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View Full Version : *Official* "Toughest Loss of the Year" 6-9 Postgame Thread


Viva Medias B's
06-09-2009, 11:48 PM
Discuss civilly.

SoxGirl4Life
06-09-2009, 11:48 PM
sigh..

BleacherBandit
06-09-2009, 11:48 PM
I maintain the 20-1 loss hurt more.

Jaffar
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
I'm off to puke and cry myself to sleep. :redneck

Brian26
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
I maintain the 20-1 loss hurt more.

Not a chance in hell. This went from the most exciting victory of the season to the toughest loss.

DSpivack
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
Well, I won't be reading Ulysses anytime soon.

35th and Shields
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
classic finish. Getz flies out with the upper-cut swing and Anderson K's....great

palehozenychicty
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
Well, we made a nice comeback, then two incidents costs us. What can you do?

spongyfungy
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
Discuss civilly.

I shall not.

:angry: :bitchslap: :tantrum:

Viva Medias B's
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
I maintain the 20-1 loss hurt more.

I don't know about that.

Domeshot17
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
Burls did not have it, but he battled. It is easy to blame the Umps, but that was a tough call. I am not sure if he was safe or out, I have rewound the DVR several times and its very close, but the ball Beating him that much is what did him in. Ultimately, our bullpen did us in and let us down.

DaveFeelsRight
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
I maintain the 20-1 loss hurt more.theres nothing you can do when you're down 20-1. but when you're down 6-3 going into the ninth and tie it and lose in extras is worse

The Immigrant
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
Disheartening. Terrible ABs in the bottom of the 10th. Long, loopy swings for the fences from three guys whose one goal should be to get on base.

JB98
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
When you're going bad, you're going bad.

This has been a poor homestand.

BadBobbyJenks
06-09-2009, 11:49 PM
I am still not sure if Wise got in there or not. Wow was that close.

Stomach puncher.

WhiteSox1989
06-09-2009, 11:50 PM
Whatever..I'm coming to peace with this season. If the Sox play ****ty and loose games, it doesn't make me less of a fan.

That being said, LETS GO SOX! Get the Tigers tomorrow!:bandance:

BleacherBandit
06-09-2009, 11:50 PM
Not a chance in hell. This went from the most exciting victory of the season to the toughest loss.

Depends on what your definition of "hurt" is. I'd say being tortured for 9 innings with Bartolo compeltely crapping himself in the first two innings was excruciating.

This sucked completely, too.

Soxman219
06-09-2009, 11:50 PM
I honestly thought Wise was safe.

Toughest loss of the year.:(:

Viva Medias B's
06-09-2009, 11:50 PM
The ump's call was big and probably cost us the game, but so did our BBs and our LOBs.

Soxfest
06-09-2009, 11:50 PM
2009 Sox "We take defeat from the jaws of victory tour"!

Navarro's Talent
06-09-2009, 11:50 PM
Ouch.

Sockinchisox
06-09-2009, 11:51 PM
We really needed this one with Verlander and Jackson going the next 2 games.

Things don't look good.

DrCrawdad
06-09-2009, 11:51 PM
When you're going bad, you're going bad.

This has been a poor homestand.

That's an understatement.

35th and Shields
06-09-2009, 11:51 PM
I think we'll be regretting Linebrink's contract sooner then expected.....

chisoxfanatic
06-09-2009, 11:51 PM
This has been a poor homestand.
The understatement of the year! I was hoping for a 9-3 homestand. I can't believe we are currently 3-7.

Viva Medias B's
06-09-2009, 11:52 PM
I just hope this loss does not send us into a real tailspin.

hi im skot
06-09-2009, 11:52 PM
Linebrink blows it, but Jim Joyce blew it worse.

The thread title is right on. Nothing's going right for this team.

Woofer
06-09-2009, 11:52 PM
At least we fought back. That play on Wise should have ended the game. It might end up being the end of our season instead.

BadBobbyJenks
06-09-2009, 11:52 PM
2009 Sox "We take defeat from the jaws of victory tour"!

Perfect.

hi im skot
06-09-2009, 11:52 PM
BA is such a black hole. Only that loser strikes out looking in that situation. Whenever he comes to bat I let out a wicked stinky fart.

How about when he hit that home run?

/non-FOBA

rookie
06-09-2009, 11:53 PM
The only bright side is that Detriot seems almost as bad as us. I can't believe our division is this bad.

DSpivack
06-09-2009, 11:53 PM
I think we'll be regretting Linebrink's contract sooner then expected.....

It's not like he's been bad all year. He made a mistake to one of the top hitters in baseball, and got beat for it.

The Immigrant
06-09-2009, 11:53 PM
That's Linebrink's 4th loss of the year. We are only a third of the way through the season. :o:

thomas35forever
06-09-2009, 11:54 PM
The call against Wise was bogus, but once again, it comes down to poor timely hitting. At least Verlander's on the mound tomorrow. We always rough him up pretty good.

Rohan
06-09-2009, 11:54 PM
BA is such a black hole. Only that loser strikes out looking in that situation. Whenever he comes to bat I let out a wicked stinky fart.

He accounted for one third of our runs tonight. Go post this somewhere else.

We had some bad moments in this game. But ultimately, when the cookie crumbled, this one falls on Joyce.

JB98
06-09-2009, 11:54 PM
That's an understatement.

I learned to be Master of the Obvious in journalism school. :D:

I thought Wise was safe, and I thought so without the benefit of a replay. That said, you gotta shrug that off, shut 'em down the next inning and take your chances. Sox didn't do that. Unfortunately, that's typical of this team. They are finding ways to lose close games this year.

I might have to watch tomorrow's game on mute, because you know Hawk isn't going to let that call go.

1989
06-09-2009, 11:54 PM
**** that ump. **** him. **** him for us being down 5.5 games instead of only 3.5. **** that. This team actually has the balls to come back and the blue takes it right from us. Un****ingbelievable. This is the type of game that can be such a momentum changer and he ****ed that one up. Big time.

Great job by Konerko for putting a great swing on an 0-2 count, way to show up when runners are in scoring position. Can't say that about the rest of team.

Viva Medias B's
06-09-2009, 11:54 PM
Our whole season could be summed up in this one game.

WhiteSox1989
06-09-2009, 11:55 PM
**** that ump. **** him. **** him for us being down 5.5 games instead of only 3.5. **** that. This team actually has the balls to come back and the blue takes it right from us. Un****ingbelievable. This is the type of game that can be such a momentum changer and he ****ed that one up. Big time.

Great job by Konerko for putting a great swing on an 0-2 count, way to show up when runners are in scoring position. Can't say that about the rest of team.


Hey there, it's going to be okay...I promise..

SoxFan1979
06-09-2009, 11:56 PM
:whiner: :shakehead: :puking:

SoxGirl4Life
06-09-2009, 11:56 PM
Comcast question:

Which team worries you most in the ALC? a.Twins, b.Tigers, c.Indians, or d. Royals.

I wanna pick E. White Sox!

hi im skot
06-09-2009, 11:56 PM
Our whole season could be summed up in this one game.

Yep. What little hope I had for this season disappeared when Cabrera went yard.

Sigh...win tomorrow, I guess.

Rohan
06-09-2009, 11:56 PM
Hey there, it's going to be okay...I promise..

Let the man vent. This one hurt, and venting is what this thread is for.

Domeshot17
06-09-2009, 11:56 PM
The Ump may have blown a tough call but that call did not make us LOSE or cost us our season. Our lack of talent did both. Our Bullpen sucked tonight.

JB98
06-09-2009, 11:57 PM
The understatement of the year! I was hoping for a 9-3 homestand. I can't believe we are currently 3-7.

And I stayed home tonight, for fear of jinxing the team. They lost anyway. :shrug:

WhiteSox1989
06-09-2009, 11:57 PM
Let the man vent. This one hurt, and venting is what this thread is for.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah.

Domeshot17
06-09-2009, 11:57 PM
comcast question:

Which team worries you most in the alc? A.twins, b.tigers, c.indians, or d. Royals.

I wanna pick e. White sox!

potw material that was great

hi im skot
06-09-2009, 11:58 PM
The Ump may have blown a tough call but that call did not make us LOSE or cost us our season. Our lack of talent did both. Our Bullpen sucked tonight.

There's plenty of blame to go around tonight, absolutely. Signaling the baserunner safe and then punching him out, though...weak.

manders_01
06-09-2009, 11:58 PM
I'm just extraordinary thankful that JD didn't break his wrist. I thought for sure he was down for the count on that catch. Schew!

Tough loss but I liked the rally.

Woofer
06-09-2009, 11:58 PM
The pitching crumbles almost every at bat after we score lately. You can't win if the pitching can't get the job done. This one stings.

1989
06-09-2009, 11:59 PM
Hey there, it's going to be okay...I promise..

I need a hug

hi im skot
06-09-2009, 11:59 PM
I need a hug

I think we all do.

WhiteSox1989
06-09-2009, 11:59 PM
The Ump may have blown a tough call but that call did not make us LOSE or cost us our season. Our lack of talent did both. Our Bullpen sucked tonight.

Took the words out of my mouth. What sucks is that the hitters are actually clutch when they usually aren't, and the bullpen sucks when they usually aren't. Can't we have it all in ONE damn game? :angry:

Oh well, get 'em tomorrow!


OH, and I'm not sure if there was a Getz bandwagon, but I am officially off of it.

Martinigirl
06-09-2009, 11:59 PM
I am still not sure if Wise got in there or not. Wow was that close.

Stomach puncher.

It would have been nice for our manager to at least go out there and ask the ump how a person can be called safe and out on the same play.

WhiteSox1989
06-10-2009, 12:00 AM
I need a hug
I need a drink.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:00 AM
Pathetic showing by a pathetic team.

Both teams deserved to lose tonight, the battle of two very crappy teams.

18 BBs combined?

That's little league nonesense.


We lose the game where we have our "ACE" going and they have the worst pitcher in the AL going.

Based on that last statement, anyone want to defend and call this pile of crap a "contender," go right ahead and buy into that. I have swamp land in Florida to sell you also.

SoxGirl4Life
06-10-2009, 12:00 AM
I need a hug

:grouphug: Its ok. Some seasons are just like this

manders_01
06-10-2009, 12:01 AM
There's plenty of blame to go around tonight, absolutely. Signaling the baserunner safe and then punching him out, though...weak.

To me, it really didn't look like he was signaling safe, just looked like he was just jumping out of the way and his arms went flying back.

Rohan
06-10-2009, 12:01 AM
I'm just extraordinary thankful that JD didn't break his wrist. I thought for sure he was down for the count on that catch. Schew!

Tough loss but I liked the rally.

Ozzie in his press conference just said that JD's wrist is fine. He's been having a little calf strain problem the last couple of days but it's nothing that really effects his play.

manders_01
06-10-2009, 12:02 AM
Ozzie in his press conference just said that JD's wrist is fine. He's been having a little calf strain problem the last couple of days but it's nothing that really effects his play.

Well that's good to hear - thanks!

BadBobbyJenks
06-10-2009, 12:02 AM
I need a drink.

Best Idea Yet

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:04 AM
Bobby Jenks has "Soreness on his one side?" That's breaking news.

***, no one can stay healthy on this team.

SoxGirl4Life
06-10-2009, 12:04 AM
Jenks wasn't available. Tightness or something

ChiSox81
06-10-2009, 12:06 AM
I am happy with the fight that the Sox showed in the 9th. If it wasn't for a blown call by the ump its a W for the Sox. Well at least we have Verlander tommorow who we own. Its going to get better soon, this bad luck with injuries and blown calls can't last forever.

SoxGirl4Life
06-10-2009, 12:06 AM
Bobby Jenks has "Soreness on his one side?" That's breaking news.

***, no one can stay healthy on this team.

:grouphug: lol

35th and Shields
06-10-2009, 12:06 AM
To me, it really didn't look like he was signaling safe, just looked like he was just jumping out of the way and his arms went flying back.

Yep I saw the same thing, just trying to get out of Wise's way

Soxman219
06-10-2009, 12:07 AM
:raincloud:

Bad times.

Viva Medias B's
06-10-2009, 12:09 AM
On that call at home, why didn't Ozzie come out and at least get a clarification from Joyce? I'm not saying Ozzie should have darted out and blown a gasket and gotten tossed, like Piniella would have, but he could have gone out and get an explanation.

35th and Shields
06-10-2009, 12:09 AM
It really is a shame because this was looking like one of those comebacks that can help a team jell and really come together.

So much for that

Rohan
06-10-2009, 12:09 AM
I am happy with the fight that the Sox showed in the 9th. If it wasn't for a blown call by the ump its a W for the Sox. Well at least we have Verlander tommorow who we own. Its going to get better soon, this bad luck with injuries and blown calls can't last forever.

Yeah... It's always nice to see Konerko continue his .300 batting average.

P.S. try to avoid the "W" thing. That's more of a cubbie thing. We here on the south side like to spell out "win".

Rohan
06-10-2009, 12:10 AM
On that call at home, why didn't Ozzie come out and at least get a clarification from Joyce? I'm not saying Ozzie should have darted out and blown a gasket and gotten tossed, like Piniella would have, but he could have gone out and get an explanation.

I wonder the same thing... Ozzie seemed very casual after the game as well. He said it was "too close of a call for him to argue." I don't understand the logic at all.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:11 AM
I am happy with the fight that the Sox showed in the 9th. If it wasn't for a blown call by the ump its a W for the Sox. Well at least we have Verlander tommorow who we own. Its going to get better soon, this bad luck with injuries and blown calls can't last forever.


Hawk, is that you?


By the way, the Sox are not losing because of bad calls or injuries. They are losing because they are bad. Dontrel Willis had no business lasting past the first inning and he went into the 5th. He's the worst pitcher in baseball today.

If we can't take advantage of that and hit the crap out of him, we don't stand a chance vs a piniata.

Verland and Jackson up next. Lord help us.

JB98
06-10-2009, 12:12 AM
I am happy with the fight that the Sox showed in the 9th. If it wasn't for a blown call by the ump its a W for the Sox. Well at least we have Verlander tommorow who we own. Its going to get better soon, this bad luck with injuries and blown calls can't last forever.

No, it won't last forever. One day, the Sox will have a good team again. It likely won't be this season.

Viva Medias B's
06-10-2009, 12:12 AM
No, it won't last forever. One day, the Sox will have a good team again. It likely won't be this season.

The pressure is on this guy...

:KW

...to make that happen.

SoxGirl4Life
06-10-2009, 12:13 AM
No, it won't last forever. One day, the Sox will have a good team again. It likely won't be this season.

This.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 12:15 AM
Pathetic showing by a pathetic team.

I take major exception to this statement tonight. The Sox fought back twice late in the game to tie it and came within an eyelash of winning it outright.

The heart and effort they displayed to get to those points was excellent. For you to dismiss it as pathetic is well... pathetic, but nothing new from you either.

Nice try. I have no idea whether Wise was safe or out. Closest play I think I've ever seen. I honestly haven't been able to tell and they showed it like 8 times. I've never felt after so many views that a play was a tie but this time I think it was and before anyone says it, no ties don't go to the runner. According to the rule book there's no such thing. Ball beats runner, runner out. I think that's what it came down to and I cannot say it was wrong.

Get 'em tomorrow.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 12:17 AM
Hawk, is that you?


By the way, the Sox are not losing because of bad calls or injuries. They are losing because they are bad. Dontrel Willis had no business lasting past the first inning and he went into the 5th. He's the worst pitcher in baseball today.

If we can't take advantage of that and hit the crap out of him, we don't stand a chance vs a piniata.

Verland and Jackson up next. Lord help us.

Willis looked to have some excellent stuff tonight. He was moving the ball in and out, up and down and changing speeds. He also was throwing strikes regularly enough to force Sox batters to swing. You cannot generalize THIS GAME based on past performances. It doesn't work that way. No matter how hard you want it to. Sometimes bad pitchers pitch well.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:18 AM
The pressure is on this guy...

:KW

...to make that happen.


Speaking of, I hope he and JR have had about enough of this nonesense. I'm not for upper management coming down to the locker room, but this is becoming Jerry Manuel bad right now. All the bitching and crying by players, failed execuction, etc. It's beyond Ozzie already. Just my opinion.

sunofgold
06-10-2009, 12:18 AM
It was a tough loss, but an exciting game. Don't give up. Get them tomorrow.

Detroit has holes like all of the teams in the AL Central. Do you really think that Rodney will hold up as their closer for the whole year? Willis is in their starting rotation?

82 wins gets you this division.

Harry Potter
06-10-2009, 12:19 AM
I take major exception to this statement tonight. The Sox fought back twice late in the game to tie it and came within an eyelash of winning it outright.

The heart and effort they displayed to get to those points was excellent. For you to dismiss it as pathetic is well... pathetic, but nothing new from you either.

Nice try. I have no idea whether Wise was safe or out. Closest play I think I've ever seen. I honestly haven't been able to tell and they showed it like 8 times. I've never felt after so many views that a play was a tie but this time I think it was and before anyone says it, no ties don't go to the runner. According to the rule book there's no such thing. Ball beats runner, runner out. I think that's what it came down to and I cannot say it was wrong.

Get 'em tomorrow.

Couldn't have said it any better Jim

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 12:19 AM
Speaking of, I hope he and JR have had about enough of this nonesense. I'm not for upper management coming down to the locker room, but this is becoming Jerry Manuel bad right now. All the bitching and crying by players, failed execuction, etc. It's beyond Ozzie already. Just my opinion.

The two players who are bitching and whining are going to be the first two gone from the team. You want to base decisions on management on the two worst players on the roster's opinion?

Simply ridiculous...

BadBobbyJenks
06-10-2009, 12:23 AM
Willis looked to have some excellent stuff tonight. He was moving the ball in and out, up and down and changing speeds. He also was throwing strikes regularly enough to force Sox batters to swing. You cannot generalize THIS GAME based on past performances. It doesn't work that way. No matter how hard you want it to. Sometimes bad pitchers pitch well.

Is this serious?

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:24 AM
Willis looked to have some excellent stuff tonight. He was moving the ball in and out, up and down and changing speeds. He also was throwing strikes regularly enough to force Sox batters to swing. You cannot generalize THIS GAME based on past performances. It doesn't work that way. No matter how hard you want it to. Sometimes bad pitchers pitch well.


With a straight face you can say Willis had excellent stuff out there?

Are you serious Voodo? :?:

The guy was a scared cat on the mound the first 10 pitches he threw. He was aiming, stretching, itching, balking (with no call but a warning). It was one of the most un-comfortable performances by a pitcher I have ever seen at this level. It made you feel sad for the guy.

MHOUSE
06-10-2009, 12:25 AM
This team just isn't that good. As great as the 3 wins in 3 days to end last season was, that team just wasn't that good. This team is comprised mostly of that team plus some wishful thinking that holes at second base and in center field would magically fix themselves. That's just the state of things. Until we unload the majority of this team, things are not going to get any better. It's a shame because we finally have a pretty solid bullpen (on most nights) and our starting pitching has been good enough overall despite some regression from Floyd and Danks. If we could only get some hits when it mattered. 5 WALKS in one inning and we only get 3 runs, then play dead in the 10th? Pathetic. I felt like that 9th inning could be a turning point in the right direction, then two pitches later it was a complete 180. We're going nowhere.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 12:28 AM
Is this serious?

He was getting the calls for strikes, working both sides of the plate, up and down and changing speeds. What more do you want from a starter?

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:28 AM
I take major exception to this statement tonight. The Sox fought back twice late in the game to tie it and came within an eyelash of winning it outright.

The heart and effort they displayed to get to those points was excellent. For you to dismiss it as pathetic is well... pathetic, but nothing new from you either.

Nice try. I have no idea whether Wise was safe or out. Closest play I think I've ever seen. I honestly haven't been able to tell and they showed it like 8 times. I've never felt after so many views that a play was a tie but this time I think it was and before anyone says it, no ties don't go to the runner. According to the rule book there's no such thing. Ball beats runner, runner out. I think that's what it came down to and I cannot say it was wrong.

Get 'em tomorrow.


I honestly don't see this fight you and other are so proud about here.

The Tigers were handing this came to us and we did not take it from them. There was no fight in the 9th inning. It was a pile of walks by Tiger pitching and one big hit by Paulie.

One thing we do agree on is the Wise call. Too cloe to call either way. Can't blame the ump there.


Get them tomorrow indeed.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 12:28 AM
With a straight face you can say Willis had excellent stuff out there?

Are you serious Voodo? :?:

The guy was a scared cat on the mound the first 10 pitches he threw. He was aiming, stretching, itching, balking (with no call but a warning). It was one of the most un-comfortable performances by a pitcher I have ever seen at this level. It made you feel sad for the guy.

So for a few pitches he struggled so by definition he struggled the whole game? No, sorry, it doesn't work that way.

BadBobbyJenks
06-10-2009, 12:30 AM
He was getting the calls for strikes, working both sides of the plate, up and down and changing speeds. What more do you want from a starter?

He was using both sides of the batters box.

5 walks and 5 hits in 5 innings is a great performance?

I guess you could make the case he was effectively wild:?:

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:31 AM
He was getting the calls for strikes, working both sides of the plate, up and down and changing speeds. What more do you want from a starter?


You and I were watching two very different games.

Willis was beyond bad out there. To his defense, something has to be wrong with his legs because the guy has Zero balane out there. He can't even lift his leg kick as high as he once did (Marlin days.)

soxfan21
06-10-2009, 12:33 AM
Tough loss, should not have come down to the play at the plate though. It seemed as though everyone we walked came home to score for the tigers, yet if it wasn't for the homer, Paulie, and pods coming home on the wild pitch, none of our guys that were walked scored. Same old story, hopefully we come back strong tomorrow and don't let this one haunt us.

MHOUSE
06-10-2009, 12:33 AM
I honestly don't see this fight you and other are so proud about here.

The Tigers were handing this came to us and we did not take it from them. There was no fight in the 9th inning. It was a pile of walks by Tiger pitching and one big hit by Paulie.

I agree completely. We should have scored more than 3 runs in an inning with 5 walks by opposing pitchers, 3 with nobody out. We were closer to a groundball or another K and scoring zero runs than we were to blowing the game open and winning it ourselves.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:34 AM
He was using both sides of the batters box.

5 walks and 5 hits in 5 innings is a great performance?

I guess you could make the case he was effectively wild:?:


He was awful out there. He has no legs.

For us to lose the Buehrle game of this series when going vs this bad of a SP, the Tigers have to giddy about the rest of this series.

This was one of those games where it was a "must win" for us because of the pitching match-up.

SoxandtheCityTee
06-10-2009, 12:37 AM
Froze to death at the Cell. Was still jumping up and down cheering when the ump called Wise out at home: quite the solar plexus punch. From that point to the first-pitch home run in the 10th was the farthest fastest fall I can recall experiencing at the park. My DVR did not pick up the game on CSN+ so I still don't know what the benches cleared about. Or if Wise was safe, though a quick glance at the thread says I may never know. Perfect.

Too tired, too cold, too down. G'night everybody.

JB98
06-10-2009, 12:38 AM
I thought Willis was bad -- and that the Sox let him off the hook. That's what this offense does. Willis looked like he was ready to cry in the first inning. Sox hitters swung at bad pitches and let him get settled a bit.

He was rattled again after BA's homer in the fifth, but another untimely GIDP cost the Sox a golden chance to put Willis away. After the score was tied 3-3, the Sox had first and second with no outs and the heart of the order coming to the plate. Nothing more got done in that inning. Weak, but entirely predictable.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:38 AM
I agree completely. We should have scored more than 3 runs in an inning with 5 walks by opposing pitchers, 3 with nobody out. We were closer to a groundball or another K and scoring zero runs than we were to blowing the game open and winning it ourselves.


Agree 100%.

We had one hit that inning. One.

I guess if taking ptiches that are 1 mile away from the strike zone is considered fight, then I don't know what to say. Rodney was not even close at all.

AnkleSox
06-10-2009, 12:39 AM
At least the wings lost. Man, **** detroit...seems like 90% of their damn tool fans move to Chicago.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:41 AM
I thought Willis was bad -- and that the Sox let him off the hook. That's what this offense does. Willis looked like he was ready to cry in the first inning. Sox hitters swung at bad pitches and let him get settled a bit.

He was rattled again after BA's homer in the fifth, but another untimely GIDP cost the Sox a golden chance to put Willis away. After the score was tied 3-3, the Sox had first and second with no outs and the heart of the order coming to the plate. Nothing more got done in that inning. Weak, but entirely predictable.


Big opportunity was missed.

And Pods was almost thrown out by an inch at HP in the 1st. We almost did not even score there. The guy was a deer on headlights that 1st inning. The human side of me felt very bad for the guy.

Risk
06-10-2009, 12:43 AM
At least the wings lost. Man, **** detroit...seems like 90% of their damn tool fans move to Chicago.

If you've ever lived in Detroit, you would do the same.

This homestand has absolutely sucked the life out of me.

Risk

Whitesoxfan23
06-10-2009, 12:43 AM
Yeah, the team did show some fight at the end, but we still lost the game. The Sox continue to suck against godawful pitchers, so no... I'm not going to let them off the hook tonight. Too little, too late. Willis is a joke. But, our team hasn't been much better this season unfortunately. Blah. Hopefully we win tomorrow, because folks we are in deep trouble.

kevingrt
06-10-2009, 12:43 AM
One word for tonight:

Sickening.

Risk
06-10-2009, 12:44 AM
One word for tonight:

Sickening.

Agreed.

Risk

WhiteSox5187
06-10-2009, 12:45 AM
This team is killing me slowly.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:45 AM
On another note, what has happened to Chris Getz?

The guy is not even a shadow of the guy we saw in April. I'm concerned a bit that non of our 2B candidate will amount to anything this season.

Contrats to Gordon for his first hit, but he also looks very over-matched and too jumpy at the dish. Hope someone can tell him to relax a bit up there.

kevingrt
06-10-2009, 12:49 AM
This team is killing me slowly.

Same. I was out with friends tonight and after that 10th was silent. I might have said two words the rest of the night. One was profane. The other was bye.

palehozenychicty
06-10-2009, 12:53 AM
On another note, what has happened to Chris Getz?

The guy is not even a shadow of the guy we saw in April. I'm concerned a bit that non of our 2B candidate will amount to anything this season.

Contrats to Gordon for his first hit, but he also looks very over-matched and too jumpy at the dish. Hope someone can tell him to relax a bit up there.


He shouldn't be up here anyway.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 12:57 AM
I blame this loss on the home plate umpire. Wise was clearly safe. No ump should rescind an original call when it was the right call.

EuroSox35
06-10-2009, 12:57 AM
This team is criminally stupid. Against Dontrelle Willis the gameplan is swing away? That first inning turned out embarrassing (even with the gift run after the ump blew a call), I was about to go nuts on Alexei for swinging at ball 4 but then you see Konerko, guy after guy, swinging out of the gate, going after balls, getting down in the count, unbelievable.

And why hasn't Buehrle earned being able to get out of his own mess?

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:57 AM
He shouldn't be up here anyway.

Well, I don't see Getz, Fields, Nix being any better than him at the plate despite his 1 for 16 start.

So he shouldn't be up here is correct, but his competition should not be starting at this level either.

So, might as well roll with the punches.

JB98
06-10-2009, 12:59 AM
This team is criminally stupid. Against Dontrelle Willis the gameplan is swing away? That first inning turned out embarrassing (even with the gift run after the ump blew a call), I was about to go nuts on Alexei for swinging at ball 4 but then you see Konerko, guy after guy, swinging out of the gate, going after balls, getting down in the count, unbelievable.

And why hasn't Buehrle earned being able to get out of his own mess?

Wasn't that terrible? My neighbors must have been pissed at me. I was swearing loudly at our hitters for hacking away at a guy who can't throw three strikes before he throws four balls.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 12:59 AM
I blame this loss on the home plate umpire. Wise was clearly safe.


With the help of 10 different angles of instant replay and at 10 different speeds 20 X each, even then it's very hard to see if he is safe or out.

Now how about a human making that call at that instant second?

It's a flip of the coin at that moment.

Unlucky for us.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 01:00 AM
I blame this loss on the home plate umpire. Wise was clearly safe. No ump should rescind an original call when it was the right call.

Okay, no way can anyone tell whether Wise was clearly safe. It's not possible. Anyone who says different is looking at it from a biased perspective, IMO.

Second, the ump didn't make a safe call. Yes his arms flew out to the side as the play unfolded in front of him, but clearly this was an effort to maintain balance as he tried to get out of the way of the headfirst sliding Wise. Once he was stable, he immediately made the out signal. He didn't change his call or even come close to doing so...

GoGoCrede
06-10-2009, 01:01 AM
Just got back from the game. Never before experienced such a wide range of emotions as I did between the 9th and 10th innings. Pure euphoria, then....meh. Gotta say, the 9th was the most exciting inning I've seen in person all year. That inning was was Exhibit A as to why you should never leave the game until it's completely over.

Glad I was able to see Beckham's first hit. :bandance:Would have been too perfect if he drove in the winning run, so of course he didn't.

I missed the entire hullabaloo with someone causing the bullpen to come running...can anyone enlighten me?

Lots of cheers rang out when they announced that the Penguins had won.

Lots of tools in the stands tonight, both sides. A few fans were ejected in my section. Yelling obscenities with kids nearby. :rolleyes:

Oh, well. This was a tough loss to witness in person. But we can still win the series, definitely.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 01:02 AM
Anyone who says different is looking at it from a biased perspective, IMO.
Hello!!! This is WSI!!!

Lip Man 1
06-10-2009, 01:02 AM
What beat the Sox tonight wasn't an umpire it was going 1-9 with runners in scoring position and only getting three runs off a pitcher who gave up five hits and five walks.

And on another note, will the Sox ever play at home in nice weather?

Lip

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 01:03 AM
Wasn't that terrible? My neighbors must have been pissed at me. I was swearing loudly at our hitters for hacking away at a guy who can't throw three strikes before he throws four balls.


LOL

Willis would have walked you tonight even during a no batter simulated game. The Sox could have gone up there with no bats on their shoulder and he would not have put 3 pitches out 7 in that strike zone.

One note about Alexei, he has started to take a ton more pitches since batting in the 2 hole. That's a good sign.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 01:05 AM
Hello!!! This is WSI!!!

Whoopty do...

I'm biased about the Sox too, but not about the calls that affect the games. That's where I draw the line. Play fair. Play hard. Play to win. Don't give either side any special treatment.

Now ask me about how I feel about the kittens and whether I'd want a bunch of kitten fans trolling the site. That's a different issue...

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 01:05 AM
What beat the Sox tonight wasn't an umpire it was going 1-9 with runners in scoring position and only getting three runs off a pitcher who gave up five hits and five walks.

And on another note, will the Sox ever play at home in nice weather?

Lip


Lip, you are better than that.

Don't go there. :cool:

central44
06-10-2009, 01:10 AM
Contrats to Gordon for his first hit, but he also looks very over-matched and too jumpy at the dish. Hope someone can tell him to relax a bit up there.

He'll be fine. Just think, the worst pitchers in the MLB probably have better stuff than anyone he's ever faced before, and it's going to take some time to adjust. As long as he stays confident and keeps approaching each at bat as though he expects to come through, he'll put it together soon.

It's probably better for him to make those adjustments sooner than later, so he can start helping the team that much earlier. Based on his numbers in AA and AAA, it seems unlikely that there were more fundamental skills for him to master in the minor leagues, at least offensivley. The rest should come with experience.

ChiSoxGirl
06-10-2009, 01:10 AM
What beat the Sox tonight wasn't an umpire it was going 1-9 with runners in scoring position and only getting three runs off a pitcher who gave up five hits and five walks.

And on another note, will the Sox ever play at home in nice weather?

Lip

As I was sitting there freezing tonight, I was going through in my head the seven games I've seen the Sox play this season; six have been at home and one was down in Tampa. The only one I've watched where I wasn't freezing cold was the one in Tampa. PATHETIC. The temperature got as cold as 50 toward the end of the game. :shakehead: :puking:

Nellie_Fox
06-10-2009, 01:13 AM
As I was sitting there freezing tonight, I was going through in my head the seven games I've seen the Sox play this season; six have been at home and one was down in Tampa. The only one I've watched where I wasn't freezing cold was the one in Tampa. PATHETIC. The temperature got as cold as 50 toward the end of the game. :shakehead: :puking:I read an article that said that due to the jet stream, this may be a year without a summer in the upper midwest.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 01:13 AM
Whoopty do...

I'm biased about the Sox too, but not about the calls that affect the games. That's where I draw the line. Play fair. Play hard. Play to win. Don't give either side any special treatment.

Now ask me about how I feel about the kittens and whether I'd want a bunch of kitten fans trolling the site. That's a different issue...
But the call made by Joyce was the WRONG call. Replays were not even needed! It was clear that his hand touched the plate before being "tagged out."

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 01:17 AM
I read an article that said that due to the jet stream, this may be a year without a summer in the upper midwest.
Chicago is usually not mentioned in the meteorological "Upper Midwest." That would be the Dakotas, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan. Chicago is known in most meteorological circles as the "Lower Great Lakes" region. For the LGL, this is supposed to be an above normal summer once the 2nd half of the month comes around (as long as the El Nino wins this battle with La Nina soon).

Don't worry, ChiSoxGirl. There will be plenty of other Sox games you'll attend this season where you will be happy with the weather.

ChiSoxGirl
06-10-2009, 01:18 AM
I read an article that said that due to the jet stream, this may be a year without a summer in the upper midwest.

I think I might just die a little inside if that's the case. We suffered through an AWFUL winter and have been waiting and waiting for summer, and this crap is our reward for putting up with one of the worst winters in my memory? The jet stream can bite me! :mad:

guillensdisciple
06-10-2009, 01:23 AM
Meh, I am just going mute on this one.

What was the disputed call?

I am kind of happy I did not catch the game. I am really optimistic, and these games would kill a lot of my positivity.


Oh well, keep the chin up Sox and win tomorrow. There is a lot of baseball left, and I have not given up yet.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 01:26 AM
What was the disputed call?
With the bases loaded and 2 outs, Konerko laced a double a few feet to the right of the 3rd base line that went all the way to the wall. All 3 runners rounded 3rd, and the first 2 guys scored (BA and Pods). The 3rd runner (Wise) should have been called safe, as he clearly tagged home plate before Laird applied the tag; but, Jim Joyce (who motioned "safe" first then "out" a nanosecond later) screwed things out, and that was the 3rd out of the 9th. Our Sox were forced to play extras instead of celebrating a walk-off double by Paulie.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 01:27 AM
What beat the Sox tonight wasn't an umpire it was going 1-9 with runners in scoring position and only getting three runs off a pitcher who gave up five hits and five walks.

And on another note, will the Sox ever play at home in nice weather?

Lip
Others have mentioned the 5 hits and 5 walks as evidence that Willis had a bad game...

Let's break that down...

First inning: One walk allowed. It was to the leadoff hitter. It scored. No ball left the infield. Game WHIP 1.0

Second inning: With two out Beckham singled. Then the next batter was retired. WHIP = 1.0

Third inning: With two outs, Willis gives up a single and a walk, but neither scores. WHIP = 1.33

Fourth Inning: Sox go in order WHIP = 1.0

5th Inning: First two batters score on single and homer. Next two batters reach base. Dye hits a sharp grounder behind the second baseman who still manages to recover and turn two. Man on third, two outs. The next two batters walked and then Willis himself made an excellent defensive stop to get the final batter at first and end the threat. Willis was clearly tiring at this point in time. Final WHIP 2.0

Of the 10 baserunners Willis allowed, 5 occurred after there were two outs and 1 was erased on a nice double play.

Odds on scoring any man with two outs regardless of where that runner is on the basepaths drops significantly. I tried googling these stats but couldn't find them. Still, I'd be surprised if a man on third with two outs and the bases loaded has much more than a 35% chance of scoring. Willis only allowed that to happen once - while facing his final batter. For the most part he kept Sox scoring opportunities in check by forcing the Sox to get hits to score the runners by not allowing a lot of runners with less than two outs.

I'll say it again. To say Willis pitched poorly belies what actually happened. If you want to simply look at the stats and say, he sucked, so be it, but until the 5th he was as good as the Tigers would want. Then he minimized damage in the 5th when he tired. Some of that was due to excellent defense that inning.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 01:31 AM
But the call made by Joyce was the WRONG call. Replays were not even needed! It was clear that his hand touched the plate before being "tagged out."

Go watch the replays you say aren't necessary. That's simply not the case. I said it before in this thread, I'd love to be able to say Wise was safe, but it's just to close to tell even at super slow speeds...

SBSoxFan
06-10-2009, 01:43 AM
I'm surprised no one questioned sending Wise. True, it took 2 good throws to get him, but the LF'er got to the ball quickly. If Wise holds at third, Beckham is batting with the bases loaded and one out instead of runners on first and second and two outs.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 01:44 AM
Go watch the replays you say aren't necessary. That's simply not the case. I said it before in this thread, I'd love to be able to say Wise was safe, but it's just to close to tell even at super slow speeds...
I saw all of the replays when they were being shown on the telecast. They all supported Wise being safe.

guillensdisciple
06-10-2009, 01:44 AM
Damn, that was an awfully close play.

Rohan
06-10-2009, 01:51 AM
Damn, that was an awfully close play.

Where did you watch the replays?

StillMissOzzie
06-10-2009, 02:23 AM
With the bases loaded and 2 outs, Konerko laced a double a few feet to the right of the 3rd base line that went all the way to the wall. All 3 runners rounded 3rd, and the first 2 guys scored (BA and Pods). The 3rd runner (Wise) should have been called safe, as he clearly tagged home plate before Laird applied the tag; but, Jim Joyce (who motioned "safe" first then "out" a nanosecond later) screwed things out, and that was the 3rd out of the 9th. Our Sox were forced to play extras instead of celebrating a walk-off double by Paulie.

Nope, that was out #2. Then they intentionally walked AJ to pitch to Beckham, who flew out to send it into extras.

Man, that game was a real knee to the 'nads. We were at the game tonight, and I only saw one replay on SportsCenter when we got home. Too tough for me to call, but as my son pointed out, if Wise gets one more step of leadoff, then we'd be talking about the great comeback victory instead of another one that got away.
I thought Willis was god-awful tonight. Effectively wild, maybe, but wild none the less. A few good ABs like AJ's helped, but he was averaging around 20 pitches per inning or more for the first five. The first Sox run comes w/o benefit of a hit thanks to a walk and, eventually, a wild pitch. Typical Sox "offense", more crappy hitting with RISP.
Detroit tryed to give it away and the Sox still couldn't take it from them.

Glad I got to see Beckham's first MLB hit, but I'd have liked it a lot more if he had come through with his 2nd one in the bottom of the 9th.

SMO
:angry::whiner::gulp:

Whitesoxfan23
06-10-2009, 02:31 AM
By the way, Linebrink shouldn't pitch tie games. Ever.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 02:45 AM
Nope, that was out #2. Then they intentionally walked AJ to pitch to Beckham, who flew out to send it into extras.
Yea, that...I was so busy flipping between that and the NHL Network for post-game reaction to the Wings' wonderful loss...I got it right in my game report, which is the most important thing. The rest of the description is spot-on.

guillensdisciple
06-10-2009, 02:52 AM
Where did you watch the replays?
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/search/media.jsp?game_pk=245065

pilotsox
06-10-2009, 02:54 AM
The Sox didn't play a good game tonight. They did way too little against a wild and ineffective Willis, continually blowing big opportunities. Mark Buehrle didn't have it, and neither did Linebrink (who, like the previous poster said, should never pitch in tie-games). And even in our nearly epic rally, Jeff Cox made the wrong call to send Wise.

Anyhow, I hate to blame games on umps. I really do. And while I will freely admit that we screwed up today in a lot of ways, if Jim Joyce had made the correct call today, we would have been celebrating an epic comeback and walkoff. I truly believe he made the wrong call, and that's what hurts the most. Losing, I can to some extent accept. If Paulie just struck out and the game ended, ****ty, but whatever. But losing on an ump's judgment is the worst thing in the world to me. If Joyce didn't **** up, we win. That hurs.

And as a brief sidenote, I'm glad nowhere in all of this did Wise get scapegoated. I feared as soon as I saw that play that Wise would be getting tons of flack here, like usual (even if it didn't make sense), but I'm happy that didn't happen. That would have really killed me.

Whitesoxfan23
06-10-2009, 02:58 AM
This is the worst loss of the season in my opinion. I am still ****ing livid. We had that game in the 9th damnit.

It's Dankerific
06-10-2009, 02:59 AM
I just caught up on the game after work. Wow. BA hit a LAZER Beam outta the park. After seeing him hit the ball hard yesterday, I was hoping he was coming around.

That walk in the ninth was a good way to set the table too.

The Wise play in the ninth. It was close. I think he was safe, I saw more evidence he was safe and then evidence that was unclear. I saw no evidence he was out. Gotta tip your hat to that relay though, it needed to be perfect and it was.

pilotsox
06-10-2009, 03:02 AM
This is the worst loss of the season in my opinion. I am still ****ing livid. We had that game in the 9th damnit.

QFT

Several years ago, Joe Crede hit a homerun down the left field line in Camden Yards. It was a fairball, but third base ump Eric Cooper called it foul. I don't remember what year this was, or how the game ended, and I'm sure it didn't affect the regular season too much. But what I am sure of is that, at some point in this life or the next, I'm gonna track Cooper's fat ass down and make him my bitch.

If my point isn't crystal clear, I'm saying I'm not going to forget this one for a long, long time.

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 03:10 AM
I just caught up on the game after work. Wow. BA hit a LAZER Beam outta the park. After seeing him hit the ball hard yesterday, I was hoping he was coming around.
That one left the premises in a hurry! He was tonight's PTC, by the way. :D:

FOBA's rejoice!

It's Dankerific
06-10-2009, 03:37 AM
That one left the premises in a hurry! He was tonight's PTC, by the way. :D:

FOBA's rejoice!

I noticed. I wish it would have led to a win though. When I was watching and he tied it up right after getting behind, I thought it was a good sign.

whitesoxfan
06-10-2009, 03:38 AM
I knew that 5th inning was going to come back and bite us. JD's double play hurt a lot. If he can somehow reach in that inning, we score at least two that inning and we win the game with (somewhat) relative ease.

That being said, we still had this won stolen from us. I hardly ever fault the umps but that's one that Hawk should have been on from the start. I know the ump was just backing up from Pierzynski, but he put on the safe sign. That was the most ridiculous thing I've seen in quite some time.

This loss hurts, but if we win the final two in this series, we'd accomplish our goal of taking 3 of 5 and picking up ground from Detroit. It just sucks because we should have won the first three in this series. We'd be looking pretty solid if that were the case..

WhiteSox5187
06-10-2009, 03:53 AM
I knew that 5th inning was going to come back and bite us. JD's double play hurt a lot. If he can somehow reach in that inning, we score at least two that inning and we win the game with (somewhat) relative ease.

That being said, we still had this won stolen from us. I hardly ever fault the umps but that's one that Hawk should have been on from the start. I know the ump was just backing up from Pierzynski, but he put on the safe sign. That was the most ridiculous thing I've seen in quite some time.

This loss hurts, but if we win the final two in this series, we'd accomplish our goal of taking 3 of 5 and picking up ground from Detroit. It just sucks because we should have won the first three in this series. We'd be looking pretty solid if that were the case..

After the series we've had with Cleveland and Oakland, taking three out of five probably wasn't going to cut it. We needed more. And it's going to be awfully tough to do with Verlander and Jackson going out there soon. I can't recall a worse home stand.

ms620
06-10-2009, 06:58 AM
The game should not have been in the umps hands as Wise should not have been sent. YOu do not make the 2nd out at home like that. If there were 2 outs already, than I understand. No reason to force the action there when you already tied up the game.

palehozenychicty
06-10-2009, 07:35 AM
The game should not have been in the umps hands as Wise should not have been sent. YOu do not make the 2nd out at home like that. If there were 2 outs already, than I understand. No reason to force the action there when you already tied up the game.


Thank you. We really needed that game and still didn't cash it in. :(:

DrCrawdad
06-10-2009, 07:43 AM
Thank you. We really needed that game and still didn't cash it in. :(:

The Sox had a great chance to win too facing Dontrelle Willis and his HUGE ERA and all the Sox could muster was 3 runs off him, even though he walked 5 in 5IP.

Two more with Detroit with our young guns - Danks & Floyd. Of course the Sox also have to face Detroit's young guns who are having great seasons.

palehozenychicty
06-10-2009, 07:49 AM
The Sox had a great chance to win too facing Dontrelle Willis and his HUGE ERA and all the Sox could muster was 3 runs off him, even though he walked 5 in 5IP.

Two more with Detroit with our young guns - Danks & Floyd. Of course the Sox also have to face Detroit's young guns who are having great seasons.


That's the thing. How they couldn't get Dontrelle out of that game early was beyond me.

spawn
06-10-2009, 08:25 AM
Others have mentioned the 5 hits and 5 walks as evidence that Willis had a bad game...

Let's break that down...

First inning: One walk allowed. It was to the leadoff hitter. It scored. No ball left the infield. Game WHIP 1.0

Second inning: With two out Beckham singled. Then the next batter was retired. WHIP = 1.0

Third inning: With two outs, Willis gives up a single and a walk, but neither scores. WHIP = 1.33

Fourth Inning: Sox go in order WHIP = 1.0

5th Inning: First two batters score on single and homer. Next two batters reach base. Dye hits a sharp grounder behind the second baseman who still manages to recover and turn two. Man on third, two outs. The next two batters walked and then Willis himself made an excellent defensive stop to get the final batter at first and end the threat. Willis was clearly tiring at this point in time. Final WHIP 2.0

Of the 10 baserunners Willis allowed, 5 occurred after there were two outs and 1 was erased on a nice double play.

Odds on scoring any man with two outs regardless of where that runner is on the basepaths drops significantly. I tried googling these stats but couldn't find them. Still, I'd be surprised if a man on third with two outs and the bases loaded has much more than a 35% chance of scoring. Willis only allowed that to happen once - while facing his final batter. For the most part he kept Sox scoring opportunities in check by forcing the Sox to get hits to score the runners by not allowing a lot of runners with less than two outs.

I'll say it again. To say Willis pitched poorly belies what actually happened. If you want to simply look at the stats and say, he sucked, so be it, but until the 5th he was as good as the Tigers would want. Then he minimized damage in the 5th when he tired. Some of that was due to excellent defense that inning.
Good post. Willis did not pitch that badly. if he were on the Sox, everyone here would be saying how great it was he "battled", which he did. Most here don't want to tip their caps to him. I will.

People want to bitch about the offense. The Sox scored 6 runs. Why isn't anyone bitching about Buehrle? He walks Inge leading off the 6th and he comes around to score. He walks the first two batters in the 7th, and they both come around to score. Let's not leave him out as partly to blame for this loss.

RedHeadPaleHoser
06-10-2009, 08:35 AM
Meh, I am just going mute on this one.

What was the disputed call?

I am kind of happy I did not catch the game. I am really optimistic, and these games would kill a lot of my positivity.


Oh well, keep the chin up Sox and win tomorrow. There is a lot of baseball left, and I have not given up yet.

I tried to see the clip on the MLB app on my iPhone (was at the movies), but it didn't load. I think I'm better off not seeing it.

I want them to win the next two - to try and salvage something from this homestand. I've not given up either.....

palehozenychicty
06-10-2009, 08:47 AM
Good post. Willis did not pitch that badly. if he were on the Sox, everyone here would be saying how great it was he "battled", which he did. Most here don't want to tip their caps to him. I will.

People want to bitch about the offense. The Sox scored 6 runs. Why isn't anyone bitching about Buehrle? He walks Inge leading off the 6th and he comes around to score. He walks the first two batters in the 7th, and they both come around to score. Let's not leave him out as partly to blame for this loss.


Burls didn't throw the ball well, but he's been consistently good, so people are giving him a pass. That's just the way it goes. They have to move on and play today, so I will move on too.

guillensdisciple
06-10-2009, 09:14 AM
Burls didn't throw the ball well, but he's been consistently good, so people are giving him a pass. That's just the way it goes. They have to move on and play today, so I will move on too.

It's just weird how nothing ever lines up for the Sox (sans once every blue moon). Instead, there are games like this where our strengths let us down.

This team needs to play consistent baseball, and there has to be a point where they gel. It has not seemed like they have to do so yet, but there is time remaining for this team to come together.

Go White Sox!!!

pilotsox
06-10-2009, 09:22 AM
The following morning...

...this one is still a bitch to think about.

spawn
06-10-2009, 09:24 AM
Burls didn't throw the ball well, but he's been consistently good, so people are giving him a pass.
I'm not saying he should be ripped, but he does get a share of the blame for that game last night. Everything else, from the offense to the bullpen is being blamed for the loss here. He should too.

downstairs
06-10-2009, 09:29 AM
I didn't watch, was out for the night. What's with Wise getting nailed on trying to go from first to third on a double? I thought the whole point of a speedy pinch runner is that they're supposed to SCORE from first on a double, not barely miss THIRD?!

doublem23
06-10-2009, 09:30 AM
I didn't watch, was out for the night. What's with Wise getting nailed on trying to go from first to third on a double? I thought the whole point of a speedy pinch runner is that they're supposed to SCORE from first on a double, not barely miss THIRD?!

He got thrown out at the plate*, and it was only possible because the Tigers executed a perfect relay.

* May not have actually been thrown out.

pilotsox
06-10-2009, 09:31 AM
I didn't watch, was out for the night. What's with Wise getting nailed on trying to go from first to third on a double? I thought the whole point of a speedy pinch runner is that they're supposed to SCORE from first on a double, not barely miss THIRD?!

He was called out at home (note, I say called out and not thrown out), not third. Stop trying to blame DeWayne.

pilotsox
06-10-2009, 09:36 AM
I watched Paulie's double again. I don't know why I'm tormenting myself by doing this, but I noticed that if his ball bounced maybe three or four extra inches to the left, it would have a hit a weird nook in the wall next to an access gate, taken a different ricochet, the stars would not have aligned bloody perfectly for the Tiggers, and we would have won.

This doesn't help us. In fact, the more I taunt myself with just how ****ing close we were, the more I feel like ****. This just shows how chance the whole thing is, because if Raburn had to run even an extra foot, the Sox win. Baseball really is a game of inches.

spawn
06-10-2009, 09:45 AM
I didn't watch, was out for the night. What's with Wise getting nailed on trying to go from first to third on a double? I thought the whole point of a speedy pinch runner is that they're supposed to SCORE from first on a double, not barely miss THIRD?!
Maybe you should watch the play so you'll know what you're talking about. He was thrown out at home.

Oblong
06-10-2009, 09:53 AM
The ironic thing is if Wise didn't pinch run for Thome then maybe Thome's at third with one out.

russ99
06-10-2009, 09:54 AM
I watched Paulie's double again. I don't know why I'm tormenting myself by doing this, but I noticed that if his ball bounced maybe three or four extra inches to the left, it would have a hit a weird nook in the wall next to an access gate, taken a different ricochet, the stars would not have aligned bloody perfectly for the Tiggers, and we would have one.

This doesn't help us. In fact, the more I taunt myself with just how ****ing close we were, the more I feel like ****. This just shows how chance the whole thing is, because if Raburn had to run even an extra foot, the Sox win. Baseball really is a game of inches.

That's one way to look at it. Another is that we had Willis on the hook with men in scoring position many, many times and didn't score except for Pods coming in by wild pitch in the first. And it's not the bottom of the order that failed at this repeatedly, it's the heart of the order. That's why we lost. The other reasons look better, but that's to make us feel better about how 3-4-5-6 can't execute with men in scoring position of late.

Semi-blown call at the plate aside, we were lucky to even get this tied in the 9th. Rodney totally melted down.

SoxGirl4Life
06-10-2009, 09:54 AM
The ironic thing is if Wise didn't pinch run for Thome then maybe Thome's at third with one out.


Ironic, and still it was the right move to pinch run for him. Close call at the plate and it didn't go our way. Or it did, if you're a Tigers fan! :wink:

palehozenychicty
06-10-2009, 10:00 AM
The ironic thing is if Wise didn't pinch run for Thome then maybe Thome's at third with one out.


I had to laugh at this cause it's so true. :D: It's a debate if he gets to third in one peace.

Jerko
06-10-2009, 10:01 AM
In the past 2 losses, the Sox have scored in 6 different innings. Tigers scored in their next at bat 5 of those 6 times. Offense sucks, yes, but it would be nice for a pitcher to sack up and put a goose egg up there once in a while as well.

Oblong
06-10-2009, 10:08 AM
Ironic, and still it was the right move to pinch run for him. Close call at the plate and it didn't go our way. Or it did, if you're a Tigers fan! :wink:

For sure. When you get called out on a play that requires 2 absolutely perfect relay throws, and a perfect catch and tag, then all you can do is tip your cap. What's Wise supposed to do? Run faster? I was watching the game with my wife, fuming, and as soon as I saw Konerko's ball land fair I said "Ballgame".

For the record the Tigers need at least a 4 run lead in the ninth at The Cell before I think we'll win. That place spooks me more than the Metrodome I think.

doublem23
06-10-2009, 10:10 AM
For sure. When you get called out on a play that requires 2 absolutely perfect relay throws, and a perfect catch and tag, then all you can do is tip your cap. What's Wise supposed to do? Run faster? I was watching the game with my wife, fuming, and as soon as I saw Konerko's ball land fair I said "Ballgame".


Obviously you don't spend enough time around here. :cool:

Jim Shorts
06-10-2009, 10:12 AM
In the past 2 losses, the Sox have scored in 6 different innings. Tigers scored in their next at bat 5 of those 6 times. Offense sucks, yes, but it would be nice for a pitcher to sack up and put a goose egg up there once in a while as well.

That's a great point.

It's been a while since we've held a lead. Lately it seems like everytime we score, we give it back in the next half of the inning.

So frustrating.

kevingrt
06-10-2009, 10:12 AM
The following morning...

...this one is still a bitch to think about.

Understatement.

FloridaTigers
06-10-2009, 10:30 AM
Its weird how this one went the Tigers way. Like Oblong says, the Cell is up there with the Metrodome in Tiger Killing ballparks. You can't blame the ump, blame the third base coach. The game was already tied up. With runners in scoring position and one out, all that was necessary was a sac fly.

WhiteSoxFTW
06-10-2009, 10:30 AM
I wonder the same thing... Ozzie seemed very casual after the game as well. He said it was "too close of a call for him to argue." I don't understand the logic at all.

At first I thought that he should have been out there, but then I looked at the score, saw Konerko on 2nd base w/ AJ coming up, and I thought that it was still our game to win...and I didn't want Ozzie coming out, going nuts, and pissing Joyce off.

We lose the game where we have our "ACE" going and they have the worst pitcher in the AL going.

I don't think Willis is the worst pitcher in the AL at all. He still has pretty decent stuff. I know he is all over the place, but the pitch on the Thome strikeout pretty early on was nasty. I kept thinking to myself, "what the hell is this guy doing?" He was so jittery. It looked like he was super-wired. The ump even came out and talked to him. I kept wondering if he was on more drugs than just the tobacco in his mouth.

FloridaTigers
06-10-2009, 10:33 AM
I don't think Willis is the worst pitcher in the AL at all. He still has pretty decent stuff. I know he is all over the place, but the pitch on the Thome strikeout pretty early on was nasty. I kept thinking to myself, "what the hell is this guy doing?" He was so jittery. It looked like he was super-wired. The ump even came out and talked to him. I kept wondering if he was on more drugs than just the tobacco in his mouth.

Thats how is every start. He talks to himself, but not in a cool Mark Fidrych way, but in a weird-nervous way.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 11:20 AM
Good post. Willis did not pitch that badly. if he were on the Sox, everyone here would be saying how great it was he "battled", which he did. Most here don't want to tip their caps to him. I will.

People want to bitch about the offense. The Sox scored 6 runs. Why isn't anyone bitching about Buehrle? He walks Inge leading off the 6th and he comes around to score. He walks the first two batters in the 7th, and they both come around to score. Let's not leave him out as partly to blame for this loss.



The Sox score 6 runs and the Tigers walked 12 batters. We were 1 for 9 with RISP. Half our runs were scored after 5 walks in the 9th inning by bad Tiger relief.

I will continue to bitch about this offense with performances like this one.

voodoochile
06-10-2009, 11:24 AM
The Sox score 6 runs and the Tigers walked 12 batters. We were 1 for 9 with RISP. Half our runs were scored after 5 walks in the 9th inning by bad Tiger relief.

I will continue to bitch about this offense with performances like this one.

Just to be picky, the 4th walk actually led to one of those runs and the 5th came after the 3 had scored. It was intentional to AJ.

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 11:30 AM
Just to be picky, the 4th walk actually led to one of those runs and the 5th came after the 3 had scored. It was intentional to AJ.

That's fine.

And getting back to Spawn's post, Sox pitching does not get a pass from me either. I agree with him on that. Buehrle did not step up last night as the ACE he is. The bullpen had a meltdown with both Dotel and Linebrink. Can't fault those 3 guys because they have been solid for us all year.

Rohan
06-10-2009, 01:13 PM
I know I need to get over what happened last night and continue on with the season. But it's so hard when this team has struggled so much and what looked to be such a beautiful play and turn around went for naught.

I've watched the play over and over again. There's one picture frame that haunts me more than anything.

http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/6946/picture2h.png

First, notice that the umps arms are already out by his sides. Meaning for him to call Wise safe he would have to bring his arms in a cross infront of his chest and then bring them back out (which he did)

Second, notice the dark under the catcher's mit. If he had the mit on Wise, there would be no shadow. But there is, which shows there is still distance between the mit and Wise's back.

I could have taken a picture that has Wise's hand just barely reaching the plate, but really it would have shown the exact same thing. It was a close play. But Dewayne Wise WAS safe. I wish replay could have been used. Because this would have been a White Sox winner.

PhillipsBubba
06-10-2009, 01:13 PM
Teams like the White Sox with so many weaknesses find a way to lose.

You keep hoping for a glimmer of light until you wake up one day in October and they've lost 90 games.:(:

doublem23
06-10-2009, 01:22 PM
First, notice that the umps arms are already out by his sides. Meaning for him to call Wise safe he would have to bring his arms in a cross infront of his chest and then bring them back out (which he did)

Second, notice the dark under the catcher's mit. If he had the mit on Wise, there would be no shadow. But there is, which shows there is still distance between the mit and Wise's back.

I could have taken a picture that has Wise's hand just barely reaching the plate, but really it would have shown the exact same thing. It was a close play. But Dewayne Wise WAS safe. I wish replay could have been used. Because this would have been a White Sox winner.

That's not a high quality photo at all, that "shadow" could very well be the dark number on his back.

I know we all want to believe Wise was safe and we were jobbed, but every angle I've seen that play from is still uncertain, that was a close of a play at the plate as I can remember in a long time. I don't think anyone can definitively say Wise was definitely safe or definitely out. Oh well. You just have to tip your hat, the Tigers were perfect, both the throw to the cut-off man and the relay home were absolutely perfect, that doesn't happen that often. That's just been our luck, as soon as things start to look good, something bad happens. What can you do? Baseball is a cruel, cruel game sometimes.

We had plenty of opprotunities to win that game long before Dewayne rounded third, so whenever you put your fate in the hands of an umpire, you just have to live with the result. It would have been a great win, though. A great win.

hawkjt
06-10-2009, 01:35 PM
Dotel pissed me off by walking Granderson to get to sox-killer polanco.
As hawk said, polanco is the last guy I want up in that situation...anybody but polanco...but nooooo...Dotel had to outsmart himself by pitching around the ice-cold granderson.

areilly
06-10-2009, 01:42 PM
I've watched the play over and over again. There's one picture frame that haunts me more than anything.

You'll notice his arms go back, and to the left.

Back. And to the left.

ike from nj
06-10-2009, 01:47 PM
The Sox had a great chance to win too facing Dontrelle Willis and his HUGE ERA and all the Sox could muster was 3 runs off him, even though he walked 5 in 5IP.

Two more with Detroit with our young guns - Danks & Floyd. Of course the Sox also have to face Detroit's young guns who are having great seasons.

maybe tonight somebody other than aj will come up with the bases loaded.

Jim Shorts
06-10-2009, 01:53 PM
maybe tonight somebody other than aj will come up with the bases loaded.

You can pick anyone of the many games we've had basesloaded already this season. AJ is far from being the only guilty party.

That, and I think you need to look at AJ's numbers with the bases loaded. Because your post seems to be nothing more than sour grapes.

Rohan
06-10-2009, 02:09 PM
maybe tonight somebody other than aj will come up with the bases loaded.

Most Sox fans LOVE Aj...
You seem to be the exception.

ode to veeck
06-10-2009, 02:28 PM
Comcast question:

Which team worries you most in the ALC? a.Twins, b.Tigers, c.Indians, or d. Royals.

I wanna pick E. White Sox!

the umps are the only thing that can stop us

chisoxfanatic
06-10-2009, 02:51 PM
the umps are the only thing that can stop us
We should request to have Doug Eddings call every one of our games.

Foulke You
06-10-2009, 03:28 PM
QFT

Several years ago, Joe Crede hit a homerun down the left field line in Camden Yards. It was a fairball, but third base ump Eric Cooper called it foul. I don't remember what year this was, or how the game ended, and I'm sure it didn't affect the regular season too much. But what I am sure of is that, at some point in this life or the next, I'm gonna track Cooper's fat ass down and make him my bitch.

If my point isn't crystal clear, I'm saying I'm not going to forget this one for a long, long time.
I remember that game as well very clearly. It is the single worst ump call I think I've ever seen in all my years watching baseball. That ball Crede hit was fair by about 5 feet and he called it foul. If there were ever any question that HR replay is needed on some plays, I would submit that Crede play from 2004 as exhibit A.

As far as the Wise play, after watching the replay, I noticed that the ump was directly watching the catcher's mitt's tag and not Wise's hand touching the plate. I think if he had been looking more towards the plate, he would have called him safe. It was a close play but I think that Wise got his hand in there by a quarter of a second. When you are going bad, calls like this tend to always go against you.:(:

Foulke You
06-10-2009, 03:35 PM
Its weird how this one went the Tigers way. Like Oblong says, the Cell is up there with the Metrodome in Tiger Killing ballparks. You can't blame the ump, blame the third base coach. The game was already tied up. With runners in scoring position and one out, all that was necessary was a sac fly.
We've lost our winning mojo at The Cell this year. Even in down years, we can usually count on the Sox playing well at home but this year, the South Side of Chicago has not been friendly to us. We have batted at least a full 50 points lower at home than on the road. I can't explain it. I'm sure Ozzie can't either. This is one of the most wildly inconsistent and tough to figure out White Sox teams I've seen.

MarkZ35
06-10-2009, 03:37 PM
I really hope they win tonight because I'm still sick to my stomach about last night. If it isn't a perfect relay Wise is safe. If we can somehow win the next two I will feel much better because we could have easily have won the first three games of this sries.

MarkZ35
06-10-2009, 03:39 PM
We've lost our winning mojo at The Cell this year. Even in down years, we can usually count on the Sox playing well at home but this year, the South Side of Chicago has not been friendly to us. We have batted at least a full 50 points lower at home than on the road. I can't explain it. I'm sure Ozzie can't either. This is one of the most wildly inconsistent and tough to figure out White Sox teams I've seen.
It could be just me but it looks like the Sox swing more for the fences a lot at home than on the road.

jdm2662
06-10-2009, 04:50 PM
Jesus Christ, the whinning about Wise being called out is really annoying. Which is why another reason why I hate Hawk as the announcer. NO ONE here can convince me you thought he was 100% safe in real time. In real time, I thought he was out by a pretty good margin. With different angles and super slow replay, it appeared he was safe. Even if he was safe, it wasn't by much. Maybe if the Sox actually play good baseball, it wouldn't had come down to a miracle ninth inning comeback. This is the White Sox fault, period, end of conversation.

Whinning about one play is rather embarassing. If Wise was on the Tigers and he was called safe, guess what, most of you would still want the umps head.

ode to veeck
06-10-2009, 04:54 PM
Jesus Christ, the whinning about Wise being called out is really annoying. Which is why another reason why I hate Hawk as the announcer. NO ONE here can convince me you thought he was 100% safe in real time. In real time, I thought he was out by a pretty good margin. With different angles and super slow replay, it appeared he was safe. Even if he was safe, it wasn't by much. Maybe if the Sox actually play good baseball, it wouldn't had come down to a miracle ninth inning comeback. This is the White Sox fault, period, end of conversation.

Whinning about one play is rather embarassing. If Wise was on the Tigers and he was called safe, guess what, most of you would still want the umps head.

Hawk whining is only one of the many many reasons, I have never taken to him as the featured TV announcer

LoveYourSuit
06-10-2009, 06:17 PM
Jesus Christ, the whinning about Wise being called out is really annoying. Which is why another reason why I hate Hawk as the announcer. NO ONE here can convince me you thought he was 100% safe in real time. In real time, I thought he was out by a pretty good margin. With different angles and super slow replay, it appeared he was safe. Even if he was safe, it wasn't by much. Maybe if the Sox actually play good baseball, it wouldn't had come down to a miracle ninth inning comeback. This is the White Sox fault, period, end of conversation.

Whinning about one play is rather embarassing. If Wise was on the Tigers and he was called safe, guess what, most of you would still want the umps head.

That's my brown's chicken caller of the show.

Well said.

Rohan
06-10-2009, 08:03 PM
Jesus Christ, the whinning about Wise being called out is really annoying. Which is why another reason why I hate Hawk as the announcer. NO ONE here can convince me you thought he was 100% safe in real time. In real time, I thought he was out by a pretty good margin. With different angles and super slow replay, it appeared he was safe. Even if he was safe, it wasn't by much. Maybe if the Sox actually play good baseball, it wouldn't had come down to a miracle ninth inning comeback. This is the White Sox fault, period, end of conversation.

Whinning about one play is rather embarassing. If Wise was on the Tigers and he was called safe, guess what, most of you would still want the umps head.

I didn't say that the White Sox didn't play poorley. That's not what I was pointing out. Yes it was a close call. And yeah, it's in the past. The poor baseball was the White Sox fault. That play WAS NOT. Therefore, there is a reason to point it out.

I'm not going to dwell on it. But it is worth mentioning. It happened less then 24 hours ago. It's certainly worth analyzing without people chastizing anyone who talks about it and accusing them of whining.

And I speak for myself when I say that if Wise had been called safe, and and he actually was not, I would not be shy in saying that he was out and that the Sox did not deserve the win. In your scenario, if he was on the Tigers (strange) and he was called safe in the same situation, I would still say, you know what that's just how it is.

Baseball's rulings are not completely objective. If they were then there would be instant replay for everything. But that's just part of the game.

I wish the chips had fallen differently but they didn't. Doesn't mean we can't talk about it, and our talking does not fall into the category of whining.

Brian26
06-10-2009, 08:09 PM
Jesus Christ, the whinning about Wise being called out is really annoying. Which is why another reason why I hate Hawk as the announcer. NO ONE here can convince me you thought he was 100% safe in real time. In real time, I thought he was out by a pretty good margin. With different angles and super slow replay, it appeared he was safe. Even if he was safe, it wasn't by much. Maybe if the Sox actually play good baseball, it wouldn't had come down to a miracle ninth inning comeback. This is the White Sox fault, period, end of conversation.

Whinning about one play is rather embarassing. If Wise was on the Tigers and he was called safe, guess what, most of you would still want the umps head.

I don't mind Hawk so much whining about a big call like that which truly does change the outcome of a game. He's a fan and he's just wearing it on his sleeve for the people at home.

What annoys me is his whining about a close 1-1 pitch with one out in the 4th inning with a man on second.

:hawk
"I'll tell you what Stonepony, that's a big big pitch right there with a 1-1 count. That changes the whollllllle complexion of the at-bat for BA and for Josh Fields on deck. Big big difference between 2-1 and 1-2."

TDog
06-10-2009, 08:34 PM
... Baseball's rulings are not completely objective. If they were then there would be instant replay for everything. But that's just part of the game. ...

No sport's rulings are completely objective. Sports that sanction players and teams for fouls are far less objective than baseball.

As for instant replay, it would be ridiculous to use it for everything. It borders on the ridiculous to use it for anything. But no sport uses instant replay for everything, although some sports have more extensive use of instant replay so they can falsely hold their games up as being fairly officiated.

Dan H
06-10-2009, 08:57 PM
Jesus Christ, the whinning about Wise being called out is really annoying. Which is why another reason why I hate Hawk as the announcer. NO ONE here can convince me you thought he was 100% safe in real time. In real time, I thought he was out by a pretty good margin. With different angles and super slow replay, it appeared he was safe. Even if he was safe, it wasn't by much. Maybe if the Sox actually play good baseball, it wouldn't had come down to a miracle ninth inning comeback. This is the White Sox fault, period, end of conversation.

Whinning about one play is rather embarassing. If Wise was on the Tigers and he was called safe, guess what, most of you would still want the umps head.

I agree with all of this. Close calls can go either way. And Hawk whines way too much about the umpires. It is easy to call a game with slow motion replays. Hawk is getting worse with age. And why do we have to hear every game that Stoney won the Cy Young Award in 1980? He did? He really did?