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View Full Version : Dave Wilder Fired


sox1970
05-16-2008, 09:39 PM
http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports_hardball/2008/05/wilder-dismisse.html

JB98
05-16-2008, 09:41 PM
I wonder what these guys did. Must be some sort of personal misconduct, or something in violation of MLB rules.

California Sox
05-16-2008, 09:48 PM
Wow. Were they cheating to get better players? Mistreating players? They asked for the government to investigate? Sounds like serious personal misconduct.

Bucky F. Dent
05-16-2008, 10:15 PM
I'm sure this will show up prominently in the loca fish wrap.

Grzegorz
05-16-2008, 10:47 PM
Who has filled the void?

Viva Medias B's
05-16-2008, 11:07 PM
We do not know the details of what went on (yet), but it appears that the White Sox organization did their due dilligence once it was discovered that something wrong was taking place. Of course, it will provide the local media the excuse it needs to kick us while we are down ─ again.

cws05champ
05-16-2008, 11:35 PM
Wow. Were they cheating to get better players? Mistreating players? They asked for the government to investigate? Sounds like serious personal misconduct.
I heard they put blow up Dolls in some of the Dominican clubhouses :cool:

Viva Medias B's
05-17-2008, 12:01 AM
Looking at the press release, it says that findings of this investigation have been turned over to Federal authorities. That makes me wonder if what was done was something that someone could be criminally prosecuted for. If that is the case, the (only and only in worst-case-scenario) negativity from the blow up doll incident would be nothing compared to how bad this could potentially be.

Vernam
05-17-2008, 12:09 AM
Looking at the press release, it says that findings of this investigation have been turned over to Federal authorities. That makes me wonder if what was done was something that someone could be criminally prosecuted for. If that is the case, the (only and only in worst-case-scenario) negativity from the blow up doll incident would be nothing compared to how bad this could potentially be.Yup. Hopefully it doesn't involve a.) steroids, b.) other drugs, or c.) sex. :o:

Vernam

thomas35forever
05-17-2008, 12:10 AM
Can't wait to see how the Trib spins this.:rolleyes:

Viva Medias B's
05-17-2008, 12:21 AM
Can't wait to see how the Trib spins this.:rolleyes:

The Trib may be tame compared to Slezak, Couch, and you-know-who else.

FireMariotti
05-17-2008, 12:25 AM
Eww, a two month FEDERAL investigation likely means bad news for anyone involved. I don't see anything good coming from this.

I'd rather reserve judgment on the media's coverage of this until we get the facts. If it's a big issue and the media covers it properly, I'll take little issue with the criticism the Sox get.

Lip Man 1
05-17-2008, 01:16 AM
This is just flat out bizarre that both federal authorities are involved and that MLB had an investigation into this.

It sounds like Wilder and company certainly were doing something illegal. With the draft just a few weeks away you wonder if this will have an impact at all.

Wow...just another piece of bad luck I guess but it sure sounds like they were doing something really stupid.

Lip

JB98
05-17-2008, 01:19 AM
Yup. Hopefully it doesn't involve a.) steroids, b.) other drugs, or c.) sex. :o:

Vernam

Speculation on my part, but my guess is it will have something to do with money and contracts given to underage players.

sox1970
05-17-2008, 01:21 AM
Speculation on my part, but my guess is it will have something to do with money and contracts given to underage players.

Somehow this will end with the Sox losing rights to Juan Silverio.

Lip Man 1
05-17-2008, 01:26 AM
Here's the Tribune story. Apparently it does have something to do with signing underage players:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080516-white-sox-fire-scouts-latin-america,1,6770649.story

Lip

SoxxoS
05-17-2008, 01:53 AM
How bad would he be without breaking the rules? Holy ****.

jabrch
05-17-2008, 01:54 AM
Somehow this will end with the Sox losing rights to Juan Silverio.

That would really suck.

Grzegorz
05-17-2008, 05:54 AM
It sounds like Wilder and company certainly were doing something illegal. With the draft just a few weeks away you wonder if this will have an impact at all.

Lip,

The short turnaround is what concerns me. I am hoping the Chicago White Sox draft goes well in spite of this nonsense.

The good: Dave Wilder was KW's right hand man. So, KW should be able to step into the draft room or, at a minimum, place a surrogate at the draft.

The bad: Dave Wilder was KW's right hand man.

soltrain21
05-17-2008, 11:41 AM
Can't wait to see how the Trib spins this.:rolleyes:


Seems like they might not need to "spin" anything.

infohawk
05-17-2008, 01:25 PM
Can't wait to see how the Trib spins this.:rolleyes:
Tell me about it. How long until a certain columnist claims that Jerry Reinsdorf needs to be held responsible for failing to set the proper tone throughout the organization, or something to that effect.

LoveYourSuit
05-17-2008, 02:52 PM
Counterfeit birth Cetificates is what I am guessing. This way under age ball players could be signed imediately without waiting for the competition to jump on them.

gamblinkenny
05-17-2008, 06:59 PM
looks like they were paying off parents of players too. no spin necessary, the sox took the appropriate pro-active approach.

guillen4life13
05-17-2008, 10:28 PM
I think it actually speaks well of the Sox as an organization to, from the looks of things, help initiate the investigation that looks to take place and not condone whatever behavior has caused this.

MetroPD
05-17-2008, 10:47 PM
Yup. Hopefully it doesn't involve a.) steroids, b.) other drugs, or c.) sex. :o:

Vernam
Most likely involves all three...

fozzy
05-17-2008, 10:51 PM
Lip,

The short turnaround is what concerns me. I am hoping the Chicago White Sox draft goes well in spite of this nonsense.

The good: Dave Wilder was KW's right hand man. So, KW should be able to step into the draft room or, at a minimum, place a surrogate at the draft.

The bad: Dave Wilder was KW's right hand man.


Wilder was in charge of the sox latin american operations. the draft is outside of that scope. it should not have anything to do with the draft.

jabrch
05-17-2008, 11:51 PM
Most likely involves all three...

More than likely doesn't involve ANY of those.

California Sox
05-17-2008, 11:58 PM
I think it is likely given the info floating out there now that the parents/players were not recieving all of the bonus money. That some was either going to birddogs and/or being kept by Sox scouts themselves. I bet Wilder wasn't involved in the impropriety, but rather was fired for mismanagement. But that is mostly speculation at this point.

Latest from Trib does mention potential "skimming" though.

link (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080517-white-sox-fire-wilder-scouting-director,1,7373042.story)

Soxfest
05-18-2008, 02:26 AM
Seems KW is making a bad habit of firing scouting people around draft time so he can make the picks! :cool:

Grzegorz
05-18-2008, 06:52 AM
Wilder was in charge of the sox latin american operations. the draft is outside of that scope. it should not have anything to do with the draft.

I thought he was the Senior Director of Player Personnel.

Bucky F. Dent
05-18-2008, 12:20 PM
According to today's Trib article, he wasn't making illegal payments to underage prospects, he was skimming off the top of payments due and owing to prospects.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/cs-080517-white-sox-fire-wilder-scouting-director,0,5293939.story

sox1970
05-21-2008, 05:30 PM
So Juan Silverio is 20 years old, and he quite possibly may suck at baseball. Just great. I hope Wilder rots in jail.

DickAllen72
05-21-2008, 07:22 PM
Anyone here keeping track of the report on another Sox Message Board (I'm not sure if it's proper to post links to other Sox forums here or not) that Regier has also been fired? The poster claims to be a White Sox scout and has made many serious and disturbing allegations about Wilder, Regier, KW, the Sox organization as a whole and even Baseball America.

At this point I'm not sure what to believe. Anyone here have any insight into this matter?

oeo
05-21-2008, 07:31 PM
So Juan Silverio is 20 years old, and he quite possibly may suck at baseball. Just great. I hope Wilder rots in jail.

Unfortunately, he's not even the only one. Thanks for ****ing up the minor league system, you ass.

KRS1
05-21-2008, 07:32 PM
So Juan Silverio is 20 years old, and he quite possibly may suck at baseball. Just great.

Where do you get this stuff?

Dan Mega
05-21-2008, 07:32 PM
At this point I'm not sure what to believe. Anyone here have any insight into this matter?

Maybe, maybe not, but I hope at least someone in the media digs deeper into this.

I'd hate to be KW in this situation though. Finding out a good friend of yours has been screwing you over which could eventually lead to your firing? That has to be tougher than anything.

oeo
05-21-2008, 07:37 PM
Where do you get this stuff?

There's someone on another Sox message board that claims to be a scout (and if he's not, he's very good at bull****ting). He says Silveiro is actually 20.5, and not as good as he was hyped up to be (like a lot of the Sox latin players). He basically says that Wilder would sign garbage players for over their market value (this includes Silveiro), and cash in by taking the extra money that was supposed to go to the player.

You can draw your own conclusion, but again, if he's bull****ting, it's the best bull****ting I've seen in awhile. I usually don't believe this stuff.

Stoky44
05-21-2008, 07:38 PM
So Juan Silverio is 20 years old, and he quite possibly may suck at baseball. Just great. I hope Wilder rots in jail.

I am really confused, is Silverio 20 or 16 like we have been told?

DSpivack
05-21-2008, 07:40 PM
I am really confused, is Silverio 20 or 16 like we have been told?

Depends. Do you read everything you read, or in this case, get second-hand or third-hand from an internet message board?

Optipessimism
05-21-2008, 07:43 PM
Depends. Do you read everything you read, or in this case, get second-hand or third-hand from an internet message board?
Bureau at Soxtalk has shown himself to be about 1000x more credible than Phil Rogers, so I'm inclined to believe him. He knows a ton about our organization and minor league players, whereas Phil Rogers does not.

oeo
05-21-2008, 07:43 PM
Depends. Do you read everything you read, or in this case, get second-hand or third-hand from an internet message board?

Well, it appears from what we already do know, Wilder was doing a lot of lying. We don't know enough about Silveiro, other than he's supposedly 17 and is a 5-tool prospect. I guess we'll find out this summer how good the great Juan Silveiro really is.

SoxyStu
05-21-2008, 08:09 PM
Well, it appears from what we already do know, Wilder was doing a lot of lying. We don't know enough about Silveiro, other than he's supposedly 17 and is a 5-tool prospect. I guess we'll find out this summer how good the great Juan Silveiro really is.

I don't know or care how touted this kid is, but I think stating that this summer he has to prove how good he'll be seems rather rash...especially at a supposed age of 17...that's baseball maturity age right there!

Optipessimism
05-21-2008, 08:17 PM
I don't know or care how touted this kid is, but I think stating that this summer he has to prove how good he'll be seems rather rash...especially at a supposed age of 17...that's baseball maturity age right there!
I don't care if he's 12 years old. Any prospect given a $600K bonus needs to hit in the DSL. That's not exactly a league full of great prospects.

Daver
05-21-2008, 08:27 PM
So Juan Silverio is 20 years old, and he quite possibly may suck at baseball. Just great. I hope Wilder rots in jail.

Jerry Owens is 27 and sucks at baseball, what's your point?

Craig Grebeck
05-21-2008, 08:28 PM
Jerry Owens is 27 and sucks at baseball, what's your point?
Signing a 16 year old SS and signing a 20 year old SS are two extremely different things.

oeo
05-21-2008, 08:31 PM
I don't know or care how touted this kid is, but I think stating that this summer he has to prove how good he'll be seems rather rash...especially at a supposed age of 17...that's baseball maturity age right there!

For the first time we'll be able to get some different views on him. He's being touted as a 5-tool player...if he's the real deal, then his ability should show early. Also, we don't know that he's 17, either. Whether you believe the guy on Soxtalk or not, that was what Wilder and Regier said, and they're obviously full of ****.

Daver
05-21-2008, 08:32 PM
Signing a 16 year old SS and signing a 20 year old SS are two extremely different things.

No kidding?

SoxyStu
05-21-2008, 08:56 PM
I don't care if he's 12 years old. Any prospect given a $600K bonus needs to hit in the DSL. That's not exactly a league full of great prospects.

12 years old...heh.

If he doesn't hit this summer, then what? He won't ever be our future shortstop? Our whole future hinges on his performance this summer? Our White Sox won't 8-peat starting 4 years from now when he's on the roster?

sox1970
05-21-2008, 09:04 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080521&content_id=2743405&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

Optipessimism
05-21-2008, 09:15 PM
12 years old...heh.

If he doesn't hit this summer, then what? He won't ever be our future shortstop? Our whole future hinges on his performance this summer? Our White Sox won't 8-peat starting 4 years from now when he's on the roster?
If he's a mediocre 20-year-old SS no one wanted then no, he'll never be starting for us. And if this 20-year-old SS no one wanted can't hit a baseball off some scrubs in the DSL, then he'll never even make it to Rookie ball. JR will eat the salary and that's it.

So yes, his future hinges on his performance this year. Leave the rest of the Sox team out of it with the our part. Silverio sounds like he'll be a $600K loss, but that has nothing to do with any other legitimate players the Sox bring in to play SS.

Edit: Even if Silverio is a legit prospect, which it now appears he isn't, he would still have to hit in the DSL. There's no such thing as a perfectly healthy legitimate hitting prospect given that kind of bonus who can't hit in the DSL.

SoxyStu
05-21-2008, 09:53 PM
If he's a mediocre 20-year-old SS no one wanted then no, he'll never be starting for us. And if this 20-year-old SS no one wanted can't hit a baseball off some scrubs in the DSL, then he'll never even make it to Rookie ball. JR will eat the salary and that's it.

So yes, his future hinges on his performance this year. Leave the rest of the Sox team out of it with the our part. Silverio sounds like he'll be a $600K loss, but that has nothing to do with any other legitimate players the Sox bring in to play SS.

Edit: Even if Silverio is a legit prospect, which it now appears he isn't, he would still have to hit in the DSL. There's no such thing as a perfectly healthy legitimate hitting prospect given that kind of bonus who can't hit in the DSL.

I gotcha, at least I think so. Now I think I initially misinterpreted oeo's point.

DSpivack
05-21-2008, 11:10 PM
Bureau at Soxtalk has shown himself to be about 1000x more credible than Phil Rogers, so I'm inclined to believe him. He knows a ton about our organization and minor league players, whereas Phil Rogers does not.

It just seems that a lot of people were blowing up the story without any concrete information. Everything should be taken with a grain of salt.

Bucky F. Dent
05-21-2008, 11:39 PM
I was listening to Bernstein this afternoon (my mistake, I know, it won't happen again) as he theorized about the potential that the Wilder situation could possibly, under some circumstance which had yet to be established, turn out to be a truly horrible situation involving theft, fraud, and steroid use. He spent several minutes outlining this diaboloical scheme which, as of this moment and by his own admission, has NO BASIS IN FACT!

Short of tying Wilder and the Sox to Al Qaeda, the JFK assassination, and conjugal relations with an underage goat there appeared to be no accusation that Bernstein was unwilling to make this afternoon.

Now, I'm not naive enough to think that this whole Wilder fiasco might not turn out to be a truly bad thing for Wilder and the Sox, but it seems to me to be utterly irresponsible for Bernstein to sit behind a microphone and broadcast to thousands of listeners this completely unsubstantiated bile!!!!

To coin a phrase they like to use on his show, Mr. Bernstein you have crapped me for the last time.

DickAllen72
05-21-2008, 11:56 PM
I was listening to Bernstein this afternoon (my mistake, I know, it won't happen again) as he theorized about the potential that the Wilder situation could possibly, under some circumstance which had yet to be established, turn out to be a truly horrible situation involving theft, fraud, and steroid use. He spent several minutes outlining this diaboloical scheme which, as of this moment and by his own admission, has NO BASIS IN FACT!

Short of tying Wilder and the Sox to Al Qaeda, the JFK assassination, and conjugal relations with an underage goat there appeared to be no accusation that Bernstein was unwilling to make this afternoon.

Now, I'm not naive enough to think that this whole Wilder fiasco might not turn out to be a truly bad thing for Wilder and the Sox, but it seems to me to be utterly irresponsible for Bernstein to sit behind a microphone and broadcast to thousands of listeners this completely unsubstantiated bile!!!!

To coin a phrase they like to use on his show, Mr. Bernstein you have crapped me for the last time.
Bernstein and his partner suck so I haven't listened to them in years.

Anyway, from what I've read on other Sox message boards, it appears that the White Sox organization was the victim here and KW was betrayed by a close friend.

Allegedly what happened was Wilder and the two scouts would file false scouting reports to the Sox on garbage players who had no agents (because they had little or no talent) and get the Sox to offer these players big contracts and signing bonuses. Wilder would then take a good percentage of the money from the player as a kickback and laundered the money in a business he had set up.

It also was alleged that Wilder had a contact with Baseball America that would publish false evaluations of these players to make the signings look legit. Also he allegedly supplied some of these players with PEDs and would push these non-prospects up the ladder quickly to justify their contracts, only to have them repeatedly fail in minor league ball which is apparently why the Sox minor league organization is rated so poorly.

These are all allegations that were made by a guy who claims to be a scout in the Sox organization. I have no idea how much or if any of it is true, but if any of it is the Sox are more dupes and victims of Wilder rather than perpetrators of any wrongdoing.