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View Full Version : Pretty soon, might have to put Floyd in the bullpen for awhile


sunofgold
05-11-2009, 09:47 PM
He really is a mess. Maybe put him on warning like Contreras. We really cannot afford more horrible starts by Floyd.

If we move Floyd to the pen, then we can give Carrasco a chance to start. I know that Carrasco is doing well in the bullpen, but right now starting rotation needs help. Maybe even Broadway should get another look.

Or bring up somebody like Torres and put Gobble back down. Gobble really hasn't pitched great in AAA to warrant a call up. Guess he's lucky that he is a lefty with some experience.

Sadly, I am starting to miss Javier Vazquez. haha!

CWSpalehoseCWS
05-11-2009, 09:49 PM
Amazing how this team has fallen apart. I knew Floyd wouldn't do as well as he did last year, but this is rediculous. I hope they can rebound in time. At least it's still May.

GoGoCrede
05-11-2009, 09:50 PM
I dunno if we should take Carrasco out of a role he's comfortable in. I remember when we moved Linebrink to closer when Bobby was on the DL; it resulted in a walk-off at Wrigley, for one. I know it has nothing to do with Carrasco, but it shows what can happen when a pitcher is taken out of his comfort zone.

I'm not ready to give up on Floyd just yet; he showed some signs of 2008 Floyd tonight (though they were few and far in between, that's true).

soxinem1
05-11-2009, 10:10 PM
I dunno if we should take Carrasco out of a role he's comfortable in. I remember when we moved Linebrink to closer when Bobby was on the DL; it resulted in a walk-off at Wrigley, for one. I know it has nothing to do with Carrasco, but it shows what can happen when a pitcher is taken out of his comfort zone.

I'm not ready to give up on Floyd just yet; he showed some signs of 2008 Floyd tonight (though they were few and far in between, that's true).

Floyd's performance in Game 5 of the ALDS resembled his effort tonight.

Marqhead
05-11-2009, 10:12 PM
Floyd will not be heading to the bullpen anytime soon.

You don't just yank starters and throw em in the pen when they struggle. Yes he has some things to work through right now, but he's going to be doing it every 5th day. This team does not have the depth to pull off a move like that.

WhiteSox1989
05-11-2009, 10:31 PM
Okay. The first thing I find atrocious, is that someone would even suggest Floyd being put in the bullpen.

The second thing is, the spelling of 'ridiculous'.

hi im skot
05-11-2009, 11:02 PM
Okay. The first thing I find atrocious, is that someone would even suggest Floyd being put in the bullpen.

Seriously. I'm as upset as anyone else, but sheesh...

Konerko05
05-11-2009, 11:08 PM
Why would putting Floyd in the bullpen be a solution to any problem?

We need him as our third starter or we have absolutely no chance to compete in a horrible division. He needs to straighten himself out and the bullpen would be the worst place to do it.

Do you want to see a rotation of

Buehrle
Danks
Colon
Richard
Broadway?

A bad Gavin Floyd is still a better option than Broadway or Carrasco.

WhiteSox1989
05-11-2009, 11:12 PM
Seriously. I'm as upset as anyone else, but sheesh...

Oh. It's THAT serious, hhaha. Maybe I overreacted a bit. But as soon as I read the thread title I immediately started shaking my head.

Konerko05
05-11-2009, 11:16 PM
Oh. It's THAT serious, hhaha. Maybe I overreacted a bit. But as soon as I read the thread title I immediately started shaking my head.

I think he was agreeing with you.

hi im skot
05-11-2009, 11:25 PM
Oh. It's THAT serious, hhaha. Maybe I overreacted a bit. But as soon as I read the thread title I immediately started shaking my head.

I think he was agreeing with you.

Yeah, Konerko05 is right. It's absurd to think that moving Floyd to the bullpen serves some sort of purpose, at least at this point in time.

Floyd's struggling big time right now. As his track history seems to suggest, it appears to be all mental. Hopefully he can get it together and get back to 2008 form soon. If he doesn't...well, that's Ozzie's call.

I'm still struggling to see how someone who seems to be so mentally unstable (pitching-wise, anyway) benefits from being demoted to the bullpen.

JB98
05-11-2009, 11:38 PM
Maybe the Sox should have Floyd throw a batting practice session to his teammates. He'd probably regain confidence very quickly if he were allowed to pitch against Sox hitters.

The Sox hitters typically can't touch pitchers with ERAs over 7.

sunofgold
05-11-2009, 11:44 PM
Doesn't do Floyd or the team any good if he gives up 8 runs a start. Any starter who does that on a continuous basis is going to lose his job.

We do have two pitchers at AAA (Whisler and Torres) who are pitching well. You have to give them a chance if Floyd continues to struggle. Maybe one of them could pitch well for the White Sox if given the chance.

You have to put Floyd on alert and let him now that his job isn't guaranteed. This isn't much different from the Contreras situation. Floyd still can turn this around but he must do better quickly.

Frankfan4life
05-12-2009, 12:02 AM
Maybe Ozzie should let the batters pitch and the pitchers bat.

drewcifer
05-12-2009, 12:12 AM
Doesn't do Floyd or the team any good if he gives up 8 runs a start. Any starter who does that on a continuous basis is going to lose his job.

We do have two pitchers at AAA (Whisler and Torres) who are pitching well. You have to give them a chance if Floyd continues to struggle. Maybe one of them could pitch well for the White Sox if given the chance.

You have to put Floyd on alert and let him now that his job isn't guaranteed. This isn't much different from the Contreras situation. Floyd still can turn this around but he must do better quickly.

Totally agree. Good post. Everyone has to show up and play their best. Floyd has been dogging it. He's behind on all his hitters, he's not commanding, and he's showing that all the propeller heads were right with his unusual periphs last year posting high wins/bbs.

It's up to him to turn it around, if he can't, then find someone else who is motivated.

thomas35forever
05-12-2009, 12:15 AM
Just what we need. Another starter going to the 'pen.:rolleyes:

I wouldn't be comfortable with Carrasco or Broadway in the rotation at this point.

WhiteSox1989
05-12-2009, 06:09 AM
But when a pitcher is struggling you can't just put him in the bullpen.

White City
05-12-2009, 08:09 AM
How long before people start roasting Kenny for not trading him, but instead signing him to a deal?

Sockinchisox
05-12-2009, 08:23 AM
I expected Gavin to regress but I didn't expect him to fall apart like he has.

doublem23
05-12-2009, 08:39 AM
How long before people start roasting Kenny for not trading him, but instead signing him to a deal?

He signed him to a deal worth less than $15.5 M over 4 years. You can't be a good GM if you're scared to pull the trigger on something like that.

Britt Burns
05-12-2009, 09:46 AM
If we are going to have any shot at winning this year we need a productive Gavin. That isn't going to happen with him in the pen.

khan
05-12-2009, 09:57 AM
I too knew Floyd would regress. But to me, its his approach that's most worrisome:

Falling behind all too often, and not throwing Strike 1 first.
Nibbling at the corners when he DOES get ahead, instead of attacking the hitters, which leads to uneccessarily-high pitch counts.
Getting locked into a pattern, which leads to easily-hit pitches. [i.e. The one hit that the highly-craptacular Kelly Shoppach hit happended because Floyd INSISTED on throwing fastball after fastball until Shoppach finally got one he could handle.]
Walking too many ****ty hitters that one need not fear, and helping them out.
Again, being inefficient, and having to throw too many pitches to be able to extend his appearances, a la Rich Harden. [107 in 5 IP last night!]
THIS is an issue for this team. In a crappy division, I see it as possible that the team can compete with either of the #4 or #5 occasionally struggling. Heck, even with a crappy offense, this team [theoretically in this crappy division] could compete. I wasn't even that amped up about Contreras' struggles, to tell you the truth. But Floyd HAS to be good for this team to have any sort of prayer.

I mean, he's given up more hits than IP. He's only K'ed 31 while walking 21. He's GOT to figure this thing out, or this team has no chance of competing whatsoever.

Craig Grebeck
05-12-2009, 10:10 AM
With Gavin's terrible performance thus far, I checked Fangraphs to see if his velocity was down -- possibly portending some sort of injury, which would at least explain the return to his terrible control. Somewhat surprisingly, his velocity is up across the board (http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=3886&position=P#pitchtype). Perhaps he's overthrowing the ball?

My workload this term has prevented me from watching too many games, so I'm fairly ignorant and am solely going off of pitch data.

Daver or anyone else have anything on his mechanics?

sunofgold
05-17-2009, 01:37 PM
Today, Floyd is giving up the longball. His next start is against Pittsburgh. I would put him on warning for his next start against Pittsburgh.

If he cannot take care of the Pirates at home, I think that Floyd needs some time in the bullpen. Right now, it doesn't look like Floyd can pitch himself out of his bad streak.

WhiteSox5187
05-17-2009, 01:46 PM
Today, Floyd is giving up the longball. His next start is against Pittsburgh. I would put him on warning for his next start against Pittsburgh.

If he cannot take care of the Pirates at home, I think that Floyd needs some time in the bullpen. Right now, it doesn't look like Floyd can pitch himself out of his bad streak.

Who would take his place in the rotation? I think that one of Ozzie's great moves in 2007 was to let Floyd sit out there and take his beatings and figure it out as by that point the season was over. I think that went a ways towards helping his confidence. Unless we start turning it around and we are getting close to contending, or the offense comes around and we are now losing CLOSE games because of Floyd's performance (rather than just getting blown out of the water), I'm tempted to just leave him out there to figure it out. This is beginning to look like a lost season anyways.

WhiteSox1989
05-17-2009, 01:52 PM
Who would take his place in the rotation? I think that one of Ozzie's great moves in 2007 was to let Floyd sit out there and take his beatings and figure it out as by that point the season was over. I think that went a ways towards helping his confidence. Unless we start turning it around and we are getting close to contending, or the offense comes around and we are now losing CLOSE games because of Floyd's performance (rather than just getting blown out of the water), I'm tempted to just leave him out there to figure it out. This is beginning to look like a lost season anyways.

Exactly. I can't think of anyone I would want to take Floyd's place. And chances are anyone who does inside the Sox organization will be just as bad as Floyd. Like you said, the offense has not been much of a help anyway.

God, I am so disappointed in this team. During the off season I was so stoked about the offense, with all of the Josh Fields hype. My only concern was the starting rotation with Colon and Contreras. I had no idea Danks and Buehrle would be the only reliable starters at this point. And even Danks has been a little shaky.

Boondock Saint
05-17-2009, 01:56 PM
How could it ever be a good idea to demote a player that lives in his own head as much as Gavin does? Do you want him to just crumble completely?

sunofgold
05-17-2009, 02:08 PM
It doesn't build confidence when you are giving up a run an inning. Right now Floyd doesn't even look close to the pitcher his was last year. You never give up on him but put him in the bullpen to try to figure things out. I have no idea how a guy could regress so much in less than a year.

We have guys who could start in place of Floyd. Broadway has look good recently. And I have no problem giving Carrasco a chance. Carrasco has started in the past and has said that he wants to start again.

Yeah, both have done well in the bullpen, but they are coming into games when we are way behind. I would rather give them a chance at the beginning of the game to pitch well and at least keep up in the game. Somewhat wasteful to have guys pitching well in games that we are way behind.

Woofer
05-17-2009, 02:45 PM
There has to be something wrong with Gavin. Last year, he was flirting with no-hitters. He is not the same pitcher as last year. He looks like he is uncomfortable, and has lost all confidence in his stuff. Cooper really has his work cut out for him this year, this season is starting to go down the drain.

russ99
05-17-2009, 02:49 PM
There has to be something wrong with Gavin. Last year, he was flirting with no-hitters. He is not the same pitcher as last year. He looks like he is uncomfortable, and has lost all confidence in his stuff. Cooper really has his work cut out for him this year, this season is starting to go down the drain.

Well, that was the knock on him before the Sox got him, that he overthinks and takes bad outings to the next game.

All he needs is a good game to restore his confidence, and then he could build on that going forward. I'd hope Cooper would try a new approach for his next start.

And I'd go with Broadway for the next time we need a 5th guy. He's shown me enough this year to deserve a shot.

sunofgold
05-20-2009, 12:51 AM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-20-white-sox-bits-chicago-may20,0,4699359.story


then Floyd might go to bullpen. He is out of options. I hope that this give Floyd a lot of incentive to pitch better. If he doesn't, we might have other options. If he does, we might have an extra starter.

BA was impressed by Contreras' pitching. Now, I want BA to also be impressed by Floyd's pitching.

DumpJerry
05-20-2009, 12:55 AM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-20-white-sox-bits-chicago-may20,0,4699359.story


then Floyd might go to bullpen. He is out of options. I hope that this give Floyd a lot of incentive to pitch better. If he doesn't, we might have other options. If he does, we might have an extra starter.

BA was impressed by Contreras' pitching. Now, I want BA to also be impressed by Floyd's pitching.
It sounds like Lillibridge got the strongest message......

OmarLittle
05-21-2009, 01:34 PM
Maybe last year was a just a fluke.