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View Full Version : Are We Putting Too Much Faith In Carlos Quentin?


WhiteSoxFan84
12-03-2008, 02:31 AM
The other day I found myself talking trade with a few friends of mine and I noticed that after every "trade", I had Carlos Quentin batting 3rd in my lineup. A lot of us here at WSI are doing the samething. And one of my friends, of course a Cubs fan, asked me, "How are you so confident that Quentin will repeat his success from last season?"

And that got me thinking, maybe we are putting too much stock into just one season? Don't get me wrong, it was a great season and Q looked like the real deal. Heck, if he hadn't gotten injured at the end of the year, he would've most likely won the AL MVP and not just a Silver Slugger award. But it was just one season.

We also have to take into consideration how many injuries he suffered before last season. What about the pressure getting to Quentin starting next season? Or what if the league finds the holes in his swing they couldn't find in 2008?

I honestly think Quentin is still the real deal and will only IMPROVE. But, I ask you guys, what if he's not who we thought he was? Or what if he is a superior hitter, but he can't stay healthy? Hate to think negatively, but Carlos Quentin is one guy with so much positive thinking surrounding him, that maybe a "worst case scenario" will keep us grounded.

Most of us can live with a lineup minus Dye, Thome, and/or Konerko. But it's safe to say that a lot of us would be very upset if The Carlos Quentin (version 2008) went missing.

oeo
12-03-2008, 02:34 AM
No, he's good. There was nothing fluky about his season.

It will be interesting to see if he loses any power from the wrist injury, but other than that, I expect a good year from him next year.

HomeFish
12-03-2008, 03:26 AM
He was very ineffective in June/July, I think. Bad slump after he hit that HR against the Angels on Memorial Day. He eventually got good again before being injured. So he seems to have adjusted back to the league at least once.

btrain929
12-03-2008, 03:29 AM
Probably, but he wouldn't have it any other way.

JermaineDye05
12-03-2008, 03:33 AM
He was very ineffective in June/July, I think. Bad slump after he hit that HR against the Angels on Memorial Day. He eventually got good again before being injured. So he seems to have adjusted back to the league at least once.

He went on an absolute tear after the Allstar break, I think hit like 12 HR's between July and August and he was hitting around .370 I think.

Carlos did not "come out of nowhere", it seems like he did but the truth was Carlos was always a highly touted prospect with Arizona. For a long time he was there #1 guy and was hyped a lot. When he was first brought up he showed flashes of that potential, then in 2007 he was stricken with injuries which restricted his ability and playing time. This brought up Upton, and Byrnes had a monster year, after the extension Carlos was expendable. After his surgery, no one was sure if he'd produce still and I think he showed him 2008 his shoulder is fine. I rarely say this since I'm such a pessimist and believe in karma, but Carlos is the real deal. You can tell by looking at him, he just has that swagger about him and he knows what he's doing there at the plate. You can also tell the way pitchers pitch to him that they can tell he's the real deal.

palehozenychicty
12-03-2008, 09:29 AM
He's good. As long as he stays healthy, he should be fine.

North Sox Sider
12-03-2008, 10:00 AM
I am only worried about the Scotty Pods effect. He did just get married.

ChiSoxFan81
12-03-2008, 10:28 AM
As long as his wrist healed properly, I see no reason why he cannot continue the success he had in 2008. Will he average 35-40 HRs and 120 RBI? Maybe not. But I think having him in the #3 spot is where he will belong and be able to produce.

Thome25
12-03-2008, 10:59 AM
The Sox putting all of their faith in him makes me a little nervous. Especially since his power numbers MAY be affected by his wrist injury.

hi im skot
12-03-2008, 11:08 AM
Carlos Quentin scoffs at this thread.

the gooch
12-03-2008, 11:17 AM
I am only worried about the Scotty Pods effect. He did just get married.I thought it was called the 'pennies in a jar' effect.

beasly213
12-03-2008, 11:25 AM
Carlos Quentin scoffs at this thread.

I think you mean THE Carlos Quentin scoffs at this thread.

guillensdisciple
12-03-2008, 11:33 AM
I am ashamed by this thread, Carlos wants the leadership role, he wants faith put on his shoulders.

He knows that he is now the offensive leader of this team, and he will come back to dominate.

The guy has all the hitting tools to continue being a star, fast bat, great torque created by amazing lower body strength, and great pitch awareness.

Reminds me of Albert Pujols, a pain in the ass to pitch against because he is extremely hard to strike out, and not because he swings and hits, but because he has an incredible awareness of the strike zone.

He is money... not worried at all.

VeeckAsInWreck
12-03-2008, 11:35 AM
I am only worried about the Scotty Pods effect. He did just get married.

Albert Pujols is married and you don't see it affecting him. I don't know that your theory carries much weight.


Seriously, Carlos will be fine. He's got a few more months for his wrist to recover. It's not like the season starts tomorrow.

Eddo144
12-03-2008, 11:48 AM
Wow...I have no problem putting faith in Quentin; if he stays healthy, he should consistently hit 30+ HR and have an OBP over .375, which is great.

But some people need to take off the rose-colored glasses. Are we seriously comparing Carlos Quentin, a promising player who has had one full, productive year, to Albert Pujols, one of the six best right-handed hitters of all time? Statements like this are why the OP questions our faith in Quentin. Let's keep our optimism tempered, people.

Lundind1
12-03-2008, 11:52 AM
And that got me thinking, maybe we are putting too much stock into just one season? Don't get me wrong, it was a great season and Q looked like the real deal. Heck, if he hadn't gotten injured at the end of the year, he would've most likely won the AL MVP and not just a Silver Slugger award. But it was just one season.


I don't think the wrist injury is going to have that much of an effect on him. It was not even close to being very serious as it was just a simple fracture, not even an all out break.

If you think that he is going to faulter, consider the fact the guy still has something to prove. He missed out on the AL MVP as a direct result of some stupid moment that he had. A silver slugger is not the same to a guy like that as an MVP or a batting title. He may very well want to vindicate himself from that one fleeting moment of anger that caused him to hit the bat, thus breaking his wrist and ending his season. If anything, you may see a much more powerful Carlos Quentin in 2009.

guillensdisciple
12-03-2008, 11:59 AM
Wow...I have no problem putting faith in Quentin; if he stays healthy, he should consistently hit 30+ HR and have an OBP over .375, which is great.

But some people need to take off the rose-colored glasses. Are we seriously comparing Carlos Quentin, a promising player who has had one full, productive year, to Albert Pujols, one of the six best right-handed hitters of all time? Statements like this are why the OP questions our faith in Quentin. Let's keep our optimism tempered, people.

I never said he was like Albert Pujols, but through his first year he showed bat control that had similarities to Pujols (meaning he had excellent control).

They might be completely different by the end of their careers, but if Carlos has a great awareness of the strike zone like he did last year, he will be a very succesful baseball player.

LoveYourSuit
12-03-2008, 12:03 PM
Very good topic here.

The same can be said about Alexei.

I think we are banking on duplicate years if not better from each one of them..... if we trade Dye and go young at that position too.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-03-2008, 12:04 PM
I am ashamed by this thread, Carlos wants the leadership role, he wants faith put on his shoulders.

Reminds me of Albert Pujols, a pain in the ass to pitch against because he is extremely hard to strike out, and not because he swings and hits, but because he has an incredible awareness of the strike zone.

He is money... not worried at all.

You're ashamed? Why? Because we're not all ready to compare CQ to the greatest hitter of our time, Albert Pujols? Come on guy. And he WAS money last year, that is for sure. Will he be next year? I sure as heck hope so and if he does it next year, I'll definitely agree with you that "he is money". But until then, I can't say that I'm "not worried at all".




But some people need to take off the rose-colored glasses. Are we seriously comparing Carlos Quentin, a promising player who has had one full, productive year, to Albert Pujols, one of the six best right-handed hitters of all time? Statements like this are why the OP questions our faith in Quentin. Let's keep our optimism tempered, people.

That is exactly my point. It's like second nature to some of us to assume that this man is in the same category as Pujols, A-Rod, Holliday, Manny, etc., which he very well maybe in a few years, but he's not there now.




He may very well want to vindicate himself from that one fleeting moment of anger that caused him to hit the bat, thus breaking his wrist and ending his season. If anything, you may see a much more powerful Carlos Quentin in 2009.

Great point made in the first sentence and I totally agree with and am hoping for what you said in the second sentence.

jabrch
12-03-2008, 12:06 PM
Having a guy who you are paying nothing to is not "putting all your faith in him". Paying him 15mm based on one season would be.

He's our best bet in that spot. If he can't handle it, we will have to adjust. But you go to war with the people you have. Right now, he is who we best have to hit #3.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-03-2008, 12:31 PM
Having a guy who you are paying nothing to is not "putting all your faith in him". Paying him 15mm based on one season would be.

He's our best bet in that spot. If he can't handle it, we will have to adjust. But you go to war with the people you have. Right now, he is who we best have to hit #3.

How do you just adjust after you admit that you're best hitter is... not so good? He's not just another role player, he's THE centerpiece of our lineup. Like I said in the original post, we can easily deal w/ losing Dye, Konerko, Thome, AJ, etc. But to lose Quentin would mean a lot. We have NO ONE in our farm system to come up and replace his production. Hell, how many current free agents can come in and produce the way he did? I can't think of one! Maybe KW could pull off another steal like he did when he acquired Quentin originally, but how likely is that? Highly unlikely.

It's not about how much we're paying him. That has nothing to do with it. Whether we were paying him $16mm per or $2mm per, if we lost him or if he didn't perform the way we expect him to, it'll be a huge shot in the arm for our lineup because we hadn't planned for that at all.

Jurr
12-03-2008, 12:35 PM
I didn't have faith in Quentin until he single-handedly beat the Angels on a Sunday night. Then he made me dance around my house like a little child when he hit that bomb against the Rangers.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-03-2008, 12:36 PM
I didn't have faith in Quentin until he single-handedly beat the Angels on a Sunday night. Then he made me dance around my house like a little child when he hit that bomb against the Rangers.

lol that was the same night he made believers out of Jon Miller and Joe Morgan. They talked about CQ every Sunday night game after.

Sargeant79
12-03-2008, 12:50 PM
He was very ineffective in June/July, I think. Bad slump after he hit that HR against the Angels on Memorial Day. He eventually got good again before being injured. So he seems to have adjusted back to the league at least once.

He had a slump that lasted about three weeks during that time. It's a long season...everyone goes through them.

Before coming to the Sox, Carlos Quentin had a track record of success in the minors. The power numbers last year exceeded anything he had done in the past, but he had always had a high OBP and good average. He may not approach last year's HR numbers next year, but there is nothing in his track record to suggest that he will not maintain his status as a good major league hitter.

JB98
12-03-2008, 01:13 PM
No, we are not putting too much faith in Carlos Quentin. Q is a tireless worker. He has a quick swing and a great approach at the plate. He's a smart guy who knows how to make adjustments. His health is the only concern. If he's healthy, he'll be one of our most productive hitters again in 2009.

WhiteSox5187
12-03-2008, 01:19 PM
Obviously you run the risk of a guy having a bad year or an off year every year, there are no sure things in baseball. I'm fairly confident that he can produce along the same lines as this year, though his wrist might hamper his power numbers. My biggest concern though is can he stay healthy? The guy has battled through a lot of injuries in his short career.

EndemicSox
12-03-2008, 02:16 PM
As long as the wrist is healthy, and unfortunately that is probably a pretty big if due to the sheer violence of his swing, he'll be the rock of this franchise for the next ten years.

hi im skot
12-03-2008, 02:18 PM
As long as the wrist is healthy, and unfortunately that is probably a pretty big if, he'll be the rock of this franchise for the next ten years.

:?:

Is there any evidence out there that makes it sound as if he won't make a full recovery?

Foulke You
12-03-2008, 02:22 PM
No, we are not putting too much faith in Carlos Quentin. Q is a tireless worker. He has a quick swing and a great approach at the plate. He's a smart guy who knows how to make adjustments. His health is the only concern. If he's healthy, he'll be one of our most productive hitters again in 2009.
You pretty much sum up my feeling on Quentin right here. Tremendous bat speed, a great eye at the plate, can hit to all fields, and is much more than just a one dimensional power hitter. Quentin also has a knack for becoming an even better hitter when there are runners in scoring position. If the man is healthy next year, he will produce.

Also, for those worried about his wrist, the Sun Times did a brief article about Quentin's injury rehab and apparently, he has already recovered 100% from this and actually could have played in the ALCS if we had made it that far. It sounds like this fracture wasn't super serious so I don't that Quentin will have a power drop off. Here is what the man himself had to say:

''I hit about a week ago, and it was a nonfactor. I have not felt it in my swing and doing the one-handed stuff. I like using that one-armed bat, taking everything out of the equation to make sure my wrist is fine. And it responded great.''

-Carlos Quentin

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/1280702,CST-SPT-sox15.article

EndemicSox
12-03-2008, 02:23 PM
:?:

Is there any evidence out there that makes it sound as if he won't make a full recovery?

No, but on the contrary, there is no evidence that he will...time will tell. A wrist injury is a terrible thing for a professional hitter, especially one with a swing like Quentin's. In all likelyhood, he will be perfectly fine due to his access to the best doctors money can buy, but nothing is guarenteed.

esbrechtel
12-03-2008, 02:24 PM
I think the thread should be...

Are we putting too much faith in Gavin Floyd and John Danks....

EndemicSox
12-03-2008, 02:25 PM
You pretty much sum up my feeling on Quentin right here. Tremendous bat speed, a great eye at the plate, can hit to all fields, and is much more than just a one dimensional power hitter. Quentin also has a knack for becoming an even better hitter when there are runners in scoring position. If the man is healthy next year, he will produce.

Also, for those worried about his wrist, the Sun Times did a brief article about Quentin's injury rehab and apparently, he has already recovered 100% from this and actually could have played in the ALCS if we had made it that far. It sounds like this fracture wasn't super serious so I don't that Quentin will have a power drop off. Here is what the man himself had to say:

''I hit about a week ago, and it was a nonfactor. I have not felt it in my swing and doing the one-handed stuff. I like using that one-armed bat, taking everything out of the equation to make sure my wrist is fine. And it responded great.''

-Carlos Quentin

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/1280702,CST-SPT-sox15.article
:bandance:

jabrch
12-03-2008, 02:26 PM
How do you just adjust after you admit that you're best hitter is... not so good?

What choice do you have? IF he is "not so good" which I don't think is true, then you adjust. If it means you lower the team's expectations for the year - then so be it. But since he is only making the minimum, you aren't in the worst position in the world. Much better off than if you realize this after signing him to a 5 year deal.

He's not just another role player, he's THE centerpiece of our lineup. Like I said in the original post, we can easily deal w/ losing Dye, Konerko, Thome, AJ, etc. But to lose Quentin would mean a lot. We have NO ONE in our farm system to come up and replace his production. Hell, how many current free agents can come in and produce the way he did? I can't think of one! Maybe KW could pull off another steal like he did when he acquired Quentin originally, but how likely is that? Highly unlikely.

Who knows? In a mythical world where he suddenly is lost, why can't someone else step in?

It's not about how much we're paying him. That has nothing to do with it. Whether we were paying him $16mm per or $2mm per, if we lost him or if he didn't perform the way we expect him to, it'll be a huge shot in the arm for our lineup because we hadn't planned for that at all.

But it is much worse to lose a guy who you have financial committments to. You can't adjust to that. The worst part about losing Contreras isn't losing a middle of the rotation guy, but not having the 10mm available to get a player.

hi im skot
12-03-2008, 02:29 PM
No, but on the contrary, there is no evidence that he will...time will tell. A wrist injury is a terrible thing for a professional hitter, especially one with a swing like Quentin's. In all likelyhood, he will be perfectly fine due to his access to the best doctors money can buy, but nothing is guarenteed.

That's fair, and I agree that nothing is guaranteed. Thankfully, it sounds as if Carlos will able to recover fully and continue to tear up the league.

kitekrazy
12-04-2008, 11:52 AM
The other day I found myself talking trade with a few friends of mine and I noticed that after every "trade", I had Carlos Quentin batting 3rd in my lineup. A lot of us here at WSI are doing the samething. And one of my friends, of course a Cubs fan, asked me, "How are you so confident that Quentin will repeat his success from last season?"


I thought the same thing about Frank Thomas.

PennStater98r
12-04-2008, 05:02 PM
How do you just adjust after you admit that you're best hitter is... not so good? He's not just another role player, he's THE centerpiece of our lineup. Like I said in the original post, we can easily deal w/ losing Dye, Konerko, Thome, AJ, etc.

We would deal becausewe have Dye, Konerko and Thome. We'd have a hard time dealing because we have Dye, Konerko and Thome. On any given stretch of time, Dye and Konerko could be our best hitter - take the '06 Dye for example. Thome could also be one of our great hitters.

I would argue that if we're going to have problems without TCQ in the line-up, we'd have those same problems with him in the line-up. We do not have enough speed. We have too many strikeouts and too many guys that don't hit enough doubles.

PennStater98r
12-04-2008, 05:04 PM
I thought the same thing about Frank Thomas.

Carlos is not in the same league as Thomas when Thomas was TCQ's age.

I love TCQ, but Thomas is up there with Manny and A-Rod and Pujols as the best hitters in my lifetime.

sullythered
12-04-2008, 07:44 PM
This thread is going to make Carlos angry. You wouldn't like him when he's angry...

FielderJones
12-04-2008, 11:56 PM
Somehow, TCQ failed to make this list (http://www.realclearsports.com/lists/Top_10_Dumbest_SelfInflicted_Injuries/self_inflicted_injuries_intro.html).