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View Full Version : What's Kenny Doing?


russ99
12-11-2008, 09:36 AM
KW's throwing all kinds of statements out and no one has any clue what's he's doing. Your take?

Tragg
12-11-2008, 09:38 AM
a bunch of red herrings (I hope)

champagne030
12-11-2008, 09:41 AM
KW's throwing all kinds of statements out and no one has any clue what's he's doing. Your take?

Confuse them with bull****, Jerry's stuffing his pockets, or we're really going through a rebuilding project.

I'd like to think he's waiting for the dust to settle and then trying to pick up some useful parts for 2009 on the cheap, but who knows.

doublem23
12-11-2008, 09:43 AM
Were is the "The season doesn't start for another 3 1/2 months, so I haven't made up my mind yet" option?

Jim Shorts
12-11-2008, 09:44 AM
I'd like to think he's waiting for the dust to settle and then trying to pick up some useful parts for 2009 on the cheap, but who knows.

That's what I'm thinking as well. Seven years for CC, Peavy going to net an entire farm system in return; the market has gotten insane and will get back to more pedestrian levels after Manny and Tex sign.

Marqhead
12-11-2008, 09:47 AM
Probably trying to move the team to Tampa.

nevr say dye sox
12-11-2008, 09:49 AM
Doesn't seem like KW was right when he said the market would correct itself after Zito got the big deal. Salaries and years have only got bigger and longer.

Domeshot17
12-11-2008, 09:59 AM
I fell somewhere between going young and he has no idea. Every year he expects the Market to correct itself, but it doesn't. This year it was expected salaries would be lower because of the economy, but really they were just waiting for the big Cogs to fall. CC is done and now the other pitchers are starting to pick up. The same will Happen when Texiera signs. He is rebuilding and going young, and trying to stagger it so guys like Quentin and Danks will be the veteran leaders when kids like Flowers come up.

LoveYourSuit
12-11-2008, 10:50 AM
Doesn't seem like KW was right when he said the market would correct itself after Zito got the big deal. Salaries and years have only got bigger and longer.


It's the dumbest arguement ever.

If a recession year pays a pitcher 7 years $160 million ..... you can forget about ever seeing a correction.

I was saying this back after 2006 to Sox fan friends of mine, they were hanging their hat on this "imaginary market correction."

oeo
12-11-2008, 10:54 AM
It's the dumbest arguement ever.

If a recession year pays a pitcher 7 years $160 million ..... you can forget about ever seeing a correction.

Just because a couple of teams are willing to pony up that money, does not mean everyone is. The Yankees have always gone far above the norm, and the Red Sox, like usual, will probably follow suit.

The last couple of years we saw even some of the smaller market teams willing to spend some cash. It doesn't look like that's going to happen this year.

voodoochile
12-11-2008, 10:55 AM
Confuse them with bull****, Jerry's stuffing his pockets, or we're really going through a rebuilding project.

I'd like to think he's waiting for the dust to settle and then trying to pick up some useful parts for 2009 on the cheap, but who knows.

Gee... um... just like every year?

How often has KW made a splash with the big FA signing?

How often has KW shored up several weak spots on the team by letting the market play out and then going and getting the players he needs/wants?

Love all the anger an frustration people are throwing around though, it makes this such a fun board to come to to see all these wannabe GM's ripping on the Sox and the managerial team which is on a run like few in the team's history. Keep it up, you clowns, you're only making yourself look stupid...

Thome25
12-11-2008, 10:56 AM
If I could've chosen two poll options I would've. I trust Kenny but, I think he's going "the kids can play" route which doesn't make sense because they've raised ticket prices.

Woo Hoo--1,501st post.....I'm a Church Elder!!

voodoochile
12-11-2008, 10:58 AM
If I could've chosen two poll options I would've. I trust Kenny but, I think he's going "the kids can play" route which doesn't make sense because they've raised ticket prices.

Woo Hoo--1,501st post.....I'm a Church Elder!!

You can alter the number of options from 2-10 if you look around a bit when entering the questions. It's while you are entering the selections that the option is available. Look around the page next time. I think it's at the top before you enter options, but it might be just below.

kittle42
12-11-2008, 11:02 AM
Love all the anger an frustration people are throwing around though, it makes this such a fun board to come to to see all these wannabe GM's ripping on the Sox and the managerial team which is on a run like few in the team's history. Keep it up, you clowns, you're only making yourself look stupid...

That's part of the problem...we are measuring success against a history of almost 90 years of failure, and 190 combined years of Chicago baseball failure. I agree it is a run like few in the team's history, but I don't want this to be the Bears, always looking back on that one championship team like it was the greatest accomplishment in human history when other big-name teams (and even small-name teams) are winning several titles in the following decades.

voodoochile
12-11-2008, 11:10 AM
That's part of the problem...we are measuring success against a history of almost 90 years of failure, and 190 combined years of Chicago baseball failure. I agree it is a run like few in the team's history, but I don't want this to be the Bears, always looking back on that one championship team like it was the greatest accomplishment in human history when other big-name teams (and even small-name teams) are winning several titles in the following decades.

I agree, but honestly all you can ask is that the team make runs at the playoffs on a consistent basis and then if you have 3 solid starters you can hope things go your way in the playoffs. How many years under KW have the Sox been in the Pennant race in August and even into September? Have other years looked like they would be but injuries decimated their chances? Heck, let's replay game 2 of this years playoffs with a healthy TCQ and see how game 5 goes.

NFL is a different animal. The revenue sharing and immediate impact of draft choices makes it much easier to go from zero to hero in a single season. Obviously MLB teams not only have to live with different budgets, but also have to take their chances on a crapshoot draft where players take years to develop and often get injured before ever making an impact on the big league club. Can you imagine if the NFL had to draft HS QB's and RB's then teach them how to play for 4 years before seeing any rewards? That's what MLB has to deal with every year.

Over By There
12-11-2008, 11:20 AM
Were is the "The season doesn't start for another 3 1/2 months, so I haven't made up my mind yet" option?

Don't be silly. Everyone knows the Tigers won the division last December.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-11-2008, 11:21 AM
http://content9.flixster.com/question/51/43/19/5143195_std.jpg

"KENNY! THE 2009 ROSTER! ... what is he doing in there?? I never know what he's doing!"

nccwsfan
12-11-2008, 11:24 AM
Gee... um... just like every year?

How often has KW made a splash with the big FA signing?

How often has KW shored up several weak spots on the team by letting the market play out and then going and getting the players he needs/wants?

Love all the anger an frustration people are throwing around though, it makes this such a fun board to come to to see all these wannabe GM's ripping on the Sox and the managerial team which is on a run like few in the team's history. Keep it up, you clowns, you're only making yourself look stupid...

I'm always amazed at how many people are disappointed with KW every December, only to see him do the same things you mentioned and put together a quality product on the field. This isn't going to change and as long as his formula works us success In Kenny I Trust.

Thome25
12-11-2008, 12:34 PM
You can alter the number of options from 2-10 if you look around a bit when entering the questions. It's while you are entering the selections that the option is available. Look around the page next time. I think it's at the top before you enter options, but it might be just below.

I wasn't the one who started the poll. Thanks for the update on how to start a poll but I already knew that. I think you misunderstood what I wa trying to say. I was implying that two of the poll answers applied to me and if I could've chosen both I would've. :D:

kittle42
12-11-2008, 12:46 PM
I'm always amazed at how many people are disappointed with KW every December, only to see him do the same things you mentioned and put together a quality product on the field. This isn't going to change and as long as his formula works us success In Kenny I Trust.

You know what the weird thing is? The only offseason I have ever been happy with him was 2005-06!

JB98
12-11-2008, 01:10 PM
I'm not sure what Kenny is doing. But even if he is secretly rebuilding, I can't say I blame him. Last year, we had a mostly veteran group, and I think Ozzie and the staff got all they could out of that team.

When you look at the 2008 Sox, they were good enough to win the division and nothing more. And that's what they did. If the goal is to get to the World Series and win it (and I hope it is), some changes are needed.

The veteran core left over from the 2005 team isn't good enough to power us to another world title. We need a "next generation" of core players, so to speak. We've already got a few of those in Quentin, Ramirez, Danks and Floyd. I think it is KW's goal to add names to that list. It may or may not lead to big things in 2009, but I think we'll be in better shape to contend year after year over the long haul.

guillensdisciple
12-11-2008, 01:22 PM
I am glad to see that the majority of people are as optimistic as I am.

Jim Shorts
12-11-2008, 01:34 PM
I'm not sure what Kenny is doing. But even if he is secretly rebuilding, I can't say I blame him. Last year, we had a mostly veteran group, and I think Ozzie and the staff got all they could out of that team.

When you look at the 2008 Sox, they were good enough to win the division and nothing more. And that's what they did. If the goal is to get to the World Series and win it (and I hope it is), some changes are needed.

The veteran core left over from the 2005 team isn't good enough to power us to another world title. We need a "next generation" of core players, so to speak. We've already got a few of those in Quentin, Ramirez, Danks and Floyd. I think it is KW's goal to add names to that list. It may or may not lead to big things in 2009, but I think we'll be in better shape to contend year after year over the long haul.

Mariotti's replacement summed up those feelings in his column today...and I agreed with it.

JB98
12-11-2008, 01:50 PM
Mariotti's replacement summed up those feelings in his column today...and I agreed with it.

And, in our division, I still think we can make the playoffs in 2009 even if we are retooling or rebuilding or whatever you want to call it. There are no power teams in the AL Central right now.

As voodoo indicated, I think we're a starting pitcher short of being the team to beat in our division, even if we have some question marks in our everyday lineup.

btrain929
12-12-2008, 03:48 AM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081210&content_id=3711470&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

This was from a few days ago. There's a statement from KW towards the bottom that really stuck out to me, and actually makes sense. To paraphrase, he said restocking the farm with new prospects, along with the 2 picks from Cabrera, "was a necessity, that had to be done, and was part of the plan." Then he switches gears and offers this line:

"Now, as you sit, take a step back and look at the Major League team, you say, 'OK, what now do we have to do that's consistent with our long-term plan, what can we do for the short-term to make sure we are leaning in a better way toward a championship?' That's kind of where we are right now."

So it sounds like (my interpretation) he wanted to attack and replenish our farm system ASAP when the season ended. Now that that objective was met, he wants to turn his attention to the Major League squad and see what needs to be done to improve our 25 man roster to solidify us as a whole. So any other moves that are made this offseason might be for (my priority list): another proven starter, an extra arm in the bullpen, possibly a CF, and backup C. My scrap-heap suggestions would be Brad Penny/Pedro Martinez, Dennys Reyes/Russ Springer, Gregg Zaun/Johnny Estrada, and anybody better than Owens (but I have a feeling that 1 player to upgrade both CF AND leadoff will be hard to find). Obviously, if KW wants to make BIGGER splashes than these, I'd allow it.....:D:

champagne030
12-12-2008, 12:28 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081210&content_id=3711470&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

This was from a few days ago. There's a statement from KW towards the bottom that really stuck out to me, and actually makes sense. To paraphrase, he said restocking the farm with new prospects, along with the 2 picks from Cabrera, "was a necessity, that had to be done, and was part of the plan." Then he switches gears and offers this line:

"Now, as you sit, take a step back and look at the Major League team, you say, 'OK, what now do we have to do that's consistent with our long-term plan, what can we do for the short-term to make sure we are leaning in a better way toward a championship?' That's kind of where we are right now."

So it sounds like (my interpretation) he wanted to attack and replenish our farm system ASAP when the season ended. Now that that objective was met, he wants to turn his attention to the Major League squad and see what needs to be done to improve our 25 man roster to solidify us as a whole. So any other moves that are made this offseason might be for (my priority list): another proven starter, an extra arm in the bullpen, possibly a CF, and backup C. My scrap-heap suggestions would be Brad Penny/Pedro Martinez, Dennys Reyes/Russ Springer, Gregg Zaun/Johnny Estrada, and anybody better than Owens (but I have a feeling that 1 player to upgrade both CF AND leadoff will be hard to find). Obviously, if KW wants to make BIGGER splashes than these, I'd allow it.....:D:

Need to shed payroll first, since God knows we don't have $.75 to spend.

btrain929
12-12-2008, 01:13 PM
Need to shed payroll first, since God knows we don't have $.75 to spend.

As of right now, our payroll is under $100MIL....

Tekijawa
12-12-2008, 02:26 PM
I just paid off the first half of the ST bill... that should add another almost $1,400 to the budget!

esbrechtel
12-12-2008, 02:32 PM
Were is the "The season doesn't start for another 3 1/2 months, so I haven't made up my mind yet" option?

That would have been my choice...I opted for "in Kenny I trust"

2906
12-12-2008, 02:57 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081210&content_id=3711470&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

This was from a few days ago. There's a statement from KW towards the bottom that really stuck out to me, and actually makes sense. To paraphrase, he said restocking the farm with new prospects, along with the 2 picks from Cabrera, "was a necessity, that had to be done, and was part of the plan." Then he switches gears and offers this line:

"Now, as you sit, take a step back and look at the Major League team, you say, 'OK, what now do we have to do that's consistent with our long-term plan, what can we do for the short-term to make sure we are leaning in a better way toward a championship?' That's kind of where we are right now."

So it sounds like (my interpretation) he wanted to attack and replenish our farm system ASAP when the season ended. Now that that objective was met, he wants to turn his attention to the Major League squad and see what needs to be done to improve our 25 man roster to solidify us as a whole.

This is a good post.

I saw this too. Williams likes to move fast and not wait around but sometimes the market doesn't cooperate.

Many teams put off trades until the free agents start signing. It's a domino effect. Then there are all the non tenders that hit the market mid December (tomorrow). Those are two factors delaying things, not just for the White Sox but for many other teams. I also believe the economy is playing a role too.

They knew the player movement market would move slowly this offseason, both Reinsdorf and Williams have said as much. However, they were able to pull off the first part of their agenda by making the two prospect deals (Swisher and Vazquez).

Now that they've restocked the farm system to an extent and waited out some of the bigger free agent signings, teams who missed out will be more eager to deal. The Burnett and Texiera signings are still unresolved along with a few others. Afterwards, we will see more player movement, especially trades. Whether that's right before Xmas or extends into January or even late January remains to be seen.

Taliesinrk
12-12-2008, 03:22 PM
This is a good post.

I saw this too. Williams likes to move fast and not wait around but sometimes the market doesn't cooperate.

Many teams put off trades until the free agents start signing. It's a domino effect. Then there are all the non tenders that hit the market mid December (tomorrow). Those are two factors delaying things, not just for the White Sox but for many other teams. I also believe the economy is playing a role too.

They knew the player movement market would move slowly this offseason, both Reinsdorf and Williams have said as much. However, they were able to pull off the first part of their agenda by making the two prospect deals (Swisher and Vazquez).

Now that they've restocked the farm system to an extent and waited out some of the bigger free agent signings, teams who missed out will be more eager to deal. The Burnett and Texiera signings are still unresolved along with a few others. Afterwards, we will see more player movement, especially trades. Whether that's right before Xmas or extends into January or even late January remains to be seen.


What I want to know is what the heck ever happened to Steve Stone and his "Sox are going to make a huge move" quotes???

champagne030
12-12-2008, 03:39 PM
As of right now, our payroll is under $100MIL....

I thought the teal was implied. I know we currently have cut payroll over last year by $18M+.

btrain929
12-12-2008, 05:36 PM
I thought the teal was implied. I know we currently have cut payroll over last year by $18M+.

Probably half teal cuz we probably STILL don't have .75 to spend.

Jurr
12-12-2008, 06:47 PM
What I want to know is what the heck ever happened to Steve Stone and his "Sox are going to make a huge move" quotes???
Steve, like us, most likely believed that the biggest thing the Sox could do was ship Vazquez's beach loving ass out of town.