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doublem23
08-27-2008, 11:35 AM
http://deadspin.com/5042390/presenting-the-unbreakable-wooden-bat-pedro-cerrano-approves

Interesting.

cws05champ
08-27-2008, 11:54 AM
http://deadspin.com/5042390/presenting-the-unbreakable-wooden-bat-pedro-cerrano-approves

Interesting.
What would the Minnesota Twins do if they can't get their broken bat singles 6 times a game?

Iwritecode
08-27-2008, 12:09 PM
They already make wood bats that are covered in fiberglass. Good for players trying to transition from metal to wood.

Lefty34
08-27-2008, 12:11 PM
They already make wood bats that are covered in fiberglass. Good for players trying to transition from metal to wood.

Is that kind of like the DeMarini Composite wood bats? I played with those in my college summer league and couldn't really tell what they were.

Iwritecode
08-27-2008, 12:13 PM
Is that kind of like the DeMarini Composite wood bats? I played with those in my college summer league and couldn't really tell what they were.

I don't know for sure.

I saw them at the Louisville Slugger factory when I was there a few weeks ago.

Luke
08-27-2008, 12:33 PM
Is that kind of like the DeMarini Composite wood bats? I played with those in my college summer league and couldn't really tell what they were.

No, the DeMarini is maple except for the handle, which is a composite material. I think the entire Louisville was basically encapsulated in clear laminate shell. Different theories same results. I don't know anyone who has hit with either.

I like the idea of this new bat, it's pretty creative. MLB would obviously have to change the rules to allow it, so the chances of that happening anytime soon are not so good. $150 for an "unbreakable" wood bat isn't too bad though. A single MLB quality maple bat from Sam Bat or XBat is $120 retail.

Given that a new metal bat is 200+ and is replaced every couple seasons, I don't see that cost being to prohibitive for youth leagues.

UofCSoxFan
08-27-2008, 12:34 PM
They already make wood bats that are covered in fiberglass. Good for players trying to transition from metal to wood.

I've used one of those for 3 years and counting now in the college/men's teams I played on (about 40 games a year) and it still is in tact. I think it has a little less pop than a normal wood bat but the difference isn't great. By comparison when I was using wood I'd go through 1 every 10 to 15 games or so on average.

Nellie_Fox
08-27-2008, 12:35 PM
As of now, that bat would not be legal. The rules say the bat must be made from one solid piece of wood. Composites and laminates are not allowed.

TDog
08-27-2008, 01:07 PM
As of now, that bat would not be legal. The rules say the bat must be made from one solid piece of wood. Composites and laminates are not allowed.

And pitchers certainly want to keep it that way.

UofCSoxFan
08-27-2008, 01:09 PM
Given that a new metal bat is 200+ and is replaced every couple seasons, I don't see that cost being to prohibitive for youth leagues.

A top of the line college level TPX of Easton is above $400 now. The thing is, those bats have great pop for about a year but to stay on top of your game they need to be replaced each season. They really go dead after about a year. It kind of defeats the orginal purpose of metal bats...to limit the costs of having to constantly replace wood bats. There really is no reason for youth through college leagues to use metal bats since composite wood bats are now even cheaper to use than metalbats. Still, people like hitting home runs (and there is a lot more margin for error in hitting with a metal bat) and TPX and Easton will fight tooth and nail to resist the movement to wood since they are really the only two companies that make a good metal bat (DeMarini is a distant third) whereas many companies, including Louisville Slugger, DeMarini, Baum, Hosier, etc...all make pretty solid composite/fiberglass bats.

UofCSoxFan
08-27-2008, 01:12 PM
And pitchers certainly want to keep it that way.

Maybe, maybe not. If you bust a guy inside off the handle on a composite bad, the ball still won't travel far...in fact it will be behave pretty similarily to a broken ash bat. The only difference is the bat won't split in half. It's not like a metal bat where you can still hit a ball fairly hard even if you get it off the handle. One would argue that pitchers may welcome the shift to the unbreakable bat if it means shifting away from the hard maple bats.

BringBackBlkJack
08-27-2008, 02:03 PM
And pitchers certainly want to keep it that way.

Roger Clemens circa October 2000 agrees.

Luke
08-27-2008, 02:07 PM
A top of the line college level TPX of Easton is above $400 now.

Yeah, I should have clarified, I meant a youth bat.

RedHeadPaleHoser
08-27-2008, 02:23 PM
What would the Minnesota Twins do if they can't get their broken bat singles 6 times a game?

Lose. :bandance:

october23sp
08-27-2008, 10:13 PM
Broken bats= baseball

Whats bad about broken bats?

FedEx227
08-27-2008, 10:20 PM
Broken bats= baseball

Whats bad about broken bats?

Apparently all of a sudden in the past two years they are going to kill someone. I don't know either.

Although if its for youth leagues I 100% agree. Metal bats don't teach good hitting in fact they teach you that pretty much any amount of contact will do, you can hit a ball on the handles and still get a half-way decent hit out of that.

Also, it sucks for infielders, especially considering the field you're playing on, if there isn't a grass patch around the mound and maybe its just all dirt, forget fielding a ball cleanly at 3B/SS, it's going WAY too fast. (At least for kids with decent hitting skills).

I like this idea, or the idea that they had the Slugger plant (went there last year) as a poster above mentioned, they are kind of wrapped in a fiberglassy type deal, looked pretty cool and seemed like a good idea.

Plus as Lefty said I've used some composite bats, for the most part acted to me like a wood bat. Didn't have the same drive as a wood bat though it definitely seemed kind of rubbery. But balls tended to travel and act the same as a wood.

october23sp
08-27-2008, 11:21 PM
I play high school baseball and I preferred a Maple Bat over a composite bat most people liked the demarini composite over the Maple but I really liked it. Bamboo bats seem pretty decent too but Metal Bats are dumb at any level for so many reasons.

Nellie_Fox
08-28-2008, 12:41 AM
Broken bats= baseball

Whats bad about broken bats?

Apparently all of a sudden in the past two years they are going to kill someone. I don't know either. Have either of you been watching games for more than the last couple of years? Yes, bats used to break. And they pretty much stayed in one piece, just not usable.

Recently, they explode into flying, pointed missiles. This absolutely didn't used to happen. There have already been a couple of serious injuries resulting, and someone is going to get killed. It definitely needs to be addressed, despite your casual dismissal.

doublem23
08-28-2008, 01:03 AM
Broken bats= baseball

Whats bad about broken bats?

Nellie is correct, it's not that the bats are breaking, it's how they are. I will be 25 in just under a week and I can distinctly remember a time when a broken bat was just a guy getting sawed off. Today, guys hit the ball on the barrel and the bats explode into many pieces.

I think this is one of those things that we'll dismiss now as nothing to worry about, but when someone does finally get seriously injured we'll look back and wonder why more action wasn't taken in the first place.

Nellie_Fox
08-28-2008, 01:52 AM
... when someone does finally get seriously injured we'll look back and wonder why more action wasn't taken in the first place.Doub, there have already been at least two serious injuries: the Pirates coach who got the sharp end of the bat embedded in his face causing permanent nerve damage, and the woman in the stands at a Dodgers game who got her jaw broken and teeth knocked out. I'm still wondering why MLB is dithering on this issue.

Whether it's a minimum diameter for the bat handle, a minimum moisture content for the various species of wood, a ban on some species of wood, or some combination thereof, something has to be done.

doublem23
08-28-2008, 02:08 AM
Doub, there have already been at least two serious injuries: the Pirates coach who got the sharp end of the bat embedded in his face causing permanent nerve damage, and the woman in the stands at a Dodgers game who got her jaw broken and teeth knocked out. I'm still wondering why MLB is dithering on this issue.

Whether it's a minimum diameter for the bat handle, a minimum moisture content for the various species of wood, a ban on some species of wood, or some combination thereof, something has to be done.

OK, I should have said someone notable. Not trying to diss the Pirates' coach or Dodgers fan, but watch how fast MLB will react if A-Rod, Johan Santana, or someone along those lines ends up getting impaled with bat shrapnel.

forrestg
08-28-2008, 03:40 AM
One thing I notice about the bats today as compared to their older counterparts is the handle is so thin. Older bats had the thicker handle were tough to break but they were probably heavier,, Not too much to the liking of today's hitters.. Are Bamboo bats legal in mlb.. I heard they don't break as easy but if you hit one of the handle it stings whereas if you hit one off the handle of a maple bat it breaks.. That one umpire got a hell of an impact from that one bat that hit his head.. MLB doesn't change to quickly someone will have to get seriously hurt.. WHo will it be a fan, an Umpire a pitcher? DOn't put any cork in a bat that may cushion the blow wake up MLB at least ban the use of the type of bat that has the highest incidence of breaking..

TDog
08-28-2008, 04:09 AM
Doub, there have already been at least two serious injuries: the Pirates coach who got the sharp end of the bat embedded in his face causing permanent nerve damage, and the woman in the stands at a Dodgers game who got her jaw broken and teeth knocked out. I'm still wondering why MLB is dithering on this issue.

Whether it's a minimum diameter for the bat handle, a minimum moisture content for the various species of wood, a ban on some species of wood, or some combination thereof, something has to be done.

Serious injuries from broken bats aren't anything new. Consider the career of Steve Yeager (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Yeager) (scroll down to "throad protector" heading in the link).

Bats do splinter more than they used to, and injuries and potential serious injuries are more common. Metal bats wouldn't break, but I wouldn't want to see those in the hands of major league hitters.

Breakable wooden bats have always been part of baseball. Maybe restrictions are needed on the way they are treated and for the thickness of handles. Not that everyone should be swinging the thick-handled U1 model that Nellie Fox used to use. When I played with wooden bats, I liked the Frank Robinson handle on the R110. The M110 witht he Mickey Mantle handle used to be a popular bat.

Luke
08-28-2008, 10:38 AM
Are Bamboo bats legal in mlb.. I heard they don't break as easy but if you hit one of the handle it stings whereas if you hit one off the handle of a maple bat it breaks.

No they're not. MLB bats have to be a single, solid piece of wood. Bamboo is basically a pressed laminate. It performs well, but like almost everyone else has said, MLB is very slow to change. Right now a player has the option of Ash, Maple or Birch. The latter of which is new this year, and supposedly performs in between Ash and Maple.

As far as the number of maple bats breaking, I think it has largely to do with the moisture content. If I remember, there was some advancement in the kilning process that allowed additional drying of maple, which is what gave rise to the use of maple bats in the first place. Before that, they were always too heavy from the added moisture. By the time they're made light enough, they're brittle as hell, and blow up when they break.

As for handles, definitely thinner. Players being bigger and stronger now like to move some of that weight to the end of bat, and that means sacrificing mass on the handle, which means getting sawed off more often.

daveeym
08-28-2008, 10:42 AM
Nellie is correct, it's not that the bats are breaking, it's how they are. I will be 25 in just under a week and I can distinctly remember a time when a broken bat was just a guy getting sawed off. Today, guys hit the ball on the barrel and the bats explode into many pieces.

I think this is one of those things that we'll dismiss now as nothing to worry about, but when someone does finally get seriously injured we'll look back and wonder why more action wasn't taken in the first place.
You're not seeing as many cracked bats nowadays either. I always remember guys fouling pitches off and having the bat boy run out a new bat and taking back a full bat. Now it's a shattered bat that's being replaced almost everytime.

TDog
08-28-2008, 11:45 AM
You're not seeing as many cracked bats nowadays either. I always remember guys fouling pitches off and having the bat boy run out a new bat and taking back a full bat. Now it's a shattered bat that's being replaced almost everytime.

I have heard and read that players sometimes can't tell when maple bats are cracked and that the shattering, splintering bats that are such a problem can come when hitting with a cracked bat.