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View Full Version : Why aren't the Sox at least considering signing Pedro Martinez?


Dice
03-10-2009, 10:07 AM
Take a look at the situation. The Mets don't seem like they want him back and there doesn't seem like there is a lot of interest from many(if any) teams to sign him. So he won't cost that much.

Besides, if we can sign Colon and his broken shoulder why can't we take a chance on Perdo?

voodoochile
03-10-2009, 10:12 AM
Honestly?

Because I think they feel they are pretty well set at starting pitcher. With Contreras ready to start facing live game hitting and the signing of Colon, they have a 1-5 already. Marquez and Richard are looking solid too, so that gives them 7 potential starters.

Pedro might be a good pickup or he might be toast. It's a crap shoot, so why spend the money if you don't have to?

SOBdmb
03-10-2009, 10:29 AM
Pretty sure Pedro is looking for quite a bit more money than Colon accepted, too

FarmerAndy
03-10-2009, 11:00 AM
Pedro is looking for the same kind of deal Smoltz received - $5.5 million base, with a few million in incentives. If he doesn't get an offer close to that, he says he's more than fine retiring to his fishing boat. I believe him.

cws05champ
03-10-2009, 12:10 PM
Pedro is looking for the same kind of deal Smoltz received - $5.5 million base, with a few million in incentives. If he doesn't get an offer close to that, he says he's more than fine retiring to his fishing boat. I believe him.

Who here thinks he'd make a pretty good set up guy that could go 2 or more innings? I don't think the Sox will sink much more into the payroll, but I could see Pedro in this role for some team...and someone will be desperate enough after the season starts and some injuries happen.

areilly
03-10-2009, 02:37 PM
Who says they're not considering him?

CWSpalehoseCWS
03-10-2009, 05:16 PM
Isn't he more of a flyball pitcher? That could be bad at home.

rookie
03-10-2009, 06:49 PM
I also heard while watching the WBC that he wants to stay in the NL.

asindc
03-10-2009, 08:27 PM
Who says they're not considering him?

Just what I was thinking.

Nellie_Fox
03-11-2009, 01:31 AM
He has made it clear that he has no intention of working cheap. If no one offers the type of money he's accustomed to, he has said he'll just go fishing (as already posted above.) Does he mean it? I don't know. But he's no longer worth "Pedro money."

Sockinchisox
03-11-2009, 11:56 AM
I don't see the point with all the pitching depth we have.

For the 4th, 5th spots that we have:

Contreras
Colon
Marquez
Richard
Poreda

sox1970
03-11-2009, 12:11 PM
I don't see the point with all the pitching depth we have.

For the 4th, 5th spots that we have:

Contreras
Colon
Marquez
Richard
Poreda

Poreda isn't an option for the rotation out of spring training; only the bullpen.

Billy Ashley
03-11-2009, 12:14 PM
Who here thinks he'd make a pretty good set up guy that could go 2 or more innings? I don't think the Sox will sink much more into the payroll, but I could see Pedro in this role for some team...and someone will be desperate enough after the season starts and some injuries happen.


The problem is, despite what the media argued during his peak- Pedro's numbers suffer the most at the onset of his appearances. The guy has had a series of catastrophic arm injuries, that's why Boston let him go after 2004. With the Mets he was very good in 05 and then the rest of his body fell apart (hip, toe, and so on).


When Pedro's healthy enough to pitch, it takes him a while to get loose. He'd be an awful reliever at this point in his career. Additionally, it's very difficult to come in 2-4 times a week as a reliever and stay healthy. Pedro already has trouble staying healthy.

No pitcher has ever pitched as well as he did from 1997-2005- but he's better off in the NL.

voodoochile
03-11-2009, 12:18 PM
I'd be skeptical of signing any player who is only going to play if they get big money and otherwise would rather go fishing. Compare that to Colon who is fighting tooth and nail for incentives only (mostly) to get back to the point he can sign a long term contract. I'll take desire and skill over just skill any day of the week.

Enjoy the fishing, Pedro. Hope you catch a whopper...

Billy Ashley
03-11-2009, 12:35 PM
I'd be skeptical of signing any player who is only going to play if they get big money and otherwise would rather go fishing. Compare that to Colon who is fighting tooth and nail for incentives only (mostly) to get back to the point he can sign a long term contract. I'll take desire and skill over just skill any day of the week.

Enjoy the fishing, Pedro. Hope you catch a whopper...

Yeah like when Colon refused to pitch in the bullpen during the play offs last season forcing his team to release him. Eye of the Tiger and such.

This is a very childish way to evaluate the situation. Pedro Martinez is a very intelligent guy, he's made a ton of investments in the Dominican and is a god there. Additionally, he's made well over 100 million dollars over his career.

Colon on the other hand has made a great deal of money himself, but never Pedro money. His desire to pitch could very well just be an effort to squeeze every last dime from his shoulder and elbow before they blow out again.

Martinez once pitched in a play off game with his labrum hanging on a thread... he's a proud son of a bitch (to a fault) and likely will be fishing this season because he's too damn proud to take a contract for anything less than (as he sees it) an inferior Smoltz.


For the record, I like both pitchers a lot but would be shocked if either managed to put up any meaningful innings (over 120 let's say) this year.

voodoochile
03-11-2009, 12:39 PM
Yeah like when Colon refused to pitch in the bullpen during the play offs last season forcing his team to release him. Eye of the Tiger and such.

This is a very childish way to evaluate the situation. Pedro Martinez is a very intelligent guy, he's made a ton of investments in the Dominican and is a god there. Additionally, he's made well over 100 million dollars over his career.

Colon on the other hand has made a great deal of money himself, but never Pedro money. His desire to pitch could very well just be an effort to squeeze every last dime from his shoulder and elbow before they blow out again.

Martinez once pitched in a play off game with his labrum hanging on a thread... he's a proud son of a bitch (to a fault) and likely will be fishing this season because he's too damn proud to take a contract for anything less than (as he sees it) an inferior Smoltz.

Okay, maybe the Colon example isn't the best. I still don't want to sign a guy who will only play for a big contract - especially one who is showing signs of breaking down (as you pointed out). I will take a flier on a guy who is willing to work for small bucks for a chance to prove himself.

If that makes me childish, so be it, but in the future, please refrain from name calling. It's something we frown on around these parts.

Billy Ashley
03-11-2009, 01:13 PM
Okay, maybe the Colon example isn't the best. I still don't want to sign a guy who will only play for a big contract - especially one who is showing signs of breaking down (as you pointed out). I will take a flier on a guy who is willing to work for small bucks for a chance to prove himself.

If that makes me childish, so be it, but in the future, please refrain from name calling. It's something we frown on around these parts.

Fair enough, I'll remember that when I invariably get called a number of names for mentioning VORP, WARP, Win Shares, and so on.

I actually think Colon is a much better signing, because he's cheaper and is more likely to remain relatively healthy compared to Martinez.

asindc
03-11-2009, 01:28 PM
Fair enough, I'll remember that when I invariably get called a number of names for mentioning VORP, WARP, Win Shares, and so on.

I actually think Colon is a much better signing, because he's cheaper and is more likely to remain relatively healthy compared to Martinez.

I am not one to call names to make my point, but I will say that you invite contempt by referring to Moneyball concepts around these parts.:smile:

As for Pedro, I agree with everyone who says he is not worth the money he is asking for. Besides, he has stated that he wants to stay in the NL, and who can blame him. He might get lit up like a Christmas tree if he pitches in the AL.

EndemicSox
03-11-2009, 01:49 PM
He may have put up good numbers in the WBC, but opponents(Netherlands both times I believe) were hitting the ball very hard when they made contact. Pedro's an all-time great, but I'll pass at this point in time.

Billy Ashley
03-11-2009, 02:20 PM
I am not one to call names to make my point, but I will say that you invite contempt by referring to Moneyball concepts around these parts.:smile:

As for Pedro, I agree with everyone who says he is not worth the money he is asking for. Besides, he has stated that he wants to stay in the NL, and who can blame him. He might get lit up like a Christmas tree if he pitches in the AL.

1 little nitpick, I've never read Moneyball but I don't believe they discuss much sabermetrics. The point of moneyball is that Billy Beane is able to compete despite his limited resources due to the fact that he targets undervalued assets. At the time of the book's release, OBP was undervalued. Now, just about everybody with an IQ over 70 understands the drawbacks of batting average as opposed to OBP. It's no longer undervalued.

The main reason a team should avoid Pedro Martinez is that he's so unlikely to bitch 150 innings this season. Clearly a move to the AL would make it harder for him to be successful, but not any more than say Colon. The problem is that, again, he'll likely spend so little time for it to matter- even if the results are equal to what he did for the Mets in 05.

asindc
03-11-2009, 03:10 PM
1 little nitpick, I've never read Moneyball but I don't believe they discuss much sabermetrics. The point of moneyball is that Billy Beane is able to compete despite his limited resources due to the fact that he targets undervalued assets. At the time of the book's release, OBP was undervalued. Now, just about everybody with an IQ over 70 understands the drawbacks of batting average as opposed to OBP. It's no longer undervalued.

The main reason a team should avoid Pedro Martinez is that he's so unlikely to bitch 150 innings this season. Clearly a move to the AL would make it harder for him to be successful, but not any more than say Colon. The problem is that, again, he'll likely spend so little time for it to matter- even if the results are equal to what he did for the Mets in 05.

Point taken. I do think, however, Pedro will bitch for at least 150 innings if he doesn't get to pitch at least that many.:smile:

Nellie_Fox
03-12-2009, 01:39 AM
Several posts back, a "quote function" was screwed up. Then everyone started quoting the screwed up quote, and the quote of the screwed up quote, etc.

I just cleaned up the mess, but again, if you see that you have screwed up the quote function when you post, either go to "edit" and fix it, or if you can't figure out how, delete the post and start over. And if you see a screwed up quote, don't quote it.

Frontman
03-12-2009, 11:54 PM
Who says they're not considering him?

Or already talked to him and realized he wanted more than what KW felt he was worth?

Pedro has had an great career; but if its time to go; its time to go.

Billy Ashley
03-13-2009, 12:57 AM
Point taken. I do think, however, Pedro will bitch for at least 150 innings if he doesn't get to pitch at least that many.:smile:

Wow, typo of my life. Man, I hate laptop keyboards. Sorry about that.