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View Full Version : *** Official *** "MacDougal made an appearance" Post-Game Thread


doublem23
04-15-2009, 04:12 PM
http://microscopiq.com/images/mushroom-clown-ps3.jpg

aryzner
04-15-2009, 04:13 PM
That was sufficiently awful today.

:chunks

ChiSoxFan81
04-15-2009, 04:13 PM
Even Coop can't fix 'im

LoveYourSuit
04-15-2009, 04:14 PM
8 games in and I can already say:

Lillebridge - No thanks
Richrard - No thanks

Not for meaningful playing time.

MushMouth
04-15-2009, 04:15 PM
My god, I know they have a nice offense, but that was some piss poor pitching.

I'd really like to see someone, anyone, other than McDougal as our 12th pitcher.

veeter
04-15-2009, 04:15 PM
Positives: Jose was pretty darn good today.
Negatives: Brian not coming through ended all hope. The umpires failing to warn than ****ing ******* for throwing four bean balls. I think they were waiting to warn a Sox pitcher for retaliating. First Greinke, now this rookie. I want some payback. MacDougal doesn't even stick up for his guys. Get the Rays tomorrow.

JB98
04-15-2009, 04:17 PM
Ehh....the game was already lost before MacDougal took the mound. He just made a bad day worse.

Maybe it's a different game if the Sox could just knock in a man from third base in either the first or fifth innings. Bad situational hitting again.

DaveFeelsRight
04-15-2009, 04:18 PM
i went to class when it was 3-0, someone care to tell me what happened?

kevingrt
04-15-2009, 04:18 PM
Wouldn't have mattered what happened with our pitching staff considering how well we hit today.

Yuck.

doublem23
04-15-2009, 04:19 PM
Ehh....the game was already lost before MacDougal took the mound. He just made a bad day worse.

Maybe it's a different game if the Sox could just knock in a man from third base in either the first or fifth innings. Bad situational hitting again.

I ain't blaming MacDougal for the loss, the quote is a reference to this post in the Game Thread (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=2199840&postcount=350), a response to someone asking for a quick summary of the debacle.

Lundind1
04-15-2009, 04:19 PM
Can't win games if you only manage 4 hits.

McDougal is done, no doubt about that. I guess it's Broadway time. Richard will be fine.

None the less, another game we might have to win in August or September just to stay in this thing.

Win them now, so you don't have to later.

If you think it gets easier, hahaha. No. Tampa is up next.

BoysMom3
04-15-2009, 04:20 PM
I missed the game because I had to take a kid in for a kindergarten checkup - instead of coming home to watch the rest of the game, I ran errands. Sooooo, what happened with Brian??? Nobody has to explain about MacDougal, trust me, I get it.

Oh, and four bean balls and no consequences???!!!

SoxSpeed22
04-15-2009, 04:23 PM
Well that sucked. On to Tampa.

roylestillman
04-15-2009, 04:23 PM
McDougal doesn't surprise me, but the Richard melt down is a BIG deal. Is he just bent out of shape from losing out on the SP role? He's been a mess so far, and leaves us in a bad spot if one of the starters goes down.

Offensively welcome back to 2008. This team is going to drive you crazy, but be right in there until the end.

DaveFeelsRight
04-15-2009, 04:24 PM
i think we'll be fine if we split with tampa

Sockinchisox
04-15-2009, 04:24 PM
I missed the game because I had to take a kid in for a kindergarten checkup - instead of coming home to watch the rest of the game, I ran errands. Sooooo, what happened with Brian??? Nobody has to explain about MacDougal, trust me, I get it.

Oh, and four bean balls and no consequences???!!!

Umm he walked and K'd with runners at 2nd and 3rd with 1 out.

BoysMom3
04-15-2009, 04:25 PM
Thank you soxinchisox.

veeter
04-15-2009, 04:26 PM
Umm he walked and K'd with runners at 2nd and 3rd with 1 out.The score was still 0-0 at the time. It was a bad at bat.

DeuceUnit
04-15-2009, 04:26 PM
Contreras looked pretty solid today I thought until Fields botched a routine ground ball

Littleturd as I call him, has no business being on a AAA roster let alone a major league team.

Hate on Pods all you want, he would look better than anyone else has leading off.

veeter
04-15-2009, 04:28 PM
Contreras looked pretty solid today I thought until Fields botched a routine ground ball

Littleturd as I call him, has no business being on a AAA roster let alone a major league team.

Hate on Pods all you want, he would look better than anyone else has leading off.No excuse, but the nano-second long replay they showed of the DP ball, hopped up on Josh, who has been playing really good defense. I disagree with Lillibridge. He's a gamer and a ROOKIE. It takes time.

soltrain21
04-15-2009, 04:36 PM
Contreras looked pretty solid today I thought until Fields botched a routine ground ball

Littleturd as I call him, has no business being on a AAA roster let alone a major league team.

Hate on Pods all you want, he would look better than anyone else has leading off.

Stupid.

soxfan21
04-15-2009, 04:37 PM
I really hope we bounce back tomorrow, I don't want this to be one of those losses that lingers for a few games.

Whappeh
04-15-2009, 04:41 PM
Is anyone else going to be at the Tampa games on 16 and 17? If not, it'll just be me and my girlfriend in the cheering section for the Sox.

LITTLE NELL
04-15-2009, 04:41 PM
A real clunker, this was one of the 60 you are going to lose no matter what.

Lip Man 1
04-15-2009, 04:43 PM
Typical Sox performance against a pitcher they only saw briefly last September. Where have we seen this act before? Hmmmmm.....

What's most disheartening is that already they've been shutout twice in only eight games...keep swingin' for those fences boys!

About as poor a performance by the team as I've seen in the past season or so, they looked completely lethargic.

Also Richard needs to be shipped out on the first aircraft to Charlotte and Ol' MacDougal (e-i-e-i-oh no!) needs to be given his walking papers...today.

I was never in favor of Richard on this team in the first place based on his body of work from last season. I don't think he's 'upset' at losing a starting role (that he never should have had consideration for in the first place) but he's still incredibly green...he's been rushed to the bigs and it's hurting him badly.

He may have a future as a pitcher if his confidence isn't completely destroyed first.

Lip

LoveYourSuit
04-15-2009, 04:44 PM
Stupid.


the statement was off the handle, but Brent does not belong on a major league field ....PERIOD.

Viva Medias B's
04-15-2009, 04:45 PM
Can we please release MacDougal now? Pretty please? Pretty please with sugar on it? Outside of that, I do like how Jose pitched today. If he keeps that up, in general, we'll be fine.

hawkjt
04-15-2009, 04:50 PM
The strikeouts by TCQ and BA with men on third and one out were the key at-bats of the game for the Sox. Just cannot allow those chances to go away like that.

Gallaraga is a solid pitcher, and had a good year last year so I am not shocked. Jose was good until his control issues in the 5th, then the defense let him down.

Just another cool weather offensive funk game for the Sox.
That fireballer for the tigers needs to get sent back down to the minors before he kills somebody.

Madscout
04-15-2009, 04:51 PM
Can we please release MacDougal now? Pretty please? Pretty please with sugar on it? Outside of that, I do like how Jose pitched today. If he keeps that up, in general, we'll be fine.
I don't get why our 12th pitcher is seeing so much game time too? Is Dotel allergic to working two innings?

doublem23
04-15-2009, 04:52 PM
Typical Sox performance against a pitcher they only saw briefly last September. Where have we seen this act before? Hmmmmm.....

What's most disheartening is that already they've been shutout twice in only eight games...keep swingin' for those fences boys!

About as poor a performance by the team as I've seen in the past season or so, they looked completely lethargic.

Also Richard needs to be shipped out on the first aircraft to Charlotte and Ol' MacDougal (e-i-e-i-oh no!) needs to be given his walking papers...today.

I was never in favor of Richard on this team in the first place based on his body of work from last season. I don't think he's 'upset' at losing a starting role (that he never should have had consideration for in the first place) but he's still incredibly green...he's been rushed to the bigs and it's hurting him badly.

He may have a future as a pitcher if his confidence isn't completely destroyed first.

Lip

No mention of the fact that Armando Galarraga is actually a pretty decent pitcher... Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/galarar01.shtml

doublem23
04-15-2009, 04:52 PM
Hawk needs to come up with a nickname for Lillibridge and fast because the ones you guys are coming up with suck.

ChiSoxFan81
04-15-2009, 04:56 PM
Hawk needs to come up with a nickname for Lillibridge and fast because the ones you guys are coming up with suck.

My wife calls him Dumbo

dickallen15
04-15-2009, 04:57 PM
Hawk needs to come up with a nickname for Lillibridge and fast because the ones you guys are coming up with suck.

How about Charlotte Knight secondbaseman. That sounds good to me.

soltrain21
04-15-2009, 04:59 PM
How about Charlotte Knight secondbaseman. That sounds good to me.

And who becomes our utility player? Nix is still hurt.

asindc
04-15-2009, 04:59 PM
I don't get why our 12th pitcher is seeing so much game time too? Is Dotel allergic to working two innings?

Need Dotel for this weekend series with Tampa. If you are going to test MacDougal one final time (hopefully!), this was the ideal game in which to do it.

beasly213
04-15-2009, 05:02 PM
Macdogal could have given up 200 runs. It didn't matter the Sox didn't score. I'm fine with Ozzie throwing him in there when the game is obviously lost. The Sox didn't have it today and as a manager you can see that sometimes and need to manage accordingly.

dickallen15
04-15-2009, 05:04 PM
And who becomes our utility player? Nix is still hurt.
Who cares? What does Lillibridge bring to the table besides giggles about his ears.

Lip Man 1
04-15-2009, 05:04 PM
Double:

Not saying he isn't, he won 13 games last season but to the White Sox he's a virtual "unknown." As stated, he came in for Garcia in the 'must win' game the final week to set up the 163rd game vs. Minnesota.

He didn't retire a batter and threw two wild pitches before Leland took him out. Feel free to look it up yourself... that's the only time the Sox ever saw him.

The point is (as you very well know) when the Sox face an 'unknown' regardless of how good or bad he is, they completely fall apart.

The good news I guess, is that he won 13 games last year, not as embarrassing as when Texas say, brings up a Double A emergency call-up and he makes the Sox look incompetent.

How that for a positive spin? :smile:

Lip

Oblong
04-15-2009, 05:04 PM
No mention of the fact that Armando Galarraga is actually a pretty decent pitcher... Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/galarar01.shtml

Don't worry, there's Tiger fans who insist he's only been lucky so far in his career. The guy's kept the team in almost every game he's pitched. 23 of the 30 games he pitched last year he gave up 3 ER or less. And that's with a crappy Tiger bullpen. Yet he still has to prove himself to a lot of people.

ChiSoxFan81
04-15-2009, 05:04 PM
Macdogal could have given up 200 runs. It didn't matter the Sox didn't score. I'm fine with Ozzie throwing him in there when the game is obviously lost. The Sox didn't have it today and as a manager you can see that sometimes and need to manage accordingly.

No one is blaming MacDougal for today's result. The fact that he still can't get it together in garbage time with no pressure is what is frustrating.

SoxGirl4Life
04-15-2009, 05:08 PM
Don't worry, there's Tiger fans who insist he's only been lucky so far in his career. The guy's kept the team in almost every game he's pitched. 23 of the 30 games he pitched last year he gave up 3 ER or less. And that's with a crappy Tiger bullpen. Yet he still has to prove himself to a lot of people.


Why did the Tigers bring in Rodney in a 9 run game? Work?

doublem23
04-15-2009, 05:14 PM
Who cares? What does Lillibridge bring to the table besides giggles about his ears.

That doesn't answer who the backup infielder is. As bad as Lillibridge is, there's no one else that can fill his role right now.

Besides, he should be back, riding the pine tomorrow.

Oblong
04-15-2009, 05:18 PM
Why did the Tigers bring in Rodney in a 9 run game? Work?

Yes. No game tomorrow so that'd be 3 off days in a row.

kravdog
04-15-2009, 05:20 PM
My wife calls him Dumbo

those are some big ears!

DeuceUnit
04-15-2009, 05:20 PM
Stupid.

Very imformative. Please give me some sort of evidence that he has any ability to play at the major league level...

kevingrt
04-15-2009, 05:24 PM
That doesn't answer who the backup infielder is. As bad as Lillibridge is, there's no one else that can fill his role right now.

Besides, he should be back, riding the pine tomorrow.

Completely agree. No one in AAA or AA has better defensive skills at the up the middle positions then Lillibridge has. Until Nix gets fully recovered or we trade for some solid utility infielder BL is going to be on the 25 man roster simply because there is no better utility infielder in our system.

hi im skot
04-15-2009, 05:27 PM
Very imformative. Please give me some sort of evidence that he has any ability to play at the major league level...

Give me a more creative nickname than "Littleturd".

JB98
04-15-2009, 05:28 PM
The strikeouts by TCQ and BA with men on third and one out were the key at-bats of the game for the Sox. Just cannot allow those chances to go away like that.

Gallaraga is a solid pitcher, and had a good year last year so I am not shocked. Jose was good until his control issues in the 5th, then the defense let him down.

Just another cool weather offensive funk game for the Sox.
That fireballer for the tigers needs to get sent back down to the minors before he kills somebody.

Bingo. Gotta put the ball in play there. No excuse for swinging at pitches out of the zone. Both TCQ and BA were guilty of that.

If the Sox get the lead in either of those two situations, maybe it's a different game.

DickAllen72
04-15-2009, 05:29 PM
Typical Sox performance against a pitcher they only saw briefly last September. Where have we seen this act before? Hmmmmm.....

What's most disheartening is that already they've been shutout twice in only eight games...keep swingin' for those fences boys!

About as poor a performance by the team as I've seen in the past season or so, they looked completely lethargic.

Lip

So far, about what I expected from this team, Lip. A .500 team with an all-or-nothing offense, and sub-par defense.

Hopefully they can stay close enough so that KW can bring in a quality CFer to give this team a shot in the arm. Either that, or perhaps the Beckham to SS Ramirez to CF scenario occurs--but I think it's still too early for that.

soltrain21
04-15-2009, 05:29 PM
Very imformative. Please give me some sort of evidence that he has any ability to play at the major league level...


Don't give a stupid nickname and I wouldn't say it's stupid.

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:32 PM
Bat over .100 and maybe we can get rid of lilliturd nickname

hi im skot
04-15-2009, 05:33 PM
Bat over .100 and maybe we can get rid of lilliturd nickname

You realize it's the second week of the season, right?

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:34 PM
Ya

doublem23
04-15-2009, 05:34 PM
Bat over .100 and maybe we can get rid of lilliturd nickname

I can't believe we're arguing over the nicknames of utility infielders.

We need Dewayne Wise starting in CF again, pronto.

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:35 PM
lillibridge is going to replace the BA threads haha

I hope i eat my words

doublem23
04-15-2009, 05:36 PM
lillibridge is going to replace the BA threads haha

I hope i eat my words

I don't think teams sink or swim based on the offensive performance of their utility middle infielder.

hi im skot
04-15-2009, 05:37 PM
Ya

:?:

I think the word you're looking for is "yeah".

It was a dumper of a game, and we're really going to call out our back-up infielder as the villain?

soltrain21
04-15-2009, 05:37 PM
I don't get why people are freaking out over our utility infielder who has started two games in a row because of an injury.

doublem23
04-15-2009, 05:38 PM
I don't get why people are freaking out over our utility infielder who has started two games in a row because of an injury.

BECAUSE WE LOST :gah: WE SUCK, I'M GOING TO KILL MYSELF

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:40 PM
:?:

I think the word you're looking for is "yeah".

It was a dumper of a game, and we're really going to call out our back-up infielder as the villain?

I have never seen a message board that is more critical of grammar anywhere????

Serious?

I agree with you it was a bad game all around.
Lillibridge is not going to make or break our season.

I am just saying an average above .100 would be nice.

Yes it is only two weeks in the season, but .077 is .077

DeuceUnit
04-15-2009, 05:41 PM
I'm not freaking out. I simply pointed out the fact the Lillibridge looks totally lost. Last time I checked, utility players still had to have the ability to hit once in awhile. I said Contreras had a solid game. The only people freaking out are the ones getting upset over me ripping on a player.

hi im skot
04-15-2009, 05:43 PM
I have never seen a message board that is more critical of grammar anywhere????

Serious?

It's been said before - fellow posters are more likely to take your post seriously if you aren't lazy with your spelling.

http://www.mediabistro.com/agencyspy/original/nbc_the_more_you_know.jpg

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:45 PM
Fair enough.


I joined the conversation late so I am sure this has been discussed but I would not be upset if MacDougal was never allowed around a baseball again.

tm1119
04-15-2009, 05:46 PM
I know its still very early, but how long of a leash does Contreras get if he continues to struggle? And what do we do with him if he cant pull it together and have a respectable ERA?

doublem23
04-15-2009, 05:46 PM
I joined the conversation late so I am sure this has been discussed but I would not be upset if MacDougal was never allowed around a baseball again.

He can pitch as many innings for the Twins, Tigers, Royals, or Indians as his heart desires.

JB98
04-15-2009, 05:47 PM
After Saturday's game, people wanted Lillibridge to be our full-time leadoff hitter because he drew a couple walks and got a bunt down in a Sox victory over the Twins. Now, after a 9-0 loss, people want him dead.

Find a middle ground, folks.

JB98
04-15-2009, 05:47 PM
I know its still very early, but how long of a leash does Contreras get if he continues to struggle? And what do we do with him if he cant pull it together and have a respectable ERA?

Contreras didn't struggle today. He should have gotten through the sixth inning with only three runs allowed. I'm not even slightly concerned.

doublem23
04-15-2009, 05:48 PM
I know its still very early, but how long of a leash does Contreras get if he continues to struggle? And what do we do with him if he cant pull it together and have a respectable ERA?

I think Jose looked pretty good today until that sixth inning meltdown. I'm hoping this is just the natural time it's taking him to rebuild his strength after missing so much time. IIRC last year, he looked pretty shaky for his first few starts; kind of wild and not able to last deep into games, before he turned it on in a big way until he hurt his arm, but kept pitching without telling anyone.

At this point, I think we're better off letting Jose see if he can work his problems out than giving the ball to Lance Broadway or Jeff Marquez every 5th day instead.

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:49 PM
I know its still very early, but how long of a leash does Contreras get if he continues to struggle? And what do we do with him if he cant pull it together and have a respectable ERA?

He had a classic Javier performance today, Looked great in the beginning of the game then gave up 5 runs.

He has a long leash, who are we going to pull up?

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:50 PM
He can pitch as many innings for the Twins, Tigers, Royals, or Indians as his heart desires.

Touche, well put

:bandance:

Konerko05
04-15-2009, 05:50 PM
I'm not freaking out. I simply pointed out the fact the Lillibridge looks totally lost. Last time I checked, utility players still had to have the ability to hit once in awhile. I said Contreras had a solid game. The only people freaking out are the ones getting upset over me ripping on a player.

Surprisingly, Lillibridge hasn't looked too lost at the plate. I expected much worse at bats after his 1 BB/24 SO spring. His problem is not doing anything with the pitches he puts into play. He's hitting pop ups instead of line drives.

His defense up the middle and speed can be assets off the bench. He just needs to start hitting the ball with more authority.

I don't understand all the outrage at this point. He is only getting consistent playing time because Getz is banged up.

hi im skot
04-15-2009, 05:50 PM
I joined the conversation late so I am sure this has been discussed but I would not be upset if MacDougal was never allowed around a baseball again.

Yeah, the MacDougal experiment must end.

JB98
04-15-2009, 05:51 PM
He had a classic Javier performance today, Looked great in the beginning of the game then gave up 5 runs.

He has a long leash, who are we going to pull up?

I don't see the comparison between Vazquez and Contreras. Jose is still building his strength back. It figures he'd tire a bit as he approached 100 pitches. Those last two runs Jose allowed were the fault of Josh Fields. That grounder off the bat of Inge needs to be a DP in that situation.

DeuceUnit
04-15-2009, 05:54 PM
At least we can all agree MacDougal needs to go!!! :bandance: :gulp:

Konerko05
04-15-2009, 05:55 PM
He had a classic Javier performance today, Looked great in the beginning of the game then gave up 5 runs.

He has a long leash, who are we going to pull up?

Contreras didn't have a full ST to prepare for the season. He looked much better today than he did in his last start.

BadBobbyJenks
04-15-2009, 05:55 PM
If Josh Fields doesn't boot that grounder, Jose goes 6 innings 3 runs. Is anyone complaining about that outing?

TSXNaVi
04-15-2009, 05:58 PM
I don't see the comparison between Vazquez and Contreras. Jose is still building his strength back. It figures he'd tire a bit as he approached 100 pitches. Those last two runs Jose allowed were the fault of Josh Fields. That grounder off the bat of Inge needs to be a DP in that situation.

I like Jose. I like Jose a lot. I understand he is building up still.


I am talking about the walks and the majority of balls before he left the game.


In no way was it a direct comparison.

My bad

JB98
04-15-2009, 05:58 PM
If Josh Fields doesn't boot that grounder, Jose goes 6 innings 3 runs. Is anyone complaining about that outing?

Not me. I was OK with the way Jose threw the ball today.

Soxman219
04-15-2009, 06:00 PM
That was a terrible performance. Oh well, on to Tampa.

guillensdisciple
04-15-2009, 06:00 PM
BECAUSE WE LOST :gah: WE SUCK, I'M GOING TO KILL MYSELF


This killed me when I read it, has to be one of the funniest things (in context), that I have ever read. Thumbs up to you sir!

After Saturday's game, people wanted Lillibridge to be our full-time leadoff hitter because he drew a couple walks and got a bunt down in a Sox victory over the Twins. Now, after a 9-0 loss, people want him dead.

Find a middle ground, folks.

Would the middle ground be him alive while sitting on the bench?

Metalthrasher442
04-15-2009, 06:17 PM
What's all the hate for Lillibridge. He's doing a little more than I expected him to. His speed is awesome. He probably just needs a little more time before he starts hitting the ball a little better.

We better show up tomorrow.

WhiteSox5187
04-15-2009, 06:18 PM
Not me. I was OK with the way Jose threw the ball today.
Jose looked pretty good today. He could easily be 2-0. But, sometimes bad games happen. Let's just not make this a habit.

JB98
04-15-2009, 06:20 PM
Would the middle ground be him alive while sitting on the bench?

As soon as Getz comes back, yes. And when Nix is healthy, we send Lillibridge to Charlotte to work on his hitting.

khan
04-15-2009, 06:34 PM
I get it:

Lillibridge needs to work on shortening his swing, getting bunts down, working the count, drawing walks, and beating out infield singles. MacDougal needs to throw strikes and is overpaid for what he's provided hereto fore. But guess what? RARELY is a utility IF or the 12th pitcher a reason for a team to win or lose the World Series.

On the other hand, Josh Fields going back to his historical level of defensive ability WILL prevent this team from winning. Having a man on 3rd with <2 outs, and not being able to score him WILL prevent this team from winning. Getting shut out in 1 out of every 4 games WILL prevent this team from winning. Having an incredibly inconsistent offense WILL prevent this team from winning. Continually swinging at pitches that are out of the strike zone WILL prevent this team from winning.


I guess what I'm saying is this: Sure, Lillibridge and MacDougal sucked today. But they won't be the primary reasons for this team's success or failure. [EDIT] And there are many, many, many, many better things to bitch about than these two relatively insignificant components of this team, in my opinion.

Lip Man 1
04-15-2009, 06:57 PM
I see some posts talking about basically the Sox have some room to maneuver when Nix comes back.

Friends let's remember that Nix is no sure thing either. He's a failed first round pick whom the Rockies thought so highly of they waived him right out of their system.

He may be OK but he's not even close to being 'bankable' yet...just need to keep that in mind.

Lip

russ99
04-15-2009, 06:59 PM
I get it:

Lillibridge needs to work on shortening his swing, getting bunts down, working the count, drawing walks, and beating out infield singles. MacDougal needs to throw strikes and is overpaid for what he's provided hereto fore. But guess what? RARELY is a utility IF or the 12th pitcher a reason for a team to win or lose the World Series.

On the other hand, Josh Fields going back to his historical level of defensive ability WILL prevent this team from winning. Having a man on 3rd with <2 outs, and not being able to score him WILL prevent this team from winning. Getting shut out in 1 out of every 4 games WILL prevent this team from winning. Having an incredibly inconsistent offense WILL prevent this team from winning. Continually swinging at pitches that are out of the strike zone WILL prevent this team from winning.


I guess what I'm saying is this: Sure, Lillibridge and MacDougal sucked today. But they won't be the primary reasons for this team's success or failure. [EDIT] And there are many, many, many, many better things to bitch about than these two relatively insignificant components of this team, in my opinion.

Very good post. :D:

But I am encouraged as to how the pitching staff is doing as a whole so far. Hopefully the hitting will come around with the nicer weather and when we kick Walker to the curb.

It looks like it's still going to be difficult to score runs without the homer, but I do see some improvement in this department over last year.

So the 2009 is certainly an early work in progress. But if we get a few breaks, a hitter or two really gets going and we don't get too many injuries, it looks like we can contend, and that's all you can ask for. And certainly more than I expected in January with the unveiling of Kenny's Kids.

chisoxfanatic
04-15-2009, 07:00 PM
Lillibridge didn't look very confident at the plate in his first couple at bats (I had to leave for tutoring in the 6th inning). I'm sure a bunch of that is just him being so young and still trying to get himself situated in the major leagues. He has so little experience.

JB98
04-15-2009, 07:05 PM
I see some posts talking about basically the Sox have some room to maneuver when Nix comes back.

Friends let's remember that Nix is no sure thing either. He's a failed first round pick whom the Rockies thought so highly of they waived him right out of their system.

He may be OK but he's not even close to being 'bankable' yet...just need to keep that in mind.

Lip

He's going to be relied upon for nothing more than a utility role, however. I think he can handle that.

russ99
04-15-2009, 07:08 PM
He's going to be relied upon for nothing more than a utility role, however. I think he can handle that.

I think that utility guy is basically there to keep Betemit from playing defense at 2B and SS, which is a very good idea. So any offense you get from him is a bonus. I'd like to see Brent not strike out as much and get on base more, but that seems to be a common problem on this club.

Lip Man 1
04-15-2009, 07:10 PM
For whatever this may be worth. From one of the Sox beat writers that I had e-mailed earlier in the afternoon with some thoughts:

"Was told not many options down at Charlotte - right now. Might be time to ride some of these starters and pray for the off day.

Richard has been alarmingly inconsistent.

Time to get Lillibridge out of there with those Cliff Johnson-like hacks.

They never should have been blanked by Galarraga. Nine more to equal last year's total?"

The last comment refers to the fact they were shutout 11 times in 2008.

Lip

JB98
04-15-2009, 07:12 PM
I think that utility guy is basically there to keep Betemit from playing defense at 2B and SS, which is a very good idea. So any offense you get from him is a bonus. I'd like to see Brent not strike out as much and get on base more, but that seems to be a common problem on this club.

Both Nix and Lillibridge are plus defenders. They both can play both middle infield spots effectively. Whichever one is hitting better is the guy who should stick on the roster. Lillibridge has a chance to hold the spot for the long haul if he can pick it up with the bat. If not, I think Nix gets a shot.

ChiSoxGirl
04-15-2009, 07:34 PM
I just checked the play-by-play on espn.com... MacDougal AGAIN?!?! When is that guy going to be shipped the hell out of town?! I'm sure glad I didn't waste a beautiful Florida afternoon inside watching this game on WGN; I opted for the pool instead! :sunshine:

Konerko05
04-15-2009, 07:41 PM
Both Nix and Lillibridge are plus defenders. They both can play both middle infield spots effectively. Whichever one is hitting better is the guy who should stick on the roster. Lillibridge has a chance to hold the spot for the long haul if he can pick it up with the bat. If not, I think Nix gets a shot.

Why are people confident Nix can play both middle infield positions?

Nix has not played an inning of SS since rookie ball in 2001. He had a .913 fld%. Since 2001, he has played 2B exclusively.

Nix might be in line to take Getz's job if Getz falters, but I doubt he will be taking Lillibridge's roster spot as utility IF/backup SS.

Frater Perdurabo
04-15-2009, 07:43 PM
Tigers 9, Walkerball 0. :(:

JB98
04-15-2009, 07:50 PM
Why are people confident Nix can play both middle infield positions?

Nix has not played an inning of SS since rookie ball in 2001. He had a .913 fld%. Since 2001, he has played 2B exclusively.

Nix might be in line to take Getz's job if Getz falters, but I doubt he will be taking Lillibridge's roster spot as utility IF/backup SS.

Go ahead and doubt if you want. Nix could potentially take either Getz's job or Lillibridge's job if either one of them falters.

Nix is a good fielder.

Konerko05
04-15-2009, 07:52 PM
Go ahead and doubt if you want. Nix could potentially take either Getz's job or Lillibridge's job if either one of them falters.

Nix is a good fielder.

I never said he wasn't a good fielder.

He is a very good defensive 2B. He just isn't a SS.

JB98
04-15-2009, 07:54 PM
I never said he wasn't a good fielder.

He is a very good defensive 2B. He just isn't a SS.

Better than Betemit. I think he can handle it.

Konerko05
04-15-2009, 08:02 PM
Better than Betemit. I think he can handle it.

I can play SS better than Betemit, but Betemit is not the backup SS. Betemit is only going to backup 1B and 3B.

Nix is a 2B. I'd rather have the weak hitting Lillibridge on the bench. I'm not comfortable playing guys out of position at very important defensive positions.

JB98
04-15-2009, 08:06 PM
I can play SS better than Betemit, but Betemit is not the backup SS. Betemit is only going to backup 1B and 3B.

Nix is a 2B. I'd rather have the weak hitting Lillibridge on the bench. I'm not comfortable playing guys out of position at very important defensive positions.

If anything happens to Ramirez, we're calling up Beckham. I can't see any scenario where Nix or Lillibridge would be playing shortstop for more than a few innings, or the odd game here or there. It's really not worth worrying about.

I wish backup SS was the biggest issue on the team.

Konerko05
04-15-2009, 08:09 PM
If anything happens to Ramirez, we're calling up Beckham. I can't see any scenario where Nix or Lillibridge would be playing shortstop for more than a few innings, or the odd game here or there. It's really not worth worrying about.

I wish backup SS was the biggest issue on the team.

So what's the problem?

Although there could be a case when Ramirez goes down for 5 days, and it's not enough time to place him on the DL.

JB98
04-15-2009, 08:13 PM
So what's the problem?

Although there could be a case when Ramirez goes down for 5 days, and it's not enough time to place him on the DL.

There isn't a problem. I think we're covered in the middle infield.

Frater Perdurabo
04-15-2009, 08:15 PM
:tomatoaward:

Britt Burns
04-15-2009, 09:42 PM
Lillibridge needs to work things out in Charlotte. Is Nix anywhere close to returning?

drewcifer
04-15-2009, 10:37 PM
I didn't get to see anything today. I caught an inning in the car 4-5th on satelitte and it was 0-0 and it seemed the ump was tough and it was a pitching duel.

Then after putting out fires and getting home finally, I see a blowout! What happened!

Contreras has 4 ER charged to him, looks like McDougal did his usual thing with some help for Richard.

When are we going to be done with McDougal? It doesn't look like Contreras was horrible...certainly not great, but the bullpen has been good until this abortion.... Was this winnable until the BP showed up today?

palehozenychicty
04-16-2009, 12:39 AM
Well, it was an ugly game all around. This was probably the one we would've lost anyway. We move on to Tampa.

guillen4life13
04-16-2009, 12:50 AM
It's been said before - fellow posters are more likely to take your post seriously if you aren't lazy with your spelling.

http://www.mediabistro.com/agencyspy/original/nbc_the_more_you_know.jpg

If you've been alive in the 21st century, you'd know that "Ya" means "yeah." And it's not like "yeah" is the proper way to say "yes" either.

So stop being a smart ass. If the grammar is truly horrible, then it's understandable.

And while I may disagree, I do think that it's understandable to think that a player doesn't even deserve to be on a AAA roster let alone MLB roster if he hits less than .240 in AAA the previous season.

drewcifer
04-16-2009, 12:56 AM
If you've been alive in the 21st century, you'd know that "Ya" means "yeah." And it's not like "yeah" is the proper way to say "yes" either.

So stop being a smart ass. If the grammar is truly horrible, then it's understandable.

And while I may disagree, I do think that it's understandable to think that a player doesn't even deserve to be on a AAA roster let alone MLB roster if he hits less than .240 in AAA the previous season.

This is why I don't post here much.. get your **** together and talk baseball or be English teachers. Either way.

doublem23
04-16-2009, 01:28 AM
They never should have been blanked by Galarraga. Nine more to equal last year's total?"


I'd like to say I'm shocked that apparently even the guys paid to follow the White Sox don't know anything about the rosters of our divisional rivals, but given the state of Chicago sports media (all sports media, I guess), nothing surprises me any more.

:geezer: But remember, newspapers are going out of business left and right because those damn kids want to read everything on their Macintoshes and PlayStations nowadays!!! Nothing to do with the quality of work we produce. :geezer:

ChiSoxFan81
04-16-2009, 10:05 AM
I'd like to say I'm shocked that apparently even the guys paid to follow the White Sox don't know anything about the rosters of our divisional rivals, but given the state of Chicago sports media (all sports media, I guess), nothing surprises me any more.

:geezer: But remember, newspapers are going out of business left and right because those damn kids want to read everything on their Macintoshes and PlayStations nowadays!!! Nothing to do with the quality of work we produce. :geezer:

I am also baffled by the lack of respect for Galarraga. We heard about him last year, and even faced him, although it was out of the 'pen. Imagine if last year, fans of Detroit or Minnesota were incredulous that they got beat by Gavin Floyd or John Danks (who are these no names?). Actually, that probably happened. It's still very early, but I don't think we can blame yesterday's blanking completely on a poor offense.

asindc
04-16-2009, 10:17 AM
I am also baffled by the lack of respect for Galarraga. We heard about him last year, and even faced him, although it was out of the 'pen. Imagine if last year, fans of Detroit or Minnesota were incredulous that they got beat by Gavin Floyd or John Danks (who are these no names?). Actually, that probably happened. It's still very early, but I don't think we can blame yesterday's blanking completely on a poor offense.

Agreed. Gallarraga might end up being their ace within the next 2-3 years. He can pitch, as he proved all last year and yesterday. He beat our lineup, straight up. It happens sometimes.

Jurr
04-16-2009, 12:11 PM
I am also baffled by the lack of respect for Galarraga. We heard about him last year, and even faced him, although it was out of the 'pen. Imagine if last year, fans of Detroit or Minnesota were incredulous that they got beat by Gavin Floyd or John Danks (who are these no names?). Actually, that probably happened. It's still very early, but I don't think we can blame yesterday's blanking completely on a poor offense.
Beautifully put.

palehozenychicty
04-16-2009, 01:14 PM
I'm not surprised that Galarraga threw well. It was their best opportunity to win in this series and they did. I'm not surprised at the ones complaining about a loss to their best pitcher, either. Some people think that the Sox should never lose to a pitcher that isn't an All-Star or Hall of Famer. Moving on...

Lip Man 1
04-16-2009, 03:05 PM
Double:

Reading your post and your diatribe against the media has caused me to respond.

To me, what my friend, was trying to say was obvious….obviously that wasn’t the case.

I can’t guarantee you this is what they were saying but I’m very confident, knowing the individual that it probably was.

To wit:

This person wasn’t saying the Sox shouldn’t have lost Wednesday but they shouldn’t have been shutout.

Why were they shutout? Because of the same reasons that we’ve seen every year this decade, save for 2005, when they had a balanced attack.

A. They continue to strand runners in scoring position.

B. They can’t advance runners with less then two out.

C. They continue to swing at pitches out of the strike zone and in the dirt.

I think this person is simply tired of the same talk every off season from Kenny and Ozzie about fundamentals, situational hitting, team speed etc… when they know, as do I, as do 99 out of 100 Sox fans, that not a damn thing is going to change. (and in my opinion it’s costing them games…)

Now strictly speaking for myself, I wish Kenny and Ozzie would shut the hell up about this in the off season for the reason I suggested above. A player is what they are and can’t change a lifetime of habits.

Should Konerko be able to lay down a bunt in a scoreless situation in the 8th inning to get a guy from second to third? Absolutely. Should Thome shorten up, choke up his swing and punch a ball to left field to beat the shift? For sure. Should Ramirez have some knowledge of the strike zone? Of course. But that’s not who these guys are, that’s not the way they play the game.

And there’s nothing wrong with this individually. The problem is the Sox have so many of these type guys.

What the Sox desperately need are speed demons and slap hitters in the numbers 1,2, 8 and 9 spots in the order to get on base, do the little things, steal bases, disrupt the defense and set things up for the sluggers 3 through 7. Granted that’s easier said then done but I get the sense frankly, that is not the style Kenny wants and he creates the team, not Ozzie.

I find it very hard to believe for example that the Sox haven't been able to get a legit lead off guy since 2006 or a competent center fielder since Roward was traded away in November 2006. That's a long time ago. Things change from year to year I understand, but not getting guys like that in almost four seasons? I simply can't accept the possibility unless it wasn't considered a priority in the first place.

So again I’d just as soon as they keep quiet because I know nothing’s going to change in this regard and I’ve got a decade’s worth of evidence to prove it.

What would really help if you want guys who simply pound the ball, are the Frank Thomas, Magglio Ordonez types, who blast 25 home runs, drive in 100 RBI’s and hit between .280 and .320.

Guys like Konerko and Thome hitting 25 home runs but batting .240 help, but not as much as they could be. (And that’s not singling out those two by the way…) Maybe, eventually, Carlos Quentin may be that type of hitter in the middle of the lineup, we’ll see.

And if you want, I’d be happy to put you in touch with this person directly so you can ask them yourselves what they meant by that comment. But I’m willing to bet that I’ve pegged their thoughts correctly… again to me it was pretty obvious.

Lip

oeo
04-16-2009, 03:52 PM
I am also baffled by the lack of respect for Galarraga. We heard about him last year, and even faced him, although it was out of the 'pen. Imagine if last year, fans of Detroit or Minnesota were incredulous that they got beat by Gavin Floyd or John Danks (who are these no names?). Actually, that probably happened. It's still very early, but I don't think we can blame yesterday's blanking completely on a poor offense.

This is crazy talk. Don't you know that any time the Sox lose it's because they beat themselves? It's never good opposing pitching, it's a bad offense. It's never good opposing hitting, it's bad pitching.

DeuceUnit
04-16-2009, 04:28 PM
As Lip was saying, watching the Sox over the last years is very frustrating because of the inability to execute some fundamentals. I remember in 2005 we were one of the top teams in the league in sac flies. I remember Crazy Carl being specifically good at getting a guy in from 3rd with less than 2 outs. That doesn't happen too often anymore and its not just this year.

As far as Nix coming back, I was told he is not close at all.

schach
04-17-2009, 09:36 PM
Thornton, MacDougal, Richard are all junk! I can't stomach to watch anytime they take the mound! Especially since I just watched Thornton give up a huge grand slam. It blows! This bullpen needs some SERIOUS help!

Quentin4prez
04-17-2009, 09:38 PM
Thornton, MacDougal, Richard are all junk! I can't stomach to watch anytime they take the mound! Especially since I just watched Thornton give up a huge grand slam. It blows! This bullpen needs some SERIOUS help!
i know ur new but thornton had a bad game... his first run this season and has looked great other than today.

CWSpalehoseCWS
04-17-2009, 09:44 PM
Thornton, MacDougal, Richard are all junk! I can't stomach to watch anytime they take the mound! Especially since I just watched Thornton give up a huge grand slam. It blows! This bullpen needs some SERIOUS help!

Thronton had a bad game. That's all, he'll be fine. MacDougal is a joke. I honestly believe I could do a better job than this guy. If he's on this team tomorrow, we have a problem. Hopefull Ozzie has had enough of this ****. Thank God Ozzie pulled him and didn't decide to give him chance #999999999999999999.

Nellie_Fox
04-18-2009, 01:50 AM
MacDougal is a joke. I honestly believe I could do a better job than this guy.No you couldn't. If you could, you'd be in organized baseball somewhere.

Mac has proven he can't perform on a major league level anymore and needs to be a distant unpleasant memory, but that doesn't mean you could do better.