan would mention his obvious roid transformation? Thank God this man won't tarnish the Hall of Fame.

rickytickytockyk
06-16-2009, 04:53 PM
This could have implications.....because he was not forthcoming with Congress, the poor guy might not be able to return to the United States to accept his Hall of Fame induction .:tongue:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/06/16/sosa.steroids/?eref=sihpT1

chisoxjtrain
06-16-2009, 04:55 PM
I've been waiting for this day since 1998. Remember all those Cubs fans who called us "jealous" whenever any Sox fan would mention his obvious roid transformation? Thank God this man won't tarnish the Hall of Fame.

He'll be waiting by that phone forever.

On a different note, your sig is hilarious.

twinsuck
06-16-2009, 04:57 PM
Ha.

Lip Man 1
06-16-2009, 04:58 PM
The circumstantial evidence has been building for years... from reporting 10 grand in cash stolen out of his hotel room in Miami, to his best friend with the Cubs Manny Alexander being busted for steroids and syringes in Chicago, to the physical transformation from White Sox greyhound to Cubs incredible Hulk, to his suddenly forgetting how to speak English before Congress to his carefully worded statement that left open the possibility of him taking steroids orally which were not illegal in the Dominican Republic at the time.

This guy has been a fraud for years.

Yet despite all this there were still members of the Chicago media who swore he was 'clean...'

Lip

veeter
06-16-2009, 05:04 PM
Great news!! I love it.

ZombieRob
06-16-2009, 05:15 PM
Don't know how credible it is, but intersting to say the least. Now he just has to sit back and wait for congress to see if the nail him or not for lying in 2005.

Edit: heres the dailyherald link http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/

hers the New York Times link http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/sports/baseball/17doping.html

Medford Bobby
06-16-2009, 05:23 PM
Don't know how credible it is, but intersting to say the least. Now he just has to sit back and wait for congress to see if the nail him or not for lying in 2005.

Edit: heres the dailyherald link http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/

hers the New York Times link http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/sports/baseball/17doping.html


Wow....that must have been a hell of a leak...........:o:

DSpivack
06-16-2009, 05:39 PM
Wow....that must have been a hell of a leak...........:o:

Huh? Other outlets pick up on the story, and say "As the NY Times has reported..."

mrfourni
06-16-2009, 05:45 PM
At this point, I think it is in Baseball's best interest to just release the names of everyone who was on that list. Kind of like ripping off a band-aid. It will suck for a little bit, but its still better than having these names released every couple of months when the story starts to die down.

ChiSoxFan81
06-16-2009, 05:45 PM
And officially the proof that the doubters cried for so long didn't exist. Happy trails, Shammy.

Jerko
06-16-2009, 05:51 PM
All he said in court was stuff like "All I know, is I don't know" and "all I can say, I can't say". Comedy gold.

soxfan21
06-16-2009, 05:54 PM
So, does this taint the cubs "magical" 2003 season then?

DumpJerry
06-16-2009, 06:05 PM
You just know that Mark Prior and Kerry Wood are texting each with tears on their cheeks from laughing so hard today..........

doublem23
06-16-2009, 06:10 PM
You just know that Mark Prior and Kerry Wood are texting each with tears on their cheeks from laughing so hard today..........

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/images/2005/06/27/iOrR7YiM.jpg
Actually, my doctor says I'm not supposed to text anybody until next month when I finish up my simulated texting regime.

wsgdf
06-16-2009, 06:35 PM
You just know that Mark Prior and Kerry Wood are texting each with tears on their cheeks from laughing so hard today..........


Hmmm... or they could be worrying that their names are next.

DrCrawdad
06-16-2009, 06:47 PM
For years if a Sox fan, such as me, expressed their belief that Sosa was using steroids that Sox fans was attacked by the Sosapologist Army. They wouldn't merely deny the charge but they'd attack the individual with the usual crap about Sox fans. It couldn't be that we had an honest opinion.

Bruce LeVineline, Grobber and the many other Sosapologists, where are you now?

Check out RosenBlog: Sosaholics have nothing to say now (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-090616rosenblogsosalink,0,4457774.storylink)

DrCrawdad
06-16-2009, 06:54 PM
You just know that Mark Prior and Kerry Wood are texting each with tears on their cheeks from laughing so hard today..........

Maybe Mark Prior is not laughing at all. Prior could very well be in fear of his name being disclosed. Mr. Monster Calfs is no longer that much of a monster, he's a shadow of the man he was when he broke into MLB.

It's Time
06-16-2009, 06:59 PM
For years if a Sox fan, such as me, expressed their belief that Sosa was using steroids that Sox fans was attacked by the Sosapologist Army. They wouldn't merely deny the charge but they'd attack the individual with the usual crap about Sox fans. It couldn't be that we had an honest opinion.

Bruce LeVineline, Grobber and the many other Sosapologists, where are you now?

Check out RosenBlog: Sosaholics have nothing to say now (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-090616rosenblogsosalink,0,4457774.storylink)

Was Levine an apologist? All I know is that Sosa is done as far as the HOF goes and he might be in hotter water as far as congress goes.

balke
06-16-2009, 07:11 PM
First a corked bat, now steroids. The new dirtiest player ever to play the game? You shamed baseball Sammy Sosa.

TommyJohn
06-16-2009, 07:12 PM
Maybe Mark Prior is not laughing at all. Prior could very well be in fear of his name being disclosed. Mr. Monster Calfs is no longer that much of a monster, he's a shadow of the man he was when he broke into MLB.

I want to know how Kerry Wood never had any fingers pointed at him. I'll never forget seeing him in a game in 2007 after one of his many stints on the DL-I couldn't believe it was the same guy! He looked a good 30-40 pounds lighter. But hey, he was a guy, according to Phil Rogers.

WhiteSox1989
06-16-2009, 07:13 PM
I was talking about this with some guy at the gym, and we were just kind of saying how it wasn't a shock. Some guy rudely interrupted us to inform us that "You know he did play for both teams".

StillMissOzzie
06-16-2009, 08:02 PM
This news just absolutely made my day. Two names on the 2003 list down, 102 to go...

HAHAHAH. The Score is playing his statement from those congress hearings on now. "To be clear I have never taken performance enhancing drugs."

Shammy's English was not so good, he meant to say, "I have taken the performance enhancing drug known as 'the clear' "

I've been waiting for this day since 1998. Remember all those Cubs fans who called us "jealous" whenever any Sox fan would mention his obvious roid transformation? Thank God this man won't tarnish the Hall of Fame.
Amen! Either Sox fans were jealous of Shammy's new found power stroke, or just being ridiculed for a trade even worse than Brock for Broglio.

SMO
:gulp:

TornLabrum
06-16-2009, 08:57 PM
I'm waiting for the usual gang of idiots to pollute this thread with, "But guys in the '60s, '70s, and '80s took amphetamines. Why isn't everybody all over their case?"

Woofer
06-16-2009, 09:09 PM
The conspiracy theorist in me thinks that Sosa knew that this news was coming out, that's why he "officially retired" a few weeks ago.

DrCrawdad
06-16-2009, 09:18 PM
Was Levine an apologist? All I know is that Sosa is done as far as the HOF goes and he might be in hotter water as far as congress goes.

Yes.

DrCrawdad
06-16-2009, 09:22 PM
The conspiracy theorist in me thinks that Sosa knew that this news was coming out, that's why he "officially retired" a few weeks ago.

Interesting. Or Sosa's pronouncement that he expects to be selected for the HoF triggered the leak of his name.

Either way, I'm so glad that this is finally out. No more, "Well, Sammy still has not be named..."

ZombieRob
06-16-2009, 09:44 PM
Did the trib take down Rosenblooms blog about apologists?

SOXPHILE
06-16-2009, 09:50 PM
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:flJew2TwSd0MvM:http://diederich.marquette.edu/Handlers/Photo.ashx%3Fid%3D692 (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://diederich.marquette.edu/Handlers/Photo.ashx%3Fid%3D692&imgrefurl=http://diederich.marquette.edu/COC/advisory-board.aspx&usg=__eeC4ATBg91xeMFVHgRAAmKZPQdg=&h=136&w=136&sz=16&hl=en&start=18&um=1&tbnid=flJew2TwSd0MvM:&tbnh=92&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3Ddan%2Bmcgrath%2Bchicago%2Bimage%26hl% 3Den%26rlz%3D1G1GGLQ_ENUS306%26sa%3DX%26um%3D1)htt p://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/columnist/2009-06/2565201-08150325.jpghttp://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/emailform/2008-09/2740827-12153812.jpghttp://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/columnist/2009-06/7622751-08150927.jpg

"Oh, he's definately got our vote...there's no proof..errr..uhhh...ahhh...well..

DrCrawdad
06-16-2009, 09:59 PM
Did the trib take down Rosenblooms blog about apologists?

It's right here. (http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/rosenblog/2009/06/whos-bringing-the-koolaid-at-the-sosaholics-anonymous-meeting.html)

veeter
06-16-2009, 10:34 PM
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:flJew2TwSd0MvM:http://diederich.marquette.edu/Handlers/Photo.ashx%3Fid%3D692 (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://diederich.marquette.edu/Handlers/Photo.ashx%3Fid%3D692&imgrefurl=http://diederich.marquette.edu/COC/advisory-board.aspx&usg=__eeC4ATBg91xeMFVHgRAAmKZPQdg=&h=136&w=136&sz=16&hl=en&start=18&um=1&tbnid=flJew2TwSd0MvM:&tbnh=92&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3Ddan%2Bmcgrath%2Bchicago%2Bimage%26hl% 3Den%26rlz%3D1G1GGLQ_ENUS306%26sa%3DX%26um%3D1)htt p://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/columnist/2009-06/2565201-08150325.jpghttp://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/emailform/2008-09/2740827-12153812.jpghttp://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/columnist/2009-06/7622751-08150927.jpg

"Oh, he's definately got our vote...there's no proof..errr..uhhh...ahhh...well..There's a real Mount Rushmore of writers.

DSpivack
06-16-2009, 10:37 PM
There's a real Mount Rushmore of writers.

A better term might be where I spent many winter hours of my youth... Mt. Trashmore. :tongue:

veeter
06-16-2009, 10:39 PM
A better term might be where I spent many winter hours of my youth... Mt. Trashmore. :tongue:You mean at Blackwell Forest Preserve?

jabrch
06-16-2009, 10:48 PM
Interesting. Or Sosa's pronouncement that he expects to be selected for the HoF triggered the leak of his name.

Either way, I'm so glad that this is finally out. No more, "Well, Sammy still has not be named..."

I'd go with your thought. He said he was calmly waiting for the WS. Someone got offended by that at resolved the issue.

Lip Man 1
06-16-2009, 10:51 PM
This and that:

The biggest defender of Sosa at the Tribune has been Fred Mitchell. As recently as a few weeks ago he wrote and said on Chicago Tribune Live! that there was no proof he did anything. Well now there's proof and I found it interesting that both Rick Morrissey and Steve Rosenbloom have columns up at the Tribune web site but not Fred.

Regarding Phil Rogers I remember he said on Chicago Tribune Live!, I want to say in the last six months (in fact I mentioned it at WSI) where Phil said along the line of "if he did use steroids and he probably did..." so I think he knew something was up.

Also I'm willing to wager that before much longer you are going to be seeing, hearing or reading some comments along the lines of, 'all the failed test proves is that he did them in 2003. There's no proof he did them in 96 or 97 or 98.'

You watch and see.

Lip

SOX LA Mikey
06-16-2009, 11:01 PM
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:flJew2TwSd0MvM:http://diederich.marquette.edu/Handlers/Photo.ashx%3Fid%3D692 (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://diederich.marquette.edu/Handlers/Photo.ashx%3Fid%3D692&imgrefurl=http://diederich.marquette.edu/COC/advisory-board.aspx&usg=__eeC4ATBg91xeMFVHgRAAmKZPQdg=&h=136&w=136&sz=16&hl=en&start=18&um=1&tbnid=flJew2TwSd0MvM:&tbnh=92&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3Ddan%2Bmcgrath%2Bchicago%2Bimage%26hl% 3Den%26rlz%3D1G1GGLQ_ENUS306%26sa%3DX%26um%3D1)htt p://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/columnist/2009-06/2565201-08150325.jpghttp://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/emailform/2008-09/2740827-12153812.jpghttp://www.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/columnist/2009-06/7622751-08150927.jpgMt. DOUCHEmore

gobears1987
06-16-2009, 11:07 PM
he might be in hotter water as far as congress goes.He was smart about the way he worded his statements. Unless they can prove where he took the drugs, he didn't perjure himself as his statements said he didn't do it in this country.

dakuda
06-16-2009, 11:14 PM
The article on the Cubs website mentions that he started his career with the White Sox. I know that the articles are not 'approved' by MLB, but shouldn't they at least do some basic fact checking?

Plus, Hendry's quote about things "that would now be illegal" seems to skirt around the fact that steroids (if that is the PED he tested positive for) was illegal then as well. There just wasn't a rule in MLB for it. MLB does not write laws. If I violate a policy at work, it is not illegal. It is just wrong.

Bradley's quote was interesting as well.

whitesoxfan1986
06-16-2009, 11:21 PM
Was this the test that the entire team (Sox) refused to take to help testing get started? If it is, then Frank is probably on the list and it would make him look guilty if he didn't do anything and would probably keep him out of the hall as well if the list is released. I just want to get some thoughts about this possibility, if in fact this was said test.

TheOldRoman
06-16-2009, 11:21 PM
The conspiracy theorist in me thinks that Sosa knew that this news was coming out, that's why he "officially retired" a few weeks ago.

I think so, too. He is silently retired, so "he can't talk about it". If he retired after this news, it would arouse more suspicion.

I am glad to finally see this slimeball revealed. With the people going after Bonds and Clemens, he was completely overlooked somehow. As PHG said, there is a lot of info to be found on Sosa for anyone who goes around the streets of San Pedro waving $20 bills. I hope one of these reporters finally investigates Sosa.

WhiteSox5187
06-16-2009, 11:46 PM
I want to know how Kerry Wood never had any fingers pointed at him. I'll never forget seeing him in a game in 2007 after one of his many stints on the DL-I couldn't believe it was the same guy! He looked a good 30-40 pounds lighter. But hey, he was a guy, according to Phil Rogers.

The weight that he put on or lost was never quite as dramatic as the weight put on and lost buy guys like Sosa, McGwire, et al. I remember thinking he looked a lot lighter in '07, but he looked the same way in 2006 as he did in 1998. Plus he still throws about as hard now as he did then. Prior on the other hand lost 20 mph off his fastball once steroid testing started.

Zisk77
06-16-2009, 11:46 PM
Was this the test that the entire team (Sox) refused to take to help testing get started? If it is, then Frank is probably on the list and it would make him look guilty if he didn't do anything and would probably keep him out of the hall as well if the list is released. I just want to get some thoughts about this possibility, if in fact this was said test.

No the sox wanted to not take the test to force mandatory testing but the union told the sox that they WOULD take the test, so they did.

Foulke You
06-16-2009, 11:48 PM
The conspiracy theorist in me thinks that Sosa knew that this news was coming out, that's why he "officially retired" a few weeks ago.
I'm almost wondering if the reverse of what you said is the case. Perhaps someone with knowledge of the 2003 list decided to "accidentally" leak this information in direct response to Sosa's recent arrogant interview where he proclaimed that he would just sit and wait patiently for Cooperstown to call for him.

twinslayer
06-17-2009, 12:16 AM
Okay I have a question about this...why have they held this back for so many years? How did they prove it? I'm a little behind...

ZombieRob
06-17-2009, 12:28 AM
I want to know why doesn't baseball want to release the names? Is it for the good of the game?

Lip Man 1
06-17-2009, 01:04 AM
Foulke:

Rick Telander of the Sun-Times brings up that exact point in his column that this may have been accelerated by Sosa's comments a few weeks ago.

Lip

Madvora
06-17-2009, 08:11 AM
I want to know why doesn't baseball want to release the names? Is it for the good of the game?
This was explained better in the NY Times article. The MLB players union is trying to keep the names from getting released, because according to the original agreement, they were never supposed to be released. But... that list was taken by Federal agents investigating steroid use in sports and the players union is saying that they shouldn't be allowed to have it. I don't know if this had anything to do with the BALCO thing, but it might. Anyway, it looks like they're still fighting it out in court which is why most of the names are still hidden.

tebman
06-17-2009, 08:25 AM
The circumstantial evidence has been building for years... from reporting 10 grand in cash stolen out of his hotel room in Miami, to his best friend with the Cubs Manny Alexander being busted for steroids and syringes in Chicago, to the physical transformation from White Sox greyhound to Cubs incredible Hulk, to his suddenly forgetting how to speak English before Congress to his carefully worded statement that left open the possibility of him taking steroids orally which were not illegal in the Dominican Republic at the time.

This guy has been a fraud for years.

Yet despite all this there were still members of the Chicago media who swore he was 'clean...'

The highlighted text is the bottom line. While the '98 home run chase was fun, I was annoyed by Sosa's antics and his obvious me-first approach to the game. The corked bat clinched it for me -- he was a phony.

When he was with the Sox he was an undisciplined hitter with a powerful but scattershot throwing arm. He always seemed more interested in showing how far he could throw the ball than actually nailing a runner. The trade for Bell was a no-brainer in my mind. Then later with the help of the Cubs/Tribune promotion machine he became an inflated caricature with little interest in winning ballgames.

The wheels of justice turn slowly, but they turn. Con men and phonies are always exposed eventually. It's a shame too, because if Sosa had behaved himself he could've been a steady, productive ballplayer on winning teams. But too much is never enough for some people.

DumpJerry
06-17-2009, 09:00 AM
When he was with the Sox he was an undisciplined hitter with a powerful but scattershot throwing arm. He always seemed more interested in showing how far he could throw the ball than actually nailing a runner.
You mean like not hitting the cut-off man in the fateful 8th inning of Game 6 of the 2003 NLCS, thus enabling the Marlins to score even more runs that inning?

Yeah, that's the guy!

GoSox2K3
06-17-2009, 09:15 AM
I can see the headlines now: "Ex-Sox Player Tested Positive for PEDs in '03".

FielderJones
06-17-2009, 09:39 AM
The highlighted text is the bottom line. While the '98 home run chase was fun, I was annoyed by Sosa's antics and his obvious me-first approach to the game. The corked bat clinched it for me -- he was a phony.

I've always wanted to use some of these tags; now it seems appropriate.

:corker

:nandrolone

RedHeadPaleHoser
06-17-2009, 09:52 AM
The whole thing disgusts me. In the end, nothing will happen to him.

Leaking of the name proves there's a list - nothing more. MLB has as much to blame for this bull**** news as much as the players who are on the list do for cheating. But, in the end, nothing will end up happening.

Cheating is accepted these days. Look at Manny's vote totals for the ASG while he serves the suspension. The ability of fans and fans/sportswriters to sway the public trust is sickening.

Big D
06-17-2009, 09:52 AM
You mean like not hitting the cut-off man in the fateful 8th inning of Game 6 of the 2003 NLCS, thus enabling the Marlins to score even more runs that inning?

Yeah, that's the guy!

It was all Bartman's fault!

slavko
06-17-2009, 10:20 AM
The weight that he put on or lost was never quite as dramatic as the weight put on and lost buy guys like Sosa, McGwire, et al. I remember thinking he looked a lot lighter in '07, but he looked the same way in 2006 as he did in 1998. Plus he still throws about as hard now as he did then. Prior on the other hand lost 20 mph off his fastball once steroid testing started.

Kerry was at his best as a fat rookie. He was never a muscle type guy. He looked more conditioned after he took the weight off.

jdm2662
06-17-2009, 10:24 AM
Kerry was at his best as a fat rookie. He was never a muscle type guy. He looked more conditioned after he took the weight off.

Wood had a beer gut more than anything. He always threw hard, even in high school. I never suspected him of roiding.

It wouldn't surprise me if Prior did, however.

Lip Man 1
06-17-2009, 10:57 AM
Sosa had great talent and potential. In 1990 with the Sox he was one of the best all around players in the game. In fact that season he was the only player in baseball with ten or more doubles, triples, home runs, stolen bases and outfield assists.

Guess talent and speed weren't enough for him.

Lip

WhiteSoxFTW
06-17-2009, 11:18 AM
I want to know why doesn't baseball want to release the names? Is it for the good of the game?

The testing of all players in 2003 was negotiated between the league office and the MLBPA. It stated that anonymous testing would take place and if more than 5% of players tested positive for PEDs, then a testing policy would be put in place the next year. The results were supposed to be destroyed or names redacted after the testing took place. But, for some reason, that didn't happen. The feds got ahold of the records during a steroid investigation (don't know which one or if they have said). The MLBPA is fighting tooth and nails to get the list destroyed. It will probably end up going to the Supreme Court they speculate. Several lawyers with inside knowledge of the case have leaked four names. A-Rod and Sosa, and two little known players. That still leaves 100 unnamed.

Hope that explanation helps.

voodoochile
06-17-2009, 11:23 AM
Sosa had great talent and potential. In 1990 with the Sox he was one of the best all around players in the game. In fact that season he was the only player in baseball with ten or more doubles, triples, home runs, stolen bases and outfield assists.

Guess talent and speed weren't enough for him.

Lip

He wanted to be famous... He got his wish. Of course now he's infamous, so perhaps he's not so happy...

jdm2662
06-17-2009, 11:58 AM
GO SOSA!!!!

I laughed my ass off at the end of the 2004 season and I am now. All these years, these stupid idiots worshipped this fraud like he was God. The minute I said he was a fraud, oh you are just jealous! How dare you mock our cute and cuddley hero. Hell, I even knew some idiots that bought his corked bat alibi. What do you have to say for yourself now Sosa fan boys??

Sargeant79
06-17-2009, 12:38 PM
The testing of all players in 2003 was negotiated between the league office and the MLBPA. It stated that anonymous testing would take place and if more than 5% of players tested positive for PEDs, then a testing policy would be put in place the next year. The results were supposed to be destroyed or names redacted after the testing took place. But, for some reason, that didn't happen. The feds got ahold of the records during a steroid investigation (don't know which one or if they have said). The MLBPA is fighting tooth and nails to get the list destroyed. It will probably end up going to the Supreme Court they speculate. Several lawyers with inside knowledge of the case have leaked four names. A-Rod and Sosa, and two little known players. That still leaves 100 unnamed.

Hope that explanation helps.

That's the first I've heard about two more names being leaked. I ask this with no other intention besides satisfying my own morbid curiosity on the subject matter, but who were the two others?

ChiSoxFan81
06-17-2009, 12:40 PM
That's the first I've heard about two more names being leaked. I ask this with no other intention besides satisfying my own morbid curiosity on the subject matter, but who were the two others?

I believe David Segui was one of them.

WhiteSoxFTW
06-17-2009, 01:17 PM
I believe David Segui was one of them.

He was. The other I can't remember. I'll listen to the interview again with Michael Schmidt, the writer that broke the Sosa story, from Mully and Hanley this morning.

Edit: The other player was Jason Grimsley.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2473485

ode to veeck
06-17-2009, 01:35 PM
No the sox wanted to not take the test to force mandatory testing but the union told the sox that they WOULD take the test, so they did.


yes the Sox players were trying to force mandatory testing, not avoid testing, until the union stepped in on their attempt

tstrike2000
06-17-2009, 03:20 PM
Sosa did PED's!!!!!!!! Damn it, I tried ot model my workout routine after his. Now I know why the Vitaman B12 I've been injecting into my own buttcheek for the last 10 years hasn't help me hit that softball farther.

EuroSox35
06-17-2009, 04:17 PM
Maybe Scammy can sign on with the Schaumburg Flyers and run to right field with 2 American flags this time

RKMeibalane
06-17-2009, 04:21 PM
Konerko: "Show Me the Proof" (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4267192)

soltrain21
06-17-2009, 04:23 PM
I don't see where it says he doesn't believe it. He just wants the reporters/lawyers to come forward as the people who broke the story.

XplodingScorbord
06-17-2009, 04:24 PM
Don't see any evidence of a foot in the mouth from the article you posted. He wants the person releasing the name(s) to come forward is all. Seems pretty reasonable, actually.

Harry Potter
06-17-2009, 04:26 PM
:threadsucks


Well at the very least, the title of said thread does...

jej254
06-17-2009, 04:26 PM
"open mouth, insert foot"
-when one slips up in a conversation and eats their own words.

How so???? Bad thread title.

thomas35forever
06-17-2009, 04:27 PM
Interesting. Wonder why he would say this. Unless...nah, he couldn't have.

Chez
06-17-2009, 04:28 PM
Well I'll probably get flamed for saying this (and I sincerely hope it's not true), but if that list is ever made public, it wouldn't shock me to see Paulie's name on it. Look at photos of him from the early part of the decade. His body has shrunk.

soltrain21
06-17-2009, 04:29 PM
Interesting. Wonder why he would say this. Unless...nah, he couldn't have.

He would say this because he wants the lawyers/reporters to be held accountable for this possible witchhunt that could be going on. I'm sure many players in the Players Union feel the exact same way he does.

sox1970
06-17-2009, 04:34 PM
I agree with Konerko. The test in 2003 was supposed to be confidential. If they could do it over I'm sure the players would have insisted on submitting the tests without names attached to them. I'm not sure why they needed to match up the tests with the name if it was just a survey anyway.

RKMeibalane
06-17-2009, 04:38 PM
Don't see any evidence of a foot in the mouth from the article you posted. He wants the person releasing the name(s) to come forward is all. Seems pretty reasonable, actually.

Let me clarify why I said that. It's not so much what he's asking the people in question to do as it is that he's speaking on Sosa's behalf. Why anyone would bother to defend Sosa of all people is beyond my ability to comprehend.

RedHeadPaleHoser
06-17-2009, 04:39 PM
I see no foot in mouth here. Konerko was giving his opinion that a confidential test has been breached, and he wants the evidence behind it.

RedHeadPaleHoser
06-17-2009, 04:40 PM
Let me clarify why I said that. It's not so much what he's asking the people in question to do as it is that he's speaking on Sosa's behalf. Why anyone would bother to defend Sosa of all people is beyond my ability to comprehend.

He's not defending Sosa inasmuch as questioning the sanctity of the confidentiality behind the testing.

DSpivack
06-17-2009, 04:51 PM
Konerko is the Sox player rep, no?

khan
06-17-2009, 05:27 PM
If they could do it over I'm sure the players would have insisted on submitting the tests without names attached to them. I'm not sure why they needed to match up the tests with the name if it was just a survey anyway.

Agreed. Fault the MLBPA & MLB for not insisting upon anonymity among the testing samples.

However, since MLB & the MLBPA ****ed that up, I see no reason to be outraged at the government seeking these tests. After all, the feds were not party to the confidentiality agreement, and are therefore not bound to it.

If anything, Konerko should be pissed off at the union.

Tragg
06-17-2009, 05:51 PM
SlammER Sammy

Lip Man 1
06-17-2009, 08:02 PM
ESPN is now reporting that Congress is going to take a closer look at Sammy's "testimony." The report said Congress doesn't like to be "mislead" by a "witness."

Lip

hi im skot
06-17-2009, 10:27 PM
What a mess.

I understand Konerko's concern, but it doesn't exactly make him look good, eh?

Lip Man 1
06-21-2009, 11:44 AM
Great column today. Asks some interesting question of the Tribune writers who said they'd vote for Sosa for the Hall then changed their minds:

http://www.southtownstar.com/sports/arvia/1632234,062109sptsundayrules.article

Lip

ode to veeck
06-21-2009, 12:03 PM
Great column today. Asks some interesting question of the Tribune writers who said they'd vote for Sosa for the Hall then changed their minds:

http://www.southtownstar.com/sports/arvia/1632234,062109sptsundayrules.article

Lip

Good point on the fact that the corked bat alone should DQ him.

kitekrazy
06-21-2009, 12:46 PM
Agreed. Fault the MLBPA & MLB for not insisting upon anonymity among the testing samples.

However, since MLB & the MLBPA ****ed that up, I see no reason to be outraged at the government seeking these tests. After all, the feds were not party to the confidentiality agreement, and are therefore not bound to it.

If anything, Konerko should be pissed off at the union.

I got a good laugh when Butt Seilg thought MLB was bigger than Congress. ON that stupidity alone he should be banned from baseball along with the players union and the owners who approve of Bud.

kitekrazy
06-21-2009, 01:10 PM
Well I'll probably get flamed for saying this (and I sincerely hope it's not true), but if that list is ever made public, it wouldn't shock me to see Paulie's name on it. Look at photos of him from the early part of the decade. His body has shrunk.

I've had my suspicions about PK ever since he had that really bad season.

WhiteSox1989
06-21-2009, 08:25 PM
I never thought PK was on steroids. I hope he wasn't. He was such a big part of '05.

DrCrawdad
06-21-2009, 11:20 PM
I've had my suspicions about PK ever since he had that really bad season.

Oh boy the baseless accusations against Konerko are starting to appear on WSI too? I expect it from the nitwit Cubbie troll, "Jeffrey Aslip" on the Sox newsgroup (http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.baseball.chi-whitesox/browse_thread/thread/bf5f07c21024a184?hl=en), but here?

ChiSoxFan81
06-23-2009, 12:45 PM
Sosa moves even higher on the douchiness meter:
http://www.nbcchicago.com/sports/baseball/Sammy-Sosa-Was-Vain-Too.html

hi im skot
06-23-2009, 01:00 PM
Sosa moves even higher on the douchiness meter:
http://www.nbcchicago.com/sports/baseball/Sammy-Sosa-Was-Vain-Too.html

Is this even news? I thought this was pretty common knowledge...?

mccoydp
06-23-2009, 01:03 PM
Sosa moves even higher on the douchiness meter:
http://www.nbcchicago.com/sports/baseball/Sammy-Sosa-Was-Vain-Too.html

Too bad the author can't spell "Camero" correctly.

An yes, Sham-me is still an asshat.

hi im skot
06-23-2009, 01:10 PM
Too bad the author can't spell "Camero" correctly.


Maybe he was just thinking of the Canyonero?

http://typetwelve.com/__oneclick_uploads/2008/12/canyonero.jpg

Lip Man 1
06-23-2009, 02:45 PM
Sandberg was on ESPN radio in Chicago today and said Sosa doesn't belong in the Hall.

Lip

skobabe8
06-23-2009, 03:05 PM
Oh boy the baseless accusations against Konerko are starting to appear on WSI too? I expect it from the nitwit Cubbie troll, "Jeffrey Aslip" on the Sox newsgroup (http://groups.google.com/group/alt.sports.baseball.chi-whitesox/browse_thread/thread/bf5f07c21024a184?hl=en), but here?

I didn't know you were a packers fan.

:cool:

pilotsox
06-23-2009, 07:42 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/news/story?id=4281359

He might be a Cub, but this gives me a great deal of respect for Ryne.

Brian26
06-23-2009, 08:44 PM
I've had my suspicions about PK ever since he had that really bad season.

What an ignorant statement.