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Rockabilly
08-13-2008, 06:48 PM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/chi-080813-chicago-cubs-atlanta-braves,1,2628473.story


Soriano is such a loser..

Frontman
08-13-2008, 07:29 PM
That he may be, but there is absolutely no reason for throwing at a man's head. I see no place for it in baseball, as someone could get seriously hurt that way. Cub player or otherwise, if you condone it to be done to anyone; you can't cry foul if Quentin gets plunked in the face and misses two to four weeks with a broken orbital socket.

chaerulez
08-13-2008, 07:32 PM
I never understood why players assume a HR like that. Especially MLB power hitters who you'd think after blasting 200+ shots they know when they hit a HR or it might be close. What Soriano did was lame, but no reason to hit a guy in the head, aim for someones side torso area, nothing can really get damaged there except for a bruise.

It's Dankerific
08-13-2008, 07:39 PM
Has anyone actually seen the pitch? Not that I don't trust the fair and unbiased writings of the tribune...

Gavin
08-13-2008, 08:05 PM
That he may be, but there is absolutely no reason for throwing at a man's head. I see no place for it in baseball, as someone could get seriously hurt that way. Cub player or otherwise, if you condone it to be done to anyone; you can't cry foul if Quentin gets plunked in the face and misses two to four weeks with a broken orbital socket.

Wrong. Daver says he once saw a guy take like 8 in a row in the head and he deserved every one.

SoxSpeed22
08-13-2008, 08:37 PM
Wrong. Daver says he once saw a guy take like 8 in a row in the head and he deserved every one.Soriano did deserve to get thrown at with the way he showed the Braves up, but I don't think that deserves a pitch to the head.
I think spiking knees deserves one, as well as going for the head on a home-plate collision. I'm more willing to hear the story from Daver though.

rocky biddle
08-13-2008, 09:12 PM
Paul Sullivan sucks at writing.

nccwsfan
08-13-2008, 09:44 PM
A pitcher doesn't have to throw the ball at the head to send a message...if it was intentional he should be suspended, period. There's never a justification for that. That said Soriano (and any other batter) needs to run the bases and stop showboating on an assumed HR.

Vernam
08-13-2008, 10:14 PM
Paul Sullivan sucks at writing.Are you "ceretain?" :wink:

Let's see, first Lou threatens to bench Fukudome, and now it's Soriano. As if. :rolleyes: Not that they don't deserve it.

Vernam

veeter
08-13-2008, 10:42 PM
All the cubs' shenanigans through the years are well documented. From Santo's heel clicking, to Sosa's crap, Dempsters stupid glove thingy and now Soriano's hopping and taunting. It's all added up to 100 years of bad carma. This will be just another year added to the pile.

1908<2005
08-13-2008, 10:53 PM
Has anyone actually seen the pitch? Not that I don't trust the fair and unbiased writings of the tribune...
It was clearly a purpose pitch

Vernam
08-13-2008, 10:56 PM
Just saw the highlights on BBTN. Kruk calling out Soriano. The apology is dubious, since he failed to run out another ball in the second game. What a POS.

Vernam

twentywontowin
08-13-2008, 10:58 PM
For retaliation, it should never be at the head.

Unless...they tried to purposely injure someone on your team, or your name is Delmon Young.

WhiteSox5187
08-13-2008, 11:14 PM
Wrong. Daver says he once saw a guy take like 8 in a row in the head and he deserved every one.
Daver said that the guy who was thrown at was just timing pitches in the on deck circle (something I've seen a number of major leaguers do).

It's funny though that now players have more protection than ever before at the plate (a good solid helmet, body armor (not literally)) and the subject of hitting guys has become ultra sensative. Bob Gibson and Don Drysdale were notorious head hunters, and they really could have killed somebody. I don't think anyone will get killed in today's game from a fastball to the head because of the helmet, but I still don't like it. Everytime a guy gets hit in the head in any sport I wince a little. I don't mind pitching a guy up and in to back him off the plate or to send a message, but to hit a guy square in the head, I don't like. I think it's much better to aim right for his numbers or ribs, you have a larger frame that way and it's harder to get out of the way. You won't do a whole lot of damage, but trust me, it still hurts. But I don't think it would hurt enough to make a guy think twice about staring at a homerun.


Also I think Dempster's glove thing doesn't belong on the same level as Santo's heel clicking or Sammy's hop. It's a bit distracting, but it's not showing off as the other guys were. It's like a guy having a screwy delievery. It might drive you nuts as a hitter, but the pitcher is just trying to give himself an advantage and I don't mind that.

doublem23
08-14-2008, 12:13 AM
That ball was meant to be inside, but you're really going to have a hard time making believe it was intended to be inside and that high.

KnightSox
08-14-2008, 12:55 AM
Just saw the highlights on BBTN. Kruk calling out Soriano. The apology is dubious, since he failed to run out another ball in the second game. What a POS.

VernamI made the mistake of watching WGN sports to see the story, no suprise that they totally omitted this story from the recap.

Domeshot17
08-14-2008, 01:05 AM
I know it shouldn't be done, When I pitched I always put it in the numbers on a guy. That said, sometimes you have to send a message. Daver's story, If you did not play very competitive baseball you might not understand, but leaving the On Deck Circle to move closer to the plate to time the pitcher is a big no no.

I also feel like if they throw at your players head, you do the same back. When I pitched I worried about protecting my guys first, and the other team second.

But, part of me thinks we have all gone soft. Clemens, Ryan, the others mentioned in this thread, all were head hunters. Heck, Pedro during his really dominant days was a head hunter.

UofCSoxFan
08-14-2008, 02:14 AM
I know it shouldn't be done, When I pitched I always put it in the numbers on a guy. That said, sometimes you have to send a message. Daver's story, If you did not play very competitive baseball you might not understand, but leaving the On Deck Circle to move closer to the plate to time the pitcher is a big no no.

I also feel like if they throw at your players head, you do the same back. When I pitched I worried about protecting my guys first, and the other team second.

But, part of me thinks we have all gone soft. Clemens, Ryan, the others mentioned in this thread, all were head hunters. Heck, Pedro during his really dominant days was a head hunter.

Domeshot, you always hear about how timing pitches was automatic grounds for being hit, but now it seems that if you do it from the ondeck circle, the practice is a lot more accepted. If you move close to the home plate area when the pitcher is warming up or throwing line, it is totally bush league still, however. Still it does not warrant throwing at a guy's head, no matter what Daver says. You can kill a guy doing that. Do people not remember when Ben Christenson from Witcha State blinded an Evansville player by hitting him with a throw in the head for timing balls on deck? Hit him in the numbers or lower and you send the message just fine.

This is still a game...you throw at a guy's head and hit him, you can ruin his life. It's complete bull**** to do so. I think when a guy gets hit anywhere but the head he should take the base. But when a guy throws at your head, all bets are off and you are justified in charging the mound. When I was playing, there were times that coming up to bat I was almost certain I was going to be hit by the pitch...and most of the time when I thought this I was right. Still I understood the reason why (it was b/c my own damn pitcher hit a few of their guys and I was first up) and since they didn't go high on me, I just took my base...had I been hit in the head, my reaction would have been different.

Another point, Soriano should be ashamed for disgracing the game. I love how Carlos Quintin sprints around the bases after a home run. He acts like he did it before and will do it again. No need to pose. And when you do it on a ball that falls short, you look like a complete asshat.

sullythered
08-14-2008, 04:36 AM
I know it shouldn't be done, When I pitched I always put it in the numbers on a guy. That said, sometimes you have to send a message. Daver's story, If you did not play very competitive baseball you might not understand, but leaving the On Deck Circle to move closer to the plate to time the pitcher is a big no no.

I also feel like if they throw at your players head, you do the same back. When I pitched I worried about protecting my guys first, and the other team second.

But, part of me thinks we have all gone soft. Clemens, Ryan, the others mentioned in this thread, all were head hunters. Heck, Pedro during his really dominant days was a head hunter.
Clemens and Ryan were both *******s. If somebody throws at your teammates head, punch them in the damn mouth. Nothing soft about that.

There's no excuse for throwing a baseball at anybody's head short of that person breaking in your house and coming at your family. A baseball moving at 90 miles an hour is a potentially deadly weapon.

WhiteSox5187
08-14-2008, 05:20 AM
I know it shouldn't be done, When I pitched I always put it in the numbers on a guy. That said, sometimes you have to send a message. Daver's story, If you did not play very competitive baseball you might not understand, but leaving the On Deck Circle to move closer to the plate to time the pitcher is a big no no.

I also feel like if they throw at your players head, you do the same back. When I pitched I worried about protecting my guys first, and the other team second.

But, part of me thinks we have all gone soft. Clemens, Ryan, the others mentioned in this thread, all were head hunters. Heck, Pedro during his really dominant days was a head hunter.
Pedro hit a lot of guys, but I don't remember him hitting a lot of guys in the head. Two examples come to mind, one was when he hit a guy on the Reds, Eric Davis, while he was in the middle of a perfect game and Davis charged the mound and later claimed "He threw it at my head." The other was to a Yankee in that game 3 of the 2003 ALCS that loaded the bases and someone on the Yankee bench started beefing and Pedro mouthed "Why would I want to do that? Use your head!" and he pointed to his head. Which some people thought he was threatening to hit the guy in the head. Then Roger threw a pitch up and in to Manny and that started the whole thing.

Bucky F. Dent
08-14-2008, 07:50 AM
I would have thrown at Soriano too, but not in the head.

oeo
08-14-2008, 10:09 AM
Paul Sullivan sucks at writing.

You could probably end that at 'sucks.'

I_Liked_Manuel
08-14-2008, 10:56 AM
it's pretty much impossible to defend throwing at somebody's head, but i have to admit that i thought it was humorous to watch randy johnson throw at kenny lofton's head every time he saw him - he did this because lofton broke up a no hitter with a bunt iirc

balke
08-14-2008, 11:14 AM
That ball was meant to be inside, but you're really going to have a hard time making believe it was intended to be inside and that high.

Well, when your head is in front of the catcher's face hovering over homeplate, because you lean so far inside... anything high and inside will look like headhunting. CQ gets plunked a lot for doing the same thing. It was a brush back pitch that didn't have enough control yesterday, and that's it. It just looked bad because Soriano leans so far inside he can't regain balance to get out of the way.

DrGiggles
08-14-2008, 05:32 PM
Does anyone have a video of the home run antics of Soriano or the pitch that was thrown at his head? I'm just curious.

kittle42
08-14-2008, 06:23 PM
Does anyone have a video of the home run antics of Soriano or the pitch that was thrown at his head? I'm just curious.

Yes. I have in fact watched it about 37 times since it occurred, studying every single aspect of it so that I can be the foremost expert on Alfonso Soriano's shortcomings.

I shall be issuing a report in the near future.