PDA

View Full Version : *Official* In the Big Inning…Mauer/Morneau beat Sox 6-5


Frater Perdurabo
07-29-2008, 10:00 PM
Another horse crap game.

At least we're still in first place.

At least Swisher made it interesting.

Discuss it here.

KnightSox
07-29-2008, 10:01 PM
Frustrating.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:01 PM
at least we're still in first

I wanted to write it too so that maybe you'll realize how stupid it sounds at this point.

Harry Potter
07-29-2008, 10:01 PM
Another game, another bottle of Tums :(:

NoShoesJoe
07-29-2008, 10:01 PM
@(#%(#$%!

DSpivack
07-29-2008, 10:01 PM
Can we still split? Please?

gosox3072
07-29-2008, 10:02 PM
Its july..... but ****

aryzner
07-29-2008, 10:02 PM
Another horse**** game in Minnesota.

Not that they affected the game much, but I'm getting a bit tired of this somewhat bogus strike zone I've been seeing these last 2 games. (Not every at-bat but I've been upset by a few calls there.)

oeo
07-29-2008, 10:02 PM
at least we're still in first

I wanted to write it too so that maybe you'll realize how stupid it sounds at this point.

This game didn't make anyone happier than you, did it?

AzureJazzMan
07-29-2008, 10:02 PM
AAAAaaaaaarrrrrrggggghhhhhhH!!!!!!!!! How many baserunners did our "defense" put on base with bonhead plays and misfires!!!! Clayton deserved a better fate than the crap that took place on that field.

Cuck the Fubs
07-29-2008, 10:02 PM
Still in first.

It's late July.

Konerko hit 2 balls hard.

Swisher homered off Nathan.

Get em tomorrow boys.

Droso5
07-29-2008, 10:02 PM
At least they physically showed up to the stadium, now if they could only find their baseball playing ability because it's nowhere to be found.

cheezheadsoxfan
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
Losing is bad enough. If I have to listen to any Twinkie love coming out of our organization I'll puke.:angry:

whitesox901
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
**** **** **** **** ****

Pear-Zin-Ski
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
I STILL cannot believe we actually got as many runs as we did with the lack of production from JD and TCQ...cant expect them to carry us every night....

Clayton looked damn good...until the 5th...not much else to say other than go get em tomorrow....

***Forgot to meniton...WALKS KILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!***

getonbckthr
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
**** Morneau, **** Mauer, **** Gardenhire, **** Tom Kelly, **** Kirby Puckett, Hrbek **** you as well. Mall of a America go **** yourself.

NoShoesJoe
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
Its july..... but ****

We had this conversation yesterday. It's not July when the last series of the month is against the Twins and the date on my calendar is 7/29.

It a momentum shift. Period.

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
I just felt if the bullpen held them at 5 runs we could come back but Thornton gave it up.

Team loss.

Frater Perdurabo
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
The worst part is that Paulie getting that hit means he gets another week of free passes from his fandom and from Ozzie.
:angry:

It's Time
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
I fully expect to see second place tomorrow. The White Sox can't win here, it's that ****ing simple.

The Rook crapped the bed in the 5th and the offense fell asleep for 5 innings.

Woofer
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
I feel like this team is aging me.

MCHSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
Another horse crap game.

At least we're still in first place.

At least Swisher made it interesting.

Discuss it here.

Can we win 1?!?!?! God damn it White Sox!!!!! OMG! All I wanted was a split. We can technically still do it. But, I doubt it gets done.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
This game didn't make anyone happier but you, did it?

**** off. there's nothing worse after a critical loss than people calling me not a sox fan for being pissed that we suck.

JB98
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
The Twins scored five runs with two outs tonight, all of which were knocked in by either Mauer or Morneau.

Meanwhile, the Sox scored only one run with two outs, and that was the solo shot by Swisher in the ninth.

If we're going to win a game in this series, someone better come up with a big two-out hit with RISP at some point.

I have an overwhelming feeling of dread tonight. Probably the most pessimistic I've felt since May.

oeo
07-29-2008, 10:03 PM
Konerko hit 2 balls hard.

The thing about Paulie, is he has been taking good swings with no one on. He's actually started a couple of rallies in the last week. His problem has been when there are guys on base.

stl_sox_fan
07-29-2008, 10:04 PM
A small glimmer of hope there at the end.
Ugh, just one win to remain in first place after this series is over. Gavin needs to bring it tomorrow.

ChiSoxGirl
07-29-2008, 10:04 PM
Time for a chisoxmike-esque rant:

I frickin' HATE the damn Twins!!!!!!!! Seriously, do they get EVERY bounce and EVERY break known to man?! I HATE that dump of a "ballpark" they call home. I HATE their center fielder for making almost every play that comes his way. I HATE the combination of Mauer & Morneau. I HATE their fans. I HATE that we have to wait 'til 2010 to play them in a normal ballpark! And finally, I HATE that we have to wait a year & a half until they'll have ten less wins than they do every year because of this damn dome!!!!!!!!! :angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry:

oeo
07-29-2008, 10:04 PM
The Twins scored five runs with two outs tonight, all of which were knocked in by either Mauer or Morneau.

How the hell do they do this ****? Can they keep up all this 2 out scoring, is the big question.

Soxman219
07-29-2008, 10:05 PM
**** the Twins. I can't wait until they move to a new stadium. No lead is safe in that place. I won't be comfortable until they are up 14-1 in a game.
If we don't change soon this could be our last day in first.:(:

Harry Potter
07-29-2008, 10:05 PM
I wonder if Hawk's knees hurt...

UofCSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:05 PM
Some positive things....

-Richard looked good except for the big inning
-Konerko's last two at-bats looked like his old self...hopfully that's a sart
-We hit two balls hard off Nathan and another ball that could have easily fallen in.
-Brian Anderson looked good hitting.

Other than that I want to puke.

spongyfungy
07-29-2008, 10:06 PM
can't we just drill morneau and mauer.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:06 PM
Time for a chisoxmike-esque rant:

I frickin' HATE the damn Twins!!!!!!!! Seriously, do they get EVERY bounce and EVERY break known to man?! I HATE that dump of a "ballpark" they call home. I HATE their center fielder for making almost every play that comes his way. I HATE the combination of Mauer & Morneau. I HATE their fans. I HATE that we have to wait 'til 2010 to play them in a normal ballpark! And finally, I HATE that we have to wait two more years until they'll have ten less wins than they do every year because of this damn dome!!!!!!!!! :angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry:

That outdoor stadium can't come soon enough.

JB98
07-29-2008, 10:06 PM
Losing is bad enough. If I have to listen to any Twinkie love coming out of our organization I'll puke.:angry:

Agreed. If we lose the division to the Twins, shame on us. That is NOT a great baseball team up there in Minnesota.

It's time to stop fellating the Twins, sack up and play some damn baseball.

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 10:06 PM
I have to say that the M& M Boys are going to be good no matter where they play. And you can build a whole franchise around them. They hit left-handed pitching well which means they are not really defensible.
I hate'em but I have to recognize how good they are.
Frank is the last hitter the sox have had like them.

gosox3072
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
Time for a chisoxmike-esque rant:

I frickin' HATE the damn Twins!!!!!!!! Seriously, do they get EVERY bounce and EVERY break known to man?! I HATE that dump of a "ballpark" they call home. I HATE their center fielder for making almost every play that comes his way. I HATE the combination of Mauer & Morneau. I HATE their fans. I HATE that we have to wait 'til 2010 to play them in a normal ballpark! And finally, I HATE that we have to wait two more years until they'll have ten less wins than they do every year because of this damn dome!!!!!!!!! :angry::angry::angry::angry::angry::angry:

Well done, that actually makes me feel a little better

spiffie
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
One good thing to take from this is that Konerko looked good at the plate, even though he only got one hit. I think he is right on the verge of a major bustout, and that can carry the team for a long stretch when it happens.

Remember, we are still in first place. Anyone complaining about this team needs to look at the standings. First ****ing place. You're going to be bitching and pissing your pants over a first place team.

oeo
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
**** off. there's nothing worse after a critical loss than people calling me not a sox fan for being pissed that we suck.

When did I say you weren't a Sox fan? Must have missed when I typed that. :scratch:

I said you're happy because you think you're right.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
can't we just drill morneau and mauer.

:thumbsup:

MCHSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
If only 1 more was on when Swish went deep...:(:

cheezheadsoxfan
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
**** the Twins. I can't wait until they move to a new stadium. No lead is safe in that place. I won't be comfortable until they are up 14-1 in a game.
If we don't change soon this could be our last day in first.:(:

I don't want to drop out of first any more than anyone here. But why do we seem to assume that if we drop out here we never get back in?

whitesox901
07-29-2008, 10:07 PM
**** off. there's nothing worse after a critical loss than people calling me not a sox fan for being pissed that we suck.

Munchman seem's to get alot of **** around here, I feal for the guy

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:08 PM
When did I say you weren't a Sox fan?

I said you're happy because you think you're right.

I remember picking the Twins fourth. And no, I find nothing but displeasure when we lose. ESPECIALLY to the Twins.

Frater Perdurabo
07-29-2008, 10:08 PM
That outdoor stadium can't come soon enough.

You're delusional if you think that the Twins will magically turn into an inept organization once they start playing home games outdoors on grass.

They develop solid, fundamental baseball players.

Visiting teams may not struggle as much when they visit an outdoor, grass Twins home ballpark, but don't believe for a second that the Twins will suddenly turn into a pumpkin.

dwalteroo
07-29-2008, 10:08 PM
I can't wait until they move to a new stadium either.

That said...this team needs a shakeup. I don't care if it's a reliever, a starter, or a bat, but we are growing stale, you can feel it. Let's just shake this thing up!

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:09 PM
Munchman seem's to get alot of **** around here, I feal for the guy

Careful, that's a bannable offense... :D:

thomas35forever
07-29-2008, 10:09 PM
How is this happening? We could be 1.5 back of these ****ers by Thursday. I'd almost sell all my belongings to get just one win this series. I am so mad and upset right now it's unbelievable.:whiner::angry:

Jerko
07-29-2008, 10:09 PM
I agree with JB98. Twins ain't ****. That makes us less than **** these past few games, I realize, but really, we're not finishing behind them. No ****in way.

UofCSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:09 PM
Agreed. If we lose the division to the Twins, shame on us. That is NOT a great baseball team up there in Minnesota.

It's time to stop fellating the Twins, sack up and play some damn baseball.

I would welcome someone saying...."They are a ****ty team. We are better than them. If they win the division, it's cuz we let them, not because they took it from us. There is no reason we should lose to them."

Let the Twins put it up for bullitan material. It's better than praising them and going out there like we expect something bad to happen.

ribbieandrhubarb
07-29-2008, 10:09 PM
Those overachieving Twinkies always seem to have a horseshoe lodged up their *** in the Dump Dome. Lucky punks. Let's split, and get the hell out of dodge.

GlassSox
07-29-2008, 10:10 PM
Losing is bad enough. If I have to listen to any Twinkie love coming out of our organization I'll puke.:angry:

I am sick and tired of listening to Hawk loving up the Twinkies and DJ acting like Hawk's little boy.:angry:

Frater Perdurabo
07-29-2008, 10:10 PM
I can't wait until they move to a new stadium either.

That said...this team needs a shakeup. I don't care if it's a reliever, a starter, or a bat, but we are growing stale, you can feel it. Let's just shake this thing up!

That starts with benching the captain. One hit and one hard-hit out when you're batting .213 doesn't cut it.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:10 PM
You're delusional if you think that the Twins will magically turn into an inept organization once they start playing home games outdoors on grass.

They develop solid, fundamental baseball players.

Visiting teams may not struggle as much when they visit an outdoor, grass Twins home ballpark, but don't believe for a second that the Twins will suddenly turn into a pumpkin.

*continues to cross fingers*

MCHSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:10 PM
I don't want to drop out of first any more than anyone here. But why do we seem to assume that if we drop out here we never get back in?

I'm not. I am just worried bout the the NEXT Twins series...Last road games. At least we play CLE the last 3...If we need em.

ChiSoxGirl
07-29-2008, 10:11 PM
Well done, that actually makes me feel a little better

I wish I did! Man, this is REALLY eating at me tonight!!!!!!! :angry::angry::angry:

Soxman219
07-29-2008, 10:11 PM
**** Morneau, **** Mauer, **** Gardenhire, **** Tom Kelly, **** Kirby Puckett, Hrbek **** you as well. Mall of a America go **** yourself.

**** IT! The whole damn state of Minnesota can go to hell!

Harry Potter
07-29-2008, 10:11 PM
Not likely, but perhaps these two games will cause KW to make a move.

That being said, I don't want KW to make a move just to please the fans

Shoeless_Jim
07-29-2008, 10:12 PM
anyone see the stat twins bullpen era at home 1.90 the road 5.90

Tragg
07-29-2008, 10:12 PM
.
-Brian Anderson looked good hitting.


He's actually been productive in his last 6 starts...you have to go back a month to find 6 starts, but they've been productive. Ozzie plays him against the pitchers against whom he has the least chance of sucess - lefties.
Tonight, he hits a homer, but with all of the deadhead hitters in the lineup, he gets lifted.

Richard pitched well for the most part - he just didnt' close the deal.

JB98
07-29-2008, 10:12 PM
I would welcome someone saying...."They are a ****ty team. We are better than them. If they win the division, it's cuz we let them, not because they took it from us. There is no reason we should lose to them."

Let the Twins put it up for bullitan material. It's better than praising them and going out there like we expect something bad to happen.

I agree completely. I'm tired of hearing about how "Gardy" is the greatest manager in the history of the world. Every other team in the league gets Carlos Gomez out. Why can't we?

I'm just spitting nails with anger over the loss tonight. I wish our manager and players would feel the same, but they'll probably spend the postgame talking up the "greatness" of the Twins.

spiffie
07-29-2008, 10:12 PM
You're delusional if you think that the Twins will magically turn into an inept organization once they start playing home games outdoors on grass.

They develop solid, fundamental baseball players.

Visiting teams may not struggle as much when they visit an outdoor, grass Twins home ballpark, but don't believe for a second that the Twins will suddenly turn into a pumpkin.
Twins Home ERA: 3.16
Twins Road ERA: 5.52

Twins Home OPS: 770
Twins Road OPS: 718

zaidecrannog
07-29-2008, 10:13 PM
In July, the Sox have given up 6 runs per game. We desperately need pitching help. 6 runs a game!!! We have no chance of getting the playoffs with that.

Vernam
07-29-2008, 10:13 PM
This is the third straight year the Sox went oh-for-our-vacation. I'm starting to think it's not safe to leave town, especially if they're playing in Minnesota. :(:

Had to follow it via "Game Day," so it's hard to judge whose fault it all is (it does have to be someone's fault, right?), though I can guess some will say Ozzie stuck with Richard too long. Not that I'd agree, since it would've been nuts to yank him with Mauer and Morneau coming up.

Vernam

thomas35forever
07-29-2008, 10:15 PM
Have the Sox ever had an oh-fer season in the HumpDome?

whitesox901
07-29-2008, 10:15 PM
This is the third straight year the Sox went oh-for-our-vacation. I'm starting to think it's not safe to leave town, especially if they're playing in Minnesota. :(:

Vernam

You need a ball and chain? My uncle's a blacksmith :D:

Frater Perdurabo
07-29-2008, 10:16 PM
Twins Home ERA: 3.16
Twins Road ERA: 5.52

Twins Home OPS: 770
Twins Road OPS: 718

Almost every team plays better at home than on the road.

I'm not saying that the Twins don't take advantage of their home park. They do.

I just happen to think that because their home park is so much different than most other parks, visiting teams struggle there more than they do in other parks.

Visiting teams will struggle less in Minnesota once they move to an outdoor, grass field. But the Twins will still have the organizational acumen to draft, develop, teach and coach solid, fundamental players.

DeadMoney
07-29-2008, 10:16 PM
That was torture.

I hate the Twins.

In ~610 days (http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/min/ballpark/timeline.jsp) WSI can rejoice.

I can barely write this with a straight face, but:
Go get 'em tomorrow.

Soxman219
07-29-2008, 10:16 PM
How is this happening? We could be 1.5 back of these ****ers by Thursday. I'd almost sell all my belongings to get just one win this series. I am so mad and upset right now it's unbelievable.:whiner::angry:

I know! Just win one game at that dump! If the Twins win the division, they'll lose in the first round just to piss us Sox fans off! We can't let the win this division. If we want to leave Minny in first place, we must win tomorrow!

ChiSoxGirl
07-29-2008, 10:17 PM
That was torture.

I hate the Twins.

In ~610 days (http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/min/ballpark/timeline.jsp) WSI can rejoice.

I can barely write this with a straight face, but:
Go get 'em tomorrow.

610.... Is that all?!

DSpivack
07-29-2008, 10:17 PM
That was torture.

I hate the Twins.

In ~610 days (http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/min/ballpark/timeline.jsp) WSI can rejoice.

I can barely write this with a straight face, but:
Go get 'em tomorrow.

I'll rejoice after the final road game the Sox play in that dump, so that should be about ~400 days or so.

UofCSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:17 PM
In June, the Sox have given up 6 runs per game. We desperately need pitching help. 6 runs a game!!! We have no chance of getting the playoffs with that.

I think you mean July, but even if you don't the trend this month has been the pitching, not the hitting that is costing us games. The offense left a ton of guys on today....but 5 runs should be enough to beat a team with two legit hitters.

BeviBall!
07-29-2008, 10:18 PM
If we fielded the '27 Yankees and made them wear Sox jerseys... at best, we split the games @ HHH. Doesn't matter who wears the uniforms, draws up the lineup... we never, ever win there.

oeo
07-29-2008, 10:18 PM
I remember picking the Twins fourth.

I remember you talking a couple of days ago on how the Twins are simply amazing at everything.

UofCSoxFan
07-29-2008, 10:20 PM
Almost every team plays better at home than on the road.

I'm not saying that the Twins don't take advantage of their home park. They do.

I just happen to think that because their home park is so much different than most other parks, visiting teams struggle there more than they do in other parks.

Visiting teams will struggle less in Minnesota once they move to an outdoor, grass field. But the Twins will still have the organizational acumen to draft, develop, teach and coach solid, fundamental players.

I think this is a very reasonable arguement. Again who knows for sure what will happen, but I doubt the Twins home success is strictly because they can sleep in their own beds and play in front of 18,000 half asleep fans.

sox1970
07-29-2008, 10:20 PM
No pressure, but Floyd and Danks are about to pitch the two biggest games of their careers.

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 10:20 PM
Farmer said the JD took a step in on Morneau's line drive ...sounds like he got a bad read..if he catches that,we win this game but that is the way it goes when you are scuffling in the dome.

The center field position was productive tonite with two homers.
Every facet of the team is leaking oil right now.
But thats just baseball. Gavin is momentum.
So much for the 3 lefties out of 4 games to shut down M & M. They hit lefties better than righthanders.

ondafarm
07-29-2008, 10:20 PM
Had to follow it via "Game Day," so it's hard to judge whose fault it all is (it does have to be someone's fault, right?), though I can guess some will say Ozzie stuck with Richard too long. Not that I'd agree, since it would've been nuts to yank him with Mauer and Morneau coming up.

Vernam

Nuts?

It'd have been nuts to win the game?

I am constantly amazed by some fans.

NU Nish 13
07-29-2008, 10:21 PM
... we never, ever win there.

Funny thing about that is I recall clinching the division title there in 2000...

after a loss to the Twins. Watching baseball in that stadium makes me puke.

JB98
07-29-2008, 10:21 PM
If we fielded the '27 Yankees and made them wear Sox jerseys... at best, we split the games @ HHH. Doesn't matter who wears the uniforms, draws up the lineup... we never, ever win there.

Certainly not late in the season. The three games we have in Minnesota the last week of the season scare the living **** out of me. We've got to find a way to exorcise the demons.

I'm glad I'm on vacation this week. I can isolate myself from the world while this series is going on. I'm not pleasant to be around right now.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:21 PM
I remember you talking a couple of days ago on how the Twins are simply amazing at everything.

Those bastards fooled me, they were suppose to suck!

DeadMoney
07-29-2008, 10:21 PM
I'll rejoice after the final road game the Sox play in that dump, so that should be about ~400 days or so.

Very true.

I'm beyond frustrated right now. If anyone says anything to me about baseball tomorrow at work (especially fans of any other team), it won't be pretty. Why should I care anyways ... I only have 8 days left until I go back to school.

thomas35forever
07-29-2008, 10:22 PM
Rongey just said that the Sox are last in the bigs with 2 outs/RISP.:puking:

Sox Supporter
07-29-2008, 10:22 PM
Is it me, or does Paulie have "Steve Sax-itis" whenever he has to throw the ball to 2nd base on what should be an out at 2nd?

oeo
07-29-2008, 10:22 PM
Those bastards fooled me, they were suppose to suck!

And I rest my case...

WhiteSox5187
07-29-2008, 10:22 PM
I just can't explain why we struggle so much up there...I'm really at a loss for words. It was one bad inning. And it just seemed like there were just so many weird things in that inning...****...the team just looked defeated after that fifth inning too, like they wanted to pack it in and give up then and there...a win tomorrow would do us a world of good. Even if we do get swept, this isn't like '03 where it's in September. It's July. Remember when we swept them and had a 6.5 game lead? What happened then? At worst we leave a game and a half out, we can make that up.

Tragg
07-29-2008, 10:22 PM
The Twins take advantage of their opportunities and dont' make mistakes. That's not changing when they change stadiums.
They get Richard on the ropes in one inning out of 5 and absolutely maximize the damage against him....they take the walks when he's giving them (Sox swing at first pitch and balls in dirt).
The Twins are also not afraid to play their young talent....the Sox are unless it produces immediately.

spiffie
07-29-2008, 10:23 PM
Almost every team plays better at home than on the road.

I'm not saying that the Twins don't take advantage of their home park. They do.

I just happen to think that because their home park is so much different than most other parks, visiting teams struggle there more than they do in other parks.

Visiting teams will struggle less in Minnesota once they move to an outdoor, grass field. But the Twins will still have the organizational acumen to draft, develop, teach and coach solid, fundamental players.
The Twins have the 2nd best ERA in the AL at home, and the worst in the AL on the road.

The Twins will still be the sharpest organization in baseball. But they won't have the advantage of building a team designed for a very unique environment.

WhiteSox5187
07-29-2008, 10:24 PM
Nuts?

It'd have been nuts to win the game?

I am constantly amazed by some fans.
You have a very tight leash on pitchers. I suspect that rookie pitchers would not exactly blossom under you.

munchman33
07-29-2008, 10:25 PM
And I rest my case...

lol...yeah, but I didn't doubt their talent. Only how long it would take for them to be this good again.

JB98
07-29-2008, 10:25 PM
Rongey just said that the Sox are last in the bigs with 2 outs/RISP.:puking:

See Post #24 in this thread. That is an area the Sox MUST improve in to win the division and go to the playoffs.

Vernam
07-29-2008, 10:25 PM
Nuts?

It'd have been nuts to win the game?

I am constantly amazed by some fans.I'm constantly not surprised by your second-guessing Ozzie. Having conceded that I didn't see the game, I still wonder what the point would have been in pulling Richard when he had breezed until that inning and had two outs in the fifth before blowing up. So please enlighten us all . . . Would you have brought in a righty to face Mauer and Morneau? Would you have brought in Logan? Thornton? Idiocy.

Vernam

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 10:26 PM
Still, the twins keep coming up with not just good players but like the best players at their position in the league like Hunter,Santana,Morneau and Mauer. Those guys are perrenial all-stars, so I would not put it past them to continue to have good players in their new stadium.

Vernam
07-29-2008, 10:27 PM
You need a ball and chain? My uncle's a blacksmith :D:I was thinking more along the lines of WSIers' chipping in to send us somewhere nice in December. :wink:

Vernam

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 10:27 PM
Rongey just said that the Sox are last in the bigs with 2 outs/RISP.:puking:

Twins scored 5 runs tonite with two outs.
Twins scored 4 with two out in the 5th.

Jerko
07-29-2008, 10:28 PM
I was thinking more along the lines of WSIers' chipping in to send us somewhere nice in December. :wink:

Vernam

Us? So you already have a ball and chain!!!

Just kidding vernam.

TommyJohn
07-29-2008, 10:28 PM
**** the ****ing Minnesota Twins.

cnw8052
07-29-2008, 10:29 PM
Well said.......:tongue:

**** Morneau, **** Mauer, **** Gardenhire, **** Tom Kelly, **** Kirby Puckett, Hrbek **** you as well. Mall of a America go **** yourself.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 10:29 PM
AAAAaaaaaarrrrrrggggghhhhhhH!!!!!!!!! How many baserunners did our "defense" put on base with bonhead plays and misfires!!!! Clayton deserved a better fate than the crap that took place on that field.

I'm so sick of the mental mistakes. I think if the Twins spotted the Sox 5 runs they would still win.

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 10:29 PM
Ranger has a caller insisting Richard should have intentionally walked Morneau, bringing in a run...:(: Thing is, I am starting to agree with him!

Woofer
07-29-2008, 10:30 PM
For some strange reason, I feel cautiously optimistic about these next 2 games. Perhaps my anger has turned into insanity though?

DeadMoney
07-29-2008, 10:31 PM
Still, the twins keep coming up with not just good players but like the best players at their position in the league like Hunter,Santana,Morneau and Mauer. Those guys are perrenial all-stars, so I would not put it past them to continue to have good players in their new stadium.

To me, it's not so much that the Twins play extremely well in their stadium ... it's that the Sox go up there and play like **** (along with most other teams that go up there). Just because there's this aura and expectation around their crap-ass-dome doesn't mean you have to play right into it, and that's what frustrates me. If the Sox went up and lost a well played game, it'd be different. But every freaking game up there seems like we either give it away or never had a chance.

EDIT: Not to say the Twins don't play well in that stadium, because they do. They're also built to play in the dome, whereas 27 other teams are not groomed to play in a ****ty domed stadium.

Frankie5Angels
07-29-2008, 10:31 PM
Sounds like Ozzie's about to go on a huge rant.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...1,1504762.story (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080729-ozzie-guille-chicago-white-sox-fans,1,1504762.story)

sox1970
07-29-2008, 10:31 PM
For some strange reason, I feel cautiously optimistic about these next 2 games. Perhaps my anger has turned into insanity though?

Perhaps.

Tragg
07-29-2008, 10:32 PM
Nuts?

It'd have been nuts to win the game?

I am constantly amazed by some fans.
I think what Guillen really needs (given that he will be here in perpetuity) is a strong coaching staff to shore up his weaknesses and to actually do some coaching. But he obviously doesn't want one.

WhiteSox5187
07-29-2008, 10:32 PM
Ranger has a caller insisting Richard should have intentionally walked Morneau, bringing in a run...:(: Thing is, I am starting to agree with him!
I briefly considered it when watching the game, but it's never a good idea to just walk in runs. He had Morneau down to two strikes and was one pitch away from getting out of it. He just couldn't get the job done. Oh well.

Tragg
07-29-2008, 10:33 PM
Sounds like Ozzie's about to go on a huge rant.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...1,1504762.story (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080729-ozzie-guille-chicago-white-sox-fans,1,1504762.story)
Will there be any self-indictment in this rant?

WhiteSox5187
07-29-2008, 10:34 PM
Sounds like Ozzie's about to go on a huge rant.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...1,1504762.story (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080729-ozzie-guille-chicago-white-sox-fans,1,1504762.story)
We do well after he rants...i'm all for it.

thomas35forever
07-29-2008, 10:36 PM
We do well after he rants...i'm all for it.
Eventually, that's going to end.

Vienna
07-29-2008, 10:38 PM
I feel like this team is aging me.

Same here. It will be worse when I go to work tomorrow. The Twins fans are typically quiet, until they win.

Lip Man 1
07-29-2008, 10:39 PM
You can't walk guys when the team they are playing for leads MLB in two out RBI's I think they are (or were) hitting over .300 in that category.

They made the kid pay the price for it.

Try again tomorrow I guess.

The pitching is seriously becoming an issue however, a 6.32 ERA over its last 13 games.

Lip

Urban Legend
07-29-2008, 10:39 PM
If the Twins don't go 81-0 at home, Gardenhire on up should be fired. How can you win at that place?

Add to that that they're so darn intelligent in drafting/aquiring/developing their players (do they ever make a mistake? Yeah, one ball dropped in that shouldn't have on TCQ's hit, but even a blind squirrel finds an acorn onece in a while)...

With all the injuries, and Konerko's problems, and how long can Dye carry the team...I'm very pessimistic. But the Evil Twins...Guzman gets hurt, they put Span in center and he tears up...I think the Twins could substitute their batboy for Morneau and he'd go 5 for 5 because of what he's absorbed.

Got to hand it to (former GM) Terry Ryan; was he the smartest GM in terms of analyzing talent, or what? Just not a good business guy is what I heard.

And the Twins play Seattle, a team no better than a good AAA team (and Washburn's headed toward Gotham) nine times in August and September.

Maybe it's better if we do fall into second place, and bring out the junkyard dog in us, not be playing not to lose. A cliche, but I think it may apply.

I hate the Twins sooooooo much....I hate 'em, I hate 'em, I hate 'em....

Tragg
07-29-2008, 10:42 PM
The pitching was paper thin coming into the season - it's catching up.

The offense is of c. 2004 construction -statistically sound, but somewhat boom or bust.

The division is weak enough that we still have a great shot at playing through it. The wildcard is also in play.

The answer is not to send the young players we do have (anderson, fields, richard) for Arthur Rhodes or Jose Mesa or any pitcher touched by the hands of Beane.
We need our young players - they should play more. And Jose Mesa or some other mediocrity isn't going to put us over the top.

PaleHoser
07-29-2008, 10:42 PM
On Morneau's clutch double, Mauer scored from first. Now think about that for a moment - their catcher scored from first on a line drive double.

Tonight's big play boiled down to team speed. The Sox could be put into that same situation and only score two runs - tie game - rather than take the lead.

"I don't run, I trot." :whiner:

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 10:44 PM
I don't want to drop out of first any more than anyone here. But why do we seem to assume that if we drop out here we never get back in?

Seems like the history of the Sox with the Twins this century except for 2005. They seem to wet their pants when it comes to the Twins. At least they aren't doing it at the Cell.
People like to say the Twins aren't very good. The truth is they are. What you don't see in that stats is they play good fundamental baseball.
They are also the best in baseball in driving in runs with 2 outs.

They caught up to Detroit when no one thougt anyone would.

Winning is a habit for them just as station to station baseball is habit for the Sox.

DrCrawdad
07-29-2008, 10:45 PM
Can we still split? Please?

IF the Sox win one of the next two, the Sox leave in 1st place, right?

Vernam
07-29-2008, 10:46 PM
So you already have a ball and chain!!!

Just kidding vernam.I'm willing to leave the kids at home, if that helps!

It really has gotten ri-goddam-diculous that they implode when we're gone each July:

96 07-22-2006 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200607220CHA) vs Texas Rangers (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2006&t=TEX) 1-3 L 58-38
97 07-23-2006 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200607230CHA) vs Texas Rangers (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2006&t=TEX) 5-0 W 59-38
98 07-24-2006 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200607240CHA) vs Minnesota Twins (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2006&t=MIN) 4-7 L 59-39
99 07-25-2006 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200607250CHA) vs Minnesota Twins (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2006&t=MIN) 3-4 L 59-40
100 07-26-2006 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200607260CHA) vs Minnesota Twins (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2006&t=MIN) 4-7 L 59-41

88 07-13-2007 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200707130BAL) at Baltimore Orioles (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2007&t=BAL) 0-2 L 40-48
89 07-14-2007 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200707140BAL) at Baltimore Orioles (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2007&t=BAL) 6-7 L 40-49
90 07-15-2007 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200707150BAL) at Baltimore Orioles (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2007&t=BAL) 3-5 L 40-50
91 07-16-2007 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200707160CLE) at Cleveland Indians (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2007&t=CLE) 11-10 W 41-50
92 07-17-2007 (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=200707170CLE) at Cleveland Indians (http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/schedule.php?y=2007&t=CLE) 5-6 L 41-51

Granted, they were already out of it in 2007, but still. Maybe not oh-fer, but close enough. They're 0-3 during Vacation '08.

Vernam

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 10:48 PM
They develop solid, fundamental baseball players.


Kenny are you listening?

I'm sure they draft guys who are solid to begin. There is a difference between athletes and baseball players.

Soxman219
07-29-2008, 10:49 PM
For some strange reason, I feel cautiously optimistic about these next 2 games. Perhaps my anger has turned into insanity though?

I already emotional set myself for us to lose tomorrow so if we lose I won't feel as bad.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 10:53 PM
I'm not. I am just worried bout the the NEXT Twins series...Last road games. At least we play CLE the last 3...If we need em.

That Cleveland series could be even more frightening with the Sept. call ups. The Sox can't hit minor league pitching either.

Brian26
07-29-2008, 10:58 PM
On Morneau's clutch double, Mauer scored from first. Now think about that for a moment - their catcher scored from first on a line drive double.

Tonight's big play boiled down to team speed. The Sox could be put into that same situation and only score two runs - tie game - rather than take the lead.

"I don't run, I trot." :whiner:

A bit sensationalistic. Yes, Mauer has good speed for a catcher, but the situation was: 2 outs, Mourneau had two strikes, Gardenhire had Mauer off with the pitch...couple that with Dye turning the wrong way initially on the ball and then acting like a drama queen after he couldn't catch it and throwing a weak toss into the cutoff man.

Brian26
07-29-2008, 10:59 PM
IF the Sox win one of the next two, the Sox leave in 1st place, right?

Correct, the worst they can leave Minnesota is 0.5 up on the Twins.

JB98
07-29-2008, 11:01 PM
On Morneau's clutch double, Mauer scored from first. Now think about that for a moment - their catcher scored from first on a line drive double.

Tonight's big play boiled down to team speed. The Sox could be put into that same situation and only score two runs - tie game - rather than take the lead.

"I don't run, I trot." :whiner:

No, it didn't. The whole game came down to the ability to get clutch two-out hits. Mauer delivered twice, and Morneau once.

The Sox scored two in the second and had an opportunity for more. Couldn't get it done. Quentin got a fluke double in the third when the ball deflected off Gomez's glove. The Sox did nothing with that.

Redmond got a fluke hit off Anderson's glove. The result? A five-run inning for the Twins.

Sox had the leadoff man on in the seventh. Couldn't do anything with it. It's not about team speed. It's about making the most of opportunities.

Lip Man 1
07-29-2008, 11:01 PM
Kite:

That's an excellent point, one that Daver has made in the past.

There's a big difference between a good athlete and a good baseball player and it's not just physical skills. A lot of it involves mentally staying alert, knowing the game, knowing the rules and knowing what to do in certain situations.

Lip

hawkjt
07-29-2008, 11:02 PM
Ozzie made a comment today in the paper alluding to how the twins scout well and draft well and he can only coach the talent he has on the field.
Bottom line, twins have done a better job of drafting but one caveat: the sox never had a top 15 pick from 90 til this year...twins had high picks the whole nineties. Mauer was the first guy taken..sox never have that shot.
Still, twins are great at scouting and trading for young talent. The twins are eerie good at hitting with two out and runners in scoring position this year...like way better than anyone else in MLB.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:04 PM
Those bastards fooled me, they were suppose to suck!

The "perts" picked the Sox to finish 3rd. Without Santana the Twins were suppose to be lifeless and finish 4th.
No one expected CLE and DET to tank.

Domeshot17
07-29-2008, 11:05 PM
Kenny are you listening?

I'm sure they draft guys who are solid to begin. There is a difference between athletes and baseball players.

It isn't just drafting but also developing. We have no minor league clue how to develop.

Domeshot17
07-29-2008, 11:07 PM
Ozzie made a comment today in the paper alluding to how the twins scout well and draft well and he can only coach the talent he has on the field.
Bottom line, twins have done a better job of drafting but one caveat: the sox never had a top 15 pick from 90 til this year...twins had high picks the whole nineties. Mauer was the first guy taken..sox never have that shot.
Still, twins are great at scouting and trading for young talent. The twins are eerie good at hitting with two out and runners in scoring position this year...like way better than anyone else in MLB.

Plenty of teams don't have top picks who draft well. How many first round busts have we had while guys in rounds 2, 3 or even sandwhich picks do much better. Part of the problem is we draft cheap. Poreda was an easy sign, so we passed on Porcello, the much better player. Now Poreda is looking like a Matt Thornton type reliever who throws hard but lacks secondary stuff while Porcello has looked like a stud in the minors.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:08 PM
For some strange reason, I feel cautiously optimistic about these next 2 games. Perhaps my anger has turned into insanity though?

POTW. If you left out your last sentence people may want to know if you have a good crack dealer. :redneck

Rockabilly
07-29-2008, 11:12 PM
Chicago Media Sucks

Here we are playing in a big series aganist the Twins and both the sun- times and trib have the AP stories about the game instead of the beat writers...

What kind of **** is that.. They're all probably covering the Flubs in Milw...

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:13 PM
Will there be any self-indictment in this rant?

The last time he went on a rant, the Sox started winning but the rant was directed in the right direction.

Coop and Ozzie need to grow up and stop being so defensive. Hopefully they are smart enough not to seek jobs in NY.

LoveYourSuit
07-29-2008, 11:14 PM
Regardless of being in 1st place by a half game as a few are still hanging thier hats on, Anyone have the confidence with our current pitching staff to get out of round 1 of a play off series?


I don't.


The pitching either steps up or we are fried.

zaidecrannog
07-29-2008, 11:14 PM
It really sucks to lose again and again up there. Depressing.

I'm going to re-read the postgame thread from the other night when Dye homered to beat the Tigers.

DSpivack
07-29-2008, 11:14 PM
Chicago Media Sucks

Here we are playing in a big series aganist the Twins and both the sun- times and trib have the AP stories about the game instead of the beat writers...

What kind of **** is that.. They're all probably covering the Flubs in Milw...

The first stories up are usually the wire ones, then the beat writers' stories.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:14 PM
I briefly considered it when watching the game, but it's never a good idea to just walk in runs. He had Morneau down to two strikes and was one pitch away from getting out of it. He just couldn't get the job done. Oh well.

You got to take your hat off to Morneau in that one.

JB98
07-29-2008, 11:14 PM
Chicago Media Sucks

Here we are playing in a big series aganist the Twins and both the sun- times and trib have the AP stories about the game instead of the beat writers...

What kind of **** is that.. They're all probably covering the Flubs in Milw...

Both Gonzo and Cowley are in Minneapolis. You are overreacting. The beat writers haven't filed yet. The respective Web sites throw the AP story up as soon as the game gets over, just to have the result and a few details available.

LoveYourSuit
07-29-2008, 11:15 PM
Chicago Media Sucks

Here we are playing in a big series aganist the Twins and both the sun- times and trib have the AP stories about the game instead of the beat writers...

What kind of **** is that.. They're all probably covering the Flubs in Milw...


Thank God no one is covering our crap play.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:22 PM
It isn't just drafting but also developing. We have no minor league clue how to develop.

I think the Sox do a great job of turning out 1B/DH. Usually the latter. At some point it's also up the player to improve as well.

kevingrt
07-29-2008, 11:24 PM
The sky appears to be falling. I'm still fairly optimistic but many including some of my friends see it on top of their heads. :gulp:heres hoping to Gavin Floyd to keep it high.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:25 PM
It's not about team speed. It's about making the most of opportunities.

Team speed can also help create opportunities.

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:30 PM
They're all probably covering the Flubs in Milw...

Well yeah, Cubs have come through now the heat is on. They'll get even more attention if they choke this season away. It won't be the attention they'll want. Maybe they'll get lucky and blame it on a fan.

Tragg
07-29-2008, 11:31 PM
The last time he went on a rant, the Sox started winning but the rant was directed in the right direction.

Coop and Ozzie need to grow up and stop being so defensive. Hopefully they are smart enough not to seek jobs in NY.I remember the one after the Tampa series. But recently, isn't he having a rant a week now? cooper's an excellent - Ozzie needs to find more Coopers for the offense and other duties.
What does Cora do exactly?

Domeshot17
07-29-2008, 11:35 PM
I remember the one after the Tampa series. But recently, isn't he having a rant a week now? cooper's an excellent - Ozzie needs to find more Coopers for the offense and other duties.
What does Cora do exactly?

He is Ozzie's boy, he couldn't hack it as the 3b coach, but he used to turn double plays with Oz, so now he gets to sit on the bench and play Ozzie when he gets kicked out.

Hes had a few head coaching interviews, but nothing ever amounts, I have a feeling Ozzie highly overrates him.

russ99
07-29-2008, 11:39 PM
It really sucks to lose again and again up there. Depressing.

I'm going to re-read the postgame thread from the other night when Dye homered to beat the Tigers.

I'm hoping Kenny does something, anything before the deadline at 3pm Thursday to get us some help and turn this around. Plus it will send a message to the players that Kenny's serious about winning.

This idea being floated by particular Sox brass and associated agents of the press that we can coast to the playoffs with what we have is obviously ludicrous. Teams better than us and worse than us are making deals. Why the heck can't we??

kitekrazy
07-29-2008, 11:45 PM
Regardless of being in 1st place by a half game as a few are still hanging thier hats on, Anyone have the confidence with our current pitching staff to get out of round 1 of a play off series?


Nope. In 2005 we had a veteran staff. I never expected Danks and Floyd to have a first half like this. I expected more from Javi. Contreras shows signs of greatness and suckiness.
This team went pretty far on the performances of the younger players while veterans like Thome and Konerko were batting .200. Mark B didn't start out so hot either.
It it weren't for the 1st half performances of Quentin, Danks and Floyd, we might be in 3rd place and talking about dumping certain players.
The Sox have had more than their share of the injury bug this season.

Woofer
07-29-2008, 11:54 PM
Same here. It will be worse when I go to work tomorrow. The Twins fans are typically quiet, until they win.
Ouch. My suggestion is to move out of Minnesota.:smile: We will have plenty of happy Cub fans to deal with here, and they are never, ever quiet.

kitekrazy
07-30-2008, 12:00 AM
I'm hoping Kenny does something, anything before the deadline at 3pm Thursday to get us some help and turn this around.

I don't think there's anything out there to turn this team around. This late in the season with only the Angels running away with the division no one is going to give anything away.
I'd rather play this season out as is. You have to evaluate whether certain veterans are worth keeping around next season.

Nellie_Fox
07-30-2008, 12:38 AM
He is Ozzie's boy, he couldn't hack it as the 3b coach, but he used to turn double plays with Oz, so now he gets to sit on the bench and play Ozzie when he gets kicked out.

Hes had a few head coaching interviews, but nothing ever amounts, I have a feeling Ozzie highly overrates him.MLB doesn't have "head coaches."

BadBobbyJenks
07-30-2008, 03:09 AM
Only in that freaking dome...

Come backer off Clayton's leg goes into foul ground and two sox comebackers stay in front of the pitcher or ricochet to the fielder behind. So Sick. And really that was the difference.


Why does the phrase we are still in first place sound so stupid? It is the truth.

It's Dankerific
07-30-2008, 03:34 AM
Wow. what a harsh disappointment for me. I left for my Poker game when we were up 4-0. I had seen BA hit a HR and move over a runner. I left right after the hit Redmond got that BA just missed with a dive.

What happened? I read some of the gamethread and it seemed someone was upset at BA for making a bad throw? missing a cutoff man?

Then all of a sudden he was out of the game. Was he benched for a crap throw?

I never in a million years thought we'd have a loss today when I left the house. Everything seemed to be clicking so nicely.

BadBobbyJenks
07-30-2008, 03:43 AM
When the Twin are playing in that dome, it is like Happy Gilmore on the 18th putting through that monstrosity to win the green jacket. The Sox are like Shooter and there is nothing we can do, but watch the ball bounce back and forth and finally into the hole.

ms620
07-30-2008, 05:48 AM
We had this conversation yesterday. It's not July when the last series of the month is against the Twins and the date on my calendar is 7/29.

It a momentum shift. Period.

There have been atleast 3 times this year when the so called "momentum shift" was going to send the Sox on a downward spiral. So far this year they have been extremely resilient. Lets hope that continues.

white sox bill
07-30-2008, 06:17 AM
**** Morneau, **** Mauer, **** Gardenhire, **** Tom Kelly, **** Kirby Puckett, Hrbek **** you as well. Mall of a America go **** yourself.

Forgot Harmon Killebrew and Rod Carew..........hell IIRC they killed us too!
*****Killebrew *****Carew

Vienna
07-30-2008, 06:50 AM
Ouch. My suggestion is to move out of Minnesota.:smile: We will have plenty of happy Cub fans to deal with here, and they are never, ever quiet.

Good point. My wife is finishing grad school at the U of Minnesota next year. We're hoping to make it back to Illinois after that. BTW, Cowley had piece on his blog about Minnesota sports fans - http://blogs.suntimes.com/whitesox/2008/07/cowley_guide_on_how_to_be_a_mi.html

Bucky F. Dent
07-30-2008, 07:16 AM
:angry::angry::angry::dtroll::angry::angry::angry:

TJ33
07-30-2008, 07:27 AM
I'm a Twins fan, hope I don't get banned :D:

I'm not here to troll, i just like to have good debates with opposing fans.

Just sit down take a couple of deep breaths and relax. Your team is just too good to keep playing like this and I'm sure they'll bounce back when your rotation gets healthy, plus your offense is just too damn good. IMO, the Sox need to get a little more speed though.

I'm just hoping for a good race that will come down to the end of the season. I had my Twins finishing 4th in the central and I'm just enjoying this run right now. I still think the Sox will win the division, I'm just hoping the Twins can sneak into the Wild Card. A division title for the Twins would just be iceing on the cake.

As for the Dome, 99% of Twins fans would agree with what you guys are saying, IT SUCKS!!!!!!!! I go to around 15 games a year and it would be more if I the Twins didn't play in that ****hole they call a stadium. The 1 1/2 hour drive has something to do with it too :D:


I look forward to having some good debates with you Sox fans, unless I'm banned :D:


By the way, what the hell has happened to Konerko? I used to just dread watching this guy come to the plate against the Twins.


Good luck the rest of the way and here's to hoping both teams make the playoffs. Screw the East Coast teams :crossfingers::thumbsup:

ondafarm
07-30-2008, 07:32 AM
You have a very tight leash on pitchers. I suspect that rookie pitchers would not exactly blossom under you.


On the contrary, pitching contributing innings on a winning team, especially a championship one, builds enormous confidence and makes rookies blossom.


Any Sox fan who looks at last nights game and doesn't see it for what happened, Ozzie squandered a win, is suffering delusions.

Frater Perdurabo
07-30-2008, 07:34 AM
I'm a Twins fan, hope I don't get banned :D:

I'm not here to troll, i just like to have good debates with opposing fans.

Just sit down take a couple of deep breaths and relax. Your team is just too good to keep playing like this and I'm sure they'll bounce back when your rotation gets healthy, plus your offense is just too damn good. IMO, the Sox need to get a little more speed though.

I'm just hoping for a good race that will come down to the end of the season. I had my Twins finishing 4th in the central and I'm just enjoying this run right now. I still think the Sox will win the division, I'm just hoping the Twins can sneak into the Wild Card. A division title for the Twins would just be iceing on the cake.

As for the Dome, 99% of Twins fans would agree with what you guys are saying, IT SUCKS!!!!!!!! I go to around 15 games a year and it would be more if I the Twins didn't play in that ****hole they call a stadium. The 1 1/2 hour drive has something to do with it too :D:


I look forward to having some good debates with you Sox fans, unless I'm banned :D:


By the way, what the hell has happened to Konerko? I used to just dread watching this guy come to the plate against the Twins.


God luck the rest of the way and here's to hoping both teams make the playoffs. Screw the East Coast teams :crossfingers::thumbsup:

:welcome:

I can only speak for myself, but as long as you don't troll, and as long as you discuss baseball intelligently, you should be welcome here. We have some intelligent fans of the Tigers, Mariners and a few other clubs who post here regularly.

As for Paulie, we've had over 500 posts spread across two threads on him, plus plenty of discussion in other threads. It's quite emotional for many folks because he's come up with some big hits in his career. It hurts all of us to see him struggle like this. It's one of the biggest mysteries I've ever seen.

DrCrawdad
07-30-2008, 07:41 AM
I'm a Twins fan, hope I don't get banned :D:

I'm not here to troll, i just like to have good debates with opposing fans.

Just sit down take a couple of deep breaths and relax. Your team is just too good to keep playing like this and I'm sure they'll bounce back when your rotation gets healthy, plus your offense is just too damn good. IMO, the Sox need to get a little more speed though.

I'm just hoping for a good race that will come down to the end of the season. I had my Twins finishing 4th in the central and I'm just enjoying this run right now. I still think the Sox will win the division, I'm just hoping the Twins can sneak into the Wild Card. A division title for the Twins would just be iceing on the cake.

As for the Dome, 99% of Twins fans would agree with what you guys are saying, IT SUCKS!!!!!!!! I go to around 15 games a year and it would be more if I the Twins didn't play in that ****hole they call a stadium. The 1 1/2 hour drive has something to do with it too :D:


I look forward to having some good debates with you Sox fans, unless I'm banned :D:


By the way, what the hell has happened to Konerko? I used to just dread watching this guy come to the plate against the Twins.


Good luck the rest of the way and here's to hoping both teams make the playoffs. Screw the East Coast teams :crossfingers::thumbsup:

If the Twins win the AL Central, I will w/o hesitation root for the Twins in the post-season. That pretty much is my norm, rooting for AL Central teams.

TJ33
07-30-2008, 07:44 AM
:welcome:

I can only speak for myself, but as long as you don't troll, and as long as you discuss baseball intelligently, you should be welcome here. We have some intelligent fans of the Tigers, Mariners and a few other clubs who post here regularly.

As for Paulie, we've had over 500 posts spread across two threads on him, plus plenty of discussion in other threads. It's quite emotional for many folks because he's come up with some big hits in his career. It hurts all of us to see him struggle like this. It's one of the biggest mysteries I've ever seen.

Thanks for the welcome Frater :thumbsup:


Not here to troll, just here for some good baseball discussion :bandance:


Too bad about Konerko, at least for you guys. I can't say that I'm disappointed though:D:

I look forward to some great discussions.

I might actually get into the game thread tonight, but I think I'll get tore up :smile:

aryzner
07-30-2008, 07:45 AM
It boggles my mind how seemingly every break goes the Twins' way when the Sox are in Minnesota. I can't wrap my head around it.

Why couldn't one of OUR hits up the middle bounce so far off the pitcher? It's not fair! :whiner:

TJ33
07-30-2008, 07:47 AM
If the Twins win the AL Central, I will w/o hesitation root for the Twins in the post-season. That pretty much is my norm, rooting for AL Central teams.

I will be doing the same. As hard as it is to root for the Sox during the season, I will be rooting for them if the are in the playoffs.

I got grief from some of my friends when I was pulling for them in the 2005 playoffs.

Frater Perdurabo
07-30-2008, 07:50 AM
It boggles my mind how seemingly every break goes the Twins' way when the Sox are in Minnesota. I can't wrap my head around it.

Why couldn't one of OUR hits up the middle bounce so far off the pitcher? It's not fair! :whiner:


Well, I think there's a partial explanation for the umpires having a double standard.

Hawk is notorious for complaining about bad calls. And I think this permeates the entire team. Even Frank Thomas was that way (yes, his eye was good enough that he was a better judge of the strike zone than many umpires, but he still didn't do himself any favors by complaining). Ozzie also chirps a lot.

Meanwhile, the Twins do not argue balls and strikes and they don't really argue with the umps at all. Gardenhire's conversation with the umps over the Dye homer/foul ball was calm and reasonable.

In short, umpires are human and they are more likely to have close calls go the way of the team that doesn't complain and against the team that does.

TJ33
07-30-2008, 07:54 AM
It boggles my mind how seemingly every break goes the Twins' way when the Sox are in Minnesota. I can't wrap my head around it.

Why couldn't one of OUR hits up the middle bounce so far off the pitcher? It's not fair! :whiner:

I say the same thing when the Twins don't get the breaks on the road. I just think when you're watching your team you always remember the breaks your team didn't get and don't remember the breaks your team did get.

I understand what you're saying though. Every fan does it, just like in the 1st game of the series, I thought Slowey had Thome struck out looking on a really close pitch and then he got called out on a pitch that looked high to me. I remember the one that he could've been K'd on and Sox fans remember the high fastball he did get called out on.

palehozenychicty
07-30-2008, 08:24 AM
Agreed. If we lose the division to the Twins, shame on us. That is NOT a great baseball team up there in Minnesota.

It's time to stop fellating the Twins, sack up and play some damn baseball.


Thank you. I'm tired of us feeling sorry for ourselves losing to these guys. How we lose to them is beyond me. Whenever they come out East or enter the playoffs, they get annihilated.

ondafarm
07-30-2008, 08:28 AM
In short, umpires are human and they are more likely to have close calls go the way of the team that doesn't complain and against the team that does.

This is always a debate in sports circles.

One of the most effective 'complainers' I know of was Tommy Lasorda. He'd go out and argue and really let the umpire hear about it when a close call didn't go his (Dodger's) way.

His logic was always, "argue about this one to get the next one."

If an ump is really jobbing you all night then giving them an earful is not just deserved but constructive. They'll choose to be scrupuously honest the next go around typically. If an umpire can't put aside his hatred of one team, or love of another then he/she shouldn't be umpiring. Avoiding somebody's games is fine, giving an advantage is not.

Personally, I don't recall one major call at the H-dome that went terribly against the Twins, so why should they complain.

ike from nj
07-30-2008, 08:30 AM
is it just me or does anybody else agree that brian anderson is really overrated as an outfielder? i don't think i have ever seen him make a good throw and he makes a lot of mistakes. often time his reads are weak and it's no wonder that he is a part time player at best. he is not the answer in centerfield.

ms620
07-30-2008, 08:42 AM
is it just me or does anybody else agree that brian anderson is really overrated as an outfielder? i don't think i have ever seen him make a good throw and he makes a lot of mistakes. often time his reads are weak and it's no wonder that he is a part time player at best. he is not the answer in centerfield.

Absolutely agree. Even though he hit that HR, I still do not love his approach at the plate. With Cabrera on second and no outs, he hit a soft fly ball to CF. Not exactly what you are looking for there, even though Cabrera got to 3rd. And his defense, which is supposed to be his strong point, is just shaky. If Swisher dropped that bloopper everyone here would be saying "Anderson would have had it". But you know what, Anderson dropped it. And his missed cutoff man was just unacceptable.

ike from nj
07-30-2008, 08:51 AM
hawk was ripping him for that. i have never heard hawk be so critical of a sox player. i think he finally realizes anderson's weakness' also.

turners56
07-30-2008, 08:59 AM
I still can't believe how terribly JD played Morneau's liner. Yes it was hit hard, but if he didn't take two steps in he would of easily had that ball.

palehozenychicty
07-30-2008, 09:02 AM
Just an ugly fifth inning all around. It's still July, but this has not been a good series for them.

Frater Perdurabo
07-30-2008, 09:02 AM
hawk was ripping him for that. i have never heard hawk be so critical of a sox player. i think he finally realizes anderson's weakness' also.

I didn't see the play.

If BA, who is known for his defense, made a boneheaded play on defense, then Hawk should rip him.

What I don't understand is why Hawk won't rip Paulie for sucking at the plate, when Paulie is paid to do nothing but hit.

This organization values loyalty over performance.

ike from nj
07-30-2008, 09:03 AM
I still can't believe how terribly JD played Morneau's liner. Yes it was hit hard, but if he didn't take two steps in he would of easily had that ball.
that would not have been an easy catch for anybody...maybe guillen should have pulled richard for thornton to face morneau as he was warming up.

beasly213
07-30-2008, 09:05 AM
Man, you'd have thought that this game was the end of the year and the Twins eliminated the Sox from the playoffs.
Look this series has provided nothing we didn't already know.

-The Sox struggle in the Hump Dome? Check

-The Sox struggle on the road at times? Check

-The starting pitching has not been the best recently? Check

The sox are going to win the next two games in this series. I have all the confidence in they will.

turners56
07-30-2008, 09:08 AM
Man, you'd have thought that this game was the end of the year and the Twins eliminated the Sox from the playoffs.
Look this series has provided nothing we didn't already know.

-The Sox struggle in the Hump Dome? Check

-The Sox struggle on the road at times? Check

-The starting pitching has not been the best recently? Check

The sox are going to win the next two games in this series. I have all the confidence in they will.

Richard wasn't exactly helped out by his defense in that inning. If the defense played like it was supposed to play, Richard would of gotten out of that inning with 2 runs and the Sox would still be up by 2 at that point in the game.

hula
07-30-2008, 09:15 AM
I think it's too soon for Ozzie to think Richard is a sure bet handling the pitching, no matter what he did in the minors. He should have pulled him earlier in the 5th inning and we might have had a chance to win the game...just my opinion... I just can't take another loss tonight.... :whiner:

ike from nj
07-30-2008, 09:15 AM
Richard wasn't exactly helped out by his defense in that inning. If the defense played like it was supposed to play, Richard would of gotten out of that inning with 2 runs and the Sox would still be up by 2 at that point in the game.
richard had ample opportunities to pitch out of that inning including but not limited to being ahead of both mauer and morneau and not finishing the deal. he needs to be back in AAA as he's not ready yet.

ma-gaga
07-30-2008, 09:28 AM
I might actually get into the game thread tonight, but I think I'll get tore up :smile:


Welcome to WSI, the best fan board on the planet*. :cool: As a Twins fan, take my advice; Stay out of the game threads. Lurk them, enjoy them, but I would not post in them. It's too easy to get caught up in the moment and get banned for trolling.

* well, at least the upper mid-west.

North Sox Sider
07-30-2008, 09:31 AM
You know what kills me about playing in that crappy dome is how we NEVER Seem to get a break. How about Ramirez hitting the ball up the middle and having it bounce off of Perkins leg but the ball stays right in front of him so he can throw Alexei out. Mauer hits Richard's leg and the ball bounces back toward the plate to score a run Mauer makes it to first. That is just typical of our luck at that stadium. I personally would love to push the button that blows that stadium up.

October26
07-30-2008, 09:37 AM
I think it's too soon for Ozzie to think Richard is a sure bet handling the pitching, no matter what he did in the minors. He should have pulled him earlier in the 5th inning and we might have had a chance to win the game...just my opinion... I just can't take another loss tonight.... :whiner:

I agree with you that Ozzie should have pulled Richard in that 5th inning and maybe the Sox have a chance in that game. I did not post last night after the game because I was so disgusted that once again the Twins had found a way to beat the Sox. Today, I am tired AND disgusted.

I will say this - I have been impressed with what I have seen so far in two major league outings from Clayton Richard. He is not afraid to pitch at this level (so far he has faced the Texas Rangers and the Minnesota Twins). I believe that Clayton Richard's future is very bright and I know Cooper will work with Richard as he did with Danks and hopefully we will all get to see the improvements.

Also, remember that the reason Richard is here is because of our pitching disabilities. Richard clearly needs more time to develop his pitches but I think Richard did an admirable job last night considering the pressure he was pitching under last night. Do I wish he had been able to get out the M & M brothers? Of course, but I will not put that loss completely on Richard. The White Sox seem to be intimidated by the Twins in that ballpark and it doesn't matter what players the Sox and the Twins have on their respective teams, the Sox have a difficult time beating the Twins up there.

spiffie
07-30-2008, 09:41 AM
is it just me or does anybody else agree that brian anderson is really overrated as an outfielder? i don't think i have ever seen him make a good throw and he makes a lot of mistakes. often time his reads are weak and it's no wonder that he is a part time player at best. he is not the answer in centerfield.
http://www.hiroshima-remembered.com/photos/nagasaki/images/H21.jpg

Pencil the thread in for 500 posts now.

Shores
07-30-2008, 09:46 AM
I can't believe how much everyone here blames the stadium. Did I miss something? Still three outs to a side? Still four balls for a walk and three for a strikeout?

I knew Clayton was going to struggle the third time through the lineup.

ms620
07-30-2008, 09:50 AM
I can't believe how much everyone here blames the stadium. Did I miss something? Still three outs to a side? Still four balls for a walk and three for a strikeout?

I knew Clayton was going to struggle the third time through the lineup.

I agree. Last nights game had nothing to do with the Dome.

turners56
07-30-2008, 10:05 AM
richard had ample opportunities to pitch out of that inning including but not limited to being ahead of both mauer and morneau and not finishing the deal. he needs to be back in AAA as he's not ready yet.

That happens to almost every pitcher. How many times have you seen Gavin Floyd do that? How many times have you seen John Danks do that?

turners56
07-30-2008, 10:06 AM
I agree. Last nights game had nothing to do with the Dome.

Maybe if there was no baggy, Dye wouldn't of played that ball so badly...

I don't get the walls they have out there, what is that crap? It's not padding, is it a plastic tarp or something?

hula
07-30-2008, 10:15 AM
I will say this - I have been impressed with what I have seen so far in two major league outings from Clayton Richard. He is not afraid to pitch at this level (so far he has faced the Texas Rangers and the Minnesota Twins). I believe that Clayton Richard's future is very bright and I know Cooper will work with Richard as he did with Danks and hopefully we will all get to see the improvements.

Also, remember that the reason Richard is here is because of our pitching disabilities. Richard clearly needs more time to develop his pitches but I think Richard did an admirable job last night considering the pressure he was pitching under last night. Do I wish he had been able to get out the M & M brothers? Of course, but I will not put that loss completely on Richard. The White Sox seem to be intimidated by the Twins in that ballpark and it doesn't matter what players the Sox and the Twins have on their respective teams, the Sox have a difficult time beating the Twins up there.

I agree with you too on all points. I would put the loss on Ozzie for not starting to get someone warmed up as soon as that first hit happened in the 5th, rather than letting the whole inning go on with more runs scored and not getting him outta there quicker. Richard has been very impressive, but we saw his limit last night that was forced beyond where it had to be in that particular situation. Why wait till the damage is done in such a crucial series before getting a reliever reading to come in? That's all I'm sayin'

ike from nj
07-30-2008, 10:22 AM
I agree with you too on all points. I would put the loss on Ozzie for not starting to get someone warmed up as soon as that first hit happened in the 5th, rather than letting the whole inning go on with more runs scored and not getting him outta there quicker. Richard has been very impressive, but we saw his limit last night that was forced beyond where it had to be in that particular situation. Why wait till the damage is done in such a crucial series before getting a reliever reading to come in? That's all I'm sayin'
he had thornton warming up and after mauer's shot off richard's leg i thought he might pull him for morneau. i guess he wanted to see if he could pitch out of it. richard does some things well but unfortunately not quite ready. the sox need another effective starter be it a healthy contreras or somebody acquired in a trade.

hawkjt
07-30-2008, 10:29 AM
Ozzies rant was against his doubters, it seems. Who is he talking about?
The fans? Does he get a ton of e-mails that he actually reads or something?

Honestly, I do not see Ozzie getting much guff other than on message boards like this and if he is reading message boards...that is a mistake.
Of course, it is probably just ozzie using the ole ''us against the world'' tactic in the locker room,which is fine by me. Anything to get some wins.

As for taking Richard out for Thornton...Matt gave up the winning run later in the game anyway so right now,there are no sure bets on the sox pitching staff outside of maybe Bobby.

ms620
07-30-2008, 10:33 AM
That happens to almost every pitcher. How many times have you seen Gavin Floyd do that? How many times have you seen John Danks do that?

I do not really see the point you are trying to make. The difference is this, Danks and Floyd have already had moderate success this season inthe majors. Richard hasn't. Obviously its only been 2 starts, but until he proves that he CAN get out of those situations, Ozzie needs to be extremely careful with him. I understand letting him pitch to Mauer. But Thornton should have been in vs. Morneau.

UofCSoxFan
07-30-2008, 10:40 AM
For everyone that wanted Ozzie to thake Richard out, remember that our bullpen has been overworked and ineffective for the past 3 weeks. Bringing a guy in in the fifth is not the best solution to this. Richard had both hitters 1-2 and couldn't finish the job. I still liked his chances there.

ike from nj
07-30-2008, 10:54 AM
For everyone that wanted Ozzie to thake Richard out, remember that our bullpen has been overworked and ineffective for the past 3 weeks. Bringing a guy in in the fifth is not the best solution to this. Richard had both hitters 1-2 and couldn't finish the job. I still liked his chances there.
i think that's the point...he has yet to show the ability to get out of trouble. thornton may have given it up to morneau in the fifth also but that was the key at bat in the game.

It's Dankerific
07-30-2008, 11:13 AM
Absolutely agree. Even though he hit that HR, I still do not love his approach at the plate. With Cabrera on second and no outs, he hit a soft fly ball to CF. Not exactly what you are looking for there, even though Cabrera got to 3rd. And his defense, which is supposed to be his strong point, is just shaky. If Swisher dropped that bloopper everyone here would be saying "Anderson would have had it". But you know what, Anderson dropped it. And his missed cutoff man was just unacceptable.

I had to leave before the missed cutoff throw, so I can't say how bad that was, but its certainly not the first time an OF has missed a cutoff throw. Swisher has airmailed it plenty of times this year.

But complaining about BA getting the job done in the 1st? thats insane. HIS JOB was to get OC to 3rd. Its EXACTLY what you are looking for there.

I did see the blooper hit. Swish doesnt touch that ball, he just picks it up on the hop. Wise has a chance because he constantly plays so shallow. DJ and Hawk, who was said to rip the cutoff, all said he that BA had an outstanding effort on that play. its just more twin BS.

kitekrazy
07-30-2008, 11:22 AM
i think that's the point...he has yet to show the ability to get out of trouble. thornton may have given it up to morneau in the fifth also but that was the key at bat in the game.

Wasn't this when the CF threw to home so there's runners on 2nd, 3rd, no chance for a double play. Where was Dye? He looked out of position.

It's the typical mental errors from the Sox at the dome.

ondafarm
07-30-2008, 11:38 AM
that would not have been an easy catch for anybody...maybe guillen should have pulled richard for thornton to face morneau as he was warming up.

That was a hard catch for anybody. It possibly could have been played slightly better and kept the guy from first from scoring, but that's really calling for perfect plays all around. I have no problem with Dye's play.

VenturaFan23
07-30-2008, 11:59 AM
http://www.hiroshima-remembered.com/photos/nagasaki/images/H21.jpg

Pencil the thread in for 500 posts now.

Haha, that was my first intial reaction too.

nasox
07-30-2008, 12:26 PM
Agreed. If we lose the division to the Twins, shame on us. That is NOT a great baseball team up there in Minnesota.

It's time to stop fellating the Twins, sack up and play some damn baseball.


Every man's dream.

kitekrazy
07-30-2008, 12:36 PM
Of course, it is probably just ozzie using the ole ''us against the world'' tactic in the locker room,which is fine by me. Anything to get some wins.


It's an old act. He needs to cross that bridge of reality that there are critics and they are not always fair.

If I was a reporter I would laugh at the "win it all" comment. What happens if they finish 3rd? It's not impossible. What's he gonna say then?

35th and Shields
07-30-2008, 01:07 PM
I do not really see the point you are trying to make. The difference is this, Danks and Floyd have already had moderate success this season inthe majors. Richard hasn't. Obviously its only been 2 starts, but until he proves that he CAN get out of those situations, Ozzie needs to be extremely careful with him. I understand letting him pitch to Mauer. But Thornton should have been in vs. Morneau.

I definitely agree. We all know Ozzie has a tendency of leaving guys in there to long but regardless of what his strategy is for that he has to keep in mind that Richard is a ROOKIE pitching in a situation where the game could have been won or lost in a tight division race.

ondafarm
07-30-2008, 01:19 PM
I definitely agree. We all know Ozzie has a tendency of leaving guys in there to long but regardless of what his strategy is for that he has to keep in mind that Richard is a ROOKIE pitching in a situation where the game could have been won or lost in a tight division race.


What?!!! How dare you criticize Ozzie Guillen. He is the best manager in the history of baseball!!!

JB98
07-30-2008, 01:41 PM
Team speed can also help create opportunities.

We had plenty of opportunities to win last night. None of those opportunities were squandered because of lack of team speed. They were, however, squandered by a horse**** approach at the plate by several Sox hitters.

ms620
07-30-2008, 01:47 PM
I had to leave before the missed cutoff throw, so I can't say how bad that was, but its certainly not the first time an OF has missed a cutoff throw. Swisher has airmailed it plenty of times this year.

But complaining about BA getting the job done in the 1st? thats insane. HIS JOB was to get OC to 3rd. Its EXACTLY what you are looking for there.

I did see the blooper hit. Swish doesnt touch that ball, he just picks it up on the hop. Wise has a chance because he constantly plays so shallow. DJ and Hawk, who was said to rip the cutoff, all said he that BA had an outstanding effort on that play. its just more twin BS.

Here is the thing. If instead of the fly ball to CF, he hit a grounder to 3rd, that somehow OC advanced, he would have gotten the job done, but it still is not a good approach. When you want to advance the runner from 2nd to 3rd, you do not want to hit a medium flyball to CF. Luckily, their CF has a terrible arm. Some CF would have nailed OC at 3rd.

It's Dankerific
07-30-2008, 01:51 PM
Here is the thing. If instead of the fly ball to CF, he hit a grounder to 3rd, that somehow OC advanced, he would have gotten the job done, but it still is not a good approach. When you want to advance the runner from 2nd to 3rd, you do not want to hit a medium flyball to CF. Luckily, their CF has a terrible arm. Some CF would have nailed OC at 3rd.

You didn't watch the play, obviously. That hit was plenty deep enough, the CF has a cannon and threw offline. If he was more accurate, he'd be a gold glover because you can't name 3 CF that would have nailed OC in that situation.

Instead of pulling the ball to the 3b, he went with an opposite field/up the middle swing and put it into CF. Like he's supposed to.

You probably figure that his HR wasn't deep enough either, if he had hit the ball more squarely it coulda been a tape measure.

spiffie
07-30-2008, 02:33 PM
What?!!! How dare you criticize Ozzie Guillen. He is the best manager in the history of baseball!!!
He's sure no Razor Shines.

The Clearwater Threshers are the best managed 13-22 (2nd half) team in the Florida State League.

kittle42
07-30-2008, 02:33 PM
What?!!! How dare you criticize Ozzie Guillen. He is the best manager in the history of baseball!!!

I take no sides in this Ozzie debate. I think he is an above-average manager of men, and a below-average game manager. He's ok.

But this, onda, is where the bull**** comes in. The reason you get ripped on for ripping on Ozzie is that that's all you *ever* do. So don't act like someone else making an opinion about Ozzie doing something wrong means they should get slammed, too.

The same goes for the BA/anti-BA debate and the Konerko/anti-Konerko debate. Those who are, overall, all-or-nothing in either direction on any of these topics are just too much.

kittle42
07-30-2008, 02:34 PM
You didn't watch the play, obviously. That hit was plenty deep enough, the CF has a cannon and threw offline. If he was more accurate, he'd be a gold glover because you can't name 3 CF that would have nailed OC in that situation.

Instead of pulling the ball to the 3b, he went with an opposite field/up the middle swing and put it into CF. Like he's supposed to.

You probably figure that his HR wasn't deep enough either, if he had hit the ball more squarely it coulda been a tape measure.

There's plenty to worry about from last night's game. This thing is not one of them.

ondafarm
07-30-2008, 02:50 PM
I take no sides in this Ozzie debate. I think he is an above-average manager of men, and a below-average game manager. He's ok.

But this, onda, is where the bull**** comes in. The reason you get ripped on for ripping on Ozzie is that that's all you *ever* do. So don't act like someone else making an opinion about Ozzie doing something wrong means they should get slammed, too. . .

You did notice the teal?

I have several times listed what I like about Ozzie. He is an above-average manager of men. His shielding his players from mediots by taking all the attention upon himself is a great maneuver, if somewhat unconventional. His handling of the middle infielders play has been superb. He seldom seemed to drop in an inferior defensive player (like Ozuna) at second or short. When he did it was for single games and typically to rest the regular. In 2005, he was exactly the manager the White Sox needed. His contrast from Jerry Manuel was just perfect. That's four things that I am praising Ozzie for.

hula
07-30-2008, 03:23 PM
He's sure no Razor Shines.

The Clearwater Threshers are the best managed 13-22 (2nd half) team in the Florida State League.

I miss Razor! He did such a great job for years down in Charlotte and the Sox really didn't give him much of a chance up in Chicago. They were crazy to let him go.

I am not a big fan of Jeff Cox from what I've seen so far. On many occassions he'll either wave a guy on from 3rd, only to get thrown out at the plate, or not wave someone one who could have easily made it home. I just don't get him because in both cases he looked so obviously way off on his calls. :scratch:

ms620
07-30-2008, 03:23 PM
You didn't watch the play, obviously. That hit was plenty deep enough, the CF has a cannon and threw offline. If he was more accurate, he'd be a gold glover because you can't name 3 CF that would have nailed OC in that situation.

Instead of pulling the ball to the 3b, he went with an opposite field/up the middle swing and put it into CF. Like he's supposed to.

You probably figure that his HR wasn't deep enough either, if he had hit the ball more squarely it coulda been a tape measure.

The CF has a cannon? Wait, who is the one who did not watch the game? It was a medium flyball, on a long swing that he was jammed. He has yet to show a good approach at the plate, regardless if he hits home runs.

It's Dankerific
07-30-2008, 03:31 PM
The CF has a cannon? Wait, who is the one who did not watch the game? It was a medium flyball, on a long swing that he was jammed. He has yet to show a good approach at the plate, regardless if he hits home runs.

Its now clear to me you're just trying to set me off by talking crazy. I'm done participating like this was a serious discussion.

ondafarm
07-30-2008, 03:55 PM
He's sure no Razor Shines.

The Clearwater Threshers are the best managed 13-22 (2nd half) team in the Florida State League.

I have no idea what the talent level at that level A-ball for the Phillies is at this time. 13-22 may be a miracle or a disaster. Do you happen to know? I will say this, a lousy record but developing several players makes for a very successful single A team in most organizations.

spiffie
07-30-2008, 03:58 PM
I have no idea what the talent level at that level A-ball for the Phillies is at this time. 13-22 may be a miracle or a disaster. Do you happen to know? I will say this, a lousy record but developing several players makes for a very successful single A team in most organizations.
Seems kind of odd that a guy who you were adamant would be a much better fit for a high-payroll MLB team in a huge media market couldn't find a better spot than managing in low A ball on a team that seems to be the spot where they let former stars get a managing fix (Mike Schmidt is one of the recent predecessors there). Other 3B coaches slide into MLB managerial jobs, and Razor is bussing around the swamps of Tallahassee.

hula
07-30-2008, 04:00 PM
Seems kind of odd that a guy who you were adamant would be a much better fit for a high-payroll MLB team in a huge media market couldn't find a better spot than managing in low A ball on a team that seems to be the spot where they let former stars get a managing fix (Mike Schmidt is one of the recent predecessors there). Other 3B coaches slide into MLB managerial jobs, and Razor is bussing around the swamps of Tallahassee.

Maybe he thought he got a raw deal from the Sox and just wanted to lay low with lessor responsibilities. I dunno, but his team won their championship last year...

Oldfellah
07-30-2008, 05:01 PM
It's the hump dome,,, err the funk dome and we don't play well there... let's win the next two and get the hell out of there!!!