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View Full Version : UK Newspaper Mentions Sox ... And It's Negative


WhiteSoxFan84
11-30-2008, 04:25 AM
I don't want this thread ending up in the roadhouse so please just talk about the 5th paragraph in which Chicago sports and namely the White Sox are mentioned. This is link to the article from "The Independent", a UK newspaper (I think?) and it's written by a Rupert Cornwell (haha, Rupert, if only Stewie knew what his stuffed animal was writing about)...

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/rupert-cornwell/rupert-cornwell-at-last-the-cure-for-chicagos-inferiority-complex-has-arrived-1041658.html

What a tool.

Boondock Saint
11-30-2008, 04:59 AM
I bet this guy knows as much about baseball as most American sports writers know about soccer.

I'd probably be a really angry person if I cared about what UK sports writers have to say about baseball.

soxinem1
11-30-2008, 12:24 PM
I bet this guy knows as much about baseball as most American sports writers know about soccer.

I'd probably be a really angry person if I cared about what UK sports writers have to say about baseball.

I'm suprised he didn't refer to baseball as 'rounders'.

JNS
11-30-2008, 12:43 PM
I lived in the UK for years. This is a typical piece by a guy who parachuted in for a day or two.

All these folks know is NYC, LA, and Florida (with the dollar low against the pound and the euro, there are super-cheap flights to Florida all Winter). And maybe SF.

Lots of our Brit friends - who would never deem to visit us in this backwater are now pumping us for invites (we live a few blocks from the Obamas). And the few who have bothered to show up over the years have loved Chicago - and we make sure to take them to a Sox game if it's during the summer and they are in town. And they love that too.

As an aside, the thing about baseball games - and certainly games at the Cell - that amazes them is how much of a family atmosphere there is, as opposed to soccer games over there, where violence is always close to bubbling up. One guy was just flabbergasted when someone in the middle of the row ordered beers and the beers got passed down to the buyer - and the money got passed along to the vendor (and the change was dutifully passed back along the row). He said "in London both the beer and the money would have disappeared long before it got to where it was supposed to be. Selling beer in the stadium and passing money back and forth isn't even in the frame of reference!"

Did you notice the reference to MJ? Well, they do watch the NBA in the UK - the host of the Sunday NBA roundup on Brit TV (not the BBC, but ITV) was a native South sider named Scoop Jackson. He's from South Shore and is a Sox fan. I remember missing work because I stayed up till 5:00 AM watching the 1998 NBA playoffs live. So the guy references MJ and the Bulls because people there are familiar with him, but don't know much about baseball. Cricket is a distant 2nd or 3rd behind soccer and rugby there, so even the game that is somewhat similar to baseball isn't all that popular. That's why the Pirates just signed a couple of Indian cricket players - cricket is much more popular in the East and West indies than in the UK itself. India and Pakistan regularly destroy the British cricket team in international play.

So really, it's just ignorance and bad journalism. American writers do the same sort of thing all the time when writing about places they aren't familiar with and haven't bothered to learn much about due to laziness or tight deadlines.

thomas35forever
11-30-2008, 01:13 PM
Here's what I'd say to the guy. Who gives a **** about what they did 89 years ago? He probably wasn't alive when the scandal happened, so why should he pretend that it's personal? Yes, it was a black eye for the Sox and the game of baseball, but not even the typical Cubs fan points to it when bashing the Sox. Why? Because there are few people alive today that actually remember it happening. Tell the guy to stop living in the 20th century and actually compliment the recent success of the President-elect's team.

Irishsoxfan
11-30-2008, 01:30 PM
I wouldn't get my knickers in a twist over what a UK (or Irish) journalist writes about Sox baseball. I read a small piece the other day in a daily newspaper that referred to arod as a basketball player. It's obviously ignorance rather that anything against the Sox.

hi im skot
11-30-2008, 01:43 PM
This article gets a giant :shrug:.

WhiteSox5187
11-30-2008, 02:00 PM
I was unaware that Chicago had an inferiority complex. I always thought we were the city with big shoulders?

chisoxfanatic
11-30-2008, 02:10 PM
The moment I read that Chicago is a metropolis of 3 million people, I stopped taking anything in that article to heart. Little research shows that is the population of the actual city itself, and the metropolis has a population of 10 million.

In addition, way to get it wrong as to why we're called the "Second City."

And sports teams who have "NEVER delivered the goods?" Most cities would die for what we have experienced here.

whitesox901
11-30-2008, 02:50 PM
:rolleyes: Bloody English

kjhanson
11-30-2008, 03:19 PM
The moment I read that Chicago is a metropolis of 3 million people, I stopped taking anything in that article to heart. Little research shows that is the population of the actual city itself, and the metropolis has a population of 10 million.


Haha, my sentiments exactly. I saw that line, and from that point on I just skimmed. If it's not worth his time to write an accurate piece, it's not worth my time to read.

Brian26
11-30-2008, 03:19 PM
Maybe he's just jealous the '81 Sting would have destroyed any incarnation of Liverpool F.C. /teal

soxinem1
11-30-2008, 04:39 PM
I'm surprised that he did not mention the horrible neighborhood the White Sox play in, the Ligues, and the total lack of safety in any neighborhood south of Division Street!!

SpartanSoxFan
11-30-2008, 04:45 PM
Hey, dude, what's the score???

Lundind1
11-30-2008, 05:17 PM
Just a bunch of assclownery if you ever ask me. I wouldn't lose any sleep over this one. What someone ought to do is write them an editorial that speaks volumes of Chicago. Oh well. I thought that we exercised the demons of 1919, so lets just win another one.

BigP50
11-30-2008, 10:44 PM
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW

idiot

what does everyone think about more 1919 or 2005

ChiSoxFan81
12-01-2008, 07:47 AM
This article makes as much sense as me doing a story about London and commenting on their oral hygiene and driving double decker buses.

nofluke69
12-01-2008, 10:11 AM
In other recent news.... in 1912 the unsinkable UK ship Titanic sunk, with huge loss of life. UK will always be overshadowed by this tragic event, and the travel industry for them should be screwed forever. Let us never forget how poorly they constructed their luxury ships, and this should be a reminder to never travel (via UK ship) to Europe........

You know, some things in life we need to just let go!

EnglishChiSox
12-02-2008, 05:53 PM
I lived in the UK for years. This is a typical piece by a guy who parachuted in for a day or two.

All these folks know is NYC, LA, and Florida (with the dollar low against the pound and the euro, there are super-cheap flights to Florida all Winter). And maybe SF.

Lots of our Brit friends - who would never deem to visit us in this backwater are now pumping us for invites (we live a few blocks from the Obamas). And the few who have bothered to show up over the years have loved Chicago - and we make sure to take them to a Sox game if it's during the summer and they are in town. And they love that too.

As an aside, the thing about baseball games - and certainly games at the Cell - that amazes them is how much of a family atmosphere there is, as opposed to soccer games over there, where violence is always close to bubbling up. One guy was just flabbergasted when someone in the middle of the row ordered beers and the beers got passed down to the buyer - and the money got passed along to the vendor (and the change was dutifully passed back along the row). He said "in London both the beer and the money would have disappeared long before it got to where it was supposed to be. Selling beer in the stadium and passing money back and forth isn't even in the frame of reference!"

Did you notice the reference to MJ? Well, they do watch the NBA in the UK - the host of the Sunday NBA roundup on Brit TV (not the BBC, but ITV) was a native South sider named Scoop Jackson. He's from South Shore and is a Sox fan. I remember missing work because I stayed up till 5:00 AM watching the 1998 NBA playoffs live. So the guy references MJ and the Bulls because people there are familiar with him, but don't know much about baseball. Cricket is a distant 2nd or 3rd behind soccer and rugby there, so even the game that is somewhat similar to baseball isn't all that popular. That's why the Pirates just signed a couple of Indian cricket players - cricket is much more popular in the East and West indies than in the UK itself. India and Pakistan regularly destroy the British cricket team in international play.

So really, it's just ignorance and bad journalism. American writers do the same sort of thing all the time when writing about places they aren't familiar with and haven't bothered to learn much about due to laziness or tight deadlines.

Pakistan doesn't regularly destroy England and Cricket is certainly second and is quite popular, at least we get 80000 for a 5 day test whereas you get about 10000 in India and Pakistan and Sri Lanka and West Indies and New Zealand and South Africa.

As for the article it's a bit meh, At least he rags on the cubs as well

JNS
12-02-2008, 07:03 PM
Pakistan doesn't regularly destroy England and Cricket is certainly second and is quite popular, at least we get 80000 for a 5 day test whereas you get about 10000 in India and Pakistan and Sri Lanka and West Indies and New Zealand and South Africa.

As for the article it's a bit meh, At least he rags on the cubs as well

It's a crap article - the guy parachuted in for a couple of days. He really didn't get it, which isn't to say that others haven't. This was just not a good piece.

I live in Obama's neighborhood - the international media has been swarming all over this place. Saw a crew from Channel 4 the other day - no Jon Snow though.

If I remember from my years in N. Ireland, there are huge swaths of the UK where cricket isn't even played much. I remember endless articles about how county cricket is dying off, how outside of the midlands, Yorkshire in particular it's dying, etc.

Couple of articles below that seem to confirm this.

I understand that a big test at the Oval, or the Ashes will draw a huge crowd, but does this translate into growth? I haven't lived in the UK since 2000, but at that time, and through most of the 90s there was a lot more Rugby on the tube than Cricket. Soccer dominates like no sport over here, and where I was there was almost no cricket. Plenty of rugby though.

Let's put it this way: I see more cricket here in Chicago - huge leagues of East and West Indian guys that play in several big parks on the weekends - than I did in NI and Northern England.

Qualitatively, all I know is that excepting 2005, England has not done all that well in International play, at least according to what I would read in the papers - I can't honestly say I followed it closely.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1932944/Fewer-than-10pc-playing-cricket-at-state-school.html

http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Few-takers-for-cricket-in-England-Survey/308477/

EnglishChiSox
12-02-2008, 08:30 PM
It's a crap article - the guy parachuted in for a couple of days. He really didn't get it, which isn't to say that others haven't. This was just not a good piece.

I live in Obama's neighborhood - the international media has been swarming all over this place. Saw a crew from Channel 4 the other day - no Jon Snow though.

If I remember from my years in N. Ireland, there are huge swaths of the UK where cricket isn't even played much. I remember endless articles about how county cricket is dying off, how outside of the midlands, Yorkshire in particular it's dying, etc.

Couple of articles below that seem to confirm this.

I understand that a big test at the Oval, or the Ashes will draw a huge crowd, but does this translate into growth? I haven't lived in the UK since 2000, but at that time, and through most of the 90s there was a lot more Rugby on the tube than Cricket. Soccer dominates like no sport over here, and where I was there was almost no cricket. Plenty of rugby though.

Let's put it this way: I see more cricket here in Chicago - huge leagues of East and West Indian guys that play in several big parks on the weekends - than I did in NI and Northern England.

Qualitatively, all I know is that excepting 2005, England has not done all that well in International play, at least according to what I would read in the papers - I can't honestly say I followed it closely.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1932944/Fewer-than-10pc-playing-cricket-at-state-school.html

http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Few-takers-for-cricket-in-England-Survey/308477/

Well at school level it's very difficult to compete with soccer so hardly a surprise but to be fair i don't think it's such a minority sport but then again it might be not as big as i imagine it to be looking from within so to speak. But with the actual team's form they remind me a bit of the Sox, 2005 of course being the big glory year in recent history but they followed it up with some mediocre stuff but i think now they're on the way up again led by a team which is giving young players a chance to play.

chaerulez
12-02-2008, 08:51 PM
I lived in the UK for years. This is a typical piece by a guy who parachuted in for a day or two.

All these folks know is NYC, LA, and Florida (with the dollar low against the pound and the euro, there are super-cheap flights to Florida all Winter). And maybe SF.

Lots of our Brit friends - who would never deem to visit us in this backwater are now pumping us for invites (we live a few blocks from the Obamas). And the few who have bothered to show up over the years have loved Chicago - and we make sure to take them to a Sox game if it's during the summer and they are in town. And they love that too.

As an aside, the thing about baseball games - and certainly games at the Cell - that amazes them is how much of a family atmosphere there is, as opposed to soccer games over there, where violence is always close to bubbling up. One guy was just flabbergasted when someone in the middle of the row ordered beers and the beers got passed down to the buyer - and the money got passed along to the vendor (and the change was dutifully passed back along the row). He said "in London both the beer and the money would have disappeared long before it got to where it was supposed to be. Selling beer in the stadium and passing money back and forth isn't even in the frame of reference!"

Did you notice the reference to MJ? Well, they do watch the NBA in the UK - the host of the Sunday NBA roundup on Brit TV (not the BBC, but ITV) was a native South sider named Scoop Jackson. He's from South Shore and is a Sox fan. I remember missing work because I stayed up till 5:00 AM watching the 1998 NBA playoffs live. So the guy references MJ and the Bulls because people there are familiar with him, but don't know much about baseball. Cricket is a distant 2nd or 3rd behind soccer and rugby there, so even the game that is somewhat similar to baseball isn't all that popular. That's why the Pirates just signed a couple of Indian cricket players - cricket is much more popular in the East and West indies than in the UK itself. India and Pakistan regularly destroy the British cricket team in international play.

So really, it's just ignorance and bad journalism. American writers do the same sort of thing all the time when writing about places they aren't familiar with and haven't bothered to learn much about due to laziness or tight deadlines.

If Scoop Jackson was the UK's source for sports, even if it's basketball, I feel sorry for the guys across the pond. Scoop Jackson is an assclown.

JNS
12-02-2008, 10:18 PM
If Scoop Jackson was the UK's source for sports, even if it's basketball, I feel sorry for the guys across the pond. Scoop Jackson is an assclown.

Well, I respectfully disagree - I like the guy. And that was a cogent, thoughtful, intelligent comment that has really added to the quality of this thread. It really adds to the collective IQ of the folks here - I know everyone is waiting for more interesting and perceptive comments from you.

What's an assclown anyhow? An invention of yours?

cub killer
12-03-2008, 10:06 AM
What a ****ing idiot. In what possible way does 1919 "overshadow" 2005? Are you ****ing kidding me? And this guy gets paid for writing utter nonsense?

Teenagers who post on Yahoo Answers are more accurate than this loser.




Re: scoop jackson. I don't know much about the guy, except that he's a Sox fan and a cub hater. That's good enough for me, so he's cool in my book.

PatK
12-03-2008, 10:31 AM
:whocares

JNS
12-03-2008, 05:35 PM
Well at school level it's very difficult to compete with soccer so hardly a surprise but to be fair i don't think it's such a minority sport but then again it might be not as big as i imagine it to be looking from within so to speak. But with the actual team's form they remind me a bit of the Sox, 2005 of course being the big glory year in recent history but they followed it up with some mediocre stuff but i think now they're on the way up again led by a team which is giving young players a chance to play.

Fair enough. These things do go up and down and nobody ever said that NI was a hotbed of cricket. I like the fact that Obama shares a name with one of Cricket's greatest stars (Hussein).

And as you touch on, nothing is as big as soccer (football) but from what everyone has told me, that's fairly recent - that football was always a working class sport, with rugby and cricket being more attractive to middle class folks and sloane rangers, and that only started breaking down in the 80s when the dough got really big and they set up the premiership to replace div 1. And teams like Liverpool and Man U started becoming like the Yankees over here.

JNS
12-03-2008, 05:37 PM
Re: scoop jackson. I don't know much about the guy, except that he's a Sox fan and a cub hater. That's good enough for me, so he's cool in my book.

And me too.

He wrote a really nice article in 2005 about the Sox and what being a South sider means.