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View Full Version : Crasnick article on Sox youth movement


RockyMtnSoxFan
03-03-2009, 02:39 PM
I haven't seen this posted anywhere else yet, but there is an article (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/spring2009/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&id=3948072) on ESPN about the White Sox getting younger and the old guys feeling threatened.

I wouldn't mention it except that there was an interesting quote from Konerko. He basically said he'd waive his 10-and-5 no trade rights if the team needed to move on. It sounded like a very classy position for him to take, and increased my respect for Konerko.

Do you think they'll take him up on it? At this point I think he's safe unless the team tanks this year and he's putting up bad numbers. For Thome and Dye, I suspect they're safe for the season, but I would be surprised if they are both here next year.

bradchifan3
03-03-2009, 02:49 PM
I haven't seen this posted anywhere else yet, but there is an article (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/spring2009/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&id=3948072) on ESPN about the White Sox getting younger and the old guys feeling threatened.

I wouldn't mention it except that there was an interesting quote from Konerko. He basically said he'd waive his 10-and-5 no trade rights if the team needed to move on. It sounded like a very classy position for him to take, and increased my respect for Konerko.

Do you think they'll take him up on it? At this point I think he's safe unless the team tanks this year and he's putting up bad numbers. For Thome and Dye, I suspect they're safe for the season, but I would be surprised if they are both here next year.


I'd hate to see Konerko go and I think we is going to be a beast this year. I could easily see the Sox moving him though. Viciendo or Flowers are probably the guys being considered as his replacement. As for Thome, don't let the door hit you. I hope they bring back Dye to DH. The guy can still hit.

guillen4life13
03-03-2009, 03:14 PM
It would be great if Dye could finish out his career here. Same with Konerko. I would hope that if Konerko is traded, the return is worth it. He's the longest tenured Sox player and it would be great if, especially in this day and age, he could go out as a White Sox. He has more or less been the team leader since 2001, taking over for Frank, Maggs and Foulke. He and Buehrle are the only holdovers from the Ron Schueler era. He will probably retire with 400+ homers.

Obviously, one of Dye/Konerko will have to go once Viciedo is ready. Depending on who performs better this year, that should be the person.

There's a good chance that, regardless of his performance this year, if next offseason is anything like this one has been, Dye may not even be offered a contract by any other teams. Who would have thought Abreu or Cabrera would have gotten what they've gotten. If the Sox can re-sign Dye at that type of a rate and he is still very potent, I would be all for it. I just hope Dye wouldn't take the pay cut as a slap in the face.

jabrch
03-03-2009, 03:19 PM
Obviously, one of Dye/Konerko will have to go once Viciedo is ready. Depending on who performs better this year, that should be the person.

Is that for sure? Isn't Viciedo a candidate to play 3B at some point in time?

RedHeadPaleHoser
03-03-2009, 03:24 PM
MOD EDIT - COPYRIGHTED TEXT

Edit - sorry Mods. Konerko has the best line in the article - right at the end.

doublem23
03-03-2009, 03:25 PM
Obviously, one of Dye/Konerko will have to go once Viciedo is ready. Depending on who performs better this year, that should be the person.


I don't see why that's so obvious considering next year, Thome will be off the books.

jabrch
03-03-2009, 03:39 PM
I don't see why that's so obvious considering next year, Thome will be off the books.


And even if they re-up Thome for a few more years, it's still possible that Viciedo ends up at 3B if Fields can't handle it.

Viciedo is 19 years old, and we have only seen him in 1/2 of a ST game. I don't think we should take anything for granted at this point in time.

bradchifan3
03-03-2009, 03:40 PM
MOD EDIT - COPYRIGHTED TEXT

Edit - sorry Mods. Konerko has the best line in the article - right at the end.

Is copying a quote copyright infringement?

doublem23
03-03-2009, 03:47 PM
Is copying a quote copyright infringement?

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1816124&postcount=2

bradchifan3
03-03-2009, 03:52 PM
http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1816124&postcount=2

Seems strict, but its not my site so I must deal with it.

Sorry for hijacking the thread. Continue on...

RedHeadPaleHoser
03-03-2009, 04:20 PM
Seems strict, but its not my site so I must deal with it.

Sorry for hijacking the thread. Continue on...

It was my bad, you didn't hijack; I should've paraphrased.

Tragg
03-03-2009, 05:59 PM
Pretty much ever veteran player who signed a contract before 1/1/09 is paid above market value. The ones who aren't are pre-arb players.
The minimum salary is probably above market for vets who make the minimum
The dynamics of the market value of salaries and the trade market will be intriguing.

34 Inch Stick
03-04-2009, 10:57 AM
And even if they re-up Thome for a few more years, .

That will not happen no matter the price or how well he performs.

Chez
03-04-2009, 11:11 AM
Leaving aside the speculation in this thread on which of the Konerko-Dye-Thome troika will be back in 2010, I thought this was a good, positive article.

jabrch
03-04-2009, 11:26 AM
That will not happen no matter the price or how well he performs.


Why? Do we have a RF or a 1B or a DH ready to play next year?

And if the market is paying guys like him what it is paying guys like Abreu, why wouldn't we consider a 1 year deal with him to see what happens while some of the guys in our system develop?

Next year is a weak class of FA.

Craig Grebeck
03-04-2009, 11:30 AM
I would very gladly keep Thome around at an incredibly discounted price to DH. I wouldn't be surprised if Dye put up a 2007-esque line this season or next.

oeo
03-04-2009, 11:32 AM
I would very gladly keep Thome around at an incredibly discounted price to DH. I wouldn't be surprised if Dye put up a 2007-esque line this season or next.

Dye was fine in 2007 once he got healthy. :shrug:

The guy has been great since 2006, despite the first half of 2007 when he was battling nagging injuries. He hasn't shown any signs of slowing down yet...

Craig Grebeck
03-04-2009, 11:45 AM
Dye was fine in 2007 once he got healthy. :shrug:

The guy has been great since 2006, despite the first half of 2007 when he was battling nagging injuries. He hasn't shown any signs of slowing down yet...
He's thirty-five and posted a not-so-nice walk rate. Knock twenty points off that average and he suddenly looks a lot worse.

All I'm saying is that I'd be surprised if he surpasses .275/.325/.515 this season.

areilly
03-04-2009, 11:46 AM
Why? Do we have a RF or a 1B or a DH ready to play next year?

Quentin is an RF by trade and Dye would make a great DH.

oeo
03-04-2009, 12:11 PM
He's thirty-five and posted a not-so-nice walk rate. Knock twenty points off that average and he suddenly looks a lot worse.

This is not the case for any other player?

Again, he hasn't shown signs of slowing down yet, and has been a consistent hitter since 2006 (other than the injury plagued first half in 2007). Yeah, he's 35, but Thome will be 39 in August and has already shown quite a bit of decline.

All I'm saying is that I'd be surprised if he surpasses .275/.325/.515 this season.

Alright, that's your opinion, but as long as he stays healthy, I think he will once again be more valuable than Big Jim.

RustyKuntz
03-04-2009, 12:13 PM
II wouldn't mention it except that there was an interesting quote from Konerko. He basically said he'd waive his 10-and-5 no trade rights if the team needed to move on. It sounded like a very classy position for him to take, and increased my respect for Konerko.

I don't understand why everyone is classifying this as such a "classy" move. He's basically saying, if the team is in the toilet and you need to trade me to a contender for prospects, please do so. Like most veterans, he doesn't want to stick around during a rebuilding process.

Don't get me wrong, I like Konerko and I don't think this is UNclassy. But let's not make this out to be anything more than it is.

Let's not forget, the whole reason we traded for Thome in the first place is because Konerko had one foot out the door to Anaheim.

oeo
03-04-2009, 12:18 PM
I don't understand why everyone is classifying this as such a "classy" move. He's basically saying, if the team is in the toilet and you need to trade me to a contender for prospects, please do so. Like most veterans, he doesn't want to stick around during a rebuilding process.

I didn't read it like that as all. I read it more as, if you're going to trade me to the west coast, then I'll accept...otherwise, I don't really have a reason. Which has been my feeling all along. Konerko doesn't say he would accept a trade anywhere, I think it has to be the right place (i.e., Arizona or LA).

Let's not forget, the whole reason we signed Thome in the first place is because Konerko had one foot out the door to Anaheim.We traded for him because we needed left-handed power. It wasn't to keep Konerko here, but it did help.

RustyKuntz
03-04-2009, 12:24 PM
We traded for him because we needed left-handed power. It wasn't to keep Konerko here, but it did help.

Actually, my interpretation was that if Konerko left for Anaheim after 2005, Thome would play 1st base and Thomas would DH. Once Konerko resigned, Thomas became expendable.

They didn't trade for Thome to keep Konerko here. They acquired him to fill Konerko's spot.

oeo
03-04-2009, 12:29 PM
Actually, my interpretation was that if Konerko left for Anaheim after 2005, Thome would play 1st base and Thomas would DH. Once Konerko resigned, Thomas became expendable.

They didn't trade for Thome to keep Konerko here. They acquired him to fill Konerko's spot.

Judging by the comments from our GM about Thomas after his departure, he was good as gone.

I've never heard this interpretation before.

EDIT: I just looked back, and you're way off. Frank's option was declined on November 5th, and the Thome deal didn't come until the 25th.

areilly
03-04-2009, 12:36 PM
We traded for him because we needed left-handed power. It wasn't to keep Konerko here, but it did help.

Where oh WHERE IS THAT KID WITH THE SUPER-SECRET INSIDER INFO ON THE THOME ACQUISITION?

RustyKuntz
03-04-2009, 12:40 PM
Where oh WHERE IS THAT KID WITH THE SUPER-SECRET INSIDER INFO ON THE THOME ACQUISITION?

As I stated.....just my interpretation at the time.

Sadly, the White Sox front office has never called me for any advise.

...yet. :smile:

RustyKuntz
03-04-2009, 12:42 PM
I just looked back, and you're way off. Frank's option was declined on November 5th, and the Thome deal didn't come until the 25th.

Stupid facts. Always getting in the way of a good argument.

To be honest, this is the first opinion I've ever had that wasn't me just restating what someone else said. I've learned my lesson.

oeo
03-04-2009, 12:46 PM
Stupid facts. Always getting in the way of a good argument.

To be honest, this is the first opinion I've ever had that wasn't me just restating what someone else said. I've learned my lesson.

Frank still could have been re-signed later, but again, Kenny does not like Frank. For that fact, I think he was gone no matter what (Thome, no thome; Konerko, no Konerko). Who would have played first base if Konerko had left, I don't know (maybe Ross Gload *shudders*). Kenny also had that defending World Champs thing going for him that offseason, which is why plans probably worked out so well.

russ99
03-04-2009, 12:59 PM
Why? Do we have a RF or a 1B or a DH ready to play next year?


Brandon Allen. Remember that name. He'll be starting at one of those 2 fielding positions by 2011.

IMO, Depending on how the Sox do this year could mean keeping or ditching members of the "big three". If the Sox contend, let's keep the gang around for another year. If they fall apart, at least one will be dealt at the deadline and I'd doubt if Thome would be brought back.

jabrch
03-04-2009, 01:01 PM
Brandon Allen. Remember that name. He'll be starting at one of those 2 fielding positions by 2011.

IMO, Depending on how the Sox do this year could mean keeping or ditching members of the "big three". If the Sox contend, let's keep the gang around for another year. If they fall apart, at least 1 will be dealt at the deadline.


Allen is an option...but by no means is he a lock to replace Thome next season.

russ99
03-04-2009, 01:04 PM
Allen is an option...but by no means is he a lock to replace Thome next season.

I said 2011, no bets for next season... Also, I doubt they'd put Allen in as DH. I'd assume the leftover of the "big three" would hit there.

jabrch
03-04-2009, 02:03 PM
I said 2011, no bets for next season... Also, I doubt they'd put Allen in as DH. I'd assume the leftover of the "big three" would hit there.

I know - but we were discussing next year.

and I agree - Allen likely isn't a DH.

EndemicSox
03-04-2009, 04:23 PM
If for some horrible reason the Sox stink this season, I expect Konerko to be moved to make room for the Cuban Pimp/Tank/Whatever. I don't see 3B in his future, but hopefully his bat is good/powerful enough to become a fixture at DH/1B. If Konerko isn't moved, Dye will be...unless Viceado tanks in AA, or wherever they place him this season. Anyway, I think Kenny Williams likes the position he has put the Sox in, as do I!