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View Full Version : Alexei Ramirez needs to be moved up


mcm3312
08-06-2008, 01:55 PM
I understand that this topic has been discussed before, but in light of our recent slump and our lack of room for error in the division I think this change definitely needs to be made.

Alexei is hitting .312 the best amongst our team. Its no longer a hot streak and he doesn't appear to be slowing down (Que last nights performance and some stat CSN flashed on the telecast about his average in the last 35 games).

It would be mathematically stupid to not have him hitting in the one or two spot. I think OC has done great things for us this year, but you cant argue with the numbers, and i cant help to wonder how much more we could've accomplished with Alexei on top of the order.

Also with Griffeys ability to take more pitches and work the counts better than AJ, I propose this lineup.
Ramirez
Griffey
Quentin
Dye
Thome
Cabrera
Pierzynski
Uribe
Swisher

*Flip flop AJ and Thome if it floats your boat, but with OC showing he's a .260's hitter and AJ's lack of patience, a change must be made for the playoff push

Also if anyone cares Ive emailed this post to Ozzie personally and definitely expect the changes to be implemented tonight

aryzner
08-06-2008, 01:59 PM
I think I would still put OC leading off and have Alexei batting in the 2 spot.

Adele_H
08-06-2008, 02:01 PM
I think I would still put OC leading off and have Alexei batting in the 2 spot.

too many righties up top

TomBradley72
08-06-2008, 02:02 PM
The way Alexei is hitting...I want him in a position to drive in runs...not leading off. Griffey needs to stay around the 7th slot or so. I'm tired of AJ at #2, and OC leading off...but I don't really see an alternative based on our starting line up.

mcm3312
08-06-2008, 02:02 PM
I would agree with OC and Alexei in the 1 2, but we all know ozzie isnt gonna start the order with 4 righties

soxfan123
08-06-2008, 02:09 PM
He has a tendency to swing at everything he sees, which is exactly what the leadoff hitter shouldn't be doing. I feel like he would be a great 2 hitter though with his ability to create momentum and get the big hit when runners are on base.

We have three legitimate two-hitters in Swisher, Cabrera, and Alexei, and you could argue Pierzynski I guess.

hawkjt
08-06-2008, 02:10 PM
I am not thrilled with OC as leadoff(too aggresive) but who is our grindiest batter? In order it is , Swish,TCQ,Junior, Thome,JD.

I would be open to Swish back at the top. Switch-hitter,check. Patient,check. High on base average,check.

So here goes:

Swish
OC
TCQ
JD
Thome
PK
Jr.
Alexei
AJ
Juan.

Not dying for any change but if it is shaken up...this is my two cents.
They have been scoring decently so maybe stand pat.

SoxNation05
08-06-2008, 02:59 PM
I am not thrilled with OC as leadoff(too aggresive) but who is our grindiest batter? In order it is , Swish,TCQ,Junior, Thome,JD.

I would be open to Swish back at the top. Switch-hitter,check. Patient,check. High on base average,check.

So here goes:

1 Swish
2OC
3TCQ
4JD
5Thome
6PK
7Jr.
8Alexei
9AJ
10Juan.

Not dying for any change but if it is shaken up...this is my two cents.
They have been scoring decently so maybe stand pat.
That won't happen.

nsdjoe
08-06-2008, 03:07 PM
That won't happen.
haha

CWSpalehoseCWS
08-06-2008, 03:08 PM
That won't happen.

Yeah, I doubt the league would allow the Sox to allow an extra man on the field.

balke
08-06-2008, 03:10 PM
I like him where he is right now. OC is good at the top, AJ is good at #2. There's a lot of OBP guys ahead of Alexei in the order, and he's making a lot of contact. He's a good person to have in that spot, because he isn't as much of a double play threat, and he's going to drive in runs.

LITTLE NELL
08-06-2008, 03:11 PM
Im a supporter of having the #2 guy batting from the left side, Id go with Griffey right now. Theres nothing wrong with having a high average hitter batting 7th or 8th. Alexei swings at too many pitches to bat 1st or 2nd right now.

jabrch
08-06-2008, 03:12 PM
Yeah, I doubt the league would allow the Sox to allow an extra man on the field.

I don't think Griffey is a good CF. But he would be a great RCF in a 4 man OF. Swish could play a mean LCF. That's amazing coverage we'd have...

lukeman89
08-06-2008, 03:12 PM
i think alexei should be hitting 6th. use his high average to knock our big OBP guys in.

OC
AJ
tCQ
Dye
Thome
Alexei
Junior
Konerko
Uribe

or when AJ gets the day off

OC
Swish/Junior
tCQ
Dye
Thome
Alexei
Junior/Konerko
Hall
Uribe

35th and Shields
08-06-2008, 04:38 PM
Im a supporter of having the #2 guy batting from the left side, Id go with Griffey right now. Theres nothing wrong with having a high average hitter batting 7th or 8th. Alexei swings at too many pitches to bat 1st or 2nd right now.

exactly. Alexei may be our leadoff hitter next season if OC goes but he doesn't work a lot of counts and that what you want from your leadoff hitter. Plus if you moved Alexei to the one spot, OC would move to two and AJ would have to move down.........too much unnecessary movement in an already productive lineup.

Jimmy Piersall
08-06-2008, 04:59 PM
I understand that this topic has been discussed before, but in light of our recent slump and our lack of room for error in the division I think this change definitely needs to be made.

Alexei is hitting .312 the best amongst our team. Its no longer a hot streak and he doesn't appear to be slowing down (Que last nights performance and some stat CSN flashed on the telecast about his average in the last 35 games).

It would be mathematically stupid to not have him hitting in the one or two spot. I think OC has done great things for us this year, but you cant argue with the numbers, and i cant help to wonder how much more we could've accomplished with Alexei on top of the order.

Also with Griffeys ability to take more pitches and work the counts better than AJ, I propose this lineup.
Ramirez
Griffey
Quentin
Dye
Thome
Cabrera
Pierzynski
Uribe
Swisher

*Flip flop AJ and Thome if it floats your boat, but with OC showing he's a .260's hitter and AJ's lack of patience, a change must be made for the playoff push

Also if anyone cares Ive emailed this post to Ozzie personally and definitely expect the changes to be implemented tonight

Let us know when Ozzie replies,and if it includes any bad words.:o:

turners56
08-06-2008, 05:01 PM
Let us know when Ozzie replies,and if it includes any bad words.:o:

Wouldn't it be nice to have Ozzie on these boards? xD.

Randar68
08-06-2008, 05:36 PM
I don't know how or if his numbers would change hitting elsewhere in the lineup, but Ramirez has been a ball of fire since he took over every-day duty at 2B on May 16th.

From May 16th through August 5th, Ramirez has the 5th highest BA in all of baseball and splits that look as follows:

253 AB
.340 Avg
0.888 OPS
10 HR

If he keeps that up for the last 1.5+ months of the year he will end up around .325-.330 with 17-18 HR's... Not sure even the Least Coast Networks can vote Longoria as ROY if that happens.

Adele_H
08-07-2008, 03:17 AM
I don't know how or if his numbers would change hitting elsewhere in the lineup, but Ramirez has been a ball of fire since he took over every-day duty at 2B on May 16th.

From May 16th through August 5th, Ramirez has the 5th highest BA in all of baseball and splits that look as follows:

253 AB
.340 Avg
0.888 OPS
10 HR

If he keeps that up for the last 1.5+ months of the year he will end up around .325-.330 with 17-18 HR's... Not sure even the Least Coast Networks can vote Longoria as ROY if that happens.

I am arguably Alexei's 12th or 15th biggest fan in the world (top-10 if you go by BCS ranking), and think he is a perennial all-star in the making...

But even I can tell you that you're setting yourself up for disappointment if you honestly believe anyone other than Longoria is winning AL RotY. (Barring a major meltdown or injury)

Between his offensive # put up while surrounded by utter dreck in Tampa, Gold Glove defense and good baserunning for a corner INF... National exposure in ASG, voting frenzy... Tampa's Cinderella factor...... It's in the bag.

Scottiehaswheels
08-07-2008, 03:22 AM
Wouldn't it be nice to have Ozzie on these boards? xD.I doubt he'd last long. I have a feeling he'd get banned in short order. :D:

Ziggy S
08-07-2008, 03:29 AM
Alexei needs a light saber, training from master Yoda, and access to a time machine.

russ99
08-07-2008, 09:05 AM
Alexei was moved up in the Kansas City series and tried to jack every pitch, and struck out and flied out a lot. Then when he was moved back to his usual spot, he settled down and hit his normal, awesome way. He's not ready to be moved up the lineup yet.

Ozzie should give him a year before moving him up, IMO. Maybe putting him 6th or 7th in front of Griffey will give him better pitches to hit.

Also, leadoff's not in his future. His plate patience is getting better, but he'll never be a big on-base guy. The #2 batter often has to take pitches and hit behind the runner if we do get a real leadof guy (like Iguchi in '05) so I doubt Alexei would be optimal there too. I see him as a high-average decent power, doubles (and triples) machine at #3.

Besides, I fully expect Kenny to get us a leadoff guy at 2B or CF in the offseason.

Patience, my son...

oeo
08-07-2008, 09:42 AM
He has a tendency to swing at everything he sees, which is exactly what the leadoff hitter shouldn't be doing.

This is not completely true. Some of you act like he's Juan Uribe.

Alexei will take some hacks, but he can also lay off of tough pitches, especially when he needs to, and work the count. Last night in the 8th is a very good example of what he can do.

Alexei was moved up in the Kansas City series and tried to jack every pitch, and struck out and flied out a lot. Then when he was moved back to his usual spot, he settled down and hit his normal, awesome way. He's not ready to be moved up the lineup yet.

Well, moving him up to the top of the order shouldn't change his approach. When he was batting 6th, he probably felt like he had to show more power, which is why he was swinging for the fences. Put him at the top, and he should be a table setter like he is at the bottom.

Alexei is a smart player, he knows his role in every AB. If he's leading off, he'll know he has to set the table and not jack homeruns.

cws05champ
08-07-2008, 09:49 AM
This is not completely true. Some of you act like he's Juan Uribe.

Alexei will take some hacks, but he can also lay off of tough pitches, especially when he needs to, and work the count. Last night in the 8th is a very good example of what he can do.



Well, moving him up to the top of the order shouldn't change his approach. When he was batting 6th, he probably felt like he had to show more power, which is why he was swinging for the fences. Put him at the top, and he should be a table setter like he is at the bottom.

Alexei is a smart player, he knows his role in every AB. If he's leading off, he'll know he has to set the table and not jack homeruns.
It shouldn't change his approach, but we have seen with a lot of players that it does change their approach when they move in the order.

If you have a guy that doesn't walk a lot but has a higher avg, you want him in the position to drive in runs. I don't think he should be moved right now.

Save McCuddy's
08-07-2008, 11:28 AM
Leave him right where he is. It seems to be working out quite well.

HawkDJ
08-07-2008, 11:45 AM
exactly. Alexei may be our leadoff hitter next season if OC goes but he doesn't work a lot of counts and that what you want from your leadoff hitter. Plus if you moved Alexei to the one spot, OC would move to two and AJ would have to move down.........too much unnecessary movement in an already productive lineup.

I'm not in favor of leading off Alexei, but I don't think OC is much better. Alexei has a higher OBP (.330 to .325) and pretty close in pitches per plate apperance (3.19 to 3.42)

TomBradley72
08-07-2008, 11:51 AM
This is not completely true. Some of you act like he's Juan Uribe.

Alexei will take some hacks, but he can also lay off of tough pitches, especially when he needs to, and work the count. Last night in the 8th is a very good example of what he can do.



Well, moving him up to the top of the order shouldn't change his approach. When he was batting 6th, he probably felt like he had to show more power, which is why he was swinging for the fences. Put him at the top, and he should be a table setter like he is at the bottom.

Alexei is a smart player, he knows his role in every AB. If he's leading off, he'll know he has to set the table and not jack homeruns.

He's proven he can drive in the big runs...I want him in the 6th slot...right after CQ/Dye/Thome and before Griffey...we've had a bigger problem driving in runs than we have had getting on base...leverage his high average to drive in runs.

TomBradley72
08-07-2008, 11:52 AM
I did like Swisher in the #2 hole last night...switch hitter, draws walks, can score from 1st on a double/2nd on a single...move AJ down in the order where he can drive in runs.

voodoochile
08-07-2008, 11:53 AM
I don't think Griffey is a good CF. But he would be a great RCF in a 4 man OF. Swish could play a mean LCF. That's amazing coverage we'd have...

You think the FOBA's would finally give up trying to squeeze him into the lineup? :tongue:

Oh and for the record. I like Ramirez batting where he is because there are a ton of guys walking in front of him. Witness last night in the 8th. Put him where his ability to hit and not much else can drive in runs. I have to admit though, the question of who you want up in a clutch situation late in an important game with runners on base has to include Alexei in the discussion, because you know he's not going to settle for the walk. I'd hit him as high as 6th, but until he learns to walk more, his talents are better utilized in a bottom half slot, IMO.

Domeshot17
08-07-2008, 12:15 PM
My thinking has always been ( and Im a huge Cuban Missle Fan ) is that if we put him leading off, its almost as bad of an idea as the Cubs leading off Soriano. The Missle has only walked 8 times all year, 8 times!!!!!!! If he goes through a slumping stretch, it is going to put the pressure on him of not being on base. He is such an idle 6 or 7 hitter, I would not mess with it. He is flourishing right now and I would not mess with it. He also is not a good base stealer. He is only 8 out of 13 attempts. He has good ball in play speed, but I don't like the idea of letting him run that much more. Cabrera is 18 out of 21. He doesn't have the speed of Ramirez, but he also knows how to steal a base, something Ramirez has yet to learn.

35th and Shields
08-07-2008, 01:34 PM
I'm not in favor of leading off Alexei, but I don't think OC is much better. Alexei has a higher OBP (.330 to .325) and pretty close in pitches per plate apperance (3.19 to 3.42)

He isn't much better but my point is basically that their is no reason to switch up our lineup when its working. Secondly, we don't know how Alexei would respond by hitting leadoff whereas for OC we know he's, at the very least, capable.

HawkDJ
08-07-2008, 04:57 PM
He isn't much better but my point is basically that their is no reason to switch up our lineup when its working. Secondly, we don't know how Alexei would respond by hitting leadoff whereas for OC we know he's, at the very least, capable.

That makes sense and I agree with you. I'm just saying reasons to have OC leadoff do not include the number of pitches he sees or how often he gets on base.

PennStater98r
08-07-2008, 05:09 PM
Two things make me disagree with this. Ramirez doesn't take enough pitches to be near the top. Further, I'd say that while he's getting established in the line-up positioning him in spot that takes a little pressure off is a good thing.