PDA

View Full Version : What About Ichiro?


Lillian
05-26-2008, 12:54 PM
With what is going on in Seattle, could the Mariners be rethinking their decision to resign Ichiro? Are they content to pay him $18 million for the next 5 years? I know that he probably brings them lots of revenue, however that is steep for a noncontender.

What would it take to get him?
Is he the perfect guy for our offense?

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 12:59 PM
No chance Seattle gives him up. He's the face of their franchise. I know that idea can be overstated, but it would cause such a negative backlash with their fans if they traded Ichiro that it just plain wouldn't happen.

Boondock Saint
05-26-2008, 01:01 PM
*checks calendar*

Man, it's a bit early in the season/offseason for the Ichiro rumors to start, isn't it?

He isn't going anywhere.

Daver
05-26-2008, 01:03 PM
What is the fascination with "fixing" a first place team?

turners56
05-26-2008, 01:03 PM
With what is going on in Seattle, could the Mariners be rethinking their decision to resign Ichiro? Are they content to pay him $18 million for the next 5 years? I know that he probably brings them lots of revenue, however that is steep for a noncontender.

What would it take to get him?
Is he the perfect guy for our offense?

He's the perfect guy for almost every offense. Every offense needs a spark plug. And Ichiro is one of the best at getting a rally started (to start the game). But I'm afraid he is going to come at an extreme price for more years that you would want for a guy already in his mid 30s. I don't know if he's on a decline or anything, but he has not looked good up at the plate this year. Plus, why would an offensively challenge team like Seattle give up their lead off hitter? They have good pitching and an okay bullpen, it's their hitting that's the problem.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 01:06 PM
What is the fascination with "fixing" a first place team?

I don't know. Why don't you ask the 2003, 2004 or 2006 White Sox :shrug:

turners56
05-26-2008, 01:08 PM
I don't know. Why don't you ask the 2003, 2004 or 2006 White Sox :shrug:

Kenny did an awful lot of fixing in 03 and 04 though. I seriously thought the Alomar and Everett deals in 03 were enough to propel us to the playoffs, especially with that weak 03 division. But we didn't have a god damn fifth starter. :mad:

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 01:09 PM
Kenny did an awful lot of fixing in 03 and 04 though. I seriously thought the Alomar and Everett deals in 03 were enough to propel us in the playoffs. But we didn't have a god damn fifth starter. :mad:

Well, right now we don't have a clean-up hitter.

It's not as big a problem as not having a 5th starter, really, it's not. But it is a significant problem and saying "we're a first place team" when we're up 2 games in May with significant lineup problems is pretty silly.

WhiteSox5187
05-26-2008, 01:10 PM
Ichiro isn't going anywhere. I'd love to have him on this team, but he's just not going to be moved. Although I'm sure Seattle wishes they didn't sign him because they need to start completely over...but I think there is some clause in Ichiro's contract that has Seattle paying him for the next twenty years, and if you're going to do that you might as well have him on your team. Plus he does bring in lots of extra revenue from Japan.

turners56
05-26-2008, 01:14 PM
Well, right now we don't have a clean-up hitter.

It's not as big a problem as not having a 5th starter, really, it's not. But it is a significant problem and saying "we're a first place team" when we're up 2 games in May with significant lineup problems is pretty silly.

JD is hitting .293 though. Thome is a useless 5th spot hitter right now. To be honest, I'm not sure there's a better option in the 5 hole, Crede's already suffered batting 6th so far. The lineup problem is a significant one, the only real problem on this team, but we had similar problems in 05. As long as guys like Swisher, Cabrera, and Konerko go back to the way they were hitting before this season started, that's not a problem, we don't need Jim Thome to produce 35 homers and hit .275 for us to win.

Getting Ichiro right now is probably a bad idea, since we have no farm guys to give up really, and the possibility of getting him or signing him after this season is quite slim. But I get your point, the fact that we're getting a leadoff hitter when the middle of our lineup is not producing is silly. Just like when Kenny didn't realize that we had no fifth starter in 03. Plus, the fact that we're up only 2.5 games in May is nothing to celebrate. It's a nice lead for this time of year, but you're right, it's early and the offensive problems don't seem to be getting any better.

getonbckthr
05-26-2008, 01:32 PM
To get Ichiro here is 2 things that would have to happen:
A) Josh Fields included
B) Sox take on Sexson's contract.

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 01:33 PM
Anderson/Owens, Broadway, Getz and any other pitching prospect they want including Masset. Heck, they can have both Anderson and Owens if they want. Any young power hitters in A or AA we can throw in to sweeten the deal is fine with me too...

TDog
05-26-2008, 01:35 PM
With what is going on in Seattle, could the Mariners be rethinking their decision to resign Ichiro? Are ...

What would it take to get him?
Is he the perfect guy for our offense?

Maybe the Sox could get him for Josh Fields. It's been a couple of years since the Mariners took on an over-hyped White Sox prospect.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 01:38 PM
Anderson/Owens, Broadway, Getz and any other pitching prospect they want including Masset. Heck, they can have both Anderson and Owens if they want. Any young power hitters in A or AA we can throw in to sweeten the deal is fine with me too...

As long as we're dreaming, can I have a date with Jessica Alba?:redneck

thomas35forever
05-26-2008, 01:38 PM
The M's are as likely to give him up as the Cards are to give up Pujols. In other words, no chance in Hell.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 01:41 PM
The M's are as likely to give him up as the Cards are to give up Pujols. In other words, no chance in Hall.

So you're saying not even if we threw in the .350 hitting Toby?

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 01:46 PM
As long as we're dreaming, can I have a date with Jessica Alba?:redneck

Sure...:tongue:

Any way we can sweeten that pot and hold on to Fields, Richar and Ramirez?

I'd throw in Siwsh too...

Swish, Broadway, Egbert and Getz?

Elephant
05-26-2008, 01:47 PM
What is the fascination with "fixing" a first place team?

We're only first in our division.

Daver
05-26-2008, 01:52 PM
We're only first in our division.

How many divisions do you have to win to make the playoffs?

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 01:55 PM
How many divisions do you have to win to make the playoffs?

Is the ultimate goal to make the playoffs or win the WS?

Because if the latter is the goal, then you must win your division, and beat two other playoff teams. Which you're unlikely to do with a guy hitting .210 in the cleanup spot

On the one hand you rip Beane for putting together teams that aren't geared up to do much more than win the division. Then on the other hand you rip White Sox fans who think that a team barely in first place in a weak division may need to make some changes to be more successful

Elephant
05-26-2008, 01:58 PM
It's not just about trying to win it all here. Our lead in the division is a bit precarious and we all know that. We don't know if one of the other teams will put it together and run away from everyone else. Basically, you should always be looking to get better.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 02:00 PM
Exactly--but even if we assume we WILL win the division (a silly assumption at this point) we still should be looking to improve the team if necessary

thomas35forever
05-26-2008, 02:01 PM
Is the ultimate goal to make the playoffs or win the WS?

Because if the latter is the goal, then you must win your division, and beat two other playoff teams. Which you're unlikely to do with a guy hitting .210 in the cleanup spot

On the one hand you rip Beane for putting together teams that aren't geared up to do much more than win the division. Then on the other hand you rip White Sox fans who think that a team barely in first place in a weak division may need to make some changes to be more successful
So the Sox should do whatever it takes, even if it means benching players that could be something more? I'm curious, how patient have you been with Thome, Konerko, and Dye?

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 02:03 PM
So the Sox should do whatever it takes, even if it means benching players that could be something more? I'm curious, how patient have you been with Thome, Konerko, and Dye?

*** are you talking about

thomas35forever
05-26-2008, 02:04 PM
*** are you talking about
I'm not sure anymore. Perhaps I shouldn't have responded. What I meant was should we do whatever it takes to try and pry Ichiro from Seattle.

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 02:06 PM
So the Sox should do whatever it takes, even if it means benching players that could be something more? I'm curious, how patient have you been with Thome, Konerko, and Dye?

Why would we need to be patient with Dye? Why do people keep lumping him in with he other players who are struggling? He's second on the team in OPS and total bases and aside from the week preceding his week off and a few days after, he's been very consistent at the plate.

Elephant
05-26-2008, 02:09 PM
One lousy week and we could be in third. We're in first now, and I'm sure everyone here is pretty happy about that, but that's another topic for another thread.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 02:09 PM
I'm not sure anymore. Perhaps I shouldn't have responded. What I meant was should we do whatever it takes to try and pry Ichiro from Seattle.

If he were available, sure. But I really don't think he's available no matter how far out of the hunt the Mariners are.

thomas35forever
05-26-2008, 02:09 PM
Why would we need to be patient with Dye? Why do people keep lumping him in with he other players who are struggling? He's second on the team in OPS and total bases and aside from the week preceding his week off and a few days after, he's been very consistent at the plate.
I lumped him in for one of two reasons:

1) His defensive abilities

2) It's hard to leave him out of a conversation involving both Thome and Konerko IMO. They were our 3-4-5 hitters until recently, so maybe it's just instinct.

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 02:11 PM
I lumped him in for one of two reasons:

1) His defensive abilities

2) It's hard to leave him out of a conversation involving both Thome and Konerko IMO. They were are 3-4-5 hitters until recently, so maybe it's just instinct.

His defense may not be what it was in years past, but it's not horrible either and has definitely improved since the first week of the season.

Oh and Dye is the only guy who moved up in the order when the change happened.

sullythered
05-26-2008, 02:21 PM
His defense may not be what it was in years past, but it's not horrible either and has definitely improved since the first week of the season.

Oh and Dye is the only guy who moved up in the order when the change happened.

I really want to know just where in the hell all the defensive hate for JD comes from. He's fine out there. And having a pretty darn good year at the plate.

goofymsfan
05-26-2008, 02:40 PM
Ichiro is going absolutely no where. End of discussion.

thomas35forever
05-26-2008, 02:42 PM
I really want to know just where in the hell all the defensive hate for JD comes from. He's fine out there. And having a pretty darn good year at the plate.
I never said I hated JD in the field. I think he's doing fine. I was pointing out the more unfavorable opinions others have of him out there.

BadBobbyJenks
05-26-2008, 02:47 PM
They traded their best hitting prospect in Adam Jones and have one of the worst offenses in the American League. I think it is pretty safe to say, Ichiro is not on the market.

Frater Perdurabo
05-26-2008, 03:43 PM
I don't think he's going anywhere, either. But if he was, the M's would begin by demanding a package of Quentin, Fields and Floyd/Danks.

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 03:59 PM
I don't think he's going anywhere, either. But if he was, the M's would begin by demanding a package of Quentin, Fields and Floyd/Danks.

I wouldn't trade Quentin straight up for Ichiro at the moment. Ask me again in 6 months, I might feel differently...:tongue:

goofymsfan
05-26-2008, 04:04 PM
They traded their best hitting prospect in Adam Jones and have one of the worst offenses in the American League. I think it is pretty safe to say, Ichiro is not on the market.

They traded Adam Jones because there was a log jam of outfielders in the Minors. The Oriole from what I've heard originally wanted Wladimir Balentien but the M's wouldn't part with him because they (the M's) felt he had the higher ceiling as far as potential goes. Only time will tell if they made the correct decision.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 04:05 PM
I wouldn't trade Quentin straight up for Ichiro at the moment. Ask me again in 6 months, I might feel differently...:tongue:


What if they threw in Jessica Alba dates for everyone!

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 04:07 PM
What if they threw in Jessica Alba dates for everyone!

Close, but the money's still off...

Daver
05-26-2008, 04:13 PM
Close, but the money's still off...

Throw in 10 maple bats then.

fquaye149
05-26-2008, 04:13 PM
Throw in 10 maple bats then.

:rolling:

Domeshot17
05-26-2008, 04:21 PM
Why stop at Ichiro, lets get Pujols too!

DumpJerry
05-26-2008, 04:27 PM
Seattle would give up actual body parts before trading Ichiro. As one poster said, he is their money guy when it comes to the the Japanese market. They derive tremendous revenues from the Japan market in Japan and the Pacific Northwest because of him.

This is why they locked him into an insanely huge contract.

Also, didn't Jessica Alba get married in the past week or am I thinking of some other movie starlet (not Ashlee Simpson)?

voodoochile
05-26-2008, 04:30 PM
Throw in 10 maple bats then.

If by Maple you mean solid gold then sure...

Craig Grebeck
05-26-2008, 04:32 PM
They traded Adam Jones because there was a log jam of outfielders in the Minors. The Oriole from what I've heard originally wanted Wladimir Balentien but the M's wouldn't part with him because they (the M's) felt he had the higher ceiling as far as potential goes. Only time will tell if they made the correct decision.
I'm afraid you heard wrong.

areilly
05-26-2008, 04:33 PM
1) Barring total disaster in Seattle on the level of losing 20 in a row, Ichiro demanding to be traded, or the single most one-sided offer ever made by the team receiving #51, there's no way this ever happens. Ever.
2) He also has a no-trade clause protecting him against being shipped to 10 teams. I would love to be there when Bill Bavasi brought up the subject of shipping out, if only to learn how to say "**** you straight to hell" in Japanese.

BadBobbyJenks
05-26-2008, 04:42 PM
Throw in 10 maple bats then.

Did anyone see the interview with the kid who was traded for 10 bats. He was trying to laugh it off, but I wasn't buying it.

Lillian
05-27-2008, 08:06 AM
This is the article that prompted my original inquiry:

http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/mariners/2008/05/start_spreading_the_news.html

However, I guess everyone here thinks that the idea of trying to take that big contract off of the Mariner's hands is just not feasible.
Thanks for the replies.

Ziggy S
05-27-2008, 08:30 AM
Reading the last linked article leads me to the assumption that Eric Bedard is pitching this year the way Javy did two years ago.

russ99
05-27-2008, 10:28 AM
Any Griffey to the Sox rumors yet? :tongue:

LoveYourSuit
05-27-2008, 10:41 AM
What is the fascination with "fixing" a first place team?


:?: You are kidding right?

The offense needs a lot of fixing. To expect our pitchers to hold down the the entire AL the rest of the year to 3 runs or less is nuts. The pitching staff will hit a wall sometime this year.


This hot stretch that has made us a 1st place team is all on the shoulders of the pitching staff, I give no more than a 5% credit to the offense.

VeeckAsInWreck
05-27-2008, 12:13 PM
Why would we need to be patient with Dye? Why do people keep lumping him in with he other players who are struggling? He's second on the team in OPS and total bases and aside from the week preceding his week off and a few days after, he's been very consistent at the plate.

I've also been wondering why people here are so anxious to get rid of JD? It seems to me that posters here have a short term memory when it comes to him. It's like "Jermaine Dye popped up in his last at bat, LET'S TRADE HIM NOW"

voodoochile
05-27-2008, 12:20 PM
I've also been wondering why people here are so anxious to get rid of JD? It seems to me that posters here have a short term memory when it comes to him. It's like "Jermaine Dye popped up in his last at bat, LET'S TRADE HIM NOW"

If the players aren't batting 1.000 with a HR in every AB and the Sox aren't undefeated at the end of May, the season is over, dontchaknow? :tongue:

Edit: Oh sorry, I forgot that would mean a ton of solo HR and those suck no matter what...