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DumpJerry
06-12-2008, 03:13 PM
Title says it all.

Sockinchisox
06-12-2008, 03:14 PM
It's June 12th.

I hope we didn't just wake up the sleeping giant.

cleanwsox
06-12-2008, 03:14 PM
Why the hell can't we hit on the road?

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 03:14 PM
Its the 12th.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:14 PM
Good pitching...what can you do?

Get it going back home tomorrow night...

:shrug:

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 03:15 PM
Good pitching...what can you do?

Get it going back home tomorrow night...

:shrug:

BS its not the pitching we faced. Its our hitting.

mccoydp
06-12-2008, 03:15 PM
That's what happens when the offense only scores one ****ing run.

Jesus, guys, be consistent.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:15 PM
Good pitching...what can you do?

Get it going back home tomorrow night...

:shrug:

More like Paul Konerko loves hitting into double plays. He was our only offense, but he also ruined numerous other chances in this game. Alexei was ever-so-close to catching that Guillen single. Man, what a terrible series. My bad feeling for this series was right.

nsdjoe
06-12-2008, 03:15 PM
I hope I'm wrong, but this series really appeared as if the hitters decided they played a great homestand and were just going to take a break.

gobears1987
06-12-2008, 03:15 PM
Burhle pitched a great game and this team couldn't give him a win.

russ99
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
It's June 12th.

I hope we didn't just wake up the sleeping giant.

8 games back is a heck of a lot less daunting than 10 back... not happy.

Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:

RedHeadPaleHoser
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
Good pitching...what can you do?

Get it going back home tomorrow night...

:shrug:

We can't hit against a dog**** team on the ****ing road, someone in our division. I am not dark clouding, just angered at the inconsistency in this ****ing team's lack of offense.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
BS its not the pitching we faced. Its our hitting.

:rolleyes:

Here we go again

cheezheadsoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
We've pretty much had our way with Detroit the last couple of years so maybe this is just the baseball gods evening things out. But why the hell is our hitting so damm bi-polar.:angry:

aryzner
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
We'll be swept by the Cubs and never hear the end of it if they play like that next weekend, and then we'll never hear the end of it. I really don't feel like having that happen.

palehozenychicty
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
Referencing the 1990 ad campaign, "Who are these guys?"

Detroit needed this series more than we did, but the hitting and baserunning were kinda stinky. At least it's a short trip, so we move on.

Stringer
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
:whiner:

Droso5
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
After yesterdays game and having Rogers on the mound today, I pretty much counted on them losing. Not saying I'm happy, or I told ya' so, but this was classic White Sox offense to a friggin' T. Let's hope they can get back into a groove and actually be able to score more than 1 run. I pray that this isn't the return of the Tigers (unlikely, their pitching sucks, but who knows) and of the "normal" White Sox offense. I.E. what we bitch and complain about on here and what Ozzie has heart attacks over.

whitesoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
It's June 12th.

I hope we didn't just wake up the sleeping giant.

Yeah, I'm sure we did. Still a long way to go in the season.

Wasted a gem by Buehrle today. Inconsistency - one of my biggest pet peeves. Back to the offense we saw in Tampa.

Irishsox1
06-12-2008, 03:16 PM
Kenny Rogers and Verlander are good pitchers so those games were going to be tough. The game we needed was the first game and they blew it.

Corlose 15
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
Let's see, the Sox had won 7 straight games by absolutely pounding the ball with consistently good pitching and they go on the road to a place where they have consistently played well against a team they have consistently beat and what happens? In typical White Sox fashion they fail to capitalize on their momentum and get swept.

Ugh.

SoxSpeed22
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
Typical against a soft-tossing lefty with a good changeup.
Buehrle and the defense played great, but this offense is still far too streaky and inconsistent. A bad series is a bad series, let's just beat the crap out of the NL.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
8 games back is a heck of a lot less daunting than 10 back... not happy.

Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:

Probably because Paul Konerko is not a great bunter?

:dunno:

I'm willing to let Paul swing instead of bunt.

delben91
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
BS its not the pitching we faced. Its our hitting.

For what it's worth, I listened to the Tigers radio broadcast on Tuesday and Wednesday. Both nights the announcers commented that it was the best stuff Robertson/Verlander had had in at least a month.

Homerism? I dunno, I don't typically listen to the Tigers radio team. Just sayin'.

Then again, the season's over, let's just shut WSI down for the winter. Catch you for spring training.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
ANOTHER quality start wasted. Just awful. And now the Tigers are instilled with confidence. Not good. Not good at all. Thing is this offense is constructed to be red hot at times and ice cold at times. We better ****ing snap out of this soon. We're not in bad shape but it's so ****ing frustrating!

peelwonder
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
6 losses in a row on the road...

3 of them by walkoff.....

Jollyroger2
06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
It's June 12th.

I hope we didn't just wake up the sleeping giant.

Oh please. Detroit still isn't going anywhere. The only people that made them a "giant" were the gasbags in the media. Our offense scored 6 runs in 3 games vs. a lousy team. This one's on us, not them.

Now they'll go home and pound on some NL weaklings and everyone will think they're WS bound again.

MushMouth
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
way to battle at the plate fellas
lots of quality ab's today

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
One thing about Dotel, is he stupid? He almost gave up a homer to Ordonez the at bat before and just falls behind Cabrera so he can give him a cookie to hit.

whitesoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
8 games back is a heck of a lot less daunting than 10 back... not happy.

Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:

Yeah...you're not going to bunt with your cleanup hitter. What is this, little league?

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
We might have just woke up the sleeping giant.

Unreal.

To score 6 runs in the series off that pitching staff...... people need to start looking at mirrors one again.

Every one of the games we had a favorable pitching matchup going our way....meanwhile we go 0 for 3.

Thank God we are home almost the entire rest of this month..... This team SUCKS on the road and usually this is a bad mix for post season play.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
Yeah, I'm sure we did. Still a long way to go in the season.

:rolleyes:

This is got to be the 7th or 8th time on these boards people have lamented over the "Tigers waking up."

Uh, hello, they scored 2 ****ing runs today. Pardon me if I continue to dismiss them as also-rans.

oeo
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
I'd like to thank the White Sox offense for showing up in Detroit...

...oh wait.

How is this team ever going to win consistently, when they can't get a consistent offense? They're either all hitting well together, or they're all hitting like **** together. When it's not one of those two, they get a couple of solo bombs and good pitching to win.

Ugh...they're so damn frustrating. Watch them scoring 30 runs this weekend.

And BTW, **** the Tigers. They're not that good. We didn't 'awake a sleeping giant' because they're not a giant at all. I'm more pissed with this inept offense.

Corlose 15
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
For what it's worth, I listened to the Tigers radio broadcast on Tuesday and Wednesday. Both nights the announcers commented that it was the best stuff Robertson/Verlander had had in at least a month.

Homerism? I dunno, I don't typically listen to the Tigers radio team. Just sayin'.

Then again, the season's over, let's just shut WSI down for the winter. Catch you for spring training.

You were able to listen to Jim Price and your brain didn't explode? Kudos, my friend.:cool:

October26
06-12-2008, 03:18 PM
This one hurts because Buehrle pitched his heart out. Gotta tip our caps to the Tigers, though. They played better than the Sox the last 3 games.

russ99
06-12-2008, 03:19 PM
Probably because Paul Konerko is not a great bunter?

:dunno:

I'm willing to let Paul swing instead of bunt.

In a tie game in the 9th in a big game on the road, I'd prefer Paulie to put his homer-swing happiness in check for once and do the stinking little things needed to grind out a win, which is what good teams do.

Jerko
06-12-2008, 03:19 PM
Oh please. Detroit still isn't going anywhere. The only people that made them a "giant" were the gasbags in the media. Our offense scored 6 runs in 3 games vs. a lousy team. This one's on us, not them.

Now they'll go home and pound on some NL weaklings and everyone will think they're WS bound again.

Agreed. We'll be back up on those guys by double digits by next weekend IMO.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:19 PM
What do the Tigers and Rockies have in common? They're both underachieving and they both have crappy records. We better get our act together.

southsideirish71
06-12-2008, 03:19 PM
Our last 6 road games. 3 walk off losses, and 10 runs total scored.

Our offense only works when the temp is 80+, the wind is blowing out, and we are at the bandbox at home. Maybe we can stop the softball crap at some point and play baseball. It would allow our team to be more consistent.

delben91
06-12-2008, 03:19 PM
One thing about Dotel, is he stupid? He almost gave up a homer to Ordonez the at bat before and just falls behind Cabrera so he can give him a cookie to hit.

Yep, he's so stupid he fell behind in the count on purpose. Lot's of pitchers do that I hear. Purposely get behind in the count so they have to groove one.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:20 PM
Thank God we are home almost the entire rest of this month..... This team SUCKS on the road and usually this is a bad mix for post season play.

You realize even with today's loss, the Sox have one of the best road records in the American League, right? You know there's only 1 AL team with a winning road record, don't you?

No, you probably don't.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:20 PM
In a tie game in the 9th in a big game on the road, I'd prefer Paulie to put his homer-swing happiness in check for once and do the stinking little things needed to grind out a win, which is what good teams do.

Konerko almost struck out the pitch before the DP in the 9th, Pudge couldn't hang on to it. Maybe he should of held on.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:20 PM
I'd like to thank the White Sox offense for showing up in Detroit...

...oh wait.

How is this team ever going to win consistently, when they can't get a consistent offense? They're either all hitting well together, or they're all hitting like **** together. When it's not one of those two, they get a couple of solo bombs and good pitching to win.

Ugh...they're so damn frustrating. Watch them scoring 30 runs this weekend.

We'll win with good pitching and just enough offense....but this offense's only consistency is in being inconsistent.

soxfandy
06-12-2008, 03:20 PM
That was a pretty pathetic 3 game series. Everyone of their pitchers had an era over 5 so i dont wanna hear anything about their pitching. Our hitting just sucks. Our offense had a outburst at home against some not so good teams. If we dont hit homeruns we dont score...as simple as that. We are not going anywhere until we learn to hit on the road. All of the sudden the tigers are only 8 games back...if u let these guys hang around it might come back to hurt you!!!

...
06-12-2008, 03:20 PM
One thing about Dotel, is he stupid? He almost gave up a homer to Ordonez the at bat before and just falls behind Cabrera so he can give him a cookie to hit.

Dotel just plain sucks.

whitesoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:20 PM
:rolleyes:

This is got to be the 7th or 8th time on these boards people have lamented over the "Tigers waking up."

Uh, hello, they scored 2 ****ing runs today. Pardon me if I continue to dismiss them as also-rans.

There's 3 1/2 months left of baseball. Everyone counted out Cleveland in 05 and Minnesota in 06, yet we all know what happened there.

I attribute them only scoring two runs was due to Buehrle. They can still mash and they're still a threat. We can't take anyone lightly and it seems that's what we did for three days.

PhillipsBubba
06-12-2008, 03:21 PM
Looks like the Sox are back to their pitty pat hitting style...

Too bad they couldn't have built on their "mo" coming out of the Twins series and buried the Tigers.

It's going to be interesting to see how both teams respond heading into the next series.

BadBobbyJenks
06-12-2008, 03:21 PM
Title says it all.

It sure does...I can't wait to see some posts in here today.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:21 PM
In a tie game in the 9th in a big game on the road, I'd prefer Paulie to put his homer-swing happiness in check for once and do the stinking little things needed to grind out a win, which is what good teams do.

Good teams also don't make players who can't bunt bunt just because that's what they did in the '30's. Good teams let their players do what they do best and when they succeed they celebrate, and when they don't, they tip their cap to the other team.

Good teams don't force it.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:21 PM
Jesus christ...get a grip people.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:21 PM
Yep, he's so stupid he fell behind in the count on purpose. Lot's of pitchers do that I hear. Purposely get behind in the count so they have to groove one.

That's what happened when he's sucked this year. Look at opening day, look at game one against the Yankees. He's been good for the most part, but sometimes, the way he pitches and falls behind puzzles me.

BRDSR
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Does anybody have the updated totals on our record in games where we did or did not hit a home run? It's absolutely maddening. But such is the nature of the beast that is this team. It won't take them very far in the playoffs, if indeed they can take advantage of this week division and get there.

JermaineDye05
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
I hope I'm wrong, but this series really appeared as if the hitters decided they played a great homestand and were just going to take a break.

It's almost as if they came in and just took the series lightly. I doubt that's it but I don't think they came to Detroit with the same mentality they had when Minnesota came to Chicago. Earlier in the season when they had Detroit for 3 and knew they were down, they swept them easily. Hopefully they get it together. Last couple of times on the road they haven't done too well. A lot of us make fun of the Cubs cause they can't win on the road, well right now we're 3 games under .500 on the road. It's still early and we still have the lead. As for waking up a sleeping giant, all I have to say is the Tigers still have Willis in their rotation :puking:. Good series for them, they came in knowing they had to play their asses off, and they did just tip your cap to them.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Good teams also don't make players who can't bunt bunt just because that's what they did in the '30's. Good teams let their players do what they do best and when they succeed they celebrate, and when they don't, they tip their cap to the other team.

Good teams don't force it.

I doubt Zeke Bonura bunted!

Harry Potter
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Fire Walker

there, I said it.

ms620
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Dotel just plain sucks.

Brilliant.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:


OK, I agree Paulie is perhaps the biggest offensive liability on this team this year but asking him to bunt is almost the dumbest thing ever said on this board.


I do agree the only cleaning up Paulie does in the 4 hole is the clean up of the bases with his automatic 6-4-3 or any other combination double play.

BadBobbyJenks
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Well we lost a must win game. Season is over. Someone point me to the ledge. Can I get a refund on my Rockies tickets this weekend? :rolleyes:

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
In a tie game in the 9th in a big game on the road, I'd prefer Paulie to put his homer-swing happiness in check for once and do the stinking little things needed to grind out a win, which is what good teams do.

This team is not constructed to do the little things. It's constructed to pound the hell out of the ball and it's done that at times. But there are going to be series when it doesn't. The key is minimize those stretches where we can't do anything right offensively and hope that two or three runs is enough to get by.

On the plus side this is the second great outting by Buerhle.

russ99
06-12-2008, 03:22 PM
Good teams also don't make players who can't bunt bunt just because that's what they did in the '30's. Good teams let their players do what they do best and when they succeed they celebrate, and when they don't, they tip their cap to the other team.

Good teams don't force it.

Playing solid situational baseball and giving your team a better chance to bring in a potential winning run isn't forcing it... I don't buy this excuse that the Sox shouldn't be expected play a little small ball when needed to win, since how many games end up close and late? You can't win 11-2 or lose 5-1 every day. Look at the 2005 team. They excelled at that, and also bashed in runs too.

But then the Sox have been bad at that all season - so who's to say the next guys down the order could have moved Quentin over and then in.

delben91
06-12-2008, 03:23 PM
That's what happened when he's sucked this year. Look at opening day, look at game one against the Yankees. He's been good for the most part, but sometimes, the way he pitches and falls behind puzzles me.

So you know for a fact he's been getting behind in the count on purpose?

Jesus Christ. I've had enough of this ****.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:23 PM
There's 3 1/2 months left of baseball. Everyone counted out Cleveland in 05 and Minnesota in 06, yet we all know what happened there.

The Indians sat at home and watched the post-season, and the Twins only sweaked in because the young Tigers didn't play out of their minds the whole season?

I'd be more worried about the Sox just taking care of our own business than wondering when the Tigers are going to wake up. If you haven't noticed, they still have a ton of problems to address.

Jeez, you'd think some of you would rather be in their shoes right now. :rolleyes:

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:23 PM
Fire Walker

there, I said it.

Fire Walker has been a common statement this year but maybe, like Pam, the Sox need to get together with a firewalker.

Harry Potter
06-12-2008, 03:24 PM
As for waking up a sleeping giant, all I have to say is the Tigers still have Willis in their rotation.

umm, Willis was sent down to Single A on Tuesday.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:24 PM
Thank ****ing god we're 8 games up on Detroit and at least 4.5 games up going back home. If we didn't have that great homestand we might be looking at second place right now.

palehozenychicty
06-12-2008, 03:24 PM
Jesus christ...get a grip people.


For real. Detroit still has some talent, and the Sox didn't need to win this series. Other than Verlander, the two bookend games were winnable and they didn't take advantage. Move on.

oeo
06-12-2008, 03:24 PM
Our last 6 road games. 3 walk off losses, and 10 runs total scored.

Our offense only works when the temp is 80+, the wind is blowing out, and we are at the bandbox at home. Maybe we can stop the softball crap at some point and play baseball. It would allow our team to be more consistent.

That's not it at all. Against the Twins, they were going with pitches, taking the ball the other way...doing a great job of HITTING. They happened to get some homeruns out of it, but they were taking a good approach, and with the tiny park that the Cell is, the ball was getting out.

They come to Detroit and throw that all out the window. Who knows what we see tomorrow...it's a day-to-day thing of how they want to come out.

VeeckAsInWreck
06-12-2008, 03:25 PM
Fire Walker

there, I said it.

I was waiting to see when I would see that. Anyway Greg Walker was the hitting coach during this last homestand so I doubt he's at fault.

Everyone relax, the Sox are coming back home to face the Rockies and Pirates next. So it'll be OK.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:25 PM
http://www.algonet.se/~prune/smilies/rollbarf.gif

bluestar
06-12-2008, 03:25 PM
Detroit desperately needed to win this series and sweep if possible. I just think there was more of an urgency in their play than the Sox had.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:25 PM
Does anybody have the updated totals on our record in games where we did or did not hit a home run? It's absolutely maddening. But such is the nature of the beast that is this team. It won't take them very far in the playoffs, if indeed they can take advantage of this week division and get there.

We're getting a little bit ahead of ourselves there, but it could work out quite well. If the offense is on one of its tears (a la Colorado last year) we're a force to be reckoned with. Even if it's dead, our pitching will still keep us in every game. But there's a way to go yet before we start thinking about playoffs.

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:25 PM
This club reminds me so much of the 2003 Sox.

The 2003 Sox and the 2008 Sox seem to share the following traits.

1. Exciting home victories
2. Corpseball road losses
3. Big winning streaks
4. Miserable losing streaks
5. Big offensive production one day, nothing the next
6. Buehrle starts slow, picks it up in June
7. Konerko sucks
8. Esteban Loaiza is on the roster

If we finish 86-76, the comparison will be complete.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:26 PM
Thank ****ing god we're 8 games up on Detroit and at least 4.5 games up going back home. If we didn't have that great homestand we might be looking at second place right now.

But guess what? We had a great homestand and you can climb down from the ledge.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:26 PM
Dotel just plain sucks.

I see that 2.70 ERA and 79% IB rate aren't fooling you.

:rolling:

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:26 PM
So you know for a fact he's been getting behind in the count on purpose?

Jesus Christ. I've had enough of this ****.

You misread, of course he's not doing it on purpose. Nobody wants to give up game winning home runs. It's more of his inconsistency in certain outings where he can't find a good arm slot and starts slinging balls 2 feet outside the strike zone. When the guy you just faced almost took you deep, you get ahead to the next hitter. You don't act like a ***** and fall behind so you have to get one over the plate. Especially if that hitter is Miguel Cabrera.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
I was waiting to see when I would see that. Anyway Greg Walker was the hitting coach during this last homestand so I doubt he's at fault.

Everyone relax, the Sox are coming back home to face the Rockies and Pirates next. So it'll be OK.

The Pirates and the Rockies are major league teams. If there's one thing this trip should have taught us it is to NEVER take an opponent lightly. There's no reason we can't go out and win six straight here, but don't kid yourselves into thinking it will be easy.

southsideirish71
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
I was waiting to see when I would see that. Anyway Greg Walker was the hitting coach during this last homestand so I doubt he's at fault.

Everyone relax, the Sox are coming back home to face the Rockies and Pirates next. So it'll be OK.

Ozzie threatens to fire Walker.
Our hitters start to respond and start to hit.

Then job is safe, hitters go back to being crappy.

white sox bill
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
We beat the crap out of our rival then we get the crap kicked out of us. What comes around........

Terrible effert today let 'em have it Ozzie!

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
I see that 2.70 ERA and 79% IB rate aren't fooling you.

:rolling:
2.97 now. It's been the 3rd time our great relievers have given up game winning homers in the 9th. What gives?

spiffie
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
This is all my fault. I bought a pro-rated weekend plan on Tuesday afternoon. Since that time they have gone into the ****ter. I will be contacting the Sox to see if they will let us just cancel the transaction for the good of all Sox fans.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
Playing solid situational baseball and giving your team a better chance to bring in a potential winning run isn't forcing it... I don't buy this excuse that the Sox shouldn't be expected play a little small ball when needed to win, since how many games end up close and late? You can't win 11-2 or lose 5-1 every day. Look at the 2005 team. They excelled at that, and also bashed in runs too.

But then the Sox have been bad at that all season - so who's to say the next guys down the order could have moved Quentin over and then in.

How many ****in times do you remember Paul laying down a bunt in 2005?

Heffalump
06-12-2008, 03:27 PM
Poopy.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:28 PM
But guess what? We had a great homestand and you can climb down from the ledge.


I'm with you!

oeo
06-12-2008, 03:28 PM
For real. Detroit still has some talent, and the Sox didn't need to win this series. Other than Verlander, the two bookend games were winnable and they didn't take advantage. Move on.

You're right, two games were winnable, and they didn't win them. You could say the same for the three games we lost in Tampa Bay. This is becoming a bad trend.

The division is terrible, so yes, we can hold onto first place, and probably win the division. That said, this isn't a good team until they show some offensive consistency. Right now this looks like the mediocre team every year that just slips into the playoffs.

LITTLE NELL
06-12-2008, 03:28 PM
These are the type of games that 2005 small ball would win, if we dont bash the ball we just dont win. Pennant winners win a lot of 1 run games, so far we have not done that.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:29 PM
2.97 now. It's been the 3rd time our great relievers have given up game winning homers in the 9th. What gives?

You're right. The best closers never blow games, and good relievers usually finish seasons with a 0.00 ERA.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:29 PM
You realize even with today's loss, the Sox have one of the best road records in the American League, right? You know there's only 1 AL team with a winning road record, don't you?

No, you probably don't.


So because everyone sucks on the road it's just OK for us to suck too, is that what you are saying?:rolleyes:


Enough with the damn excuses.

You wan to be an elite team take care of the piss poor competition on the road.

Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:29 PM
This is all my fault. I bought a pro-rated weekend plan on Tuesday afternoon. Since that time they have gone into the ****ter. I will be contacting the Sox to see if they will let us just cancel the transaction for the good of all Sox fans.

lmao. I felt that way in 05. They lost EVERY game I went to. I stopped going for the good of the team

delben91
06-12-2008, 03:29 PM
Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.

Then go join it.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
You're right. The best closers never blow games, and good relievers usually finish seasons with a 0.00 ERA.

It's not only once...3 times. 3 TIMES. IN THE PAST 6 ROAD GAMES!

soxpride724
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
8 games back is a heck of a lot less daunting than 10 back... not happy.

Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:

That's what I was saying! On a day when you aren't hitting you need to get these guys over with bunts.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.


Cool. See you later, then.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
So because everyone sucks on the road it's just OK for us to suck too, is that what you are saying?:rolleyes:


Enough with the damn excuses.

You wan to be an elite team take care of the piss poor competition on the road.

Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.


Have fun

BadBobbyJenks
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
8 games back is a heck of a lot less daunting than 10 back... not happy.

Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:
Because he is our ****ing clean up hitter. When is the last time you saw Paulie bunt someone over?

What do the Tigers and Rockies have in common? They're both underachieving and they both have crappy records. We better get our act together.

Actually they have nothing in common whatsoever. They went on a miraculous run last year in a weak division and got hot heading into October.

Dotel just plain sucks.

Posts like these drive me crazy. Last 10 games before today 1 run in 12 and a third inning. Get a grip on reality.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
This thread needs more "Konerko should have bunted!!!!!" posts.

What a joke.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:30 PM
The Indians sat at home and watched the post-season, and the Twins only sweaked in because the young Tigers didn't play out of their minds the whole season?

I'd be more worried about the Sox just taking care of our own business than wondering when the Tigers are going to wake up. If you haven't noticed, they still have a ton of problems to address.

Jeez, you'd think some of you would rather be in their shoes right now. :rolleyes:

His point still remains that there is a long way to go and anything can happen. If the Sox don't make the playoffs they wouldn't be the first team up eight at the start of June not to make the playoffs. Having said that I like where are right now and I think based on our pitching alone (which is so much better than it was in '03 to the person who made the '03-'08 comparison) I think we have a damn good shot and I'd take us against anyone in the AL Central. But this offense's inconsistency is maddening and can lead to some very frustrating losses like these past three.

Jollyroger2
06-12-2008, 03:31 PM
So because everyone sucks on the road it's just OK for us to suck too, is that what you are saying?:rolleyes:


Enough with the damn excuses.

You wan to be an elite team take care of the piss poor competition on the road.

Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.

Exactly. If the Sox are going to be good, they need to pound teams like this both home and away. This lackluster %$#@ really stinks to watch, especially after such a great homestand.

palehozenychicty
06-12-2008, 03:31 PM
You're right, two games were winnable, and they didn't win them. You could say the same for the three games we lost in Tampa Bay. This is becoming a bad trend.

The division is terrible, so yes, we can hold onto first place, and probably win the division. That said, this isn't a good team until they show some offensive consistency. Right now this looks like the mediocre team every year that just slips into the playoffs.


Indeed, the offense must become more consistent. It's been awhile since that happened, though.

russ99
06-12-2008, 03:31 PM
How many ****in times do you remember Paul laying down a bunt in 2005?

Not at all, but this situation absolutely called for it, especially considering we had Mr. GIDP at bat.

If we had a faster guy at first, I'd been more for letting Paul swing away, maybe even trying a run and hit - but the Sox can't let these opportunities slip away. That run would have been huge.

VeeckAsInWreck
06-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Ozzie threatens to fire Walker.
Our hitters start to respond and start to hit.

Then job is safe, hitters go back to being crappy.

You really believe that? :kukoo:

You think hitters can just turn it on and off like that? I doubt hitters are going to "crappy" mode because their coach's job is safe.

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 03:31 PM
How exactly do you want us to act after another pathetic road performance? I hate when people get upset when you point out the flaws of this team. I am going to be happy when we win and upset when we lose. If the hitting sucks I am going to say it sucks.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:32 PM
Indeed, the offense must become more consistent. It's been awhile since that happened, though.


Monday?

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:32 PM
How exactly do you want us to act after another pathetic road performance? I hate when people get upset when you point out the flaws of this team. I am going to be happy when we win and upset when we lose. If the hitting sucks I am going to say it sucks.

There's a difference between being upset and a loss and thinking we're doomed and might as well quit now.

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 03:32 PM
There's a difference between being upset and a loss and thinking we're doomed and might as well quit now.

I never said that though.

DumpJerry
06-12-2008, 03:33 PM
Dotel just plain sucks.

Obviously you have not been watching the Sox much this year.

2.97 now. It's been the 3rd time our great relievers have given up game winning homers in the 9th. What gives?

This was game 66 this season. You're talking about 4.5% of the games. Not to worry.

spiffie
06-12-2008, 03:33 PM
This thread needs more "Konerko should have bunted!!!!!" posts.

What a joke.
What this thread needs are another 30 posts complaining about anyone who posts anything negative. Perhaps the Powers That Be could add a filter where any thought about the Sox not ending in "2008 World Series Champions" just gets edited to look like :):):):):):):):):):).

delben91
06-12-2008, 03:33 PM
How exactly do you want us to act after another pathetic road performance? I hate when people get upset when you point out the flaws of this team. I am going to be happy when we win and upset when we lose. If the hitting sucks I am going to say it sucks.

It's one thing to call a duck a duck, it's another thing to imply you'd rather be the Tigers, 8 games back, then the Sox, 4.5 or 5.5 games up.

CHISOXFAN13
06-12-2008, 03:33 PM
One thing about Dotel, is he stupid? He almost gave up a homer to Ordonez the at bat before and just falls behind Cabrera so he can give him a cookie to hit.

He made a mistake. GEEZ.

he pitched fantastic the other night. Cabrera is getting paid a lot of money to hit the ball out of the ballpark, and he won the battle. Big ****ing deal.

I'm sure he intentionally fell behind him, too. *****

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:33 PM
I never said that though.

You didn't, but statements like 'Dotel sucks' because he give up a run today get pretty tiresome.

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:33 PM
This thread needs more "Konerko should have bunted!!!!!" posts.

What a joke.

Konerko was doing the right thing - trying to hit the ball to right field. Then he got two strikes and tried to pull a pitch. UGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:34 PM
What this thread needs are another 30 posts complaining about anyone who posts anything negative. Perhaps the Powers That Be could add a filter where any thought about the Sox not ending in "2008 World Series Champions" just gets edited to look like :):):):):):):):):):).


Wow, they're making me dizzy!

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:34 PM
So because everyone sucks on the road it's just OK for us to suck too, is that what you are saying?:rolleyes:


Enough with the damn excuses.

You wan to be an elite team take care of the piss poor competition on the road.

Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.

No, but if you've noticed, the Sox are still one of the American League's better road teams. Wah wah, we lost, we're still in great shape. As for elite, who gives a ****? The Cardinals won 83 games in 2006 and won the World Series. Would you have rather been on the Mets bandwagon that season since they won 97 and were more "elite?"

Win your division, go from there.

kobo
06-12-2008, 03:34 PM
So because everyone sucks on the road it's just OK for us to suck too, is that what you are saying?:rolleyes:


Enough with the damn excuses.

You wan to be an elite team take care of the piss poor competition on the road.

Angels are 21-12 on the road ....... that my friends is the parade I want to join.
The White Sox are not an elite team, not with the inconsistent offense they have.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:35 PM
He made a mistake. GEEZ.

he pitched fantastic the other night. Cabrera is getting paid a lot of money to hit the ball out of the ballpark, and he won the battle. Big ****ing deal.

I'm sure he intentionally fell behind him, too. *****


Its all a part of the vast pitching staff conspiracy to teach the offense a lesson. shhh..

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:35 PM
The White Sox are not an elite team, not with the inconsistent offense they have.

Where is this magic team that has a consistent offense?

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:35 PM
Monday?

The offense sucked two weeks ago, was great last week and sucks this week. That sounds fairly inconsistent to me. I don't think it's going too far to suggest this offense is inconsistent.

voodoochile
06-12-2008, 03:36 PM
The morons posting in this thread are cracking me up...

aryzner
06-12-2008, 03:36 PM
I once bunted with Paul Konerko in a video game. I think he popped out as a result. :(

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:36 PM
Thank ****ing god we're 8 games up on Detroit and at least 4.5 games up going back home. If we didn't have that great homestand we might be looking at second place right now.


I thank God this division stinks and we can take the luxury to not show up for entire series at a time.

So the cause of Ozzie's tirade was the 3 straight losses in TB.

0-3 there

Then we go 7-0 in the homestand, everyone is happy thinking we are heading in the right direction.


and now we go 0-3 in Detroit.


So we are 7-6 in that stretch ..........So it's almost like we take 5 steps forward but then imediately we take 4 of them back.

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:36 PM
The White Sox are not an elite team, not with the inconsistent offense they have.

I don't think there are any elite teams this year. Even the top clubs in baseball have a glaring hole somewhere.

soxpride724
06-12-2008, 03:37 PM
The offense sucked two weeks ago, was great last week and sucks this week. That sounds fairly inconsistent to me. I don't think it's going too far to suggest this offense is inconsistent.

I agree, when they are hitting they are looking awesome, when they aren't...well you know.

DumpJerry
06-12-2008, 03:37 PM
The morons posting in this thread are cracking me up...
Well, it is true that Konerko should have bunted and Dotel should not have played since he sucks........:rolleyes:

stl_sox_fan
06-12-2008, 03:37 PM
Before the season began, a sports radio guy here said in a baseball season that you will win 60 and you will lose 60, it's the other 40 that define your season. I keep seeing more losses falling into that "other 40" category. Glad my Exrtra Innings package was glitchy this past week. Maybe they will fair better tomorrow vs a last place team. Since apparently a "2nd to last place" team was way too much.

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 03:38 PM
You didn't, but statements like 'Dotel sucks' because he give up a run today get pretty tiresome.

Well, that's a stupid comment. Don't lump everyone who says something negative into that group.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:38 PM
What this thread needs are another 30 posts complaining about anyone who posts anything negative. Perhaps the Powers That Be could add a filter where any thought about the Sox not ending in "2008 World Series Champions" just gets edited to look like :):):):):):):):):):).

No one shouldn't be upset, since the Sox just layed an egg against a division opponent, but some perspective would be nice.

A) the Sox have one of the best road records in the American League.
B) the AWESOMELY GREAT TIGERS are still 8 games under .500 and 8 games behind us.
C) At worst, we start 2 3-game series at home against the Rockies and Pirates tomorrrow, and we're 4 1/2 games up in the division.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:38 PM
No, but if you've noticed, the Sox are still one of the American League's better road teams. Wah wah, we lost, we're still in great shape. As for elite, who gives a ****? The Cardinals won 83 games in 2006 and won the World Series. Would you have rather been on the Mets bandwagon that season since they won 97 and were more "elite?"

Win your division, go from there.

amen!

oeo
06-12-2008, 03:38 PM
Where is this magic team that has a consistent offense?

The team on the North side has a pretty consistent one.

You're not going to score a ton of runs every game...I understand that, and I don't expect it. What I do expect is consistent, 3-4 run games. Not 3 straight games with 10+, then we can hardly push 1 across for 3-4 games. I'd gladly trade in those 30+ runs in three games against the Twins for a few more in this past Detroit series. The highs and lows of this offense are ridiculous. Give some consistent production, not spikes here and there.

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:39 PM
Well, it is true that Konerko should have bunted and Dotel should not have played since he sucks........:rolleyes:

****, I wanted Ozzie to bring in Dotel for the eighth. I thought he was pushing his luck leaving Buehrle in that long. In retrospect, maybe he should have let Mark have the ninth too.

I had confidence in Dotel. He just didn't get it done today.

CHISOXFAN13
06-12-2008, 03:39 PM
Before the season began, a sports radio guy here said in a baseball season that you will win 60 and you will lose 60, it's the other 40 that define your season. I keep seeing more losses falling into that "other 40" category. Glad my Exrtra Innings package was glitchy this past week. Maybe they will fair better tomorrow vs a last place team. Since apparently a "2nd to last place" team was way too much.

Based on what?

We rallied TWICE against nthe Twins. Chalk those up on the "40" column.

Verlander dominated our **** last night. Chalking that one up in the 40, too?

This thread is almost as good as Jan from Brookfield's call in the post game.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:40 PM
Well, that's a stupid comment. Don't lump everyone who says something negative into that group.

I wasn't lumping you in with anyone. You made a statement about people 'getting upset against negative comments', I was responding to that.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:40 PM
The team on the North side has a pretty consistent one.


:rolleyes:

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:40 PM
I don't think there are any elite teams this year. Even the top clubs in baseball have a glaring hole somewhere.

Thank you.

Perhaps now would be a good time to mention the darling Red Sox we're all so scared of have a 14-20 road record, or the "elite Angels" basically score just as many runs as they allow.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:41 PM
He made a mistake. GEEZ.

he pitched fantastic the other night. Cabrera is getting paid a lot of money to hit the ball out of the ballpark, and he won the battle. Big ****ing deal.

I'm sure he intentionally fell behind him, too. *****

*** is this? How stupid do you think I am to think he intentionally fell behind? You think I have an idea that they're throwing games or something?

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:41 PM
:rolleyes:

Why the eye roll? Their offense is the reason they have the best record in baseball.

palehozenychicty
06-12-2008, 03:41 PM
Monday?


They hit well all week, but they haven't been a consistent, balanced offense for awhile now.

soxpride724
06-12-2008, 03:42 PM
Why the eye roll? Their offense is the reason they have the best record in baseball.

They are consistent, I will give em that.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:42 PM
The team on the North side has a pretty consistent one.

You're not going to score a ton of runs every game...I understand that, and I don't expect it. What I do expect is consistent, 3-4 run games. Not 3 straight games with 10+, then we can hardly push 1 across for 3-4 games. I'd gladly trade in those 30+ runs in three games against the Twins for a few more in this past Detroit series. The highs and lows of this offense are ridiculous. Give some consistent production, not spikes here and there.

It took us 9 pages to finally get a Cubs reference around here? For shame, WSI. For shame!

stl_sox_fan
06-12-2008, 03:42 PM
Based on what?

We rallied TWICE against nthe Twins. Chalk those up on the "40" column.

Verlander dominated our **** last night. Chalking that one up in the 40, too?

This thread is almost as good as Jan from Brookfield's call in the post game.

Hold on I'll get right on those stats you need.....

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 03:42 PM
:rolleyes:

haha I know they are not exactly road warriors.

cheezheadsoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:42 PM
****, I wanted Ozzie to bring in Dotel for the eighth. I thought he was pushing his luck leaving Buehrle in that long. In retrospect, maybe he should have let Mark have the ninth too.

I had confidence in Dotel. He just didn't get it done today.

At least Mark didn't take the loss, tho after the way he pitched the ND is bad enough.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:43 PM
:rolleyes:

Hate to admit it, but it's true. There's a reason they're the best team in baseball right now.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:43 PM
It took us 9 pages to finally get a Cubs reference around here? For shame, WSI. For shame!

I pointed out there aren't many teams who have had a consistent offense, this season's Cubs team happens to have one.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:43 PM
One thing about Dotel, is he stupid? He almost gave up a homer to Ordonez the at bat before and just falls behind Cabrera so he can give him a cookie to hit.


You kinda imply he fell behind on purpose in this post. :dunno: Maybe that's where people are getting that idea.

spiffie
06-12-2008, 03:43 PM
I don't think there are any elite teams this year. Even the top clubs in baseball have a glaring hole somewhere.
I would say right now there are two teams that look pretty solid top to bottom. The Cubs and the Red Sox. And even the Cubs seem like their pitching staff shouldn't be as good as it is this year. So in the AL, there's really one team that I think you can point to and say is objectively a better team than everyone. Then there's 4-5 teams all kind of hanging around just a bit below that in the Sox, Rays, Angels, A's, and Twins. Then there's those teams that you figure are bound to get better at some point, but will there be enough time for them like the Tigers, Indians, and Yankees. Really there's only a handful of teams that you can say are out of it pretty much like the Royals, Orioles, Mariners, Rangers, and Blue Jays, and even a couple of them could surprise.

I think that's why a series like this is so frustrating to many of us. In a league where everyone is so close talent wise, you have to take advantage of the chances you have to give yourself breathing room. A good series here could have damn near ended Detroit's season. Now though they have a glimmer of hope, and are in a reasonable distance from the leaders, so instead of it being really a 3-team race, its still a 4-team race.

oeo
06-12-2008, 03:43 PM
:rolleyes:

What are you rolling your eyes at?

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 03:44 PM
Konerko was doing the right thing - trying to hit the ball to right field. Then he got two strikes and tried to pull a pitch. UGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

Oh, totally. I just hate to use teal.

The idea that anyone thinks Konerko should be bunting, especially in that situation, is completely clueless.

kobo
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
I don't think there are any elite teams this year. Even the top clubs in baseball have a glaring hole somewhere.
I agree. I have come to accept that this team will be hot and cold when it comes to hitting. It's frustrating as all hell, but it is what it is.

cheezheadsoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
This thread is almost as good as Jan from Brookfield's call in the post game.

Almost glad I'm at work and can't hear it. Rongey must be taking a pounding. Tho there should be fewer drunks after a day game.

kidmccarthy
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
First place, 8 games up and colorado and pittsburgh next at home. Hmmm... this is just what this team needs.:smile:

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
Thank you.

Perhaps now would be a good time to mention the darling Red Sox we're all so scared of have a 14-20 road record, or the "elite Angels" basically score just as many runs as they allow.

Whichever eight teams get in the playoffs, it's probably going to be a roll of the dice.

Baseball hasn't produced a repeat champion since 2000. That shows that there isn't anybody who is "elite" in this particular era.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
Hate to admit it, but it's true. There's a reason they're the best team in baseball right now.


Oh, I admit they have a good team. But to compare them in this thread? After the heat of being swept? That just sounds a little like sour grapes. We are what we are...

whitesoxfan
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
What are you rolling your eyes at?

Probably the fact that the Cubs are mentioned so damn much. At least that's why I'd roll my eyes at it.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:45 PM
Before the season began, a sports radio guy here said in a baseball season that you will win 60 and you will lose 60, it's the other 40 that define your season. I keep seeing more losses falling into that "other 40" category. Glad my Exrtra Innings package was glitchy this past week. Maybe they will fair better tomorrow vs a last place team. Since apparently a "2nd to last place" team was way too much.

The Sox are 26-12 against teams who entered today with a sub-.500 record.

They're taking care of business.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:46 PM
You kinda imply he fell behind on purpose in this post. :dunno: Maybe that's where people are getting that idea.

I think some people are really sarcasm impaired. Or maybe they get the idea that I'm raging mad that I can't possibly be sarcastic. I don't know.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:46 PM
Whichever eight teams get in the playoffs, it's probably going to be a roll of the dice.

Baseball hasn't produced a repeat champion since 2000. That shows that there isn't anybody who is "elite" in this particular era.

I appreciate your rationality, but IT HAS NO PLACE IN A POST-GAME THREAD AFTER A LOSS.

Seriously, though, thank you.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:46 PM
Have fun

Is is it wrong to ask for my team to join this group?

I want my team to walk that line of greatness and not a mediocre road team.

It's funny, the same people acting all calm and all rosy with the crap play the last 3 days are the same people that will bitch 6 pages of threads when stupid power rankings has our team outside the the top 5 :rolleyes:

kobo
06-12-2008, 03:47 PM
The team on the North side has a pretty consistent one.

You're not going to score a ton of runs every game...I understand that, and I don't expect it. What I do expect is consistent, 3-4 run games. Not 3 straight games with 10+, then we can hardly push 1 across for 3-4 games. I'd gladly trade in those 30+ runs in three games against the Twins for a few more in this past Detroit series. The highs and lows of this offense are ridiculous. Give some consistent production, not spikes here and there.
Spot on OEO. I feel the same as you.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:47 PM
Oh, I admit they have a good team. But to compare them in this thread? After the heat of being swept? That just sounds a little like sour grapes. We are what we are...

Someone asked "Who has a consistent offense right now?" and oeo said the Cubs, then you rolled your eyes. But oeo is right, the Cubs have a fairly consistent offense.

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:47 PM
Oh, totally. I just hate to use teal.

The idea that anyone thinks Konerko should be bunting, especially in that situation, is completely clueless.

But the funny thing is, as soon as Paul hit into the DP, I knew there would be discussion here about how he should have bunted.

That entire AB, I was yelling at the TV (pointless because the hitter can't hear me, I know) for Konerko to hit through the hole on the right side. He took a couple shots that way, but then for some reason, he abandoned that approach with two strikes.

CHISOXFAN13
06-12-2008, 03:48 PM
Hold on I'll get right on those stats you need.....

Yep. Enjoy your imaginary 60-102 season, too.

Silliness personified.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:48 PM
There's a difference between being upset and a loss and thinking we're doomed and might as well quit now.


I have not seen or read anything on this thread that mentions "The Sox are doomed."


People have the right to be upset when we saw the way we played these 3 games.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:49 PM
Is is it wrong to ask for my team to join this group?

I want my team to walk that line of greatness and not a mediocre road team.

It's funny, the same people acting all calm and all rosy with the crap play the last 3 days are the same people that will bitch 6 pages of threads when stupid power rankings has our team outside the the top 5 :rolleyes:

I didn't realize that power rankings determine playoff berths.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:49 PM
I think some people are really sarcasm impaired. Or maybe they get the idea that I'm raging mad that I can't possibly be sarcastic. I don't know.


I'm mad too.. I think we all are, and have a different way of expressing it.

Jerko
06-12-2008, 03:49 PM
What are you rolling your eyes at?

I would guess she is rolling her eyes trying to figure out what the **** the Cubs have to do with the Sox losing to the Tigers. Again, that's just a guess.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 03:49 PM
I have not seen or read anything on this thread that mentions "The Sox are doomed."


People have the right to be upset when we saw the way we played these 3 games.

Suggesting Paul Konerko should be bunting goes beyond the standard "just being upset."

spiffie
06-12-2008, 03:50 PM
No one shouldn't be upset, since the Sox just layed an egg against a division opponent, but some perspective would be nice.

A) the Sox have one of the best road records in the American League.
B) the AWESOMELY GREAT TIGERS are still 8 games under .500 and 8 games behind us.
C) At worst, we start 2 3-game series at home against the Rockies and Pirates tomorrrow, and we're 4 1/2 games up in the division.
I agree with much of this, but we're actually middle of the pack in the AL in road record, even though we are way ahead of the rest of our division in that regard.
Road records:
1. LAA - 21-12 (.636)
2. Tex - 17-17 (.500)
3. Oak - 13-14 (.481)
4. Tor - 17-19 (.472)
5. SOX - 17-20 (.459)
6. NYY - 15-18 (.455)

So by the end of the night the Sox could be 6th out of 14 in road record.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 03:50 PM
Someone asked "Who has a consistent offense right now?" and oeo said the Cubs, then you rolled your eyes. But oeo is right, the Cubs have a fairly consistent offense.

I know. but mentioning the Cubs after this series is like gasoline. That's the only reason I rolled my eyes. Apologies.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:51 PM
But the funny thing is, as soon as Paul hit into the DP, I knew there would be discussion here about how he should have bunted.

That entire AB, I was yelling at the TV (pointless because the hitter can't hear me, I know) for Konerko to hit through the hole on the right side. He took a couple shots that way, but then for some reason, he abandoned that approach with two strikes.

When you're down 2 strikes, you're gonna have to hit the pitcher's pitch. Maybe PK should of went up there taking.

It's incredibly stupid to think Paulie should bunt, as much as I hate the double plays, having him bunt may yield the same result or you come up empty handed with him striking out. Having him swing away is the best thing to do. But, honestly, I would of liked a much more patient approach. You strike out, you strike out. The two guys behind you can try and pick you up. You get a walk, you give the guys behind you a better chance to get the run in and maybe, you might get a cookie to hit when ahead in the count.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:52 PM
What this thread needs are another 30 posts complaining about anyone who posts anything negative. Perhaps the Powers That Be could add a filter where any thought about the Sox not ending in "2008 World Series Champions" just gets edited to look like :):):):):):):):):):).


Indeed, this is starting to get very annoying.

As annoying as "asking Paulie to bunt" nonesense.

Anytime the Sox lose or play like crap for an entire series, by default negative feelings and thoughts will come out. Just the nature of the thing. IMO.

turners56
06-12-2008, 03:53 PM
I thought Leyland made a great move in the 8th to move Clevelen to LF. Because on Quentin's leadoff hit in the 9th, that might as well been a leadoff double had Thames been out there.

Maybe we should just drop all the "what ifs" and talk about how great Buehrle pitched. Because he got into trouble a couple of times and got out of it with very little damage. I loved that sequence to Polanco where he fell behind 3-0 and aced him on the next 3 pitches. Buehrle's the only plus in this game today...I also liked Paulie's approach in the 2nd inning on the double and he had a similar one in the 4th where he got doubled up because Rogers made a great effort to knock down what could of been a single up the middle.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 03:54 PM
No, but if you've noticed, the Sox are still one of the American League's better road teams. Wah wah, we lost, we're still in great shape. As for elite, who gives a ****? The Cardinals won 83 games in 2006 and won the World Series. Would you have rather been on the Mets bandwagon that season since they won 97 and were more "elite?"

Win your division, go from there.


That is not a scenario I would want to hang my hat on ..... I have a better chance of winning the lottery than something that rare happening again.

stl_sox_fan
06-12-2008, 03:54 PM
Yep. Enjoy your imaginary 60-102 season, too.

Silliness personified.

Wow you captured my thought exactly.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 03:54 PM
When you're down 2 strikes, you're gonna have to hit the pitcher's pitch. Maybe PK should of went up there taking.

It's incredibly stupid to think Paulie should bunt, as much as I hate the double plays, having him bunt may yield the same result or you come up empty handed with him striking out. Having him swing away is the best thing to do. But, honestly, I would of liked a much more patient approach. You strike out, you strike out. The two guys behind you can try and pick you up. You get a walk, you give the guys behind you a better chance to get the run in and maybe, you might get a cookie to hit when ahead in the count.

Paulie had the right approach in that at bat, first two pitches he tried to take the other way which I agree with. Then Jones got smart and threw that runner in on him and he just barely fouled it off. The runner he did hit he was just trying to make contact with, he was either going to a) foul it off b) strike out or c) hit into a double play. There was no good outcome there. This isn't Paulie's fault we lost today. It's the offense as a whole. And Dotel!

kobo
06-12-2008, 03:54 PM
Indeed, this is starting to get very annoying.

As annoying as "asking Paulie to bunt" nonesense.

Anytime the Sox lose or play like crap for an entire series, by default negative feelings and thoughts will come out. Just the nature of the thing. IMO.
Negative thoughts and feelings are one thing, irrational comments made based off those feelings is another.

JB98
06-12-2008, 03:55 PM
When you're down 2 strikes, you're gonna have to hit the pitcher's pitch. Maybe PK should of went up there taking.

It's incredibly stupid to think Paulie should bunt, as much as I hate the double plays, having him bunt may yield the same result or you come up empty handed with him striking out. Having him swing away is the best thing to do. But, honestly, I would of liked a much more patient approach. You strike out, you strike out. The two guys behind you can try and pick you up. You get a walk, you give the guys behind you a better chance to get the run in and maybe, you might get a cookie to hit when ahead in the count.

Throughout his career, Jones has been a strike-thrower. He doesn't walk many. That's why he's been able to hang around as long as he has.

I liked what Konerko was doing initially. He took a couple shots toward right, and he fouled them off. Paul has had some success driving the ball to the opposite field recently: A home run Monday against the Twins and a double today.

Then, all of a sudden he rolls over on a pitch that was down and middle-out. Oh, well. At least we agree that a bunt in that situation is a horribly stupid idea.

BadBobbyJenks
06-12-2008, 03:56 PM
Indeed, this is starting to get very annoying.

As annoying as "asking Paulie to bunt" nonesense.

Anytime the Sox lose or play like crap for an entire series, by default negative feelings and thoughts will come out. Just the nature of the thing. IMO.


Rational negative thoughts are fine, but Dotel sucks and Paulie should have bunted are ridiculous.

btrain929
06-12-2008, 03:56 PM
I'd like to thank the White Sox offense for showing up in Detroit...

...oh wait.

How is this team ever going to win consistently, when they can't get a consistent offense? They're either all hitting well together, or they're all hitting like **** together. When it's not one of those two, they get a couple of solo bombs and good pitching to win.

Ugh...they're so damn frustrating. Watch them scoring 30 runs this weekend.

And BTW, **** the Tigers. They're not that good. We didn't 'awake a sleeping giant' because they're not a giant at all. I'm more pissed with this inept offense.

Trade for a potent bat at the deadline? Me likey.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:58 PM
That is not a scenario I would want to hang my hat on ..... I have a better chance of winning the lottery than something that rare happening again.

The previous season they won 100 games and lost the NLCS. They had a lot of injuries in 2006, but most of the same team as 2005. They were lucky to get into the playoffs with 83 wins, but what they did when they got there wasn't a huge surprise.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 03:59 PM
Trade for a potent bat at the deadline? Me likey.

For whom, and where would he play? And we certainly don't need another slugger.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 04:00 PM
I didn't realize that power rankings determine playoff berths.


For some people it does. They will bitch a storm "Damn national media is not giving us respect, bla,bla.bla

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 04:00 PM
Just a side comment here, but I'm hurt that nobody has commented on my posts! They're all rational! :whiner:

JB98
06-12-2008, 04:00 PM
Trade for a potent bat at the deadline? Me likey.

I'd like to see Kenny add a piece offensively too, but that's going to be hard to come by with how little we have left in our minor-league system.

I wouldn't trade pitching staffs with anybody. We're likely just going to have to find a way to get into the playoffs with what we have, and then hope our bats get hot at the right time to complement this pitching staff.

Heffalump
06-12-2008, 04:02 PM
Not at all, but this situation absolutely called for it, especially considering we had Mr. GIDP at bat.

Are you twelve? No matter how bad Paulie is playing, NOBODY is going to bunt their cleanup man.

kobo
06-12-2008, 04:02 PM
That is not a scenario I would want to hang my hat on ..... I have a better chance of winning the lottery than something that rare happening again.
Why is that rare? They won their division and had all of their players healthy the last few weeks of that season. The majority of that season they had guys on the DL. They finally had everyone together and played well in the playoffs. Anything can happen once you get into the playoffs, it doesn't matter how many games you win in the reg season as long as you get into the playoffs.

aryzner
06-12-2008, 04:02 PM
People are mad because we should be upset with how the team played. Some people show it more than others. Some people are so upset that they make irrational claims about this team and this division. I have no problem with that. I like that we get mad about the Sox losing because it shows how much we love this team and want them to win.

I think of it like this:

Kenny Williams is never happy. (Hasn't he said that himself?) This team could go 161-1 (or even 162-0) on the season and he STILL wouldn't be happy and he'd try to make improvements.

Therefore, I am allowed to be unhappy with the team despite us being in first place.

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 04:03 PM
Just a side comment here, but I'm hurt that nobody has commented on my posts! They're all rational! :whiner:


lol..:thumbsup:

turners56
06-12-2008, 04:05 PM
For whom, and where would he play? And we certainly don't need another slugger.

We have the sluggers and for the most part, they have been consistent in their careers. A big negative right now is that Quentin has stopped hitting well. He's not having his share of luck either, a lot of his hard hit balls are right at people. Plus, when you have nobody else really hitting that well, we have trouble. Crede is one of the streakiest hitters I've ever seen, Alexei is yet to be seen, Thome hasn't hit well all year, same with Konerko. Cabrera is semi-streaky, leaving A.J. and Quentin as the only true consistent hitters on this team so far. It's rare you'll find a good slugger that will be consistent all year long, streaky hitters are everywhere in this league. I think we need a better leadoff man. That's just me. OC is holding up alright, but eh, we could get better there.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 04:06 PM
I think of it like this:

Kenny Williams is never happy. (Hasn't he said that himself?) This team could go 161-1 (or even 162-0) on the season and he STILL wouldn't be happy and he'd try to make improvements.

Therefore, I am allowed to be unhappy with the team despite us being in first place.

It's OK to be mad and upset, but it's entirely different to jump off the ledge everytime the Sox hit a skid in the road. Dotel sucks! Konerko should bunt! These are kneejerk reactions. Be upset the Sox didn't swing the bats well against a soft-tossing lefty, be made Konerko couldn't hit the ball out of the infield, etc.

Unhappiness and frustration are one thing, but going crazy is something else.

aryzner
06-12-2008, 04:08 PM
It's OK to be mad and upset, but it's entirely different to jump off the ledge everytime the Sox hit a skid in the road. Dotel sucks! Konerko should bunt! These are kneejerk reactions. Be upset the Sox didn't swing the bats well against a soft-tossing lefty, be made Konerko couldn't hit the ball out of the infield, etc.

Unhappiness and frustration are one thing, but going crazy is something else.
Yeah I think you're right and I can agree with you there.

I am mad that the team got swept but I am looking at the bright side in that we're still in first with a decent lead.

I will never go crazy about it but I will get mad.

It's nice to hear voices of reason here as well. :D:

spiffie
06-12-2008, 04:08 PM
I understand not wanting Konerko to bunt, but considering the situation, where you're playing for one run at that point, maybe you think about removing PK for someone more able to bunt and less likely to hit into a DP. After all, if playing for one run in the first makes sense, judging by how many people liked the idea of AJ bunting in the first with a man on base recently, why not play that way in the ninth of a tie game?

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 04:09 PM
We have the sluggers and for the most part, they have been consistent in their careers. A big negative right now is that Quentin has stopped hitting well. He's not having his share of luck either, a lot of his hard hit balls are right at people. Plus, when you have nobody else really hitting that well, we have trouble. Crede is one of the streakiest hitters I've ever seen, Alexei is yet to be seen, Thome hasn't hit well all year, same with Konerko. Cabrera is semi-streaky, leaving A.J. and Quentin as the only true consistent hitters on this team so far. It's rare you'll find a good slugger that will be consistent all year long, streaky hitters are everywhere in this league. I think we need a better leadoff man. That's just me. OC is holding up alright, but eh, we could get better there.

Yeah, I'd like a better leadoff hitter, but at this point I seriously doubt we make a trade for one, as there doesn't seem to be any room for addition unless we subtract a starting position player.

Law11
06-12-2008, 04:10 PM
Are you twelve? No matter how bad Paulie is playing, NOBODY is going to bunt their cleanup man.

What if he was twelve... And can you imagine this board if Paulie was to shorten up as if to bunt in that situation...:o:

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 04:11 PM
Yeah, I'd like a better leadoff hitter, but at this point I seriously doubt we make a trade for one, as there doesn't seem to be any room for addition unless we subtract a starting position player.

There's Uribe...if we were to make a move for a leadoff sort of guy, Uribe is the one who leaves. Either through trade or being DFA'd.

infohawk
06-12-2008, 04:11 PM
For what it's worth, I listened to the Tigers radio broadcast on Tuesday and Wednesday. Both nights the announcers commented that it was the best stuff Robertson/Verlander had had in at least a month.

Homerism? I dunno, I don't typically listen to the Tigers radio team. Just sayin'.

Then again, the season's over, let's just shut WSI down for the winter. Catch you for spring training.
I may be wrong, but I thought we'd already beaten Verlander twice before yesterday's game. If so, the odds of beating a good pitcher three straight times goes down considerably.

I think the White Sox are exactly what they appear to be. The hitting will run very hot and cold. To expect otherwise is only kidding ourselves. As long as the pitching and defense holds up for the rest of the season, they'll have an excellent chance to win the division. When the offense gets hot, though, they've got to string together bunches of wins.

turners56
06-12-2008, 04:12 PM
I understand not wanting Konerko to bunt, but considering the situation, where you're playing for one run at that point, maybe you think about removing PK for someone more able to bunt and less likely to hit into a DP. After all, if playing for one run in the first makes sense, judging by how many people liked the idea of AJ bunting in the first with a man on base recently, why not play that way in the ninth of a tie game?

Remember Pablo Ozuna's beauty of a game ending come backer back in Toronto? I don't think so. The idea of bunting in that situation isn't real good. The Sox can't bunt, period. Unless it's Alexei or Orlando up there, bunting is halfway useless in that situation. Maybe Crede knocks Quentin in, maybe Dye knocks Quentin in. Who knows? But it's over now, no need to question the obvious.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 04:12 PM
Why is that rare? They won their division and had all of their players healthy the last few weeks of that season. The majority of that season they had guys on the DL. They finally had everyone together and played well in the playoffs. Anything can happen once you get into the playoffs, it doesn't matter how many games you win in the reg season as long as you get into the playoffs.


Look at the history of this game, not too many 83 win (pretty much .500)regular season teams have won a World Series.

I think only the Cardinals did it and the Twins won 85 in 1987.

The arguement was that all you need to do is win your division and you have a chance as seen by that Cardinal team, but I don't want to hang my hat on that to Win a World Series since very few teams that bad get it done.


My confidence level in the post season 2005 was so high going into the Boston series because of our ability to play on the road. We could steal a game on the road and that series was pretty much done. So was every series. We did not lose a single road game that post season.

This is why I feel it is very important for us to start playing better on the road.

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 04:12 PM
You know what was most annoying about this loss. The person the tribune had doing the in the cubicle. She was clearly not a sox fan and also did not understand baseball. This was in her final thoughts, "Thank goodness, since my Comcast feed is dead. Just like um, the Sox's winning spirit?"

turners56
06-12-2008, 04:14 PM
Yeah, I'd like a better leadoff hitter, but at this point I seriously doubt we make a trade for one, as there doesn't seem to be any room for addition unless we subtract a starting position player.

And tbh, I really don't like giving anybody up on this team right now. This is a solid team, they just need to consistently hit. I think once Alexei starts walking some more, he is to be our leadoff hitter.

BTW, I really don't like the pitching matchup tomorrow. Jeff Francis is pitching. But then again, we're going home.

turners56
06-12-2008, 04:15 PM
You know what was most annoying about this loss. The person the tribune had doing the in the cubicle. She was clearly not a sox fan and also did not understand baseball. This was in her final thoughts, "Thank goodness, since my Comcast feed is dead. Just like um, the Sox's winning spirit?"

It's the Cubicle. The name just gives away what's going to happen.

DSpivack
06-12-2008, 04:17 PM
There's Uribe...if we were to make a move for a leadoff sort of guy, Uribe is the one who leaves. Either through trade or being DFA'd.

True, but I was thinking a starting position player, as in Thome/Konerko/Ramirez/Cabrera/Crede/Quentin/Swisher/Dye.

soxrme
06-12-2008, 04:17 PM
In a tie game in the 9th in a big game on the road, I'd prefer Paulie to put his homer-swing happiness in check for once and do the stinking little things needed to grind out a win, which is what good teams do.
Didn't see the game, did Paulie try to hit the ball to right or was it the usual pulled ground ball to 3rd base?

infohawk
06-12-2008, 04:17 PM
I agree with much of this, but we're actually middle of the pack in the AL in road record, even though we are way ahead of the rest of our division in that regard.
Road records:
1. LAA - 21-12 (.636)
2. Tex - 17-17 (.500)
3. Oak - 13-14 (.481)
4. Tor - 17-19 (.472)
5. SOX - 17-20 (.459)
6. NYY - 15-18 (.455)

So by the end of the night the Sox could be 6th out of 14 in road record.
17-20 is close enough to .500 to be considered alright, not great, but alright. The Sox would have a far better road record if they hadn't just gone 1-6 over their last 7 road games!:puking:

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 04:18 PM
Yeah, I'd like a better leadoff hitter, but at this point I seriously doubt we make a trade for one, as there doesn't seem to be any room for addition unless we subtract a starting position player.

I think our top of the order is no longer an issue. Yes it would be nice to have the luxury of a base stealer up there but OC and AJ have been doing a solid job up there. It's te middle of the order that needs to start putting out what they are being paid to do. Just look at the RBIs right now from Dye, Paulie, Thome, & Swisher ... way down IMO.

We knew Quentin was going to slump at some point, the big question back then was who would step up in the middle of the order to pick this team up for a full month stretch. I don't see any one of those guys who has or can carry this team for a 30 day stretch.

JB98
06-12-2008, 04:19 PM
Didn't see the game, did Paulie try to hit the ball to right or was it the usual pulled ground ball to 3rd base?

It was a 6-4-3. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, Paulie took a couple shots to right early in the count. He fouled those pitches off. I thought he was doing the right thing......and then he pulled that pitch with two strikes.

jdm2662
06-12-2008, 04:19 PM
I may be wrong, but I thought we'd already beaten Verlander twice before yesterday's game. If so, the odds of beating a good pitcher three straight times goes down considerably.

Going into yesterday's game, Verlander was a career 1-6 with an ERA over 6 against the Sox. He was bound to have a good game eventually.

infohawk
06-12-2008, 04:21 PM
But the funny thing is, as soon as Paul hit into the DP, I knew there would be discussion here about how he should have bunted.

That entire AB, I was yelling at the TV (pointless because the hitter can't hear me, I know) for Konerko to hit through the hole on the right side. He took a couple shots that way, but then for some reason, he abandoned that approach with two strikes.
It was probably a bunting situation, but Konerko isn't the type of player to successfully lay down a bunt. I would definitely like to see him go the other way more often, even if it detracts from his power numbers. It's not like the Sox only have 2-3 guys who can hit a home run. They need more rallies.

jabrch
06-12-2008, 04:23 PM
We can't hit against a dog**** team on the ****ing road, someone in our division. I am not dark clouding, just angered at the inconsistency in this ****ing team's lack of offense.

That's what happens when the offense only scores one ****ing run.

Jesus, guys, be consistent.


Data shows we are not significantly more inconsistent than the majority of the other teams who score as many runs as us.

I know that's not what it feels like - but it is true.

JB98
06-12-2008, 04:25 PM
It was probably a bunting situation, but Konerko isn't the type of player to successfully lay down a bunt. I would definitely like to see him go the other way more often, even if it detracts from his power numbers. It's not like the Sox only have 2-3 guys who can hit a home run. They need more rallies.

As I mentioned earlier, Paul has gone the other way with great success as of late. RBI double on Sunday, two-run HR on Monday, double today to set up our lone run. Wish he would have done it again in the ninth today.

Sox35th
06-12-2008, 04:26 PM
8 games back is a heck of a lot less daunting than 10 back... not happy.

Why the heck didn't Paul bunt Quentin over? With a man on 1st and no outs in a tie game in the 9th, there's no excuse not to get that guy in... :angry:


The issue is that PK can't bunt...this team has had issues all season getting the bunt down!!

Foulke You
06-12-2008, 04:29 PM
I think some NL pitching and playing in our ballpark will be just what the doctor ordered to get the Sox rolling again. I'm not worried. Now, if we drop games to the dregs of the NL like the Rockies and Pirates, I might start to get concerned. This was just a bad series in Detroit. They basically needed a sweep to have any hope of contending this year and they got it. The Sox built a little cushion on their 7W-0L homestand to allow for bumps in the road like this Detroit series. I think we'll be fine.

soxfanatlanta
06-12-2008, 04:29 PM
This team is feast or famine.

Today's menu: famine.

Lip Man 1
06-12-2008, 04:31 PM
It appears the only thing "consistent" about the 2008 White Sox is their blatant INCONSISTENCY.

TEN losses now where they hold the opponent to three runs or less.

Six straight road losses and six straight road losses scoring under four runs each game. They have scored ten runs total in the six games.

My, my, my.

Lip

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 04:36 PM
It appears the only thing "consistent" about the 2008 White Sox is their blatant INCONSISTENCY.

TEN losses now where they hold the opponent to three runs or less.

Six straight road losses and six straight road losses scoring under four runs each game.

My, my, my.

Lip

Lip, why do you always have to hit us with these negative stats, that is not allowed here.

It is starting to really get annoying for those poor starting pitchers to see their offense piss away pitching gem after pitching gem.

Say you split those 10 losses in half and take 5 of them.......Wow we would have the best record in the game and lead the division by at least 10-12 games right now.

Lip Man 1
06-12-2008, 04:49 PM
Love:

Here's one better.

In those six straight road losses they've scored a TOTAL of ten runs.

If this club can "only" hit at U.S. Cellular Field then they are in for some rough times ahead.

Lip

turners56
06-12-2008, 04:54 PM
Love:

Here's one better.

In those six straight road losses they've scored a TOTAL of ten runs.

If this club can "only" hit at U.S. Cellular Field then they are in for some rough times ahead.

Lip

The Sox rode a 7-3 west coast road trip before all the bad thing started happening though. It's inconsistency, that's the forte of this offense.

Cuck the Fubs
06-12-2008, 05:16 PM
Not thrilled about getting swept, but good god it's not the end of the world guys.

Back at home against weak NL teams..nothing to worry about.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 05:17 PM
Love:

Here's one better.

In those six straight road losses they've scored a TOTAL of ten runs.

If this club can "only" hit at U.S. Cellular Field then they are in for some rough times ahead.

Lip

You mean, they LOSE games when they don't score a lot runs? ****, Lip, I need to break out my degree in Quantum Calculus to wrap my mind around that one.

:rolleyes:

spiffie
06-12-2008, 05:23 PM
You mean, they LOSE games when they don't score a lot runs? ****, Lip, I need to break out my degree in Quantum Calculus to wrap my mind around that one.

:rolleyes:
Problem is looking at the numbers Lip posted they lose a lot of games where their opponents don't score a lot of runs.

LoveYourSuit
06-12-2008, 05:24 PM
You mean, they LOSE games when they don't score a lot runs? ****, Lip, I need to break out my degree in Quantum Calculus to wrap my mind around that one.

:rolleyes:

I think he meant that our offensive production on the road tha last 6 games has been beyond awful.

doublem23
06-12-2008, 05:30 PM
I think he meant that our offensive production on the road tha last 6 games has been beyond awful.

Can we talk about the 6 previous road games when we averaged 5.8 runs per game and went 5-1? Or does that not sufficiently fit in the Whiny Crybaby Manifesto that Lip champions?

TomBradley72
06-12-2008, 05:43 PM
My $0.02:

It's already been mentioned...losing to Verlander and Rogers doesn't bother me that much..they were both bringing their A games. Game 1 was the killer.
Last week is probably a bit of a mirage when it comes to our offense...hot weather, wind blowing out, some of the worst pitching in the AL, playing at the Cell...completely optimal conditions for our 16" softball team.
We're now 6-8 in 1 run games...we have to re-engineer this line up to be more effective at "manufacturing" a run or 2 in close/well pitched games. I'm an advocate for Ramirez moving to the #2 slot, Swisher to #9....to maximize our ability to score from 1st on doubles/2nd on singles, bunt/hit&run,etc. for the #3-#5 hitters coming up.
All in all, the sky is NOT falling. We have the 4th best record in the AL, while playing the 2nd fewest games at home so far. We're in first place by 5 games, the largest lead of any division leader.
Quentin needs a break. This is his first full season in the majors...he's hitting .172 over the last 7 games. (Along w/Hall..the ONLY guys hitting < .300 in that time span....give Swisher a start here and there in LF to refresh him a little bit.

TDog
06-12-2008, 05:49 PM
It's June 12th.

I hope we didn't just wake up the sleeping giant.

The Tigers eight of 10 at the end of April through May 1. During that stretch they won their a game with one of their two 19-run offensive outbursts this year. People thought the "sleeping giant" was awake, but the Tigers lost their next nine of 11 games.

The White Sox lost today mostly because Rogers for the fourth straight start allowed one earned run or less in at least seven innings of work. The Sox lost Wednesday night because Vazquez didn't pitch well on a night when Verlander was on. The Sox lost Tuesday night because Contreras pitched a bad game. He couldn't hold a lead Tuesday night. The Sox won Monday despite Danks not pitching well.

I don't think there are any endemic problems with the offense. I don't think there is anything wrong with the Sox pitching. The offense should have been good enough to win Tuesday night. Good starting pitchers often pitch better at home and good hitters often hit better at home.

russ99
06-12-2008, 05:49 PM
When you're down 2 strikes, you're gonna have to hit the pitcher's pitch. Maybe PK should of went up there taking.

It's incredibly stupid to think Paulie should bunt, as much as I hate the double plays, having him bunt may yield the same result or you come up empty handed with him striking out. Having him swing away is the best thing to do. But, honestly, I would of liked a much more patient approach. You strike out, you strike out. The two guys behind you can try and pick you up. You get a walk, you give the guys behind you a better chance to get the run in and maybe, you might get a cookie to hit when ahead in the count.

It was probably a bunting situation, but Konerko isn't the type of player to successfully lay down a bunt. I would definitely like to see him go the other way more often, even if it detracts from his power numbers. It's not like the Sox only have 2-3 guys who can hit a home run. They need more rallies.

Fine, then maybe Ozzie should have brought in someone who can bunt, like Ozuna. If Anderson wasn't in CF, I'd have pinch run him for Quentin too.

What I don't understand is how a manager who was seemingly from the NL school - and obviously understands the importance of trying to push across a potential tying run late in a close game, especially considering how our offense had been shut down - just falls asleep at the switch and leaves our hack and bash hitters to their own devices...

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 05:51 PM
My $0.02:

It's already been mentioned...losing to Verlander and Rogers doesn't bother me that much..they were both bringing their A games. Game 1 was the killer.
Last week is probably a bit of a mirage when it comes to our offense...hot weather, wind blowing out, some of the worst pitching in the AL, playing at the Cell...completely optimal conditions for our 16" softball team.
We're now 6-8 in 1 run games...we have to re-engineer this line up to be more effective at "manufacturing" a run or 2 in close/well pitched games. I'm an advocate for Ramirez moving to the #2 slot, Swisher to #9....to maximize our ability to score from 1st on doubles/2nd on singles, bunt/hit&run,etc. for the #3-#5 hitters coming up.
All in all, the sky is NOT falling. We have the 4th best record in the AL, while playing the 2nd fewest games at home so far. We're in first place by 5 games, the largest lead of any division leader.
Quentin needs a break. This is his first full season in the majors...he's hitting .172 over the last 7 games. (Along w/Hall..the ONLY guys hitting < .300 in that time span....give Swisher a start here and there in LF to refresh him a little bit.

Can we talk about the 6 previous road games when we averaged 5.8 runs per game and went 5-1? Or does that not sufficiently fit in the Whiny Crybaby Manifesto that Lip champions?

The Tigers eight of 10 at the end of April through May 1. During that stretch they won their a game with one of their two 19-run offensive outbursts this year. People thought the "sleeping giant" was awake, but the Tigers lost their next nine of 11 games.

The White Sox lost today mostly because Rogers for the fourth straight start allowed one earned run or less in at least seven innings of work. The Sox lost Wednesday night because Vazquez didn't pitch well on a night when Verlander was on. The Sox lost Tuesday night because Contreras pitched a bad game. He couldn't hold a lead Tuesday night. The Sox won Monday despite Danks not pitching well.

I don't think there are any endemic problems with the offense. I don't think there is anything wrong with the Sox pitching. The offense should have been good enough to win Tuesday night. Good starting pitchers often pitch better at home and good hitters often hit better at home.

Three rational posts in a row...amazing!

JB98
06-12-2008, 05:52 PM
Fine, then maybe Ozzie should have brought in someone who can, like Ozuna. If Anderson wasn't in CF, I'd have pinch run him for Quentin too.

What I don't understand is how a manager who was seemingly from the NL school, and he obviously understands the importance of trying to push across a potential tying run late in an important close game, just falls asleep at the switch and leaves our hack and bash hitters to their own devices...

Quentin is one of our very best baserunners.

I think you've lost your marbles. Thank goodness Konerko didn't bunt in the seventh inning on Monday.

There isn't a single manager in baseball who would have ordered Konerko to bunt in the ninth. Not one.

Bob G
06-12-2008, 05:53 PM
Detroit obviously wanted this series a lot more than we did.

I think the AL Central teams will be taking turns on beating each other up over the course of the season which means there will not be a dominant team. It's going to be close all the way into Sept. I still believe it won't take more than 90 W's to win the division.

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 05:54 PM
Fine, then maybe Ozzie should have brought in someone who can bunt, like Ozuna. If Anderson wasn't in CF, I'd have pinch run him for Quentin too.

What I don't understand is how a manager who was seemingly from the NL school, and he obviously understands the importance of trying to push across a potential tying run late in a close game, just falls asleep at the switch and leaves our hack and bash hitters to their own devices...

You pinch hit Ozuna for ****ing Paul Konerko? You lose our best stick in Quentin and replace him with Anderson? We lose two of our best hitters in a matter of seconds...

****, if Ozzie gets fired, you're a shoe-in for his replacement.

Blueprint1
06-12-2008, 05:55 PM
Quentin is one of our very best baserunners.

I think you've lost your marbles. Thank goodness Konerko didn't bunt in the seventh inning on Monday.

There isn't a single manager in baseball who would have ordered Konerko to bunt in the ninth. Not one.


Does anyone really think Konderko should have bunted? Give me a break.

Lip Man 1
06-12-2008, 05:56 PM
Double:

The key words are inconsistency and balance.

The Sox have the first...they don't have the second and it has cost them.

Feel free to return to your VORP's and OBP and XYZ's at your leisure.

Lip

russ99
06-12-2008, 05:57 PM
You pinch hit Ozuna for ****ing Paul Konerko? You lose our best stick in Quentin and replace him with Anderson? We lose two of our best hitters in a matter of seconds...

****, if Ozzie gets fired, you're a shoe-in for his replacement.

It's called situational hitting. The Sox could have played for the one run, but didn't.

On the road in the 9th inning of a 1-1 game with a potential to win, heck yeah I would. I certainly wouldn't bring in Ozuna to swing away and then there'd most likely be a man on 2nd with one out and give Dye and Crede a shot to being in the lead run.

With Paul, there was a real chance for 2-4 outcomes, a homer, single, strikeout or double play - only one of which would give us the lead. Sure he could have hit one the other way, but why not move the runner over and give one of our other hitters a chance to give us the lead with a single? Besides, Konerko already grounded into a DP before that at-bat - the Tigers were certainly playing for one.

Ozzie's done this before (not specifically with these players) but why not today?

hi im skot
06-12-2008, 06:03 PM
It's called situational hitting. The Sox could have played for the one run, but didn't.

On the road in a 1-1 game with a potential to win, heck yeah I would. I certainly wouldn't bring in Ozuna to swing away and then there'd most likely be a man on 2nd with one out and give Thome and Dye a shot to being in the lead run.

With Paul, there was a real chance for 2-4 outcomes, a homer, single, strikeout or double play. Sure he could have hit one the other way, but why not move the runner over and give one of our other hitters a chance to give us the lead with a single?

Sorry man...I just don't see taking out one of our best hitters for a utility man who may or may not get a bunt down. Let Paulie try to do some damage...especially with the middle of Detroit's order coming up in the bottom half.

If Ozuna gets a bunt down and Dye brings in the run, cool, it's a 2-1 lead. If Detroit scores a run off of Jenks, it's a tie game and we've lost Konerko. No thanks.

Lip Man 1
06-12-2008, 06:05 PM
Russ:

While I wouldn't advocate the exact scenario you talk about, I understand where you are coming from.

The issue though is that these guys simply can not execute what you are advocating.

Ozzie himself was quoted in the newspapers last year as saying he's love to bunt more, run more, hit and run but simply doesn't have the players to do it.

It's unreasonable to expect that guys who aren't comfortable in that role or haven't had a lot of success are suddenly going to be able to get it done at crunch time.

I despise the fact that the Sox are a "home run or nothing," club but I think your odds of success in key times are still better when going to your strengths as opposed to "hoping" to get lucky.

Lip

DickAllen72
06-12-2008, 06:07 PM
I think our top of the order is no longer an issue. Yes it would be nice to have the luxury of a base stealer up there but OC and AJ have been doing a solid job up there. It's te middle of the order that needs to start putting out what they are being paid to do. Just look at the RBIs right now from Dye, Paulie, Thome, & Swisher ... way down IMO.

We knew Quentin was going to slump at some point, the big question back then was who would step up in the middle of the order to pick this team up for a full month stretch. I don't see any one of those guys who has or can carry this team for a 30 day stretch.
I agree. I think the main issue for the 2008 White Sox is if the heart of the order, specifically the two guys that get paid the big bucks and are supposed to be the big RBI men, Thome and Konerko, are good enough to come through in the clutch situations on a consistent basis and carry the offense throughout the long season. So far the answer has been "no".

If Konerko returns to his peak form from a few years ago and Thome returns to his first half of 2006 form, all will be well. If not, the Sox are going to struggle to maintain their lead.

whitesoxfan
06-12-2008, 06:07 PM
It's called situational hitting. The Sox could have played for the one run, but didn't.

On the road in the 9th inning of a 1-1 game with a potential to win, heck yeah I would. I certainly wouldn't bring in Ozuna to swing away and then there'd most likely be a man on 2nd with one out and give Dye and Crede a shot to being in the lead run.

With Paul, there was a real chance for 2-4 outcomes, a homer, single, strikeout or double play - only one of which would give us the lead. Sure he could have hit one the other way, but why not move the runner over and give one of our other hitters a chance to give us the lead with a single? Besides, Konerko already grounded into a DP before that at-bat - the Tigers were certainly playing for one.

Ozzie's done this before (not specifically with these players) but why not today?

I can see where you're coming from, but that's way out there. I'm all for playing for one run, but when you have the middle of the order up which includes guys like Konerko and Dye (guys who probably haven't bunted in 25 years), you don't do the small ball stuff. The way you play for one run then is go with the pitch and try to take it the other way, which is what Konerko did before he got to two strikes. Then he tried to pull the ball and hit into the double play.

You also forgot another outcome in there. A walk.

JB98
06-12-2008, 06:08 PM
Does anyone really think Konderko should have bunted? Give me a break.

Apparently, a few misguided posters do. Since we are still arguing about it three hours after the Sox lost.

WhiteSox5187
06-12-2008, 06:09 PM
Russ:

While I wouldn't advocate the exact scenario you talk about, I understand where you are coming from.

The issue though is that these guys simply can not execute what you are advocating.

Ozzie himself was quoted in the newspapers last year as saying he's love to bunt more, run more, hit and run but simply doesn't have the players to do it.

It's unreasonable to expect that guys who aren't comfortable in that role or haven't had a lot of success are suddenly going to be able to get it done at crunch time.

I despise the fact that the Sox are a "home run or nothing," club but I think your odds of success in key times are still better when going to your strengths as opposed to "hoping" to get lucky.

Lip
I don't mind having boppers like Paulie, JD, Swish and Thome in the heart of the order but you gotta have guys who are capable of doing the little things at the top and the bottom then, and we just don't have that. Yea, we have Cabrera, but AJ is not an ideal number two guy nor is OC an ideal leadoff guy. Kenny I think is hesistant to build a team that would suit what sort of style Ozzie wants to manage. I'm not sure why Kenny wouldn't want to do that, but there ya go.

russ99
06-12-2008, 06:10 PM
Russ:

While I wouldn't advocate the exact scenario you talk about, I understand where you are coming from.

The issue though is that these guys simply can not execute what you are advocating.

Ozzie himself was quoted in the newspapers last year as saying he's love to bunt more, run more, hit and run but simply doesn't have the players to do it.

It's unreasonable to expect that guys who aren't comfortable in that role or haven't had a lot of success are suddenly going to be able to get it done at crunch time.

I despise the fact that the Sox are a "home run or nothing," club but I think your odds of success in key times are still better when going to your strengths as opposed to "hoping" to get lucky.

Lip

Good points. I guess I just wish some of our guys were a little better at doing the little things than they are.

Maybe it's just the idea of the '05 Sox that makes me think that they can play situational ball and grind out a lead run better than they can, and not any actual situations from that year, or since then...

voodoochile
06-12-2008, 06:14 PM
It's called situational hitting. The Sox could have played for the one run, but didn't.

On the road in the 9th inning of a 1-1 game with a potential to win, heck yeah I would. I certainly wouldn't bring in Ozuna to swing away and then there'd most likely be a man on 2nd with one out and give Dye and Crede a shot to being in the lead run.

With Paul, there was a real chance for 2-4 outcomes, a homer, single, strikeout or double play - only one of which would give us the lead. Sure he could have hit one the other way, but why not move the runner over and give one of our other hitters a chance to give us the lead with a single? Besides, Konerko already grounded into a DP before that at-bat - the Tigers were certainly playing for one.

Ozzie's done this before (not specifically with these players) but why not today?

Taking out your #3 and 4 hitters in a tied game in the ninth inning is not a smart way to manage a baseball team, period.

whitesoxfan
06-12-2008, 06:16 PM
Good points. I guess I just wish some of our guys were a little better at doing the little things than they are.

Maybe it's just the idea of the '05 Sox that makes me think that they can play situational ball and grind out a lead run better than they can, and not any actual situations from that year, or since then...

We never bunted with Konerko and Dye then, we're not bunting with them now, and we're never going to bunt with them.

You don't take out your best hitter for Pablo Ozuna in a tie game. If he doesn't score, you're stuck with Ozuna out in LF and in the 3 spot the rest of the game (if it goes extras). That just strikes a ton of fear in the opponents hearts.

ElmhurstMarcus
06-12-2008, 06:17 PM
The worst thing from something like this is that it could wake up a sleeping giant. After this series, I now expect the Tigers, not the Indians or Twins, to become our chief rivals for the division crown.

Cabrera hit.
Verlander pitched a gem.
Rogers killed us, again.
Thames hit a 3-run HR.
They outpitched and outhit us.

We still have a lot of factors giving us an edge. 8-game lead. More home than road games left. Etc. But we'll need to return the favor when they come to our house.

In the meantime, the best way to erase this is to kick some NL ass.

russ99
06-12-2008, 06:19 PM
In the meantime, the best way to erase this is to kick some NL ass.

Heck yeah, I'm all for that. :D:

RCWHITESOX
06-12-2008, 06:32 PM
A good series against Colorado and a great weekend next week kicking the Cub's buts and all will be forgoten.

Soxman219
06-12-2008, 06:34 PM
I just came back from work and heard about another Sox loss. I knew WSI would go crazy and say crazy things. First of all, Konerko should never bunt in any situation, EVER! Second, we did not awake a sleeping giant. After the Tigers scored 19 runs that game, they lost 8 out of the next 10. The Tigers are not going to go on a tear like everyone is saying. I confident we will beat them at the Cell. Third, I still think we are in good shape. I think we have the most home games left in the MLB where the offense actually hits. That being said, I would be more comfortable if the Sox could start winning on the road and start scoring at least 4 runs a game.

soxpride724
06-12-2008, 07:03 PM
3 to 4 runs a game with our pitching would certainly pile up the wins. I hope this offense gets back on track at home, beat up on the N.L and gain some confidence.

MarySwiss
06-12-2008, 07:12 PM
Just got home from work.

I read through the first thirty or so posts and then decided to kill myself because we just lost three in a row. :whiner:

Then I remembered that we were still in first place. :D:

So rather than read the rest of the thread, I decided just to say, "**** it!" and go have a beer! :gulp:

Or two. :gulp::gulp:
Then I'll go play "Tomorrow" from Annie on my banjo. :bandance:

I don't really know how to play "Tomorrow" on the banjo, but it seemed appropriate somehow. Perhaps because I have red hair? :scratch:

Soxman219
06-12-2008, 07:13 PM
3 to 4 runs a game with our pitching would certainly pile up the wins. I hope this offense gets back on track at home, beat up on the N.L and gain some confidence.

We should get back on track at home. Technically it's a nine game homestand. Personally, I think we can win the series at Wrigley and go 7-2 in the Chicago homestand.
:smile:

ArkanSox
06-12-2008, 07:20 PM
so mercifully, I missed watching the Detroit match-ups, but it's frustrating enough just reading about them. It's great that the pitching continues to excel, but it looks like the more elite pitchers are going to be big trouble for this team all year long.

Hopefully, from here on we can pull out more of the close ones.

Let's just pulverize the Rockies this weekend. :club:

Lip Man 1
06-12-2008, 07:27 PM
Mary:

Remember what Steve Martin always said, "you can't be sad when playing the banjo..."

(As a banjo plays in the background...)"oh death and greed and sorrow and murder."

Then he goes on to say, "I always thought the banjo was the one thing that could save Nixon..."

:D:

Lip

SoxGirl4Life
06-12-2008, 07:28 PM
Just got home from work.

I read through the first thirty or so posts and then decided to kill myself because we just lost three in a row. :whiner:

Then I remembered that we were still in first place. :D:

So rather than read the rest of the thread, I decided just to say, "**** it!" and go have a beer! :gulp:

Or two. :gulp::gulp:
Then I'll go play "Tomorrow" from Annie on my banjo. :bandance:


I don't really know how to play "Tomorrow" on the banjo, but it seemed appropriate somehow. Perhaps because I have red hair? :scratch:



:)

MCHSoxFan
06-12-2008, 08:19 PM
Its the 12th.


Don't care. This is how it is. It will continue. Just a waste of my time. Hell, at least I did my laundry while watching.