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CashMan
05-01-2009, 08:52 PM
Someone needs to tell him, you are hitting #2 this year so stop swinging for the god damn fences! It seems like EVERY SO, he is swinging to hit a home run.

oeo
05-01-2009, 08:57 PM
Someone needs to tell him, you are hitting #2 this year so stop swinging for the god damn fences! It seems like EVERY SO, he is swinging to hit a home run.

Key words of the whole post are 'seems like.' It 'seems like' to me that he's in the middle of a rough patch.

WhiteSox5187
05-02-2009, 01:41 AM
Key words of the whole post are 'seems like.' It 'seems like' to me that he's in the middle of a rough patch.

That is certainly the case, but I am thinking that with Getz back, Fields might snap out of it. If Getz can keep getting on, that SHOULD mean Fields sees more fastballs which he can handle.

soxfan43
05-02-2009, 01:48 AM
While I like Josh and think he's doing a pretty good job in the 2 hole, let's not forget he is/was a power hitter.

delben91
05-02-2009, 08:10 AM
Release him.

doublem23
05-02-2009, 08:11 AM
Release him.

Agreed. Now, if we can get Crede back from the Twins, Rowand and Uribe from the Giants, and Tadahito from whatever team he's playing for in Japan, I think we've got a real shot at this thing.

delben91
05-02-2009, 08:14 AM
Agreed. Now, if we can get Crede back from the Twins, Rowand and Uribe from the Giants, and Tadahito from whatever team he's playing for in Japan, I think we've got a real shot at this thing.

I'm really dying for a POTW. Was hoping my insight above would've done the trick...

:(:

TomBradley72
05-02-2009, 08:51 AM
He swung at a first pitch last night that was on the inside corner to begin with then came in further on his hands..definitely in a rough patch...but he's also clearly not a #2 hitter...too many strike outs.

Maybe Pods/Getz at the top of the line up with Fields moving to a slot at the bottom of the order? Lillibridge replaces Pods vs. LHs?

pdimas
05-02-2009, 08:58 AM
First pitch swinging yaaaayyyyyy!!!! :angry:

That just frustrated the hell out of me. Take a few for crying out loud. Especially after Getz got a few balls and worked the count full before you. Not to mention we were making their pitcher look like an all star. Get his damned pitch count up

BadBobbyJenks
05-02-2009, 09:23 AM
Why is he still even on the roster!?!?!?!?! Bring back Crede! Damn him and his on base percentage that is better than Dye and Thome.

BainesHOF
05-02-2009, 09:33 AM
I think the No. 2 slot might be screwing up Fields. I'd like to take the pressure off him by moving him to the bottom of the order.

TomBradley72
05-02-2009, 09:47 AM
Why is he still even on the roster!?!?!?!?! Bring back Crede! Damn him and his on base percentage that is better than Dye and Thome.

No one is saying he sucks....he just doesn't belong in the #2 slot.

tick53
05-02-2009, 10:00 AM
I think the No. 2 slot might be screwing up Fields. I'd like to take the pressure off him by moving him to the bottom of the order.

That might help. Maybe put AJ back to batting second again. He handled it pretty well last season. I'm sure Josh will work out his problem. I hope Alexei does the same.

BadBobbyJenks
05-02-2009, 10:05 AM
No one is saying he sucks....he just doesn't belong in the #2 slot.

He is getting on base. What are the other options? AJ? He is more of a free swinger and doesnt run well. Alexei? No. The only option is Pods leading off and Getz in the two hole. But do you expect that to work?

Daver
05-02-2009, 10:09 AM
He is getting on base. What are the other options? AJ? He is more of a free swinger and doesnt run well. Alexei? No. The only option is Pods leading off and Getz in the two hole. But do you expect that to work?

Until Scott was brought up AJ was the best baserunner on the team.

BadBobbyJenks
05-02-2009, 10:27 AM
Until Scott was brought up AJ was the best baserunner on the team.

True, I was just refering to his speed or lack there of.

DonnieDarko
05-02-2009, 10:27 AM
I can accept that Fields is in the middle of a slump right now.

...but what kind of slump has you late on EVERY ****ING FASTBALL THROWN AT YOU?!

Shoeless
05-02-2009, 10:32 AM
http://a.espncdn.com/i/headshots/mlb/players/65/4250.jpg

You could have me...with my .212 batting average and a sub .300 OBP

voodoochile
05-02-2009, 10:33 AM
No one is saying he sucks....he just doesn't belong in the #2 slot.

He's already walked 11 times this year - more than anyone else on the team to date. That leads to him having a .356 OBP and having scored 12 runs (tied with Dye for second on the team). Of the other options to date (AJ, BA, TCM) he's clearly been the best option and barring a major Pods resurgence or a major fall off by Fields, he will probably remain so.

thedudeabides
05-02-2009, 11:44 AM
He's already walked 11 times this year - more than anyone else on the team to date. That leads to him having a .356 OBP and having scored 12 runs (tied with Dye for second on the team). Of the other options to date (AJ, BA, TCM) he's clearly been the best option and barring a major Pods resurgence or a major fall off by Fields, he will probably remain so.

And just forget the two out hit he had to keep the inning alive that eventually led to Thome's game tying double.

All anybody around here wanted all offseason was someone who got on base in the 2 spot, which he is doing. (AJ seems to be his popular replacement at the 2 spot, and he has a .286 OBP) He's drawing walks and has had some important hits, not to mention an improved approach at the plate. But, that's not good enough because he is striking out.

This board is impossible to please.

BleacherBandit
05-02-2009, 11:56 AM
Just because he's in a slump doesn't mean you have to move him down. Wait for him to get his stride back. Him and Getz were looking promising as our first two hitters before Getz got hurt. You can't break up something before it has a chance.

cws05champ
05-02-2009, 12:19 PM
I can accept that Fields is in the middle of a slump right now.

...but what kind of slump has you late on EVERY ****ING FASTBALL THROWN AT YOU?!

One that has you in between and looking for breaking stuff instead of looking fastball and adjusting to offspeed. I don't see him pull hitting looking for the fences every time. He's trying to put a hard charge on the ball and looks to be trying to go up the middle more than just pulling the ball.

voodoochile
05-02-2009, 12:57 PM
One that has you in between and looking for breaking stuff instead of looking fastball and adjusting to offspeed. I don't see him pull hitting looking for the fences every time. He's trying to put a hard charge on the ball and looks to be trying to go up the middle more than just pulling the ball.


I think he's also making a conscious effort to go to RF so some of the late swings are on purpose, IMO.

LoveYourSuit
05-02-2009, 01:27 PM
I think the guys on the top have done more than an acceptable job at the 1 & 2, based on my expectations.


If 3-4-5-6 start hitting, as they should, we would be fine and people would not be bitching about a slump here and there by Fiels or Getz. Paulie is the only one who has been consistant with RISP.

DonnieDarko
05-02-2009, 01:47 PM
One that has you in between and looking for breaking stuff instead of looking fastball and adjusting to offspeed. I don't see him pull hitting looking for the fences every time. He's trying to put a hard charge on the ball and looks to be trying to go up the middle more than just pulling the ball.

However true that may be...it's still hella frustrating to see Fields at the plate lately for the most part. It really is. -_- I REALLY want him to do well, but he's not doing so well thusfar. What's going on that's different from earlier in the year? Is he doing something different, or are pitchers just handling him differently? I mean, besides trying to put a hard charge into the ball--not always swinging for the fences.

chisox77
05-02-2009, 03:04 PM
Overall, I think Fields has performed very well. He has also played a very respectable 3B, and as a hitter, he will get into a groove, although as stated in this thread, Fields has done well at the plate. I agree.

soxinem1
05-03-2009, 01:49 PM
Nobody is ever pleased here.

True, Fields is not a real #2 hitter, but an OBP of nearly .360, some clutch hits and RBI, and drawing some walks means something. What else can he do? He has been a swinger his whole career and now he has to protect runners.

At least his K rate is making fewer outs than AJ and his 6-4-3 or 4-6-3 DP's.

Why are people suggesting Lillibridge? He's whiffing more and has no clue with the stick.

And Getz should stay at leadoff. He is hitting LHP, RHP, starting to drive the ball, making contact, etc. Let him be.

jabrch
05-03-2009, 02:24 PM
Agreed. Now, if we can get Crede back from the Twins, Rowand and Uribe from the Giants, and Tadahito from whatever team he's playing for in Japan, I think we've got a real shot at this thing.

Can someone explain to me who you are mocking when you say that? I don't hear anyone proposing this **** seriously - only people mocking a group of people who exist only in the same universe at the BA-Haters?

Nobody is proposing we "reunite the band" - why do people mock a non-existant group of people?

jabrch
05-03-2009, 02:27 PM
First pitch swinging yaaaayyyyyy!!!! :angry:


The first pitch strike is usually the best pitch you will see in an AB if you don't do something with it. Swinging at a 1st pitch ball is bad. But taking a first pitch strike, just to take a pitch, is not a great approach for many hitters who can't hit well from behind in the count.

oeo
05-03-2009, 02:32 PM
Until Scott was brought up AJ was the best baserunner on the team.

I still need to see more, but I'm close to putting Getz up there.

kittle42
05-03-2009, 04:37 PM
Can someone explain to me who you are mocking when you say that? I don't hear anyone proposing this **** seriously - only people mocking a group of people who exist only in the same universe at the BA-Haters?

Nobody is proposing we "reunite the band" - why do people mock a non-existant group of people?

It's because there are bits and pieces of that argument here and there. At some point, it's been suggested to bring back Rowand, Iguchi, Pods, etc.

voodoochile
05-03-2009, 05:15 PM
It's because there are bits and pieces of that argument here and there. At some point, it's been suggested to bring back Rowand, Iguchi, Pods, etc.

Maybe because people saw holes that needed filling at that time and had memories of these players doing well at those positions at some time in the not so distant past.

It's not about 2005, it's about having solid veterans to fill gaps that need filling. Maybe those guys aren't as good as they were in 2005, but that doesn't mean they completely suck either...

jabrch
05-03-2009, 11:07 PM
It's because there are bits and pieces of that argument here and there. At some point, it's been suggested to bring back Rowand, Iguchi, Pods, etc.


I don't buy it...I have not seen any evidence of the existence of people who want to reunite the 2005 team. I see evidence of people who want to better the 2009 Chicago White Sox team in any way possible.

Of course we could use Aaron Rowand. Anyone who pays any attention to this team would realize that. I never heard any mass support for bringing back Pods or Iguchi - despite having no proven answer for 2B in either of the past two seasons.

Insulting the people who want to reunite the 2005 team feels like insulting the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy and the BA-Haters. None of them exist - and are a figment of people's imaginations.

WhiteSox5187
05-04-2009, 12:45 AM
I thought that Fields looked a bit lost up there tonight. I really think it's time to move AJ up to the two hole and put Fields down in the order. I think he's starting to think at the plate and as Yogi Berra said, you can't hit and think at the same time!

peelwonder
05-04-2009, 12:54 PM
All I have to say is 28 K's.......only 86 AB's........

Why in the hell does Ozzie have him in the 2 hole?

He's on pace for 189 K's......Let's put that in perspective....Nellie Fox struck out 216 times in his entire Career.....

LoveYourSuit
05-04-2009, 01:03 PM
All I have to say is 28 K's.......only 86 AB's........

Why in the hell does Ozzie have him in the 2 hole?

He's on pace for 189 K's......Let's put that in perspective....Nellie Fox struck out 216 times in his entire Career.....


I thought he was doing fine until this past week. Worst part is that now his bad ABs have gone out to the field with bad glove work.

They have to move him down to get the pressure of him. Problem is, who moves up?

Alexei should have been there by now but he is more ****ed up that Josh to begin with.

JohnTucker0814
05-04-2009, 01:06 PM
I thought he was doing fine until this past week. Worst part is that now his bad ABs have gone out to the field with bad glove work.

They have to move him down to get the pressure of him. Problem is, who moves up?

Alexei should have been there by now but he is more ****ed up that Josh to begin with.

Time to move Alexei to CF with Anderson on the DL... Getz at 2b, Nix at SS and there is your 1-2 in the order. Solves the problem until Anderson comes back because he seemed to be turning it on... but worry about that problem when he comes back.

jabrch
05-04-2009, 01:12 PM
Let's put that in perspective....Nellie Fox struck out 216 times in his entire Career.....

Comparing a slugging near-rookie to Nellie Fox is your idea of perspective?

Yikes!

kittle42
05-04-2009, 01:36 PM
If Nix has a couple more hits tonight, people will start advocating trading Beckham, since our IF problems will be solved for years!

WhiteSox5187
05-04-2009, 01:45 PM
I thought he was doing fine until this past week. Worst part is that now his bad ABs have gone out to the field with bad glove work.

They have to move him down to get the pressure of him. Problem is, who moves up?

Alexei should have been there by now but he is more ****ed up that Josh to begin with.
AJ. He's a good two hole hitter.

LoveYourSuit
05-04-2009, 01:49 PM
AJ. He's a good two hole hitter.

I disagree.


AJ was forced on there because of Swisher's failures but he is not suited for a 2 hole hitter.

peelwonder
05-04-2009, 01:51 PM
Comparing a slugging near-rookie to Nellie Fox is your idea of perspective?

Yikes!


No...the strikeouts were what was prospective....

I want the guy to succeed as much as the next person but let's face it.....He's just not that good and he won't ever be.

kittle42
05-04-2009, 02:01 PM
No...the strikeouts were what was prospective....

I want the guy to succeed as much as the next person but let's face it.....He's just not that good and he won't ever be.

He's not nearly as good at K ratio as Hall-of-Famer and widely-regarded "one of the hardest to strike out in history" hitters Nellie Fox? No way!

voodoochile
05-04-2009, 02:40 PM
And Fields continues to reach base at least once a game generally. He's reached base in every game except for two in Baltimore this year. That's what you want from a top of the order guy. The K's suck, but it's to be expected with more patience too. He's taking more walks than he ever has before too, so until his OBP starts to seriously drop, I'd leave him alone and hope he figures it out.

Everyone wants to fix the Sox. It's May 3rd and they are .500 with a bunch of injuries and 1.5 games out of first. It's a bit early to be trying to "fix the team"

KenBerryGrab
05-04-2009, 02:54 PM
Fields, strikeouts and all, is more suited to No. 2 than AJ, who swings at the first pitch far too often for a 2 hitter.

doublem23
05-04-2009, 03:04 PM
No...the strikeouts were what was prospective....

I want the guy to succeed as much as the next person but let's face it.....He's just not that good and he won't ever be.

:scratch:

Fields has been fine. Yeah, he strikes out a lot but that's just the way the game is today. Tadahito, whom everyone generally agrees was a great #2 hitter for the Sox in 2005, struck out 114 times that year. So comparing him to Nellie Fox is a just ridiculous. P.S., Nellie's career OBP was .348. Josh's current OBP is .354. He's doing fine.

jabrch
05-04-2009, 03:13 PM
No...the strikeouts were what was prospective....

I want the guy to succeed as much as the next person but let's face it.....He's just not that good and he won't ever be.


It is only monday, but congrats. You are the leader in the clubhouse for SPOTW.

1) Strikeouts are worse than groundouts why?

2) His OBP and Avg are OK.

3) He's played good D for Josh.

Want to complain about Josh Fields? Go ahead and complain about his lack of power. But to compare him to one of the greatest contact hitters of all time, and to call that perspective, is complete lunacy. They to conclude he won't ever be "all that good" is stupidity.

Perspective? My ass.

Nellie_Fox
05-04-2009, 03:18 PM
Strikeouts are worse than groundouts why? Because ground outs can advance runners; strikeouts don't accomplish anything. Put the ball in play and good things can happen.

oeo
05-04-2009, 03:19 PM
Because ground outs can advance runners; strikeouts don't accomplish anything. Put the ball in play and good things can happen.

Bad things can also happen, i.e., one pitch AB's, double plays, etc.

Nellie_Fox
05-04-2009, 03:28 PM
Bad things can also happen, i.e., one pitch AB's, double plays, etc.The good things far outweigh the bad when you put the ball in play. The ball can get through. There can be an error. A runner can move up, maybe score. And your "etc." indicates that there are more. What are they?

Strikeouts suck.

oeo
05-04-2009, 03:39 PM
The good things far outweigh the bad when you put the ball in play. The ball can get through. There can be an error. A runner can move up, maybe score. And your "etc." indicates that there are more. What are they?

Strikeouts suck.

Actually, there shouldn't have been an "etc."

Anyways, I thought the discussion was about strikeouts vs. groundouts, not ground balls. An out is an out. You could ground out and advance the runner, you could also ground into a double play. Not only that, at least a strike out is going to take at least three pitches (likely more), while you could be racking up two outs on one pitch with a groundout.

And I disagree that strikeouts accomplish nothing. Sure, if you go up there and three pitches, you're gone...that accomplishes very little. However, you could strike out after a 10 pitch AB, which in today's game, those 10 pitches mean a lot.

Nellie_Fox
05-04-2009, 03:45 PM
...I thought the discussion was about strikeouts vs. groundouts, not ground balls. An out is an out.But that was a false dichotomy. The original poster did not mention groundouts, only that strikeouts are bad. Jabrch erected the straw man of strikeouts vs. groundouts. The true dichotomy is strikeout vs. putting the ball in play, because those are the two things that can happen when you swing the bat, and a grounder is vastly preferable to a strikeout.

Noneck
05-04-2009, 04:04 PM
But that was a false dichotomy. The original poster did not mention groundouts, only that strikeouts are bad. Jabrch erected the straw man of strikeouts vs. groundouts. The true dichotomy is strikeout vs. putting the ball in play, because those are the two things that can happen when you swing the bat, and a grounder is vastly preferable to a strikeout.

I am kind of amazed how anyone could imagine that someone that keeps the ball in play could be worse than someone that strikes out. This is one of the main reasons why Nellie is in the Hall. I am impressed with your patience, Prof.

oeo
05-04-2009, 04:05 PM
I am kind of amazed how anyone could imagine that someone that keeps the ball in play could be worse than someone that strikes out. This is one of the main reasons why Nellie is in the Hall. I am impressed your patience, Prof.

Not that it's worse, just that striking out is not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Especially in today's game, where pitch counts are a major factor in the game's outcome.

jabrch
05-04-2009, 04:11 PM
But that was a false dichotomy. The original poster did not mention groundouts, only that strikeouts are bad. Jabrch erected the straw man of strikeouts vs. groundouts. The true dichotomy is strikeout vs. putting the ball in play, because those are the two things that can happen when you swing the bat, and a grounder is vastly preferable to a strikeout.

Nellie - an out is an out.

Let's compare - outs to hits - that's fine. But to segment Fields Ks from his GOs and compare him to Nellie Fox because Nellie didn't strike out as much as Fields does is horrendous logic.

The true dichotomy is not K vs ball in play. That implies that there is only one "true" dichotomy here. K vs GO is a fair comparison. So his hits to outs. So are many other comparisons.

Sure - good things happen when you make contact. But good things also happen when you don't (walks) so if you are going to compare Ks to GOs, you actually need to compare K+BB to GO+H to give him credit for things that can and do happen if "contact" is what you are saying is good.

You are taking the point way out of context Nellie. I'm not taking the position that Fields is anywhere close to the player that Fox was. I'm saying that using "contact" to bash a young kid, by comparing him to one of the greatest contact hitters ever is a bad arguement. (and that's not even mentioning that Fields OBP of .354 compares favorable to many, including Nellie's career .348)

jabrch
05-04-2009, 04:13 PM
Because ground outs can advance runners; strikeouts don't accomplish anything. Put the ball in play and good things can happen.

Get hits and good things happen. Sacrifice, and less good things happen. Let's look at those outcomes individually. And let's look at their probability also.

Don't tell me you believe it is a legitimate arguement to compare Josh Fields to Nellie Fox and call that "Prospective" in evaluating Fields. You can't be serious. That's not prospective - that's horse****.

Noneck
05-04-2009, 04:21 PM
Not that it's worse, just that striking out is not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Especially in today's game, where pitch counts are a major factor in the game's outcome.

I was referring to the poster that stated

1) Strikeouts are worse than groundouts why?

I know an out is an out and a groundout could turn out to be worse than a strikeout, but that is not the point, unless we all know the final outcome after someone hits the ball. The chances of something good happening after someone hits the ball far outweighs something good happening after a strikeout. (pitch count and pass ball after a strikeout)

Nellie_Fox
05-05-2009, 12:07 AM
I was not at all agreeing with comparing him to Nellie (although your comparing Fields' OBP over less than one total season to Nellie's career OBP is certainly not fair, either.) Just to the idea that the out is inevitable, and it doesn't matter whether it's a K or a groundout. If you reduce your K's by 50 a year, those 50 plate appearances won't all be other kinds of outs. Some will be walks. Some will be balls put in play, which can then result in an unproductive out, an out that advances a runner, a hit, or an error. The net result of those 50 plate appearances will be a vast improvement over 50 K's. Ergo, a high strikeout total is a bad thing.

WhiteSox5187
05-05-2009, 12:16 AM
Nellie - an out is an out.

Let's compare - outs to hits - that's fine. But to segment Fields Ks from his GOs and compare him to Nellie Fox because Nellie didn't strike out as much as Fields does is horrendous logic.

The true dichotomy is not K vs ball in play. That implies that there is only one "true" dichotomy here. K vs GO is a fair comparison. So his hits to outs. So are many other comparisons.

Sure - good things happen when you make contact. But good things also happen when you don't (walks) so if you are going to compare Ks to GOs, you actually need to compare K+BB to GO+H to give him credit for things that can and do happen if "contact" is what you are saying is good.

You are taking the point way out of context Nellie. I'm not taking the position that Fields is anywhere close to the player that Fox was. I'm saying that using "contact" to bash a young kid, by comparing him to one of the greatest contact hitters ever is a bad arguement. (and that's not even mentioning that Fields OBP of .354 compares favorable to many, including Nellie's career .348)
Yes but a groundout can be productive, a ground out to the right side with a runner on second and no outs moves the runner over to third where a ground ball to short or second (assuming the IF is not playing in) can bring in that runner. Outs by putting the ball in play can at times be productive. A strike out is almost never productive (unless of course AJ is at the plate and Josh Paul rolls the ball back to the pitcher after a dropped third strike :cool:)

Eddo144
05-05-2009, 12:08 PM
Yes but a groundout can be productive, a ground out to the right side with a runner on second and no outs moves the runner over to third where a ground ball to short or second (assuming the IF is not playing in) can bring in that runner. Outs by putting the ball in play can at times be productive. A strike out is almost never productive (unless of course AJ is at the plate and Josh Paul rolls the ball back to the pitcher after a dropped third strike :cool:)
There's two separate arguments here:

1) Groundouts vs strikeouts: yes, the occasional groundout can move a runner over, but groundouts can also result in double plays. The negative impact of that second out is much greater than the positive impact of another runner moving up one base. Strikeouts can only result in two outs if a runner is caught stealing, but that's not the hitter's fault, now is it?

So in this argument, I'll side that strikeouts are the preferred out type.

2) Contact vs strikeouts: here, Nellie is right. Making contact is better than striking out, provided your contact results in you getting on base.

Strikeouts are not the issue with Fields. Sure, he strikes out a lot, but overall, he doesn't make that many outs (as evidenced by his .350+ OBP). In front of Quentin, Dye, and company, I'd rather have a guy making fewer outs than one who makes more "productive" outs.

Paulwny
05-05-2009, 12:53 PM
Early in the game, infield playing back, runner at third, less than 2 outs, would you prefer a ground out or a strike out ?
Without putting a ball in play you never score.

jabrch
05-05-2009, 01:04 PM
I was not at all agreeing with comparing him to Nellie (although your comparing Fields' OBP over less than one total season to Nellie's career OBP is certainly not fair, either.) Just to the idea that the out is inevitable, and it doesn't matter whether it's a K or a groundout. If you reduce your K's by 50 a year, those 50 plate appearances won't all be other kinds of outs. Some will be walks. Some will be balls put in play, which can then result in an unproductive out, an out that advances a runner, a hit, or an error. The net result of those 50 plate appearances will be a vast improvement over 50 K's. Ergo, a high strikeout total is a bad thing.

I don't think we are disagreeing on much here. Feels quite like semantics.

If you reduce your OUTS by 50 a year, great. If you reduce your Ks by 50, that's a different question. What do you replace them with? If you replace them with 50 weak GOs to the pitcher, then it is of no value. If you start to make weak contact instead of walking, then it is of no value.

My point is that the initial poster comparing Fields to Nelli by saying Nellie didn't strike out and Fields did and calling that prospective was completely lacking in perspective.

Past that, hitters need evaluating based on the complete results set of their performances. Using a single number or a single statistic isn't either productive or does it have "prospective".

35th and Shields
05-05-2009, 01:05 PM
Early in the game, infield playing back, runner at third, less than 2 outs, would you prefer a ground out or a strike out ?
Without putting a ball in play you never score.

That's really not the argument here.

Eddo144
05-05-2009, 01:14 PM
Early in the game, infield playing back, runner at third, less than 2 outs, would you prefer a ground out or a strike out ?
Without putting a ball in play you never score.
Early in the game, infield playing back, runner at first, less than two outs, would you prefer a ground out or strike out?

This is a much more common scenario (runner on first instead of third), and a groundout has a pretty good chance of resulting in a double play.