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stevemcstud
11-30-2008, 01:17 AM
Thome's contract is up after 2009. He is scheduled to make around 15 mil I think this year from what I have heard. So here is my question:

If Thome has the same kind of season in 2009 he has had in the last 3 years (34hr+, 90RBI+ and .360 OBP+) would you guys like it if he came back and signed a 1 year deal for 2010 at around the 5 million mark? Maybe a club option for the 2nd season.

This would allow Thome to reach 600 HR in a Sox uniform and most likely retire after that. And if he shows sign of further decline we don't take him the 2nd year.

This would also allow for further player development for players who would come up to take over 1st for Konerko after he moves to DH. Also would save us 10 mil in salary room and not make us go looking for a DH to fill the spot.

CashMan
11-30-2008, 01:25 AM
Thome's contract is up after 2009. He is scheduled to make around 15 mil I think this year from what I have heard. So here is my question:

If Thome has the same kind of season in 2009 he has had in the last 3 years (34hr+, 90RBI+ and .360 OBP+) would you guys like it if he came back and signed a 1 year deal for 2010 at around the 5 million mark? Maybe a club option for the 2nd season.

This would allow Thome to reach 600 HR in a Sox uniform and most likely retire after that. And if he shows sign of further decline we don't take him the 2nd year.

This would also allow for further player development for players who would come up to take over 1st for Konerko after he moves to DH. Also would save us 10 mil in salary room and not make us go looking for a DH to fill the spot.

I would rather offer Dye, if he is still with the Sox, that deal.

Nellie_Fox
11-30-2008, 01:42 AM
If Thome has the same kind of season in 2009 he has had in the last 3 years (34hr+, 90RBI+ and .360 OBP+) would you guys like it if he came back and signed a 1 year deal for 2010 at around the 5 million mark? Maybe a club option for the 2nd season.Someone who is more familiar with the collective bargaining agreement than I am will surely wade in, but I don't think he would be allowed to take that big of a pay cut to re-sign with his current team. I think the Sox can't offer him anything that is more than a 20% pay cut without making him a free agent with whom they cannot negotiate until May. Correct, CBA experts?

Surely you can't think he'd be so loyal to the Sox that he wouldn't listen to any other offers until May 2010, and that no other team would be willing to take a shot at him for more than $5M

WhiteSoxFan84
11-30-2008, 02:12 AM
Thome's contract is up after 2009. He is scheduled to make around 15 mil I think this year from what I have heard. So here is my question:

If Thome has the same kind of season in 2009 he has had in the last 3 years (34hr+, 90RBI+ and .360 OBP+) would you guys like it if he came back and signed a 1 year deal for 2010 at around the 5 million mark? Maybe a club option for the 2nd season.

This would allow Thome to reach 600 HR in a Sox uniform and most likely retire after that. And if he shows sign of further decline we don't take him the 2nd year.

This would also allow for further player development for players who would come up to take over 1st for Konerko after he moves to DH. Also would save us 10 mil in salary room and not make us go looking for a DH to fill the spot.


$13mm in 2009 if his option is picked up (or has it been already). $3 mill buyout if the sox choose to let him go. i doubt they will (again, if they haven't signed him already). and we will be on the hook for almost all 13 mill this year. the phillies gave us 22mm to cover half his salaries from 06-08 (combined: 40.5mm) and the buyout. half of that 40.5mm is 20.25mm which leaves 1.75mm. subtract the 1.75mm from the 13mm thome will make in 09, and we're actually paying him 11.25mm for his services this upcoming season. not bad if he can post a .365 OBP w/ 35+ HRs.

Nellie_Fox
11-30-2008, 02:16 AM
$13mm in 2009 if his option is picked up (or has it been already). $3 mill buyout if the sox choose to let him go. The option became guaranteed when Thome reached a combined 1100 plate appearances for 07-08. There is no buy out. 2009 is now guaranteed.

jabrch
11-30-2008, 02:19 AM
Someone who is more familiar with the collective bargaining agreement than I am will surely wade in, but I don't think he would be allowed to take that big of a pay cut to re-sign with his current team. I think the Sox can't offer him anything that is more than a 20% pay cut without making him a free agent with whom they cannot negotiate until May. Correct, CBA experts?

I believe that 20% is only the largest paycut they can offer him via arbitration. Prior to it getting to arbitration, the two sides can agree to whatever they want.

WhiteSoxFan84
11-30-2008, 02:24 AM
The option became guaranteed when Thome reached a combined 1100 plate appearances for 07-08. There is no buy out. 2009 is now guaranteed.

Thank you sir. I knew I missed something.
So there it is, he officially gets paid $13mm in 2009 but it's safe to assume we are only on the hook for $11.25mm unless the Sox "used up" all of the $22mm they received from the Phillies already.

NLaloosh
11-30-2008, 02:54 AM
no

btrain929
11-30-2008, 05:16 AM
I believe that 20% is only the largest paycut they can offer him via arbitration. Prior to it getting to arbitration, the two sides can agree to whatever they want.

That's my understanding of it as well. Seeing as Thome is obviously about 1-4 years away from retiring, I'd like to see us give him a perpetual option (like Tim Wakefield has), where it's a set amount every year. Wakefield has a 4 million dollar option every year. I figure with Thome, maybe 6 million every year? If he keeps performing, we keep accepting. If he doesn't, we decline and he becomes a free agent/retires. This way, in the latter stages of his career, he doesn't have to worry about bouncing around from team to team and state to state on 1 year deals. He is from here and lives here, so let's let him finish his career here on terms both of us would agree on. If we let him walk after '09, we would have absolutely 0% pop from the left side of our batting order.

soxrepublican
11-30-2008, 11:52 AM
Yep. We should sign him until he retires, then he might go the HOF with a Sox hat on, because the Tribe "fans" treated him like a jerkoff.

soltrain21
11-30-2008, 12:12 PM
Yep. We should sign him until he retires, then he might go the HOF with a Sox hat on, because the Tribe "fans" treated him like a jerkoff.


That would be like Frank Thomas going in with an Oakland hat. Sorry sir, but no.

soxrepublican
11-30-2008, 12:35 PM
That would be like Frank Thomas going in with an Oakland hat. Sorry sir, but no.

Well, We treated Frank well, and he only played one full year with them. Thome has the potential to play 5 or so years with us, and played 10 years with Clevland. Many players have done what Thome could do. Remember Carlton Fisk? 8 years with Boston 13 CARRER years with the Pale Hose. Goes in with Boston hat.

Woofer
11-30-2008, 12:42 PM
Well, We treated Frank well, and he only played one full year with them. Thome has the potential to play 5 or so years with us, and played 10 years with Clevland. Many players have done what Thome could do. Remember Carlton Fisk? 8 years with Boston 13 CARRER years with the Pale Hose. Goes in with Boston hat.

I don't think that the player has a say so anymore in what hat he is wearing on his HOF plaque.

jabrch
11-30-2008, 12:44 PM
Yep. We should sign him until he retires, then he might go the HOF with a Sox hat on, because the Tribe "fans" treated him like a jerkoff.

He will go in as an Indian. He has no say in the matter, and the best years in his career were in Cleveland.

soxinem1
11-30-2008, 01:09 PM
Someone who is more familiar with the collective bargaining agreement than I am will surely wade in, but I don't think he would be allowed to take that big of a pay cut to re-sign with his current team. I think the Sox can't offer him anything that is more than a 20% pay cut without making him a free agent with whom they cannot negotiate until May. Correct, CBA experts?

Surely you can't think he'd be so loyal to the Sox that he wouldn't listen to any other offers until May 2010, and that no other team would be willing to take a shot at him for more than $5M

He could sign a deal like Vazquez did, for security at less $$$$$ than he was making, as an extension. Though not much less in yearly salary, he is guaranteed $10 million per season.

For Thome to take a 2/3 paycut to stay here, on paper that sounds unlikely, but I couldn't see a team giving him $10 million to DH at ths stage of his career, especially since he is unproductive against LHP, a likely injury risk, and not likely to get 500 AB even if healthy.

If he took the cut and was still productive, sure. But I would rather have Dye if there was a choice.

HomeFish
11-30-2008, 01:49 PM
No way. If we want somebody to hit under .250 for us in 2010 but hit a bunch of home runs, we have Josh Fields.

Craig Grebeck
11-30-2008, 01:55 PM
No way. If we want somebody to hit under .250 for us in 2010 but hit a bunch of home runs, we have Josh Fields.
There's a huge difference between .250/.310/.480 and .250/.360/.500.

WhiteSoxFan84
11-30-2008, 02:39 PM
There's a huge difference between .250/.310/.480 and .250/.360/.500.

.... not really? :scratch:
the only worthy difference is in OBP and it is .050 (that's a difference of 5 more times reaching base per 100 at-bats). but factor in their salaries and if those numbers you stated are true, fields is the one i'd rather have.

Craig Grebeck
11-30-2008, 02:40 PM
.... not really? :scratch:
the only big difference is in OBP but factor in their salaries and if those numbers you stated are true, fields is the one i'd rather have.
No thanks. I'll take the above average offensive player.

WhiteSoxFan84
11-30-2008, 02:44 PM
No thanks. I'll take the above average offensive player.

id rather have thome over fields too, but not because of the numbers you compared. those do nothing to help your cause. especially since you neglected to add thome will command around $8-$10mm in 2010 when fields will probably still be getting under $1mm.

Craig Grebeck
11-30-2008, 02:58 PM
id rather have thome over fields too, but not because of the numbers you compared. those do nothing to help your cause. especially since you neglected to add thome will command around $8-$10mm in 2010 when fields will probably still be getting under $1mm.
I'm not talking about 2010. I'm talking about offensive numbers in general. The original poster equated Fields' numbers with Thome's.

HomeFish
11-30-2008, 03:00 PM
I'm accounting for the fact that by 2010, Thome's skills will have diminished so much that he will be the same as Josh Fields.

whitesox901
11-30-2008, 03:15 PM
Thome will prob be gone at the end of this season.

Nellie_Fox
12-01-2008, 01:52 AM
I don't think that the player has a say so anymore in what hat he is wearing on his HOF plaque.The player still gets to express a preference, but the HOF retains final veto in case the player makes a ridiculous request. I think the HOF would have no problem with either Chicago or Cleveland for Thome, but seriously, he put up his major numbers with Cleveland, and that is who he should represent in the HOF.

No way. If we want somebody to hit under .250 for us in 2010 but hit a bunch of home runs, we have Josh Fields.There is no evidence that Fields can produce at that level for any extended period. A DH needs to have proved himself.

chisoxfanatic
12-01-2008, 03:08 AM
The player still gets to express a preference, but the HOF retains final veto in case the player makes a ridiculous request. I think the HOF would have no problem with either Chicago or Cleveland for Thome, but seriously, he put up his major numbers with Cleveland, and that is who he should represent in the HOF.
If those fans in Cleveland continue to be classless whenever he comes to Progressive Field, perhaps he might convince the HOF to have him go in as a Sox.

HomeFish
12-01-2008, 03:18 AM
There is no evidence that Fields can produce at that level for any extended period. A DH needs to have proved himself.

Again, we're talking about 2010. I don't think it's implausible to claim that in 2010, Josh Fields will be a better player than Jim Thome.

Nellie_Fox
12-01-2008, 12:47 PM
Again, we're talking about 2010. I don't think it's implausible to claim that in 2010, Josh Fields will be a better player than Jim Thome.
That isn't the same thing as saying he should be the DH in 2010. Thome may well be retired, but until Fields proves something I'd say the Sox better be making other plans for DH.

FarmerAndy
12-01-2008, 04:46 PM
Jim Thome is a great player who has had a great career. Stand up guy too.

But after this season is over, let it go. He's not bad. But he's not the player he once was, and at his age there's no reason to believe that he's going to do anything but slowly decline. Freeing up Thome's spot provides a lot of flexibility.

And as much as I like Thome, I don't care what uniform he is wearing when/if he hits #600, or what hat he wears into the hall of fame. None of these things have anything to do with the White Sox winning another championship.

jabrch
12-01-2008, 05:13 PM
If those fans in Cleveland continue to be classless whenever he comes to Progressive Field, perhaps he might convince the HOF to have him go in as a Sox.

He has absolutely no say, and the HOF isn't seeking out his opinion. Boggs begged to not have to go in as a Red Sox, and was told to shut up. Gary Carter wanted to be a Met - where he won his World Series - and was told to shut up.

Interestingly - Catfish Hunter had no pref. between Oakland or NYY - and thus his cap has no logo.

Thome will enter the HOF as a Indian. There's no debate.

champagne030
12-01-2008, 05:19 PM
He has absolutely no say

Wrong again.

Nellie_Fox
12-02-2008, 12:53 AM
He has absolutely no say.That's not what it says on the HOF website FAQ.

HomeFish
12-02-2008, 01:18 AM
It's close enough.