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View Full Version : Predict what KW will do at the trade deadline


Frater Perdurabo
07-28-2008, 09:12 AM
Obviously we already have discussed what we WANT the Sox to do. But what do you think Kenny Williams WILL do at the trade deadline?

On one hand we've heard KW say that the market is bad and that most deals staring him in the face would weaken the Sox this year and for the long term. On the other hand, we know that KW rarely telegraphs his moves and likes to operate "under the radar."

So what will KW do between now and July 31?

Nothing?

Acquire a reliever?

Acquire a starter?

Acquire a hitter?

You can vote for multiple options, so vote and discuss. :smile:

fquaye149
07-28-2008, 09:15 AM
That Konerko-for-a-bag-of-balls thing I brought up in the offseason is looking better and better every day!

Pull the trigger, Kenny!

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 10:11 AM
I don't know what he'll do, but I have a couple of ideas:

1. Send Paulie back to the DL for his oblique or hand or whatever it is that is still bothering him even though he doesn't need to be on the DL and put him on a rehab assignment, like they did with Loaiza. Paulie needs AB's but he's not helping us at all right now.

2. Put together a trade for Mark Kotsay. He's back from the DL and tearing the cover off the ball. He shouldn't cost much at all since I don't even think he'll be a Type B free agent, but who knows. Mark could take over in CF with Swish moving to first until Paulie finds his swing. When Paulie gets back, demote Wise back to Triple A and use Kotsay as your CF when you want to give someone a break. Keep Anderson as the defensive replacement.

3. Check into the cost of Arthur Rhodes. He could be a better value than Fuentes because of the cost and because we don't need a closer. Rhodes could help if Logan doesn't get his confidence back anytime soon.

4. Check the cost of Tim Redding. He's been doing very well in Washington but is still 30 years old and a former journeyman. If he's not too much he could help out at the back of the rotation. I'd give up one of our 4th/5th starter prospects in Double A/Triple A and a good relief prospect for him if he was that cheap, but he'd probably cost more.

5. Other pitchers to look at: Heath Bell (SD), Chad Bradford (BAL), Odalis Perez (WSH), John Grabow (PIT and probably expensive), Jeremy Affeldt (CIN), David Weathers (CIN)

The one thing I'm afraid of is that Kenny will do nothing because there are no huge names out there that we can afford or that we really need. I can understand if Kenny is hesitant to deal Josh for a guy like Duchscherer who is kind of an uncertainty beyond this year given that he's never done what he's doing now before, but I think there are a couple smaller moves out there that would help us a lot. We don't necessarily need a dominant set-up man or closer or a legit ace right now, but I think we will need someone in the pen to be pretty good for about 20-25 more games and a starter who will give some guys a bit of rest.

munchman33
07-28-2008, 10:15 AM
Kenny has to make moves, and he knows it. No way he gets caught sleeping.

btrain929
07-28-2008, 11:11 AM
Going off of what Opti said, Heath Bell would be a great pickup from a losing team. SD would probably ask for a lot (and I can't blame them), but I'd love that.

russ99
07-28-2008, 11:26 AM
I don't know what he'll do, but I have a couple of ideas:

1. Send Paulie back to the DL for his oblique or hand or whatever it is that is still bothering him even though he doesn't need to be on the DL and put him on a rehab assignment, like they did with Loaiza. Paulie needs AB's but he's not helping us at all right now.

2. Put together a trade for Mark Kotsay. He's back from the DL and tearing the cover off the ball. He shouldn't cost much at all since I don't even think he'll be a Type B free agent, but who knows. Mark could take over in CF with Swish moving to first until Paulie finds his swing. When Paulie gets back, demote Wise back to Triple A and use Kotsay as your CF when you want to give someone a break. Keep Anderson as the defensive replacement.

3. Check into the cost of Arthur Rhodes. He could be a better value than Fuentes because of the cost and because we don't need a closer. Rhodes could help if Logan doesn't get his confidence back anytime soon.

4. Check the cost of Tim Redding. He's been doing very well in Washington but is still 30 years old and a former journeyman. If he's not too much he could help out at the back of the rotation. I'd give up one of our 4th/5th starter prospects in Double A/Triple A and a good relief prospect for him if he was that cheap, but he'd probably cost more.

5. Other pitchers to look at: Heath Bell (SD), Chad Bradford (BAL), Odalis Perez (WSH), John Grabow (PIT and probably expensive), Jeremy Affeldt (CIN), David Weathers (CIN)

The one thing I'm afraid of is that Kenny will do nothing because there are no huge names out there that we can afford or that we really need. I can understand if Kenny is hesitant to deal Josh for a guy like Duchscherer who is kind of an uncertainty beyond this year given that he's never done what he's doing now before, but I think there are a couple smaller moves out there that would help us a lot. We don't necessarily need a dominant set-up man or closer or a legit ace right now, but I think we will need someone in the pen to be pretty good for about 20-25 more games and a starter who will give some guys a bit of rest.

Tim Redding was in our system last season (or maybe the one before). I doubt we'd give up prospects for a guy who couldn't make the club when he was pitching for Charlotte for a whole season.

I'd personally love it if Chad Bradford came back to the Sox. He could also mentor Wassermann.

Kotsay is a good idea, but I'm starting to doubt that Kenny would be able to get us an experienced hitter with the market the way it is now. It's probably better for him to focus on getting us 1-2 pitchers.

Law11
07-28-2008, 11:30 AM
We have nothing to offer for anything valuable and for whats out there between Oakland and Baltimore they are going to want a lot for their guys on the block.

Plus you have to remember there are about 10 other clubs looking for the same thing we are.
Chances are we do nothing because we have nothing to offer.

With Crede on the Dl our one chip in Fields now is gone.

CashMan
07-28-2008, 11:55 AM
I predict...say it like you mean it I predict

Jim Hendry will not only trade for a starting pitcher, he will also trade for a closer.


Brought to you by Brown's Chicken, it tastes better.

oeo
07-28-2008, 11:57 AM
Kenny has to make moves, and he knows it. No way he gets caught sleeping.

You don't make a move for the sake of making a move. If nothing is there, then nothing is there.

Hopefully someone cuts down on their demands and we can get a pitcher (a reliever or a starter).

asindc
07-28-2008, 12:02 PM
Tim Redding was in our system last season (or maybe the one before). I doubt we'd give up prospects for a guy who couldn't make the club when he was pitching for Charlotte for a whole season.

I'd personally love it if Chad Bradford came back to the Sox. He could also mentor Wassermann.

Kotsay is a good idea, but I'm starting to doubt that Kenny would be able to get us an experienced hitter with the market the way it is now. It's probably better for him to focus on getting us 1-2 pitchers.

I'd rather get Arthur Rhodes or another top reliever anyway. More pitching depth would make me more confident about the last two months. With a guy like Rhodes, we could afford more 5+ inning starts from Contreras, for instance.

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 12:04 PM
We have nothing to offer for anything valuable and for whats out there between Oakland and Baltimore they are going to want a lot for their guys on the block.

Plus you have to remember there are about 10 other clubs looking for the same thing we are.
Chances are we do nothing because we have nothing to offer.

With Crede on the Dl our one chip in Fields now is gone.

We've got quite a few trade chips actually, just like every single organization out there. Fields is just our only big chip, but there other guys teams would be interested in.

A few: Jon Link (who I'm really starting to like a lot and hope we keep), Kanekoa Texeria, John Shelby, Charlie Shirek, Brandon Allen, Chris Getz, Lance Broadway, Jack Egbert, Clayton Richard, Nevin Griffith, Adam Russell, Danny Richar, Jason Childers, Aaron Poreda, Derek Rodriguez, Anthony Carter, John Lujan...

Obviously some of those guys have more value than others but they're all prospects. A package like Shelby + Poreda + Russell might even be able to get us Sherrill. We know Billy Beane's people heavily scout the Sox as he's always picking up ex-Sox players, so maybe we could get a guy like Santiago Casilla who would actually help now and in the future as a set-up guy? There's enough out there though that we don't have to move Fields, it's just that if we don't give up Fields we probably won't be able to get Duchscherer who is the best guy available for what we're looking for.

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 12:14 PM
Tim Redding was in our system last season (or maybe the one before). I doubt we'd give up prospects for a guy who couldn't make the club when he was pitching for Charlotte for a whole season.

I'd personally love it if Chad Bradford came back to the Sox. He could also mentor Wassermann.

Kotsay is a good idea, but I'm starting to doubt that Kenny would be able to get us an experienced hitter with the market the way it is now. It's probably better for him to focus on getting us 1-2 pitchers.
Redding is a tough guy to gauge. Yes, he was once a member of the Knights, but he at one time was a pretty big prospect and he's always had stuff, it's just been whether or not he'd be able to harness it enough to pitch at the big league level. It didn't look like he ever would but he's turned into another Jack Cust/Ryan Ludwick kind of story for Washington.

Anyway, I don't get Nats games so I haven't seen him pitch, but he's put up good numbers and if he's available, he's an under-the-radar kind of guy. If the Sox had any interest, I'd trust their scouts.

2906
07-28-2008, 12:18 PM
We've got quite a few trade chips actually, just like every single organization out there. Fields is just our only big chip, but there other guys teams would be interested in.

A few: Jon Link (who I'm really starting to like a lot and hope we keep), Kanekoa Texeria, John Shelby, Charlie Shirek, Brandon Allen, Chris Getz, Lance Broadway, Jack Egbert, Clayton Richard, Nevin Griffith, Adam Russell, Danny Richar, Jason Childers, Aaron Poreda, Derek Rodriguez, Anthony Carter, John Lujan...



These are all interesting names and I would agree, some may have some value as a piece of a deal.

Someone mentioned Jason Childers in another thread. He's not what I'd call a prospect, he's 33 and has been kicking around the minors 11 years. Still, he's having a good year in Charlotte. Hopefully there aren't any more injuries or problems in the bullpen ... but if there's a need and the Sox brass deems Childers to be the best option from Charlotte, they'll add him to the 40 man and he'll get the call. He's not the most talented guy but he's not afraid and he knows what he's doing.

I do not think Williams will stand pat. I think something will break right near the deadline and he'll pick up a bullpen arm of some sort. However I do not see deals happening with either Oakland or Baltimore. Steve Stone said this morning that Beane and McPhail have very high asking prices and the White Sox might not match up.

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 12:22 PM
These are all interesting names and I would agree, some may have some value as a piece of a deal.

Someone mentioned Jason Childers in another thread. He's not what I'd call a prospect, he's 33 and has been kicking around the minors 11 years. Still, he's having a good year in Charlotte. Hopefully there aren't any more injuries or problems in the bullpen ... but if there's a need and the Sox brass deems Childers to be the best option from Charlotte, they'll add him to the 40 man and he'll get the call. He's not the most talented guy but he's not afraid and he knows what he's doing.

I do not think Williams will stand pat. I think something will break right near the deadline and he'll pick up a bullpen arm of some sort. However I do not see deals happening with either Oakland or Baltimore. Steve Stone said this morning that Beane and McPhail have very high asking prices and the White Sox might not match up.
You're right on Childers. My mistake. I saw that in the other thread too and jotted it down. I actually meant to say Justin Cassel. He's not a huge prospect or anything but he's the type of guy that in a package might get us a useful older reliever or a bench guy or something. Really, a couple nice complimentary moves could help a ton.

balke
07-28-2008, 12:35 PM
I see a reliever coming back for Boone Logan and a minor leaguer. That's my shot in the dark. Street? I don't know. But some better reliever. I think the Sox are going to find bullpen help easier to acquire than a quality starter.

munchman33
07-28-2008, 12:48 PM
You don't make a move for the sake of making a move. If nothing is there, then nothing is there.

Hopefully someone cuts down on their demands and we can get a pitcher (a reliever or a starter).

Three starters and two relievers have moved already. There are moves to make. And we need help.

Jimmy Piersall
07-28-2008, 01:00 PM
Three starters and two relievers have moved already. There are moves to make. And we need help.

Me thinks the same.Javy & Jose are doing their best to keep
us on the ledge every time they throw and the bullpen needs
a boost as well.If Kenny stands pat the division is up for grabs
and the Twinks are going to get a boost as soon as they get
Liriano back.

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 01:42 PM
My trade ideas:

Sox trade to OAK:
3B Josh Fields
SP/RP Aaron Poreda
2B/OF John Shelby
RP Boone Logan
RP Adam Russell

Sox receive from OAK:
SP Justin Duchscherer
RP Santiago Casilla

******************

Sox trade to SEA:
CF Brian Anderson
SP/RP Nick Masset

Sox receive from SEA:
RP Arthur Rhodes
UT Willie Bloomquist

********************

Sox trade to ATL:
OF Jerry Owens/OF David Cook
SP Kyle McCulloch
RP Derek Rodriguez

Sox receive from ATL:
CF Mark Kotsay
Low-level throw-in

SP: Duchscherer, Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Vazquez

BP: Jenks CL, Thornton LHSU, Linebrink RHSU, Dotel RHSU, Casilla RHSU, Rhodes LHSU, Contreras LR

Lineup: Cabrera SS, Pierzynski C, Quentin LF, Dye RF, Thome DH, Crede 3B, Konerko 1B, Swisher CF, Ramirez 2B

Bench: Uribe UT (2B, SS, 3B), Bloomquist UT (OF, 2B, 3B, PR), Hall C, Kotsay OF

*We pick up some added bench depth and deepen both the starting rotation and bullpen, but the Oakland deal kills a big chunk of what's left of the farm, at least until Beckham and Danks officially sign.

Anyone think any of these deals would work? Or would anyone be in favor of one of them?

Tragg
07-28-2008, 02:08 PM
The Atlanta trade doesn't look terrible (because we're trading Owens). But when you get down to it, Kotsay has a bad obp and no power, so why would we want him on this team?


The trade with Seattle is horrible. Bloomquist is about as useless a balllplayer as exists in the majors. Bloomquist has ZERO value. Arthur Rhodes must be 40 years old and is basically awful but who throws in a good stretch once in a while....if you want to take a shot with Rhodes and pray, fine, but at basically your nondescript AA pitcher price. Not for a young outfielder who plays +++ defense.

alohafri
07-28-2008, 02:12 PM
My trade ideas:

Sox trade to OAK:
3B Josh Fields
SP/RP Aaron Poreda
2B/OF John Shelby
RP Boone Logan
RP Adam Russell

Sox receive from OAK:
SP Justin Duchscherer
RP Santiago Casilla

******************

Sox trade to SEA:
CF Brian Anderson
SP/RP Nick Masset

Sox receive from SEA:
RP Arthur Rhodes
UT Willie Bloomquist

********************

Sox trade to ATL:
OF Jerry Owens/OF David Cook
SP Kyle McCulloch
RP Derek Rodriguez

Sox receive from ATL:
CF Mark Kotsay
Low-level throw-in

SP: Duchscherer, Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Vazquez

BP: Jenks CL, Thornton LHSU, Linebrink RHSU, Dotel RHSU, Casilla RHSU, Rhodes LHSU, Contreras LR

Lineup: Cabrera SS, Pierzynski C, Quentin LF, Dye RF, Thome DH, Crede 3B, Konerko 1B, Swisher CF, Ramirez 2B

Bench: Uribe UT (2B, SS, 3B), Bloomquist UT (OF, 2B, 3B, PR), Hall C, Kotsay OF

*We pick up some added bench depth and deepen both the starting rotation and bullpen, but the Oakland deal kills a big chunk of what's left of the farm, at least until Beckham and Danks officially sign.

Anyone think any of these deals would work? Or would anyone be in favor of one of them?

Heck, the Cubs were able to trade their guy from the doghouse (Murton). Why can't we trade ours (Anderson)? I like Anderson, but it is pretty obvious that the powers that be don't. So why not use him to get something?

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 02:27 PM
I like the trade with Atlanta sort of.
The trade with Seattle is horrible. Bloomquist is about as useless a balllplayer as exists in the majors. Arthur Rhodes must be 40 years old and is basically awful....if you want to take a shot with Rhodes and pray, fine, but at basically your organizational minoir leaguer price.
Bloomquist brings nothing and so there's no reason why we would want him.
Bloomquist admittedly isn't the greatest ballplayer in the world, but on a team with a 4-man bench I like to have some depth in the IF. When Crede comes back Fields goes down, if he isn't traded, and then you only have one IF. Bloomquist can cover several positions so that's why I like him. He's having a good year for a bench player and also provides some speed. Seattle doesn't need him.

A deal like that would have the potential to bite the Sox in the ass, but I like the idea of sending Brian somewhere he could get some playing time. Masset is out of options and can't be sent down without being dealt or claimed through waivers, and I doubt he's in our longterm plans anymore. Maybe I'm wrong and he is, but with the emergence of Floyd and Danks he's pretty much out of the starting picture, and as a reliever I think he's been too hit-or-miss to stick around much longer.

Optipessimism
07-28-2008, 02:39 PM
The Atlanta trade doesn't look terrible (because we're trading Owens). But when you get down to it, Kotsay has a bad obp and no power, so why would we want him on this team?

Let me set the scene:

Playoff situation. You need a pinch hitter. Uribe? Anderson? Wise? Hall?

Kotsay sounds like a much better option to me, anyway.

Same thing with Rhodes. Playoff situation, tough lefty at the plate, RISP. Thornton has been used. Logan or Rhodes? I take Rhodes.

BTW, Rhodes is having a good year too. He's not getting traded for an organizational minor leaguer. In my scenario I'm overpaying, but if all Rhodes cost was a guy like Mike Huffman he'd have been gone by now.

palehozenychicty
07-28-2008, 02:44 PM
Heck, the Cubs were able to trade their guy from the doghouse (Murton). Why can't we trade ours (Anderson)? I like Anderson, but it is pretty obvious that the powers that be don't. So why not use him to get something?


I wonder the same thing about BA. If management thinks so little of him, why haven't they dumped him somewhere? The typical argument is that he has no value, blah blah blah.

His glove would be good enough to help a team like the Marlins (Willingham is not an OF, Maybin needs more time) and they have young, promising starters. Their defense is awful at every position.

Tragg
07-28-2008, 02:50 PM
Bloomquist admittedly isn't the greatest ballplayer in the world, but on a team with a 4-man bench I like to have some depth in the IF. When Crede comes back Fields goes down, if he isn't traded, and then you only have one IF. Bloomquist can cover several positions so that's why I like him. He's having a good year for a bench player and also provides some speed. Seattle doesn't need him.

A deal like that would have the potential to bite the Sox in the ass, but I like the idea of sending Brian somewhere he could get some playing time. Masset is out of options and can't be sent down without being dealt or claimed through waivers, and I doubt he's in our longterm plans anymore. Maybe I'm wrong and he is, but with the emergence of Floyd and Danks he's pretty much out of the starting picture, and as a reliever I think he's been too hit-or-miss to stick around much longer. If you are going to cut Ozuna you don't trade for Willie Bloomquist. Last year, Ozzie loaded the team up with his versatile players, none of whom could hit a lick -the result was baseball's worst offense. Why repeat that approach? Uribe can cover every infield position and he actually has some pop in his bat. We're fine at utility.
Massett "is what he is" - the 5th reliever. You want to trade him for Rhodes - fine with me.
It's likely that a position in the rotation will open up - although I doubt Masset is the man to fill it.

Tragg
07-28-2008, 02:56 PM
Let me set the scene:

Playoff situation. You need a pinch hitter. Uribe? Anderson? Wise? Hall?

Kotsay sounds like a much better option to me, anyway.

Same thing with Rhodes. Playoff situation, tough lefty at the plate, RISP. Thornton has been used. Logan or Rhodes? I take Rhodes.

BTW, Rhodes is having a good year too. He's not getting traded for an organizational minor leaguer. In my scenario I'm overpaying, but if all Rhodes cost was a guy like Mike Huffman he'd have been gone by now.

Then get a pinch hitter if we need a pinch hitter. Not Kotsay. And at least Anderson can go deep - a lot of times, that's what you need. That's what makes Uribe interesting off the bench. Not as pinch hitters, I agree. Kotsay is like Erstad.


Rhodes is having a good year. How long will it last? Last year he was horrible. HIs career isn't particularly good either. Give them Massett for him. You don't give a legitimate prospect for a 40 year old journeyman reliever.

If the Sox could get an equivalent player, we should trade Anderson. Ozzie has him platooning with meidocre journeyman Wise for backup duty, so nothing's going to change with Anderson's playing time. But I'd do that in the offseason.

forrestg
07-28-2008, 06:36 PM
Kw goes after Alex Rios and Aj Burnett giving up a struggling Paul kOnerko,( who will probably come out of his funk eventually) Jack Egbert, Brandon Allen (this is from matthew Pouliot from rotoworld) trade for AJ Burnett.. I believe we may also give another pitcher, Massett, and Anderson in the deal for Rios.. I believe Masset could be a better starter than he is a reliever.

Frater Perdurabo
07-28-2008, 06:39 PM
Kw goes after Alex Rios and Aj Burnett giving up a struggling Paul kOnerko,( who will probably come out of his funk eventually) Jack Egbert, Brandon Allen (this is from matthew Pouliot from rotoworld) trade for AJ Burnett.. I believe we may also give another pitcher, Massett, and Anderson in the deal for Rios.. I believe Masset could be a better starter than he is a reliever.

This would be an absolute steal for the Sox. Deeppink maybe?

Also, why would Paulie approve a trade to the Jays?

forrestg
07-28-2008, 06:47 PM
I just wanted to say that he might be good elsewhere for a while.. He won't go to a team that doesn' t have spring training in Arizona... Trade rumors have to have some sense of the Bizarre to them like they were writtten for the national enquirer.. I myself think that getting Rios who has been in some trade talk would be great.. Quentin, Rios and Dye.. Best outfield in both leagues...............

munchman33
07-28-2008, 07:05 PM
This would be an absolute steal for the Sox. Deeppink maybe?

Also, why would Paulie approve a trade to the Jays?

It is deep pink. But don't discount a trade of Paulie just because of a no-trade clause. If you tell him he's a pinch hitter the rest of his contract, he'd probably accept a trade.

WhiteSox5187
07-28-2008, 07:27 PM
Also, why would Paulie approve a trade to the Jays?
He loves hockey.

KyWhiSoxFan
07-28-2008, 07:51 PM
Also, why would Paulie approve a trade to the Jays?

He wants the Sox to win?

EMel9281
07-28-2008, 10:36 PM
If he does anything, and the good Lord is willing, he'll get God-awful Paul Konerko off of this team. Go get Mark Texeria somehow...