PDA

View Full Version : *Offical* Those dark clouds are rolling in....


Pear-Zin-Ski
09-23-2008, 09:54 PM
Geez...not what we needed...go get them tomorrow White Sox!

Sockinchisox
09-23-2008, 09:55 PM
:puking:

drewcifer
09-23-2008, 09:55 PM
Team sucks.

veeter
09-23-2008, 09:55 PM
This team has to lay everything on the line and win tomorrow.

BadBobbyJenks
09-23-2008, 09:55 PM
Wow did the game thread really go 3 deep? Impressive, something tells me I am glad I stayed away from there.

Griffey Homered!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:happybday:):ban dance::dtroll::rolleyes:

hi im skot
09-23-2008, 09:55 PM
http://gmargari.files.wordpress.com/2006/11/suicide-booth.jpg

btrain929
09-23-2008, 09:55 PM
Griffey's pimp act after his homer in a 9-3 game reminds me of the football player that does an endzone dance when they are down by 4 touchdowns still...

Soxman219
09-23-2008, 09:56 PM
**** Vazquez.

EuroSox35
09-23-2008, 09:56 PM
Ozzie is a ****tard. Vazquez wasn't great, but he wasn't terrible. One mistake, and more bloops, bunts, and effects from slow, old defenders as they run wild all over us. But back to Ozzie. Playing headgames with your starting pitcher in the biggest game of the year, real brilliant. Especially with a guy whose biggest problem seems to be battling himself mentally.

Meanwhile, old man Griffey helped put this game in the bag for them. Between a DP in a big spot, having to play station to station baseball, and giving away extra bases due to defense, this was a lot easier then it should've been for them.

Vazquez will still get the blame, especially after his misinterpreted comments (your manager attacks you out of nowhere, what are you going to say, that after he's retired he's going to cry himself to sleep every night thinking about bad games?), yet the offense still couldn't muster anything to make it matter anyways. Sadder is this 'message' and mindgames that Ozzie chose as the more important lesson in today's game, like warming up Broadway so early. No way Vazquez shouldn't have gone at least one more inning, again, he wasn't as terrible as the line shows and it isn't likely Broadway will give you much more.

I'm not saying we're dead yet, but if we get swept, Ozzie loses this team. This series [if they sweep] reminds me of Neil Cotts starting at Yankee Stadium. The only difference will be that Ozzie will not be fired at the end of the year.

BleacherBandit
09-23-2008, 09:56 PM
It's the sound. That's definatly why they lost.

doublem23
09-23-2008, 09:56 PM
Just remember...

It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...

These games mean more to the Twins than they do us. I'll really start to worry if we lose tomorrow.

Frontman
09-23-2008, 09:56 PM
Stand up and try again, Sox. Rally behind your pitcher and get some hits.

We can pout about it, or we can hope for the best. I'm all for hoping we get them tomorrow.

hi im skot
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
Ozzie is a ****tard. Vazquez wasn't great, but he wasn't terrible. One mistake, and more bloops, bunts, and effects from slow, old defenders as they run wild all over us. But back to Ozzie. Playing headgames with your starting pitcher in the biggest game of the year, real brilliant. Especially with a guy whose biggest problem seems to be battling himself mentally. Meanwhile, old man Griffey helped put this game in the bag for them. Between a DP in a big spot, having to play station to station baseball, and giving away extra bases due to defense, this was a lot easier then it should've been for them. Vazquez will still get the blame, especially after his misinterpreted comments (your manager attacks you out of nowhere, what are you going to say, that after he's retired he's going to cry himself to sleep every night thinking about bad games?), yet the offense still couldn't muster anything to make it matter anyways. Sadder is this 'message' and mindgames that Ozzie chose as the more important lesson in today's game, like warming up Broadway so early. No way Vazquez shouldn't have gone at least one more inning, again, he wasn't as terrible as the line shows and it isn't likely Broadway will give you much more. I'm not saying we're dead yet, but if we get swept, Ozzie loses this team. This series [if they sweep] reminds me of Neil Cotts starting at Yankee Stadium. The only difference will be that Ozzie will not be fired at the end of the year.

Vazquez was terrible. No excuses.

october23sp
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
Grody to the MAX.

Uncle_Patrick
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
Let's just get the next two.

Javy, Boone, and the offense = :puking:

ChiSoxGirl
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
**** Vazquez.

Proved once again that he craps the bed in big-game situations, and exactly why it is he's now one game under .500 for his career. Buehrle better be Buehrle tomorrow... we need a stopper like nobody's business!

Rdy2PlayBall
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
Geez...not what we needed...go get them tomorrow White Sox!
Thank you. I am glad not some jackass made this thread, because those stupid disappointing, jerk titles and stupid negative opening comments make the whole loss thing a whole lot worse. Thanks! :D:

Btw... darks clouds IS nothing compaired to what half the titles say when they lose.

WhiteSox5187
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
I don't remember the last time I felt this depressed over a Sox loss. A win tomorrow puts us back on the right track. Another game like this, we're in a lot of ****ing trouble.

kevingrt
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
Ozzie is a ****tard. Vazquez wasn't great, but he wasn't terrible. One mistake, and more bloops, bunts, and effects from slow, old defenders as they run wild all over us. But back to Ozzie. Playing headgames with your starting pitcher in the biggest game of the year, real brilliant. Especially with a guy whose biggest problem seems to be battling himself mentally.

Meanwhile, old man Griffey helped put this game in the bag for them. Between a DP in a big spot, having to play station to station baseball, and giving away extra bases due to defense, this was a lot easier then it should've been for them.

Vazquez will still get the blame, especially after his misinterpreted comments (your manager attacks you out of nowhere, what are you going to say, that after he's retired he's going to cry himself to sleep every night thinking about bad games?), yet the offense still couldn't muster anything to make it matter anyways. Sadder is this 'message' and mindgames that Ozzie chose as the more important lesson in today's game, like warming up Broadway so early. No way Vazquez shouldn't have gone at least one more inning, again, he wasn't as terrible as the line shows and it isn't likely Broadway will give you much more.

I'm not saying we're dead yet, but if we get swept, Ozzie loses this team. This series [if they sweep] reminds me of Neil Cotts starting at Yankee Stadium. The only difference will be that Ozzie will not be fired at the end of the year.

*** does this post mean? :scratch:

Parrothead
09-23-2008, 09:57 PM
:hawk
I tell ya DJ the umps squeezed us today.....

MISoxfan
09-23-2008, 09:58 PM
We'll get 'em tomorrow.

MeteorsSox4367
09-23-2008, 09:58 PM
Nice job, Javy. Way to soil the bed in your biggest start of the year. Thanks for hanging all those change-ups and other off-speed garbage.

Dammit.

And can the Sox get a hit with the bases loaded?

Let's get 'em tomorrow.

C'mon, Buehrle. We need ya, dude.

Sockinchisox
09-23-2008, 09:58 PM
http://gmargari.files.wordpress.com/2006/11/suicide-booth.jpg

Slow and painful please.

hi im skot
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
Tonight's the night Hawk officially lost it.

Glad Stoney's in the booth next year.

JohnnyInnsbrook
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
Just remember...

It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...

These games mean more to the Twins than they do us. I'll really start to worry if we lose tomorrow.

Yeah 1 game and if they continue to play this way it will very quickly become 3 games

Frontman
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
Ozzie is a ****tard. Vazquez wasn't great, but he wasn't terrible. One mistake, and more bloops, bunts, and effects from slow, old defenders as they run wild all over us. But back to Ozzie. Playing headgames with your starting pitcher in the biggest game of the year, real brilliant. Especially with a guy whose biggest problem seems to be battling himself mentally.

Meanwhile, old man Griffey helped put this game in the bag for them. Between a DP in a big spot, having to play station to station baseball, and giving away extra bases due to defense, this was a lot easier then it should've been for them.

Vazquez will still get the blame, especially after his misinterpreted comments (your manager attacks you out of nowhere, what are you going to say, that after he's retired he's going to cry himself to sleep every night thinking about bad games?), yet the offense still couldn't muster anything to make it matter anyways. Sadder is this 'message' and mindgames that Ozzie chose as the more important lesson in today's game, like warming up Broadway so early. No way Vazquez shouldn't have gone at least one more inning, again, he wasn't as terrible as the line shows and it isn't likely Broadway will give you much more.

I'm not saying we're dead yet, but if we get swept, Ozzie loses this team. This series [if they sweep] reminds me of Neil Cotts starting at Yankee Stadium. The only difference will be that Ozzie will not be fired at the end of the year.

Withint 10 posts, its a call for Ozzie to be fired. That's a record for this season.

And if Javy even did an above average start, Ozzie would of been heralded as a great manager.

The Twins came out all guns a blazing. Javy was terrible, TERRIBLE tonight. I could of had a shot at that first home run; THAT PITCH WAS ON A FREAKIN TEE FOR THEM.

Madscout
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
Just nothing went our way, and the guys didn't come to play. **** that dome, and **** everytime I hear "off the end of the bat just out of the reach of (insert slow outfielder's name here)."

sox1970
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
A typical 2008 loss--look like ****. Nothing new.

I expect a better game with Buehrle on the mound for us, and Blackburn on the mound for them.

Clinch Friday or Saturday.

doublem23
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
http://gmargari.files.wordpress.com/2006/11/suicide-booth.jpg


Futurama reference, yes!

I have a bad feeling this thread will be unbearable to read in the morning.

Jurr
09-23-2008, 09:59 PM
This team was thoroughly outclassed in every possible way. A kid that has been pitching poorly shut the offense down. Javy craps all over himself. Boone Logan......icky.

Dear Sox: Quentin isn't coming through that door. Wake the **** up. For the first time all year, try and play fundamental baseball and look somewhat like a championship ballclub. So far, all you have done is limped along to the finish in this "tallest midget" competition known as the AL Central Division.

Blueprint1
09-23-2008, 10:00 PM
Vazquez was terrible. No excuses.

I know, don't blame Ozzie for Vasquez having another bad day. He **** his pants in his other start on this roadtrip. He is not a big game pitcher.

cleanwsox
09-23-2008, 10:00 PM
At least they had the Long Haul Bombers stadium tour before the game. About the only thing I enjoyed from tonight.

Get some damn runs tomorrow off Blackburn please.

Medford Bobby
09-23-2008, 10:00 PM
It's one of those game I turned off (sat radio) when it was 5 to 1. Just new it was over.

Our ACE will save us tomorrow:bandance:

Rdy2PlayBall
09-23-2008, 10:01 PM
It's one of those game I turned off (sat radio) when it was 5 to 1. Just new it was over.

Our ACE will save us tomorrow:bandance:Who's playing tomarrow? Then the next day?

doublem23
09-23-2008, 10:01 PM
Yeah 1 game and if they continue to play this way it will very quickly become 3 games

Well, unless you have a magic crystal ball that will tell us how the next 2 will play out, you just got to believe.

As long as the Sox win one of the next two, they'd essentially bury the Twins in a corner. Tomorrow and Thursday would be nice, but 1 is really all they REALLY, REALLY need.

9-3 doesn't count any more in the standings for them.

EuroSox35
09-23-2008, 10:01 PM
Vazquez was terrible. No excuses.

But so was the offense, we can't expect to win 1-0. Okay, it's 3 at the end of the game, but I'm sure a grand total of 3 people in that building cared about that home run. Could've been less than 9 given up if we didn't concede with our terrible pen instead of sending out Vazquez for a little bit more

Frater Perdurabo
09-23-2008, 10:01 PM
As another poster posted, let's hope the Sox got all their bad baseball out of their system tonight.

We really need Buehrle and Floyd to step it up for these next two games.

It would be nice not to have to rely on Kansas City winning in Minnesota.

It also would be nice not to have to play the make-up game against Detroit.

It also would be nice to rest the regulars on Saturday and Sunday to set up a playoff rotation.

Get them tomorrow night and get that magic number down to three! PLEASE!

Quentin08
09-23-2008, 10:01 PM
As bad as the team was tonight, Hawk outsucked em all. Hawk's worst game ever! :scratch:

PeteWard
09-23-2008, 10:01 PM
Futurama reference, yes!

I have a bad feeling this thread will be unbearable to read in the morning.

Why wait? Go to the game threads now.

Marc will come through tomorrow and the Sox will win 5-2.

kittle42
09-23-2008, 10:02 PM
I said in the other thread that Griffey starting gave this team the best chance to win. I stated that the reason was he was acquired to be a strong veteran, big-game-player insurance policy, and that I will take that over Anderson, who has never done anything in his major-league career to show he shoudl merit starting in a huge series like this.

I still stand by the general reasoning of my statement, and it has nothing to do with Griffey's garbage-time homer. I'd also still play Swisher over Anderson. In fact, I might put Swisher in there tomorrow, and slide Wise to CF despite his general suckitude, as well. But I understand the argument for starting Anderson due to defense. However, this team is so poor offensively, as well, that I'll take the potential and veteran instinct a Griffey or Swisher gives you over what Anderson has posted.

I may be completely wrong, and I see both sides of this argument.

Nevertheless, it still had little to do with why the Sox lost tonight. Crap pitching and a lack of situational (or any) hitting did them in once again.

Well, back to the drawing board tomorrow. I said going into this series I would be satisfied winning 1, and I definitely feel that way now. Split the next two, get the hell home, and finish this thing.

HangWiffum
09-23-2008, 10:02 PM
As another poster posted, let's hope the Sox got all their bad baseball out of their system tonight.

We really need Buehrle and Floyd to step it up for these next two games.

It would be nice not to have to rely on Kansas City winning in Minnesota.

It also would be nice not to have to play the make-up game against Detroit.

It also would be nice to rest the regulars on Saturday and Sunday to set up a playoff rotation.

Get them tomorrow night and get that magic number down to three! PLEASE!

hope in one hand and crap in the other and see which one gets filled first.

whitesox901
09-23-2008, 10:02 PM
Damn that ****ing sucked, go get em tomorrow boys!

SoonerBookbabe
09-23-2008, 10:02 PM
Tonight's the night Hawk officially lost it.

Glad Stoney's in the booth next year.
What was said? My MLB pkg didn't carry the sox announcers and I had to stomach the twinkies homers.

ChiSoxGirl
09-23-2008, 10:02 PM
As bad as the team was tonight, Hawk outsucked em all. Hawk's worst game ever! :scratch:

I don't know if I'd go that far, but the Twins man love was absolutely nauseating and didn't stop for nearly three hours! :angry: And DJ joined in on the man love fest, too!

kevingrt
09-23-2008, 10:02 PM
As bad as the team was tonight, Hawk outsucked em all. Hawk's worst game ever! :scratch:

I mean listening to him you would think the Twins had a dynasty going and were one of the best teams ever to step on the field.

Hawk the Twinkies suck! We just suck even more when we play them.

doublem23
09-23-2008, 10:03 PM
Why wait? Go to the game threads now.

Marc will come through tomorrow and the Sox will win 5-2.

I understand misspelling Vazquez, but we're spelling Mark wrong now, too.

FOR SHAME!

drewcifer
09-23-2008, 10:04 PM
I don't know if I'd go that far, but the Twins man love was absolutely nauseating and didn't stop for nearly three hours! :angry: And DJ joined in on the man love fest, too!

Of course he did.

It's Dankerific
09-23-2008, 10:04 PM
As i said:

no ba, no winning
know ba, know winning

nasox
09-23-2008, 10:05 PM
**** **** **** **** ****

I'm pissed as hell, but we'll get 'em tomorrow.

October26
09-23-2008, 10:05 PM
Very disappointing loss. Thankfully, this game is over. I'm not going to listen to the post game show or the Score - it will just annoy me further. Hope the Sox come ready to play tomorrow. Go White Sox!

Rdy2PlayBall
09-23-2008, 10:05 PM
As i said:

no ba, no winning
know ba, know winningWhats a ba? :?:

SpartanSoxFan
09-23-2008, 10:05 PM
But back to Ozzie. Playing headgames with your starting pitcher in the biggest game of the year, real brilliant. Especially with a guy whose biggest problem seems to be battling himself mentally.

+1000

I agree with you 100%. There are two types of athletes. There are those that benefit from the Tough Love/"Get your head out of your ass" approach of coaching. There are those that need to be coddled and held by the hand by a coach or manager. Javy is most definetely the type that needs to be coddled. Plain and simple. Ozzie opening his mouth about how Javy isn't a big game pitcher was the kiss of death, and Javy even admitted it, basically saying "I don't care what happens, I'll just go retire in Puerto Rico with my family." A lame cop-out response.

Ozzie, shut your ****ing mouth and manage the team like you don't have your head in your ass.

kittle42
09-23-2008, 10:05 PM
As i said:

no ba, no winning
know ba, know winning

Again, the 4th OF's inclusion or lack thereof in the game is not going to decide the season for the Sox.

veeter
09-23-2008, 10:05 PM
I don't know if I'd go that far, but the Twins man love was absolutely nauseating and didn't stop for nearly three hours! :angry: And DJ joined in on the man love fest, too!I had the volume off and I'm glad. DJ's out of the way, now just one to go. Hawk is an *******.

btrain929
09-23-2008, 10:06 PM
As i said:

no ba, no winning
know ba, know winning

Hahaha. That's up there with: "Whether you think you can, or you think you can't........you're right!" I like it!

soxwon
09-23-2008, 10:06 PM
Da Rev's really bumbed, but we will overcome, must win tommorow.
But we really cant win in this park, what teams have beaten minnesota there?

Woofer
09-23-2008, 10:07 PM
It's one of those game I turned off (sat radio) when it was 5 to 1. Just new it was over.

Our ACE will save us tomorrow:bandance:
He will need to throw a perfect game, cause bad things happen whenever Twins are on base. At least we know Buehrle can hold runners on. This is going to be tough to get a win in Minnesota. I feel sick and crabby right now.

EuroSox35
09-23-2008, 10:07 PM
Withint 10 posts, its a call for Ozzie to be fired. That's a record for this season.

And if Javy even did an above average start, Ozzie would of been heralded as a great manager.

The Twins came out all guns a blazing. Javy was terrible, TERRIBLE tonight. I could of had a shot at that first home run; THAT PITCH WAS ON A FREAKIN TEE FOR THEM.

If we don't make the playoffs I'd love for him to be fired, even though I know it won't happen. I have disagreed with a ton of his decisions this year, and think this team should've clinched last week, and not be worried about their playoff lives.

No one will agree, but Vazquez being "terrible" tonight is going to be overrated big time. One terrible pitch to Kubel, and every one judges him on that. He can't be perfect on every pitch, and he wasn't, but he's facing an offense that is great at their stadium, and again got hurt by those hits that fall in, bunts, bad defense, runners being able to steal all over us, etc...

And Hawk, we knew what this team would be going in. But don't act like Ozzie doesn't have some flexibility. Especially in center. HE is the one who is tacking on more slow, station to station, players by starting Griffey in center. Why don't the coaches do their job and actually teach something other then waiting for a 3 run HR? Yeah Ozzie, it's not that they're annoying pirahanas, it's that their manager is actually, you know, managing...

JB98
09-23-2008, 10:07 PM
I said in the other thread that Griffey starting gave this team the best chance to win. I stated that the reason was he was acquired to be a strong veteran, big-game-player insurance policy, and that I will take that over Anderson, who has never done anything in his major-league career to show he shoudl merit starting in a huge series like this.

I still stand by the general reasoning of my statement, and it has nothing to do with Griffey's garbage-time homer. I'd also still play Swisher over Anderson. In fact, I might put Swisher in there tomorrow, and slide Wise to CF despite his general suckitude, as well. But I understand the argument for starting Anderson due to defense. However, this team is so poor offensively, as well, that I'll take the potential and veteran instinct a Griffey or Swisher gives you over what Anderson has posted.

I may be completely wrong, and I see both sides of this argument.

Nevertheless, it still had little to do with why the Sox lost tonight. Crap pitching and a lack of situational (or any) hitting did them in once again.

Well, back to the drawing board tomorrow. I said going into this series I would be satisfied winning 1, and I definitely feel that way now. Split the next two, get the hell home, and finish this thing.

I'd move Wise to CF and put Swisher in LF tomorrow.

Sox are 0-5 with Griffey starting in CF on this trip. Sox are 3-0 with Wise/Anderson in CF. Coincidence? Maybe or maybe not.

ChiSoxGirl
09-23-2008, 10:07 PM
I had the volume off and I'm glad. DJ's out of the way, now just one to go. Hawk is an *******.

I muted the volume for awhile during one of the Twins' big innings; the crowd noise was making me :nuts:.

WhiteSox5187
09-23-2008, 10:08 PM
I said in the other thread that Griffey starting gave this team the best chance to win. I stated that the reason was he was acquired to be a strong veteran, big-game-player insurance policy, and that I will take that over Anderson, who has never done anything in his major-league career to show he shoudl merit starting in a huge series like this.

I still stand by the general reasoning of my statement, and it has nothing to do with Griffey's garbage-time homer. I'd also still play Swisher over Anderson. In fact, I might put Swisher in there tomorrow, and slide Wise to CF despite his general suckitude, as well. But I understand the argument for starting Anderson due to defense. However, this team is so poor offensively, as well, that I'll take the potential and veteran instinct a Griffey or Swisher gives you over what Anderson has posted.

I may be completely wrong, and I see both sides of this argument.

Nevertheless, it still had little to do with why the Sox lost tonight. Crap pitching and a lack of situational (or any) hitting did them in once again.

Well, back to the drawing board tomorrow. I said going into this series I would be satisfied winning 1, and I definitely feel that way now. Split the next two, get the hell home, and finish this thing.
Right now, Anderson is the best hitter of the bunch. He also is not a member of the clog the basepath group, to which Swish and Junior belong.

It's Dankerific
09-23-2008, 10:08 PM
Again, the 4th OF's inclusion or lack thereof in the game is not going to decide the season for the Sox.

The splits tell otherwise.

soxwon
09-23-2008, 10:08 PM
Whats a ba? :?:

Bryan Anderson

PeteWard
09-23-2008, 10:08 PM
I understand misspelling Vazquez, but we're spelling Mark wrong now, too.

FOR SHAME!

http://daily.greencine.com/archives/eric-idle.jpg I can't type the letter "k" so I used a "c".

hi im skot
09-23-2008, 10:08 PM
If we don't make the playoffs I'd love for him to be fired, even though I know it won't happen. I have disagreed with a ton of his decisions this year, and think this team should've clinched last week, and not be worried about their playoff lives.

No one will agree, but Vazquez being "terrible" tonight is going to be overrated big time. One terrible pitch to Kubel, and every one judges him on that. He can't be perfect on every pitch, and he wasn't, but he's facing an offense that is great at their stadium, and again got hurt by those hits that fall in, bunts, bad defense, runners being able to steal all over us, etc...

And Hawk, we knew what this team would be going in. But don't act like Ozzie doesn't have some flexibility. Especially in center. HE is the one who is tacking on more slow, station to station, players by starting Griffey in center. Why don't the coaches do their job and actually teach something other then waiting for a 3 run HR? Yeah Ozzie, it's not that they're annoying pirahanas, it's that their manager is actually, you know, managing...

Welcome to WSI, Mrs. Vazquez. Your son seems like a very nice boy. I hope that meanie Ozzie gets the boot, too!

Sockinchisox
09-23-2008, 10:09 PM
670 isn't streaming their post game show online tonight. :angry:

kittle42
09-23-2008, 10:09 PM
The splits tell otherwise.

Your splits are highly flawed, as has been pointed out in the past.

btrain929
09-23-2008, 10:09 PM
Bryan Anderson

What does a minor league prospect of the St. Louis Cardinals have to do with anything?

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/A/bryan-anderson-1.shtml

Madscout
09-23-2008, 10:10 PM
I'd move Wise to CF and put Swisher in LF tomorrow.

Sox are 0-5 with Griffey starting in CF on this trip. Sox are 3-0 with Wise/Anderson in CF. Coincidence? Maybe or maybe not.
**** Swisher. Anderson in CF, Wise with his hot or slightly cooled off bat in LF. We don't need Swisher and his .100 ish average.

thomas35forever
09-23-2008, 10:10 PM
:whiner::whiner::whiner::whiner:

I'm really upset with this loss. I know it's only one game, but I'm down about it. And I had to do my radio shift tonight and I hated watching the action unfold on Gameday. We're gonna be lucky to get one win in this series the way things are going. Ozzie better do SOMETHING to wake this team up. I seriously hope Javy comes out of the clubhouse with a big gash on his head after what he did. I would also like to see Boone Logan doing something along the lines of "Ya want fries with that?"

guillensdisciple
09-23-2008, 10:10 PM
Ozzie is a ****tard. Vazquez wasn't great, but he wasn't terrible. One mistake, and more bloops, bunts, and effects from slow, old defenders as they run wild all over us. But back to Ozzie. Playing headgames with your starting pitcher in the biggest game of the year, real brilliant. Especially with a guy whose biggest problem seems to be battling himself mentally.

Meanwhile, old man Griffey helped put this game in the bag for them. Between a DP in a big spot, having to play station to station baseball, and giving away extra bases due to defense, this was a lot easier then it should've been for them.

Vazquez will still get the blame, especially after his misinterpreted comments (your manager attacks you out of nowhere, what are you going to say, that after he's retired he's going to cry himself to sleep every night thinking about bad games?), yet the offense still couldn't muster anything to make it matter anyways. Sadder is this 'message' and mindgames that Ozzie chose as the more important lesson in today's game, like warming up Broadway so early. No way Vazquez shouldn't have gone at least one more inning, again, he wasn't as terrible as the line shows and it isn't likely Broadway will give you much more.

I'm not saying we're dead yet, but if we get swept, Ozzie loses this team. This series [if they sweep] reminds me of Neil Cotts starting at Yankee Stadium. The only difference will be that Ozzie will not be fired at the end of the year.


Ozzie did nothing wrong, all he asked of his pitcher was to step up. He didn't insult him but pointed out the facts.
Javy blew it off, hence disrespecting the manager. The Sox should put him in the bullpen if they make it into the playoffs. The guy chokes big whenever he is needed.

Also brings the wrong attitude to the game, you admit that you have problems and say you are going to fix it. At least that way you don't look like a ****ing deushbag.

JB98
09-23-2008, 10:10 PM
Your splits are highly flawed, as has been pointed out in the past.

Yeah, we've won a lot of games this year without Brian Anderson in CF. He's no savior.

Griffey shouldn't be there either, though.

Rdy2PlayBall
09-23-2008, 10:10 PM
Bryan AndersonOh, you mean THE BA? :tongue: I'm all for Griffey's 9th inning HR... but I really want BA in there for the rest of the series. His skills are beyond Griffey's right now, and that what we need. Thomas got a WS ring without playing, give Griffey the chance to do the same... lets get there first.

doublem23
09-23-2008, 10:11 PM
Bryan Anderson

:rolling:

Will someone please spell someone's name correctly in this thread?

Alexi Ramirez
AJ Pierzynsky
John Danks
Duane Wise
Jaun Uribe

There, I think I covered most of them, right?

JB98
09-23-2008, 10:11 PM
**** Swisher. Anderson in CF, Wise with his hot or slightly cooled off bat in LF. We don't need Swisher and his .100 ish average.

I got a feeling Swisher will give us a big hit in this series, if he gets an opportunity.

No rational reason for that. Like everyone else, I see the bad ABs he has had lately. But I've got a hunch he's due. Hope to see him in the lineup tomorrow.

pmck003
09-23-2008, 10:12 PM
They had their best pitcher going and we had arguably the worst of our four starters going. Not the game to dump your pants over, especially since the Sox really need only one game to have a huge advantage going into the last series of the season...

kittle42
09-23-2008, 10:12 PM
Yeah, we've won a lot of games this year without Brian Anderson in CF. He's no savior.

Griffey shouldn't be there either, though.

I was never really happy with the Griffey acquisition, but I understand why they did it. Unfortunately, he is terrible.

It's Dankerific
09-23-2008, 10:12 PM
Your splits are highly flawed, as has been pointed out in the past.

Voodoo is on board now =)

There can be no subjection when the question is "did BA play? Yes/No"

The only time the Sox have a losing record is when BA is not in the game at all.

Before this game they were on pace for 87 wins, one extra, if he had just ONE plate appearance.

SpartanSoxFan
09-23-2008, 10:12 PM
Momentum is clearly in the Twins favor right now. The Sox are gonna have to fight like hell to get it back. That said, I like our chances with Mark on the bump, assuming our defense comes to play. A few bad bounces here or there, and it could get ugly again quickly. Here's hoping for a better result tomorrow. :gulp:

Rdy2PlayBall
09-23-2008, 10:12 PM
:rolling:

Will someone please spell someone's name correctly in this thread?

Alexi Ramirez
AJ Pierzynsky
John Danks
Duane Wise
Jaun Uribe

There, I think I covered most of them, right?You forgot Jym Tomey. :wink:

Konerko05
09-23-2008, 10:13 PM
I don't know which performance was more embarassing: the offense flatlining, or Vazquez curling up the fetal position on the mound.

Vazquez was awful. Everyone was giving him one last opportunity to show he can handle a big game. This better solidify the fact for everyone. I can't really say I'm surprised one bit.

I really can't believe this group of players can hit so bad. Is it impossible for them to string back to back hits together? I'm beginning to think so. A legitimate rally seems to be out of the question. I'm not buying the crap about, "that's the kind of offense we have... homerun or nothing." There is no reason why these 9 hitters can't put together a rally with singles and doubles. The whole offense has one of the worst approaches I've ever seen.

Why the hell is Griffey playing CF?

Things aren't looking too good for the White Sox. 1.5 game lead or not, there isn't really much about this team to be positive about. Twins absolutely destroyed the Sox in every aspect of baseball. They really believe they will win this division. I don't think I can say the same thing about the Sox.

Buehrle and Floyd are our only hope right now. I'm not counting on this offense or bullpen to get the job done.

thomas35forever
09-23-2008, 10:13 PM
:rolling:

Will someone please spell someone's name correctly in this thread?

Alexi Ramirez
AJ Pierzynsky
John Danks
Duane Wise
Jaun Uribe

There, I think I covered most of them, right?
Actually, you spelled Danks' name correctly.

kittle42
09-23-2008, 10:13 PM
:rolling:

Will someone please spell someone's name correctly in this thread?

Alexi Ramirez
AJ Pierzynsky
John Danks
Duane Wise
Jaun Uribe

There, I think I covered most of them, right?

You're asking quite a lot out of people. :D:

angiew
09-23-2008, 10:14 PM
Welcome to WSI, Mrs. Vazquez. Your son seems like a very nice boy. I hope that meanie Ozzie gets the boot, too!


OMG!!!!! I sooooooooo needed to read that tonight!
:rolling::worship:

Medford Bobby
09-23-2008, 10:14 PM
670 isn't streaming their post game show online tonight. :angry:
It's 8:13 west coast time and still no Sox post game stream...:scratch:

mccoydp
09-23-2008, 10:16 PM
You forgot Jym Tomey. :wink:

Finally, something to laugh about.

You **** the bed tonight, Sox. Win tomorrow!

TDog
09-23-2008, 10:17 PM
Just remember...

It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...
It's 1 game...

These games mean more to the Twins than they do us. I'll really start to worry if we lose tomorrow.

I agree. I understand that people are overrreacting, but they are overreacting nonetheless.

During the Twins' last homestand, they won the first game of both three-game series. In the remaining four games they went 1-3. The Twins have only twice since August 21 won while scoring less than seven runs. Both times Liriano started.

The Sox came into this series with three fewer losses. Now they have two fewer losses. Buehrle and Floyd have pitched better against the Twins than Vazquez has. Vazquez has pitched better against the Twins this year than Danks has.

I expect the offense will have a better night Wednesday. I expect Buehrle will pitch a better game Wednessay. The Twins are still looking up at the Sox.

Chisox353014
09-23-2008, 10:18 PM
Well, there are 2 games left in the series. We have to have at least 1. It was pretty clear that this one had the least favorable pitching matchup for us.
Not entirely unexpected that we'd lose this one, especially with the way the Twins seem to win every opening game at the Dump.

Mark will give us a good start tomorrow and we'll be back on course.

In other news, I hope Nick Punto falls down a well.

Procol Harum
09-23-2008, 10:18 PM
An old friend called me in the 3rd inning and I owe him a world of gratitude--we jabbered for the rest of the game and it thankfully delivered me from paying full attention to the stinkfest that was unfolding in front of my eyes on TV. Unbelievable--can anybody say "must win" concerning tomorrow's game? These guys looked whipped from the get-go. Oh well, c'mon Buerhle..... :(:

soxwon
09-23-2008, 10:19 PM
Oh, you mean THE BA? :tongue: I'm all for Griffey's 9th inning HR... but I really want BA in there for the rest of the series. His skills are beyond Griffey's right now, and that what we need. Thomas got a WS ring without playing, give Griffey the chance to do the same... lets get there first.


TBA the Brian anderson.

kitekrazy
09-23-2008, 10:19 PM
I mean listening to him you would think the Twins had a dynasty going and were one of the best teams ever to step on the field.


In some ways they are. They go pretty far for a team whose ownership has the spending habits of Bill Wirtz.

Soxman219
09-23-2008, 10:20 PM
Tonight's game was an embrassment. The offense was sickening, Rex Vazquez the mental midget can't win a big game, and Hawk was lauding the Twins all night! Hawk, the Twins are not the '27 Yanks OK! Griffey, you want to do a pimp walk after you hit a HR then do it when it matters. All we need is ONE win, nine innings of good baseball! Is that too much to ask for? At least show that you give a damn.

DaveFeelsRight
09-23-2008, 10:22 PM
:chickenlittle

kitekrazy
09-23-2008, 10:24 PM
During the Twins' last homestand, they won the first game of both three-game series.

It takes a game for opposing hitters to adjust. Opposing teams don't see the ball very well. It's a bad place for baseball.

Pear-Zin-Ski
09-23-2008, 10:24 PM
We need to win one game...thats it...ONE GAME...I have 1000000% faith in both MB and Gavin the next two nights....

Don't make me look like a fool Sox....

cheezheadsoxfan
09-23-2008, 10:26 PM
That was brutal. Even watching the news was better. Come on Mark, get'em tomorrow.

drewcifer
09-23-2008, 10:26 PM
I don't know which performance was more embarassing: the offense flatlining, or Vazquez curling up the fetal position on the mound.

Vazquez was awful. Everyone was giving him one last opportunity to show he can handle a big game. This better solidify the fact for everyone. I can't really say I'm surprised one bit.

I really can't believe this group of players can hit so bad. Is it impossible for them to string back to back hits together? I'm beginning to think so. A legitimate rally seems to be out of the question. I'm not buying the crap about, "that's the kind of offense we have... homerun or nothing." There is no reason why these 9 hitters can't put together a rally with singles and doubles. The whole offense has one of the worst approaches I've ever seen.

Why the hell is Griffey playing CF?

Things aren't looking too good for the White Sox. 1.5 game lead or not, there isn't really much about this team to be positive about. Twins absolutely destroyed the Sox in every aspect of baseball. They really believe they will win this division. I don't think I can say the same thing about the Sox.

Buehrle and Floyd are our only hope right now. I'm not counting on this offense or bullpen to get the job done.

I like this post and agree with all of it. I like Buehrle and Floyd for the next 2 and hope they can get it done. But the inconsistent hitting, handicaps in baserunning and small ball, BAD defensive position we're putting ourselves in like Jr. at this point in CF (especially with Vazquez pitching), and a 9-1 opening in this much more important than ".01%" rah-rah thing put up earlier is troubling. It is.

There needs to be a massive turn-around in the next 2 games (and not just in play, but in managing decisions) to get this division. These aren't just single games divided by 162. They are the 3 most heavily weighted in a 162 game "effort" of a season. Bad math and there is reason for concern without question. We've been completely and totally inconsistent on both sides of the plate.

southsideirish71
09-23-2008, 10:29 PM
Walkers patented offensive attack, of flail at everything, swing as hard as humanly possible, lift, pull, and extend.

September numbers.

OPS .706 good for 12th in the AL
Runs 79 good for 12th in the AL
BA .243 good for 13th in the AL
OBP .299 good for last in the AL, 29th in the majors

4th in homers, with 24.

CHISOXFAN13
09-23-2008, 10:30 PM
:rolling:

Will someone please spell someone's name correctly in this thread?

Alexi Ramirez
AJ Pierzynsky
John Danks
Duane Wise
Jaun Uribe

There, I think I covered most of them, right?

LO ****ing L. I needed that. Thanks!

Vernam
09-23-2008, 10:30 PM
On the bright side, now the Sox will clinch at home! :bandance:

But seriously . . .



Any of our other CFs catches Kubel's triple without leaving his feet.
Javi is truly a small-game pitcher.
I hate hate hate that ****er Kubel. :angry:


Tomorrow is Buehrle's chance to come up big. If we win that one, I still think we'll be okay. But I do NOT want to head into the third game looking to salvage one win.

Vernam

Adele_H
09-23-2008, 10:33 PM
Walkers patented offensive attack, of flail at everything, swing as hard as humanly possible, lift, pull, and extend.

September numbers.

OPS .706 good for 12th in the AL
Runs 79 good for 12th in the AL
BA .243 good for 13th in the AL
OBP .299 good for last in the AL, 29th in the majors

4th in homers, with 24.

Sox have a veteran line-up.

That shipment of greenies, errr, "decaf coffee" will be arriving to Minnesota any moment now. That oughta give us a boost of energy. :bandance:

Lip Man 1
09-23-2008, 10:35 PM
Well...

Buehrle pretty much has to win tomorrow or else the pressure on Floyd and the team could be suffocating.

1-6 in the House of Horrors now.

Oh stating the obvious, Boone Logan is atrocious.

Lip

It's Dankerific
09-23-2008, 10:36 PM
I got a feeling Swisher will give us a big hit in this series, if he gets an opportunity.

No rational reason for that. Like everyone else, I see the bad ABs he has had lately. But I've got a hunch he's due. Hope to see him in the lineup tomorrow.

I guarantee a Sox win with a BA start in this series.

JB98
09-23-2008, 10:38 PM
I guarantee a Sox win with a BA start in this series.

Anderson isn't going to start in this series, so who cares?

EuroSox35
09-23-2008, 10:38 PM
Let's look at Vazquez's performance more objectively, inning by inning instead of looking at the final score or his line.

1st inning - He cruises, 3 batters, 3 outs

2nd inning - A walk to Morneau (which isn't as bad as Hawk made it out to be, this is a AL MVP we're talking about that kills us), and a terrible pitch to Kubel for the HR, 2 runs.

3rd inning - Javy cruises, 3 batters, 3 outs

4th inning - Fat ass Kubel triples thanks to our defense, sets the tone for the inning. A double, a squeeze bunt scores the run, that runner steals second, and he comes in on a hit (which IIRC was one of those that just fell in again), so 3 more runs, but this time more due to the Twins aggressiveness

And after that inning, he has 78 pitches and is taken out of the game :scratch: How can he not be given a chance to start the 5th?

Warming up Broadway seemed like a clear message from Ozzie to me, and he was being punished by being taken out, especially with what was said the other day in the papers by Ozzie, all these mind game sound almost like a vendetta, and it wouldn't surprise me if they've been having problems with each other behind closed doors

Again, not a brilliant outing, but I wasn't expecting a perfect game, and I would've liked to have given him a chance to redeem himself, especially after he cruised through 2 of the 4 innings. Meanwhile, the offense is asleep, though maybe they would have been less likely to go through the motions in the late innings if it's 5-1 instead of 9-1...

Medford Bobby
09-23-2008, 10:40 PM
That was brutal. Even watching the news was better. Come on Mark, get'em tomorrow.
I might have watched sports only if Paula Ferris was....nevermind:whiner:

It's Dankerific
09-23-2008, 10:40 PM
Anderson isn't going to start in this series, so who cares?

Anyone who gives a damn whether we win or lose.

SpartanSoxFan
09-23-2008, 10:45 PM
Warming up Broadway seemed like a clear message from Ozzie to me, and he was being punished by being taken out, especially with what was said the other day in the papers by Ozzie, all these mind game sound almost like a vendetta, and it wouldn't surprise me if they've been having problems with each other behind closed doors

I wouldn't be suprised if this was the case. Vazquez may have very well pitched his final game in a Sox uniform tonight. If so, good riddance. :rolleyes:

JB98
09-23-2008, 10:46 PM
Anyone who gives a damn whether we win or lose.

I care deeply about whether the Sox win or lose, but I don't give a damn about your "guarantee" about Anderson. That's an easy remark for you to make, because you will not be proven right or wrong because Anderson ain't gonna play.

It's Dankerific
09-23-2008, 10:48 PM
I care deeply about whether the Sox win or lose, but I don't give a damn about your "guarantee" about Anderson. That's an easy remark for you to make, because you will not be proven right or wrong because Anderson ain't gonna play.

How is that my fault and not the fault of our boneheaded manager?

TomBradley72
09-23-2008, 10:53 PM
Saw this movie once before...2003...led to a new manager who won us a World Series...but by 2008...we looked like 2003.

SpartanSoxFan
09-23-2008, 10:54 PM
Saw this movie once before...2003...led to a new manager who won us a World Series...but by 2008...we looked like 2003.

I guess we will have a better idea by tomorrow, but this season actually has the potential to be more heartbreaking than '03 was...:whiner:

voodoochile
09-23-2008, 10:58 PM
Anyone who gives a damn whether we win or lose.

Wow, first you put words in my mouth and now you troll everyone who doesn't think BA is the answer...

Awesome job...

Soxman219
09-23-2008, 10:58 PM
That better not happen! We can't give the Twins the division! If that happens then they will make the playoffs and get DESTROYED! Mark needs to take care of business tomorrow and get this win.

The Dude
09-23-2008, 10:59 PM
Tonight's game was an embrassment. The offense was sickening, Rex Vazquez the mental midget can't win a big game, and Hawk was lauding the Twins all night! Hawk, the Twins are not the '27 Yanks OK! Griffey, you want to do a pimp walk after you hit a HR then do it when it matters. All we need is ONE win, nine innings of good baseball! Is that too much to ask for? At least show that you give a damn.

Relax there big fella. Lets not include football in this because this will turn into a Orton rulez/Rex droolz visa versa thread. But for the record, Rex indeed won two playoff games unlike Vazquez and played a huge part in one of them and was decent in the other. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

This game was absolutely an embarrassment to the game of baseball as the Bears game Sunday was an embarrassment to the game of football. :whiner:

Oldfellah
09-23-2008, 11:00 PM
Bad night all around!:whiner:

Silver lining.... I just upped my ignore the dark cloud bandwagon list by 8000% :bandance:

Another silver lining.... Tomorrow is a new game and the Sox have a very short memory!!!!:bandance:

assrevolution
09-23-2008, 11:04 PM
Is it still only the 3rd inning down 2-1??
Wow, didn't see THAT ass beating coming..

Who's going to step up for this team? Mark's the only one I'd put any money on. It's tomorrow or pack it in. Twins aren't giving us the title this weekend.

JUribe1989
09-23-2008, 11:04 PM
Before this river
Becomes an ocean
Before you throw my heart back on the floor
Oh baby I reconsider
My foolish notion
Well I need someone to hold me
But I'll wait for something more

Yes I've gotta have faith...


George Michael to save the season! Perhaps even the Limp Bizkit version?

Everybody play it right now...

JB98
09-23-2008, 11:04 PM
How is that my fault and not the fault of our boneheaded manager?

I guarantee we'll win tomorrow if Buehrle throws a shutout. Big ****ing deal. This is a pointless discussion.

thomas35forever
09-23-2008, 11:08 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8h9_9zfo7B0

Oldfellah
09-23-2008, 11:08 PM
Before this river
Becomes an ocean
Before you throw my heart back on the floor
Oh baby I reconsider
My foolish notion
Well I need someone to hold me
But I'll wait for something more

Yes I've gotta have faith...


George Michael to save the season! Perhaps even the Limp Bizkit version?

Everybody play it right now...

:ironDitka says YOUR FIRED!

SpartanSoxFan
09-23-2008, 11:13 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8h9_9zfo7B0

Thanks for that. It definetely made me smile on such a downer of an evening! :cool:

Oh, Jerry Jones, don't quit your day job, either....:tongue:

doublem23
09-23-2008, 11:14 PM
Oh stating the obvious, Boone Logan is atrocious.

Lip

We agree on something! Mark the day!

nccwsfan
09-23-2008, 11:17 PM
Bad, bad, baaaaad loss, but keep it in perspective:


White Sox 86-70 ___
Minnesota 85-72 1 1/2


They're still trying to catch us with 4-5 games remaining. Win tomorrow night and we're in good shape...

kittle42
09-23-2008, 11:19 PM
Anyone who gives a damn whether we win or lose.

Puh-****ing-lease.

Jerko
09-23-2008, 11:21 PM
Got a bad feeling the Sox are gonna have to win 2 in Minny. I think they will, but it's gonna get hairy if they don't.

champagne030
09-23-2008, 11:21 PM
Your splits are highly flawed, as has been pointed out in the past.

No, they're not. Swisher has been ****ing pathetic all year on the road. A .190 AVG and a .595 OPS, with substandard defense, is unacceptable.

And Griffey contributed more than anyone to us being behind 5-1. Anderson turns Kubel's fly into out #1 and then Alexei catches the short fly for out #2 because he's not playing in to cut the runner down at the plate. Two out and nobody on vs. a Twinkie inning caused by craptacular defense to start the inning. That's in addition to Griffey's rally kill with the DP ball.

slavko
09-23-2008, 11:24 PM
I was never really happy with the Griffey acquisition, but I understand why they did it. Unfortunately, he is terrible.

He surprised me by diving for that triple. I didn't think he would dive anymore after his wrist problems. If he had broken the wrist when he dove, would we be moaning over the idea that the season is now lost? That tells you how much he means to our chances. Can't hit, can't field, can't run.

Any alternative but the snakebit Nick Swisher offers more right now, including (am I really saying this?) Jerry Owens.

Lip Man 1
09-23-2008, 11:29 PM
Defense is certainly a part of the issue but keep in mind two other things that happened in that inning, which basically put the game away, the Twins keep sticking it to the White Sox because they have balance, they can do different things to score runs.

The inning was helped a lot by a stolen base and a good bunt.

Speed and execution, two things that are just about a foreign language to this all or nothing, beer league softball team.

Lip

mark2olson
09-23-2008, 11:29 PM
Just nothing went our way, and the guys didn't come to play. **** that dome, and **** everytime I hear "off the end of the bat just out of the reach of (insert slow outfielder's name here)."

Agreed on the dome...but the first game of a series there is always bad. We'll be back tomorrow.

LoveYourSuit
09-23-2008, 11:38 PM
This was just another typical 2008 White Sox loss. This one didn't hurt becauase they had ZERO chance to even win the game to begin with.


They came out like a team with no pulse. It's like they didn't care how big this series is to begin with. Kudos to OC for calling out the club on Boers and Bernstein before the game. Act like you want it for once.


I have been on Ozzie's side for quite a long time and it is dumb when people flame him for his management of this club. But if he is not able to motivate this group of 25+ guys for this series and at least get them to show a pulse out there, then I really don't know what he is good for. Motivation is his top quality and yet this team played dead tonight in the biggest series since 2005.

drewcifer
09-23-2008, 11:43 PM
He surprised me by diving for that triple. I didn't think he would dive anymore after his wrist problems. If he had broken the wrist when he dove, would we be moaning over the idea that the season is now lost? That tells you how much he means to our chances. Can't hit, can't field, can't run.

Any alternative but the snakebit Nick Swisher offers more right now, including (am I really saying this?) Jerry Owens.

BA would've caught that ball without staining his uniform. Ask anyone.

AnkleSox
09-23-2008, 11:47 PM
I hope Javier Vazquez is not a pitcher on the Chicago White Sox by the start of the 2009 season.

ViPeRx007
09-23-2008, 11:50 PM
It's pretty depressing watching practically every Twins player steal a base at will. Combine that with their freakin' bloop hits and they can just about drive you insane. Unbelievably frustrating to watch.

The slow, homer-happy White Sox didn't appear to have a chance tonight. This team is predictably unpredictable and it's not a good thing. I'm not feeling good vibes for the rest of this series...or the season...if the two are independant of one another, but we'll see what happens. I'm not about to throw in the towel but that was just brutal tonight.

Here's to a better tomorrow! :gulp:

Medford Bobby
09-23-2008, 11:50 PM
Agreed on the dome...but the first game of a series there is always bad. We'll be back tomorrow.
How many series have the Sox taken after losing the 1st game all year. :scratch:I'd check, but it's bed time.....:bandance:

LoveYourSuit
09-23-2008, 11:53 PM
I hope Javier Vazquez is not a pitcher on the Chicago White Sox by the start of the 2009 season.


With Contreras in the tank until perhaps July, start liking Mr Javy. He will be a fixture next year.

Chisox353014
09-23-2008, 11:54 PM
Who's going to step up for this team? Mark's the only one I'd put any money on. It's tomorrow or pack it in. Twins aren't giving us the title this weekend.

Gavin did it last time we were in Minnesota. He and Mark will both do it this time. :gulp:

HawkDJ
09-24-2008, 12:00 AM
The good news is Javier still has a family and a house.

Konerko05
09-24-2008, 12:01 AM
Defense is certainly a part of the issue but keep in mind two other things that happened in that inning, which basically put the game away, the Twins keep sticking it to the White Sox because they have balance, they can do different things to score runs.

The inning was helped a lot by a stolen base and a good bunt.

Speed and execution, two things that are just about a foreign language to this all or nothing, beer league softball team.

Lip

Yeah, but Ozzie knows exactly what kind of team the Twins have. The best way to stop them from "doing different things to score runs," is by putting the best defense on the field. Our outfield defense was terrible.

Would Swisher and Anderson really hit that much worse than Wise and Griffey? Does Ozzie really think Wise/Griffey's offense can offset their defense? One miscue in the outfield can be the difference between a blowout and a shutout with a guy like Vazquez. Yeah, that is a fault of Vazquez, but it's not like Ozzie doesn't know this. There is nothing Griffey could do offensively to offset Kubel's "triple." The damage was done.

Against the Twins in the Metrodome, you need to put your best defense on the field. It's very questionable if Swisher/Anderson would even be sacrificing offense. It's a no brainer to me.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 12:04 AM
They came out like a team with no pulse. It's like they didn't care how big this series is to begin with. Kudos to OC for calling out the club on Boers and Bernstein before the game. Act like you want it for once.


.

Orlando Cabrera can kiss my ass.

Considering the money he is making, the no-range, noodle-armed assclown could at least have the decency to get on base to start off a game once in a while (barely .300 on the season).

Real sparkplugs (see 2003 Kenny Lofton for the Cubs; Damon for 2004 Red Sox; (healthy) 2005 Podsednik for the Sox, etc) spark meaningful 1st inning rallies which makes the SP's job easier and takes some pressure off of the offense the rest of the way.

Cabrera's first two AB were as ugly as anything else (save for Vazquez, Griffey) by the Sox tonight. By the time he got his obligatory hit, Sox were already down 5-1 and reeling.

drewcifer
09-24-2008, 12:05 AM
Yeah, but Ozzie knows exactly what kind of team the Twins have. The best way to stop them from "doing different things to score runs," is by putting the best defense on the field. Our outfield defense was terrible.

Would Swisher and Anderson really hit that much worse than Wise and Griffey? Does Ozzie really think Wise/Griffey's offense can offset their defense? One miscue in the outfield can be the difference between a blowout and a shutout with a guy like Vazquez. Yeah, that is a fault of Vazquez, but it's not like Ozzie doesn't know this. There is nothing Griffey could do offensively to offset Kubel's "triple." The damage was done.

Against the Twins in the Metrodome, you need to put your best defense on the field. It's very questionable if Swisher/Anderson would even be sacrificing offense. It's a no brainer to me.

Agree again.

That triple opened the flood gates. Not one of you could say how that may have energized the team with a good catch by a young, EXCEPTIONAL defensive CFer like BA. And the offensive stats that he offers don't pale much compared to what the geriatric HOFer is doing anyway.

To beat the Twins, you need to hit them and not give them anything. Not one of us can say how the game would've turned out without that triple.

It's Dankerific
09-24-2008, 12:07 AM
Wow, first you put words in my mouth and now you troll everyone who doesn't think BA is the answer...

Awesome job...

You miss the smiley face VC?

KingXerxes
09-24-2008, 12:19 AM
I listened to the game on XM while driving around tonight, so I didn't get to watch it at all.

What did Harrelson say that has some people on him?

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 12:26 AM
What did Harrelson say that has some people on him?

Compared Carlos Gomez to the Big Bang in significance, and theorized that Susan Sontag was in fact a zebra mutant.

KingXerxes
09-24-2008, 12:31 AM
:hawk

"Yessir..........Ol' Susie Rosenblatt.............mercy she was ugly."

chisoxfanatic
09-24-2008, 12:36 AM
I listened to the game on XM while driving around tonight, so I didn't get to watch it at all.

What did Harrelson say that has some people on him?
He kept at his ass-kissing of Gardenhire.

KingXerxes
09-24-2008, 12:48 AM
He kept at his ass-kissing of Gardenhire.

Maybe Minnesota is looking for a play-by-play guy.

:hawk

"I have always said........in my fifty years of baseball..........heck fifty plus years.........that there is no better atmosphere........no better ballpark......than right here in downtown Minneapolis. Mercy, the way they make use of plastic in this place brings a tear to my eye.........and you never get rained out."

SteveFakeBlood
09-24-2008, 01:04 AM
Gavin did it last time we were in Minnesota. He and Mark will both do it this time. :gulp:

THANK YOU! It took 10 pages for someone to say this (apologies to anyone who said it that I may have missed).

Our next two games we're starting the most consistently solid pitcher we've had this decade (Buehrle) and the most consistently solid pitcher we've had this year (Floyd).

I don't give a damn who the hell we put in Centerfield, if those guys pitch like themselves, we will win.

Everyone's pissed about Hawk "loving" the Twins or whatever, I see it as him just giving due respect to a team that has consistently handed us our asses in that stadium over the last 7 seasons. He says the same types of things when we play in Oakland...

Everyone will realize how petty and stupid things like these are when we win a couple games and clinch the division.

Let's also remember, to use a cliched analogy from another sport, the ball is in our court. We've got these two games in Minnesota with our two most reliable starters going- then we're coming home and starting the guy who leads the team in ERA. Even if we finish Sunday a 1/2 game out, we get another chance by making up that game against Detroit at home. Then if we win that, we face the Twins in a playoff game at home.

We have absolutely every opportunity to win this thing... and if we don't it sure as **** won't be about who started in Center or Hawk's commentary....

~Steve

WhiteSox5187
09-24-2008, 01:09 AM
Defense is certainly a part of the issue but keep in mind two other things that happened in that inning, which basically put the game away, the Twins keep sticking it to the White Sox because they have balance, they can do different things to score runs.

The inning was helped a lot by a stolen base and a good bunt.

Speed and execution, two things that are just about a foreign language to this all or nothing, beer league softball team.

Lip
Lip, don't you realize that speed, execution and defense are overrated? It's all about OPS! Homeruns! Woo!

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 01:28 AM
Lip, don't you realize that speed, execution and defense are overrated? It's all about OPS! Homeruns!

Bull****.

It's not all about just any kind of HR - just the ones that are pulled (to LF by RH and RF by LH) with a majestic towering trajectory.

HR hit to center and to opposite field are communist creations that symbolize the destruction of our very way of life, and as such are highly undesirable under Walkerball.

RockJock07
09-24-2008, 02:06 AM
I hope Javier Vazquez is not a pitcher on the Chicago White Sox by the start of the 2009 season.

I'm wondering If Ozzie and Kenny are thinking about moving him. I think both of them are just getting tired of his ****. At this point, you may be able to move him in and get a quality pitching prospect, maybe similar to the Garcia/Gavin deal.

Tonight was awful, and the theme of this 2nd half is will someone step up in the absence of TCQ? Its mark's turn tomorrow night, will he?

ms620
09-24-2008, 05:41 AM
First of all, last night's loss is on Javy. Yes the hitting did not step up. And the defense let us down, both in the outfield and infield. However, as we saw in 2005, starting pitching wins playoff games, and this is essentially a playoff series. The sox grabbed a 1-0 lead, and Javy gave it right back with a 2 run homer. Those are plays that change the game. It is easier to play with a lead, than from behind. Even though the Sox did not have much momentun after the double play to take the lead, it would hav ebeen nice to come up next inning with a chance to build on it.

Second, while our outfield defense is bad, it will not decide our fate. I have been against starting BA all season. I have argued with the BA lovers all season about why its ridiculous to constantly preach to start him. However, I actually will jump on the BA bandwagon for the rest of this season. And I will explain why. It will improve the outfield defense, but that is not my primary concern. I have backed Griffey all year, and I still support the acquisition, as it was a low risk - high reward move. I just do not think he has it in him to help the Sox right now. Without TCQ, the sox are struggling to score consistantly. BA has looked better at the plate, and he might provide a spark. However, this will not happen, and it will also not decide the fate of the sox. It is pointless to continuously argue this fact, and discuss the "sox organizational philosophy on CF defense". That whole conversation is tired, so lets end it.

Thirdly, while Ozzie deserves a lot of credit for the White Sox success since he has been here, his comments on Javy were just not smart. We all have heard motivating speaches, and reminding someone of past failures does not do the trick. Nor does the BS about expecting to lose. At some point, not being able to win in a certain place has to be put on the manager. There are different players, same results, same manager. Not saying I am totally blaming this on Ozzie, but if the sox get swept, it must get considered.

Finally, IT IS JUST 1 GAME. I did not think the Sox were going to sweep the Twins. Did anyone here honestly believe that? Personally, my goal for this series is 1 win. They will head in to this weekend with a 1.5 game lead. So what if they have to play Detroit, and not able to rest their starters. This has not hurt teams in the past. Sox will take 1 game, and we will win this at home vs. Cleveland. MB will come through tonight, and Perkins will not make it out of the 5th inning.

delben91
09-24-2008, 06:33 AM
The good news is Javier still has a family and a house.

:rolling:

white sox bill
09-24-2008, 06:46 AM
Alls I ask for is ONE measly win this series. Thats the best we can ask for. ONE win and I'll be :bandance::bandance::bandance: like we won the WS!

TomBradley72
09-24-2008, 06:55 AM
No, they're not. Swisher has been ****ing pathetic all year on the road. A .190 AVG and a .595 OPS, with substandard defense, is unacceptable.

And Griffey contributed more than anyone to us being behind 5-1. Anderson turns Kubel's fly into out #1 and then Alexei catches the short fly for out #2 because he's not playing in to cut the runner down at the plate. Two out and nobody on vs. a Twinkie inning caused by craptacular defense to start the inning. That's in addition to Griffey's rally kill with the DP ball.

Great post. The domino effect of mediocre outfield defense is huge. All of this for a guy hitting .245 with 2 HR in 117 ABs.

RedHeadPaleHoser
09-24-2008, 07:00 AM
Great post. The domino effect of mediocre outfield defense is huge. All of this for a guy hitting .245 with 2 HR in 117 ABs.

Domino effect is right. Ozzie, if you read these posts, PLEASE but BA in center. If we lose tonight, we're toast up there. We have to win to give us a swinging chance of getting out of the Dumpdome in first.

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 07:12 AM
Ozzie deserves the credit for establishing the unbelievable confidence Minnesota plays with against the whitesox, especially at home. even when the sox beat them at home most times it is not without some type of Minnesota comeback. at the dome it's ridiculous. the sox don't just loose they get whupped, embarrassed, beaten in every facet of the game. i am personally sick of Ozzie talking about the piranhas, about how tough it is for the sox to win there, about how javy is not a big name pitcher. his players hear it and believe it! that isn't motivation! his comments stoke their team, their manager and their crowd. it is time he shut's up about how good Minnesota plays.

ms620
09-24-2008, 07:21 AM
I agree. The Twins are not more talented than the Sox. But they know they dominate the sox in that dome. And it shows on the field. Maybe Mark should throw behind Morneau tonight. Just send a message that they are not going to lay down this entire series.

russ99
09-24-2008, 07:55 AM
I agree. The Twins are not more talented than the Sox. But they know they dominate the sox in that dome. And it shows on the field. Maybe Mark should throw behind Morneau tonight. Just send a message that they are not going to lay down this entire series.

I'm getting tired of that cop-out. Other teams can play well in the dome.

Despite Javy's bad game this team doesn't look like a playoff team. Watch highlights of other teams... There's no fire or attitude. They all look like "Oh crud, we have to play another game??" There's also no excuse for the utterly unfocused at-bats we've been seeing the last week (or three). Do we have a hitting coach???

Personally, I'm shocked Ozzie didn't let them all have it after the game yesterday. They really need to step it up today.

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 08:00 AM
I agree. The Twins are not more talented than the Sox. But they know they dominate the sox in that dome. And it shows on the field. Maybe Mark should throw behind Morneau tonight. Just send a message that they are not going to lay down this entire series.
good point...you could see how afraid of morneau vasquez was on his first at bat. if he want's to pitch around him maybe he should have just drilled him.

BeviBall!
09-24-2008, 08:01 AM
Buehrle needs a shutout tonight. That's where we are.

Mohoney
09-24-2008, 08:09 AM
Thirdly, while Ozzie deserves a lot of credit for the White Sox success since he has been here, his comments on Javy were just not smart. We all have heard motivating speaches, and reminding someone of past failures does not do the trick. Nor does the BS about expecting to lose. At some point, not being able to win in a certain place has to be put on the manager. There are different players, same results, same manager. Not saying I am totally blaming this on Ozzie, but if the sox get swept, it must get considered.


It's not just Ozzie, though. Jerry Manuel's teams played like crap there, too.

ms620
09-24-2008, 08:16 AM
It's not just Ozzie, though. Jerry Manuel's teams played like crap there, too.

Unfortuantely, while that might be true, that does not mean that Ozzie does not deserve some blame.

chisoxfanatic
09-24-2008, 08:16 AM
good point...you could see how afraid of morneau vasquez was on his first at bat. if he want's to pitch around him maybe he should have just drilled him.
The one I'd like to see get drilled before anyone else is Kubel. In fact, if we're leading by a bunch tonight, Buehrle should drill him with a fast ball.

ms620
09-24-2008, 08:17 AM
I'm getting tired of that cop-out. Other teams can play well in the dome.

Despite Javy's bad game this team doesn't look like a playoff team. Watch highlights of other teams... There's no fire or attitude. They all look like "Oh crud, we have to play another game??" There's also no excuse for the utterly unfocused at-bats we've been seeing the last week (or three). Do we have a hitting coach???

Personally, I'm shocked Ozzie didn't let them all have it after the game yesterday. They really need to step it up today.

I will say this 1 last time. When teams play well, it looks like they are fired up, want to be there, are focused and intense. When they struggle, it looks the opposite.

ms620
09-24-2008, 08:21 AM
The one I'd like to see get drilled before anyone else is Kubel. In fact, if we're leading by a bunch tonight, Buehrle should drill him with a fast ball.

I disagree. We are not drilling Morneau or Kubel b/c they hit home runs. We should throw behind Morneau as he is the leader of that team, and we must send a message that we will not them walk all over us.

oeo
09-24-2008, 08:26 AM
I disagree. We are not drilling Morneau or Kubel b/c they hit home runs. We should throw behind Morneau as he is the leader of that team, and we must send a message that we will not them walk all over us.

How about not letting them walk all over us instead? This is stupid. Just play the damn game, play it hard, and kick their ass. No need to play little games.

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 08:27 AM
I will say this 1 last time. When teams play well, it looks like they are fired up, want to be there, are focused and intense. When they struggle, it looks the opposite.
i think it still comes back to ozzie who has conditioned the team to fear playing at that place. as soon as vazquez gave up the first homerun they threw in the towel.

SoxFan78
09-24-2008, 08:29 AM
How about not letting them walk all over us instead? This is stupid. Just play the damn game, play it hard, and kick their ass. No need to play little games.

Agreed. There is no reason to throw at any of the twins right now? Do they showboat? No. Do they play dirty? No. They just happen to play baseball the right way. Maybe the Sox pitchers should worry about putting away hitters and throwing to first every once in a while to make sure they dont steal bases at will.

white sox bill
09-24-2008, 08:29 AM
Does any team have a winning record at the Dome this yr? When the ball bounces around like a superball on steroids, its easy to se why the home team wins there so much. The crowd seemed loud last PM could barley hear Farmio over the noise

white sox bill
09-24-2008, 08:30 AM
We don;t need to be beaning anyone, we can't afford suspensions

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 08:30 AM
Agreed. There is no reason to throw at any of the twins right now? Do they showboat? No. Do they play dirty? No. They just happen to play baseball the right way. Maybe the Sox pitchers should worry about putting away hitters and throwing to first every once in a while to make sure they dont steal bases at will.
throwing to first last night did not stop their running game...they have the one commodity you cant coach...speed. dont give up the two out hits and the stolen bases wont hurt you.

palehozenychicty
09-24-2008, 08:33 AM
I got a feeling Swisher will give us a big hit in this series, if he gets an opportunity.

No rational reason for that. Like everyone else, I see the bad ABs he has had lately. But I've got a hunch he's due. Hope to see him in the lineup tomorrow.


We'll see. He'll take strike two and three before he swings though. :tongue:

chisoxfanatic
09-24-2008, 08:34 AM
i think it still comes back to ozzie who has conditioned the team to fear playing at that place. as soon as vazquez gave up the first homerun they threw in the towel.
As soon as we could only score one stinkin' run after Thome and Konerko started off the second frame (runners on the corners, mind you) by reaching safely, I knew it wasn't gonna be our night.

beasly213
09-24-2008, 08:39 AM
At least The Sox have MB going tonight. He moves quick can keep the Twins off balance and also keep those base runners close.

ms620
09-24-2008, 08:48 AM
How about not letting them walk all over us instead? This is stupid. Just play the damn game, play it hard, and kick their ass. No need to play little games.

No you are missing the point. It is not about little games. It is about regaining the mental edge, or atleast some of it. Would it be great if you did not have to resort to "little games"? Obviously. But at this point, that might not be an option. If the sox are more talented than the Twins, why don't they win there? It is not b/c its in a dome. It is b/c it is the Metrodome. That is a big difference. Sometimes it takes a little thing to make a big difference. Javy looked afraid to pitch to Morneau. He walks him on 4 pitches, and then Kubel hits a home run. The Sox need to make a statement. You do what you need to do to make that statement. If you struggle to do it without playing "little games"...then you play those games.

stl_sox_fan
09-24-2008, 08:57 AM
At least The Sox have MB going tonight. He moves quick can keep the Twins off balance and also keep those base runners close.

I hope so. Anything to keep AJ and his 10% throw out ratio out of the equation. After Gomez stole second, the Minn broadcast put that stat up. Woah!!!

Was pretty much expecting a loss with Javy. Glad to see Ozzie used the gas can relievers in garbage time last night. Allthough gas can and our bullpen is pretty synonymous lately.
Just win one guys!!!!

cards press box
09-24-2008, 08:58 AM
Things aren't as bleak as some might imagine. I have five reasons:

(1) The best pitching match up for the Twins in this series was the Monday night game. If Baker isn't the Twins' best pitcher right now, he's no worse than #2. The Buehrle/Blackburn and Floyd/Slowey match ups favor the White Sox.

(2) The Twins' record in the first game of series in the Metrodome is off the charts in their favor. Visiting teams do better in the 2nd and 3rd games of a series. Teams apparently need a full game to get acclimated to the dump.

(3) The Sox still have a 2 game lead in the loss column.

(4) The odds favor the Sox winning at least one of the next two games. As of this morning, computer models (such as the one at Baseball Prospectus) still make the Sox 3-1 favorites to win this division.

(5) I have a hunch that the Sox' bats will make some noise the next two nights.


O.K., #5 isn't a reason but I do have a good feeling about these next two games.

assrevolution
09-24-2008, 09:01 AM
Gavin did it last time we were in Minnesota. He and Mark will both do it this time. :gulp:

I'm not worried that Mark and Gavin won't do their jobs. It's everybody else on the team. These guys should have several more wins a piece, especially Mark. Logan will probably come in and pull a triple balk to blow the game.
I'm waiting for Gardenhire to come out in Dennis Green fashion...'The Sox ARE who we THOUGHT they were!'

oeo
09-24-2008, 09:01 AM
No you are missing the point. It is not about little games. It is about regaining the mental edge, or atleast some of it. Would it be great if you did not have to resort to "little games"? Obviously. But at this point, that might not be an option. If the sox are more talented than the Twins, why don't they win there? It is not b/c its in a dome. It is b/c it is the Metrodome. That is a big difference. Sometimes it takes a little thing to make a big difference. Javy looked afraid to pitch to Morneau. He walks him on 4 pitches, and then Kubel hits a home run. The Sox need to make a statement. You do what you need to do to make that statement. If you struggle to do it without playing "little games"...then you play those games.

There is no mental edge, and throwing behind Morneau isn't going to do a thing. In fact, it would probably piss him and the rest of the Twins off. They feed off of crap like that, so just play ball.

The Sox have the upper hand here. All they need to do is win one game and they're in very good shape. Don't give the Twins any extra incentive. You want to get in their heads? Try shutting them down offensively, and I know it sounds crazy, but score some ****ing runs for once.

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 09:01 AM
mauer and morneau feast on pitchers who live away...you have to pitch them in and also make them move their feet.

assrevolution
09-24-2008, 09:03 AM
As soon as we could only score one stinkin' run after Thome and Konerko started off the second frame (runners on the corners, mind you) by reaching safely, I knew it wasn't gonna be our night.

I hear ya, but that's one more run than they normally score in that situation so I was thinking we were on to something...

veeter
09-24-2008, 09:15 AM
I hope Javier Vazquez is not a pitcher on the Chicago White Sox by the start of the 2009 season.I do. Javy is extremely valuable, IF, he's the fourth or fifth starter. I was just thinking, if the Sox would/ could somehow get another stud (Sabathia, Cain, etc.), they would be dominant. They can't go into it next year thinking Richard replaces Jose. The staff of Buehrle, Danks, Floyd, stud pick-up, and Vazquez would be tough to beat. It's at their fingertips, I hope they go for it.

chisoxfanatic
09-24-2008, 09:22 AM
I do. Javy is extremely valuable, IF, he's the fourth or fifth starter. I was just thinking, if the Sox would/ could somehow get another stud (Sabathia, Cain, etc.), they would be dominant. They can't go into it next year thinking Richard replaces Jose. The staff of Buehrle, Danks, Floyd, stud pick-up, and Vazquez would be tough to beat. It's at their fingertips, I hope they go for it.
I'd want to keep Javy ONLY if he's our #5 starter. I'd REALLY like for them to go after AJ Burnett. He could probably be had for a few million less than Sabathia.

veeter
09-24-2008, 09:33 AM
I'd want to keep Javy ONLY if he's our #5 starter. I'd REALLY like for them to go after AJ Burnett. He could probably be had for a few million less than Sabathia.Sounds good to me. Burnett, though, is due for an injury plagued season. But Dr. Herm, Coop and Ozzie probably could coax an awesome season or two out of that guy.

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 09:42 AM
what makes anybody think the whitesox will make a competitive offer to a high priced free agent pitcher. more likely they will try to trade for a typical ken williams outside the box pitcher instead. as he has had pretty diecnt success finding players this way i think it is more realistic expectation than sabathia or anyother stud who is a free agent.

veeter
09-24-2008, 09:46 AM
what makes anybody think the whitesox will make a competitive offer to a high priced free agent pitcher. more likely they will try to trade for a typical ken williams outside the box pitcher instead. as he has had pretty diecnt success finding players this way i think it is more realistic expectation than sabathia or anyother stud who is a free agent.You're probably right, but I was painting a 'wouldn't it be great' scenario. Kenny probably already has his sights on somebody as you speak of. Like Lannan(sp?) on Washington.

hi im skot
09-24-2008, 09:47 AM
I'm not worried that Mark and Gavin won't do their jobs. It's everybody else on the team. These guys should have several more wins a piece, especially Mark. Logan will probably come in and pull a triple balk to blow the game.
I'm waiting for Gardenhire to come out in Dennis Green fashion...'The Sox ARE who we THOUGHT they were!'

A positive outlook in a post-game thread?!

I like the way you think...the Sox will bounce back tonight.

mark2olson
09-24-2008, 09:55 AM
How many series have the Sox taken after losing the 1st game all year. :scratch:I'd check, but it's bed time.....:bandance:

Yep, yer right.

4/29 - at Twins, L
4/30 - at Twins, L
7/28 - at Twins, L
7/29 - at Twins, L
7/30 - at Twins, W
9/23 - at Twins, L

The Milkman
09-24-2008, 10:03 AM
Too bad Boone Logan wasn't ever put in a Sean Tracey-like situation. I'd like to see him crying and then never have to lay eyes on him again.

hi im skot
09-24-2008, 10:04 AM
Too bad Boone Logan wasn't ever put in a Sean Tracey-like situation. I'd like to see him crying and then never have to lay eyes on him again.

Boone Logan is dead on the inside.

kjhanson
09-24-2008, 10:05 AM
Vazquez would be a phenomenal fifth starter, but he's being paid to be a number 2 starter. Unless he's willing to take a pay-cut (not gonna happen), he'll be under-performing his contract. Vazquez, Linebrink, Dotel, Contreras and Konerko have all performed below their contracts (Nick Swisher only makes $3.6mil this year). Fortunately, Danks, Floyd, Quentin, Ramirez and Dye have out-performed their contracts, which is why we're two up in the loss column with 6 to play.

Tonight, it's time for Buehrle to live up to his contract, as he has time and time again in a Sox uniform.

kitekrazy
09-24-2008, 10:44 AM
Vazquez would be a phenomenal fifth starter, but he's being paid to be a number 2 starter.

You are thinking in Sox economics. Some teams have paid close to what Javi is making for middle relief.

kittle42
09-24-2008, 10:56 AM
You are thinking in Sox economics. Some teams have paid close to what Javi is making for middle relief.

Agreed. Jason Marquis makes $7 mil. I don't think $10 mil for Vazquez is ridiculous. That's simply market.

markopat
09-24-2008, 10:57 AM
Not sure what it is Sox fans...but I can feel it. I had a bad feeling yesterday...and it played out. I really feel great about tonight and We will prevail. In fact...not just prevail...but win by 6 or more.

Keepin the faith in AZ!

Don't stop believin people!

GO GO SOX!

brick1119
09-24-2008, 11:07 AM
I knew Vazquez would crap the bed, which is why I didn't play my emotional hedge. Buehrle should get us the win we need, so I played the emotional hedge bet by placing $100 on the Twins. If we lose again tonight, I'll take my "winnings" and roll it onto the Twins again. So we'll either get the win we need out of the next two games or I'll have plenty of money to drown my sorrows in beer. Worth the $100 in my mind if we can get one damn win!

PatK
09-24-2008, 11:20 AM
I don't know what was worse, Javy's crapping of the bed, or Hawks non-stop Twins love.

Jesus Christ, Hawk was downright pathetic last night. I would have no problem if his audition for the Twins started once they blew the game open, but it started as soon as the Twin took the 2-1 lead.

I really cannot stomach Hawk anymore. When I watch home games, I synch up my TV with my XM at home so I can listen to Stoney and Farmio. too bad XM carries the home team's broadcast.

TDog
09-24-2008, 11:31 AM
There is no mental edge, and throwing behind Morneau isn't going to do a thing. In fact, it would probably piss him and the rest of the Twins off. They feed off of crap like that, so just play ball.

The Sox have the upper hand here. All they need to do is win one game and they're in very good shape. Don't give the Twins any extra incentive. You want to get in their heads? Try shutting them down offensively, and I know it sounds crazy, but score some ****ing runs for once.

Throwing at Morneau could lead to a suspension. When one of your starters is out for the season with an injury, it would not be a good time for a suspension.

As for visiting teams in the dome, it's mostly bad news, as you might expect. The Blue Jays have a winning record in Minnesota. They went 3-0 home and 3-0 away. Maybe their home dome had something to do with their success in the Metrodome. The Orioles were 2-1 in the dome and 1-2 against the Twins at home. The Angels were 3-1 in the dome and 2-2 against the Twins at home. The Red Sox lost three of four in the dome, but won all three games against the Twins in Fenway. The Rays only played two games in the Metrodome and four games at their home dome, splitting both series. It isn't the noise in the dome that is an issue, although I'm guessing the Metrodome was empty when the Orioles came to town. The big issue is the lighting. Then comes the playing surface.

The Twins won two games out of nine against the Sox in Chicago. The Sox were not in either game. One was pitched by Danks, whose ERA against the Twins is nearly 8 in three starts. Danks probably would have lost Tuesday night as well. Buehrle, although he has lost to the Twins both in Chicago and Minneapolis this year, has more positive experience in the Metrodome than anyone in the Sox rotation. Floyd pitched well in the Metrodome in July when no one else on the Sox did. I wasn't expecting the Sox to sweep. I wasn't expecting them to win the first game. I am expecting better Wednesday and Thursday nights.

palehozenychicty
09-24-2008, 11:36 AM
Throwing at Morneau could lead to a suspension. When one of your starters is out for the season with an injury, it would not be a good time for a suspension.

As for visiting teams in the dome, it's mostly bad news, as you might expect. The Blue Jays have a winning record in Minnesota. They went 3-0 home and 3-0 away. Maybe their home dome had something to do with their success in the Metrodome. The Orioles were 2-1 in the dome and 1-2 against the Twins at home. The Angels were 3-1 in the dome and 2-2 against the Twins at home. The Red Sox lost three of four in the dome, but won all three games against the Twins in Fenway. The Rays only played two games in the Metrodome and four games at their home dome, splitting both series. It isn't the noise in the dome that is an issue, although I'm guessing the Metrodome was empty when the Orioles came to town. The big issue is the lighting. Then comes the playing surface.

The Twins won two games out of nine against the Sox in Chicago. The Sox were not in either game. One was pitched by Danks, whose ERA against the Twins is nearly 8 in three starts. Danks probably would have lost Tuesday night as well. Buehrle, although he has lost to the Twins both in Chicago and Minneapolis this year, has more positive experience in the Metrodome than anyone in the Sox rotation. Floyd pitched well in the Metrodome in July when no one else on the Sox did. I wasn't expecting the Sox to sweep. I wasn't expecting them to win the first game. I am expecting better Wednesday and Thursday nights.


That is the temperature of the realistic posters here, which is a lot. Vazquez is who he is, which is consistently inconsistent. Anyone expecting different is fooling themselves. I think that Buehrle and Gavin will give good efforts on the mound, but the lineup and pen must contribute, especially for Buehrle.

Jurr
09-24-2008, 11:43 AM
Throwing at Morneau could lead to a suspension. When one of your starters is out for the season with an injury, it would not be a good time for a suspension.

As for visiting teams in the dome, it's mostly bad news, as you might expect. The Blue Jays have a winning record in Minnesota. They went 3-0 home and 3-0 away. Maybe their home dome had something to do with their success in the Metrodome. The Orioles were 2-1 in the dome and 1-2 against the Twins at home. The Angels were 3-1 in the dome and 2-2 against the Twins at home. The Red Sox lost three of four in the dome, but won all three games against the Twins in Fenway. The Rays only played two games in the Metrodome and four games at their home dome, splitting both series. It isn't the noise in the dome that is an issue, although I'm guessing the Metrodome was empty when the Orioles came to town. The big issue is the lighting. Then comes the playing surface.

The Twins won two games out of nine against the Sox in Chicago. The Sox were not in either game. One was pitched by Danks, whose ERA against the Twins is nearly 8 in three starts. Danks probably would have lost Tuesday night as well. Buehrle, although he has lost to the Twins both in Chicago and Minneapolis this year, has more positive experience in the Metrodome than anyone in the Sox rotation. Floyd pitched well in the Metrodome in July when no one else on the Sox did. I wasn't expecting the Sox to sweep. I wasn't expecting them to win the first game. I am expecting better Wednesday and Thursday nights.
That hitter's backdrop is treacherous, as are the lighting tricks that the roof places on the ball. The Twins definitely have an advantage due to the fact that they are used to it.
Hopefully after a day of toiling at that ballfield, the Sox can adjust a little.
It always seems like they struggle in that first game of a Twins series in Minnesota from an offensive standpoint.

kjhanson
09-24-2008, 12:00 PM
It always seems like they struggle in that first game of a Twins series in Minnesota from an offensive standpoint.

It's not just the White Sox. A while back somebody started a thread about Minnesota in the first game of a home series. Well, after last night's win, the Twins are 19-6 (.760) in the first game of a series in their dump of a ballpark. In all other home games, they are a more realistic 31-20 (.608).

Tragg
09-24-2008, 12:03 PM
I disagree. We are not drilling Morneau or Kubel b/c they hit home runs. We should throw behind Morneau as he is the leader of that team, and we must send a message that we will not them walk all over us.
Head-hunting is cowardly.
Beat them on the field....that sends the right message.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 12:11 PM
I'm getting tired of that cop-out. Other teams can play well in the dome..

It's not just the Metrodome.

Sox are also 0-4 in Toronto. And lost 3 of 4 to TB last time they were there.

ike from nj
09-24-2008, 12:39 PM
Head-hunting is cowardly.
Beat them on the field....that sends the right message.
knocking a guy down who kills you is not cowardly but how the game should be played. morneau is so comfortable batting against the sox that it is ridiculous

ms620
09-24-2008, 12:49 PM
Head-hunting is cowardly.
Beat them on the field....that sends the right message.

Head-hunting? Show me where I said to throw it at his head and then I will respond.

JB98
09-24-2008, 01:15 PM
Head-hunting is cowardly.
Beat them on the field....that sends the right message.

We don't need to head-hunt. But we do need to pitch inside, especially to Morneau and Kubel.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 01:27 PM
We don't need to head-hunt. But we do need to pitch inside, especially to Morneau and Kubel.

It's not that simple.

Like Hawk, I am neither a doctor nor a scientist.

But big part of pitching success is throwing where they ain't (looking for it). Changing the eye level; disrupting delicate timing mechanism; forcing the hitter to re-route his hands, re-shift weight - all of which work against the hitter trying to square up the round ball with the "fat" part of his bat on a desired line plane...

You pitch inside (hard), when you believe the hitter is looking away & off-speed, when he is diving across the plate, trying to get extension. To jam, to tie up.

But if Morneu is looking hard, middle-in because that's where he believes Sox want to pitch him, he'll kill you all the same, maybe even worse.

And it's all moot anyway: Javy was hanging his breaking ball & floating the change-up all game long when he was forced to pitch out of the stretch. If Sox had given him a bigger lead and made the tough defensive plays, maybe he would have calmed down. But as it was, it was just a matter of time.

JB98
09-24-2008, 01:34 PM
It's not that simple.

Like Hawk, I am neither a doctor nor a scientist.

But big part of pitching success is throwing where they ain't (looking for it). Changing the eye level; disrupting delicate timing mechanism; forcing the hitter to re-route his hands, re-shift weight - all of which work against the hitter trying to square up the round ball with the "fat" part of his bat on a desired line plane...

You pitch inside (hard), when you believe the hitter is looking away & off-speed, when he is diving across the plate, trying to get extension. To jam, to tie up.

But if Morneu is looking hard, middle-in because that's where he believes Sox want to pitch him, he'll kill you all the same, maybe even worse.

And it's all moot anyway: Javy was hanging his breaking ball & floating the change-up all game long when he was forced to pitch out of the stretch. If Sox had given him a bigger lead and made the tough defensive plays, maybe he would have calmed down. But as it was, it was just a matter of time.

Well, duh. That's why you come in hard and off the plate a couple times. There's a difference between head-hunting and coming in to make a hitter move his hands or his body. The latter is a good idea - and necessary right now, IMO. The former is just a macho waste of time.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 01:40 PM
Well, duh. That's why you come in hard and off the plate a couple times. .

...which probably results in a 2-0 count and Morneau just so happens to have a 1040 OPS after he is up that count.

That is if you don't HBP him by aiming off the plate inside, giving the Twins a free baserunner.

KingXerxes
09-24-2008, 01:42 PM
Adele H - I have a question.

Why in some of your posts does a picture show up at the bottom, and on others it is missing?

Just curious.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 01:44 PM
Adele H - I have a question.

Why in some of your posts does a picture show up at the bottom, and on others it is missing?

Just curious.

To avoid causing undue seizures.

It's board policy.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 01:45 PM
or is it?
.

Nellie_Fox
09-24-2008, 01:46 PM
Adele H - I have a question.

Why in some of your posts does a picture show up at the bottom, and on others it is missing?

Just curious.
Signature blocks only appear once per page. For second and subsequent posts on the same page, it is suppressed.

Nellie_Fox
09-24-2008, 01:46 PM
Like this.

JB98
09-24-2008, 01:47 PM
...which probably results in a 2-0 count and Morneau just so happens to have a 1040 OPS after he is up that count.

That is if you don't HBP him by aiming off the plate inside, giving the Twins a free baserunner.


Well, you don't do it twice in the same at-bat. I'm saying you want to come inside hard a couple times a game on Morneau.

That's what teams are doing to Dye right now. They are coming in off the plate for effect, because they want to get him out with breaking balls away. And the strategy has been working.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 01:52 PM
That's what teams are doing to Dye right now. They are coming in off the plate for effect, because they want to get him out with breaking balls away. And the strategy has been working.

You can't compare Dye in his current anywhere-but-here mode, to MVP candidate Morneau.

Right now, Dye couldn't hit a pitch away, especially if it's off-speed, if you told him it was coming. I haven't seen him this pitiful since Jermaine Dead days of April-May of 2005.

JB98
09-24-2008, 01:57 PM
You can't compare Dye in his current anywhere-but-here mode, to MVP candidate Morneau.

Right now, Dye couldn't hit a pitch away, especially if it's off-speed, if you told him it was coming. I haven't seen him this pitiful since Jermaine Dead days of April-May of 2005.

Why can't I compare Dye to Morneau? In 2006, when Morneau won his MVP, Dye had just as good a season. Morneau only won the MVP because his team made the playoffs and Dye's did not.

You've been listening to Hawk's Twinkie love bull**** too much. Morneau isn't a class above Jermaine Dye by any means. Both have been among the most productive hitters in the American League over the last five years.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 02:10 PM
Why can't I compare Dye to Morneau? In 2006, when Morneau won his MVP, Dye had just as good a season. Morneau only won the MVP because his team made the playoffs and Dye's did not.

You've been listening to Hawk's Twinkie love bull**** too much. Morneau isn't a class above Jermaine Dye by any means. Both have been among the most productive hitters in the American League over the last five years.

Can you read? Seriously.

Right now. Currently. September 2008. Not July 2006.

Right now Dye looks old & uninspired. Watch some damn games, pal.

KingXerxes
09-24-2008, 02:13 PM
Like this.

Got it.

doublem23
09-24-2008, 03:11 PM
Considering how bad last night was, this thread is remarkably read-able.

Bravo, WSI. Bravo!

doublem23
09-24-2008, 03:13 PM
Right now Dye looks old & uninspired. Watch some damn games, pal.

Holy ****, the guy's allowed to have a slump, he's still slugging .538, the 3rd best mark of his 13-year career. If you want to accuse KGJ of being old and uninspired, I won't argue with you, but JD's been pretty good all season long. He's finally not hitting, unfortunately, at the worst time of the year, but it's pretty easy to deduce that had Jermaine not been so good all year, it's unlikely these games would mean much, anyway.

Adele_H
09-24-2008, 03:31 PM
Holy ****, the guy's allowed to have a slump.

A month-long slump? With the team leader Quentin out, and nobody else aside from Cabrera able to step up lately? I don't think so. MVP don't disappear with the weather.

While we're on the subject... do you realize that Dye hasn't hit on the road all season long, right? No wonder the team is so jeckyl/hyde when half the damn line-up is content with padding their stats at home...