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Fenway
10-31-2008, 12:46 PM
OK the good news. Wednesday the end of Game 5 drew 19.8 million viewers but when combined with Monday it drops to 15.8 million.

The Series averaged 13.6 million viewers which was lower than the Celtics-Lakers NBA finals in June which averaged 14.9 million.

Ratings were off the charts in Philadelphia (51.8) and Tampa (32.4) but otherwise *yawn*

TommyGavinFloyd
10-31-2008, 12:49 PM
OK the good news. Wednesday the end of Game 5 drew 19.8 million viewers but when combined with Monday it drops to 15.8 million.

The Series averaged 13.6 million viewers which was lower than the Celtics-Lakers NBA finals in June which averaged 14.9 million.

Ratings were off the charts in Philadelphia (51.8) and Tampa (32.4) but otherwise *yawn*

If I worked at Fox, I would care. But I don't. It was better than last year's series, that's for sure.

Fenway
10-31-2008, 01:14 PM
If I worked at Fox, I would care. But I don't. It was better than last year's series, that's for sure.

2006 was the lowest before this year. Red Sox-Rockies averaged 19 million.

World Series usually needs to get into at least a Game 6 to gain traction and that hasn't happened since 2003.

MLB has a major problem when the NBA finals outdraw the Series.

jdm2662
10-31-2008, 01:18 PM
If I worked at Fox, I would care. But I don't. It was better than last year's series, that's for sure.

My thoughts exactly. I usually don't watch the playoffs without the Sox, but I watched some of the Series. I enjoyed watching what I did. Screw Fox and MLB. They get what they deserve.

RedHeadPaleHoser
10-31-2008, 01:40 PM
I watch the Series because I love to watch baseball. With all respect to Fenway, I'm sick of the 93,000 camera shot changes in between pitches. If it's 4 or 5 close, down to the last 2 inning games, then I will watch every pitch.

I agree with a few others - **** Fox for wishing on a star for Red Sox/Cubs. Congrats to both the Rays and Phillies for winning their divisions & leagues.

tstrike2000
10-31-2008, 01:50 PM
2006 was the lowest before this year. Red Sox-Rockies averaged 19 million.

World Series usually needs to get into at least a Game 6 to gain traction and that hasn't happened since 2003.

MLB has a major problem when the NBA finals outdraw the Series.

Besides not being marquee teams, I wished Fox would get two different announcers to call the series.

NLaloosh
10-31-2008, 01:55 PM
Who cares?

I hope next year's World Series is watched even less - and the White Sox win it!

Oblong
10-31-2008, 02:17 PM
I'm glad the ratings are lower because then maybe Fox or whoever else gets it after the current deal won't treat it like an infomercial for the fall/winter lineups.

D. TODD
10-31-2008, 02:18 PM
The Celts vs. Lakers was a much better matchup then Phillies/Rays. The real problem is the time of the year I think. The end of October and first week in November next year for the world series. That is not baseball time!

thedudeabides
10-31-2008, 02:19 PM
It's MLB and Fox's own fault. Start promoting your entire product, like the NFL, instead of just 3 or 4 teams. Finish the games at reasonable hours. Get an announcing crew that gives a **** about the game and isn't so smug.

This keeps happening every year unless they're lucky and get one of their darling teams in. You will never get one ounce of sympathy for Fox from me.

Fenway
10-31-2008, 02:28 PM
I watch the Series because I love to watch baseball. With all respect to Fenway, I'm sick of the 93,000 camera shot changes in between pitches. If it's 4 or 5 close, down to the last 2 inning games, then I will watch every pitch.

I agree with a few others - **** Fox for wishing on a star for Red Sox/Cubs. Congrats to both the Rays and Phillies for winning their divisions & leagues.

When I first started shooting baseball we used 5 cameras period. Home, first, third, CF and first base dugout. That is all you need.

Arne Harris at WGN-TV started doing more color shots in the mid 80's and other stations copied his style.

FOX started going overboard with crowd shot in 2003 at Wrigley and it went over the top in the 2004 ALCS at Fenway. Now for a major post-season game 18-20 cameras is considered normal from a blimp to cameras inserted into the field. It is overkill but it will not change.

When I was younger the World Series and All Star Game mattered because fans did root for their leagues. and that is no longer the case. The National League was a big mystery to me as in Boston we never saw the teams during the regular season until NBC started the Game of the Week and even then I would still watch the Red Sox. I never even saw Wrigley on TV until one winter in the early 60's WGN syndicated condensed baseball games to be shown in one hour with Jack Brickhouse hosting.

Today the average fan doesn't care unless their team is playing. The NFL doesn't have this problem and gambling is a big reason.

LoveYourSuit
10-31-2008, 02:44 PM
To be fair, the crappy weather did not help this series at all. Late start times + rain delays = disaster.

kobo
10-31-2008, 02:56 PM
It's MLB and Fox's own fault. Start promoting your entire product, like the NFL, instead of just 3 or 4 teams. Finish the games at reasonable hours. Get an announcing crew that gives a **** about the game and isn't so smug.

This keeps happening every year unless they're lucky and get one of their darling teams in. You will never get one ounce of sympathy for Fox from me.
Exactly. Having the same core of teams shoved down fans' throats year in and year out is becoming tiresome. If MLB and its TV partners started to promote more teams and the product overall they might not have this problem. It's also ridiculous to have Fox doing a 30 minute pre-game which pushes the start time of a game to 7:30 or later.

LoveYourSuit
10-31-2008, 02:56 PM
This keeps happening every year unless they're lucky and get one of their darling teams in. You will never get one ounce of sympathy for Fox from me.


Just curious, is there any TV station, Sports Talk Radio Show, or Sports Writer WSI is OK with?

Lukin13
10-31-2008, 03:32 PM
The entire playoffs started too late.

I have no real idea but I would guess that the target audience is 18-50 year old males....

I also bet the average 18-50 male wakes for work less than 8 hours after the last pitch of the game.

That is a problem. I loved the three inning game! It was the first 9th inning I was awake for since the divisional series.

Fenway
10-31-2008, 03:44 PM
First pitch can be no later than 7:35 Eastern to insure games don't go past midnight in the east.

Why worry about California viewers as they don't watch their home teams in big numbers. The Dodgers and Anaheim rank among the lowest in percentage of total viewers. Say what you want about the Northeast but that is where a huge percentage of baseball fans live.

The NBA can get away with late start times because they know a game will run no more than 3 hours.

Also try to speed up the game. 4 hours for a nine inning game is ridiculous.

At least FOX didn't use Scooter this year :)

thedudeabides
10-31-2008, 03:47 PM
Just curious, is there any TV station, Sports Talk Radio Show, or Sports Writer WSI is OK with?

Actually, I just really dislike the announcing team of Buck and McCarver. But, your right, you would be hard pressed to find a majority of people on any sports message board that like a particular network.

Hitmen77
10-31-2008, 03:51 PM
It's MLB and Fox's own fault. Start promoting your entire product, like the NFL, instead of just 3 or 4 teams. Finish the games at reasonable hours. Get an announcing crew that gives a **** about the game and isn't so smug.

This keeps happening every year unless they're lucky and get one of their darling teams in. You will never get one ounce of sympathy for Fox from me.

Agreed! The networks spend 6 months acting like the Yankees, Red Sox, and Cubs are the only teams that matter and then cry when other teams make it to the WS. The Phillies play in the 4th largest market and have been good with several good, exciting players for a few years now. If the viewing audience thinks the Phillies are "nobodies", then MLB is doing a horse**** job of marketing its product.

A couple other points:

1) Ratings are on a general downward trend no matter what. Each year, people have more and more viewing or other entertainment options that will take a large slice of the World Series ratings pie.

2) The games have ended too late! Sorry, unless the Sox are in it I can't get too into game when I know I'll miss the end of the game because it's a work night and I have to get up early and the damn game is not going to end until 11:00. I'd imagine it's even worse in Eastern time where the games end at midnight on work/school nights.

voodoochile
10-31-2008, 03:51 PM
Just curious, is there any TV station, Sports Talk Radio Show, or Sports Writer WSI is OK with?

John Kass well for the most part. I don't assume everyone agrees with his politics...

thomas35forever
10-31-2008, 04:03 PM
I don't care about the low ratings. Anbody but Fox should be covering the damn series. The announcers suck too and the NBA on NBC made MLB's coverage of Fox look like a high school station. Sadly though, it's not going to change and everybody knows it.

C-Dawg
10-31-2008, 04:26 PM
Of course the low ratings will never be mentioned here in Chicago. They wouldn't want to bust Eric Zorn's bubble about "2005 being the worst ratings ever".

RKMeibalane
10-31-2008, 04:46 PM
I'm in complete agreement with everyone on this. Fox has only themselves to blame, as they spend the majority of the baseball season focusing on the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs, and to a lesser extent, the Mets.

People tend to prefer those things that they are familiar with, and since none of the above teams reached the World Series, it's not surprising that people weren't that interested. A shame. They missed the coming out party for the Phillies, who stand a good chance of contending again next season.

Nonetheless, Joe Sucks and company are idiots if they think they had nothing to do with the low ratings from this World Series. If they want to attract more viewers, they need to do a better job of marketing other teams and players- and not just during the All Star game. They need to televise games featuring the other twenty six teams, and not limit these telecasts to regional audiences. The entire country needs to learn about the Marlins, Rangers, Tigers, and Padres- not just teams that play on the East Coast.

doublem23
10-31-2008, 04:47 PM
Just curious, is there any TV station, Sports Talk Radio Show, or Sports Writer WSI is OK with?

No, they all suck.

We're just waiting for the day we can launch WSI TV, all WSI, all the time!

RKMeibalane
10-31-2008, 04:47 PM
No, they all suck.

We're just waiting for the day we can launch WSI TV, all WSI, all the time!

If I turn on the TV and see Daver sitting there with his gun, I'll probably die laughing.

chisoxfanatic
10-31-2008, 05:52 PM
Besides not being marquee teams, I wished Fox would get two different announcers to call the series.
I think that they shouldn't have national broadcasters doing these games at all. It would be great to get the "local" taste of the teams playing in the playoffs. Do one of the following two things:



Have the home team's TV broadcasters cover the game. Every team in the playoffs is guaranteed at least one or two home games, so this is fair.
Combine the broadcasting teams for the two teams involved. Have the play-by-play guy from one team pair with the color analyst from the other team. Alternate games so that everyone is involved. This would actually be a great idea in the sense that both teams would have an "expert" talking about their team during all times during postseason games.

Local broadcasters bring so much more to the table than national broadcasters who do not specialize in a single team.


Finish the games at reasonable hours.
What they should really do is have the start time be variable and cater to the home team. The games should start at typical game times for the home team.

I want Mags back
10-31-2008, 07:49 PM
I don't care about the low ratings. Anbody but Fox should be covering the damn series. The announcers suck too and the NBA on NBC made MLB's coverage of Fox look like a high school station. Sadly though, it's not going to change and everybody knows it.

the NBA hasn't been on NBC in what, 7-8 years.

Oblong
10-31-2008, 11:04 PM
But is the bigger question really whether Fox cares what the ratings are? The whole playoff run was nothing but a big advertisement for their shows this fall.

If those shows end up getting the ratings they want then for Fox it's Mission Accomplished. They are only using baseball as a platform to promote 24, American Idol, House, and whatever else is on.

In one of my first college classes a professor told us "TV is not a bunch of TV shows with commercials in between. It's a bunch of commercials with TV shows in between." That's all Fox is interested in, much like ABC/ESPN/Disney uses sports to promote their entire brand and suite of products.

TommyJohn
10-31-2008, 11:53 PM
Waitacottonpickinminute!

OK, we all read about how the Yankees and Red Sox are the big national draws and Fox would love to have them and the Cubs in it. (Telander has said this in a couple of whiny "who cares?" columns). But would it really make that much of a difference? Seriously? I recall the ratings for last year weren't so hot. They were only slightly above 2006, which was the lowest-rated series.

There is also the 2005 series, which was the former record holder for lowest-rated series ever, a fact that we had rubbed in our faces. (Because of course it isn't a TRUE championship if no one but us watched it). What was the lowest-rated World Series before 2005? It was none other than the 2000 series between the Yankees and Mets. And in 2007 ratings for the Cubs' postseason games were down 38% from 2003. That's a huge dip. I'm curious as to what the ratings were for this year.

Bottom line-Fox may wish for the Red Sox and Yankees, and their fans and sportswriters may sniff that no one cares about baseball unless those grand teams are in it (the Cubs too) but the numbers don't seem to be backing them up.

I would also like to know what was the highest-rated Series since 1980, when cable began to really take hold, also the highest-rated one this decade.

EuroSox35
11-01-2008, 12:15 AM
I think Fox plays a big role in these bad ratings year after year. One thing that annoys me, a 35 minute + pregame show is ridiculous. I can just see average joe seeing 'World Series' on his on screen guide at 7, tuning in, then finally getting annoyed when 15 minutes in it's not close to starting yet, and looking around and him or his wife then being more interested in Dancing With The Stars or whatever people watch these days.

The Buck/McCarver hate is universal too, the article that had this story yesterday (I think off Drudge) was full of comments of people who say they can't stand them and it turns them off from watching.

I know people hate the ESPN bias and it would help for the media to showcase other teams more, but wasn't the Boston/Rockies series also the lowest rated at its time? Knowing that, you know there are other factors, since ESPN and all of them rate Boston as the mecca, while Col was an awesome Cinderella story. That's why I think it's time to point the finger at FOX

PKalltheway
11-01-2008, 05:29 AM
I think that they shouldn't have national broadcasters doing these games at all. It would be great to get the "local" taste of the teams playing in the playoffs. Do one of the following two things:



Have the home team's TV broadcasters cover the game. Every team in the playoffs is guaranteed at least one or two home games, so this is fair.
Combine the broadcasting teams for the two teams involved. Have the play-by-play guy from one team pair with the color analyst from the other team. Alternate games so that everyone is involved. This would actually be a great idea in the sense that both teams would have an "expert" talking about their team during all times during postseason games.
Local broadcasters bring so much more to the table than national broadcasters who do not specialize in a single team.



From what I have read in the past, NBC used to have the home team's announcer call the game with their own play-by-play and color man (usually Curt Gowdy/Joe Garagiola and Tony Kubek). I believe that the last time this was utilized was in 1976, when Marty Brennaman for Cincinnati, and Phil Rizzuto for New York, did their respective home games with the NBC crew. I wonder why they quit doing this? Maybe an older poster would know. :scratch:


I would also like to know what was the highest-rated Series since 1980, when cable began to really take hold, also the highest-rated one this decade.
Here you go.
http://baseball-almanac.com/ws/wstv.shtml

From what it looks like, the highest rated World Series since 1980 was 1980. The higest rated World Series this decade appears to be 2004 from that list, which was slightly higher than 2001. Wikipedia says otherwise, though. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Series_television_ratings

I don't really pay too much attention to ratings. If I enjoy watching it, I'll watch it. Besides, the World Series is an event, not a sitcom. Fox is not going to cancel the World Series due to low ratings.

Frater Perdurabo
11-01-2008, 07:14 AM
In addition to the ridiculously long pre-game show (save the analysis for the game, you idiots), and then the over-the-top pomp and circumstance of the introductions of the entire teams and umpires and celebrities, and the superstar rendition of the national anthem, FOX also starts the whole shebang - and thus the games - way too late.

This was an East Coast series. FOX knew the West Coast markets would not watch it it large numbers. So they should have backed up the starting times so that local market kids - tomorrows baseball consumers - could stay up to watch the games even on school nights.

If normal weeknight games start at 7:05 local time in Philly and Tampa Bay, open the gates at 5:05 and start the pre-game festivities at 6:25 local time. That gives them enough time to get the game started at the normal time. Who gives a crap if that means it starts at 4:05 on the West Coast? Obviously the West Coast wouldn't, since they didn't watch anyway!

Finally, schedule the games like this:

Game 1: Tuesday night
Game 2: Wednesday night
Game 3: Friday night (kids can stay up on Friday nights!)
Game 4: Saturday DAY GAME
*Game 5: Sunday DAY GAME
*Game 6: Tuesday night
*Game 7: Wednesday night
* if necessary

Lip Man 1
11-01-2008, 12:07 PM
At best...AT BEST, you'll see ONE day World Series game.

Lip

Frater Perdurabo
11-01-2008, 12:40 PM
At best...AT BEST, you'll see ONE day World Series game.

Lip

OK, since most kids can stay up later on Saturday nights, too, then make the Sunday game a day game. Work with the NFL to make a "sandwich" schedule:

East coast NFL games start at 1 p.m. EDT.

World Series Game 5 starts at 4:30 p.m. EDT (1:30 p.m. Pacific)

West coast NFL games start at 8:00 p.m. EDT (5:00 p.m. Pacific)

If the World Series is a sweep, then all sports fans get an afternoon off. Is that so bad?

Fenway
11-01-2008, 01:10 PM
OK, since most kids can stay up later on Saturday nights, too, then make the Sunday game a day game. Work with the NFL to make a "sandwich" schedule:

East coast NFL games start at 1 p.m. EDT.

World Series Game 5 starts at 4:30 p.m. EDT (1:30 p.m. Pacific)

West coast NFL games start at 8:00 p.m. EDT (5:00 p.m. Pacific)

If the World Series is a sweep, then all sports fans get an afternoon off. Is that so bad?

NBC used to work with the NFL to have all their AFC games kickoff at 1 PM when they carried the Series in the 70's. It affected the 1975 WS as Game 2 in Boston started at 4 and there was a rain delay in the 8th and the Reds came back to win after the delay.

There were Sunday afternoon Series games as late as 1984 as the Tigers won it late in the afternoon. I know 1986 all the Series games were at night and I think the change happened in 1985.

roylestillman
11-01-2008, 01:15 PM
This ratings stuff is all nonsense anyway. Through the early 80's the choices of TV at night were limited. Fox didn't even exist. Now with cable networks and the internet the competion for eyes is considerable.

I would love to see a chart giving the ratings/share for the top rated TV series over the last 3 decades vs World Series ratings during that period. I would bet that the drop off is more for the top rated series.

turners56
11-01-2008, 01:28 PM
In addition to the ridiculously long pre-game show (save the analysis for the game, you idiots), and then the over-the-top pomp and circumstance of the introductions of the entire teams and umpires and celebrities, and the superstar rendition of the national anthem, FOX also starts the whole shebang - and thus the games - way too late.

This was an East Coast series. FOX knew the West Coast markets would not watch it it large numbers. So they should have backed up the starting times so that local market kids - tomorrows baseball consumers - could stay up to watch the games even on school nights.

If normal weeknight games start at 7:05 local time in Philly and Tampa Bay, open the gates at 5:05 and start the pre-game festivities at 6:25 local time. That gives them enough time to get the game started at the normal time. Who gives a crap if that means it starts at 4:05 on the West Coast? Obviously the West Coast wouldn't, since they didn't watch anyway!

Finally, schedule the games like this:

Game 1: Tuesday night
Game 2: Wednesday night
Game 3: Friday night (kids can stay up on Friday nights!)
Game 4: Saturday DAY GAME
*Game 5: Sunday DAY GAME
*Game 6: Tuesday night
*Game 7: Wednesday night
* if necessary

They would never do a WS game that's not in primetime. There's no way they could do day games. I agree with everything else though.

sox1970
11-01-2008, 01:34 PM
They would never do a WS game that's not in primetime. There's no way they could do day games. I agree with everything else though.

They start the Super Bowl around 5:30 on a Sunday. If they start the World Series on a Wednesday, I don't see a problem with having Game 3 and 4 start at 5:00-5:30 central on a Saturday and Sunday. Might have some overlap with college and pro football, but at least the ends of games would have huge ratings. The problem now is people know they aren't staying up until midnight-1am to watch to the end, so they don't watch at all.

Frater Perdurabo
11-01-2008, 03:15 PM
The problem now is people know they aren't staying up until midnight-1am to watch to the end, so they don't watch at all.

Exactly.

I have to be at work at 7:30 each morning, which means I'm up between 5:30 and 6 a.m. So unless the Sox are in it, I'm just not watching it. I watched a grand total of three innings of this World Series. The rain delay and re-start allowed me to watch the Phillies actually win it all. So if not for the rain, I would have missed the entire series.

white sox bill
11-01-2008, 05:53 PM
According to cub fans, our 05 series against Houston was the least watched WS

ode to veeck
11-01-2008, 06:13 PM
OK the good news. Wednesday the end of Game 5 drew 19.8 million viewers but when combined with Monday it drops to 15.8 million.

The Series averaged 13.6 million viewers which was lower than the Celtics-Lakers NBA finals in June which averaged 14.9 million.

Ratings were off the charts in Philadelphia (51.8) and Tampa (32.4) but otherwise *yawn*

the game time contortions for Fox are killing the series, that plus Joe Buck's pathetic work in the booth

ode to veeck
11-01-2008, 06:15 PM
No, they all suck.

We're just waiting for the day we can launch WSI TV, all WSI, all the time!

where are RPS and Guido for the prime time?!

Brian26
11-01-2008, 08:29 PM
NBC used to work with the NFL to have all their AFC games kickoff at 1 PM when they carried the Series in the 70's. It affected the 1975 WS as Game 2 in Boston started at 4 and there was a rain delay in the 8th and the Reds came back to win after the delay.

There were Sunday afternoon Series games as late as 1984 as the Tigers won it late in the afternoon. I know 1986 all the Series games were at night and I think the change happened in 1985.

I also remember Ripken snagging that line-drive to win the '83 Series against the Phillies as a day game at the Vet....had to have been a Saturday or Sunday afternoon.

Railsplitter
11-01-2008, 08:53 PM
In addition to the ridiculously long pre-game show (save the analysis for the game, you idiots), and then the over-the-top pomp and circumstance of the introductions of the entire teams and umpires and celebrities, and the superstar rendition of the national anthem, FOX also starts the whole shebang - and thus the games - way too late.

This was an East Coast series. FOX knew the West Coast markets would not watch it it large numbers. So they should have backed up the starting times so that local market kids - tomorrows baseball consumers - could stay up to watch the games even on school nights.

If normal weeknight games start at 7:05 local time in Philly and Tampa Bay, open the gates at 5:05 and start the pre-game festivities at 6:25 local time. That gives them enough time to get the game started at the normal time. Who gives a crap if that means it starts at 4:05 on the West Coast? Obviously the West Coast wouldn't, since they didn't watch anyway!

Finally, schedule the games like this:

Game 1: Tuesday night
Game 2: Wednesday night
Game 3: Friday night (kids can stay up on Friday nights!)
Game 4: Saturday DAY GAME
*Game 5: Sunday DAY GAME
*Game 6: Tuesday night
*Game 7: Wednesday night
* if necessary
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but don't FCC regulations state the hour before prime time on week days belongs to local stations? If so that needs to be changed before Series start times are moved up.

RadioheadRocks
11-01-2008, 09:58 PM
According to cub fans, our 05 series against Houston was the least watched WS


And according to Cub fans, "it" was supposed to happen this year. :rolleyes:

What's your point?

Frater Perdurabo
11-02-2008, 06:58 AM
According to cub fans, our 05 series against Houston was the least watched WS

It's too bad, too, since our World Series trophy is really small, while their attendance trophy is as big as the Sears Tower! I'm jealous! Size matters! It's gonna happen!

WSox597
11-02-2008, 07:48 AM
LOL

I've stopped many a cub fan in their tracks asking to see their attendance trophies.

The look on their faces is priceless. Kind of a cross between heartburn and constipation.

End of discussion.

cub killer
11-02-2008, 01:37 PM
LOL

I've stopped many a cub fan in their tracks asking to see their attendance trophies.

The look on their faces is priceless. Kind of a cross between heartburn and constipation.

End of discussion.

I've had many an argument with those idiots over the 2005 WS ratings. We held the dubious record of "lowest rated WS" for just one year. Which means when the first opportunity there was for a WS to be lower rated than ours, it happened. But no, these flub fans don't read the news or anything and they think that 2005 was still the lowest. Morons.

Plus, ours was "low rated" (even tho less than 1% of that total saw the cubs' last WS win) because it was a sweep. I'm sorry, but I'd rather sweep a team and get low ratings for it than stretch it to a nail-biting game 7 and have higher ratings as a result. Actually, it's good if people across the country stop watching because our team is too dominant and the result is a foregone conclusion. I'd rather have that than have everyone tune in and see what happens to us because we have the longest championship drought in the history of pro sports.

soltrain21
11-02-2008, 02:30 PM
And another relevant thread about baseball gets turned into a thread about Cubs fans.

Frankfan4life
11-02-2008, 05:16 PM
Besides not being marquee teams, I wished Fox would get two different announcers to call the series.I don't get why there is so much emphasis put on who announces a baseball game. Quite frankly I don't care that much about it. When I go to the ballpark, I don't rely on a broadcaster and color commentator in order to enjoy the game. If the announcers bother you so much why don't you just turn the sound off? Any true baseball fan should be able to follow the action without having someone else's interpretation of the game.

Furthermore, I don't understand why true baseball fans don't watch the World Series in bigger numbers. It's sad that our premier game gets such low ratings. I enjoy watching the playoffs whether or not the Sox are in it.

chisoxfanatic
11-02-2008, 06:08 PM
where are RPS and Guido for the prime time?!
It would be awesome for SNR to be "back in business."

FedEx227
11-03-2008, 01:13 AM
the game time contortions for Fox are killing the series, that plus Joe Buck's pathetic work in the booth

But mostly the fact that when the World Series comes and a team not named Red Sox, Yankees or Cubs is in it people immediately are tuned out because A) they barely know the players on those teams B) they've been told countless times only those three teams matter.

It's the MLB's fault. Good riddance, learn to advertise your league, not 3 teams.

Oblong
11-03-2008, 08:11 AM
I also remember Ripken snagging that line-drive to win the '83 Series against the Phillies as a day game at the Vet....had to have been a Saturday or Sunday afternoon.

The last WS day game was game 6 in 1987. Before that it was game 5 in 1984. Those were 4 pm EST starts.

DumpJerry
11-03-2008, 08:21 AM
It's the MLB's fault. Good riddance, learn to advertise your league, not 3 teams.
That's the winner. Selig needs to stop pissing off the fans of the other 25 teams, there are more of us than there are of those three.

Even last year when the Pats were rolling through the NFL, the league did not alienate the fans who did not care for the Pats. They emphasize the play of outstanding players and other teams around the league. Would it kill Selig & Co. to take notice of a hot rookie on a small market team?

FedEx227
11-03-2008, 06:35 PM
That's the winner. Selig needs to stop pissing off the fans of the other 25 teams, there are more of us than there are of those three.

Even last year when the Pats were rolling through the NFL, the league did not alienate the fans who did not care for the Pats. They emphasize the play of outstanding players and other teams around the league. Would it kill Selig & Co. to take notice of a hot rookie on a small market team?

Because they enjoy getting caught in their own trap for some reason?

Advertise the hell out of the Yanks, Sawks and Cubs and use the excuse that those are the most popular teams so you have to advertise them.

Stupid. Why do you fear creating new baseball markets?

chisoxfanatic
11-03-2008, 06:39 PM
Because they enjoy getting caught in their own trap for some reason?

Advertise the hell out of the Yanks, Sawks and Cubs and use the excuse that those are the most popular teams so you have to advertise them.

Stupid. Why do you fear creating new baseball markets?
But then you'll get the argument thrown back at you "Well, those teams have earned their constant publicity being shoved down your throats, because they make the most for the league." Until MLB gets people running it with brains, it will continue.

FedEx227
11-03-2008, 06:46 PM
Exactly. That's where the money is at with those teams... blah blah blah... it's stupid.

AZChiSoxFan
11-03-2008, 07:36 PM
It's MLB and Fox's own fault. Start promoting your entire product, like the NFL, instead of just 3 or 4 teams. Finish the games at reasonable hours. Get an announcing crew that gives a **** about the game and isn't so smug.



Awesome post!!! Spot on.

Michstate45
11-03-2008, 08:44 PM
What scares me about the bad ratings is that I always fear that, instead of networks/baseball spending more time promoting teams other then the Cubs/Yankees/Red Sox, that game fixing might occur to get those dream matchups the MLB wants. I'm sure that kind of stuff doesn't really happen right now, but it's always been a fear of mine. The fact that neither Boston or LA got in this year kind of calms that down a bit for me.

Secondly, I agree with the person who said that there are just more things competing for people's eyes these days, compared to years ago. I think all of the options on primetime tv these days, in addition to easier access to movies, not to mention the evolution of video games, is enough to drive a lot of casual fans away from watching two baseball teams they don't really care about.

ChiSoxFan81
11-03-2008, 10:55 PM
What scares me about the bad ratings is that I always fear that, instead of networks/baseball spending more time promoting teams other then the Cubs/Yankees/Red Sox, that game fixing might occur to get those dream matchups the MLB wants. I'm sure that kind of stuff doesn't really happen right now, but it's always been a fear of mine. The fact that neither Boston or LA got in this year kind of calms that down a bit for me.

Secondly, I agree with the person who said that there are just more things competing for people's eyes these days, compared to years ago. I think all of the options on primetime tv these days, in addition to easier access to movies, not to mention the evolution of video games, is enough to drive a lot of casual fans away from watching two baseball teams they don't really care about.

As far as the fix, I think the NBA has cornered the market on that. The refs have a lot more control over outcomes in that league than the umps in baseball. Although the fix must have been on in 2005 to get the Sox to the World Series.

I agree that the start of the game times are ridiculous. I realize that people live on the west coast, but if no teams from the west are in the WS, then they should start the games earlier. No one outside of the two markets in the WS want to stay up that late to see the whole game. I try to watch as much of it as I can, but if I fall asleep, I'm not too worried about it. They need to change something around so that the whole "get baseball over, it's football season" crowd shuts their mouth. Even if your team isn't in the WS, if you are truly a baseball fan, you will watch, or at least try to. I like football too, but baseball is my true love, and until the WS is over, it's baseball season to me.

As far as all the knuckleheads talking about a neutral site for the WS...hell no. Not only does that screw the fans, but it's really unfeasable for a 7 game series. Season ticket holders can't take a week off to attend. Also, if there were no travel days, it would jack up the rotations. Not to mention that home field in baseball has a lot more to do with the actual field than the crowd. The dimension and surface are crucial. Imagine the Sox having to play a WS in Minnesota or PetCo. Yeah, that would be fair.

soxrme
11-04-2008, 10:42 AM
It's MLB and Fox's own fault. Start promoting your entire product, like the NFL, instead of just 3 or 4 teams. Finish the games at reasonable hours. Get an announcing crew that gives a **** about the game and isn't so smug.

This keeps happening every year unless they're lucky and get one of their darling teams in. You will never get one ounce of sympathy for Fox from me.
I agree with you 100%. The late games are brutal and the season is just too long. The rain game was a disgrace to baseball. Bud was there on top of it.

Soxaholic
11-04-2008, 10:49 PM
I don't get why there is so much emphasis put on who announces a baseball game. Quite frankly I don't care that much about it. When I go to the ballpark, I don't rely on a broadcaster and color commentator in order to enjoy the game. If the announcers bother you so much why don't you just turn the sound off? Any true baseball fan should be able to follow the action without having someone else's interpretation of the game.

Furthermore, I don't understand why true baseball fans don't watch the World Series in bigger numbers. It's sad that our premier game gets such low ratings. I enjoy watching the playoffs whether or not the Sox are in it.

If you happen to have a 5.1 surround system in your house, you can just disable the center speaker to mute the voices and still hear the sounds in the stadium through the rest of the speakers. I did this accidentally. Just a thought for next season.

Lip Man 1
11-05-2008, 12:37 PM
Franklin:

To each his own. Many fans (including myself) are very provincial. If the Sox aren't in it, frankly I could care less.

Add to it the constant hype and promoting of only a select few teams by the media and MLB and I want to do something to hurt them in return... therefore I don't watch.

I want their ratings to be dismal...that's the only way change may come.

Lip

FedEx227
11-05-2008, 02:37 PM
If you happen to have a 5.1 surround system in your house, you can just disable the center speaker to mute the voices and still hear the sounds in the stadium through the rest of the speakers. I did this accidentally. Just a thought for next season.

Hmmm... not bad. What type of system do you have?

palehozenychicty
11-05-2008, 02:54 PM
Franklin:

To each his own. Many fans (including myself) are very provincial. If the Sox aren't in it, frankly I could care less.

Add to it the constant hype and promoting of only a select few teams by the media and MLB and I want to do something to hurt them in return... therefore I don't watch.

I want their ratings to be dismal...that's the only way change may come.

Lip


Keep dreaming. With the player's union holding Selig by the strings, and the attendance and concessions turning record profits for ownership, there's little reason for them to actually promote the game with any intelligence. Selig has a lifetime job as the Commissioner, and his constant blunders are excused to the detriment of true fans that genuinely love the sport's treasured history and magic.

People love to hate the NBA, but there's little doubt as to who runs the league or guides its strategic initiatives. It's the same thing with the NFL. Both these leagues also have games better tailored for television, which aids to their advantage. The NBA and NFL also do a far superior job of promoting their players and sport to the community at-large. I can't remember the last time that the Yankees or Mets visited a school in the Bronx or Queens to teach fundamentals of their game or just promoted a basic human skill to children, like reading and writing. Yet, they want public funding for their stadiums and got it.

Fans are provincial, and that's expected to a degree. Some people can watch anyone play. Personally, I can watch anyone play and do so because you get a sense of players' abilities and find out how your management can get them on the roster so that your team wins more games.

But baseball was hardly this blatant with its promotion and stewardship of certain markets before Selig and Fox started their partnership. If you are force-fed the same teams and storylines, then you lose interest in a game that is markedly different from the brisker, disposible pace of modern society and does not appeal to certain demographics due to economics, lack of outreach, and the like. That's a whole another topic, but it's relevant to understanding the numbers drop.

I also find it pathetically hypocritical for Selig to push for revenue sharing at the beginning of the decade, yet disrespect teams that benefit from it. There's no way in hell that he would started Game 3 of the World Series at 10 pm on Saturday nor tried to finish Game 5 if the Red Sox were playing the Dodgers. It's just basic economics, that in order for your market to grow, you must establish a zone and put resources in it.

Okay, my rant is done. But it's a fascinating topic. :redface: