PDA

View Full Version : Jose Contreras is already throwing off a mound!


gf2020
01-16-2009, 10:41 PM
So says Ken Rosenthal in this piece. (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9090020/Why-aren%27t-teams-calling-for-Hudson)

Are we going to actually witness the resurrection of JC? Obviously, the team can't count or depend on him at all until he proves healthy, but that's still pretty impressive given his original prognosis.

Domeshot17
01-16-2009, 10:43 PM
So says Ken Rosenthal in this piece. (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9090020/Why-aren%27t-teams-calling-for-Hudson)

Are we going to actually witness the resurrection of JC? Obviously, the team can't count or depend on him at all until he proves healthy, but that's still pretty impressive given his original prognosis.

hey we finally agree on something!

In all seriousness, if we can roll the dice Colon can give us 15 starts of good ball in the first half and Jose can give us 15 good in the 2nd half, we could have a nice split roll in the 4 spot.

Tragg
01-16-2009, 10:50 PM
Getting Jose healthy is step 1.
Getting him to pitch well is something else....he was okay in 2008 until the injury; he was awful in 2007.
Okay would be fine for 5th starter.

SoxSpeed22
01-16-2009, 10:52 PM
Throwing off of the mound is a lot of progress. Running will be the biggest concern with Jose after his injury. But I am very happy with his progress. I thought that his career would be over given his age and the severity of the injury. Hopefully he will help us in the second half.

PaleHoser
01-16-2009, 11:20 PM
This is encouraging news.

Mobility will be the key. If I was the opposing team I would bunt relentlessly until he could prove that he could field his position.

DSpivack
01-16-2009, 11:23 PM
So says Ken Rosenthal in this piece. (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9090020/Why-aren%27t-teams-calling-for-Hudson)

Are we going to actually witness the resurrection of JC? Obviously, the team can't count or depend on him at all until he proves healthy, but that's still pretty impressive given his original prognosis.

Hah.

cburns
01-16-2009, 11:47 PM
If I was the opposing team I would bunt relentlessly until he could prove that he could field his position.

He couldn't field his position before the injury.

DirtySox
01-17-2009, 12:22 AM
There is an article just put up on Whitesox.com about this as well:

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090116&content_id=3748269&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

102605
01-17-2009, 12:30 AM
Jose is one of my favs. It doesn't surprise me that he is pushing himself to play again.

The game he went down I said I thought that was the last I have ever seen of him.

drewcifer
01-17-2009, 12:32 AM
Great news - It'd be great to have him ready to contribute early. This rotation blows for a 162 game set. Only 1 sure thing - the rest are 1 year wonders and maybes.

1989
01-17-2009, 12:51 AM
So says Ken Rosenthal in this piece. (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9090020/Why-aren%27t-teams-calling-for-Hudson)

Are we going to actually witness the resurrection of JC? Obviously, the team can't count or depend on him at all until he proves healthy, but that's still pretty impressive given his original prognosis.

I'm writing him off. At the point of his injury last year, his production was falling off and wasn't contributing much. Add an achilles' tendon tear and at his age, I just don't think he has anything left. I hope he proves me wrong

DaveFeelsRight
01-17-2009, 01:03 AM
i dont want jose to rush back. i want him to take his time.

...
01-17-2009, 01:05 AM
Great news - It'd be great to have him ready to contribute early. This rotation blows for a 162 game set. Only 1 sure thing - the rest are 1 year wonders and maybes.

:rolleyes:

Your opinions blow 365 days of the year.

DumpJerry
01-17-2009, 10:59 AM
Great news - It'd be great to have him ready to contribute early. This rotation blows for a 162 game set. Only 1 sure thing - the rest are 1 year wonders and maybes.

Seeing as how our rotation is not yet established, I fail to see how you can already assess it.

:rolleyes:

Your opinions blow 365 days of the year.
Do everyone a favor. Substantive criticisms of other posters' opinions from now on. Ok?

Lip Man 1
01-17-2009, 11:23 AM
If Jose can come back and do anything positive, great. But as others have said (Tragg?) he was mediocre and seeing stints on the DL in the previous years since that lower back / nerve injury in May 2006.

I can certainly understand why the Sox would like to give him a shot, they'd like to get something for ten million dollars but they need to be careful...don't just give him a shot because he's owed money if he simply isn't any good anymore.

Lip

cards press box
01-17-2009, 11:35 AM
The Rosenthal article says that the Sox are considering bringing Freddy Garcia back as well to compete in spring training for a spot in the starting rotation. I like the idea of bringing Freddy and Bartolo Colon back to compete with the young pitchers the Sox have for the 4th and 5th slots in the rotation.

Competition is good.

...
01-17-2009, 11:37 AM
Seeing as how our rotation is not yet established, I fail to see how you can already assess it.


Do everyone a favor. Substantive criticisms of other posters' opinions from now on. Ok?

Sure.

DickAllen72
01-17-2009, 11:39 AM
Jose is one of my favs. It doesn't surprise me that he is pushing himself to play again.

The game he went down I said I thought that was the last I have ever seen of him.
Jose Contreras is one of my favorites as well. If anybody can come back from this type of injury, he'll do it. He's a man amongst men.

asindc
01-17-2009, 12:13 PM
I ruptured my Achilles when I was 39 years old. After 2.5 months in a cast, two months of physical therapy, I was walking normally. I'm not surprised by this. I assume the "after the all-star break" prediction is meant to give him time to get into baseball shape.

EMel9281
01-17-2009, 12:22 PM
:rolleyes:

Your opinions blow 365 days of the year.


Seriously, is this necessary? Posts like this (and people like you) make me shy away more and more from this site.

But, back to Jose, good luck to him. I hope he can come back, and if he does, great. If he doesn't, I'd be fine with that. He can be so inconsistent that I'd rather have a young, unproven guy on the hill learning to master his craft and someone riding off to the sunset getting shelled.

thedudeabides
01-17-2009, 01:58 PM
If Jose can come back and do anything positive, great. But as others have said (Tragg?) he was mediocre and seeing stints on the DL in the previous years since that lower back / nerve injury in May 2006.

I can certainly understand why the Sox would like to give him a shot, they'd like to get something for ten million dollars but they need to be careful...don't just give him a shot because he's owed money if he simply isn't any good anymore.

Lip

That's true Lip, but he was pitching very well into June until his elbow flared up. You hope the time off will help the rest of his body recuperate. The article also says he has lost 25 pounds, which is always good for back problems.

I'm just excited to have the possibility of him contributing this year. You can never have enough arms, and he has shown he can put a few really good months together.

Heffalump
01-17-2009, 03:36 PM
Great news - It'd be great to have him ready to contribute early. This rotation blows for a 162 game set. Only 1 sure thing - the rest are 1 year wonders and maybes.


Boy, you sure know your baseball.

Nellie_Fox
01-17-2009, 03:43 PM
Do we have to go back to issuing bans? Personal attacks are starting to increase again. Knock it off.

DoItForDanPasqua
01-17-2009, 03:59 PM
If Contreras is able to come back, here's what the Sox have. Floyd and Danks are interchangeable as two or three.

1) Buehrle is the Sox most reliable starter and close to an ace.
2) Danks is coming off his first solid season as a big league starter. It is essential that he repeats last year's performance if the Sox hope to compete.
3) Floyd: see Danks.
4) Contreras was a key part of the Sox first half success last year. You can't expect him to repeat what he did in the second half of 2005, but I would think he may have another solid season left in him.
5) Colon. If he's healthy he could be the best fifth starter in the league.

Looking at this rotation does give me some hope. Four of the five starters have some sort of question mark and they are huge at the bottom of the rotation. At least, though, there is a scenario where this could work out to be a good staff.

...
01-17-2009, 04:00 PM
Seriously, is this necessary? Posts like this (and people like you) make me shy away more and more from this site.

But, back to Jose, good luck to him. I hope he can come back, and if he does, great. If he doesn't, I'd be fine with that. He can be so inconsistent that I'd rather have a young, unproven guy on the hill learning to master his craft and someone riding off to the sunset getting shelled.

Is the truth necessary?

sunofgold
01-17-2009, 04:24 PM
Alright Jesus...I mean Jose Contreras. One of the hardest working pitcher on the planet. We want you dude. We need you dude.

TornLabrum
01-17-2009, 06:38 PM
Is the truth necessary?

Truth is one thing. Personally attacking someone for their opinion is another. The personal attacks will stop. I hope that's clearly understood.

soxfanreggie
01-17-2009, 07:26 PM
That's great news, thanks for sharing. This could add something to the staff later in the season, an injection of something...not sure what. Hopefully they can get him on progress to make some starts at each minor league level before he sees if he can come back to the show.

thomas35forever
01-17-2009, 09:10 PM
This is great to hear. I honestly never thought I'd see him in a White Sox uniform again, but if he keeps this up, it would be great to have him back. Just having him pitch with us once again would be a comeback. Pitching like the player of old would be even better. I'm not expecting anything big right now, but he should take all the time he needs. At his age (could be 50 for all I know), slow is the way to go. One more injury could shut him down for good.

Go Jose!

whitesox901
01-17-2009, 09:38 PM
hey we finally agree on something!

In all seriousness, if we can roll the dice Colon can give us 15 starts of good ball in the first half and Jose can give us 15 good in the 2nd half, we could have a nice split roll in the 4 spot.

Agreed

SoxNation05
01-17-2009, 10:36 PM
If Contreras is able to come back, here's what the Sox have. Floyd and Danks are interchangeable as two or three.

1) Buehrle is the Sox most reliable starter and close to an ace.
2) Danks is coming off his first solid season as a big league starter. It is essential that he repeats last year's performance if the Sox hope to compete.
3) Floyd: see Danks.
4) Contreras was a key part of the Sox first season success last year. You can't expect him to repeat what he did in the second half of 2005, but I would think he may have another solid season left in him.
5) Colon. If he's healthy he could be the best fifth starter in the league.

Looking at this rotation does give me some hope. Four of the five starters have some sort of question mark and they are huge at the bottom of the rotation. At least, though, there is a scenario where this could work out to be a good staff.

Red Sox
1. Lester
2. Matsuzaka
3. Beckett
4. Smoltz
5. Penny- Younger, more upside. 1 year removed from great pitching.

Angels
1. Lackey
2. Santana
3. Saunders
4. Escobar
5. Weaver- Trememndous upside, consistently an average starter.

Cubs
1. Zambrano
2. Harden
3. Dempster
4. Lilly
5. Marshall- Proven he can stay healthy, entering prime

Braves
1. Lowe
2. Jurrjens
3. Vazquez
4. Hudson
5. Kawakami/ Hanson- Both have more upside Kawakami pitched well in Japan and Tommy Hanson absolutely domminate the AFL.

That is off the top of my head I am sure there are other cases of team's having a stronger No. 5. Also, if Contreras were to be ready, which he is not, you would have to think Colon, who is less fragile would have to be the 4 and Jose at 5.

havelj
01-18-2009, 04:53 PM
This is great news. He's contribution this year is all gravy. I would love to see him get us 8 wins.

rdivaldi
01-18-2009, 05:48 PM
Red Sox
1. Lester
2. Matsuzaka
3. Beckett
4. Smoltz
5. Penny- Younger, more upside. 1 year removed from great pitching.

Cubs
1. Zambrano
2. Harden
3. Dempster
4. Lilly
5. Marshall- Proven he can stay healthy, entering prime


Considering Smoltz's age/injuries & Penny's age/injuries that Red Sox projection will be very different by the middle of season. As for the Flubs, well you may as well write that one off, Harden will likely never be healthy.

Tragg
01-18-2009, 09:09 PM
4) Contreras was a key part of the Sox first season success last year.

I'm not sure what the means exactly, but IF Jose can come back healthy and deliver a 4.5 ERA, that would be great...if Colon can do it too, it would be better. We'd essentially have 2 5th starters and no fourth, but that's would be okay.
And our pen should be a lot better...that pitcher that we got from the Yanks plus Richard the pen should be a nice improvement.

NLaloosh
01-19-2009, 09:34 AM
1. I think Contreras can come back and pitch well for the Sox in the second half even if it's out of the pen.

2. I think that it would be wise for the Sox to sign Garcia to a contract as well as the Cuban, Marti. Depth will be very important here throughout the season.

3. Marquez, Poreda, Broadway and whomever they get if they trade Dye will need more seasoning in Charlotte. Let them force their way onto the team.

4. Richard's best role right now would probably be out of the pen anyway as a second lefty and a long man/ spot starter.

hawkjt
01-19-2009, 06:02 PM
So much rooting for Jose to make it back...I like the guy a lot.
I honestly think he was going to have a good finish last year if that injury had not happened.
Go JOSE!!!!

bechtel129
01-20-2009, 10:34 PM
Do everyone a favor. Substantive criticisms of other posters' opinions from now on. Ok?

Thank you kind sir, today you have motivated me to look up the word "Substantive". Interestingly enough, I also had to use to dictionary's audio function for help with pronunciation-gotta love M-Webster's.

"WSI, making it's members slightly smarter, little by little, day by day."

Pinar_del_Rio_WS
01-22-2009, 10:00 AM
He is still the Bronze Titan and will do his best to comeback.

on anyway if WS need another starter try to put an eye on Yuniesky Maya (27 YO) in the next World Baseball Classic, he is now 7W - 1L and 1.01 ERA in 9 starts for Pinar del Rio in the Cuban National Championship

drewcifer
01-23-2009, 03:08 AM
:rolleyes:

Your opinions blow 365 days of the year.

Wow - I hardly post but thanks for the recognition.


Anyway, can you back up your mouth or just ... (you)

We've got Buehrle (solid), Danks (1 good year), (Floyd) - (1 finally good year), and the rest are question marks. that is what it is!

If you disagree fine - show me. Colon isn't it and wasn't even signed when you decided to puff your chest.

Sorry for being so late to respond to your ineffective point, but I've been busy.

Boy, you sure know your baseball.

I know the White Sox. If you stick with it, you will too.

Lefty34
01-23-2009, 09:16 PM
I have been away for awhile, and I'm sorry if I'm asking a question already answered, but what is Contreras actually coming back from?

I personally don't like Contreras, and his WHIP's for the past two years have been sub-par, on top of the fact that he is 36, but I really don't see a better option for the Sox in terms of someone in the rotation.

Huisj
01-23-2009, 09:53 PM
I have been away for awhile, and I'm sorry if I'm asking a question already answered, but what is Contreras actually coming back from?

I personally don't like Contreras, and his WHIP's for the past two years have been sub-par, on top of the fact that he is 36, but I really don't see a better option for the Sox in terms of someone in the rotation.

Tore his achilles tendon running to cover first base in the middle of last season. Nasty looking injury--it was like his foot was sticking out in a completely wrong direction.

central44
01-23-2009, 10:22 PM
yeah, scary stuff....36(+) year olds shouldn't be able to come back from a torn achillies. Really, it's hard to do at any age, but at Jose's? That just shows what kind of work ethic he has.

If we could get Jose back by the All Star Break, it would help, but Jose is no savior. It's hard to imagine him pitching as well as he was last season before that injury (not the achilles, the shoulder thing we found out about after he went from being unhittable to getting lit up every time out).

FedEx227
01-24-2009, 06:53 PM
I was there live, it was pretty nasty looking down at his foot you could see it was not pointed in the right direction.

sunofgold
02-16-2009, 01:22 PM
He lost at least 30 lbs. Could be ready to pitch earlier than expected. That would be a huge boost.

VeeckAsInWreck
02-16-2009, 01:29 PM
It would be a boost but I'd rather he hold off and come back at 100%. That way if we're still in contention after the all-star break he'd be an even bigger boost.

102605
02-16-2009, 01:31 PM
I thought we saw his last pitch when the injury happened. Props to Jose for working hard to get back to playing again. He has always been one of my favorites.

Lip Man 1
02-16-2009, 05:58 PM
If he can make it back and more importantly, pitch with some effectiveness (unlike most of his time with the club from July 06 on) then THAT would be a big help.

You have to have both parts, not just the fact that he can throw from a mound in a game.

Lip

JermaineDye05
02-16-2009, 09:32 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=200902163837274&c_id=cws

Someone else mentioned that he's lost 30 lbs. He looks in great shape from a short clip they have during this Ozzie interview. Hopefully they don't rush him, he could be a big surprise.

Frater Perdurabo
02-16-2009, 09:52 PM
He looks more like Alexei! :tongue:

WhiteSox1989
02-16-2009, 10:11 PM
Contreras looks good.

I like Ozzie's shirt.

WhiteSox5187
02-16-2009, 11:34 PM
If he can make it back and more importantly, pitch with some effectiveness (unlike most of his time with the club from July 06 on) then THAT would be a big help.

You have to have both parts, not just the fact that he can throw from a mound in a game.

Lip
He was pretty good in '08. If he hadn't gotten hurt (and he looked pretty good that game he went down in), I think we clinch in mid-September and would have been a much tougher opponent for Tampa.

WhiteSox1989
02-17-2009, 07:21 AM
He was pretty good in '08. If he hadn't gotten hurt (and he looked pretty good that game he went down in), I think we clinch in mid-September and would have been a much tougher opponent for Tampa.

I agree. That made the game even more painful to watch, because Contreras came out and was pitching so well.

He was pitching incredibly well in the beginning of 2008 too. Then he got hurt.

Lip Man 1
02-17-2009, 12:34 PM
According to Retrosheet, Contreras has a record of 25-32 since June 1, 2006 with the Sox and has been on the DL at least three times for various ailments.

With respect I stand by my original statement.

Lip

doublem23
02-17-2009, 12:41 PM
According to Retrosheet, Contreras has a record of 25-32 since June 1, 2006 with the Sox and has been on the DL at least three times for various ailments.

With respect I stand by my original statement.

Lip

Whose manipulating stats to back their argument now?

Jose was up and down in 2008, but overall he was fine. If he can give the Sox 121 innings of 4.50 ERA pitching, I'll be ecstatic.

oeo
02-17-2009, 12:43 PM
Whose manipulating stats to back their argument now?

Jose was up and down in 2008, but overall he was fine. If he can give the Sox 121 innings of 4.50 ERA pitching, I'll be ecstatic.

Jose was our ace in 2008 until he started having problems, and he was pitching for over a month with an injury.

I have no question, based on his performance early last year, that Jose can be dominant if he's healthy. If he's not, then we'll probably have problems.

doublem23
02-17-2009, 12:49 PM
Jose was our ace in 2008 until he started having problems, and he was pitching for over a month with an injury.

I have no question, based on his performance early last year, that Jose can be dominant if he's healthy. If he's not, then we'll probably have problems.

Yeah, I think people really forget how good he was pitching because one of those games he blew up was during the sweep at Wrigley (I know that's true for me). After kind of a rocky start, he had a great run from mid-April to June.

10 G, 1 CG, 6-2, 70 IP, 48 H, 14 BB, 46 K, 2.19 ERA, .191 BAA

oeo
02-17-2009, 12:51 PM
Yeah, I think people really forget how good he was pitching because one of those games he blew up was during the sweept at Wrigley. After kind of a rocky start, he had a great run from mid-April to June.

10 G, 1 CG, 6-2, 70 IP, 48 H, 14 BB, 46 K, 2.19 ERA, .191 BAA

I'm reminded most of his game against the Angels the night before Memorial Day. His forkball was working so well that night, and he matched Lackey pitch-for-pitch. I said to myself, "Jose is back."

soxfanreggie
02-17-2009, 01:42 PM
Just heard that Jose has lost 30+ lbs and is going to throw some (not yet off a mound). Great job Jose...great offseason work. We're proud of you!

Can you please introduce Bartolo to your workout/diet?

Lip Man 1
02-17-2009, 05:34 PM
Double:

I chose June 1, 2006 because that was shortly after his first serious injury, the lower back / nerve condition that put him on the DL for a little while before that date. Not trying to manipulate anything. That was the start of the time period when he started to go on the DL fairly regularly.

He has not been the same pitcher that he was before that date, it seems pretty clear.

Maybe our definitions of being "effective" are different. To me a sub .500 record and a mid 4's to high 4's ERA doesn't warrant that moniker. (especially when you are making ten million a year...)

Lip

asindc
02-17-2009, 05:48 PM
I'm reminded most of his game against the Angels the night before Memorial Day. His forkball was working so well that night, and he matched Lackey pitch-for-pitch. I said to myself, "Jose is back."

When I think of how well Jose pitched at times last year, that is the game that first comes to mind. If he can get back to at least 90% of that with consistency, I would take it.

doublem23
02-17-2009, 05:57 PM
He has not been the same pitcher that he was before that date, it seems pretty clear.

Maybe our definitions of being "effective" are different. To me a sub .500 record and a mid 4's to high 4's ERA doesn't warrant that moniker. (especially when you are making ten million a year...)

Lip

What he makes is irrelevant to this discussion. You're not awarded or deducted runs based on your salary. I never said Jose was going to regain his status as a frontline starter, but I don't think he's washed up and should be written off. As I pointed out, he had a nice stretch of 10 straight starts in early 2008 (which surprisingly coincides when he was healthy) when he was very effective, and yes, his 2008 season ended poorly, but overall, his performance was decent. I'm sure back in the day, an ERA in the 4's would get you a bus trip back to AAA, but in today's game that's not too shabby, especially from a guy who, at most, will be counted on to be a 4th starter.

I repeat that if Jose can reproduce his 2008 line of 121 IP with an ERA in the 4's, the Sox will be much better off for it.

Konerko05
02-17-2009, 06:08 PM
Yeah, I think people really forget how good he was pitching because one of those games he blew up was during the sweep at Wrigley (I know that's true for me). After kind of a rocky start, he had a great run from mid-April to June.

10 G, 1 CG, 6-2, 70 IP, 48 H, 14 BB, 46 K, 2.19 ERA, .191 BAA

After reading your post, I decided to check out Conteras' career splits. This seems to be the pattern throughout Conteras' career.

He starts off April pitching well, gets stronger in May, falls off in June, pitches worse in July, then gets back on track for August and September.

April 4.09
May 3.23
June 5.58
July 6.66
Aug. 4.29
Sept. 3.62

I checked year by year and this pattern is pretty consistent. His arm must tire out in the middle of the year. Maybe the weight he lost could help him stay strong through the entire year.

ode to veeck
02-17-2009, 08:48 PM
After reading your post, I decided to check out Conteras' career splits. This seems to be the pattern throughout Conteras' career.

He starts off April pitching well, gets stronger in May, falls off in June, pitches worse in July, then gets back on track for August and September.

April 4.09
May 3.23
June 5.58
July 6.66
Aug. 4.29
Sept. 3.62

I checked year by year and this pattern is pretty consistent. His arm must tire out in the middle of the year. Maybe the weight he lost could help him stay strong through the entire year.


in '05 he was struggling eary then stopped shaking AJ off arond June and got better as the season went on, arguably the most unstoppable pitcher near the end of the season and through the playoffs

Konerko05
02-17-2009, 09:09 PM
in '05 he was struggling eary then stopped shaking AJ off arond June and got better as the season went on, arguably the most unstoppable pitcher near the end of the season and through the playoffs

2005 basically shows the same exact pattern.

April 3.04
May 3.51
June 5.81
July 5.71
Aug. 2.14
Sept. 1.99

You're right about the last two months though. Instead of just pitching well, he was dominant.

He was horrible again in June and July.

Chez
02-18-2009, 08:57 AM
While I'm happy for Contreras, a large part of me was hoping that his injury status would provide us with the opportunity to see just what we've got with Marquez, Broadway, Richard, and (to a lesser extent) Poreda. I think Poreda is still a year away from the rotation and Richard is better suited for the bullpen, but Jose's early comeback means fewer opportunities for the younger guys. I know "you can never have too much pitching (blah, blah, blah)," but sometimes you got to give guys a chance (other than in Spring Training) to see what you've got.

guillensdisciple
02-18-2009, 09:02 AM
While I'm happy for Contreras, a large part of me was hoping that his injury status would provide us with the opportunity to see just what we've got with Marquez, Broadway, Richard, and (to a lesser extent) Poreda. I think Poreda is still a year away from the rotation and Richard is better suited for the bullpen, but Jose's early comeback means fewer opportunities for the younger guys. I know "you can never have too much pitching (blah, blah, blah)," but sometimes you got to give guys a chance (other than in Spring Training) to see what you've got.

What better way to see what they've got from the bullpen? As far as I am concerned Broadway has had a fair enough chance. Marquez and Richard will get their chances. Poreda will probably be the most affected by this because he has an outside chance of getting in. In his case that is fine since he still needs fine tuning with his breaking stuff and perhaps another sting in the minors will get that figured out.

voodoochile
02-18-2009, 10:03 AM
While I'm happy for Contreras, a large part of me was hoping that his injury status would provide us with the opportunity to see just what we've got with Marquez, Broadway, Richard, and (to a lesser extent) Poreda. I think Poreda is still a year away from the rotation and Richard is better suited for the bullpen, but Jose's early comeback means fewer opportunities for the younger guys. I know "you can never have too much pitching (blah, blah, blah)," but sometimes you got to give guys a chance (other than in Spring Training) to see what you've got.

Early comeback or not. JC won't be pitching in game situations for at least a few months. June is the earliest I would imagine. That gives two months for the kids to prove themselves.

AZChiSoxFan
02-18-2009, 10:18 AM
Whose manipulating stats to back their argument now?



I hope Kittle42 doesn't read this.

thedudeabides
02-18-2009, 10:48 AM
While I'm happy for Contreras, a large part of me was hoping that his injury status would provide us with the opportunity to see just what we've got with Marquez, Broadway, Richard, and (to a lesser extent) Poreda. I think Poreda is still a year away from the rotation and Richard is better suited for the bullpen, but Jose's early comeback means fewer opportunities for the younger guys. I know "you can never have too much pitching (blah, blah, blah)," but sometimes you got to give guys a chance (other than in Spring Training) to see what you've got.

Bartolo and Jose are question marks to even start the season on time, let alone make all of their scheduled starts for the year. The young guys will have their chance.

And if some miracle happens and those two stay healthy and effective all year, I'll gladly wait another year to see the young guys.

Huisj
02-18-2009, 11:47 AM
2005 basically shows the same exact pattern.

April 3.04
May 3.51
June 5.81
July 5.71
Aug. 2.14
Sept. 1.99

You're right about the last two months though. Instead of just pitching well, he was dominant.

He was horrible again in June and July.

The June and July ERAs don't tell the entire story though. He was starting to show flashes of being good through that stretch at times too. In June he put together 3 quality starts out of 5, and the worst start he had that month was when he gave up 6 runs to AZ in the second inning. I vaguely remember that game, and it was like after that inning, something clicked and his splitter suddenly got nasty and he pretty much cruised through 4 more innings after looking helpless in the first two.

In July he threw 7 nice shutout innings against Cleveland, and had a pretty good start in a win over Boston too. And then, yes, it all came together with consistency, and he was unreal for the next 3 months.

Sockinchisox
02-20-2009, 02:55 PM
Cowley update:

Ozzie says Jose will start a game this spring.

:o:

chisoxfanatic
02-20-2009, 03:00 PM
Cowley update:

Ozzie says Jose will start a game this spring.

:o:
I hope they're not rushing him just because, if he doesn't, there would be inexperience pitching every 5 games. I'd rather Richard pitch for a couple months and have Jose totally healed than have this happen, and then he goes down again.

cards press box
02-20-2009, 03:10 PM
I hope they're not rushing him just because, if he doesn't, there would be inexperience pitching every 5 games. I'd rather Richard pitch for a couple months and have Jose totally healed than have this happen, and then he goes down again.

I can't imagine that the Sox would let Contreras pitch until the doctors gave a green light. If Contreras is healing quickly and his arm feels good, then the Sox could have more pitching depth than anyone dreamed.

jabrch
02-20-2009, 04:22 PM
Good luck Jose....Rehab smartly!

everafan
02-20-2009, 05:00 PM
I trust the Sox medical staff. Nate Silver made a comment that one of the reasons BP is riutunely off on their Sox projections is because they remain fairly healthy - and that is not luck.

doublem23
02-20-2009, 05:11 PM
I trust the Sox medical staff. Nate Silver made a comment that one of the reasons BP is riutunely off on their Sox projections is because they remain fairly healthy - and that is not luck.

Well... It's some luck. The Sox seem to be pretty decent at keeping guys on the field from little nagging injuries, but even the best medical staffs in the world can't do much for guys with broken bones or torn tendons.

Maybe we're lucky that the guys who got hurt in 2008 stunk (Owens, Richar).

oeo
02-20-2009, 05:11 PM
I trust the Sox medical staff. Nate Silver made a comment that one of the reasons BP is riutunely off on their Sox projections is because they remain fairly healthy - and that is not luck.

Yup, Herm and Co. are the best in the business. If they say he's okay to go, I trust them.

hawkjt
02-20-2009, 06:49 PM
Ironically,one of the new bulls just acquired,Jerome James, has a ruptured achilles tendon and it is a career ender that will trigger an insurance payment for the rest of his contract...guess all achilles tendon injuries are not the same...thankfully for Jose.

WhiteSoxFan84
02-22-2009, 12:54 PM
Early comeback or not. JC won't be pitching in game situations for at least a few months. June is the earliest I would imagine. That gives two months for the kids to prove themselves.

Not quite. Kenny Williams was on "Hit & Run" this morning and was asked if he was surprised at the thought of Bartolo and Contreras breaking camp in the rotation. Kenny responded with something like:

I'm not surprised because we were given some information a while ago that told me he would be ready for the regular season. The media and the public maybe surprised, but because of the private information I knew already, I'm not surprised.

So maybe that was why he didn't consider picking up another arm aside from Bartolo. He knew all along that Contreras was going to be ready.

voodoochile
02-22-2009, 02:48 PM
Not quite. Kenny Williams was on "Hit & Run" this morning and was asked if he was surprised at the thought of Bartolo and Contreras breaking camp in the rotation. Kenny responded with something like:

I'm not surprised because we were given some information a while ago that told me he would be ready for the regular season. The media and the public maybe surprised, but because of the private information I knew already, I'm not surprised.

So maybe that was why he didn't consider picking up another arm aside from Bartolo. He knew all along that Contreras was going to be ready.

Awesome news the Sox have to be division favorites if JC can open the season as a starter.

HomeFish
02-22-2009, 02:54 PM
Awesome news the Sox have to be division favorites if JC can open the season as a starter.

Whoa there. That still leaves us with at best two proven starters. Danks and Floyd have never proven that they can pitch well more than one season, and Colon has not had a good season since 2005.

And JC has struggled occasionally too, you know.

voodoochile
02-22-2009, 02:58 PM
Whoa there. That still leaves us with at best two proven starters. Danks and Floyd have never proven that they can pitch well more than one season, and Colon has not had a good season since 2005.

And JC has struggled occasionally too, you know.

Okay, that's your opinion. I'll take my chances with that starting 5 and Richar, Marquez and Poreda waiting to step up. Depth matters and the Sox have good depth in the starting rotation.

champagne030
02-22-2009, 03:02 PM
Okay, that's your opinion. I'll take my chances with that starting 5 and Richar, Marquez and Poreda waiting to step up. Depth matters and the Sox have good depth in the starting rotation.

When did we get Danny back and he's now a pitcher? :wink:

I like those three being in the bullpen or working on their stuff in Charlotte too.

HomeFish
02-22-2009, 03:14 PM
Okay, that's your opinion. I'll take my chances with that starting 5 and Richar, Marquez and Poreda waiting to step up. Depth matters and the Sox have good depth in the starting rotation.

We had great depth in 2004 too. Danny Wright, Arnie Munoz, Jason Grilli, that other guy who came before Munoz...surely at least one of them was bound to step it up, right?

voodoochile
02-22-2009, 03:33 PM
We had great depth in 2004 too. Danny Wright, Arnie Munoz, Jason Grilli, that other guy who came before Munoz...surely at least one of them was bound to step it up, right?

Had any or them already shown the ability to pitch in the bigs before? Richar actually has.

Corlose 15
02-22-2009, 03:39 PM
We had great depth in 2004 too. Danny Wright, Arnie Munoz, Jason Grilli, that other guy who came before Munoz...surely at least one of them was bound to step it up, right?

I get your schtick, you are compelled to be as absolutely pessimistic as possible, but I'll take the resume of Contreras, and Colon along with the potential of Richard and Marquez over that of Munoz, Stewart, Grilli, Shoeneweis, and an injured Danny Wright.

jabrch
02-22-2009, 03:45 PM
I get your schtick, you are compelled to be as absolutely pessimistic as possible, but I'll take the resume of Contreras, and Colon along with the potential of Richard and Marquez over that of Munoz, Stewart, Grilli, Shoeneweis, and an injured Danny Wright.

And regardless - the fact that those guys failed has nothing to do with this class.

The logic is no better to say that because Robin and Frank became stars, so will Fields and Allen.

Evaluate each player on his own - there's no reason Richard, Poreda or anyone needs to carry the burden of Munoz and Wright.