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doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:11 PM
That sucked.

october23sp
06-08-2009, 04:11 PM
That sucked.

Truer words have never been spoken.

TheAnswer32
06-08-2009, 04:11 PM
This team and their manager...just awful

jabrch
06-08-2009, 04:11 PM
Can't blame the O. We were 9 for 33 with 5 walks.

The D stunk.

kittle42
06-08-2009, 04:11 PM
They played to their abilities.

MushMouth
06-08-2009, 04:11 PM
My goal for game 2: Not care about the sox level of play, and keep my son up til the 7th, because he wants to sing Take Me Out To the Ballgame. Oh, and Umphreys is playing before the game, that'll be fun too.

ms620
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
Tigers execute...sox dont...thats the story. Offensively, defensively....Sox just have too many below average players.

spawn
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
That sucked.
Pretty much.

Soxman219
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
**** Fields

Rikirk
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
Did someone on the team step on a black cat or something..?


:mad:

Konerko05
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
I knew Fields would boot that ball the second I saw it hit to him. Just awful. Please, no more.

Carrasco continues to be the unsung hero of this team.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
Truer words have never been spoken.

Really, what do you expect? This team is just very incomplete, Fields and Wise are not MLB caliber players, Getz is a borderline everyday player with some upside, and Richard is just not much of a starter.

Whatever. :shrug:

ms620
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
Can't blame the O. We were 9 for 33 with 5 walks.

The D stunk.

Can't blame the O??? Since when is baseball about getting hits and walks? It is about scoring runs. I do not understand why people fail to realize this. The O was sub par as usual today.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:12 PM
Having second thoughts about going to Milwaukee.


This team sucks :angry:

MarkZ35
06-08-2009, 04:13 PM
I don't think the Tigers are a better team but they are exxecuting and taking advantage of opportuities much better than the Sox lately.

Woofer
06-08-2009, 04:13 PM
Part of the blame for this loss goes to the pitching. Every time we scored, they scored in their next at bat. They kept us in the game, but this one hurts more than our usual blowout.

DSpivack
06-08-2009, 04:13 PM
Can't blame the O. We were 9 for 33 with 5 walks.

The D stunk.

And if I watch this team too much I will... OD?

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:13 PM
Can't blame the O. We were 9 for 33 with 5 walks.

The D stunk.

14 baserunners = 4 runs, and that's OK?

This game should never have been close enough the defense would be put in a position to make a critical error.

pilotsox
06-08-2009, 04:13 PM
Josh Fields is on my permanent ****list. I know it won't happen, but I will **** pure Swiss chocolate if this douchebag never sullies the Black & White with his presence ever again.

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 04:14 PM
:whiner: :whiner: :whiner: :whiner: :whiner:

MarkZ35
06-08-2009, 04:14 PM
Having second thoughts about going to Milwaukee.


This team sucks :angry:
I was just thinking the same thing. I already have tickets for all 3 but if we get swept this series they'll be on stubhub.

Woofer
06-08-2009, 04:14 PM
And if I watch this team too much I will... OD?

If it happens, it won't be pretty.

hi im skot
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
u7tsb9EFZIc

I don't even want to go to the game tonight.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
Really, what do you expect? This team is just very incomplete, Fields and Wise are not MLB caliber players, Getz is a borderline everyday player with some upside, and Richard is just not much of a starter.

Whatever. :shrug:


This first phase of "young" players have suckage all over them (Anderson, Getz, Fields, Broadway, etc).

Let's hope the next wave (Viciedo, Beckham, Flowers, Allen, Danks, Poreda) sure don't dissapoint like this.

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
I don't think the Tigers are a better team but they are exxecuting and taking advantage of opportuities much better than the Sox lately.

That's what it comes down to. The Sox simply aren't getting it done when they have to.

pilotsox
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
I knew Fields would boot that ball the second I saw it hit to him. Just awful. Please, no more.

Carrasco continues to be the unsung hero of this team.

I had a bad feeling as soon as I saw that ball hit to Fields too. I hate Fields so much at the moment.

RedHeadPaleHoser
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
Grr. Not much more I can say nor does it matter.

Let's hope game 2 is much better than this.

WhiteSox5187
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
This team is in constant danger of just phoning the rest of the season in. A pathetic effort the past two days by a pathetic team. If we lose this series, we may as well start trading guys for prospects. This team isn't going anywhere.

DirtySox
06-08-2009, 04:15 PM
So I had class during the majority of the game, but left the TV on for the dog. Upon returning home I walked in to see a Tiger run cross the plate to break a tie, and a rather large pool of yellow dog puke in front of the TV. I'm going to assume the vomit was warranted.

SoxGirl4Life
06-08-2009, 04:16 PM
sigh. It look so promising for a few minutes there after paulie tied it up.

hi im skot
06-08-2009, 04:16 PM
Josh Fields is on my permanent ****list. I know it won't happen, but I will **** pure Swiss chocolate if this douchebag never sullies the Black & White with his presence ever again.

:putitontheboard

SoxGirl4Life
06-08-2009, 04:16 PM
So I had class during the majority of the game, but left the TV on for the dog. Upon returning home I walked in to see a Tiger run cross the plate to break a tie, and a rather large pool of yellow dog puke in front of the TV. I'm going to assume the vomit was warranted.

I leave the tv on for my dog too. And yes, you would have done the same had you been watching, I'm sure.

hi im skot
06-08-2009, 04:17 PM
so i had class during the majority of the game, but left the tv on for the dog. Upon returning home i walked in to see a tiger run cross the plate to break a tie, and a rather large pool of yellow dog puke in front of the tv. I'm going to assume the vomit was warranted.

potw.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:17 PM
sigh. It look so promising for a few minutes there after paulie tied it up.


That road trip was so promising to me for the outlook of the rest of the season.

This ends up feeling like a bad prom date.

DSpivack
06-08-2009, 04:17 PM
So I had class during the majority of the game, but left the TV on for the dog. Upon returning home I walked in to see a Tiger run cross the plate to break a tie, and a rather large pool of yellow dog puke in front of the TV. I'm going to assume the vomit was warranted.

Smart dog.

KempersRS
06-08-2009, 04:17 PM
I'm definitely not the kind of person who puts a whole lot of stock in one game out of 162, but I think that game is a pretty representation of what this team is.

You know the old saying, everybody wins 60 and loses 60, its what you do with the other 40. That was one of those 40 that was up in the air.

Bad defense, some glaring holes weighing the lineup down, and just poor fundamentals.

Oh and Josh Fields is not a major league caliber player. Not even close.

SoxFan1979
06-08-2009, 04:17 PM
All I hve to say is........ seriously? :scratch:

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:18 PM
This first phase of "young" players have suckage all over them (Anderson, Getz, Fields, Broadway, etc).

Let's hope the next wave (Viciedo, Beckham, Flowers, Allen, Danks, Poreda) sure don't dissapoint like this.

Pretty much. I have high hopes for Beckham and Little Danks, Viciedo, Flowers, and Allen may or may not pan out, it'd be nice if one became an everyday player.

I'm just looking at that $40 million or so coming off the books after this year and thinking that the Sox just need to make a few moves and plug a few holes and this team is right back in the mix of things (IMO). Unfortunately, it looks like we're stuck with this garbagefest for the rest of the season. Oh well, **** happens, just enjoy the ride because Novemeber will be here soon enough and we'll all be waiting impatiently for baseball to come back.

DSpivack
06-08-2009, 04:18 PM
I'm definitely not the kind of person who puts a whole lot of stock in one game out of 162, but I think that game is a pretty representation of what this team is.

You know the old saying, everybody wins 60 and loses 60, its what you do with the other 40. That was one of those 40 that was up in the air.

Bad defense, some glaring holes weighing the lineup down, and just poor fundamentals.

Unless you are the Nats!

PhillipsBubba
06-08-2009, 04:18 PM
Too bad...the loyal Sox fans around here deserve better...:(:

When do the Bears go to camp???:?:

http://www.essex1.com/people/jmiller/images/butkus.gif

SoxGirl4Life
06-08-2009, 04:18 PM
That road trip was so promising to me for the outlook of the rest of the season.

This ends up feeling like a bad prom date.

A bad date that just replays itself every day. You know, that awkward moment when you just know you'd rather go to the dentist than finish dinner with this person.

billyvsox
06-08-2009, 04:19 PM
Really sucked, everytime we did something right, we turned right around and did two things wrong. Plus no one seems to care!! Someone needs to go ballistic and IMO it should be Carrasco or Thornton or someone who has been consistantly good.

We have a growing list of guys who should NOT be on major league roster.
Fields, Getz, Wise, Anderson, Nix, Lillibridge (oh yeah..he's gone). Guess we do miss OC. Crede, Uribe, Swisher after all.

Huisj
06-08-2009, 04:20 PM
Someone wondered in the game thread if anyone's ever been swept in a 5 game series at home. I believe the Yankees did that at Boston in '06.

Patrick134
06-08-2009, 04:20 PM
Fields is in for his bat, which has stunk, so why is he even here? Even in his breakout 20 homer partial season, he hit .244 and struck out 1 of every 3 at bats.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:20 PM
a bad date that just replays itself every day. You know, that awkward moment when you just know you'd rather go to the dentist than finish dinner with this person.


lol

october23sp
06-08-2009, 04:21 PM
This wouldn't suck so much if we hadn't gotten to 25-25. I knew we sucked and then we hit that and then for some reason I started to think we were capable of winning a bad division, but no, I was right the first time, WE suck.:whiner::whiner::angry::angry:

pilotsox
06-08-2009, 04:22 PM
Guess we do miss OC. Crede, Uribe, Swisher after all.

Ouch.

WhiteSox5187
06-08-2009, 04:23 PM
Fields is in for his bat, which has stunk, so why is he even here? Even in his breakout 20 homer partial season, he hit .244 and struck out 1 of every 3 at bats.

That's a good question. But I think the Josh Fields experiment has failed.

guillensdisciple
06-08-2009, 04:24 PM
Well, if the Sox don't win this series, there will be a serious up hill climb for a long time. Both mentally and in the division standings. This team needs a swift kick in the rear, but hey, all we can do is keep on cheering them on.


Here is to winning the rest of the series!

TDog
06-08-2009, 04:24 PM
Tigers execute...sox dont...thats the story. Offensively, defensively....Sox just have too many below average players.

The Tigers didn't execute. The Tigers would have scored eight runs against Richard if they had executed. Beginning with a doubleplay with two on to end the first, the Tigers squandered opportunities. The Tigers had three times the opportunities as the Sox and only scored one more run.

Again, the starting pitching was a concern for the Sox. On a day when you have to play a day game and a night game, Richard didn't last long enough.

With the weather warming up, the Sox got two home runs, both tying the game. They scored a first inning run hitting only one ball out of the infield.

I don't think Beckham should have been called up, but he's obviously on this team because there isn't a legitimate third baseman preceding him on the roster. I don't know if he would have driven in Getz or he would have fielded the ball in the ninth, but it's clear that Fields is only acceptable in comparison to Betemit.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:24 PM
Pretty much. I have high hopes for Beckham and Little Danks, Viciedo, Flowers, and Allen may or may not pan out, it'd be nice if one became an everyday player.

I'm just looking at that $40 million or so coming off the books after this year and thinking that the Sox just need to make a few moves and plug a few holes and this team is right back in the mix of things (IMO). Unfortunately, it looks like we're stuck with this garbagefest for the rest of the season. Oh well, **** happens, just enjoy the ride because Novemeber will be here soon enough and we'll all be waiting impatiently for baseball to come back.


I know I get ripped for looking into the chairman's books, but those $40 million more than likely have to get re-invested within the same young players we already have : Jenks, Danks, Quentin.

I would assume you can't let both Thome and Dye walk away at once either. Dye more than likely gets re-signed.

veeter
06-08-2009, 04:24 PM
This team is very weird. Winning isn't even in their vocabulary. I just wish they'd left Beckham in AA, so that team could win a championship. They still might, but he won't be a part of it. Not a good team for him to cut his teeth with.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:24 PM
Guess we do miss OC. Crede, Uribe, Swisher after all.

Cabrera is hitting .236. Swisher is hitting .250. Crede is hitting .237. Uribe is the only one doing anything, he's hitting .306 for the Giants, but he's only recently been getting regular playing time.

Whatever, the Sox did what they had to do, they're in the 2-3 year process of turning over their roster and they had to kick the tires on Fields, Getz, etc. to see if they can be everyday players in the Majors or if they're just crap.

Let's not pretend like OC, Swisher, and Crede would be leading us back to the play-offs. They've been collectively as terrible as the guys who have replaced them.

billyvsox
06-08-2009, 04:25 PM
Lineup for game 2?:

C) Flowers
1b) Allen
2b) Alexi
SS) Beckham
3b) Viciedo
LF) Danks
CF) Pods
RF) Dye
Dh) Konerko

That would send a message!!!

kevingrt
06-08-2009, 04:25 PM
What an ugly frustrating game. Words don't describe that debacle.

Rikirk
06-08-2009, 04:25 PM
So...anyone have ideas what we can do to get better?

Throw out some ideas...I wanna hear 'em.

Humor me.

SoxSpeed22
06-08-2009, 04:25 PM
We just stink now. We deserved to lose and we did. JD had a great game and Carrasco kept us in it.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:26 PM
I know I get ripped for looking into the chairman's books, but those $40 million more than likely have to get re-invested within the same young players we already have : Jenks, Danks, Quentin.

I would assume you can't let both Thome and Dye walk away at once either. Dye more than likely gets re-signed.

If the market is anything like it was last year, there will be some bargains to be had out there, and I'm sure that some of that money is earmarked for the up and coming "stars" like Quentin and Danks, it's not like we need superstar production out of every spot, we just need some ballplayers that can get on base and not strike out 250 times per season.

Boondock Saint
06-08-2009, 04:26 PM
This team is just so disappointing, I can hardly find the words to explain it.

I know that the Sox can still win this bad division, but I'm starting to wonder if I'll even enjoy it if they win it while playing like this.

KempersRS
06-08-2009, 04:26 PM
Let's not pretend like OC, Swisher, and Crede would be leading us back to the play-offs. They've been collectively as terrible as the guys who have replaced them.

I think what is sad is that all 4 of those guys absolutely suck. There is no doubt about it. But the sad part is that they are still all better than Wise, Getz, and Fields.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:27 PM
Cabrera is hitting .236. Swisher is hitting .250. Crede is hitting .237. Uribe is the only one doing anything, he's hitting .306 for the Giants, but he's only recently been getting regular playing time.

Whatever, the Sox did what they had to do, they're in the 2-3 year process of turning over their roster and they had to kick the tires on Fields, Getz, etc. to see if they can be everyday players in the Majors or if they're just crap.

Let's not pretend like OC, Swisher, and Crede would be leading us back to the play-offs. They've been collectively as terrible as the guys who have replaced them.


Yeah, that clown car is the last thing we need right now.
The problem is not replacing those clowns with capable ML ballplayers. All the replacements have sucked.

ms620
06-08-2009, 04:27 PM
The Tigers didn't execute. The Tigers would have scored eight runs against Richard if they had executed. Beginning with a doubleplay with two on to end the first, the Tigers squandered opportunities. The Tigers had three times the opportunities as the Sox and only scored one more run.

Again, the starting pitching was a concern for the Sox. On a day when you have to play a day game and a night game, Richard didn't last long enough.

With the weather warming up, the Sox got two home runs, both tying the game. They scored a first inning run hitting only one ball out of the infield.

I don't think Beckham should have been called up, but he's obviously on this team because there isn't a legitimate third baseman preceding him on the roster. I don't know if he would have driven in Getz or he would have fielded the ball in the ninth, but it's clear that Fields is only acceptable in comparison to Betemit.

Are you serious? Really? The Tigers were 3-13 w/RISP...the Sox were 0-6. The Tigers committed 0 errors, sox 3. The Tigers did not walk in a run...the sox did. So please tell me how the Tigers did not execute. Yes the Tigers could have scored more runs...but so could the sox. The Tigers did not hit a home run, the sox had 2, and the Tigers still won the game.

white sox bill
06-08-2009, 04:27 PM
I think cub fans are right--We are the White Sux

WhiteSox5187
06-08-2009, 04:28 PM
This season is starting to feel eerily reminiscent of 2007. Our bullpen is still holding up, but the offense seems lost.

billyvsox
06-08-2009, 04:28 PM
Cabrera is hitting .236. Swisher is hitting .250. Crede is hitting .237. Uribe is the only one doing anything, he's hitting .306 for the Giants, but he's only recently been getting regular playing time.

Whatever, the Sox did what they had to do, they're in the 2-3 year process of turning over their roster and they had to kick the tires on Fields, Getz, etc. to see if they can be everyday players in the Majors or if they're just crap.

Let's not pretend like OC, Swisher, and Crede would be leading us back to the play-offs. They've been collectively as terrible as the guys who have replaced them.


I agree they have not been great, but they are significantly better defensively. OC always moved runners, Crede always hit in the clutch, Uribe was a good luck charm and solid utility guy. They all signed elsewhere late for half the money they wanted.

Its not always about the numbers, Its about executing when the time comes!!

Konerko05
06-08-2009, 04:28 PM
So...anyone have ideas what we can do to get better?

Throw out some ideas...I wanna hear 'em.

Humor me.

Stop playing Josh Fields.

october23sp
06-08-2009, 04:29 PM
So...anyone have ideas what we can do to get better?

Throw out some ideas...I wanna hear 'em.

Humor me.

Use metal bats. While taking away the Tigers bats entirely. This strategy could get use to extra innings if Ozzie manages well.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:29 PM
Is it sad that Podsednik right now is our best everyday player next to Dye?


That's very sad to me. That's a guy that was out of baseball at start of the season.


7 other guys need to start looking in the mirror.

Patrick134
06-08-2009, 04:29 PM
This season is starting to feel eerily reminiscent of 2007. Our bullpen is still holding up, but the offense seems lost.


They could find their way and win this subpar division, but I don't see whoever wins the AL Central doing much in the postseason anyway.

Patrick134
06-08-2009, 04:30 PM
Is it sad that Podsednik right now is our best everyday player next to Dye?


That's very sad to me. That's a guy that was out of baseball at start of the season.


7 other guys need to start looking in the mirror.


PK and AJ have been solid. Not all stars , but far from horrible.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:31 PM
This season is starting to feel eerily reminiscent of 2007. Our bullpen is still holding up, but the offense seems lost.

Honestly this season feels more like some of those marose teams in the late-1990s that had some talent, but just couldn't seem to find consistent everyday players at some positions, so what little good some of the team was doing was totally negated by the crap half.

Fortunately, I think KW is a better GM than Schueler so I still trust him to turn this thing around, and he's still in that "5-Year World Series window" I gave him and Ozzie, so whatever direction they want to take, I'll follow like a blind dog.

2011, the gloves come off if we're still just spinning wheels.

WhiteSox5187
06-08-2009, 04:31 PM
They could find their way and win this subpar division, but I don't see whoever wins the AL Central doing much in the postseason anyway.

I don't see this team doing anything like that unless there is a sudden and dramatic turn around.

WhiteSoxFTW
06-08-2009, 04:32 PM
Is it sad that Podsednik right now is our best everyday player next to Dye?


That's very sad to me. That's a guy that was out of baseball at start of the season.


7 other guys need to start looking in the mirror.

I was thinking along those same lines when I saw that Pods was 2 for 3 w/ a walk late in the game.

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 04:32 PM
Lineup for game 2?:

C) Flowers
1b) Allen
2b) Alexi
SS) Beckham
3b) Viciedo
LF) Danks
CF) Pods
RF) Dye
Dh) Konerko

That would send a message!!!

What message would that be?

:KW:
"we don't give a damn about player development, here's hoping these kids' collective heads don't explode trying to hit major league breaking balls and ruin the next development cycle. If that happens, we'll try to get back into contention sometime in 2013. Thanks for all your support and remember, please keep spending money, we cannot sign any free agents unless you continue to throw your money at us. We'll be pocketing the money we saved from Thome, Contreras and Colon next year so enjoy "The Kids can play (hopefully) round II."

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:33 PM
PK and AJ have been solid. Not all stars , but far from horrible.


PK and AJ have been OK, but not great.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:34 PM
I agree they have not been great, but they are significantly better defensively. OC always moved runners, Crede always hit in the clutch, Uribe was a good luck charm and solid utility guy. They all signed elsewhere late for half the money they wanted.

Its not always about the numbers, Its about executing when the time comes!!

What they did in the past have no bearing on what they're doing now, and they're all sucking. OC and Swisher just never fit in here, OC because of his personality and Swisher because we have nowhere for him to play everyday, and Crede was just too great a risk for the Sox to realistically take.

I know it's easy to think the grass is always greener, especially at times like this, but I still think the Sox made the right decision starting to go in a new direction. It was time for the Sox to start getting younger, problem is the current crop of youngsters is not impressive. But you at least had to give Fields and Getz a shot, right?

Law11
06-08-2009, 04:34 PM
after attending yesterday and hearing todays outcome Im getting closer to the conclusion that its time for Football season.

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 04:34 PM
So...anyone have ideas what we can do to get better?

Throw out some ideas...I wanna hear 'em.

Humor me.

Find a 3B/2B who can actually play the position and hit. Put Beckham at the other slot. Hope that TCQ is healthy at the end of the week and can start a rehab assignment if not, then trade for a CF too.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:35 PM
after attending yesterday and hearing todays outcome Im getting closer to the conclusion that its time for Football season.

Hate to sound like Dan MacNeil, but I can't wait for the boys to put the pads on.

Law11
06-08-2009, 04:36 PM
Hate to sound like Dan MacNeil, but I can't wait for the boys to put the pads on.

BearBonnais anyone?

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 04:36 PM
I think cub fans are right--We are the White Sux

Don't go there, Bill. Please don't go there. Sux for Sox is a replacement word that long ago got disallowed on these forums. I'm talking year 2000 stuff...

Rdy2PlayBall
06-08-2009, 04:38 PM
I no longer like this team. There is no other team in the MLB I can say I like more... but right now the Sox are just the team I dislike the least. Right now I'm a Chicago fan who doesn't like the Cubs... Idk, I just lost all hope in this team. If they lose today when I am at the game I wont watch another game this season. I'm downright depressed right now.

Carolina Kenny
06-08-2009, 04:38 PM
Stop playing Josh Fields.

Even Joey can't help this hack. How ironic, Fields can't field. Never could and never will. Fields will be another footnote in Sox 3rd base history. Right behind Gene Freese.

LoveYourSuit
06-08-2009, 04:38 PM
So...anyone have ideas what we can do to get better?

Throw out some ideas...I wanna hear 'em.

Humor me.


Anderson
Wise
Getz
Nix
Fields

Find a way to keep those guys off the everyday line up, I think we can turn this around.


Quentin coming back will knock out Anderson and Wise.

Beckham needs to play ahead of Getz/Fields. He's here, he needs to play.

We need to trade for a 3B ASAP!!!

ode to veeck
06-08-2009, 04:39 PM
But you at least had to give Fields and Getz a shot, right?

Fields never, Getz maybe

ShoelessJoeS
06-08-2009, 04:39 PM
Fields is in for his bat, which has stunk, so why is he even here? Even in his breakout 20 homer partial season, he hit .244 and struck out 1 of every 3 at bats.I was wondering about this too. He clearly has no business playing 3B, so you have to imagine that he's in there for his bat... yet, he can't hit for power, or average, and he strikes out a ton. :scratch:

guillensdisciple
06-08-2009, 04:40 PM
Don't go there, Bill. Please don't go there. Sux for Sox is a replacement word that long ago got disallowed on these forums. I'm talking year 2000 stuff...


I saw that shirt so much throughout high school, and it angered me so much. Luckily, I have calmed down a lot since then and it does not bother me as much. Still, even at my present state of calm/ happiness, that "Sux" brings back a little tinge of bitterness.

DickAllen72
06-08-2009, 04:40 PM
They played to their abilities.
Yep.

Fields sucks. Wise sucks. Anderson sucks. Quentin can't stay healthy.

And since they made the decision to bring up Beckham, he should be starting every day--at 2B where he belongs. Trade for a real third baseman and a real centerfielder. Otherwise, this team will continue to suck.

I had this team pegged for about 79 wins unless they added a real centerfielder. Now I think I was being generous. I still think they can turn it around by adding a 3B, CF, playing Beckham at 2B and getting a healthy CQ back. Probably not much of a chance of all of those things happening though.

Welcome to 2007 all over again.

DirtySox
06-08-2009, 04:40 PM
Yay fun fact time!

On this homestand the Sox are 3-51 with RISP.

Rdy2PlayBall
06-08-2009, 04:41 PM
I was wondering about this too. He clearly has no business playing 3B, so you have to imagine that he's in there for his bat... yet, he can't hit for power, or average, and he strikes out a ton. :scratch:Beckham is here to have a better bat but his is **** so far too. I'd rather have Fields who has been decent as of late.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:42 PM
Fields never, Getz maybe

I don't know, Fields had a 101 OPS+ his rookie year, I don't think it was a terrible decision to see what he could do, nobody expected Fields to be a superstar, just to add some pop to the bottom of the lineup. But yeah, he's been terrible, it's time to pull the plug.

DickAllen72
06-08-2009, 04:42 PM
Anderson
Wise
Getz
Nix
Fields

Find a way to keep those guys off the everyday line up, I think we can turn this around.


Quentin coming back will knock out Anderson and Wise.

Beckham needs to play ahead of Getz/Fields. He's here, he needs to play.

We need to trade for a 3B ASAP!!!
Couldn't agree more.

johnnyg83
06-08-2009, 04:42 PM
Yay fun fact time!

On this homestand the Sox are 3-51 with RISP.

That's the saddest fun fact I've ever read.

Jim Shorts
06-08-2009, 04:44 PM
.045 Batting Average with runners in scoring position over the last 7 games.

Saying that is Bush League would be a compliment.


That's humiliation in a stat

guillensdisciple
06-08-2009, 04:44 PM
Yay fun fact time!

On this homestand the Sox are 3-51 with RISP.



:o::o::o::o::o::o:


6 percent success rate.

We are the shame of baseball.:D::D:

AnkleSox
06-08-2009, 04:44 PM
Yay fun fact time!

On this homestand the Sox are 3-51 with RISP.

:puking:

ode to veeck
06-08-2009, 04:44 PM
I don't know, Fields had a 101 OPS+ his rookie year, I don't think it was a terrible decision to see what he could do, nobody expected Fields to be a superstar, just to add some pop to the bottom of the lineup. But yeah, he's been terrible, it's time to pull the plug.


there never was a place for Fields in the field, we already have a 1B and DH and he was never gonna be a 3B

october23sp
06-08-2009, 04:45 PM
There's been no PTC selection made.

thomas35forever
06-08-2009, 04:46 PM
Having second thoughts about going to Milwaukee.


This team sucks :angry:
I'm not. I've been waiting forever to go to Miller Park. After begging my dad to buy tickets, there's no way I'm backing out.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:46 PM
there never was a place for Fields in the field, we already have a 1B and DH and he was never gonna be a 3B

I think he's actually bee OK in the field this year, I know he had a huge error in today's loss, but (IMO) he's been adequate for most of the season. Again, nobdody was expecting greatness from him, just to be an average player, which is obviously is not.

jordans323
06-08-2009, 04:46 PM
The sad thing is that we will counter this terrible game by putting Contreras on the mound. Like he will last longer that Richards did, or even keep us in the game as well as Richards did. We are going from one bad pitcher to a worse pitcher. He needs to goto the bullpen, sit in AAA or be released. It is that simple. WE are about to get swept in the double header. 6.5 games back and we could easily be 9.5 back after this series

guillensdisciple
06-08-2009, 04:46 PM
Comments by Ozzie during the post game press?

whitesoxfan
06-08-2009, 04:47 PM
Beckham is here to have a better bat but his is **** so far too. I'd rather have Fields who has been decent as of late.

False. Beckham's had 10 AB's. Small sample size, much? He's here to play, not ride the damn bench.

I hate to sound like a dark cloud but bad teams give runs right back after they score them. We did that three times today. That's a recipe for disaster, and that's almost more frustrating than the 3 errors. We're fortunate the Tigers are a bad team too. I realize they're in first, but everyone in this division sucks. If that was a good team we were playing today, we lose that game by at least 5 runs. Pretty embarrassing display of baseball at the Cell today.

ShoelessJoeS
06-08-2009, 04:47 PM
Beckham is here to have a better bat but his is **** so far too. I'd rather have Fields who has been decent as of late.You can't expect Beckham to come out of the gates guns blazing. Fields' biggest issue has always been his defense. He's a butcher a 3B, that much is clear. So you have to wonder why he's still trotted out there, because he can't hit either. He strikes out like a power hitter, but lacks power. What is the answer at third then? I don't know, but it's certainly not Fields.

Konerko05
06-08-2009, 04:47 PM
Yay fun fact time!

On this homestand the Sox are 3-51 with RISP.

Wow. How can part of the blame not go to Walker when the whole team is collectively horrible in this department?

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:48 PM
The sad thing is that we will counter this terrible game by putting Contreras on the mound. Like he will last longer that Richards did, or even keep us in the game as well as Richards did. We are going from one bad pitcher to a worse pitcher. He needs to goto the bullpen, sit in AAA or be released. It is that simple. WE are about to get swept in the double header. 6.5 games back and we could easily be 9.5 back after this series

And the Tigers are starting Jeremy Bonderman. It's a two-way street.

Tomorrow we get Dontrelle and Wednesday we get Verlander, who we have owned in his career.

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 04:48 PM
There's been no PTC selection made.

Whoops... Okay, now there is...

DirtySox
06-08-2009, 04:48 PM
Comments by Ozzie during the post game press?


Ozzie: "good teams win games, horse**** teams have meetings. Well, we're to the point where we're going to have a lot of meetings."True.

whitesoxfan
06-08-2009, 04:49 PM
The sad thing is that we will counter this terrible game by putting Contreras on the mound. Like he will last longer that Richards did, or even keep us in the game as well as Richards did. We are going from one bad pitcher to a worse pitcher. He needs to goto the bullpen, sit in AAA or be released. It is that simple. WE are about to get swept in the double header. 6.5 games back and we could easily be 9.5 back after this series

If we're swept, it's fire sale time. That's not over reactionary, but it's what needs to be done. If we somehow get swept that would mean we'd finish this home stand at 2-10, including going 2-5 against pathetic baseball teams.

DirtySox
06-08-2009, 04:49 PM
Also, Whisler was sent down for those wondering.

whitesoxfan
06-08-2009, 04:50 PM
And the Tigers are starting Jeremy Bonderman. It's a two-way street.

Tomorrow we get Dontrelle and Wednesday we get Verlander, who we have owned in his career.

It's the White Sox offense. Bonderman will find a way to shut us down.

I'd much rather face Verlander 10 times out of 10 than face a guy that's making his first Major League start in a year. How bad is that?

thomas35forever
06-08-2009, 04:50 PM
Wow. How can part of the blame not go to Walker when the whole team is collectively horrible in this department?
As I've said before, Ozzie will never throw any of his coaches under the bus. There's Bears-type loyalty within the organization.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:51 PM
If we're swept, it's fire sale time. That's not over reactionary, but it's what needs to be done. If we somehow get swept that would mean we'd finish this home stand at 2-10, including going 2-5 against pathetic baseball teams.

I really wish someone would recommend a "fire sale" with what we're supposed to sell off and who will take their place playing everyday.

Do you want to see the Charlotte Knights lineup here every night? Awesome.

TDog
06-08-2009, 04:51 PM
Are you serious? Really? The Tigers were 3-13 w/RISP...the Sox were 0-6. The Tigers committed 0 errors, sox 3. The Tigers did not walk in a run...the sox did. So please tell me how the Tigers did not execute. Yes the Tigers could have scored more runs...but so could the sox. The Tigers did not hit a home run, the sox had 2, and the Tigers still won the game.

I am serious. The Tigers failed with runners in scoring postion 10 times. None of their three hits with runner in scoring positoin came with two out. That's not executing. The Tigers were beneficiaries of three errors. Only one scored. The Tigers had two on and one out in the first and didn't score. The threatened constantly when Richard was in there, and aside from the second inning, they could only score on a bases-loaded walk The Tigers executed on defense, except for the blown save. They didn't execute on offense.

Two of the Sox failures with runners in scoring position were Wise with two outs. The only failure that didn't come with two outs was Fields, who did not have a good day.

White Sox pitching and defense gave the Tigers many opportunites that they squandered.

If the White Sox had been the Tigers today, people would be complaining about the Sox only going 3-for-13 with runners in scoring position, squandering numerous oppotunities and being lucky to come away with a win.

Konerko05
06-08-2009, 04:51 PM
there never was a place for Fields in the field, we already have a 1B and DH and he was never gonna be a 3B

Yeah, and unfortunately a sub .650 OPS just doesn't cut it at 1B/DH.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:51 PM
As I've said before, Ozzie will never throw any of his coaches under the bus. There's Bears-type loyalty within the organization.

Tim Raines agrees.

guillensdisciple
06-08-2009, 04:51 PM
True.


Wow, well, at least he is not hiding our suck.

Too bad Ozzie can't do much to fix this team. These players have to look within themselves to figure this one out.

kobo
06-08-2009, 04:52 PM
I know it's easy to think the grass is always greener, especially at times like this, but I still think the Sox made the right decision starting to go in a new direction. It was time for the Sox to start getting younger, problem is the current crop of youngsters is not impressive. But you at least had to give Fields and Getz a shot, right?
I agree. The Sox had to see what they have in Fields, Getz, and to a lesser extent Anderson. Unfortunately, they have all been bad. There was hope at the beginning of the season, but since the end of April both Getz and Fields have underperformed. At the very least, we know Fields won't be back next year. Unless something snaps and he does a 180 and turns his season around, but I don't see that happening.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:52 PM
It's the White Sox offense. Bonderman will find a way to shut us down.

I'd much rather face Verlander 10 times out of 10 than face a guy that's making his first Major League start in a year. How bad is that?

No, no, Bonderman's not an unknown, he just sucks. The Tigers would be better off plucking some kid from the derth of their A-ball rotation. The fact that it's Bonderman makes me pretty happy.

whitesoxfan
06-08-2009, 04:52 PM
I really wish someone would recommend a "fire sale" with what we're supposed to sell off and who will take their place playing everyday.

Do you want to see the Charlotte Knights lineup here every night? Awesome.

I only said that if we're swept, which I don't think will happen anyway.

If we're 9.5 games back, you wouldn't want to trade some of your most tradeable pieces to get some pretty solid prospects back in return? These guys aren't getting any younger you know.

whitesoxfan
06-08-2009, 04:53 PM
No, no, Bonderman's not an unknown, he just sucks. The Tigers would be better off plucking some kid from the derth of their A-ball rotation. The fact that it's Bonderman makes me pretty happy.

That's true..I hope you're right and I hope I'm wrong.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 04:54 PM
If we're 9.5 games back, you wouldn't want to trade some of your most tradeable pieces to get some pretty solid prospects back in return? These guys aren't getting any younger you know.

Right, but what do you realistically expect to get back? Sometimes, the long-term future of the team is best served by taking some lumps at the MLB level and allowing your kids to continue their development at the appropriate MiLB level.

Of course, if someone floors KW with an offer for Thome or Dye, etc. then you have to take it, but I don't see the point of just selling this team off just for the sake of breaking it apart.

thomas35forever
06-08-2009, 04:55 PM
I agree. The Sox had to see what they have in Fields, Getz, and to a lesser extent Anderson. Unfortunately, they have all been bad. There was hope at the beginning of the season, but since the end of April both Getz and Fields have underperformed. At the very least, we know Fields won't be back next year. Unless something snaps and he does a 180 and turns his season around, but I don't see that happening.
Going further, if guys like Swisher, Cabrera, Crede, etc. were still on the team, people would still be complaining about how we're too old. You can't win with some people.

hi im skot
06-08-2009, 04:55 PM
Ozzie: "good teams win games, horse**** teams have meetings. Well, we're to the point where we're going to have a lot of meetings."

True.

Well, this team is indeed horse****, so good call, Ozzie.

chisoxfanatic
06-08-2009, 04:58 PM
My god, I am not having fun at the ballpark anymore. I feel like I wasted 3 hours there.

Why can't Getz and TCM get their uniforms dirty to dive for grounders? Why couldn't the pitching keep the Tigers off the scoreboard the next inning every time they scored?

I'm just about losing ideas about this team and what they might be able to do to pull out of their struggles.

whitesoxfan
06-08-2009, 04:59 PM
Right, but what do you realistically expect to get back? Sometimes, the long-term future of the team is best served by taking some lumps at the MLB level and allowing your kids to continue their development at the appropriate MiLB level.

Of course, if someone floors KW with an offer for Thome or Dye, etc. then you have to take it, but I don't see the point of just selling this team off just for the sake of breaking it apart.

Oh, I definitely don't want to break this team apart just for the sake of breaking it apart. I think we can get good value for Dye, Thome, or even PK. I've never been a big fire sale guy, but in an instance when you're best hitters are all getting older and nearing the end of their deals as well as basically being left dead in the water (if we were somehow swept once again), then I believe you have to give as much value as you can for someone like Jermaine or Thome.

WhiteSoxFTW
06-08-2009, 05:00 PM
Yep.

Fields sucks. Wise sucks. Anderson sucks. Quentin can't stay healthy.

And since they made the decision to bring up Beckham, he should be starting every day--at 2B where he belongs. Trade for a real third baseman and a real centerfielder. Otherwise, this team will continue to suck.

I had this team pegged for about 79 wins unless they added a real centerfielder. Now I think I was being generous. I still think they can turn it around by adding a 3B, CF, playing Beckham at 2B and getting a healthy CQ back. Probably not much of a chance of all of those things happening though.

Welcome to 2007 all over again.

Turn it around by adding a 3B and a CF? Though, I think we can all agree that would work...what do you suggest we trade away to get it? The bullpen seems to be the only part of this team that is playing well enough to have trade value. And, there's not many in there I'd want to part with.

jordans323
06-08-2009, 05:00 PM
Even if we win 1 game, we are 8.5 back, still doesn't look good. We need to take 2 or 3 of these games to stay in some borderline contention. Or maybe play on the road all year long?

ode to veeck
06-08-2009, 05:01 PM
Even if we win 1 game, we are 8.5 back, still doesn't look good. We need to take 2 or 3 of these games to stay in some borderline contention. Or maybe play on the road all year long?

welcome to WSI

DickAllen72
06-08-2009, 05:04 PM
Turn it around by adding a 3B and a CF? Though, I think we can all agree that would work...what do you suggest we trade away to get it? The bullpen seems to be the only part of this team that is playing well enough to have trade value. And, there's not many in there I'd want to part with.
Depending on the quality of the return, I wouldn't mind trading prospects like Poreda, Flowers, Allen, etc. Mind you, not trade them for has-beens or fringe players, but for quality. Some of those prospect coupled with young guys like Getz, Fields, Anderson and lesser prospects like Shelby, Retheford, etc, should be able to get you some quality major league talent.

sunofgold
06-08-2009, 05:06 PM
But we are fortunate to have a second game to help erase this tough loss. Let's win the nightcap. Hopefully, a start of good things for the White Sox. Sense a 10 game winning streak upcoming soon.

DirtySox
06-08-2009, 05:15 PM
Ozzie Furious with Lack of Execution (http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports_hardball/2009/06/ozzie-guillen-furious-with-lack-of-execution-in-white-soxs-54-loss-to-detroit.html)

Some choice words in there.

BadBobbyJenks
06-08-2009, 05:15 PM
Galaragga's stuff looked so bad in the first inning, they had a pitcher up in the pen during the first ****ing inning in game one of a double header. AND we lose the game?

So Pods gets on 3 times today and he does not steal a base or do we hit and run.

Oh and Alexei continues to show off his fantastic bunting ability.

Fields continues to be a butcher, but has lost the ability to hit a fastball.

I love double plays.

Wise needs to be Old Yellered.

Quentin needs to get healthy.

But we have good news, Jose Contreras is starting the night cap!

But Stone and Hawk were really good today actually, I am not upset I gave my tickets away.

Frankfan4life
06-08-2009, 05:17 PM
14 baserunners = 4 runs, and that's OK?

This game should never have been close enough the defense would be put in a position to make a critical error.I couldn't wait to get home from the game. I don't think I've ever felt more depressed after a loss. The Sox just are not executing in key situations. I almost hate to see Pods get on base because chances are he's going to die there. We had all kinds of chances to put this game in the win column but couldn't do it. This is a bad, bad team.

guillensdisciple
06-08-2009, 05:20 PM
Ozzie Furious with Lack of Execution (http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports_hardball/2009/06/ozzie-guillen-furious-with-lack-of-execution-in-white-soxs-54-loss-to-detroit.html)

Some choice words in there.

If these guys have any respect for the game, for themselves, for the fans, and for a very loyal managing crew I suggest they start playing baseball.

Ozzie is the man for those reasons, I love when people speak it how they see it, not try to beat around the bush like 99 percent of the managers in the major leagues.

This team has to play like they have some pride, not like they are just another group of guys going out there to get money and leave. To Ozzie, the game of baseball is everything, perhaps these guys should check themselves at the door and see if it means to them as much as it means to him. In my opinion, that is what separates a lot of losers from the winners.


Alas, I will keep on watching regardless (mainly because I respect Kenny and Ozzie too much to give up so early).

JB98
06-08-2009, 05:22 PM
The White Sox are a bad team doing what bad teams do. Bad offense, terrible defense and the pitching wasn't good enough either.

I thought the U.S. Cellular text poll question of the game was humorous. Sixty-eight percent of the respondents selected the Tigers to win this five-game series. That shows that Sox fans have come to the conclusion that this team sucks.

I'm not even that upset by the loss. I expected it. I'm just grateful I didn't waste any money going to the park today. As a matter of fact, I just put some tickets to the Cubs series and the Yankees series up for sale today. I really don't enjoy watching the team play. I'll stay home more frequently, so I can simply change the channel or turn off the TV and do other things when the Sox become too nauseating to watch.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 05:34 PM
Ozzie Furious with Lack of Execution (http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports_hardball/2009/06/ozzie-guillen-furious-with-lack-of-execution-in-white-soxs-54-loss-to-detroit.html)

Some choice words in there.
Congrats to Ozzie for calling these bums out. KW, start selling.

JB98
06-08-2009, 05:42 PM
Ozzie Furious with Lack of Execution (http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports_hardball/2009/06/ozzie-guillen-furious-with-lack-of-execution-in-white-soxs-54-loss-to-detroit.html)

Some choice words in there.

At least all the fans who wanted Ozzie to go on a tirade got their wish.

Will it help? Don't know. I still hope KW makes some changes to this roster. Of course, I'm mindful of the fact that it takes two to trade.

billyvsox
06-08-2009, 05:43 PM
Anyone know why KW "stormed out of the clubhouse"?

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 05:48 PM
Anyone know why KW "stormed out of the clubhouse"?
If you were the GM, wouldn't you storm out? Although KW is the one who put this whole mess together. He put this team together with no CF, 2nd baseman, or 3rd baseman. He deserves mush of the blame for what is happening now.

DickAllen72
06-08-2009, 05:49 PM
Congrats to Ozzie for calling these bums out. KW, start selling.
Yes, KW start selling. Sell Fields, Getz, Anderson along with some of those hot prospects and get us another Championship this year. Oh yeah, and give away Wise.

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 05:49 PM
If you were the GM, wouldn't you storm out? Although KW is the one who put this whole mess together. He put this team together with no CF, 2nd baseman, or 3rd baseman. He deserves mush of the blame for what is happening now.

That's hindsight. Getz and Fields both appeared to be ready for their crack at the big leagues. Add in the budgetary constraints brought on by the recession and declining attendance the last few years and sometimes you have to take a chance on the kids.

Carolina Kenny
06-08-2009, 05:50 PM
If you were the GM, wouldn't you storm out? Although KW is the one who put this whole mess together. He put this team together with no CF, 2nd baseman, or 3rd baseman. He deserves mush of the blame for what is happening now.

That's not true. As a matter of fact we have a plethora of 2nd baseman right now, Nix, TCM, Saviour,Getz. That four of them.

TheAnswer32
06-08-2009, 05:52 PM
Thank god I can view this anytime, http://bluefoot.tv/videos/video/80 , because this team is unwatchable.

Konerko05
06-08-2009, 05:54 PM
Anyone know why KW "stormed out of the clubhouse"?

That sentence combined with the following Guillen quote also caught my attention. Sounds like Williams went into the clubhouse to reenact his famous buffet flipping tirade and Guillen kicked him out.

billyvsox
06-08-2009, 05:54 PM
That's not true. As a matter of fact we have a plethora of 2nd baseman right now, Nix, TCM, Saviour,Getz. That four of them.

Not to mention Lillibridge. I thought is was odd he acquired so many infielders during the offseason, maybve he was hoping one or two would work out.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 05:56 PM
That's hindsight. Getz and Fields both appeared to be ready for their crack at the big leagues. Add in the budgetary constraints brought on by the recession and declining attendance the last few years and sometimes you have to take a chance on the kids.
I said this last year when Fields sucked. Getz did nothing last year to impress me neither. Fields is a bust, and Getz is a utility man, nothing more. As for the economy or the attendance, the last few years the attendance has been great, so that dog don't hunt. As for the economy, Orlando Hudson came really cheap, but so much for that.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 05:57 PM
That's not true. As a matter of fact we have a plethora of 2nd baseman right now, Nix, TCM, Saviour,Getz. That four of them.
I should have said players who can actually play in the Majors.

billyvsox
06-08-2009, 05:57 PM
That sentence combined with the following Guillen quote also caught my attention. Sounds like Williams went into the clubhouse to reenact his famous buffet flipping tirade and Guillen kicked him out.

That is exactly how I interpreted it also. That he came in to raise hell and Ozzie wouldnt let him. Anyway I could also think of numerours reasons her stormed out.

1) Atmosphere was too loose
2) Fields sucks
3) Poor execution
4) Wise sucks
5) Bad defense
6) BA sucks
7) Food sucks.

I am reminded of John McKay's favorite quote abou his lowly Tampa Bay Buccaneers. When asked what he thought of his teams execution...his response was "I'm all for it"

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 05:58 PM
I said this last year when Fields sucked. Getz did nothing last year to impress me neither. Fields is a bust, and Getz is a utility man, nothing more. As for the economy or the attendance, the last few years the attendance has been great, so that dog don't hunt. As for the economy, Orlando Hudson came really cheap, but so much for that.

The attendance last year was down 500K from 2006. That money has to come out of the budget somewhere.

pilotsox
06-08-2009, 06:01 PM
That's hindsight. Getz and Fields both appeared to be ready for their crack at the big leagues. Add in the budgetary constraints brought on by the recession and declining attendance the last few years and sometimes you have to take a chance on the kids.

True, and it is in no way Kenny's fault that every single part of the youth movement has stunk. They looked ready for their shot, we gave it to them, and we ended up getting bent over the bathroom sink.

One thing I will definitely credit Kenny for is that, on paper, his teams look great. Before this mess started, I was super excited to watch the youth movement in action over an entire season, and I'll admit that. So sometimes, the great team on paper translates into a great team on the field, like three of the last four years. And other times, that product sucks.

And since I'd say the GM has to deal with the "on-paper" part, KW cannot be blamed for this ****. He can, however, be tasked with fixing it. And having watched him in action for eight years, I trust him to do that. Maybe not for this year, but definitely for years to come.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:02 PM
The attendance last year was down 500K from 2006. That money has to come out of the budget somewhere.
You got rid of 2 big contracts in Swisher and Vazquez, and replaced those contracts with no one. Like I said, the attendance argument, that dog don't hunt.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:04 PM
True, and it is in no way Kenny's fault that every single part of the youth movement has stunk. They looked ready for their shot, we gave it to them, and we ended up getting bent over the bathroom sink.

One thing I will definitely credit Kenny for is that, on paper, his teams look great. Before this mess started, I was super excited to watch the youth movement in action over an entire season, and I'll admit that. So sometimes, the great team on paper translates into a great team on the field, like three of the last four years. And other times, that product sucks.

And since I'd say the GM has to deal with the "on-paper" part, KW cannot be blamed for this ****. He can, however, be tasked with fixing it. And having watched him in action for eight years, I trust him to do that. Maybe not for this year, but definitely for years to come.
With the history this Org. has had with draft picks and young players, what made you think that Fields, Getz and BA were gonna have good years? KW put this disaster together, so he shares part of the blame for it. That's the bottom line, and I am sure he would say the same thing.

Woofer
06-08-2009, 06:04 PM
If you were the GM, wouldn't you storm out? Although KW is the one who put this whole mess together. He put this team together with no CF, 2nd baseman, or 3rd baseman. He deserves mush of the blame for what is happening now.

Don't forget that the 4th and 5th starters were (are) question marks too.

ChiSox81
06-08-2009, 06:05 PM
We need to put this game behind us. We just need to win this second game. Tomorrow we are in very good shape with Buehrle pitching. Win these two games and we have the momentum for the rest of this series. Go Sox

russ99
06-08-2009, 06:05 PM
The attendance last year was down 500K from 2006. That money has to come out of the budget somewhere.

That's something like 7,000 less a game. I don't buy it. I think either a panic move based on mis-interpreted loss of ad revenue during a recession or Jerry going back to his pre-2005 tightwad ways were why Kenny didn't get a contender's budget to work with for this season.

And we all know each team is quite profitable due to the advanced media/website sales, so that doesn't really wash either...

jabrch
06-08-2009, 06:06 PM
Can't blame the O??? Since when is baseball about getting hits and walks? It is about scoring runs. I do not understand why people fail to realize this. The O was sub par as usual today.

It is very easy to boil "what baseball is all about" into one item.

It is much harder to actually be right.

9 for 33 with 5 walks is a nice day for most offenses. I'll take it. The offense played well enough to win today.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:06 PM
Don't forget that the 4th and 5th starters were (are) question marks too.
I forgot about those. Thanks for reminding me. KW is a big part of the blame for this year. He got credit last year and in 2005, so he should be held responsilbe for this year, and I am sure he would agree with that.

Konerko05
06-08-2009, 06:06 PM
Anyway I could also think of numerours reasons her stormed out.

1) Atmosphere was too loose
2) Fields sucks
3) Poor execution
4) Wise sucks
5) Bad defense
6) BA sucks
7) Food sucks.

I am reminded of John McKay's favorite quote abou his lowly Tampa Bay Buccaneers. When asked what he thought of his teams execution...his response was "I'm all for it"

Yeah, but why would he be in the clubhouse unless he had something to say?

JB98
06-08-2009, 06:10 PM
It is VERY easy to boil "what baseball is all about" into one item.

It is much harder to actually be right.

9 for 33 with 5 walks is a nice day for most offenses. I'll take it. The offense played well enough to win today.

That's insanity. They were 0-for-5 with RISP again. They botched two sacrifice bunt attempts. They failed to get a man in from third with less than two outs. They were awful.

Did you see the stuff Galarraga was featuring? He didn't have it at all today. He was so bad that Detroit had a reliever warming up in the first inning. The Sox let him off the hook time and time again.

pilotsox
06-08-2009, 06:17 PM
With the history this Org. has had with draft picks and young players, what made you think that Fields, Getz and BA were gonna have good years? KW put this disaster together, so he shares part of the blame for it. That's the bottom line, and I am sure he would say the same thing.

Oh. Well then! Considering our history, I guess we can write Beckham off too. Quick, let's DFA him before it's too late.

You do not judge prospects on history. I know a lot of prospects in this team's past have tanked. But at the same time, there have been successes. Frank, Crede, Rowand, Maggs, El Caballo etc. Sorry, but I'm not nicking off Getz and Fields because guys like Rauch and Danny Wright ended up sucking.

Now, I am starting to suspect that these guys are not major league ballplayers. Fields, for one, looks incredibly outmatched against any major league pitcher. He wasn't even close today. But I wasn't gonna make that decision at the beginning of the year after they had decent STs.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:19 PM
Oh. Well then! Considering our history, I guess we can write Beckham off too. Quick, let's DFA him before it's too late.

You do not judge prospects on history. I know a lot of prospects in this team's past have tanked. But at the same time, there have been successes. Frank, Crede, Rowand, Maggs, El Caballo etc. Sorry, but I'm not nicking off Getz and Fields because guys like Rauch and Danny Wright ended up sucking.

Now, I am starting to suspect that these guys are not major league ballplayers. Fields, for one, looks incredibly outmatched against any major league pitcher. He wasn't even close today. But I wasn't gonna make that decision at the beginning of the year after they had decent STs.
If Beckham is a bust, this org. will be crippled for many years to come. So let's hope he isn't.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 06:21 PM
If Beckham is a bust, this org. will be crippled for many years to come. So let's hope he isn't.

Crippled?

The Sox have had what, 2-3 1st round picks pan out in the past 15 years, and we've managed to win a World Series, 2 division titles, and 90 games twice in the past 5 years, Gordon Beckham is not the sole keystone to the next decade of White Sox baseball.

Calm down.

:chillpill:

It's Dankerific
06-08-2009, 06:23 PM
I'm not even that upset by the loss. I expected it. I'm just grateful I didn't waste any money going to the park today. As a matter of fact, I just put some tickets to the Cubs series and the Yankees series up for sale today. I really don't enjoy watching the team play. I'll stay home more frequently, so I can simply change the channel or turn off the TV and do other things when the Sox become too nauseating to watch.

Not to be mean, but that's one way to keep the Ozzie attendance tracker in positive territory. :(:

It is very easy to boil "what baseball is all about" into one item.

It is much harder to actually be right.

9 for 33 with 5 walks is a nice day for most offenses. I'll take it. The offense played well enough to win today.

That's insanity. They were 0-for-5 with RISP again. They botched two sacrifice bunt attempts. They failed to get a man in from third with less than two outs. They were awful.

Did you see the stuff Galarraga was featuring? He didn't have it at all today. He was so bad that Detroit had a reliever warming up in the first inning. The Sox let him off the hook time and time again.

Gotta agree with JB again here. 4 runs, in the American League, is not getting the job done. The offense certainly did not play well enough to win.

I just read the Ozzie Quotes. Of course, my eyes perked up to this one Or Iím m too tough on some guys. hmm... I wonder who THAT could be!

pilotsox
06-08-2009, 06:23 PM
If Beckham is a bust, this org. will be crippled for many years to come. So let's hope he isn't.

Now you're just overreacting. Beckham's success isn't going to save this franchise, and his failure isn't going to destroy it. He's just one player. I want him to succeed, of course, but I'm not going insane if he doesn't.

DickAllen72
06-08-2009, 06:25 PM
That's insanity. They were 0-for-5 with RISP again. They botched two sacrifice bunt attempts. They failed to get a man in from third with less than two outs. They were awful.

Did you see the stuff Galarraga was featuring? He didn't have it at all today. He was so bad that Detroit had a reliever warming up in the first inning. The Sox let him off the hook time and time again.
But NINE hits! FIVE walks! Man, they even scored FOUR runs! Let's just tip our caps to the Tigers for those hard hit ground balls in the ninth and go get 'em tonight!

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:25 PM
Crippled?

The Sox have had what, 2-3 1st round picks pan out in the past 15 years, and we've managed to win a World Series, 2 division titles, and 90 games twice in the past 5 years, Gordon Beckham is not the sole keystone to the next decade of White Sox baseball.

Calm down.

:chillpill:
I am calm. If this kid is a bust, this org. will be crippled for years.

JB98
06-08-2009, 06:28 PM
Not to be mean, but that's one way to keep the Ozzie attendance tracker in positive territory. :(:

I'm cutting back on attendance a bit this year anyway because of finances and job insecurity. The miserable play on the field is just giving me added motivation.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 06:29 PM
I am calm. If this kid is a bust, this org. will be crippled for years.

Yeah, you already said that. This is a team game, one player doesn't make or break a team. The Sox will be in much better shape if Beckham lives up to his tremendous hype, but if he doesn't, he doesn't... And you move on.

The Sox won the World Series in 2005 with Joe Crede, Mark Buehrle, and Brandon McCarthy as the sole representatives of the White Sox farm system. You are overreacting, likely just to try and illicit responses from other members. There's no way anyone who actually pays attention to baseball could actually believe that.

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:32 PM
Yeah, you already said that. This is a team game, one player doesn't make or break a team. The Sox will be in much better shape if Beckham lives up to his tremendous hype, but if he doesn't, he doesn't... And you move on.

The Sox won the World Series in 2005 with Joe Crede, Mark Buehrle, and Brandon McCarthy as the sole representatives of the White Sox farm system. You are overreacting, likely just to try and illicit responses from other members. There's no way anyone who actually pays attention to baseball could actually believe that.
Well hopefully he isn't a bust and we won't have to find out.

doublem23
06-08-2009, 06:33 PM
Well hopefully he isn't a bust and we won't have to find out.

I already know what will happen, if the kid is great he won't make the Sox automatically great, and if the kid is a bust he won't automatically make the Sox terrible.

DSpivack
06-08-2009, 06:34 PM
Yeah, you already said that. This is a team game, one player doesn't make or break a team. The Sox will be in much better shape if Beckham lives up to his tremendous hype, but if he doesn't, he doesn't... And you move on.

The Sox won the World Series in 2005 with Joe Crede, Mark Buehrle, and Brandon McCarthy as the sole representatives of the White Sox farm system. You are overreacting, likely just to try and illicit responses from other members. There's no way anyone who actually pays attention to baseball could actually believe that.

Why do you hate Rowand?

Frankie5Angels
06-08-2009, 06:35 PM
I already know what will happen, if the kid is great he won't make the Sox automatically great, and if the kid is a bust he won't automatically make the Sox terrible.
Really? We will truly find out in the future, not what you believe will happen.

Carolina Kenny
06-08-2009, 06:45 PM
I would still like to know what the Sox see in Fields?
I think Ozzie will have enough of the Fields experiment very soon.
I also think is very upset about TCM, who would think he could have such problems with sacrifice bunts?

TCM has range that OC can only dream about, but OC does not make that error late in the game, like TCM did.

palehozenychicty
06-08-2009, 06:49 PM
Beckham is here to have a better bat but his is **** so far too. I'd rather have Fields who has been decent as of late.


Beckham is a 22-year old first rounder. He'll be good if they develop him properly. He's up here and should be playing. I don't understand the logic.

DSpivack
06-08-2009, 06:53 PM
Beckham is a 22-year old first rounder. He'll be good if they develop him properly. He's up here and should be playing. I don't understand the logic.

I understand that he has high expectations, but you have to let a youngster struggle. Many of the great ones do; Robin Ventura and Willie Mays both started off something like 0-for-40; Matt Wieters is off to a slow start in Baltimore. Pulling the plug early would be a bigger mistake than anything else.

kobo
06-08-2009, 06:54 PM
I am calm. If this kid is a bust, this org. will be crippled for years.
How will one prospect who doesn't pan out cripple the organization for years? This makes absolutely no sense.

Thigpen "57"
06-08-2009, 06:54 PM
Yeah, you already said that. This is a team game, one player doesn't make or break a team. The Sox will be in much better shape if Beckham lives up to his tremendous hype, but if he doesn't, he doesn't... And you move on.

The Sox won the World Series in 2005 with Joe Crede, Mark Buehrle, and Brandon McCarthy as the sole representatives of the White Sox farm system. You are overreacting, likely just to try and illicit responses from other members. There's no way anyone who actually pays attention to baseball could actually believe that.

... Rowand, Thomas, and the forbidden mentioning of BA.

You could even put Garland in that list since he was traded by the Cubs one year after being drafted. I won't even dare mention Borchard or Pedro Lopez playing that year either. Oops... I just did! :redneck

(I know it wasn't the point you were making, but I couldn't resist :wink:)

voodoochile
06-08-2009, 06:55 PM
zJust to be clear, 500K loss if seats = 7k/game = ~$25M lost revenue...

Yeah, it hurts the ability to spend...

Mohoney
06-08-2009, 06:57 PM
I also think is very upset about TCM, who would think he could have such problems with sacrifice bunts?

Eventually, if a player fails time and time again at something, and he shows no hope of getting better at it, shouldn't the manager stop asking him to do it?

Ozzie should have given Pods the green light to try and steal the base instead of having Ramirez try and bunt.

If Ozzie wants to bunt to move Pods to 2nd in the future, then Ramirez can't be the #2 hitter anymore.

TDog
06-08-2009, 07:02 PM
...
I think Ozzie will have enough of the Fields experiment very soon.
I also think is very upset about TCM, who would think he could have such problems with sacrifice bunts?

TCM has range that OC can only dream about, but OC does not make that error late in the game, like TCM did.

I don't know where people get the idea that Fields at third is an experiment. It is his position. And the last I checked, Ramirez didn't make an error late in the game.

Bunting with Ramirez is a ridiculous, low-percentage concept. It could be that Ramirez, knowing that, doesn't have his heart in bunting. Intentionally getting two strikes on you would be a selfish approach to the game.

You bunt with Anderson. I believe his sacrifice Saturday was the last successful sacrifice by a White Sox hitter. You bunt with players whose probability of hitting is extremely low.

Ramirez had a successful sacrifice against the Royals a couple of weekends ago -- so successful he got a hit out of it. But Mr. Guillen and I disagree on the value of the sacrifice bunt.

Whitesoxfan23
06-08-2009, 07:02 PM
[QUOTE= Guess we do miss OC. Crede, Uribe, Swisher after all.[/QUOTE]


POTW. I rather have OC at short, Crede or Uribe at 3rd. Alexei hasn't been great at short, and Fields is a joke.

The Immigrant
06-08-2009, 07:05 PM
zJust to be clear, 500K loss if seats = 7k/game = ~$25M lost revenue...

Yeah, it hurts the ability to spend...

What was the percentage increase in the average price of a ticket between 2006 and 2009? My guess is that this increase largely offset the losses from reduced ticket sales.

It's Dankerific
06-08-2009, 07:08 PM
zJust to be clear, 500K loss if seats = 7k/game = ~$25M lost revenue...

Yeah, it hurts the ability to spend...

Losing this often and this bad (with this roster) is not going to help the revenue stream EITHER.

palehozenychicty
06-08-2009, 07:09 PM
POTW. I rather have OC at short, Crede or Uribe at 3rd. Alexei hasn't been great at short, and Fields is a joke.


None of those guys that left would make a damn bit of difference. People act like we got rid of Jimmy Rollins and David Wright. Please.

Alexei has been steady, but not spectacular. Fields, can't.

chisoxfanatic
06-08-2009, 07:10 PM
What was the percentage increase in the average price of a ticket between 2006 and 2009? My guess is that this increase largely offset the losses from reduced ticket sales.
My season ticket package rose about 8-9% each year, so I'd imagine it would be pretty close to around the same percentage.

Whitesoxfan23
06-08-2009, 07:21 PM
None of those guys that left would make a damn bit of difference. People act like we got rid of Jimmy Rollins and David Wright. Please.

Alexei has been steady, but not spectacular. Fields, can't.

I'm not talking about offense, I am talking about defense. Alexei has not been that steady at shortstop. He was much better at 2nd base. Uribe or Crede would have been much better on defense than Fields. OC would have been better at SS than Alexei. That's the point. I do find it hysterial though that you think having Crede or Uribe at 3rd instead of Fields wouldn't have made a bit of difference.

kittle42
06-08-2009, 07:38 PM
zJust to be clear, 500K loss if seats = 7k/game = ~$25M lost revenue...

Yeah, it hurts the ability to spend...

Spend money. Make money. Repeat.

4 points
06-09-2009, 03:30 PM
[QUOTE=jabrch;2252757]Can't blame the O. We were 9 for 33 with 5 walks.

9 for 33 sounds good. What were we with RISP? Don`t tell me what you hit, tell me when you hit it.:gulp: