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PorkChopExpress
05-27-2008, 04:57 PM
How long until the powers that be realize the current method of selecting "allstars" is bogus? I know, a lot of posters here don't even care about the allstar game, but I like to watch it, and watch players from my team perform in front of the baseball world. The problem is, as the balloting stands now, seven of the starting nine are from either the Red Sox or the Yankees, and five of those seven are Red Sox. We will likely have one or two players on the team this year, but who knows if they will even play. I know this has turned into a popularity contest, but unless mlb intends to change the name to Boston and New York v. the NL, the rules should change.

I propose two different methods. Either do it 1) little league stile where every team is represented by the same amount of players, and the coaches figure out the best roster, or 2) pick players proportionate (sp?) to current standings, since the teams in first or at least closer to it seemingly have more to play for since it could mean home field advantage in the WS. Just ranting.

turners56
05-27-2008, 05:12 PM
They let people vote way to many times online. Plus, they need a baseball IQ test before every balloting process to filter out the idiots who vote for nothing but their favorite team's players. To me, that's extremely idiotic. It ruins the whole gist of the all-star game for rewarding players who are deserving.

In addition, they need to stop giving each team a representative. They had Mark Redman on the team a couple years back for Kansas City on the All-Star team. What the hell is that? Does anybody in Kansas City really care that much about baseball or even the Royals? Who's feelings are they hurting? The current system is extremely noob friendly and totally screws it up for people that know something about the game and what is currently happening.

Corlose 15
05-27-2008, 05:26 PM
There is nothing wrong with every team having a representative since it is essentially an exhibition. The problem is the fan vote. You have nothing but idiot Red Sox and Yankee fans voting for everyone on their own team.

You've got Rodriguez as the leading vote getter for 3B in the AL with him having missed what 3 weeks of play?. Ichiro and Guerrero being in the outfield with Guerrero hitting about .260 with a .322 OBP and 28RBI and Ichiro is having a rather pedestrian year hitting about .280 with a .350 OBP and 14 RBI (admittedly he's not in a rbi slot in the order).

Meanwhile you have Hamilton at 4th place in voting despite putting up triple crown type numbers and Quentin is nowhere to be found.

Meanwhile at 2B you have Pedroia leading the way despite Kinsler having better offensive numbers in almost every category.

The whole process is a joke.

Daver
05-27-2008, 07:08 PM
Just do away with the All Star game.

Lip Man 1
05-27-2008, 10:57 PM
MLB knows this has become simply a "popularity contest" but they will never change it. Selig has already said so because they love the fact that so many fans apparently care about it.

I don't have an issue with a fan voting....ONCE....but multiple times....no thank you.

They need to institute some sort of system like voting in a political election. ONE VOTE period.

Plus I agree with the late Billy Martin, every team does not automatically deserve a representative.

My solution in a perfect world, no one votes...not fans, not media, not players, not managers.

A program is designed using whatever factors MLB says are relevant. The computer totals them up and ranks every player at a specific position (including DH).

The top two at every infield position goes, the top six "outfielders" (regardless of LF, CF, RF) goes, the top two catchers go, the top two DH's goes. (Adjustments can be made for the N.L., perhaps the top eight outfielders).

That's 18 players.

Then the top five "starting" pitchers and the top five "relief" pitchers go.

That's 28 players and that's the team.

In case of injury the next highest ranked player at that respective position is taken.

That takes the best players this season, not for what they have done over ten years, not because they play in a bigger market.

Lip

thomas35forever
05-27-2008, 11:27 PM
MLB knows this has become simply a "popularity contest" but they will never change it. Selig has already said so because they love the fact that so many fans apparently care about it.

I don't have an issue with a fan voting....ONCE....but multiple times....no thank you.

They need to institute some sort of system like voting in a political election. ONE VOTE period.

Plus I agree with the late Billy Martin, every team does not automatically deserve a representative.

My solution in a perfect world, no one votes...not fans, not media, not players, not managers.

A program is designed using whatever factors MLB says are relevant. The computer totals them up and ranks every player at a specific position (including DH).

The top two at every infield position goes, the top six "outfielders" (regardless of LF, CF, RF) goes, the top two catchers go, the top two DH's goes. (Adjustments can be made for the N.L., perhaps the top eight outfielders).

That's 18 players.

Then the top five "starting" pitchers and the top five "relief" pitchers go.

That's 28 players and that's the team.

In case of injury the next highest ranked player at that respective position is taken.

That takes the best players this season, not for what they have done over ten years, not because they play in a bigger market.

Lip
This means we shouldn't have stuffed the 30th-man vote in '05 and '06.

kaufsox
05-27-2008, 11:39 PM
They need to institute some sort of system like voting in a political election. ONE VOTE period.

Plus I agree with the late Billy Martin, every team does not automatically deserve a representative.


Lip

The one vote system would be very hard to institute and I guess all of these years living in Chicago makes me feel like that is just down right unAmerican:D: Seriously, I have fond memories of sitting at the ballpark and punching multiple ballots, which I think would be a slightly better system, only folks at games can vote, no online voting.

I also agree with Martin. There are some really bad teams that don't have anyone worthy of being on an all-star team.

Lip Man 1
05-27-2008, 11:51 PM
Thomas:

That's right.

I don't care for a single fan voting four hundred times. In my opinion that's wrong.

Lip

I want Mags back
05-28-2008, 12:04 AM
The one vote system would be very hard to institute and I guess all of these years living in Chicago makes me feel like that is just down right unAmerican:D: Seriously, I have fond memories of sitting at the ballpark and punching multiple ballots, which I think would be a slightly better system, only folks at games can vote, no online voting.

I also agree with Martin. There are some really bad teams that don't have anyone worthy of being on an all-star team.

limit it to one online vote, but unlimited paper ballots submitted at the game.

Optipessimism
05-28-2008, 12:25 AM
Just do away with the All Star game.
It is annoying but the kids love it.

Personally I wish they'd have the All-Star game at the beginning of each season right after ST. I'd rather see the AL Cy Young, the AL Silver Sluggers, the AL Gold Glovers, the AL Saves Leader, the AL Rolaids Reliever of the Year, and the AL Rookie of the Year all playing their counterparts. That way everything is mostly fair and everyone on the roster is deserving. Screw the concept of every team having an All-Star.

I'd still like to see the break in the middle of the season, but MLB could fill the break with the Futures Game, the old-timers game, and maybe even some sort of short international showcase where they'd bring in players from other nations to play some kind of international All-Star game. MLB could also consider some sort of game featuring the top 50 players taken in the amateur draft.

Nellie_Fox
05-28-2008, 01:19 AM
Just do away with the All Star game.
http://www.clipartof.com/images/emoticons/thumbnail2/1233_hand_clapping.gif

ondafarm
05-28-2008, 08:59 AM
I'd love to see the opposite, the "No-Star Game". No pitcher with an era less than 7 would be allowed to participate. No batter hitting above the Mendoza line (that's .215 for those who don't know) could get in. Those guys who've worked hard at taking their team down, would get to demonstrate their ineptness in front of a national audience.

I wonder how many Sox would get on these teams? Thome, Konerko, Swisher?

Oblong
05-28-2008, 09:19 AM
Keep it the way it is but stop pretending it's "the best" players. Don't credit players for how many ASG's they played in anymore. Just call it as it is.

Law11
05-28-2008, 10:01 AM
As an adult I couldnt care less about this game.
As a kid it was all i could do to get my hands on the ballots at the games and punch them out with my dads keys.

I felt so important as a kid..

kittle42
05-29-2008, 05:08 PM
Soriano and Fukudome are 1 and 2 at NL OF. Griffey is 3.

Ha on all counts.

doublem23
05-29-2008, 05:30 PM
Soriano and Fukudome are 1 and 2 at NL OF. Griffey is 3.

Ha on all counts.

I'm all for giving us home field advantage in the World Series.

chaotic8512
05-29-2008, 05:44 PM
Thomas:

That's right.

I don't care for a single fan voting four hundred times. In my opinion that's wrong.

Lip

I agree with you, but can we just sit there and do nothing to counteract all the Red Sox, Cubs, and Yankees sheep stuffing the ballots? I mean, I know that only ameliorates things, but until (if?) the system is changed, I want to do whatever I can to see that the true best players get voted in. If that means voting for Kinsler, Hamilton, Quentin, and McLouth hundreds of times, then so be it. It'll likely end up being for nothing, but hey, that's how much I don't want to see the Red Sox and Yankees teaming up to play the Cubs this July.

Lip Man 1
05-29-2008, 10:31 PM
Chaotic:

Maybe it's because I don't care about the All Star Popularity Contest and would rather see all the guys get the three days off.

Even if the Sox got eight "All-Star's" it's not going to change the perception of the franchise as mouthed by organizations like the Eastern Sports Programming Network.

I just don't get worked up over the game, in fact I haven't really watched one since the 80's.

Now if they limited voting to one fan, one vote or turned everything over to a computer program to base the selections or some form of logic that would change.

Lip

CubsfansareDRUNK
05-29-2008, 11:00 PM
Chaotic:

Maybe it's because I don't care about the All Star Popularity Contest and would rather see all the guys get the three days off.

Even if the Sox got eight "All-Star's" it's not going to change the perception of the franchise as mouthed by organizations like the Eastern Sports Programming Network.

I just don't get worked up over the game, in fact I haven't really watched one since the 80's.

Now if they limited voting to one fan, one vote or turned everything over to a computer program to base the selections or some form of logic that would change.

Lip

While I agree with you Lip, I feel like I have to watch it just because it's such a big event and it actually means something. At times it can actually be pretty exciting too.

I want Mags back
05-29-2008, 11:49 PM
While I agree with you Lip, I feel like I have to watch it just because it's such a big event and it actually means something. At times it can actually be pretty exciting too.

and cause what else is on that night, not as if the Sox are playing

Zisk77
05-30-2008, 10:15 AM
The problem is some HOF voters consider how many times a candidate was an all-star.

pierzynski07
05-30-2008, 11:06 AM
The problem is some HOF voters consider how many times a candidate was an all-star.
On average, how many players get voted on the team that would not even make it on as a reserve?

Zisk77
05-30-2008, 12:41 PM
On average, how many players get voted on the team that would not even make it on as a reserve?

Many do for many reasons. Here are some examples.

Rey Sanchez had career yaer with KC at SS. He was leading the league in hitting and was the only Royal that was worthy of consideration. Cal Ripken of course was the leading vote getter despite the fact he wasn't having an allstar year. of course jeter and Tejada were also taken. Sanchez? Nope the only royal was a pitcher than boasted a near .500 record...I think he was 9-10. You think sanchez making an allstar team he deserved would have meant more to him then another for Cal or Derek?

Frank Thomas had a tremendous year and was easily all-star worthy, but didn't make it because mcgwire, Mo Vaughn, Tino Matinez, Tony Clark etc.

EVERY YEAR deserving players get snubbed.

What is scairy is the pro and con arguments for the hall of fame i've already heard for Baines and Thomas. The con argument says they didn't dominate their era as players did after all Baines was only a 3-time (i believe) allstar and no MVP's

Thomas won 2 MVP"s but one was a strike year and he didn't have a lot all star apperaences. :o:

What really sucks is that you here the pro and con argum

Cuck the Fubs
05-30-2008, 01:00 PM
Soriano and Fukudome are 1 and 2 at NL OF. Griffey is 3.

Ha on all counts.

Cubbie Nation rules the earth! :rolleyes:

Hitmenof77
05-30-2008, 01:17 PM
Who cares??? But fans bitch about not being a part of the game. But the AS game allows fans to be a part of the game by voting in the starters. And now fans bitch about it? Take the AS game for what it is, a fraud and it has been since Kruk/Walker and Unit pulled that BS.

Give me Rose running over Fosse or Parker throwing out two runners at home or Reggie HR or Lynn's grand slam.

Lip Man 1
05-30-2008, 03:02 PM
Hitmen:

It's been a fraud since the fans voted Mike Schmidt to "start" at 3rd base for the game in San Diego (I think) and he'd retired a month before...and it's been a fraud since Davey Lopes was voted to "start" with his average below .200. To his credit he declined that "honor."

Lip

ondafarm
05-30-2008, 03:12 PM
I still think it'd be more fun to have a NoStar game with all the players who've tried to take their team down the chute.

RKMeibalane
05-30-2008, 03:14 PM
Hitmen:

It's been a fraud since the fans voted Mike Schmidt to "start" at 3rd base for the game in San Diego (I think) and he'd retired a month before...and it's been a fraud since Davey Lopes was voted to "start" with his average below .200. To his credit he declined that "honor."

Lip

The game that year (1989) was actually in Anaheim, and Bo Jackson was the MVP. The San Diego game was played in 1992. Ken Griffey Jr. was the MVP, after homering off Greg Maddux.

Paulwny
05-30-2008, 05:36 PM
Hitmen:

It's been a fraud since the fans voted Mike Schmidt to "start" at 3rd base for the game in San Diego (I think) and he'd retired a month before...and it's been a fraud since Davey Lopes was voted to "start" with his average below .200. To his credit he declined that "honor."

Lip


The fraud started in 1957. I remember how pissed baseball fans were at the time.
The Cincinnati Enquirer printed pre marked ballots with all Reds players. 7 Reds were elected as starters, Stan Musial was the only non-Red starter. That's how good Musial was.
Commissoner Ford Frick stepped in and substituted Willie Mays for Gus Bell and Hank Aaron for Wally Post. Frick then took the voting away from the fans, All Star teams were then selected by the managers, coaches and players.
The voting was returned to the fans in 1970.