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View Full Version : Alexei Ramirez as lead-off man?


ondafarm
06-05-2008, 12:17 PM
Alexei has raised his batting average 64 points since May 25th batting .384 (15/39 in that stretch.) While he may not have many stolen bases, that will come. He appears, IMHO, to be the Sox's best option as a lead-off man at this time. Cabrera is hitting .319 in that same stretch (15/47) with another stolen base.

Perhaps Alexei still needs a little protection but perhaps he really needs the chance to run free, produce and score runs. Alexei has scored 7 runs, Cabrera 5 in that same time frame.

IMHO, good lead-off men have a knack for scoring runs, Pods did, Alexei seems to have it. Perhaps batting him lead-off would help the Sox offense?

SBSoxFan
06-05-2008, 12:23 PM
I've been thinking about that myself. He's the closest thing to a lead-off hitter they have. Might as well try it.

VeeckAsInWreck
06-05-2008, 12:26 PM
:thumbsup: Count me in!

When Ozzie was discussing the changes I really hoped one of them would be Alexei leading off.

amsteel
06-05-2008, 12:28 PM
I tend to agree, but so far he's only drawn 4 walks. I'm sure patience at the plate will come with experience, but moving him to leadoff might put and undue amount of pressure on him.

Thats why I though Swish made a great leadoff man, he was seeming to draw walks left and right at the beginning of the season. I think hes still in the AL top 5 for BBs

ondafarm
06-05-2008, 12:31 PM
I tend to agree, but so far he's only drawn 4 walks. I'm sure patience at the plate will come with experience, but moving him to leadoff might put and undue amount of pressure on him.

Thats why I though Swish made a great leadoff man, he was seeming to draw walks left and right at the beginning of the season. I think hes still in the AL top 5 for BBs

:welcome:

Okay, welcoming is over: I thought we'd bloodied everybody who'd suggested Swish leading off?

Konerko05
06-05-2008, 12:33 PM
I don't think Cabrera is a great choice for a lead off hitter.
I think Ramirez might be a worse choice though.

From what I've seen, Ramirez is way too much of a free swinger.
He seems to be a guy that would have to hit .310 to post a .330 OBP, which is still not great. 4 walks in 106 at bats.

At least Cabrera has proven over the last two years he can post a .335 OBP.

btrain929
06-05-2008, 12:38 PM
I don't think Cabrera is a great choice for a lead off hitter.
I think Ramirez might be a worse choice though.

From what I've seen, Ramirez is way too much of a free swinger.
He seems to be a guy that would have to hit .310 to post a .330 OBP, which is still not great. 4 walks in 106 at bats.

At least Cabrera has proven over the last two years he can post a .335 OBP.

....and weren't 2 of those yesterday?

kaufsox
06-05-2008, 12:39 PM
the idea isn't crazy, but I think he still swings a little to wildly and as others have said, doesn't draw any walks. Maybe flip him with Swish, making Alexi 7 and Swish 9.

CHIsoxNation
06-05-2008, 12:41 PM
I don't think Cabrera is a great choice for a lead off hitter.
I think Ramirez might be a worse choice though.

From what I've seen, Ramirez is way too much of a free swinger.
He seems to be a guy that would have to hit .310 to post a .330 OBP, which is still not great. 4 walks in 106 at bats.

At least Cabrera has proven over the last two years he can post a .335 OBP.

Not to compare the two, but Soriano has always been a free swinger and has done pretty well in his lead off roll over the years. He was also able to swipe a ton of bags but I think Ramirez could too with more playing time and experience.

amsteel
06-05-2008, 12:43 PM
:welcome:

Okay, welcoming is over: I thought we'd bloodied everybody who'd suggested Swish leading off?

I may be new, but I'm no dope...
I was saying Swish was a good leadoff hitter and hopefully he will be a good leadoff hitter. But right now, ugh. Thanks for the Welcome!

Konerko05
06-05-2008, 12:45 PM
Not to compare the two, but Soriano has always been a free swinger and has done pretty well in his lead off roll over the years. He was also able to swipe a ton of bags but I think Ramirez could too with more playing time and experience.

Oh man, don't get me started on Soriano in the lead off role. Pinella is an idiot plain and simple. Soriano is just doing what he's always done. That doesn't mean hes doing well in the lead off role. Stolen bases do not make a good lead off hitter.

EMachine10
06-05-2008, 12:46 PM
....and weren't 2 of those yesterday?

Yep.

CHIsoxNation
06-05-2008, 12:51 PM
Oh man, don't get me started on Soriano in the lead off role. Pinella is an idiot plain and simple. Soriano is just doing what he's always done. That doesn't mean hes doing well in the lead off role. Stolen bases do not make a good lead off hitter.

I agree, I don't think Soriano is an ideal "leadoff hitter" but he does a fine job in his roll. I don't think anyone on the Sox roster right now is an ideal leadoff hitter but considering our choices, I think Ramirez could probably produce the best results at the top of the order. I just feel that Cabrera definitely shouldn't be leading off and if I had to chose between Swisher or Ramirez leading off then I'd take Ramirez.

Carolina Kenny
06-05-2008, 12:52 PM
I like the Missle in the 9 hole. The reasons are in no particular order:

1. Less pressure than leading off
2. In the AL with the DH, the lineup turns faster.
3. Don't mess with success.
4. With the Missle on first and nobody out, Cabrera is actually batting 2nd and AJ is batting 3rd and TCQ is cleanup. Not too shabby.

cws05champ
06-05-2008, 12:52 PM
As long as they don't try and change him when he goes to lead off. He doesn't need anyone in his head saying," take a couple pitches, work the count...just focus on getting on". That would probably turn out poorly.

If they just tell him to do what he has been doing, great:

Ramirez
Swish
Quentin
Dye
Thome
Konerko
AJ
Crede
Cabrera

Or you could switch Swish and Cabrera.

kobo
06-05-2008, 12:57 PM
Keep him where he is right now. He's swinging a hot bat right now, but he's also a rookie who is adjusting to not only hitting at the ML level but playing the game at this level. As some others have pointed out he hasn't walked much, and I think moving him into the leadoff spot will put undue pressure on him. Keep him in the 9 hole and let him adjust to the game and then maybe he can be the leadoff man of the future for the Sox.

WisSoxFan
06-05-2008, 01:06 PM
As has been already noted keep him in the nine hole. He's got enough to learn besides being forced to lead off. At nine he is the proverbial "second lead-off man" and that seems to be working for him right now.

TDog
06-05-2008, 01:14 PM
At the beginning of the season, I thought the only place to put Swisher was in the leadoff spot. A leadoff hitter doesn't need to have great speed, but needs to get on base. I thought Swisher would get on base more. I think Cabrera has turned out to be a pretty good leadoff hitter. He has hit better in the leadoff role than he did batting second. Meanwhile, if Swisher must be in the lineup, the only place to put him where he could help the team more than hurt it would be seventh or eighth.

Now, if Swisher or whoever is batting eighth and makes the last out in the inning, be it the first or second -- if it's the third, the Sox have probably scored a few runs and there would be great rejoicing -- Ramirez becomes the leadoff hitter in the next inning and Cabrera bats second. The way the lineup has been working lately, Pierzynski bats third and Quentin cleanup. In the American League, you will often see speedy, first-ball-fast-ball hitters batting ninth, and often they are good enough to have the effect of second leadoff men while they may have find themselves in RBI positions in the second inning. If the nine and one hitters can run, you have speed bunched in the lineup. The difference is that the leadoff spot generally will come up one more time than the nine hitter during the game. Even in the National League, a couple of managers have batted pitchers eighth, not because they can hit better than the ninth-place hitter, but to get a better hitter coming up to turn over the lineup. I don't agree with them, but I'm not managing.

I'm guessing Hall will start tonight after Pierzynski caught nearly the equivalent of a doubleheader Wednesday. I don't know if Crede will be able to go tonight, and Ozuna has more speed, but I expect Ramirez will still be batting ninth.

russ99
06-05-2008, 01:16 PM
I like the Missle in the 9 hole. The reasons are in no particular order:

1. Less pressure than leading off
2. In the AL with the DH, the lineup turns faster.
3. Don't mess with success.
4. With the Missle on first and nobody out, Cabrera is actually batting 2nd and AJ is batting 3rd and TCQ is cleanup. Not too shabby.

Good points. Leadoff doesn't really mean anything after the 1st inning anyway. :D:

Why mess with him? If he's doing well and comfortable at the 9th spot, by all means keep him there.

ondafarm
06-05-2008, 01:40 PM
My answer to the question of why mess with success is simple. To get more success.

I'd say if nobody gets into his head and says "take a few pitches" then Alexei would be fine in the lead-off spot. I'd very much like if he was walking more, but that will come. I do like seeing him bat ninth as a "second lead-off" man, but flipping Cabrera and Alexei might make more sense.

Just saying "might".

RCWHITESOX
06-05-2008, 01:56 PM
I don't think Cabrera is a great choice for a lead off hitter.
I think Ramirez might be a worse choice though.

From what I've seen, Ramirez is way too much of a free swinger.
He seems to be a guy that would have to hit .310 to post a .330 OBP, which is still not great. 4 walks in 106 at bats.

At least Cabrera has proven over the last two years he can post a .335 OBP.

I agree plus I think it would put too much pressure on Ramirez in his first year in the Major Leagues. I say we either try to find a CF who can leadoff or stick it out with Cabrera. Maybe Taveras??