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View Full Version : *Official* Teacup strikezone helps sink Sox; Rays trip Thornton at the Trop, 6-5


Frater Perdurabo
04-17-2009, 09:25 PM
Bloviate here

Hartman
04-17-2009, 09:25 PM
I'm not blaming this one on the umps.

DaveFeelsRight
04-17-2009, 09:25 PM
i liked what i saw from lillibridge in the 9th but other than that, this was a heartbreaker.

BadBobbyJenks
04-17-2009, 09:26 PM
Zobrist Really?

oeo
04-17-2009, 09:26 PM
CB Buckner and a bad outing by Matt Thornton = 4 runs. :whiner:

Rohan
04-17-2009, 09:26 PM
Such a heart breaker...

Frater Perdurabo
04-17-2009, 09:27 PM
I'm not blaming this one on the umps.

The Sox alone are responsible.

Thornton should have pitched better in the sixth, so there are no excuses. But it is a possible explanation that he wasn't comfortable coming into the sixth.

The tiny and inconsistent strike zone certainly did not help.

DaveFeelsRight
04-17-2009, 09:27 PM
it would be 5-5 going into the bottom of the 9th if pena didn't hit that HR. he was out 2 pitches before that.

Hartman
04-17-2009, 09:28 PM
Should be: Matt Thornton really?

Frater Perdurabo
04-17-2009, 09:28 PM
It's his third career grand slam. :o:

JB98
04-17-2009, 09:29 PM
Tough loss. Thornton has been good for us, but he screwed the pooch tonight.

Keep battling and find another couple wins on this road trip. We'll be OK.

Hartman
04-17-2009, 09:29 PM
it would be 5-5 going into the bottom of the 9th if pena didn't hit that HR. he was out 2 pitches before that.

And it would have been 5-2 had Thornton not served up that meatball. What's your point?

Frater Perdurabo
04-17-2009, 09:30 PM
Tough loss. Thornton has been good for us, but he screwed the pooch tonight.

Keep battling and find another couple wins on this road trip. We'll be OK.

I guess. It's hard to win games in the Trop, against the defending AL champs.

But it's even harder for us fans to deal with losing winnable games.

JermaineDye05
04-17-2009, 09:31 PM
Really tough one. A couple things I've noticed from Getz that have me a bit concerned. I've seen this multiple times at the plate and in the field. He seems to have little confidence at certain times, I've rarely seen him turn it loose on 2-0, 3-0, 3-1 counts. Many times, like tonight, he takes pitches right down the middle in hopes of getting the walk. I'd like to see Chris be a little more aggressive at the plate, especially when the pitches are right there. Also, the play in the 6th when he dove. It was a great stop, however I didn't like that he didn't go for the out at first and instead just held onto the ball. Burrell isn't that fast of a runner and if Getz recovers quickly and makes a throw, he probably gets the out or at least makes it close. I don't know if he had a brain cramp or if he just didn't trust his arm (he also could have not really had a play but I didn't see where Burrell was when he made the stop). His defense has been fine it's just that I question some of the decision he makes on the field, that's all. We are only 10 games in though so I'm not condemming him yet, I'm just a bit concerned.

BadBobbyJenks
04-17-2009, 09:32 PM
Ump had nothing to do with this one. Thornton served up a fast ball and got beat. Life goes on.

Great outing by Clayton tonight at least and I love what I have seen from Bartolo so far.

JB98
04-17-2009, 09:35 PM
I guess. It's hard to win games in the Trop, against the defending AL champs.

But it's even harder for us fans to deal with losing winnable games.

It's a tough loss, but we are competing well in this series against a tough team. I would rather play the Rays at home, on grass, on a slower track. This is a difficult matchup for us in that dome.

I'll be delighted if the Sox take one of the next two and get out of there with a split. It will take nine innings of solid pitching. We gotta stay away from that one bad inning.

soxfan21
04-17-2009, 09:37 PM
Still couldn't get it going with guys in scoring position. Oh well, hopefully we come back and get them tomorrow even though the game is on WGN, which makes me worried.

...
04-17-2009, 09:38 PM
Ump had nothing to do with this one. Thornton served up a fast ball and got beat. Life goes on.

Great outing by Clayton tonight at least and I love what I have seen from Bartolo so far.

You're ****ing high.

Soxman219
04-17-2009, 09:40 PM
No big deal, I rather lose winnable games early in the season rather than later. We know we can beat Tampa, just get the job done tomorrow.

Viva Medias B's
04-17-2009, 09:41 PM
I'm not blaming this one on the umps.

I just got back from work and, hence, did not see or hear the game. However, a team generally has to learn how to play over calls by the men in blue. Meanwhile, of our five losses, I think two or three of them should have been wins including this one tonight. If we can just consistently put it together more often than we are at the moment, we can be virtually lights out.

BadBobbyJenks
04-17-2009, 09:42 PM
You're ****ing high.

Enlighten me.

chisox77
04-17-2009, 09:50 PM
Tough loss tonight. Need to get one of these last two in the series. An overall split would be fine, then go on to Baltimore. But that doesn't mean winning the next two is not possible. That would be nice. The White Sox have the top of the rotation going into the weekend.

SoxGirl4Life
04-17-2009, 09:52 PM
I'm surprised this thread isn't 12 pages long already

Viva Medias B's
04-17-2009, 09:54 PM
I'm surprised this thread isn't 12 pages long already

Also, the postgame show doesn't seem wacked out tonight.

DaveFeelsRight
04-17-2009, 09:56 PM
i think it's because even though this was a tough one to lose, there are positives.

JermaineDye05
04-17-2009, 09:57 PM
Also, the postgame show doesn't seem wacked out tonight.

I'm surprised this thread isn't 12 pages long already


BREAKING NEWS: 95% of Sox fans jump off a cliff after the White Sox season was decided in 1 inning.

Lip Man 1
04-17-2009, 09:57 PM
Agreed...another one that slipped away.

Interesting stat (again) this evening... Sox were 2 of 9 with runners in scoring position and got three of their five runs off the home run.

I don't know, maybe it's become a mental issue after last season, (with guys on base in scoring position) maybe they tense up and lose focus...I'm just guessing here.

I simply don't know what's happened to things like plate discipline, taking pitches, trying to hit the other way with these guys.

Is it the players?, is it the hitting coach?...I have no answers on this.

Lip

MarkZ35
04-17-2009, 09:59 PM
You can't blame it on the umps when the strike zone was tiny for both teams. The break down came in the 6th inning and the strike zone was already known by then.

SoxGirl4Life
04-17-2009, 10:02 PM
i think it's because even though this was a tough one to lose, there are positives.

I agree.

It's Dankerific
04-17-2009, 10:02 PM
i think its a friday night..

SoxGirl4Life
04-17-2009, 10:03 PM
BREAKING NEWS: 95% of Sox fans jump off a cliff after the White Sox season was decided in 1 inning.

I'd believe it with some over-reactions I've seen lately.

Viva Medias B's
04-17-2009, 10:05 PM
i think its a friday night..

That loss to Minnesota that led to the epic postgame show took place on a Friday night too.

cws05champ
04-17-2009, 10:22 PM
Agreed...another one that slipped away.

Interesting stat (again) this evening... Sox were 2 of 9 with runners in scoring position and got three of their five runs off the home run.

I don't know, maybe it's become a mental issue after last season, (with guys on base in scoring position) maybe they tense up and lose focus...I'm just guessing here.

I simply don't know what's happened to things like plate discipline, taking pitches, trying to hit the other way with these guys.

Is it the players?, is it the hitting coach?...I have no answers on this.

Lip
Yeah, but on a couple of these it was just outstanding defensive plays by the Rays. Pena's diving stop on Getz and Longoria's grab on Fields. I think it is a weakness and a bit of a concern but it's still early.

Lip Man 1
04-17-2009, 10:38 PM
CWS:

Agreed, it is early but the early results seem to show a lot like last year and the year before and so forth.

We'll see.

I know that Ozzie and Kenny talked a lot about how things were going to be different on the team this year...better speed, better base running, more hitting the other way and so forth.

Well the numbers so far show the Sox have scored 42 runs in 10 games. 20 of those (almost 50%) have come directly because of the home run, that seems to be on par with the splits for this club since 2006.

Maybe things will start to change but I have a hard time believing that it will especially with guys in scoring position.

Lip

Red Barchetta
04-17-2009, 11:22 PM
it would be 5-5 going into the bottom of the 9th if pena didn't hit that HR. he was out 2 pitches before that.

I was at the game tonight. I agree this was a key point in the game. After Pena hit a 425 ft. foul ball Colon came back with a fastball down the middle that Pena hit 410 ft. to dead center for a HR. Man! :angry:

Jerksticks
04-18-2009, 12:45 AM
It's not so bad: Angels gave up 7 runs in the bottom of the 8th to lose. Haha weak ass 05 ALCS opponent.

Anybody else think we were gonna get double grand-slammed when Richard came in?

DSpivack
04-18-2009, 02:13 AM
It's not so bad: Angels gave up 7 runs in the bottom of the 8th to lose. Haha weak ass 05 ALCS opponent.

Anybody else think we were gonna get double grand-slammed when Richard came in?

It's not so bad because the Twins came back after being down big? :scratch:

ms620
04-18-2009, 05:41 AM
I think there are some positives to take out of this game. I like the way Colon has pitched. BA and Getz looked MUCH MUCH better at the plate. It is not just about the results, but also the approach. Lillibridge looks like a great base stealer. Clayton had a nice rebound effort. Out big bats are swinging pretty well so far. The season is still early, and there will be more tough losses. But so far I am real excited about the potential of this team.

Madscout
04-18-2009, 06:21 AM
I gotta put this on Colon and Thorton. If Colon doesn't start walking guys, and if Thorton threw anything besides 3 straight fastballs, then I think we avoid the disaster that was the 6th. Our guys scored 5 runs, and on most nights, that should be enough.

thedudeabides
04-18-2009, 07:12 AM
I gotta put this on Colon and Thorton. If Colon doesn't start walking guys, and if Thorton threw anything besides 3 straight fastballs, then I think we avoid the disaster that was the 6th. Our guys scored 5 runs, and on most nights, that should be enough.

When Colon lost it last night, he lost it fast. He looked to be cruising up until that point. When he loses his control you know he's done. Not much you can say about Thornton, he just didn't have it last night. There will be nights like that for every pitcher, it was just an unfortunate situation for Matt to have one of those nights.

I still feel good that they're 1-1 in those first two games. Both of those games could have gone either way. They just need to pick up 1 of the next 2 and get the hell out of that dump. That place is really turning into ****-dome II for the Sox.

SOXfnNlansing
04-18-2009, 07:13 AM
That game sucked to watch unfold. I'm just glad we somehow won Thursday's game.

LITTLE NELL
04-18-2009, 07:19 AM
No matter what you will win a third of your games and lose a third of your games. Last nights game is in the other category, a game you should have won, that you need to have to win a division.

jabrch
04-18-2009, 07:19 AM
Zobrist got us. Oh well.

Move on.

jabrch
04-18-2009, 07:31 AM
. Last nights game is in the other category, a game you should have won, that you need to have to win a division.

Isn't that a bit of an exaggeration?

You can easily win a division without having won last night's game.

LITTLE NELL
04-18-2009, 07:36 AM
No matter what you will win a third of your games and lose a third of your games. Last nights game is in the other category, a game you should have won, that you need to have to win a division.

Isn't that a bit of an exaggeration?

You can easily win a division without having won last night's game.
It was a generalization, point being that you need to win games like last night to have a successful season.

southside rocks
04-18-2009, 07:43 AM
I think there are some positives to take out of this game. I like the way Colon has pitched. BA and Getz looked MUCH MUCH better at the plate. It is not just about the results, but also the approach. Lillibridge looks like a great base stealer. Clayton had a nice rebound effort. Out big bats are swinging pretty well so far. The season is still early, and there will be more tough losses. But so far I am real excited about the potential of this team.

I saw it the same way. I'll agonize over losses in August, but not April.

Matt Thornton had been perfect, so he was due to get hit. Just too bad it was with the bases loaded.

I liked the 9th inning, though -- the Sox didn't just put their heads down and walk away.

jabrch
04-18-2009, 07:49 AM
It was a generalization, point being that you need to win games like last night to have a successful season.

Sure - but teams lose games like this also. Defending AL Champs, on the road, in the dome... after winning game 1 of a 4 game set... in April... and still win the World Series.

You need to win about 90 games to win this division. Some games that you could win, you will lose. Some games that you should lose, you will win. Every year this happens to every team. Every win is important, we all know that. But at the same time, you are going to lose games like this. It just happens.

hawkjt
04-18-2009, 09:58 AM
It is hard to really get on Thornton who has been lites out until that one batter. And even Colon..he was was impressive ,imo, and I think did suffer a bit with Buckner ,who is one of the worst guys behind the plate. Barts pitches move so much that Buckner will not give him those pitches that nip a corner going by...but Buckner was bad for the Rays at times also.

If Bart stays healthy, he will be a key guy for us..really liked his mound presence and lively arm.

No, this is one you just chalk up to a couple of bad breaks, the infield hit, the walk and the dome factor. Sox were 4-16 in domes last year..I have come to expect some games like this in domes...just go get Kaz today with Burls on the mound.

Lip Man 1
04-18-2009, 10:17 AM
Ozzie pointed out to the newspapers that he can't afford to overuse Thornton, Dotel and Linebrink and that the keys were Richard, Ol' MacDougal and Carrasco.

So far they haven't been getting the job done. This bears watching.

Remember at least right now, at best Colon and Contreras are going to give you five or six innings...that means at least twice every five days one of the middle guys is going to have to pitch.

Lip

soxyess
04-18-2009, 02:33 PM
Take whatever wins you can get out of this series and move on. We dont play well here, and the Rays are a very good team at home. It might be best to resume watching on tues.

DonnieDarko
04-18-2009, 04:14 PM
The positives from last night's game were that it looks like we're not relying entirely on the long ball like we were since...God, I don't know how long now. In the summer we're going to be raking in wins (assuming that the starting pitching holds up), but come fall, it's going to come down to scraping out wins with guys like Fields, Getz, Lillibridge, (ugh) Owens and Anderson running the bases.

I also like that Sox hitters look a lot more patient than they did last year (well, save for most of this game, but that's neither here nor there). I want Getz to be more aggressive too, and take less pitches down the middle, but it's really nice to see the leadoff man not strikeout a lot and take a lot of pitches, either way. Getz also got robbed of a double last night, and Fields got robbed of a single earlier in the game (there goes the hitting streak, sadly). Dye's raking it in too, and struckout on some really good pitches (changeup low and sinking in at the last possible moment? Nasty). I'm honestly not worried about those guys.

Who does worry me are Quentin (I would like to see him get more hits), Alexei (goddammit, man! Stop swining at the helmet-high fastballs!), Anderson (though he's shown some improvement at the plate...in non-RBI situations) and Thome a bit. We've yet to see Josh Fields hit a HR, either. I think he's just about due for one. :)

All in all, I wasn't TOO dissapointed at this loss. Of course it hurt, but at the same time I liked some things that I saw. I think that Thornton has been used a bit too much, and he needs some rest. Now if the rest of the bullpen can just take up the slack...

And to the guy that thinks that Konerko is going into one of his prolonged slumps, well...it's possible, sure. But I don't think I see that. He's starting to lower his head when he hits into groundouts, popouts and such, yeah. But he's a hell of a lot more patient than he was last year at the plate, and until this night he was doing well. If he keeps this up for the next few days, though...then I'll have to reexamine my opinion.

SBSoxFan
04-19-2009, 11:40 AM
I gotta put this on Colon and Thorton. If Colon doesn't start walking guys, and if Thorton threw anything besides 3 straight fastballs, then I think we avoid the disaster that was the 6th. Our guys scored 5 runs, and on most nights, that should be enough.

When Colon lost it last night, he lost it fast. He looked to be cruising up until that point. When he loses his control you know he's done. Not much you can say about Thornton, he just didn't have it last night. There will be nights like that for every pitcher, it was just an unfortunate situation for Matt to have one of those nights.

I still feel good that they're 1-1 in those first two games. Both of those games could have gone either way. They just need to pick up 1 of the next 2 and get the hell out of that dump. That place is really turning into ****-dome II for the Sox.

Colon walked 1 batter in that game, nor did he seem wild in the strike zone. His control wasn't an issue. He sure went from 53 pitches in the 5th to 90+ in the sixth inning though.

I'm surprised they used Thornton. He had thrown 22 pitches the night before. However, I heard part of an interview with Cooper yesterday, and he basically said if they have a chance to win a game they're going to use their best relievers.

Even though the Sox couldn't score, the top of the 8th and 9th were fun to watch. Owens and Lillibridge used their speed to force matters. It wasn't enough this time though.