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gogosox16
08-14-2008, 06:29 PM
I was just watching the sports on NBC 5 and they said that Broadway got sent down after his start today. Has anyone else heard this?:scratch:

TomBradley72
08-14-2008, 06:30 PM
With some open days....they may not need a 5th starter for a while...he may be going back to Charlotte to get his regular turn in the rotation down there until we need him again.

Whitesoxfan23
08-14-2008, 06:31 PM
I was told that as well. What is going to happen with the 5th starter?

gogosox16
08-14-2008, 06:31 PM
With some open days....they may not need a 5th starter for a while...he may be going back to Charlotte to get his regular turn in the rotation down there until we need him again.
I hope thats the case becuase it had me worrying that after his very well pitched game they sent him down in favor of Richard becuase of some of the reports going on.

DeadMoney
08-14-2008, 06:31 PM
I was just watching the sports on NBC 5 and they said that Broadway got sent down after his start today. Has anyone else heard this?:scratch:

Ozzie said on the postgame interview that they were probably going to call up another pitcher (to be in the bullpen) for this weekend because they don't need Broadway again for 5 days and he wanted the extra arm on a short 3-day road trip.

EDIT: Actually, I think that's what he said/meant. It was sort of confusing when he was being asked about it and explaining it.

gogosox16
08-14-2008, 06:32 PM
Ozzie said on the postgame interview that they were probably going to call up another pitcher (to be in the bullpen) for this weekend because they don't need Broadway again for 5 days and he wanted the extra arm on a short 3-day road trip.
Ok. As long as he makes his next scheduled start with the Sox I am fine. He definately deserves another one.

DickAllen72
08-14-2008, 06:32 PM
That's probably why they recalled Richard, according to some reports. Broadway can't pitch for four or five days now anyway, so Richard can take his spot on the roster in case they need some innings from him in the next few days.

btrain929
08-14-2008, 06:34 PM
Ozzie said on the postgame interview that they were probably going to call up another pitcher (to be in the bullpen) for this weekend because they don't need Broadway again for 5 days and he wanted the extra arm on a short 3-day road trip.

So they are going to call him up every 5-7 days only when they need him? :scratch:

I'd prefer to keep Carrasco in the 7th inning role to give Thornton time off as supposed to a 5th starter.

Adele_H
08-14-2008, 06:35 PM
I hope thats the case becuase it had me worrying that after his very well pitched game.

Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

gogosox16
08-14-2008, 06:39 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.
Yes I did watch the game but he battled and was throwing strikes. He should of not given up any runs. If you consider 5 1/3 of 2 run ball mediocre, then theres something wrong. Expecially being his first start of the year

BadBobbyJenks
08-14-2008, 06:39 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

Did you watch the game? If the defense doesn't let him down in the first he goes 6 shut out innings today.

DeadMoney
08-14-2008, 06:39 PM
So they are going to call him up every 5-7 days only when they need him? :scratch:

I'd prefer to keep Carrasco in the 7th inning role to give Thornton time off as supposed to a 5th starter.

Well, I believe that once a guy is called up once in a season, moving him back and forth only counts as using up that one option - the original one - so that's not a concern. And, in 16 days the rosters expand ... so after September 1, it will no longer be a problem (moving them back and forth).

IF this is the case (moving guys back and forth to keep 11/12 pitchers - depending on the day), it makes sense ... if not, I have no idea what the plan is.

gogosox16
08-14-2008, 06:39 PM
Did you watch the game? If the defense doesn't let him down in the first he goes 6 shut out innings today.
Thank you

Jeckle2000
08-14-2008, 06:40 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

He battled... And I must say with some garbage defense behind him. Just because he wasn't blowing hitters away from strike outs doesn't change the result. The kid deserves another start!

TomBradley72
08-14-2008, 06:40 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

Completely disagree. Konerko doesn't botch the ball in 1st inning....he allows only 1 run...maybe none. Probably goes another inning as well.

gogosox16
08-14-2008, 06:41 PM
Well, I believe that once a guy is called up once in a season, moving him back and forth only counts as using up that one option - the original one - so that's not a concern. And, in 16 days the rosters expand ... so after September 1, it will no longer be an option.

IF this is the case (moving guys back and forth to keep 11/12 pitchers - depending on the day), it makes sense ... if not, I have no idea what the plan is.
Once your demoted, isn't there a certain amount of days you have to stay with that team before getting promoted again?

turners56
08-14-2008, 06:41 PM
Makes sense, we need an extra guy in the bullpen.

btrain929
08-14-2008, 06:42 PM
Well, I believe that once a guy is called up once in a season, moving him back and forth only counts as using up that one option - the original one - so that's not a concern. And, in 16 days the rosters expand ... so after September 1, it will no longer be a problem (moving them back and forth).

IF this is the case (moving guys back and forth to keep 11/12 pitchers - depending on the day), it makes sense ... if not, I have no idea what the plan is.

Yeah I know only 1 option is used, but I forgot that September 1st is around the corner. So maybe he'll be called up twice or three times, then just kept on the roster. That makes sense.

Jeckle2000
08-14-2008, 06:44 PM
Completely disagree. Konerko doesn't botch the ball in 1st inning....he allows only 1 run...maybe none. Probably goes another inning as well.

Not to mention that routine ground ball to Cabrera that got botched. It's hard to throw 6 full innings when your defense keeps making you get more outs.

TomBradley72
08-14-2008, 06:46 PM
So they are going to call him up every 5-7 days only when they need him? :scratch:

I'd prefer to keep Carrasco in the 7th inning role to give Thornton time off as supposed to a 5th starter.

Richard would is insurance to gobble up innings in a blow out/long relief type scenario so we can rest the more important arms in the bullpen.

I would think Broadway would be back up to start on Tuesday vs. Seattle. After that, they may not need a 5th starter until September 2nd at Cleveland.

DeadMoney
08-14-2008, 06:47 PM
Once your demoted, isn't there a certain amount of days you have to stay with that team before getting promoted again?

Good question, and I'm not sure ... but I don't think this is the case.

In fact I seem to remember a story from earlier this season where the Braves Jeff Francoeur got sent down to get some work with a familiar hitting coach and before he made it to the airport he was recalled because of an injury to someone else. So that situation would indicate that this is not an issue ... but again, I'm not positive if there is a rule on that or not.

Foulke You
08-14-2008, 06:48 PM
Richard would is insurance to gobble up innings in a blow out/long relief type scenario so we can rest the more important arms in the bullpen.
I agree. The move makes sense. I also think that Clayton Richard might be able to thrive in the 1 or 2 inning bullpen role more than being a starter. He gets up there and throws strikes. I can see him being a solid long reliever/loogy in the future.

Adele_H
08-14-2008, 06:49 PM
Completely disagree. Konerko doesn't botch the ball in 1st inning....he allows only 1 run...maybe none. Probably goes another inning as well.

I roasted Konerko in the Post-game thread for that defensive miscue...

BUT IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE FACT THAT IT WAS A BATTING PRACTICE QUALITY PITCH THAT MIKE AVILES HIT HARD, AND IF WEREN'T FOR KONERKO GUARDING THE BAG WITH RUNNER AT 1ST BASE, IT'S A DOUBLE DOWN RF LINE.

And it works both ways: if Uribe and Ramirez don't make good defensive plays behind him, Broadway allows a couple more runs easy.

Pitch-for-pitch, Clayton Richard looked better in his White Sox debut than Broadway did. Yes, Broadway did settle in after Sox gave him the lead, but prior to that he was awful - pitching like this against Texas, Broadway may not make it out of the 2nd inning.

.

Daver
08-14-2008, 06:50 PM
Once your demoted, isn't there a certain amount of days you have to stay with that team before getting promoted again?


No.

He could be recalled tomorrow if the team chooses to do that.

DickAllen72
08-14-2008, 06:51 PM
Once your demoted, isn't there a certain amount of days you have to stay with that team before getting promoted again?
Yes. I believe it's 10 days, but I'm not certain.

Tragg
08-14-2008, 06:54 PM
Richard would is insurance to gobble up innings in a blow out/long relief type scenario so we can rest the more important arms in the bullpen.

I would think Broadway would be back up to start on Tuesday vs. Seattle. After that, they may not need a 5th starter until September 2nd at Cleveland.
Re Broadway - Did they hit the ball hard off of him? Did he have good control? Hit corners? Trying to make my way through divergent opinions.

The thing I like about Richard he showed that he can be really good. His good pitching was really good (shut out the Twins for 4 or 5 innings with several Ks, e.g.). Just for the future.

Daver
08-14-2008, 06:54 PM
Yes. I believe it's 10 days, but I'm not certain.

That is incorrect.

A player on the forty man roster can be added or subtracted to the 25 man roster at anytime without penalty. You run into issues with players that are not on the forty man roster.

Adele_H
08-14-2008, 07:00 PM
Re Broadway - Did they hit the ball hard off of him? Did he have good control? Hit corners? Trying to make my way through divergent opinions.

The thing I like about Richard he showed that he can be really good. Some really good potential there. Just for the future.


For most of the game, Broadway did not have the stuff, nor control I expected him to have after a good (if garbage time-ish) outing he had with the Sox in 2007. IMO, he was bailed out by slumping Royals offense that couldn't touch either Buerhle or Vazquez if you gave them 5 outs each inning.

Richard? In his Texas start, and first 4 innings of the game in The Metrodome, he looked good, not flawless by any means, but good.... But something in him seemed to break when Justin Morneau smoked him in the 5th inning - cuz in Kansas City, Richard was **** personified.

Harry Potter
08-14-2008, 07:05 PM
Going into today's game we had 11 arms and 14 bats.

I'm guessing Broadway was the one to go, rather then the more obvious candidate IMO, Wise, since we all know by now that Wise is without options so he'd have to clear waivers.

Face it, we all know that Richard wasn't recalled to be the 5th starter.

Noneck
08-14-2008, 07:12 PM
This is a nice move. The option was already used on Broadway and Richard so this way you get use out of both. Flip flop after each Broadway start till 9/1.

LoveYourSuit
08-14-2008, 07:38 PM
Don't we have a mop up guy in Russell?


I think it would be nice to bring up a quality pen arm instead of another mop man.

anewman35
08-14-2008, 07:41 PM
I think it would be nice to bring up a quality pen arm instead of another mop man.

Do you have a name in mind?

Oldfellah
08-14-2008, 07:42 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.



Thanks for all your dark cloud postings... You've won "first place on my ignore list"... Thanks to your post here and other threads, you've made me figure out how to work the damn thing!! Thank you,,, buh-bye now!

Sox_UofI
08-14-2008, 07:51 PM
Thanks for all your dark cloud postings... You've won "first place on my ignore list"... Thanks to your post here and other threads, you've made me figure out how to work the damn thing!! Thank you,,, buh-bye now!

I'm nearing that stage with BigP50. 144 posts in one day?

Brian26
08-14-2008, 07:51 PM
That is incorrect.

A player on the forty man roster can be added or subtracted to the 25 man roster at anytime without penalty. You run into issues with players that are not on the forty man roster.

The other misconception is that this might use up all of Broadway's options, which is completely untrue. The Sox could call him up and send him down 50 times this year. A guy like Broadway has unlimited options since he's been on the 40-man for less than three years.

soxinem1
08-14-2008, 08:12 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

What game did you watch or listen to? This guy threw 55 pitches in the first two innings, had crummy defense behind him in the first, and still pitched into the sixth.

He battled, showed stones, and put up a solid effort, and should be left in the rotation. Even with the off days, I'm sure the current four could use an extra day rest here and there.

russ99
08-14-2008, 08:16 PM
I roasted Konerko in the Post-game thread for that defensive miscue...

BUT IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE FACT THAT IT WAS A BATTING PRACTICE QUALITY PITCH THAT MIKE AVILES HIT HARD, AND IF WEREN'T FOR KONERKO GUARDING THE BAG WITH RUNNER AT 1ST BASE, IT'S A DOUBLE DOWN RF LINE.

And it works both ways: if Uribe and Ramirez don't make good defensive plays behind him, Broadway allows a couple more runs easy.

Pitch-for-pitch, Clayton Richard looked better in his White Sox debut than Broadway did. Yes, Broadway did settle in after Sox gave him the lead, but prior to that he was awful - pitching like this against Texas, Broadway may not make it out of the 2nd inning.

.
Richard was leaving pitches over the plate his last start, big time. I attune a lot of Lance's first inning to first-start jitters.

Broadway was a bit off on his 2-seamer or cutter or whatever that upper-80's pitch he has that breaks in on righties at the last minute, (he was a bit more off with his slider too) which led to many high counts. If he can get that pitch over for strikes, he'll be a lot more dominant than Richard could be.

He definitely earned another start, but let's see if Kenny gets us a major leaguer within the next 5 days.

Adam looked great out there today, even though it was mop-up duty. Can't wait to see him with another year under his belt.

Adele_H
08-14-2008, 08:34 PM
Thanks for all your dark cloud postings...


:rolling:



Nice try, Sky is Rising :tsk:

Adele_H
08-14-2008, 08:42 PM
He definitely earned another start

Oh he definately hung in there whereas the likes of Arnie Munoz, Felix Diaz, etc would have likely fallen apart. At the end of the day, it's all about results - and they alone earned Broadway at least another start.

But his next start(s) better come with a realization that he needs to be better across the board, or his next opponent may not be quite as forgiving as KC were this whole series long.

(No I agree Richard had nothing in his start in KC, neither did Buerhle for that matter. But his start against Texas I was referring to, he was working quickly, attacked hitters and showed better fastball & off-speed stuff than I thought he would have.)

dickallen15
08-14-2008, 08:49 PM
Yes. I believe it's 10 days, but I'm not certain.
You are right, its 10 days, but there are exceptions. Replacing an injured player or a player on the bereavement list, or a player suspended for drugs are a few. Also if you get traded your new team doesn't have to wait the 10 days. Those are the exceptions I know about.

TDog
08-14-2008, 09:49 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

He pitched 5.1 innings and gave up two runs, which wasn't as good as Danks the other day who was spectacular and gave up two runs in seven innings. I don't have tremendous faith in stats, but Broadway did his job. The coaching staff has a much better idea of Broadway's pluses and minuses today than fans watching the game, and coaches will work with him. One of the problems with scouting young pitchers is that they haven't established themselves from start to start. You can scout what they do, but you can't scout what they're working to improve.

A lot of people here believed the Sox should have traded for Byrd, who should be expected to be mediocre at best, and is on the downside of his career. People would be raving if Byrd had come in for the Sox and gave up two runs in five innings while looking hittable on television. If Carrasco had started, a lot of people would be happy with two runs in five innings, and he wouldn't be available in the upcoming Oakland series.

As for sending Broadway down, it is a smart personnel move to try to keep pressure off the bullpen. Broadway will need four day's rest before he can pitch again. They have the luxury of being able to him up and down in the system as needed. By moving him off the active roster, they can call up a relief pitcher to put at the back of the pen. They don't have a deep pen at the moment, although Jenks, Carrasco, Dotel, Thornton and Ramirez haven't been extended lately and should be counted on. Russell pitched two innings today, and someone else is needed at the back of the pen.

The A's used six relievers today, even using Street in extra innings. It's possible the A's won't even need to go to their bullpen tomorrow night against the Sox, but the Sox pen should be fresher going into the game. Part of the key to having an effective bullpen (3.2 scoreless innings today -- 2 scoreless innings from Russell) is keeping relievers well rested.

FireMariotti
08-14-2008, 09:57 PM
I'm nearing that stage with BigP50. 144 posts in one day?

You just joined WSI and your only two comments are about how much this other guy posts. I dunno, something about this smells.

ChiSox89
08-14-2008, 10:12 PM
i believe that lance will end up being a very good 2 or 3 starter in the future with the sox

gogosox16
08-14-2008, 10:14 PM
i believe that lance will end up being a very good 2 or 3 starter in the future with the sox
I really like Lance but I doubt he will ever develop into a 2-3 starter. I believe that he just doesnt have the stuff to make him a 2-3. I believe he will be a big part of this teams future but as a 4-5 starter.

Adele_H
08-14-2008, 10:18 PM
He pitched 5.1 innings and gave up two runs, which wasn't as good as Danks the other day who was spectacular and gave up two runs in seven innings.

I stopped reading after that out of fear that you were going to say that Broadway outpitched Danks because got a Win and not a Loss. You probably won't but that's a chance I am not going to take as I respect your opinion too much.

Suffice it to say, I don't think Broadway's best pitch today was as good as Dank's worst pitch - the game-loser to JD Drew - in his "losing" effort

Much smarter/more talented Boston hitters would have crushed Broadway the way he pitched today.

DickAllen72
08-14-2008, 10:29 PM
You are right, its 10 days, but there are exceptions. Replacing an injured player or a player on the bereavement list, or a player suspended for drugs are a few. Also if you get traded your new team doesn't have to wait the 10 days. Those are the exceptions I know about.
That's what I thought. I believe the ten day rule is there for exactly this reason. They don't want a team to keep calling up a pitcher for one day to start then send him back after the game only to keep calling him back every fifth day. It would kind of make a mockery of the 25 man roster rule.

champagne030
08-14-2008, 10:41 PM
You are right, its 10 days, but there are exceptions. Replacing an injured player or a player on the bereavement list, or a player suspended for drugs are a few. Also if you get traded your new team doesn't have to wait the 10 days. Those are the exceptions I know about.

I thought this was the rule.

Daver, Are you sure about the 40 man roster rule? That doesn't seem correct to me, but I could be very wrong.

Edit: Sorry, DA72, I guess you just brought this question up........

Daver
08-14-2008, 10:55 PM
I thought this was the rule.

Daver, Are you sure about the 40 man roster rule? That doesn't seem correct to me, but I could be very wrong.

Edit: Sorry, DA72, I guess you just brought this question up........

I have not double checked the current CBA, but in the previous CBA a player on the forty man roster could be moved on and off the 25 man roster at the teams whim. This was done to give teams flexibility of their rosters in order to avoid signing and waiving multiple players and falling into a luxury tax situation.

TDog
08-14-2008, 11:00 PM
I stopped reading after that out of fear that you were going to say that Broadway outpitched Danks because got a Win and not a Loss. You probably won't but that's a chance I am not going to take as I respect your opinion too much.

Suffice it to say, I don't think Broadway's best pitch today was as good as Dank's worst pitch - the game-loser to JD Drew - in his "losing" effort

Much smarter/more talented Boston hitters would have crushed Broadway the way he pitched today.

You can go ahead and read my post. Considering that Danks and Broadway each gave up two earned runs in their most recent outings, and some would argue that at least one of the Broadway earned runs should have been unearned, the comparable stats could even be considered an indictment on the unreliability of earned run average as well as wins and losses to gauge a pitcher's effectiveness. Obviously, Danks pitched a better game against a better team. But Broadway did what was asked of him, probably as well as Carrasco would have done and probably better than -- outrageously speaking hypothetically -- Byrd would have done.

I doubt Broadway would have started the game against Boston if Contreras had not been ready to go Saturday. The fact that Carrasco pitched in long relief -- when he had been an important late-inning reliever and Broadway was down in the pen after starting in the minors -- supports that premise.

By the way, the Royals had been hitting well before visiting Chicago. At home they hit very well against the White Sox while winning two of three recently. More recently, they outhit the Twins while losing two of three. Sox fans only looked at the scores last weekend, but the Royals played the Twins tough before coming into Chicago and scoring two runs in 27 innings.

102605
08-14-2008, 11:21 PM
This is a nice move. The option was already used on Broadway and Richard so this way you get use out of both. Flip flop after each Broadway start till 9/1.

I hope Broadway has frequent flyer miles!

Gammons Peter
08-14-2008, 11:33 PM
I hope Broadway has frequent flyer miles!


He doesn't actually have to fly to Charlotte does he? Can't he just stay in Chicago until the team gets back. Whats the point in having him fly there, do nothing for 4 or 5 days and then fly back (if that's the plan for him to pitch in the 5 spot again)

cards press box
08-14-2008, 11:42 PM
Did you watch the game today? Broadway was mediocre, at best.

I was at the game today and I thought that Broadway threw the ball well. He was a little shaky in the 1st inning (jitters?) but, after that, he had the sinker working and was getting a lot of ground outs.

If the Sox can get 7 or so more starts like that, the Sox will be in fine shape. Moreover, if the Sox make the playoffs, Broadway can be the long man in the pen, as the Sox would likely go with a playoff rotation of Buerhle, Floyd, Danks and Vazquez.

doublem23
08-14-2008, 11:49 PM
I roasted Konerko in the Post-game thread for that defensive miscue...

BUT IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE FACT THAT IT WAS A BATTING PRACTICE QUALITY PITCH THAT MIKE AVILES HIT HARD, AND IF WEREN'T FOR KONERKO GUARDING THE BAG WITH RUNNER AT 1ST BASE, IT'S A DOUBLE DOWN RF LINE.

And it works both ways: if Uribe and Ramirez don't make good defensive plays behind him, Broadway allows a couple more runs easy.

Pitch-for-pitch, Clayton Richard looked better in his White Sox debut than Broadway did. Yes, Broadway did settle in after Sox gave him the lead, but prior to that he was awful - pitching like this against Texas, Broadway may not make it out of the 2nd inning.

.

Crucifiy a guy after 102 pitches... Classic WSI overreaction. :rolleyes:

I forgot these guys are machines and therefore silly things like "human emotion" don't mean anything.

Optipessimism
08-14-2008, 11:57 PM
Going into today's game we had 11 arms and 14 bats.

I'm guessing Broadway was the one to go, rather then the more obvious candidate IMO, Wise, since we all know by now that Wise is without options so he'd have to clear waivers.

Face it, we all know that Richard wasn't recalled to be the 5th starter.
Wise went through waivers unclaimed earlier in the year and accepted his assignment to Triple A, so there's no need to put him on waivers again. The Sox can send him up and down freely.

It's still a wonder why they haven't sent him down. We have 6 OF's, and he's the least important one, plus we have Alexei who can play CF. So that's 7 OF... err, that's actually 8 OF as Chris Getz can run around out there too. So really, since Getz is more versatile and also has value as a pinch runner, Wise is our 8th most valuable OF. Let's send him down for a pitcher already. This is stupid.

Plus, I was wondering if anyone knew, why did the Sox have to send Broadway back to Charlotte? Couldn't he have just traveled with the team? Extras do it in the playoffs and DL'ed players do it during the season without being on the active roster. If the Sox are going to call him back up then you know they've given orders to Charlotte's management not to use him no matter what, so why make him sit in Charlotte when he could be sitting in Chicago with the rest of the team? Does he have bad breath? Excessive gas? It just seems unnecessary to me.

Adele_H
08-15-2008, 12:25 AM
Crucifiy a guy after 102 pitches... Classic WSI overreaction. :rolleyes:



"Crucify"? Classic "Classic WSI overreaction" uber-overreactionspeak, right back a'cha. :rolleyes:

Look. It's not my fault that Lance Broadway sucked today, for the most part. It's not my fault he sucked in AAA for a while now, either.

Maybe next start he'll pitch like Brandon MaCarthy in Boston, Texas in September of 2005 - and we'll all rejoice.

Don't take criticism of the players so personally. Lance Broadway is not the entire Chicago White Sox; thankfully there were other guys like Dye, Uribe, Thome, Junior out there today who made sure all of us had something to celebrate. :bandance:

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 12:28 AM
"Crucify"? Classic "Classic WSI overreaction" uber-overreactionspeak, right back a'cha. :rolleyes:

Look. It's not my fault that Lance Broadway sucked today, for the most part. It's not my fault he sucked in AAA for a while now, either.

Maybe next start he'll pitch like Brandon MaCarthy in Boston, Texas in September of 2005 - and we'll all rejoice.

Don't take criticism of the players so personally. Lance Broadway is not the entire Chicago White Sox; thankfully there were other guys like Dye, Uribe, Thome, Junior out there today who made sure all of us had something to celebrate. :bandance:

I think it's the fact that you are saying he "sucked" today. He might not have had the greatest line, but he was far from sucking.

Adele_H
08-15-2008, 12:41 AM
I think it's the fact that you are saying he "sucked" today. He might not have had the greatest line, but he was far from sucking.

'Sucked' may have been a strong word, but to me he had the perfect mixture of underwhelming stuff & poor command for a good stretch earlier in the game. There is a reason why he didn't strike anybody out until, what, the 6th inning. And it's not because he has a crazy turbo-sinker, either.

He did okay in latter innings after Sox gave him the lead, but the way he pitched earlier, a more experience/hotter/more talented team than the Royals would have made sure he didn't see the middle innings, in the first place.

In 2007 cup'o'coffee start, Broadway looked like a major leaguer. Today he looked like dare I say it, taller Felix Diaz but with even less velocity. Here's hoping he improves in his next start and cements his spot in the Sox rotation for years to come. There.

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 12:47 AM
'Sucked' may have been a strong word, but to me he had the perfect mixture of underwhelming stuff & poor command for a good stretch earlier in the game. There is a reason why he didn't strike anybody out until, what, the 6th inning.

He did okay in latter innings after Sox gave him the lead, but the way he pitched earlier, a more experience/hotter/more talented team than the Royals would have made sure he didn't see the middle innings, in the first place.

In 2007 cup'o'coffee start, Broadway looked like a major leaguer. Today he looked like dare I say it, taller Felix Diaz but with even less velocity. Here's hoping he improves in his next start and cements his spot in the Sox rotation for years to come. There.

I agree his stuff wasn't very sharp at all today. I've seen him have better stuff before though. I'd like to see him make a start another start. He kept us in the game with average stuff. I mean we basically did give him 3 extra outs. That's a whole inning which is also about 15 extra pitches. Until he shows me this is all he has, I'm going to chalk it up as worksman like performance.

doublem23
08-15-2008, 12:49 AM
I think it's the fact that you are saying he "sucked" today. He might not have had the greatest line, but he was far from sucking.

No, he just obviously knows more than the rest of us.

Our eyes are deceiving us!

gf2020
08-15-2008, 01:20 AM
According to Cowley in the Sun Times (http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/1109084,CST-SPT-sox15.article):

COPYRIGHTED TEXT

hi im skot
08-15-2008, 01:41 AM
And it works both ways: if Uribe and Ramirez don't make good defensive plays behind him, Broadway allows a couple more runs easy.


You could play this game with just about any starting pitcher in baseball.

"If player A doesn't make a great play, the pitcher gives up two runs, blah blah blah."

Broadway looked good, at least good enough to get the win. Case closed.

Mohoney
08-15-2008, 02:07 AM
Somebody please just answer this question:

Is Broadway starting the game on Tuesday against the Mariners?

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 02:13 AM
Somebody please just answer this question:

Is Broadway starting the game on Tuesday against the Mariners?

No.

Mohoney
08-15-2008, 02:26 AM
No.

Who is getting that start? If it's Richard, I wholeheartedly disagree with the decision.

Broadway put 4 zeros on the scoreboard today after the rocky 1st inning. That alone earns him another start in my book.

Who else in our system is capable of doing that in the 5th starter role?

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 02:27 AM
Who is getting that start? If it's Richard, I wholeheartedly disagree with the decision.

Broadway put 4 zeros on the scoreboard today after the rocky 1st inning. That alone earns him another start in my book.

Who else in our system is capable of doing that in the 5th starter role?

I have no idea who they are planning on starting. I'm just pretty sure that he has to stay in AAA for 10 days before being recalled again.

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 02:36 AM
Has Richard officially been called up?

Chilli Palmer
08-15-2008, 03:13 AM
For most of the game, Broadway did not have the stuff, nor control I expected him to have after a good (if garbage time-ish) outing he had with the Sox in 2007. IMO, he was bailed out by slumping Royals offense that couldn't touch either Buerhle or Vazquez if you gave them 5 outs each inning.

Richard? In his Texas start, and first 4 innings of the game in The Metrodome, he looked good, not flawless by any means, but good.... But something in him seemed to break when Justin Morneau smoked him in the 5th inning - cuz in Kansas City, Richard was **** personified.

Was he now?

The Immigrant
08-15-2008, 09:29 AM
Somebody please just answer this question:

Is Broadway starting the game on Tuesday against the Mariners?

My bet is that Buehrle starts on Tuesday and we skip the 5th spot the next two times through the rotation. Broadway will be back by the time we need a 5th starter again.

...or KW may have lost his mind and has decided to give Richard the next start over Broadway. :wink:

oeo
08-15-2008, 09:45 AM
My bet is that Buehrle starts on Tuesday and we skip the 5th spot the next two times through the rotation. Broadway will be back by the time we need a 5th starter again.

...or KW may have lost his mind and has decided to give Richard the next start over Broadway. :wink:

Buehrle is set to start on Monday.

I'd rather we not skip the 5th starter's spot, anyway. It doesn't bother me that Buehrle and Javy would be getting worked, but I think Danks and Floyd are going to need all the rest they can get. I just hope we don't get to the final two weeks of the season and Danks and/or Gavin are too fatigued.

If Broadway can give us 5-6 innings of 4 run ball every time out, that's fine. Just eat up some innings and keep us in the ballgame, is all I ask. Richard hasn't been able to do that in any of his starts.

doublem23
08-15-2008, 09:46 AM
Buehrle is set to start on Monday.

Yeah, they're going to need someone else for Tuesday.

KW better have something up his sleeve, because right now I don't understand this move. :scratch:

patbooyah
08-15-2008, 09:53 AM
Somebody please just answer this question:

Is Broadway starting the game on Tuesday against the Mariners?

I'm 100% sure that a player sent to the minors needs to remain there for 10 days unless someone on the 25-man roster who plays said player's position is put on the DL.

Broadway will be available to be recalled if the White Sox put a pitcher on the disabled list prior to Tuesday's game.

If they don't, the Sox will use a spot starter unless they want Floyd pitching on three days' rest.

My educated guess would be that Carrasco will pitch on the 19th, and that combined with the off day will allow for Broadway to miss just one start before being called back up to pitch in the double(half)header on the 25th.

cws05champ
08-15-2008, 10:00 AM
I'm 100% sure that a player sent to the minors needs to remain there for 10 days unless someone on the 25-man roster who plays said player's position is put on the DL.

Broadway will be available to be recalled if the White Sox put a pitcher on the disabled list prior to Tuesday's game.

If they don't, the Sox will use a spot starter unless they want Floyd pitching on three days' rest.

My educated guess would be that Carrasco will pitch on the 19th, and that combined with the off day will allow for Broadway to miss just one start before being called back up to pitch in the double(half)header on the 25th.
I don't think you have to be down for 10 days. If you recall eariler this year Jeff Francouer was sent down and recalled the same day, or next day. He got to airport and was recalled because of an injury. I bet Broadway comes back up for Tuesday, and then they go with 4 starters the next two weeks because of the off days(starts can go on normal rest).

White City
08-15-2008, 10:15 AM
I don't think you have to be down for 10 days. If you recall eariler this year Jeff Francouer was sent down and recalled the same day, or next day. He got to airport and was recalled because of an injury. I bet Broadway comes back up for Tuesday, and then they go with 4 starters the next two weeks because of the off days(starts can go on normal rest).

That's the key phrase.

patbooyah
08-15-2008, 10:22 AM
I don't think you have to be down for 10 days. If you recall eariler this year Jeff Francouer was sent down and recalled the same day, or next day. He got to airport and was recalled because of an injury. I bet Broadway comes back up for Tuesday, and then they go with 4 starters the next two weeks because of the off days(starts can go on normal rest).

Yes, Francoeur was able to be recalled because the team placed Omar Infante on the disabled list.

Chez
08-15-2008, 10:24 AM
Right. Otherwise teams could carry 5 extra players (assuming they still have options left) and activate and deactivate players each night depending on pitching match ups or bullpen needs for the night.

White City
08-15-2008, 10:25 AM
So then which of our pitchers is going on the DL? Clayton Richard, maybe? That would be weird.

patbooyah
08-15-2008, 10:36 AM
So then which of our pitchers is going on the DL? Clayton Richard, maybe? That would be weird.

If the Sox do end up putting a pitcher on the disabled list so that Broadway can return, I imagine it would be someone of the Adam Russell variety (or maybe Richard if he winds up being called up on Friday). They could declare Russell/Richard has shoulder "soreness," put him on the DL, and recall Broadway to start next week. That would get them an extra pitcher in the bullpen for the next 3-4 games.

However, it's certainly not a sure thing, or even likely that the Sox would pursue such a route.

The Dodgers are doing a similar thing with Delwyn Young and Andruw Jones right now - they have VERY questionable injuries that conveniently allow for both players to be left on the roster until the team can expand its rosters in September.

Harry Potter
08-15-2008, 10:46 AM
IMO, Wise is "injured"

southside rocks
08-15-2008, 11:02 AM
The last paragraph in today's Sun-Times story notes that Broadway will have to spend 10 days in the minors, per MLB rules, which means that the Sox are looking for a starter for the next #5 turn in the rotation.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/1109084,CST-SPT-sox15.article

Also, Ozzie spoke very highly of Broadway and his starting effort yesterday, in the post-game press conference. I guess Ozzie just doesn't have the baseball acumen and discerning eye of some WSI posters.

UofCSoxFan
08-15-2008, 11:13 AM
I was definitely in the camp that we needed another starter, even before Jose went down, but I think Broadway did just fine. If we could get that effort from our fifth starter each time I'd be ecstatic.

I think we've been spoiled with 5 above average to very good pitchers here for awhile. Typically from a fifth starter, if you can have him go 6 innings, to save your pen a bit, and keep the game close to give your team a chance to win, he's done his job. This is espeicially true when it works out that your 5 is going against the other teams 1, which seems to happen a fair amount.

Again, it looks like we need another starter on the 19th. After that, with days off, I don't think we'll need a fifth starter until September 3 but with few off days in September, we will probably need at least 4 starts from that spot in that month.

wulfy
08-15-2008, 11:19 AM
I'm nearing that stage with BigP50. 144 posts in one day?

That's about 6 years of posting for me.

gogosox16
08-15-2008, 05:20 PM
It's official. Clayton Richard recalled:

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20080815&content_id=3313600&vkey=pr_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

thomas35forever
08-15-2008, 06:09 PM
It's official. Clayton Richard recalled:

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20080815&content_id=3313600&vkey=pr_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws
Let's hope he's not used this weekend unless it's an emergency.

anewman35
08-15-2008, 06:10 PM
Let's hope he's not used this weekend unless it's an emergency.

Or a blowout (in our favor).

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 06:37 PM
Can someone help me understand these moves. Guillen said he was sending down Broadway to have an extra reliever for the weekend series against Oakland. Then he calls up another starter from AAA. There were no off days from Friday-Tuesday, so we will still need a 5th starter on Tuesday. So someone from the pen is going to have to start which elimates a reliever for the weekend anyway. Unless he is going to have someone pitch in relief and start on Tuesday, which by no means softens the workload of the bullpen.

If he is simply just sending down Broadway in favor of Richard being our 5th starter I understand, but that is not what Guillen said

Optipessimism
08-15-2008, 06:54 PM
This is a lot of maneuvering just to keep Dewayne Wise on this team. ***, Ozzie?

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 06:57 PM
This is a lot of maneuvering just to keep Dewayne Wise on this team. ***, Ozzie?

That was exactly the point I was getting to. If you want an extra reliever, send down Wise, not our 5th starter.

anewman35
08-15-2008, 06:59 PM
Can someone help me understand these moves. Guillen said he was sending down Broadway to have an extra reliever for the weekend series against Oakland. Then he calls up another starter from AAA. There were no off days from Friday-Tuesday, so we will still need a 5th starter on Tuesday. So someone from the pen is going to have to start which elimates a reliever for the weekend anyway. Unless he is going to have someone pitch in relief and start on Tuesday, which by no means softens the workload of the bullpen.

If he is simply just sending down Broadway in favor of Richard being our 5th starter I understand, but that is not what Guillen said

Just because Richard started in AAA doesn't mean he has to start here. He might just be up to make sure the pen is full for the weekend, and then we'll worry about the 5th starter when it comes up. I also saw somewhere that there was a chance they'd start him in one of the games this weekend because they think it would be a favorable matchup.

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 08:03 PM
Just because Richard started in AAA doesn't mean he has to start here. He might just be up to make sure the pen is full for the weekend, and then we'll worry about the 5th starter when it comes up. I also saw somewhere that there was a chance they'd start him in one of the games this weekend because they think it would be a favorable matchup.

Where in my post did I say he had to start because he started in AAA?

How do you just worry about the 5th starter when it comes up? It's only 5 days away. It is going to affect the bullpen regardless.

WhiteSoxBlog
08-15-2008, 08:21 PM
This is a lot of maneuvering just to keep Dewayne Wise on this team. ***, Ozzie?
I agree. When they didn't send him down when they got Griffey it was okay because everything seemed stable in the pen, Contreras was coming back, whatever. It was ridiculous, but it was acceptable. Now it's bordering on insane. This move seems SO OBVIOUS. I mean, even if they think Wise is better than BA, send BA, don't send Broadway. I'll take a starting pitcher over a 5th/6th/(17th/however many outfielders we have nowadays) outfielder any day. What am I missing here? It doesn't add up to anything that makes sense. :scratch:

anewman35
08-15-2008, 08:51 PM
How do you just worry about the 5th starter when it comes up? It's only 5 days away. It is going to affect the bullpen regardless.

You play to win the next few games, pitching who you need to pitch. If we can save somebody for Tuesday (Carrasco or Richard, I'd assume), great. If you have to use them, call up whoever is scheduled to go at Charlotte or Birmingham (it's not as if they could be much worse than Richard has been in his starts).

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 08:54 PM
You play to win the next few games, pitching who you need to pitch. If we can save somebody for Tuesday (Carrasco or Richard, I'd assume), great. If you have to use them, call up whoever is scheduled to go at Charlotte or Birmingham (it's not as if they could be much worse than Richard has been in his starts).

I don't agree with that at all. Anyways, Guillen said he wanted to take some stress off the bullpen. I don't know how playing to win and scrambling to find pitchers is going to take any stress off the bullpen. Guillen should have let Broadway makes his next scheduled start, and sent down Wise to actually have an extra arm.

Frater Perdurabo
08-15-2008, 09:02 PM
IIRC Wise would have to clear waivers in order to be sent down.

I'm not sure he should get CF starts over BA, but he is about the best pinch runner they've got on the team.

anewman35
08-15-2008, 09:10 PM
I don't agree with that at all. Anyways, Guillen said he wanted to take some stress off the bullpen. I don't know how playing to win and scrambling to find pitchers is going to take any stress off the bullpen. Guillen should have let Broadway makes his next scheduled start, and sent down Wise to actually have an extra arm.

So you'd be ok with losing a game tomorrow because we used Russell in a key situtation because we were saving Carrasco for Tuesday?

Daver
08-15-2008, 09:12 PM
IIRC Wise would have to clear waivers in order to be sent down.

I'm not sure he should get CF starts over BA, but he is about the best pinch runner they've got on the team.

I don't think even Ozzie believes that, since Brian is usually picked to pinch run.

dickallen15
08-15-2008, 09:17 PM
IIRC Wise would have to clear waivers in order to be sent down.

I'm not sure he should get CF starts over BA, but he is about the best pinch runner they've got on the team.
Wise cleared waivers earlier this year. The Sox could send him down anytime without risk of losing him.

2906
08-15-2008, 09:31 PM
Wise cleared waivers earlier this year. The Sox could send him down anytime without risk of losing him.

How would they send him down? He's out of options, so they can't option him. They'd have to outright him, meaning off the 40 man roster. It seems they don't want to do that.

Konerko05
08-15-2008, 09:33 PM
So you'd be ok with losing a game tomorrow because we used Russell in a key situtation because we were saving Carrasco for Tuesday?

Why are we losing a game tomorrow? I'd be more worried about losing Tuesday's game when we don't have a starter.

2906
08-15-2008, 09:43 PM
Why are we losing a game tomorrow? I'd be more worried about losing Tuesday's game when we don't have a starter.

We'll see if Egbert gets his scheduled start tomorrow in AAA. He last pitched on Monday 8/11. He's already on the 40 man, they can easily swap out Clayton Richard with Egbert. They need some bullpen cushion for this weekend so I can see what they're doing.

But you are right, the situation for Tuesday is up in the air. If Charlotte scratches Egbert tomorrow night, look for him to get the call.