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View Full Version : Ozzie Speaks at Winter Meetings, Interesting Stuff...


WhiteSoxFan84
12-10-2008, 02:41 AM
Linky (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081210&content_id=3710202&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws)

Nothing about acquiring new guys but he spoke about his current roster and this is what he said...
- Getz is the frontrunner at second base.
- Owens will start in CF and leadoff: this is mainly because the opening series is vs. KC and they will be throwing a lot of righties against us.
- Richard will have a shot at the rotation but if he fails he will replace Logan in the bullpen.
- He advised Viciedo to lose weight and wants him in shape by ST. He doesn't sound too high on the kid?
- Lillibridge will get a shot at 2nd, center, and looks like may end up as the backup utility guy.
- Guillen and Joey Cora are about to start working with Fields on his defense and it looks like if Josh is healthy he will start at third although nothing is guaranteed.
- Trades/signings usually go down when Ozzie leaves the meetings. He leaves today (Wednesday) so expect a move today :redneck

GoGoCrede
12-10-2008, 02:52 AM
I heard Cowley say (I know, reliable source) that Ozzie said he "took full blame for Nick Swisher." Anyone else hear that?

Kudos, Ozzie, for leaving on a day when I have no finals and can therefore be on WSI for the play by play when major stuff goes down.

WhiteSox5187
12-10-2008, 02:52 AM
Yikes! Owens leading off and in center? Fields at third? Richard in the rotation with no fifth starter? It's only December, so there is time to rectify this, but I hope this is not the plan we're going into spring training with!

whitesox901
12-10-2008, 02:54 AM
Getz is the frontrunner at second base.

Figured as much

Owens will start in CF and leadoff: this is mainly because the opening series is vs. KC and they will be throwing a lot of righties against us.

I bet he will be in Left and lead off, with BA in center

Richard will have a shot at the rotation but if he fails he will replace Logan in the bullpen.

Yikes, terrible out of the pen..as a starter...COOP WILL FIX EM' :redneck

He advised Viciedo to lose weight and wants him in shape by ST. He doesn't sound too high on the kid?

I don't think so, he expects his players to be in shape

Lillibridge will get a shot at 2nd, center, and looks like may end up as the backup utility guy.

No problem there

Guillen and Joey Cora are about to start working with Fields on his defense and it looks like if Josh is healthy he will start at third although nothing is guaranteed.

As a fan of Josh Fields (maybe the only one), I'm glad he gets to start at 3B

Trades/signings usually go down when Ozzie leaves the meetings. He leaves today (Wednesday) so expect a move today :redneck

I HOPE SO! :smile:

aryzner
12-10-2008, 07:37 AM
- Trades/signings usually go down when Ozzie leaves the meetings. He leaves today (Wednesday) so expect a move today :redneck
Don't we always? :D:

LITTLE NELL
12-10-2008, 07:50 AM
2009 is starting to sound like a rebuilding year.
I think Getz can be the answer at 2B but Owens batting leadoff and in CF scares me.
Im still on the fence about Fields, I felt a lot better about him after the 06 season.
We need to get a proven leadoff man and a proven SP and I will feel much better.

esbrechtel
12-10-2008, 07:57 AM
I heard Cowley say (I know, reliable source) that Ozzie said he "took full blame for Nick Swisher." Anyone else hear that?

Kudos, Ozzie, for leaving on a day when I have no finals and can therefore be on WSI for the play by play when major stuff goes down.

Garfein interviewed Ozzie for a fluff piece on Comcast Sports net and Ozzie said that they kinda set Swisher up to fail (not on purpose' obviously). He wasn't a lead off hitter and was asked to lead off, he wasn't a natural CF and they put him in CF. He said that he is a great kid and he wishes him luck and he feels that if he had an opportunity to get comfortable maybe he would have produced better. Something along those lines...

RockyMtnSoxFan
12-10-2008, 08:51 AM
Garfein interviewed Ozzie for a fluff piece on Comcast Sports net and Ozzie said that they kinda set Swisher up to fail (not on purpose' obviously). He wasn't a lead off hitter and was asked to lead off, he wasn't a natural CF and they put him in CF. He said that he is a great kid and he wishes him luck and he feels that if he had an opportunity to get comfortable maybe he would have produced better. Something along those lines...

Hmm. I wonder if this means they will give guys like BA or Getz a chance to get comfortable. Probably not. But if it's someone like Owens who Ozzie likes, he'll get infinite chance to prove he can't hack it.

Tragg
12-10-2008, 09:01 AM
Linky (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081210&content_id=3710202&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws)


- Owens will start in CF and leadoff: this is mainly because the opening series is vs. KC and they will be throwing a lot of righties against us.
NO suprise as Ozzie's keen eye for talent had Carlos Quentin and Alexei on the bench for Jerry Owens. He vanquished Ryan Sweeney because he had Jerry Owens.
.320 OBP, leadoff hitting, bad defense? No problem - he has speed and fearlessly swings at everything.

thedudeabides
12-10-2008, 09:08 AM
NO suprise as Ozzie's keen eye for talent had Carlos Quentin and Alexei on the bench for Jerry Owens. He vanquished Ryan Sweeney because he had Jerry Owens.
.320 OBP, leadoff hitting, bad defense? No problem - he has speed and fearlessly swings at everything.

:rolleyes:

Frontman
12-10-2008, 09:32 AM
The hatred of Ozzie Guillen astounds me at this board sometimes.

Also, whomever suggested Owens for LF? Where's Quentin going to play then? You know, the front-runner for MVP/winner of the Silver Slugger award? Yeah, that kid.

For crying out loud, gang. EVERY year the team makes moves, EVERY year who comes to spring training are not the same guys who finish game 162.

Give them some time. The Sox will put together the best team they can put together. Honestly, I want to know what pro-shop Kenny can walk into and say:


Gimme an innings eater, I need a lead-off second baseman....wait none in stock? Gimme a lead-off CF. I need another starting pitcher, one who can handle lefties. I'll take 3 solid bullpen arms. Got anything to fix age? I really need to make Thome and Contreras younger; if that works, I'm going re-sign Griffey. Anything to fix speed? Yeah, you're probably right. Nothing would make Konerko faster.

Hey orange balls! Hey, I'll have a box of those...give me a box of those naked lady tee's, and give me two of those..and give me six of those...(sees Javy Vasquez) aww this is the worst looking pitcher I ever saw...you sign a pitcher like this and you get a free bowl of soup. (notices Frank Wren) Looks good with you though!

Iwritecode
12-10-2008, 09:33 AM
I bet he will be in Left and lead off, with BA in center

Where's TCQ then?

Frontman
12-10-2008, 09:34 AM
Where's TCQ then?

Great minds think alike. :wink:

esbrechtel
12-10-2008, 09:42 AM
All fans are Fickle however I don't understand how there is hate for the managemnet of a team that made the playoffs and won their division (yes from a weak division but it is not the Sox fault the Indians choked, Tigers suck again, KC has always sucked and Minnie can't win outside of the dome...)

And Ozzie "passing" up on Quentin...come on who knew that he was going to have a near MVP year? NO ONE, Kenny took a gamble and it paid off but even he did not think Quentin was going to be THAT good....

champagne030
12-10-2008, 09:43 AM
Also, whomever suggested Owens for LF? Where's Quentin going to play then? You know, the front-runner for MVP/winner of the Silver Slugger award? Yeah, that kid.


Where's TCQ then?

I assume the poster was suggesting Dye is dealt and Ozzie moves tCQ to RF.

esbrechtel
12-10-2008, 09:43 AM
Great minds think alike. :wink:

I think they are assuming he moves to RF if (in their minds when) Dye is traded...

For some reason Dye is already off of the Sox in many peoples eyes. I am not against a trade but lets at least wait to see what happens...

Chrisaway
12-10-2008, 09:55 AM
- Owens will start in CF and leadoff: this is mainly because the opening series is vs. KC and they will be throwing a lot of righties against us.
Say it ain't so:o:

Tragg
12-10-2008, 10:00 AM
Erstad is a .400 quality hitter; Jerry Owens is a better player than Carlos Quentin and Alexei Ramirez and Ryan Sweeney.
It's not a matter of hate. With the team, as is, Owens should be in AAA. Ozzie has him starting.
I guess I should be on Williams' case for giving Ozzie players like Owens, after the 2007 debacle.

ode to veeck
12-10-2008, 10:02 AM
I heard Cowley say (I know, reliable source)

then why do you bother to even read or listen to anything the fool says?!

BainesHOF
12-10-2008, 10:28 AM
1. Quentin is not a major league right fielder.

2. Owens is not a major league center fielder.

3. Owens is not a major league leadoff hitter.

oeo
12-10-2008, 10:29 AM
- He advised Viciedo to lose weight and wants him in shape by ST. He doesn't sound too high on the kid?

Not true at all. Ozzie said last week that he 'pushed' for the Sox to sign him.

Yikes! Owens leading off and in center? Fields at third? Richard in the rotation with no fifth starter? It's only December, so there is time to rectify this, but I hope this is not the plan we're going into spring training with!

First, Fields at third and Richard in the rotation should not be a surprise to you. Second, who said there would be no fifth starter? :?:

kittle42
12-10-2008, 10:43 AM
Either this is a rebuilding year as I've feared, or the Sox publicly are REALLY trying to throw everyone off.

kobo
12-10-2008, 10:47 AM
Either this is a rebuilding year as I've feared, or the Sox publicly are REALLY trying to throw everyone off.
If they're trying to throw everyone off they're donig a good job of it considering some of the posts that have been made around here lately.

voodoochile
12-10-2008, 10:52 AM
The hatred of Ozzie Guillen astounds me at this board sometimes.

Also, whomever suggested Owens for LF? Where's Quentin going to play then? You know, the front-runner for MVP/winner of the Silver Slugger award? Yeah, that kid.

For crying out loud, gang. EVERY year the team makes moves, EVERY year who comes to spring training are not the same guys who finish game 162.

Give them some time. The Sox will put together the best team they can put together. Honestly, I want to know what pro-shop Kenny can walk into and say:

Gimme an innings eater, I need a lead-off second baseman....wait none in stock? Gimme a lead-off CF. I need another starting pitcher, one who can handle lefties. I'll take 3 solid bullpen arms. Got anything to fix age? I really need to make Thome and Contreras younger; if that works, I'm going re-sign Griffey. Anything to fix speed? Yeah, you're probably right. Nothing would make Konerko faster.

Hey orange balls! Hey, I'll have a box of those...give me a box of those naked lady tee's, and give me two of those..and give me six of those...(sees Javy Vasquez) aww this is the worst looking pitcher I ever saw...you sign a pitcher like this and you get a free bowl of soup. (notices Frank Wren) Looks good with you though!

:rolling:

Good stuff, Frontman!

I also agree with the rest of your post. People are freaking out just like last year way too early.

Owens in CF? The kid has shown a better stick and a better eye than BA in less at bats. I actually expect a platoon of these two with Owens leading off when he starts and maybe Alexei leading off when BA starts (against LHP he had a .340 OBP last year, but hit most of his HR against RHP). Getz probably hits second initially but if that fails, they can put AJ back in that slot.

Of course if one of the other young kids suddenlty breaks out during ST then they can move things around and that's before any other changes are made - though barring a trade I mostly expect KW to sign one more starter and call it a day. However I can picture him making a trade for a 3B with Fields included in the package. I don't expect a trade for a middle IF because they seem to be slightly overloaded with "close to ready" players and that includes Beckham who seems bound and determined not to waste time in the minors. I figure if AR doesn't do a great job at SS this year, they'll move him back to second and hand the SS job to Beckham in 2010 if not sooner - though again that will at least in part depend on Getz and Lillibridge. I mean it would truly suck if all these players fought so hard to make the team and developed so well that the Sox had too much talent...

GoGoCrede
12-10-2008, 11:11 AM
then why do you bother to even read or listen to anything the fool says?!

It honestly amuses me how much stuff he gets wrong, so I added him to my twitter.

DaveFeelsRight
12-10-2008, 11:12 AM
i dont hate fields as much as some people do here...he did show he can hit in 07 and he was playing injured in 08. i wouldnt mind him at 3B this year. then again, i would welcome a new third baseman via a trade or whatever

PorkChopExpress
12-10-2008, 11:12 AM
1. Quentin is not a major league right fielder.

I thought that's where he played until he came to the Sox. Why do you think he is not a major league RF? He's got decent range and a strong arm.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-10-2008, 11:29 AM
To those who are upset about Owens leading off, I ask who, who would you rather have leading off? And please keep it to someone that is CURRENTLY in our organization because that's the population Ozzie was speaking about. And this is a serious question because I'm not uber happy about Owens being a starter nor am I ultra excited about him being our leadoff man, but right now, I see him as our best bet mainly because of his speed.

asindc
12-10-2008, 11:33 AM
1. Quentin is not a major league right fielder.

2. Owens is not a major league center fielder.

3. Owens is not a major league leadoff hitter.

Well, at least two major league teams think Quentin can play RF, the Dbacks and the Sox. Maybe you have evaluated his talent differently than they have.

CashMan
12-10-2008, 11:33 AM
To those who are upset about Owens leading off, I ask who, who would you rather have leading off? And please keep it to someone that is CURRENTLY in our organization because that's the population Ozzie was speaking about. And this is a serious question because I'm not uber happy about Owens being a starter nor am I ultra excited about him being our leadoff man, but right now, I see him as our best bet mainly because of his speed.


I don't mind him leading off, I don't think you can have him starting over BA. If he played 2B, I think it would be a different story.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-10-2008, 11:39 AM
I don't mind him leading off, I don't think you can have him starting over BA. If he played 2B, I think it would be a different story.

yeh, BA's defense is amazing... some of the games he starts, his defense alone is worth the price of admission.

btrain929
12-10-2008, 11:40 AM
yeh, BA's defense is amazing... some of the games he starts, his defense alone is worth the price of admission.

But the downside is some of the games he starts, his offense alone makes you ask for a refund :(:

slavko
12-10-2008, 11:44 AM
1. Quentin is not a major league right fielder.

2. Owens is not a major league center fielder.

3. Owens is not a major league leadoff hitter.


Don't confuse me with facts.

kittle42
12-10-2008, 11:54 AM
yeh, BA's defense is amazing... some of the games he starts, his defense alone is worth the price of admission.

He's very good defensively, but this is waaaaaaaaaay too much of an exaggeration.

CashMan
12-10-2008, 11:56 AM
He's very good defensively, but this is waaaaaaaaaay too much of an exaggeration.

Not when, you have a pitcher who puts the ball in play like Marky Mark.

UofCSoxFan
12-10-2008, 11:57 AM
I'm pretty sure Ozzie's statements were prefaced with the caviat: "If the season started today"...which it doesn't. If the season did start today, I think you have to have Owens as your starter. Who else would lead off?

munchman33
12-10-2008, 11:59 AM
Well, at least two major league teams think Quentin can play RF, the Dbacks and the Sox. Maybe you have evaluated his talent differently than they have.

:kneeslap:

WhiteSoxFan84
12-10-2008, 12:03 PM
But the downside is some of the games he starts, his offense alone makes you ask for a refund :(:

yesh indeed :(:


He's very good defensively, but this is waaaaaaaaaay too much of an exaggeration.

nah, i dont think so. some of the plays he has made have stuck with me and will do so for a while. that makes me say "that game was worth it" because of that memory alone.

Tragg
12-10-2008, 12:04 PM
To those who are upset about Owens leading off, I ask who, who would you rather have leading off? And please keep it to someone that is CURRENTLY in our organization because that's the population Ozzie was speaking about. And this is a serious question because I'm not uber happy about Owens being a starter nor am I ultra excited about him being our leadoff man, but right now, I see him as our best bet mainly because of his speed.
Pretty much anybody. Let's go around the horn: AJ, PK, Getz/Lillibridge/Missle/Fields/TCQ/Anderson (only because he can field his position - Owens cannot), Dye.
I put Owens ahead of Wise.
A slap hitter who can't take a walk, has no power and can't play defense is of little value.
This is the BS Ozzie pulled in 2007.

btrain929
12-10-2008, 12:06 PM
Pretty much anybody. Let's go around the horn: AJ, PK, Getz/Lillibridge/Missle/Fields/TCQ/Anderson (only because he can field his position - Owens cannot), Dye.
I put Owens ahead of Wise.

This is the BS Ozzie pulled in 2007.

Uhhmm, wow...

champagne030
12-10-2008, 12:14 PM
I'm pretty sure Ozzie's statements were prefaced with the caviat: "If the season started today"...which it doesn't. If the season did start today, I think you have to have Owens as your starter. Who else would lead off?

Well, if we must play by the hypothetical situation that our current roster will not change then you can bat whoever you want leadoff 'cause that team sucks.

kittle42
12-10-2008, 12:14 PM
nah, i dont think so. some of the plays he has made have stuck with me and will do so for a while. that makes me say "that game was worth it" because of that memory alone.

The only plays like that which immediately stick out for me in in recent history were Rowand in Yankee Stadium, Iguchi's flip, and Alexei's play last year.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-10-2008, 12:25 PM
The only plays like that which immediately stick out for me in in recent history were Rowand in Yankee Stadium, Iguchi's flip, and Alexei's play last year.

really... how soon you've forgotten BA's diving catch to end the one-game playoff just over 2 months ago...

kittle42
12-10-2008, 12:33 PM
really... how soon you've forgotten BA's diving catch to end the one-game playoff just over 2 months ago...

I thought about it. That wasn't that outstanding of a play. I in fact thought about that right after it happened.

whitesox901
12-10-2008, 12:47 PM
I dont have a problem with Owens leading off and starting in one of the OF positions, and I dont mind Fields at third :shrug:

WhiteSox5187
12-10-2008, 01:04 PM
Not true at all. Ozzie said last week that he 'pushed' for the Sox to sign him.



First, Fields at third and Richard in the rotation should not be a surprise to you. Second, who said there would be no fifth starter? :?:
Well, it is only December but I don't like the idea of the Sox going into 2009 with Fields being plan A at third base. I kind of expected Richard to be in the rotation, but he's a big question mark and without Javy (who I was not really fond of anyways) that means we have another hole we have to fill in the rotation and I would rather it not be the likes of Broadway. But again, it's only December and I know Kenny isn't going to come out and say "Well, we need to retool here, here and here..." I just hope he's not done dealing yet and I would like to see us get some MAJOR LEAGUE guys, not major league prospects!

Whitesoxfan23
12-10-2008, 01:15 PM
Well, it is only December but I don't like the idea of the Sox going into 2009 with Fields being plan A at third base. I kind of expected Richard to be in the rotation, but he's a big question mark and without Javy (who I was not really fond of anyways) that means we have another hole we have to fill in the rotation and I would rather it not be the likes of Broadway. But again, it's only December and I know Kenny isn't going to come out and say "Well, we need to retool here, here and here..." I just hope he's not done dealing yet and I would like to see us get some MAJOR LEAGUE guys, not major league prospects!


I completely agree. This better not be a rebuilding year. After making the playoffs last year, people expect an improved team now. Alot of people are going to be pretty pissed if we suck this year.

It's Dankerific
12-10-2008, 01:18 PM
I completely agree. This better not be a rebuilding year. After making the playoffs last year, people expect an improved team now. Alot of people are going to be pretty pissed if we suck this year.

They already have our (the season ticket holder's) money. They can do whatever they like, like 2007.

PS. **** Jerry Owens in CF. Maybe Kenny and Ozzie should see what "bounty" we can get for such an outstanding MLB player.

btrain929
12-10-2008, 01:22 PM
I thought about it. That wasn't that outstanding of a play. I in fact thought about that right after it happened.

I'm pretty sure BA had a blog going on during the end of the season and the playoffs, and he mentioned that the dive wasn't necessary, but instead he "chose" to dive because of the importance of the game, going against the Twins, ****, probably even mocking that ****head Carlos Gomez and rubbing it in all of their faces.

WhiteSox5187
12-10-2008, 01:24 PM
I completely agree. This better not be a rebuilding year. After making the playoffs last year, people expect an improved team now. Alot of people are going to be pretty pissed if we suck this year.
I don't so much mind rebuilding but I would rather they said "Look, we're not going to be as competitive in 2009 so we can be more competitive in 2010 and beyond." But don't give me this "oh we intend to compete" bull**** when that's clearly not the case.

But the most important thing to remember is that it's December 10th, Kenny might trade Dye for a bunch of prospects and then turn around and unload some of those guys for someone like Roberts or Figgins and then sign a guy like Sheets or Lowe or someone. So, while I'm a bit wary I'm not looking towards jumping out of the window yet. Kenny did a lot in 2008 to prove me absolute 100% dead wrong, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.

kittle42
12-10-2008, 01:26 PM
I don't so much mind rebuilding but I would rather they said "Look, we're not going to be as competitive in 2009 so we can be more competitive in 2010 and beyond." But don't give me this "oh we intend to compete" bull**** when that's clearly not the case.

But the most important thing to remember is that it's December 10th, Kenny might trade Dye for a bunch of prospects and then turn around and unload some of those guys for someone like Roberts or Figgins and then sign a guy like Sheets or Lowe or someone. So, while I'm a bit wary I'm not looking towards jumping out of the window yet. Kenny did a lot in 2008 to prove me absolute 100% dead wrong, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.

This is exactly how I feel. Getting tired of the b.s., but willing to reserve judgment, of course.

CWSpalehoseCWS
12-10-2008, 01:32 PM
Where's TCQ then?

LF - Owens
CF- Anderson
RF - Quentin

Dye = Traded.

CashMan
12-10-2008, 01:37 PM
This is exactly how I feel. Getting tired of the b.s., but willing to reserve judgment, of course.

Kenny says, We are rebuilding, how do you think tickets sales will do? Retooling is more PC than flat out saying rebuilding.

munchman33
12-10-2008, 01:50 PM
LF - Owens
CF- Anderson
RF - Quentin

Dye = Traded.

While I'm in the "trade Dye for pitching" camp, I'm not for it if it means that outfield. I'm alright with BA in center (or Owens to a lesser extent), but we'll need to sign one of Dunn/Burrell/Abreu/G. Anderson/Ibanez/Baldelli/Ramirez/Rivera. You've got to think with so few teams looking for corner OF that some of those guys are going to be real bargains.

It's Dankerific
12-10-2008, 02:04 PM
Kenny says, We are rebuilding, how do you think tickets sales will do? Retooling is more PC than flat out saying rebuilding.

Walkup sales are going to depend on the record, weather and to some extent promotions. Doesn't matter how its dressed. He has 95% season ticket retention rate (according to the the ticket office) so they could say whatever they want.

Some of us would prefer the truth, or at least, some ****er not named jerry owens playing in CF.

khan
12-10-2008, 02:22 PM
But the most important thing to remember is that it's December 10th,
Agreed.

Kenny might trade Dye for a bunch of prospects
Yep, this is next.

and then turn around and unload some of those guys for someone like Roberts
I don't think there will be enough on-hand to trade for Roberts, but that's just me.

or Figgins
Maybe.

and then sign a guy like Sheets
I'd take a chance, now that we have only 1 veteran, 2 guys with limited resumes of success, and a trio of rookies in the rotation. But I'm sure Sheets is just a half-hour away from being injured again.

or Lowe or someone.
Ain't happening. Scott Boras. The Stupid Yankees are apparently giving a 4 year, $66M deal to a 35 year old.

Suddenly, despite all his troubles at the end of '08, Vazquez's $11.5M seems like a bargain compared to the ridiculous contract offered to Lowe. A guy who sucked ass the last time he pitched in the big boy AL. A guy who MIGHT be "OK" in 2009, but I'd bet he'll be injured or suck beyond 2009. For something like $16.5M/yr!!!! Wow.


So, while I'm a bit wary I'm not looking towards jumping out of the window yet. Kenny did a lot in 2008 to prove me absolute 100% dead wrong, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
I agree. Let's reserve [final] judgement until Spring Training.

champagne030
12-10-2008, 02:24 PM
Some of us would prefer the truth, or at least, some ****er not named jerry owens playing in CF.

But he's Jerry Freakin' Owens!

How about we bring Andy Gonzales back into the mix? He could fit in anywhere in the OF, play some 3rd, give Paulie a rest.

russ99
12-10-2008, 02:27 PM
Walkup sales are going to depend on the record, weather and to some extent promotions. Doesn't matter how its dressed. He has 95% season ticket retention rate (according to the the ticket office) so they could say whatever they want.

Some of us would prefer the truth, or at least, some ****er not named jerry owens playing in CF.

Season ticket holders are on the hook, but not the Ozzie plan and single-game tickets buyers. I don't think walkup makes that much difference, or at least it hasn't the last few years. Oh well. If they rebuild, I'll be able to get really good seats again. :D:

I won't get into an Anderson vs. Owens argument. I hope we end up with neither in CF. But the way Kenny's going we may have to put up with both (shudder).

Konerko05
12-10-2008, 02:52 PM
I really don't understand the logic of putting a below average player in the lineup because the Sox need a lead-off hitter.

If the lead-off spot is so important, why the hell is Jerry Owens the top candidate?

I'd rather have Getz in the lead-off spot just to keep Owens off the field.

Frontman
12-10-2008, 02:58 PM
So, after close to two years of shopping Dye, all of a sudden a team will give up pitching for him, just because Quentin should be in right?

I take my first post and change it. I want to know what pro-shop KW can walk into to trade-in Dye for a newer model.

Preferably with a mp3 player jack and heated seats.

soxfan43
12-10-2008, 03:04 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081209&content_id=3709616&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

Anyone see this mess of an interview yet?

thomas35forever
12-10-2008, 03:07 PM
I don't think it's a rebuilding year. Winter Meetings are just going on right now, so don't be so quick to judge what the White Sox will or will not be in 2009. Owens is a fine choice for leadoff on Opening Day. Really, who else do we have that can do that? Chone Figgins if we somehow get him, but that's it, and I doubt we're going to land him. Face it, Fields is our most experienced third baseman with both Crede and Uribe gone. Could Viciedo beat him out for the job in ST? Perhaps, but that's a long shot IMO. I firmly believe Dye will be traded. The Sun-Times even reported earlier this week it's going to happen. I end this post with a final thought: people were upset throughout '08 about how this team was too old. Well, people are getting their wish as that is pretty much no longer the case. Still, I think said people are now complaining about how we're getting too young and thus, unable to compete. What do they want? They're always looking for something to complain about, aren't they? There's just no pleasing some people.

CWSpalehoseCWS
12-10-2008, 03:46 PM
I don't think it's a rebuilding year. Winter Meetings are just going on right now, so don't be so quick to judge what the White Sox will or will not be in 2009. Owens is a fine choice for leadoff on Opening Day. Really, who else do we have that can do that? Chone Figgins if we somehow get him, but that's it, and I doubt we're going to land him. Face it, Fields is our most experienced third baseman with both Crede and Uribe gone. Could Viciedo beat him out for the job in ST? Perhaps, but that's a long shot IMO. I firmly believe Dye will be traded. The Sun-Times even reported earlier this week it's going to happen. I end this post with a final thought: people were upset throughout '08 about how this team was too old. Well, people are getting their wish as that is pretty much no longer the case. Still, I think said people are now complaining about how we're getting too young and thus, unable to compete. What do they want? They're always looking for something to complain about, aren't they? There's just no pleasing some people.

I agree. There is still a long offseason left, so more changes could (and probably will) happen. As of right now, if the season began tomorrow, those are our best options.

oeo
12-10-2008, 03:51 PM
They already have our (the season ticket holder's) money. They can do whatever they like, like 2007.

It's hard to compare this offseason with the 06-07 offseason. In fact, it's not even close. Things didn't go as planned which is why we saw Pods back, Erstad starting in CF, etc.

Tragg
12-10-2008, 04:14 PM
I really don't understand the logic of putting a below average player in the lineup because the Sox need a lead-off hitter.

If the lead-off spot is so important, why the hell is Jerry Owens the top candidate?

I'd rather have Getz in the lead-off spot just to keep Owens off the field.
Particularly as Owens has poor on base skills.
I realize Ozzie doesn't find getting on base a particularlyly meaningful skill. The "OBP" era of Williams/Ozzie didn't last long, Ozzie and Walker never bought into it anyway, and Swisher is long gone.
But, you can't have lousy players like Owens on this team and expect to win. At least Anderson can field his position. If Ozzie wants speed, Williams should go out and trade MacDougal some other stiff and try to get Taveras here. I hate to say that because TAveras can't hit either, but he's a decent defender.

SoxNation05
12-10-2008, 04:49 PM
Jerry Owens sucks ass.

Lundind1
12-10-2008, 05:11 PM
Jerry Owens sucks ass.


Could you elaborate on that statement just a bit for us there. Not trying to incite a brawl, but I'd like to hear your side of that opinion.

Lundind1
12-10-2008, 05:15 PM
I don't think it's a rebuilding year. Winter Meetings are just going on right now, so don't be so quick to judge what the White Sox will or will not be in 2009. Owens is a fine choice for leadoff on Opening Day. Really, who else do we have that can do that? Chone Figgins if we somehow get him, but that's it, and I doubt we're going to land him. Face it, Fields is our most experienced third baseman with both Crede and Uribe gone. Could Viciedo beat him out for the job in ST? Perhaps, but that's a long shot IMO. I firmly believe Dye will be traded. The Sun-Times even reported earlier this week it's going to happen. I end this post with a final thought: people were upset throughout '08 about how this team was too old. Well, people are getting their wish as that is pretty much no longer the case. Still, I think said people are now complaining about how we're getting too young and thus, unable to compete. What do they want? They're always looking for something to complain about, aren't they? There's just no pleasing some people.

Well that is just a situation of you can't make people happy all of the time, and I for one am happy about the prospects here. Since 1990 the Sox have only had 5 losing seasons. With the exception of 2007, we have flirted with .500 in all of those other 4 losing seasons for the most part. There has not been a real time that we have had a bad situation here. I think that it is time to start breaking with the "old" club and turn it into a dynamic new one with players coming in and taking on roles that we desperately need.

kittle42
12-10-2008, 05:57 PM
Well that is just a situation of you can't make people happy all of the time, and I for one am happy about the prospects here. Since 1990 the Sox have only had 5 losing seasons. With the exception of 2007, we have flirted with .500 in all of those other 4 losing seasons for the most part. There has not been a real time that we have had a bad situation here. I think that it is time to start breaking with the "old" club and turn it into a dynamic new one with players coming in and taking on roles that we desperately need.

And they've made the playoffs a whopping 4 times. Great success!

LoveYourSuit
12-10-2008, 06:03 PM
Jerry Owens sucks ass.


The Best thinkg Jerry Owens has done in a Sox uniform was get hurt on time in the Spring to allow TCQ to take his spot.

Can you imagine had that not happened?

thomas35forever
12-10-2008, 06:58 PM
The Best thinkg Jerry Owens has done in a Sox uniform was get hurt on time in the Spring to allow TCQ to take his spot.

Can you imagine had that not happened?
I'm willing to bet TCQ would have been as productive as Earl Bennett has so far with the Bears.

KRS1
12-10-2008, 07:22 PM
Owens leading off AND playing CF, barfalicious. The only problem with that is he is just not good at baseball.

Daver
12-10-2008, 07:27 PM
Could you elaborate on that statement just a bit for us there. Not trying to incite a brawl, but I'd like to hear your side of that opinion.

Can I?

Jerry Owens has one tool, he doesn't use it well.

champagne030
12-10-2008, 07:47 PM
Could you elaborate on that statement just a bit for us there. Not trying to incite a brawl, but I'd like to hear your side of that opinion.

Can't hit, can't walk, can't catch and is in contention with Pierre and Damon for the worst arm in all of baseball, but he's fast.

Let's start him. :rolleyes:

Frater Perdurabo
12-10-2008, 07:55 PM
Jerry Owens has one tool, he doesn't use it well.

That's not a nice thing to say about a former lover. :tongue:

DSpivack
12-10-2008, 08:01 PM
Can't hit, can't walk, can't catch and is in contention with Pierre and Damon for the worst arm in all of baseball, but he's fast.

Let's start him. :rolleyes:

Fast yes, good baserunner and base-stealer, not even.

BadBobbyJenks
12-10-2008, 08:01 PM
So, after close to two years of shopping Dye, all of a sudden a team will give up pitching for him, just because Quentin should be in right?

I take my first post and change it. I want to know what pro-shop KW can walk into to trade-in Dye for a newer model.

Preferably with a mp3 player jack and heated seats.

2 years of shopping Dye?

soxwon
12-10-2008, 08:09 PM
Yikes! Owens leading off and in center? Fields at third? Richard in the rotation with no fifth starter? It's only December, so there is time to rectify this, but I hope this is not the plan we're going into spring training with!


hey we won the division, we are the favorites.
no more glum, im sick of it.
sox will DOMINATE-A

Vernam
12-10-2008, 08:14 PM
I dont have a problem with Owens leading off and starting in one of the OF positions, and I dont mind Fields at third :shrug:Sometimes, WSI members seem evenly split between people who hate Ozzie for daring to play so many unproven players, and people who hate Ozzie for never giving unproven players a chance. Based on that model, your existence is a theoretical impossibility. :cool: :wink:

Vernam

...
12-10-2008, 08:17 PM
1. Quentin is not a major league right fielder.

2. Owens is not a major league center fielder.

3. Owens is not a major league leadoff hitter.

It's amusing to me how people think they can evaluate a player's talents better than those whom have been employed by the MLB teams. Perhaps you are in the wrong line of work? Rascals.

champagne030
12-10-2008, 08:23 PM
It's amusing to me how people think they can evaluate a player's talents better than those whom have been employed by the MLB teams. Perhaps you are in the wrong line of work? Rascals.

I didn't see the Sox putting tCQ in RF when Dye took a rest. :scratch:

KRS1
12-10-2008, 08:25 PM
I didn't see the Sox putting tCQ in RF when Dye took a rest. :scratch:

That can easily explained by the fact that he was already struggling to adjust from RF to LF in the first place. No sense in jumbling the guys reads even more when he needed every single rep he could get in LF.

champagne030
12-10-2008, 08:33 PM
That can easily explained by the fact that he was already struggling to adjust from RF to LF in the first place. No sense in jumbling the guys reads even more when he needed every single rep he could get in LF.

That's one possible explanation. Or maybe his arm just hasn't come back from his first surgery. And he's also put on muscle/bulk with age and just doesn't look as smooth in the field as he did when younger.

Frontman
12-10-2008, 09:14 PM
2 years of shopping Dye?

Ok, a year and a half. That talk started in June of 2007, and continued all though this season; even when the Sox were fighting for the playoffs.

My point is though that folks view the real world of the MLB like MLB "The Show" when the force trade option is on.

This isn't a video game, its real life. While we might want KW to get everything the team needs, its NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

The Sox will put the best team they can on the field. It might not be what we want, per se; but they can't FORCE the trade to happen.

Daver
12-10-2008, 09:20 PM
I didn't see the Sox putting tCQ in RF when Dye took a rest. :scratch:

Why would they? They had two players better suited to spell Dye in Swisher and Anderson, why move Quentin out of position for the sake of doing it?

soxwon
12-10-2008, 09:25 PM
Why would they? They had two players better suited to spell Dye in Swisher and Anderson, why move Quentin out of position for the sake of doing it?

Ats all part of KW magic Time, we will be the team to beat, love ALL his moves.

Brian26
12-10-2008, 09:41 PM
Ats all part of KW magic Time, we will be the team to beat, love ALL his moves.

Couldn't have said it better or more eloquently myself.

gogosox16
12-10-2008, 10:05 PM
That's one possible explanation. Or maybe his arm just hasn't come back from his first surgery. And he's also put on muscle/bulk with age and just doesn't look as smooth in the field as he did when younger.
IIRC, the surgery TCQ had was on his non throwing arm. so that wouldn't have to do with anything about putting him in right field

champagne030
12-10-2008, 10:09 PM
IIRC, the surgery TCQ had was on his non throwing arm. so that wouldn't have to do with anything about putting him in right field

He's had surgery on his non-throwing shoulder and TJ surgery on his throwing elbow.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-10-2008, 10:23 PM
Recently, haven't our White Sox won the division when we didn't think they'd be any good (2005 and 2008) and not made the playoffs the seasons we expected them to be good (2006 and 2007)?

Keep the doubt coming! :bandance:

BadBobbyJenks
12-12-2008, 05:47 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/chi-10-white-sox-winter-meetingsdec10,0,3670284.story

Josh Fields volunteered to go down to Miami and work with Ozzie and Cora on his fielding.