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View Full Version : Vazquez - Figgins Reprint Explained


Lip Man 1
11-12-2008, 12:14 PM
Joe got back with me and explained what happened. Also he gives an idea of what it would take to get Roberts and adds info on the conditions where Javy would accept a deal.

Just FYI:

"That story was the one that ran like two weeks ago, with some web guys trying to re-do the site and messing up by putting a new dateline on it. Javy has a no-trade clause to the West Coast because of his family and access to them in Puerto Rico, but he told me in a casual conversation that if a team - obviously one with some cash - was willing to allow him to go back and forth between starts he would consider it.

He has friends on the Angels and knows they are a playoff contender every year, while not having a media spotlight in his face every day - which he is not comfortable with. The other possibility, however, is Baltimore, as KW was seen talking to McPhail several times during the GM meetings. Packaging Vazquez to get Roberts is his dream deal. Problem is Baltimore asked for either Danks or Floyd, Alexei, Fields and Poreda last year for Roberts, and that wasn't going to happen.

Figgins is still on the list, but they are waiting to see which dominoes fall. The Angels are looking at acquiring Atkins from Colorado, so that could make Figgins dead weight.

There are a lot of things going on behind closed doors, and Kenny is not afraid of pulling off a few blockbusters this winter if it falls his way."


Lip

munchman33
11-12-2008, 12:18 PM
Lip this is WSI. It is unreasonable to expect a veteran workhorse and potential ace/Cy Young Javier Vazquez would go for anything but another stud starter and all of that teams' best prospects.

Flight #24
11-12-2008, 12:32 PM
Lip this is WSI. It is unreasonable to expect a veteran workhorse and potential ace/Cy Young Javier Vazquez would go for anything but another stud starter and all of that teams' best prospects.

Nope, not when the expectation is that they deal him for a bag of balls and turn around and replace him much more cheaply with any number of players hanging around outside USCF.

Isn't it fun to characterize things in the extreme!!! No possible middle ground there like "he's a solid mid-tier starter on a pretty good contract and so has value to both the Sox and a potential trade partner". Nope - that would be ludicrous!

oeo
11-12-2008, 12:38 PM
Problem is Baltimore asked for either Danks or Floyd, Alexei, Fields and Poreda last year for Roberts, and that wasn't going to happen.

For Roberts alone? :thud:

I wouldn't trade Danks straight up for Roberts. I think it's pretty evident that he's not going anywhere.

munchman33
11-12-2008, 12:43 PM
Nope, not when the expectation is that they deal him for a bag of balls and turn around and replace him much more cheaply with any number of players hanging around outside USCF.

Isn't it fun to characterize things in the extreme!!! No possible middle ground there like "he's a solid mid-tier starter on a pretty good contract and so has value to both the Sox and a potential trade partner". Nope - that would be ludicrous!

I figure since people do it to me, it's alright.

I don't have a problem with people who think we could keep Javy. I DO have a problem with people who think we have to keep Javy because he's irreplaceable.

KenBerryGrab
11-12-2008, 12:45 PM
For Roberts alone? :thud:

I wouldn't trade Danks straight up for Roberts. I think it's pretty evident that he's not going anywhere.

And that is problem with trying to deal with the Orioles. They ask for the moon, sun and stars and are shocked when the other team doesn't roll over.

LoveYourSuit
11-12-2008, 12:47 PM
Lip this is WSI. It is unreasonable to expect a veteran workhorse and potential ace/Cy Young Javier Vazquez would go for anything but another stud starter and all of that teams' best prospects.


Wow, there is just no middle ground with you. You take everything to the extreme.

Anyone asking for studs in return for Javy sounds as dumb as you asking for a bag of balls for him. Javy in my book is still a pretty darn good asset to the Sox because of his work load capacity as a #4 starter, especially with 2 and perhaps 3 still very young arms in our rotation. I expect to get something good in a package that involves him. Expecting a stud back in return would be very dumb from my part. I think Figgins is serviceable but not good, for me. I would want the Angels to throw in another prospect in there. Or if Kenny by some miracle opens up his note pad and shows me that moving $12 million of Javy as just a dump of $$$ will push him in getting in the bid for CC, then yes I say dump him for nothing or a Chone Figgins. But that's not going to happen.

munchman33
11-12-2008, 12:52 PM
Wow, there is just no middle ground with you. You take everything to the extreme.

Anyone asking for studs in return for Javy sounds as dumb as you asking for a bag of balls for him. Javy in my book is still a pretty darn good asset to the Sox because of his work load capacity as a #4 starter, especially with 2 and perhaps 3 still very young arms in our rotation. I expect to get something good in a package that involves him. Expecting a stud back in return would be very dumb from my part. I think Figgins is serviceable but not good, for me. I would want the Angels to throw in another prospect in there. Or if Kenny by some miracle opens up his note pad and shows me that moving $12 million of Javy as just a dump of $$$ will push him in getting in the bid for CC, then yes I say dump him for nothing or a Chone Figgins. But that's not going to happen.

Actually I posted this as a joke.

I figure since people do it to me, it's alright.

I don't have a problem with people who think we could keep Javy. I DO have a problem with people who think we have to keep Javy because he's irreplaceable.

LoveYourSuit
11-12-2008, 12:52 PM
And that is problem with trying to deal with the Orioles. They ask for the moon, sun and stars and are shocked when the other team doesn't roll over.


I think the article mentions that those were the demands last year for Roberts.


I think this next season, being 1 yr from FA, the demands will be much less. But as soon as McPhail starts metioning any of those cast members listed, Kenny needs to tell him to go **** off.

Kenny's proposal should start with Swisher and other minor league players.

oeo
11-12-2008, 12:55 PM
I think the article mentions that those were the demands last year for Roberts.


I think this next season, being 1 yr from FA, the demands will be much less. But as soon as McPhail starts metioning any of those cast members listed, Kenny needs to tell him to go **** off.

I think the Orioles plan on re-signing him unless they get a huge deal. So you can probably knock the 'or Danks' off, and they'll be asking for Floyd, Alexei, Fields, and Poreda.

LoveYourSuit
11-12-2008, 01:08 PM
I think the Orioles plan on re-signing him unless they get a huge deal. So you can probably knock the 'or Danks' off, and they'll be asking for Floyd, Alexei, Fields, and Poreda.


Well, he is the face of that franchise.


I just think the direction they are gong over there, Roberts will be the one to make the decision to test the FA market and not even give them a chance to sign him back. I think this is why everyone is assuming that he can be had, the Orioles want to cash in now. Only problem is that they are asking for the moon.

CashMan
11-12-2008, 01:31 PM
Only problem is that they are asking for the moon.


Didn't they get the moon for Bedard?

btrain929
11-12-2008, 01:46 PM
This guy wants to fly home in between starts? I'm all for being a family man, but if this has been happening a lot in the past, then I can see why he's only a .500 pitcher...........the guy is jetlagged 24/7. You already do a ton of flying during your regular MLB schedule, let alone doing all that X3 if you're seeing your family once a week in another country.

Tragg
11-12-2008, 01:56 PM
Didn't they get the moon for Bedard?
Yes
Roberts is a rent. I can't imagine a 1 year rental eing anyone's "dream deal" unless you pay a renters price, knowing that you will sign him to an extension and then do so.

soxfan43
11-12-2008, 01:56 PM
This guy wants to fly home in between starts? I'm all for being a family man, but if this has been happening a lot in the past, then I can see why he's only a .500 pitcher...........the guy is jetlagged 24/7. You already do a ton of flying during your regular MLB schedule, let alone doing all that X3 if you're seeing your family once a week in another country.

Isn't that basically what Clemens wanted from Houston?

white sox bill
11-12-2008, 01:58 PM
This guy wants to fly home in between starts? I'm all for being a family man, but if this has been happening a lot in the past, then I can see why he's only a .500 pitcher...........the guy is jetlagged 24/7. You already do a ton of flying during your regular MLB schedule, let alone doing all that X3 if you're seeing your family once a week in another country.

First off, PR is territory of USA. Yes I'm all for family too, can't he take his family to Chicago for at least summer? Can't he afford it!!!???

btrain929
11-12-2008, 02:01 PM
Isn't that basically what Clemens wanted from Houston?

Yeah, but:

1) His home was only in Texas (I believe), or at least in viscinity.
2) Clemens has the stats and success throughout his career to be worthy of that type of perk. (steroids or not).

btrain929
11-12-2008, 02:02 PM
First off, PR is territory of USA. Yes I'm all for family too, can't he take his family to Chicago for at least summer? Can't he afford it!!!???

Haha, SOMETHIN', right?

CashMan
11-12-2008, 02:09 PM
Isn't that basically what Clemens wanted from Houston?

Clemens lived in Texas, not Puerto Rico.

sorry didn't see the responses to this.

guillen4life13
11-12-2008, 02:20 PM
PR jet lag should not be significant, depending on the time of day he is flying.

Or maybe I'm just not as prone to the bad effects of jet lag when the time zone difference is under 6 hrs.

soxfan43
11-12-2008, 02:38 PM
Yeah, but:

1) His home was only in Texas (I believe), or at least in viscinity.
2) Clemens has the stats and success throughout his career to be worthy of that type of perk. (steroids or not).


i know, I was just making sure I remembered correctly that Clemens had a deal like that. And also, when your flying first class or private, the distance of Texas and PR isn't a big deal.

Brian26
11-12-2008, 09:13 PM
Problem is Baltimore asked for either Danks or Floyd, Alexei, Fields and Poreda last year for Roberts, and that wasn't going to happen.

For Roberts alone? :thud:

I wouldn't trade Danks straight up for Roberts. I think it's pretty evident that he's not going anywhere.

Insane. I don't know how you ever try to do business with Baltimore again after they had the guts to ask for that.